Web Series: The Battle of The Bands/The Burn; AKA We All Have a Crush on Marc Maron

We talk about the joy of “The Battle of The Bands.” Steve makes a public statement. We discuss Gallagher Too, Evil Dead, Cloverfield (again), and whatever we can to avoid “The Burn.”

Patrick Tomasso Interview with Matt Johnson and Jared Raab: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8hYi8qBWMgg 

Email: nirvannathepod@gmail.com

Bluesky: @nirvannathepod.bsky.social

Instagram: @nirvannathepod

Voice memos: www.speakpipe.com/nirvannathepod

www.nirvannathepod.com

Transcript

Kit 0:00

Hello and welcome to Cloverfield the Monster, the Show, the Podcast. The show all about beloved Kaiju Clover from J.J. Abrams' hit 2008 movie Cloverfield, as well as its extended cinematic universe, 10 Cloverfield Lane and the Cloverfield Paradox. I'm Kit and I'm joined by my two lovely co-hosts.

Michelle 0:22

I'm the Cloverfield Monster. And that's my child, Cloverfield Monster Jr.

Kit 0:29

Cloverfield Monster Jr., yeah. So you would be in the first one, I think, right, Cloverfield?

Steve 0:37

Uh yeah. Hey, is that a portal opening up? Back to a normal podcast?

Kit 0:44

I'm already fine, and I'm already Hello and welcome to Nirvana the Band, the show, the podcast. The podcast all about watching and talking about Nirvana, the band, the show, and not J.J. Abrams' 2008 masterpiece, Cloverfield. My name is Kit, and I'm joined by my two lovely co-hosts.

Steve 1:19

I'm Steve.

Michelle 1:20

And I'm still the Cloverfield monster somehow. But you could call me Michelle.

Steve 1:26

Well, I I I know we're all here to have fun, but I really need to address something that happened on our last episode. What is it? Look, I did a lot of reflecting and and I've written a statement that I just uh please let me get it out, okay? Okay. Okay. Whatever you need. After much self-reflection and consultation with my loved ones, I've decided to address my recent transgressions. I made an impulsive statement without proper thought and consideration. I want to apologize to the Cloverfield monster, their loved ones, and their fans for accusing them of eating a spaceship in the Cloverfield paradox. This is a fundamentally untrue statement. And one I deeply regret saying, I will not be taking any questions at this time. Thank you so much.

Kit 2:08

Wow, that was so brave of you to say. Yeah.

Steve 2:12

It's just the right thing to do.

Michelle 2:14

Thank you. I know it might have sounded like I was laughing, but that was um crying. That's just what it sounds like when I cry, because it was so beautiful.

Steve 2:21

Please forgive me, Cloverfield Monster. I forgive you.

unknown 2:24

I forgive you.

Kit 2:26

I mean, to be fair. I know we need to get into that episode, but to be fair, it does very much look like the monster eats the spaceship at the end.

Steve 2:35

But I I looked it up and apparently it doesn't actually eat the spaceship, nor is it the Cloverfield Monster. I'm crying, I'm not laughing.

Kit 2:43

That is the Cloverfield Monster. Like just a bigger version.

Michelle 2:45

I haven't seen the Cloverfield Paradox. When you say it looks like it eats the spaceship, but it didn't, is this like an Austin Powers like pretending to go down an elevator behind the sofa situation?

Steve 2:57

Kind of. Welcome to Austin Powers. Is it okay? Because I showed you that picture and you told me it wasn't the Cloverfield monster.

Kit 3:06

Well, okay, because it was so big that I was just like, that can't be it.

Steve 3:11

Did I apologize for no reason? Did I go through all of this pain and suffering?

Kit 3:15

No, you listen, you apologized for a good reason, which is the monster did not eat the spaceship. But I should apologize for doubting that the image that you shared in the safe space of this Zoom call was the Cloverfield Monster because it was just a bigger version of it. Growing monster. So big. I should also say that I just marathoned all three of the Cloverfield movies very recently. So I know we're here to talk about Nirvana the band. All of my notes are about Cloverfield, so I can't wait to shoehorn that into uh Battle of the Bands.

Steve 3:50

Kit loves TJ Miller and everything he's done on and off screen.

Kit 3:54

My favorite guy.

Michelle 3:57

I thought he really excelled as the Musinix um blob of snot or whatever he is in those commercials.

Steve 4:04

That's his favorite. I believe he's a booger. He's working class. He doesn't say blob of snot. I'm a booger! I'm from Brooklyn.

Michelle 4:16

Oh my god. Uh I think it's episode four, and we have hit a new record approaching light speed with how quickly we've gotten off topic. Uh and I think that's amazing.

Steve 4:29

So if anybody has any questions or comments about Cloverfield or TJ Miller, you are not welcome on the show. Uh, but if you have any comments about TJ Miller, please, please reach out.

Kit 4:40

Um, and also if you have any thoughts about Cloverfield, you can email us directly at nirvana the pod at gmail.com. Address it to me, kit. I will answer as quickly as humanly possible.

Steve 4:50

I'd just also like to let you know if you're talking about Austin Powers, I will probably answer as quickly as Getwood Cloverfields.

Michelle 4:56

Uh and I don't care to answer emails, so please don't email me about anything. Thank you.

Kit 5:02

Yeah, I think you prefer carrier pigeon, right?

Michelle 5:05

Yeah, that's correct. I will respond immediately if you get a pigeon to come to my window.

Steve 5:10

They didn't leak your signal chats in the court filings? No, they didn't get me.

Kit 5:14

For what, Michelle?

Michelle 5:16

Yeah, Michelle. What didn't we get you for? Uh no comment.

Kit 5:21

Um But yeah, today we are continuing our watch of the web series. Uh, we're gonna be covering episodes seven and eight, which is Battle of the Bands and The Burn, respectively. And I also wanted to call out seven and eight, we are approaching at a very fast velocity, the end of the web series.

Michelle 5:40

Yeah. I'm scared and excited to go into new territory.

Steve 5:45

I'm so hyped to go back to the Vice Land series. I have intentionally not watched any of it since we decided to do the show. That'll be fun. You'll be like me, almost. Yeah. Almost I've seen it three times.

Michelle 5:57

Experiencing it anew.

Kit 5:59

All right, so let's start talking about episode seven, Battle of the Bands. Um, so in this one, after a disastrous B Day, uh Nirvana the band has broken up. Uh, and Matt and Jay have gone their separate ways and are now working with other musicians. Um, and the opening credits for this one is it's the great pumpkin Charlie Brown. So, what did we all think?

Steve 6:20

Perfect opening. I love the great pumpkin so much. I was so delighted to spend time with that. It's really nice. I really, really like this episode. How about the two of you?

Michelle 6:31

I think it's well done. It makes me so sad, like the whole time. I just I I hate to see the two boys apart and yearning for each other and trying to replace each other and uh failing and like seeing people who don't understand their vibes. I don't know. I I think I enjoyed this one more when I re-watched it, but the first time I was just I was just so bummed out the whole time because I just wanted them to say they were sorry and find each other again.

Steve 7:04

I need to just get this out now because otherwise I'm gonna be sitting on it for the rest of the episode. And I think you both know what I'm about to say. I cried at the end of this episode. Aww. Me noted crier at most things, uh, as you two know. Uh, even though I knew what you know the actual end was, I because we're going like so emotional in our analysis of this, I like got really overwhelmed and teared up quite a bit.

Kit 7:31

That's fair. I would say this is my favorite episode of theirs in general. I just think this is so well done. It's really great. I love that they've brought in their friends to be part of this. That was such an exciting thing to hear in the commentary that it has this like additional personal meaning to them. And more importantly, this was the episode where I fully intended to press the button and lock you all into my saw trap about how these two are in love. Um, but we can move on to other things. Uh, this is a deep yearning episode, as Michelle said. And um, even outside of that, if you're reading this is friendship, still so beautiful, so touching.

Steve 8:13

Kit, your favorite joke comes up at the beginning, uh, the triple jump, and and Jay being so angry about it was really sad. Yeah. Okay, so watching it this go-round for our show um had a different feel for me because I'm gonna admit, until about five months ago, I had no idea who the Born Ruffians are.

Michelle 8:34

I still don't totally know outside of the show. I like listened to a couple songs, but I have no greater context for who they are as a band or how famous they are or not.

Kit 8:46

I had context because my partner is a big Born Ruffians fan. And so when we initially watched the reps the web series and the Born Ruffians appeared at the end of the last episode, he was all over the moon. He was so fucking psyched.

Steve 8:58

They are a big deal. Yeah. Yeah. I know I only know them now because, like, um, you know, um, my wife knows, like, is a fan of theirs. Like, they're an indie rock band that are quite popular. And I was like, I don't fucking know who these guys are, they seem like nice guys. So cool. I'm glad I'm not the only one. Because like her response to me was like, Do you know who the Born Ruffi are? I was like, Yeah, obviously.

Michelle 9:19

No, I I had heard the name, but I feel like it may have only been from other Nirvana the band stuff.

Steve 9:26

Okay. But otherwise. I guess Kit and I are married to a couple of cool dudes.

Kit 9:30

Sounds like it. Very true.

Steve 9:32

This episode's a little weird because there's not a lot of plot to it. It is all very much just character beats and emotion. And it's a really interesting departure from the way the rest of the series goes.

SPEAKER_02 9:45

Mm-hmm.

Steve 9:46

Especially with, and as Matt called out in the commentary, like Jay was forced to fend by for himself, and normally it is Matt leading the scenes to the point where they got into fights because Matt wouldn't leave space for Jay to do his lines in a lot of episodes.

SPEAKER_02 10:01

Mm-hmm.

Steve 10:02

So it it's really interesting to see Jay have to be the like funny one.

Michelle 10:08

I think that's interesting because I felt like there were a couple times when Jay is doing scenes with all these other people that are coming through where he is, if not repeating exact lines that Matt said, like really like pulling a Matt impression out of him in a way that I think is so like interesting. And I'm sure it's intentional, but watching the show like feels like maybe he doesn't realize he's doing it.

Steve 10:36

I think you're probably right. And we're also seeing like how much of the I don't want to use delusion, but like uh misconceptions about things are ingrained in Jay in a way that it's not Matt necessarily leading it. Because there's the part where he's playing with the guy with the guitar, and he's like, I don't think most clubs have an elaborate lighting setup. And Jay's like, it's the Rivoli. And the guy goes, Well, have you ever seen a show at the Rivoli? And Jay gets so angry. Because, you know, while it seems on its surface that Matt is leading this, it's like this one really shows you, like, no, this is their thing. Yeah. And I thought that was really sweet because also there's the part where the other guy's pushing like back on how to like make music, and Jay was like, No, you do spoken word thing while I play piano. Like, that's how a band works. And he was like refusing to hear any other way but his and Matt's way.

Michelle 11:33

Yeah. And I think it's the same with the guitar guy. He's like, A band is just two guys. And and he's like, not more than two guys. He's like, No, it's just two guys doing this one specific thing the way that I've been doing it.

Kit 11:48

Yeah, he is so committed to this thing that him and Matt are doing. And I mean, even at the start of the episode, like obviously previous episode, Jay has cursed the hole, Matt is really upset with him, they've broken up the band, all of that. In this episode, when Jay goes out to go get a pumpkin in the big box of airheads, he sees that the Rivoli is doing a battle of the bands, and his immediate thought is to call Matt. But Matt doesn't hear him because he's practicing with the Born Ruffians.

Steve 12:12

It's really sweet. And also, I think this is really interesting character study for Matt. Because while he is either intentionally ignoring Jay or not, you can see as the Born Ruffians are buying into his shit, like he's like, Oh, a band needs to have a laugh. Like it goes through all of them, whatever. He's getting angrier and angrier and trying to be more and more off-putting to try and force them to kick him out. He first he's like, Oh, we gotta do this thing with this laugh or whatever, you know, and it's going, and then eventually he's like, $15 for this is gonna go to the fighting the Iraq war, and by that I mean killing Iraqis. And it just he's escalating. Because they they're not being like, oh come on, we don't have to do the laughing, like, let's do it. And then they're yes anding him, and they're doing the bits and they're going along, and you can see Matt being like, uh-uh, I guess I gotta push it more. And that was my read is that the more that they wanted him, they were taking him on, the more he missed the dynamic with Jay, and the more he just felt the need to get worse. I don't know how you two felt.

Kit 13:16

Yeah, that's an interesting read. I didn't really read it as like him escalating the bit to get kicked out. I just kind of read it as just Matt being Matt in a way. Like I didn't see it as an escalation, but I did I it felt to me that he was just getting bored there. And so he left. But that was my take on it.

Michelle 13:34

I don't know, Michelle, if you no, that's sort of how I read it too, was like he they stop they like like his jokes immediately, and then they sort of stop responding to him in the way that he wants and likes, and he gets bored and leaves. But I thought it was. But it could be the escalation. I think that's definitely I think that's an interesting read.

Steve 13:57

Jay often is like Matt, you gotta stop. Like he doesn't always immediately buy into Matt's bits. Like he buys into the plans, but not so much always uh the jokes, and like because Jay cuts him off a lot when he just keeps going. And they ha did not cut Matt off once.

Kit 14:16

Yeah. Yeah. I I mean the only person who really sort of pushed back on him was sort of silent the drummer doing those incredible faces to camera.

Steve 14:23

Mm-hmm. But none of them were like, dude, you're a fucking weirdo. And that's why I was viewing it as the escalation thing. I could again be reading too deeply, but um he gets to like that Iraq war joke was just so aggro and like a fuck you to a non-existent audience that I was like, you are trying to be off-putting, sir, because he doesn't go out in a rage. He like lies about going to get gelato and is just mopey. He's not even like, fuck yeah, I got out of there. He's just like, okay, I'm gonna call Jay now.

Kit 14:57

Gonna call Jay and walk around this park and chase some birds.

Michelle 15:00

I feel like whether you read it as him like intentionally escalating or not, it's an interesting thing where like he over time is like, this is in the same way that Jay keeps like saying no to all these people and like finding reasons to kick him out of kick them out of the apartment. Matt's saying, like, this isn't right because I'm not with my guy.

Steve 15:21

And he leaves his jacket and doesn't even bother to go back for it.

Michelle 15:24

Like, and he's not wearing the hat at all this episode, which is he's just he's not himself.

Steve 15:32

No, and in the park, he's literally chasing a bird. Just like his heart has been chasing the whole episode.

Michelle 15:39

Yearning.

Kit 15:40

I'm thriving right now.

Michelle 15:42

I do have a note on my list for this episode that is um just incredible goose acting.

Steve 15:47

Oh yeah. Did you too watch the commentary?

Michelle 15:50

Yeah. Yes.

Steve 15:51

Where Matt reveals that that's just a thing he does, chase geese around the park.

Michelle 15:55

Of course he does.

Steve 15:56

I was like, yeah, it seems like a thing you would do, sir.

Michelle 15:59

I think one of my favorite lines from this episode is when he's on the phone calling Jay back. And he's like, uh, his goose is probably gonna be good for a couple more hours. And then the goose immediately flies away when he gets off the phone.

Steve 16:13

And then he's like, Oh wait, I gotta stop him from going to get his friends. He's Matt and Goose are just like one of the greatest comedy pairings we've seen, besides Matt and Jay.

Kit 16:23

So, in a way, he did find a replacement for Jay, who was just three Canadian geese in the park.

Michelle 16:29

I do think it's possible that a Canada goose is a creature that most closely matches Matt Johnson for like inherent level of chaos.

Steve 16:42

I like this theory.

Michelle 16:43

I'll keep working on it. This is a this is a theory that I invented in this exact moment. Uh, so I'll build my body of evidence.

Steve 16:51

I will be checking back in on this soon enough. Especially what bird you think Jay is on top of it.

Michelle 16:57

Yeah. I don't know. I have thoughts, but not an answer yet.

Steve 17:01

Fair. Um, I I found the commentary, you know, really intriguing. The couple things was Jay being the music one of the musical directors at Second City. I was like, that's a pretty big fucking deal, man. Mm-hmm. I didn't know that he was that entrenched in like the local comedy scene at the time.

Michelle 17:20

I think that was one of the things that was mentioned in the zine that you shared a couple weeks ago, kit, was like Jay's journey to doing that. Was he at Berkeley, is that right? The like fancy music school, and he dropped out, and his parents were pressuring him to get a job, and he got this job at Second City. And uh he's like, Oh, music director sounds like a fancy title, but like I just play piano for comedians, and I have no context for that world and like how fancy of a title it is or is not. Maybe he was just downplaying it, but it does sound like impressive and that like connects them to this big network of improvisers and comedians that I think is cool, and like you start to see in this episode how that community comes into this show and I assume will continue being a part of the show.

Steve 18:09

I think it's really sweet that they put all of their friends in the credits with like the picture of them, like an in memorium segment, just to make sure you know who each person was. And it it just was clearly such a labor of hey, let's spend time with our buds. And they even call that out in the commentary. They're like, I don't think anybody like is gonna like this one because this was just for us.

Kit 18:30

Yeah. Yeah, I was so shocked to hear that in the commentary. They're like, oh yeah, this is like personal, like, no one's really gonna like this. It'll this episode only really gets good when the smashing pumpkin needle drop happens. And I was just like, no, dude, I was having a great time this entire time, even before I knew that these people were your friends. I thought these were just like random people you pulled in or like people that you knew. I didn't realize these were like your buddies that you wanted to be in the show with you because they're your friends and you want them to be part of this thing. Like it made it even better, honestly.

Steve 18:59

You can tell that they all have a like a vibe together and they're not just actors that they brought in. The one guy who's like, oh, you're filming? My uncle's a man for Canadian, so you think you can dance? That's one of my other favorite lines from this entire episode. And then they, you know, they reveal that the guy who's like fake Matt that comes in at the end is one of the main stage players in Second City, which in terms of improv is kind of a big fucking deal. Mm-hmm.

Michelle 19:27

I looked him up on IMDb. I'm forgetting his name right now. We can check. Um uh, but he seems to continue appearing in Nirvana the Band, the the Vice Land series, and then he's in the movie. He seemed so familiar when I saw him. And I'm assuming this is just that I remember seeing him in the movie.

Kit 19:47

I feel like since Matt and Jay are separated for the majority of this episode until the very end, I know we spent a lot of time on this podcast, sort of like as Matt Johnson's little fan club, but I think we should spend some time talking about how great Jay is in this episode. Like, obviously, like they've mentioned that, you know, he had to lead all his friends through these like comedic scenes and everything. And I also loved that that improv song that he did um where that they made it up on the spot, and apparently they were prof him and the person involved like were actually performing it because they wrote a second verse. Like, such a good song.

Steve 20:22

Well, they said that they improvised it for that scene, then later added a second verse and have performed it live many times. I thought that was really fascinating. And Jay is really fucking funny on this episode. The way that he goes from confused to full of rage in like two seconds really made me cackle.

Michelle 20:43

When that guy comes in who is doing an impression of Matt, basically, Jay at some point turns to the camera and just makes this beautiful, excited, like wide-open smile that is so delightful and charming and made me laugh out loud because it's the face that I was making in that moment when I realized this was a person who was like wearing Matt's suit and being him in a slightly different body.

Steve 21:10

What do we think about Jay drawing the line at this guy eating warheads that were supposed to be for children? I found that to be a really interesting character beat that that was such a slight, you know?

Kit 21:22

I didn't understand why that was so upsetting, but I was just like, we're just rolling with it, I guess.

Steve 21:28

Because they don't have a lot of moral boundaries. No. And do we think it was him just looking, like even subconsciously, for a reason to get this Matt impersonator out? Or is it that Jay truly has like this line of like, hey, I bought candy for children, you cannot have it.

Michelle 21:43

I my heart tells me that it's like like Matt finding a reason to leave the studio with the bored ruffians, like just having a moment of like, this could work, but you're not right, so I don't want it to. Get out of here. And then it sets up one of the most beautiful. moments in the show so far, which is this guy stealing the box, him running outside, Jay chasing him, and Matt witnessing while he's coming to deliver his I'm sorry pumpkin, Jay chasing after someone else with a box, just like they used to do.

Steve 22:15

That got me a little bit. Devastating.

Kit 22:17

And then the needle drop? Oh my god. It's so emotional.

Steve 22:22

It really is. And the raw power of smashing pumpkins.

Kit 22:26

I had already liked the episode, but once that hit, I was locked in a hundred percent. Like so good.

Steve 22:33

It's the most sincere that they were like outwardly in the whole web series.

Michelle 22:40

That feels right. I do also, if we can back up for one second, the moment where he's approaching the apartment and carrying his I'm sorry pumpkin is some of my favorite fictional Matt Johnson lore of the show so far, which is him being like, this is how we apologize in my family. And like just explaining that you leave an I'm sorry pumpkin outside the door so you don't have to be there, but you can still apologize. And then a really great interaction with someone passing by to be like, I bet you really fucked up.

Steve 23:12

I like that he goes on to be like this is how the green goblin apologizes.

SPEAKER_01 23:15

Yeah.

Steve 23:16

Because he can't sit with it for more than a second that he has to go into like a Willem Dafoe impression.

Kit 23:22

We've all been there holding a pumpkin and then going into a Willem Dafoe. Who has Avenge me? Yeah.

Steve 23:27

I say that in the mirror every morning. I yell avenge me.

Kit 23:32

Not it's showtime.

Steve 23:33

Nope.

Michelle 23:34

Not yelling at an old woman to finish her prayer.

Steve 23:37

Insert other Willem Dafoe reference not uh being a lighthouse keeper not spilling beans yeah that's um can I go back to the the park for a minute? Yes of course I laughed so hard at Matt looking at a guy taking phone be like oh uh peeping tom's still at it yeah I know the game which is so bizarre and Matt casually dropping yeah obviously I have a peeping tom who takes pictures of people.

Michelle 24:08

Yeah that's what you do.

Steve 24:09

And the guy does not react.

Michelle 24:11

And he's like clearly taking pictures of like birds or plants or yeah that's a type of peeping Michelle. That's the kind of peeping I do all the time. Whoa leaf peeping like a leaf peeper. I've never traveled specifically to see leaves change color but I have I have peeped some leaves on premises you got that casual peefe?

Kit 24:34

Yeah that's that's the excuse she used she's going to see the cherry blossoms on on January 6th I heard it was bloom yeah um one thing I do want to go back to is Matt and Jay's contact photos when they call each other just shirtless flexing in front of the camera. Why guys why is that your contact photo for each other I think you know here's my question why not?

Steve 25:05

I I think it's a good bit I mean I don't want my phone ringing and having a shirtless person on it but you know it it's a pretty good bit when you're in your 20s.

Michelle 25:16

I also loved seeing that old iPhone interface I this is not the point of that whatsoever but just really nice took me back.

Steve 25:24

I enjoyed seeing Matt have a third phone number in his phone sorry fourth phone number in his phone because he had a text from somebody else right he met a fourth person. Good job incredible good job Matt when we get to or to go you know bring it all the way to the end like when we get to the part where Matt starts smashing the pumpkins against the door I love this woman that runs up and just starts joining him in it. Mm-hmm because she is so hyped. And then the second woman comes up that's like picking up the pieces and in the commentary they say that she showed up and was talking about how they could use pieces of pumpkins to feed the homeless which is one of the most psychotic things I've ever heard.

Michelle 26:02

Yeah piece of broken pumpkin that have been on the ground.

Steve 26:05

On the ground do not have a pie at that lady's house.

unknown 26:09

No.

Steve 26:10

How do we feel about the end of this episode?

Kit 26:12

So I love the way that this episode progresses we have Matt seeing Jay and fake Matt running down the sidewalk and then we see Matt is smashing the pumpkins and then we see Jay going up the stairs. I love that scene of him going up the stairs to the music he opens the door and then Matt has presumably hung himself right and then Jay running to go to him. He's so upset all of that and then to see Matt just start laughing. The first time I saw this episode I was laughing so hard I thought I was going to throw up like it it was so funny to me. His facial reac his facial expression where he just sort of like puts his hands up in like a sort of half-hearted shrug and is like laughing so hard. So funny to me because you have like the whiplash of like oh my God did Matt just hang himself there's no way and then of course it's all a fucking bit to like make Jay feel bad about running around with his other man on the streets of Toronto.

Steve 27:15

He's his facial reaction is basically but as a face. Yeah. But you know even though I knew he was faking I teared up at Jay's reaction to thinking Matt was dead.

Kit 27:29

Yeah.

Steve 27:29

Because it it is such a it's such a good acting by Jay. Because it seems like he's really distraught.

Michelle 27:37

Yeah I think it works in the show like because there is a moment of taking it very seriously and then revealing that it's a joke. It would have been really easy to do this like badly but I don't think it was.

Steve 27:54

I think part of that is in Jay finding it funny. Yeah.

Michelle 27:58

Yeah.

Steve 27:58

I think if Jay was like inconsolable it would stop being humorous. Yeah.

Michelle 28:04

Yeah and I think like it's such a nice button on the end of this episode where they've both been like trying and failing to find other ways to meet what each other are in their lives is like this is the only person who could make this joke and Jay would laugh. And it's the only person Matt could make that joke to who would think it was funny.

Kit 28:27

It's just such a great bit of acting from Jay where you see him go from being like so devastated like grabbing Matt, all of that seeing Matt like laughing like haha got you and then the the di like watching all of his emotions wash over Jay until he's like oh yeah this is pretty fucking funny. How dare you like it's it's such a good bit.

Michelle 28:47

Yeah. And I don't I don't know if this is gonna continue to hold true for the remaining episodes of the web series but that noose just stays in the middle of their living room throughout at least the next episode and I'm assuming maybe for the rest of the web series. Who's to say well now it's a sex news.

Kit 29:07

It was always a sex noose right yeah in a way aren't all nooses in your living room a sex noose it's definitely a conversation starter my brain broke when Matt reveals in the commentary that he always wanted to do a fake hanging at his future wedding same yes and Jay is so appalled by this concept one of them says oh I guess we have different tastes in weddings and I was just like yeah obviously why the fuck would you want to do that at your wedding Matt I have a theory it's uh weddings are too sincere for Mr.

Steve 29:42

fictional and maybe real Matt Johnson.

Michelle 29:46

You gotta really counterbalance the love and affection with a fake hanging I would use squibs at my wedding if I could have just making it look like my chest exploded that's cartoony enough.

Kit 29:59

What in what way? Like you were shot alien chest monster like what's what's the vibe?

Steve 30:06

Just spontaneous squibing. Nice.

Michelle 30:09

I I'm trying to imagine at what point in the ceremony or reception do you imagine this taking place?

Steve 30:17

I know pronounce you no sorry it's until death do you part is really when you do it and then all the squibs go off. That's better. You gotta workshop it a little bit would it just be you with squibs or both parties? You both know who I'm married to do you really think they would allow squibs to go off on themselves I I think if it was funny enough they would let it happen. Fair. Yeah you would have to make a strong case I was informed that I was only allowed to do a Borad impression once like before the wedding I was told you are only allowed to say my wife once make it count once?

Kit 30:58

Come on that's not fair. It was not very nice oh my god enough about weddings I know you guys have watched the commentary but have you guys seen the clip from the deleted scenes where they're talking about the setup of this the shot of May of Matt being hung I have not no okay um so in the deleted scenes there is a section there where it is Jay talking to camera with Matt sort of ready with the noose around his neck they're getting ready to shoot the scene um and Jared is there filming um and they're talking about they're basically treating it as Matt's last will and testament where they're like if this doesn't go well and I die Matt goes you need to use the shot you have to use the shot or I die. Oh my God. Jared is going no we're not gonna do that. We're obviously not going to do that and Jay immediately was like no no no we'll use it we'll use it um it is such an incredible moment of seeing their friendship of like yeah of course Jay would use the shot this is like really funny and also important to the both of them um but I will I will find the scene and send it to both of you. It's incredible.

Michelle 32:15

Did they say like how they set it up because I think when they first show it I was like trying to look at it and see where the supports were like it it's a remarkably I don't know convincing stunt for like the level of production that the series has.

Kit 32:35

Yeah they didn't explain in the deleted scene how they did it but it it did seem like there is a high possibility that Matt could have possibly actually hung himself or at least that's how I interpret it given his life for the bit. Yeah.

Steve 32:50

Well Matt looks like puffier on the back so I kind of assume there was a harness involved that would make sense. Well when they come on the show that's the first question yeah is how'd you do the hanging?

Kit 33:02

Second question is Matt Johnson are you still a hater?

Steve 33:05

Okay the second question is when you hang yourself you know we did get that right Michelle can you put that on the whiteboard those are our first two questions questions for Matt Are you still a hater? How'd you do the hanging and Jay, first question why are you such a cutie pie? Uh great noted thank you.

Kit 33:25

Yeah I feel like all of our questions for Matt will be very hard hitting and all of our questions for Jay will just be heart eyes emoji for like 20 minutes. Yeah.

Steve 33:33

Michelle looks at him and says I just have a quick question.

Michelle 33:40

I would say how'd you get so cute but I know that the answer is from his very cute dad.

Steve 33:45

Yeah. When we get Jay's dad on the show. Well ask him how'd you get so cute?

Michelle 33:49

Yeah that's the real investigative journalism that we need.

Kit 33:52

Yeah this is now uh a podcast sponsored by myancestry com interrogating Jay McCarroll's genealogy um we are going to be put in jail uh very normal please don't sue us do we have any other thoughts on uh episode seven it does end with the kind of setup for the next episode where Matt runs into the room with sort of ski masks and is like we have to go we have to go and then just kidding actually I have a coffee and I have to do something for my mom. Um but yeah I do love that and I know that we're seven episodes into this but I'm always shocked every single time at the the arcs that exist in this web series.

Steve 34:37

Yeah. And also we're in two episodes in a row where we learn about Matt's kind of weird relationship with his mom.

Michelle 34:44

Mm-hmm. There's a lot of fictional Matt Johnson family lore stuffed into these two episodes.

Steve 34:51

Intriguing I do wonder why that started to pop up. Yeah I don't know huh because it's not really a character beat before you know a character trait before it is this one oh I gotta do something for my mom and then the next one is like oh my mom takes me to get my hair cut I'm really excited to talk about the haircut.

Kit 35:10

Have you two seen that clip for when uh Matt Johnson went on Stabby's world yes I have I have not he asked his mom if he's handsome and she she flat out said no but he's interesting looking yeah devastating to be honest I don't know how he recovered from that if my mother did that to me I would have jumped off a building heartbreaking to hear from your mom. Yeah that's episode seven well um I did want to come back and provide another little interview for you guys to look at uh I feel like a little cat that runs around into the woods of uh fandom and Twitter and all of that um and comes back with a little dead mouse and leaves it on your doorstep to look at. This one is an interview with Jared Robb and Matt Johnson um with a YouTuber named I believe it's Patrick Tomaso and it's from the video I didn't know you could make a movie like this. And so it's uh Jared and Matt talking to the YouTuber Patrick about um the the process of filming Nirvana the band, the movie, but they also talk a lot about the web series itself and sort of how the decisions that were made in the web series um kind of became their Bible for how they handled certain things um in terms of how things looked, how things were shot, moving on through the rest of the web series, into the Vice television show and into the movie itself. Really interesting interview. Highly recommend checking it out all together. But something I found particularly interesting from this interview was at the very top of it where they're talking about almost like color theory. It's a conversation with Jared and Matt where they say the fact that these characters always begin and end in a warm space that's really their own and then without changing the color temperature they go out into a cold space. And that the world is neutral and cold and real and then they come back into their apartment where they're in their own world where everything is warm and they're safe. Which I think is such a fascinating way to look at that because when Jared is talking about this specifically the reason why this happened is because they just didn't know anything about lighting. So of course the apartment was warm and orange toned for going outside and doing the man on the street stuff that's cold and neutral.

Michelle 37:24

I love this. I think this is so interesting. I think it's another one of these perfect things where they talk about this being something yeah that they weren't doing on purpose that it was an accident and then once they sort of realized they leaned into it. And um that feels like it's such like a interesting microcosm for the whole show is is a lot of this is like beautiful happy accidents that they sort of find what feels good and lean into it and keep doing that thing, even if it was not necessarily on purpose initially. And like that holds true for like all of their man on the street interactions and like these things that are just sort of happening but then they become essential DNA to the show.

Steve 38:12

Yeah they're building out their both their world and their techniques and their visual language in a way that just shows how much care there is. And I it is really interesting to see just how observant they are.

SPEAKER_02 38:26

Mm-hmm.

Steve 38:27

Yeah. Versus a lot of things of the era which were very much let's shoot some shit and throw it out there. Just this is you can see like the origins of Matt Johnson the filmmaker.

Kit 38:36

Mm-hmm. And it also kind of goes back to I think the episode the basement where I think in the commentary they were talking about how they tried to do lighting in there and it just didn't really quite work. Either because of you know how how small the space was or anything like that. And so I mean I think some of the stylistic choices were either they didn't know or budget or just sort of how things happened. But I love that they continued to use some of the same language in a way moving forward to sort of make the the web series and the vice show and then we all feel interconnected even though technically maybe they're not a strong visual language will without them realizing it get audiences to stay with your consistency even if your plot changes.

Steve 39:26

Think about like Evil Dead. Evil Dead 2 basically remakes Evil Dead 1 in the first 10 minutes but the rainy visual language and the way that he does stuff and the way that his movies look like you don't give a shit. Because it is the same thing. It's a continuation but with a different tone. But that visual consistency does make them the same series you know that's a really interesting parallel.

Michelle 39:51

I haven't seen Evil Dead 1, but I have seen Evil Dead 2, which I think when we all watched Evil Dead 2 together you told me it was okay because now I have seen Evil Dead 1 in the first 20 minutes of Evil Dead 2.

Steve 40:04

Uh also Evil Dead 1 not a Michelle film.

Kit 40:07

No, you would not have fun. Great I will continue to not have watched it it's a Evil Dead 2 though masterpiece Evil Dead 2 really fun. 10 out of 10 I still love the original Evil Dead but it's not a Michelle movie.

Steve 40:20

No I think it should be it's great except for that one scene.

Kit 40:24

Yep that scene sucks immensely hate it.

Steve 40:27

Seen that Sam Raimi has apologized for Steve have you ever seen the musical for Evil Dead? Buddy I've seen it who do you think was their opening night of previews off Broadway and also has gone to see the production they do in New Jersey every Halloween.

Kit 40:43

Okay I'm sorry I didn't know this intrinsic part of Steve lore. Um no I was just asking because I was also really bummed that when I saw the musical God when I was in high school so a billion years ago uh that they also include that scene in there. Mm-hmm hate it.

Michelle 40:59

I'm so delighted to not have any clue what you're talking about.

Steve 41:02

Yeah you should be you don't want to know. Though when I did see that I was in the splatter zone. Oh which the musical does have a splatter zone where in which you are covered in blood.

Michelle 41:14

Do you get ponchos like SeaWorld?

Steve 41:16

You are allowed to bring a poncho. Yeah but the woman sitting next to me was unaware she was clearly in her sixties and her and her husband were dressed up for the theater oh no and the Off-Broadway production used a blood hose that fucking rocks dude hell yeah we all looked like an Andrew WK album cover walking out of that thing just covered in fake blood and she was not too happy.

Kit 41:43

When you saw it on Off Broadway did they tell you which seats you were in okay so she had an inkling though this was the splash stone.

Steve 41:52

I don't think he told her oh I think he purchased Splatter. Because also the right when it started they were like anybody want to move and they were like nah because you don't assume it to be that much blood.

Kit 42:04

I mean I guess I would be surprised by a blood hose. I would expect like a little bit not a whole fucking hose.

Steve 42:11

Ash cuts the top of the scalp of a dead eye off with a chainsaw and then blood from the brain just sprays out and when I've seen the smaller productions they have basically like little blood shooters that they just fire off at the crowd.

Michelle 42:27

It kind of rocks like Gallagher but not racist is Gallagher racist the ol the literal only thing I know about Gallagher is that he smashes a watermelon.

Steve 42:38

That is the sum total of my knowledge I wish my brain wasn't full of this stuff. Yeah Gallagher's a ghoul good thing he's dead never mind he's dead but yeah tragic smashing incident I'm Facebook friends 100% what wait hold on what did you just say Gallagher would add anybody on Facebook like real truly Gallagher not like when I added the Jonas brothers in middle school and it was definitely a liar making fake Jonas brothers Facebook profiles no it was him he went on a lot of weird rants and then one time he posted accidentally posted a photo of his coffee table with his driver's license and several pill bottles hell yeah brother what I know this has nothing to do with Nirvana the band. It has everything to do with Nirvana Do you two know about Gallagher 2? What are you saying? No So Gallagher retired many of his bits and then his brother toured for years as Gallagher 2. Does his brother look like him? Not that much what but he would chew Gallagher bits and he would book himself advanced don't worry it's Gallagher 2 baby was he also racist? Yes were you also his Facebook friend? No because uh Gallagher

Kit 44:02

Wait, what? What?

Steve 44:03

Yeah. Yeah, it was really weird. There was a lawsuit. You two don't know about the infamous Mark Marin interview?

Michelle 44:09

No. With Gallagher? One or two.

Steve 44:12

One.

Michelle 44:13

Okay.

Steve 44:13

One of the things that made WTF like really pop off, besides the uh Carlos Mencia interview, was Mark Marin interviewing Gallagher and asking him about some of his like recent tirades, uh like racist tirades and shit. And like 15 minutes in, Gallagher walks out of the interview.

Kit 44:32

What? Oh my god.

Steve 44:33

Yeah. And uh it's glorious. And that is one of the things that made WTF popular was him confronting Gallagher and Gallagher storming out.

Kit 44:44

I always thought WTF was popular because Mark Marin is very charming and I have a crush on him.

Steve 44:49

I mean, we all have a crush on Mark Marin. I think it's safe to assume.

Kit 44:53

I thought that's why we all liked WTF, is because we all collectively had a crush on Mark Marin.

Michelle 44:58

I thought he just started a podcast at early enough stages that there were only like six podcasts a person could listen to.

Steve 45:05

That was part of it. But I think why it broke out into normies was the Gallagher thing and also the confronting Carlos Mancia about stealing jokes.

Michelle 45:14

I didn't realize that's where the Carlos Mancia joke stealer thing occurred.

Steve 45:20

It was out there, uh, but he just asked him to his face.

Michelle 45:25

What did he say? I can look up.

Steve 45:27

There's like stories of Carlos Mancia stealing jokes, and then he had another comedian on to talk about the jokes with Stahl, then Carlos Mancia heard it and stormed back to Mark Marin's house to do a second interview. It's good shit.

Michelle 45:38

This is fascinating.

Steve 45:39

WTF, we miss you. Kit, you're gonna edit all this out.

Michelle 45:43

Mark Marin, come on the show.

Steve 45:45

Mark Marin, friend of the pod. You know what? If we had started this six months ago when he was going on every podcast, we could have gotten Mark Marin.

Kit 45:53

There's still time. We can just say we emailed him six months ago and it was in his spam. Mm-hmm.

Steve 45:58

Hey, can you come on for Nirvana the band the show? What is that?

Kit 46:03

Yes. We can talk about your cats. It'll be fine.

Steve 46:06

Talk about your coffee. I don't give a shit. Almost famous. Let's do it.

Kit 46:10

I love that we have so many upcoming guest episodes that have nothing to do with Nirvana the Band. We have the Mark Marin Cats and Coffee. We have Seth McFarland, Frank Sinatra. Um, I love that we're slowly also turning into a JJ Abrams podcast because we have brought him up in every single fucking episode so far. Um, so I'd love to get him on the pod. Contractually obligated.

Steve 46:36

Please. Hey, hey, JJ.

Kit 46:38

Can we have a real Cloverfield movie, please?

Steve 46:40

Uh Bad Robot's basically out of business and being sold off for scraps, so I don't think that's gonna be happening.

Kit 46:46

What? What happened to Bad Robot?

Steve 46:48

I was just about to say, I haven't heard anything about what he's doing lately. Yeah, yeah, that show on HBO Max flop and didn't even know he had that. Yeah, exactly. Uh and they closed one of their two offices and fired most of the staff of Bad Robot.

Michelle 47:03

That makes me sad. As as many alias two, as many cruel words as I've had for JJ Abrams. I liked that he existed in the world and was doing whatever he was doing. I had faith that someday he was going to finish something well.

Kit 47:20

He did. It was called Cloverfield.

Michelle 47:22

2008 Cloverfield.

Kit 47:24

He he was enough involved, maybe. Possibly.

Steve 47:30

No.

Kit 47:30

Yes. James on the credits. He was there every day. He was he was in the the suit. That's a good idea.

Steve 47:36

Steven Spielberg Steven Spielberg directed Hamnet.

Kit 47:40

He did. He was the camera operator.

Steve 47:43

Honestly, that would be great.

Kit 47:45

He was Hamnet.

Steve 47:46

Just Steven Spielberg CGI'd onto a baby slowly dying of blake. Steven Spielberg is Hamnet. Hamnet. This time, it's personal. Anyway, we've really lost the plot.

Kit 47:59

I think we're just avoiding dreading what we have to do next. Um all right, everybody. Let's let's buckle in for what we're doing next, which is moving on out of the interlude and into episode eight, The Burn. Matt and Jay try to blackmail Vince Valence two different ways. Through wiretapping his house and by trying to dig up dirt from employees at the Rivoli. Meanwhile, Jay has a crisis about being called Jewish. Opening credits, the wire. So guys, how did we feel about episode eight, The Burn?

Michelle 48:38

I think we really just Oh I think we need to start by addressing the elephant in the room. Just like really get it done first. Um, and it is that Matt got a nice haircut between the last episode and this one. It wasn't too short. He looks really handsome. It doesn't look too short.

Kit 48:54

His mom was wrong. Yep. Uh I think he looks like he belongs in panic at the disco with a haircut, and I mean that affectionately.

Michelle 49:01

I think he does look a little Irish. Especially when he sort of musses the top like that.

unknown 49:06

Yeah.

Steve 49:06

Yeah, I I'm for it. I thought it was cute. I'm for it. But I'm just gonna come out and say my theory. You know how I've gone I've been on the record saying that the Matt character and potentially Matt Johnson, the guy, have this thing where when they are sincere and somewhat emotional, that they immediately pivot to being super aggro and unable to like sit in that sincerity for like a minute. The last episode was deeply sincere and emotional, and whether intentional or not, it really seems like they went, well, let's make the most off-putting episode possible immediately after the emotional one. And it seems thematically consistent.

Kit 49:48

I mean, I could see that. I just to get this out of the way, I don't like this episode. Oh, I sort of hate it. I don't like it. I was dreading talking about this episode when we decided that we were gonna do this podcast. Um I think when we first started this podcast, we talked about how we weren't going to sort of nitpick every single off-color joke because that we would just be here all day, honestly. And that's not very exciting or interesting to listen to of us trying to outwoke Matt Johnson and Jamie Carroll from 2008. Right. And so far that has been fine because the the jokes that have been off-color and insensitive and frankly racist have not been intrinsic to the plot in the way that this one is. This one, we can't not talk about how anti-Semitic it is, the the different moments where Matt is explicitly being racist towards black people with like impressions in the car. It's deeply horrific on so many fundamental levels. And I mean, I I think, yeah, there's the theory that like Matt is like so sincere, so let's make something so off-putting. But when I watched this, I was just like, these are dudes who were on the something awful forums in 2008. These are just internet users who play Magic the Gathering and video games. These are people I hung out with in 2008. Like, yeah, this is just how it is, and that doesn't make it okay. It doesn't. Yeah. But I was just like, this fucking sucks deeply to watch. It sucked then to watch, and it sucks now to watch.

Michelle 51:21

Yeah, it feels very much like guys in their 20s in 2008, and like we know at this point that they have like grown and learned and become more thoughtful people, but it's it wasn't fun to watch.

Steve 51:36

Do we think that it is at all because they do the wire opening, them trying to do a heightened version of all of the racist language uh and shit that was on the wire and failing at it because it's so fucking edgelordy?

Kit 51:52

I think that could be the POV that they're trying to do, but I also just think that like even now Matt Johnson is an edgelord. You know, it's just like less than he was back then. So I do think this is just like Matt and Jay's worst impulses as comedians.

Steve 52:09

Oh, I I definitely think that that's the case. I just wonder if that's the rationale, you know?

Michelle 52:15

Yeah, yeah. I do think I think it was interesting that the commentary for this one is one where they talk almost not at all about what's happening in the actual episode. Because if you do that, you have to like sit there and talk about like this was a shitty joke, and this was a shitty joke, and I can't believe I did that. And like, why am I doing that voice? Why did we dress Jay up as an Orthodox Jew? And it just like feels gross. And yeah, so it makes sense to me that they sidestepped that by saying, like, this is gonna be the commentary where Matt and Jared just talk about, you know, more technical stuff the whole time.

Kit 52:55

I found that so cowardly when I clicked in to listen to the commentary. I was just like, I alright, let's lock in, hear how we're gonna talk about this episode, and then for it to be the two of them just talking about like things that are interesting and important. Like I loved hearing them talk about how they made the show. I just wish it wasn't backdrop to Jay doing like a horrific stereotypical impression.

Steve 53:18

There are two bits in this whole episode that worked for me. The first is when they lay dog poop on Vince Valence's stoop and Vince Valence comes out still wearing the scarf. Got a huge laugh at him. Yeah. And the second is that there was a fire for real, like on the block. So they wrote into it an excuse for to make it look like Jay burned someone's apartment down. And those are the only two laughs I got in the entire episode.

Kit 53:45

Yeah. I also did laugh at the part where they're wiretapping Vince Valence and Jay is just drinking at 9 a.m. and Matt goes, You're really getting lit right now. I thought that was pretty funny, but the laughs are far and few on this one.

Michelle 53:58

I liked when Matt um said Christmas orange. Because I eat oranges on Christmas. That's the thing my family does. Oh my god, me too. Yeah.

Steve 54:07

Not mine. I only learned about Christmas oranges a few years ago.

Michelle 54:10

You can join anytime. It's true. Great tradition.

Steve 54:14

My grandmother used to claim that she only got an orange for Christmas, uh, which was fundamentally untrue because there's many pictures of her in fur coats that my great-grandfather bought. Uh, and I didn't know that a Christmas orange was a thing. I just thought she had a weird lie that she was telling everybody.

Michelle 54:33

I do love an old person weird lie, and I look forward to being an elderly person who can make shit up and never get called on it. I guess I could start doing that now, but I think it's less charming when you're just a regular person in their 30s.

Steve 54:48

Yeah, you just look like a fucking sociopath. Yeah. So, I mean, we could go through the plot of this, but basically it's Matt lies about a guy calling Jay Jewish, and then they spiral, and then they do a wiretap, and then they call the people who work at the Rivoli to try and blackmail Vince Valence, and that's the whole thing. Sorry, I'm really defeated by watching this one.

Michelle 55:08

I I think there's also it seems like they were actually calling real employees of the Rivoli in this one. And I don't know if it's just sort of like the general tenor of this episode not feeling great, but this is one of the moments where the like interacting with real people in the world didn't feel great to me. And I had I got like a little chuckle out of the one person they called who like doesn't seem to want to admit that he doesn't know who's calling him, and he sort of pretends to know who Vince Valence is. Uh, but the rest of it is just like, leave these ladies alone. What are you doing?

Steve 55:47

Yeah. It it felt icky. And in the commentary, they say that all the phone numbers were the real phone numbers of the staff of the Rivoli that someone who worked there leaked to them. Yeah. And that also felt wrong. It just everything about this episode is doing all of the things that we praise them for not doing in other episodes.

Michelle 56:08

I I'm I was trying to figure out why that felt so different from like what was it two or three episodes ago where like they're filming and it's a real like wait staff at the Rubeli who's like really playing along with them and being charming and like may or may not know that they're being filmed. Why does it like I think it being like a phone call in their actual personal phone numbers instead of like in public is what separates those for me. But I'm curious if you guys feel differently.

Steve 56:38

100%. It was them like violating someone's personal space versus we're in public and I'm doing something weird and you're responding to it. Like this was a direct invasion of people's like privacy and personal space.

Kit 56:53

Yeah, it definitely didn't feel good knowing that the numbers that they had were real people from the Rivoli, that the photos that were on the board were real people from the Rivoli, like all of that like felt gross to me to hear in the commentary. Like I was already pretty grossed out, and then I was like, oh, this also kind of sucks.

Steve 57:10

Yeah, I walked away with no deep analysis or overthinking. Uh just kind of feeling like shit.

Kit 57:17

Yeah, this one and the previous one, Battle of the Bands, when I was explaining to you, Michelle, that this is like a saw trap, these both feel like Jay McCarroll saw trap episodes.

SPEAKER_02 57:28

Mm-hmm.

Kit 57:28

In a way, just in different ways. We're like, Battle of the bands, haha, we're having fun.

SPEAKER_02 57:33

Mm-hmm.

Kit 57:34

Like, yes, Matt attempts to kill himself, but it's like a joke. Yeah. This one is just, uh, as I wrote in my notes, a fucking prison.

Steve 57:44

But you know what? I think it's a saw trap to us because Jay fucking dresses up in a racist costume and goes into someone's place of business. Yeah. Like he is just as fucking complicit.

Kit 57:56

Oh, yeah. 100%.

Steve 57:58

Goes back to my whole, they're both dick bags. Like the characters are both dick bags.

Kit 58:03

Mm-hmm.

Steve 58:04

Thing. Though, I don't know if you noticed. If we ever get sued or get a takedown notice, Matt Johnson gave us some evidence to cite in the court case on the commentary here.

Michelle 58:16

Thank you, Matt.

Steve 58:17

He says, Stealing is important. Since it's a web show not being sold, you can do whatever you want. If you get a comment from lawyers, just take it down and put it back up in a week.

Kit 58:30

Words to live by.

Steve 58:31

So, um, when I saw uh the opening night of the People's Joker, Vera Drew said that the way that she got that movie out, despite Warner Brothers not wanting it, was they found out that Peter Soffron, head of DC uh movies, had uh illegally used Batman in a parody movie that he produced, and that was the legal loophole she found to get the People's Joker out.

Michelle 58:53

Whoa.

Kit 58:55

Rocked.

Steve 58:55

Yeah, rocked. She's fucking Vera Drew, come on the fucking show.

Kit 58:59

We love you.

Steve 59:00

I love her so much. Um but if we ever get a season desist or a takedown notice, motherfuckers, we got you. That's the one upside to episode eight.

Michelle 59:12

The secrets hidden in the commentary for the worst episode so far.

Kit 59:16

Yeah, I mean the commentary in this is great. I I felt very if I wasn't looking at the screen, I felt very inspired by what they were saying. Yeah, like you film school is telling you need all of this stuff. You don't actually, you really just need like a couple friends and like a good camera and a mic, and you're good to fucking go. Like all of that I found really incredible. And then hearing them talk about how they got some of these shots that like the Queen Street fire, they only got it because him and Jay were playing Diablo 2 at like four in the morning, and they rushed out with their cameras and shot like four different versions of reactions to it. Yeah. That's incredible. And I I feel that right now Nirvana the band is in this really interesting inflection point with fans, where like it was already popular with certain groups of people, but I feel like it's really exploded since the movie. Yeah. And I think part of that does have to do with the sort of like DIY ethic of it, like and the and the aesthetics. And like you walk out of there feeling inspired to just go make shit with your friends. And I feel like this commentary really gets at that. Like, I'm not a person who ever was interested in like making videos or movies or anything but like that, but you just sort of feel it when you watch their stuff. That like, oh man, I want to hang out with my buddies and just like make something cool.

Steve 1:00:34

That's what prompted this fucking show. You know, we were b all felt pretty inspired to connect with our pals. So thank you to this commentary for reinforcing that, but uh fuck you to this episode.

Kit 1:00:47

True.

Steve 1:00:47

Agreed. Watch the last five minutes for the fire stuff, because I think that is a really big shift in how they make stuff with the whole a thing happens and we'll write around it that does happen in the movie in a pretty big way. And we capture this raw footage, how do we make the show fit it? So that's important.

Michelle 1:01:07

Yeah. Watch the first 30 seconds to see uh well no, I guess it's a little longer. See Matt's nice haircut and then the fire at the end, and you can skip the whole most of the episode.

Steve 1:01:19

Yeah.

Kit 1:01:20

It is a really nice haircut. It's a really nice haircut.

Steve 1:01:23

He looks cute. Ah, episode eight. Bad vibes.

Kit 1:01:28

You know what isn't a bad vibe?

Michelle 1:01:30

The Cloverfield Monster?

Kit 1:01:31

The Cloverfield Monster.

Michelle 1:01:33

Yeah, it's I don't it feels like bad vibes to end the episode on.

Kit 1:01:37

Yeah. I mean, we could go through our plans, see if we've gotten anybody lately.

Steve 1:01:42

Uh sure.

Kit 1:01:43

Um but we Yeah.

Steve 1:01:46

We have.

Kit 1:01:47

That also might be a bad time. We should also probably explain how the production of this podcast has worked. In that we are recording this episode, episode four, the day before episode one officially goes live. So if you have sent us feedback about anything, wait a month. We waited a little bit. We haven't we haven't heard it. I'm sorry.

Michelle 1:02:12

Uh uh, we have been absolutely shocked by the level of interest to our no episodes yet, uh, which is fascinating and delightful and a little bit scary.

Steve 1:02:26

In terms of good vibes, I'd like to call out just how wonderful it's been to see the support of the fan community and the enthusiasm for a thing that has not even come out yet. And I hope y'all are enjoying it. Obviously, we want to hear your feedback. You know, we want to make the best show we can, even though we are just three friends fucking around. But I really love the response we've gotten, even before we've dropped. It's really, really heartening, especially me, anti-fandom, McGee, being like, y'all seem really nice.

Michelle 1:02:54

Yeah. Uh Steve, before we started recording, Steve did share with us that um Nirvana the Band, the show, is one of the fastest growing fandoms on AO3 this week. Um so I think there's just there's a real there's a real appetite for content about it, and I hope you enjoy our stupid version of doing that.

Steve 1:03:17

We got to it a month before all the fanfiction writers.

Michelle 1:03:20

Yeah, we got to it before them. Definitely. Wink.

Steve 1:03:24

And you know, I would talk about the New York Mets, but that is also a bad vibe right now.

Michelle 1:03:29

Live podcasts at the Mets at Citi Fields, podcast face reveal.

Kit 1:03:34

Yes. Oh my god, can we do it with Mr. Met? And they have to guess which one of us is not Mr. Met. I'm the one What if Mr. Met is one of us?

Steve 1:03:42

I'm the one looking off to the side at his wife.

Kit 1:03:45

Oh my god.

Michelle 1:03:46

She's so hot. I'm sorry. You don't have to apologize. I I don't think either of us disagree.

Kit 1:03:53

No, no, we don't disagree.

Steve 1:03:55

I do think Kit is slightly bothered for by how horny I am for Mrs. Matt.

Kit 1:04:00

It's it's pretty horny, okay? Like, it's it's a little more than anticipated for a mascot.

Michelle 1:04:06

Um it's weird how your eyes like physically pop out of your head and like go three feet out and get way bigger every time.

Steve 1:04:14

I do turn into a cartoon wolf.

Michelle 1:04:16

Yeah.

Steve 1:04:17

Hammina, humina, hummina. Yeah. I'd do a January 6th for Mrs. Met's affection.

Kit 1:04:22

What does that mean, Steve? What does that mean?

Steve 1:04:24

I don't know, but I wanted to bring up Michelle Storming the Capitol one last time before we retire the bid.

Kit 1:04:29

Like, what in this scenario is Mr. Met the president and he's like Stop the Steal. No, like I don't Is it Steve Cohen? Like, what are we talking about here?

Steve 1:04:39

Okay, I got it. The Mets are out of ABS challenges, and the umpire makes a bad call, and Mr. Met's like, stop the steal, and Mrs. Met's like, yeah, and then they want me to storm the field to punch an umpire.

Michelle 1:04:52

Okay. I bet there's a lectern somewhere in there that you could steal.

Steve 1:04:57

Yeah. There is. I took a picture with it recently when I did a tour.

Michelle 1:05:00

You could oh, you did a tour. Take that bad boy out.

Steve 1:05:03

Yeah.

Michelle 1:05:04

Your very own January 6th. Mm-hmm.

Steve 1:05:07

I did a J6 at the Mets.

Michelle 1:05:10

And all I got was this t-shirt.

Steve 1:05:12

Okay, fan art. We need somebody to make a Michelle Michelle participated in January 6th, and all she got was a stupid t-shirt. I might make that myself.

Michelle 1:05:24

Is there a rule that you can't make fan art for your own show?

Steve 1:05:28

I think we just are making merch now.

Kit 1:05:31

Yeah. January 6th merch for our band show podcast.

Steve 1:05:36

One of them is gonna be me that says, I'm sorry to the Cloverfield Monster. One of them is I stormed the Capitol, and I'll let go is the stupid t-shirt and kit. We gotta make uh kit merchandise.

Kit 1:05:47

Yeah.

Steve 1:05:48

I don't know what it's gonna be.

Kit 1:05:49

We'll get there.

Steve 1:05:50

We'll get there. But you know, anything else y'all wanna talk about or add before we go off to hopefully better vibes next week.

Kit 1:06:00

I mean, I know we have ended this one on a a real a real rough one. This was a real heaven and hell episode. Um, but Michelle, we are almost at the end. We have two more episodes left. How are you feeling? Three more episodes left. You are correct. I don't know how to count.

Steve 1:06:17

Oh, I know. Remember what happened last episode?

Kit 1:06:19

No.

Michelle 1:06:21

Uh I'm feeling good. I've been having a lot of good times. I've been having a laugh. I'm really excited for the production value to go up slightly. Uh, but also I've I've just like grown really fond of these boys. It's it's interesting to watch the show the way we have been for this, because I've been watching each episode a couple times so that I have like notes and thoughts and things to talk about. And I realized earlier today that like this is exactly how I think I would have consumed something like this if I had encountered it when it was going live. Because like this is how I consume the things I loved then, which was like they only come out every couple weeks or every couple months. I'm just gonna like keep watching it what I can over and over while I have it. Um and like developing parasocial bonds to the people acting in it. Um and I don't know, it's it's really interesting to sort of replicate that experience and not just like binge it in its entirety the whole way through.

Steve 1:07:28

It's much better to do it that way, I feel. Like me checking in on them once a week and and doing this thing where I'm like refusing to go back to any of the other stuff has allowed me to really appreciate the show in a different way. It's really beautiful.

Kit 1:07:43

Yeah. I wish I could say the same. I have been just watching everything all the time, have not stopped.

Michelle 1:07:50

I might watch the movie again before we get to the movie in podcast land, because that's still quite a ways off.

Steve 1:07:57

By the time that episode comes out, I will have my Blu-ray, so I'm waiting for that.

Michelle 1:08:01

I can't wait.

Steve 1:08:02

We're gonna have so much fun with the making of features. I hope so.

Michelle 1:08:07

Although, there is part of me that like doesn't at all want to know how they've made things, and maybe the making of will leave some secrets. I don't know.

Steve 1:08:16

That'll be just me and Kit that episode.

Kit 1:08:19

Yeah, it'll be you being like, oh, I'm so excited that they explained how they did this, and me going, it's all real. None of this was fake. 9-11 was an inside job.

Steve 1:08:28

Like, it's Marion Coltiard on the podcast. You know, because she thinks 9-11 was fake.

Kit 1:08:35

Didn't know that.

Steve 1:08:36

Well, there you go.

Michelle 1:08:37

You are full of such terrible cursed information.

Steve 1:08:42

Do you think I want to be like this? Yes. I really don't. I wish I had better things in my brain than OJ Simpson reality prank shows.

Michelle 1:08:54

Doesn't Marianne Catilliard also think the moon landing is fake?

Steve 1:08:59

Seems like a thing she'd believe.

Kit 1:09:01

If you believe one of those things, you probably believe the other.

Steve 1:09:03

Okay, before we go, can I just explain to you what her 9-11 conspiracy is because it's incredible.

Michelle 1:09:08

Wait, not the usual?

Steve 1:09:10

Yeah, I thought there was kind of just the one she thinks that the people who own the building wanted to tear it down for insurance money, and it was too expensive.

Kit 1:09:20

The World Trade Center?

Steve 1:09:22

And it was too expensive to just demolish it, so they flew a couple of planes into it.

Kit 1:09:29

At that? The World Trade Center.

Steve 1:09:32

Like a guy burning down a bodega for the insurance money. Oh, they just flew a few planes into the World Trade Center.

Kit 1:09:38

What about the Pentagon? What about that field in Pennsylvania?

Steve 1:09:42

Oh man, this episode went off the fucking grass.

Kit 1:09:45

Yep.

Steve 1:09:46

Hey listeners. I want to thank you for bearing with us. I don't know what's gonna make it into the episode, but some of it will.

Kit 1:09:56

Ugh. Yeah, the cut I'm gonna release is gonna be just like 15 minutes.

Steve 1:10:02

Release the unredacted cut. Where in which I get several facts wrong. Uh anywho, uh I'm excited to get back to other episodes next week with you too. Because we are so close to the Viceland series.

Kit 1:10:18

I can't wait. And we finally get to go through some of the little bits and bobs from the web series.

Steve 1:10:24

Yeah.

Kit 1:10:25

Cannot wait, Michelle, to show you Nikki Nikki Nine Doors.

Steve 1:10:29

It's pretty great.

Kit 1:10:30

I can't wait. I don't know if you've already seen it, but I it's very important to me.

Michelle 1:10:34

I have not seen the full episode that it comes from. I think I've seen a clip or two from it.

Kit 1:10:40

Okay.

Michelle 1:10:41

So just I tried to scroll away when I realized that was happening. I am excited to talk for three and a half hours about uh Wii Shop update day.

Steve 1:10:51

Are we so just so we have this clear, we're finishing the web series, we're gonna do the odds and ends, and then the Vice Land series.

Michelle 1:11:00

That was my interpretation, but I'm cool, cool, cool. No, I'm gonna see chronological order.

Steve 1:11:06

Yeah.

Michelle 1:11:06

Yeah, that feels right.

Steve 1:11:08

No, you're right. I totally forgot about it. Episode eight broke me so like deep in my core that I forgot the format of our podcast.

Kit 1:11:17

It's understandable.

Michelle 1:11:18

Well, it's okay. We're just here to talk about the Cloverfield movies.

Kit 1:11:22

Kit, good luck editing this one. Yeah. Is there anything else we wanted to talk about before I do the outro?

Steve 1:11:29

No, I don't think so. I love you all. Thanks for listening.

Kit 1:11:32

Love you. Thank you all for listening. We're super excited to keep on watching the show. Uh next week we'll be covering episodes nine and ten. And yeah, nothing like a good feeling. Nothing like a good feeling.

Steve 1:11:47

Jet fuel can't melt steel beams.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:49

God damn it, Steve!

Steve 1:11:53

Nothing like Thank you for listening to Nirvana the Band The Show the Podcast. We'd love to hear from you. You can email us or send a voice memo to NirvanaThePod at gmail.com. And we're also on Blue Sky and Instagram at NirvanaThePod. Our website is nirvana the pod.com. Our show is edited by Kit with additional help by John. Special thanks to Anne Meadows for our logo. Oh, and Matt and Jay, if you're listening, we'd love to have you on the show.