Lone Star Trail
Texas themed hunting and fishing interviews featuring experts and real tales from the field.
Lone Star Trail
Screwworm Confirmed and a Colorado Perspective
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This week new world screwworm was confirmed in South Texas. It’s been expected and now it’s officially here. Livestock producers have many questions and fear mongering is rampant with consumers paying the price. What this news means for livestock and wildlife remains to be seen but ranchers will do what they always do - adapt. McKenzie Rojas with Arrow M Cattle Company joins for a discussion of screwworm implications and advocates for a return to traditional stockmanship. Dayton continues to grill Nathan while hog hunting on this week’s House Rules segment.
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Welcome to Lone Star Trail, a new outdoor show aimed at bringing you hunting and fishing updates and compelling stories from around Texas and right here at home. Get ready to join us down the trail. Now, here's your host, Nathan Smith.
SPEAKER_05Hello, friends, and welcome to another edition of the Lone Star Trail. So glad you could join us again today. Well, what a week it has been. Warmer weather is here. Summer is right around the corner. Hope it's been a great week for you since we talked last. Well, it's been an eventful week in uh in Texas in the world of animal health, as uh as we're all aware. Unfortunately, we did have a confirmed New World Screwworm case pop up in LaPrior, down in South Texas, south of Uvaldi. And so uh we're gonna be talking about that on the show. We've talked about screw worm before. Uh now that it's officially here in the States, we're gonna talk about it uh some more today. And you know, I don't want to beat this horse to death because uh it can be easily beat to death, but uh we want to talk about fact, not fiction, fact, uh science-based, and uh we really want to have some perspective, you know, with this thing. And so we've got a great uh great lineup uh show for you today. We've got a great guest who's gonna talk about some of that and some of the things that we may not have thought about before surrounding the implications of a possible screw worm outbreak. So uh that's gonna take up the majority of our time today. We're gonna talk uh about a few other things as well as have another great edition of House Rules with Dayton House. You're gonna want to stay tuned for this and more, all coming up right after the break. Stay tuned, pour some more coffee, and I'll see you on the other side. Whether you're looking to buy your next hunting property or have acreage to sell, you need Brian Clark and Ranch Pro Real Estate in your corner. They use the latest in technology to make listings easy for sellers to maximize value. In the market to buy that perfect ranch or hunting getaway, call Ranch Pro Real Estate at 325-642-3630. That's Ranch Pro Real Estate at RanchproRealEstate.com. The land is their life. Let's face it, whether you farm or ranch or raise wildlife, you've encountered problems with predators, no doubt. My friends at Texas Farm and Ranch Wildlife Solutions have the answer to your predator nuisance farmant problems. They specialize in taking care of those pesky raccoons, coyotes, bobcats, beavers, whatever wildlife issues you're having, Texas Farm and Ranch Wildlife Solutions is your answer. Call my friend Phillip Wood, 713-208-3517. That's 713-208-3517. You can find him online at TFRWS.com. He's a professional trapper. He knows what he's doing. He has the right resources and the right techniques to get the job done. If you don't believe him, look at his website and see all the happy customers he's racked up over the years. Phillip Woods with Texas Farm and Ranch Wildlife Solutions. Give him a call. You'll be glad you did. Let them help protect your land and livestock. You're listening to the Lone Star Trail. We're glad you're here. Now let's get back to the show. Hey, you're listening to the Lone Star Trail Podcast. Thanks for joining us. Uh, we've got a special guest today. We've got McKenzie Rojas, all the way from Colorado, uh, the state of Colorado. Uh McKenzie, thanks for joining us.
SPEAKER_01Thank you so much for having me.
SPEAKER_05Now, correct me if I'm wrong, you're the CEO of the Aero M Cattle Company. Is that right?
SPEAKER_01Yes, I'm owner operator.
SPEAKER_05First, before we get into our topic, I really wanted to kind of get a little bit of a background story on you, or kind of introduce you to our listeners. And so if you don't mind, uh, tell us a little bit about yourself and your operation and uh how you got into ranching.
SPEAKER_01Absolutely. Um, well, I am a fourth generation cattlewoman. Um I was born and raised in the great state of Mississippi. That's where my family still resides at. And the family farm that's been in our family since the late 1800s is still there, alive and kicking. Um, my dad and brother live there and run everything currently. Uh my dad, he's a retired order buyer. He bought cattle for 30 some odd years and retired and then kind of went out and did his own thing. Um, during all of that time, he did a bunch of packer cow buying, selling, trading, getting a lot of fur, you know, last calves out of those cows and so on and so forth. So I've kind of been around the uh beef business on multiple fronts for many years, ever since I can remember. Um, that being said, after I graduated high school, I went to Mississippi State University where I got a degree in animal science, beef cattle production, and a minor in chemistry. I thought that I was gonna go the vet school route and then quickly changed my mind. Then in 2013, I got offered a manager trainee position with JBS Five Rivers and went through their whole trainee program, managed shipping and receiving, and uh also was able to manage the feed department and do some really feed-through trials and stuff working with a ruminant nutritionist. Um, got to learn a lot and do a lot and see a lot in the feed yard, and so that was kind of good being from more of the southeast and the cow calf production type side of things moving all the way to the Texas panhandle, Dalhart, Texas. Those people that that have been through there know that there's barely any trees in sight, the wind blows constantly.
SPEAKER_05Um it's God's country, right?
SPEAKER_01It is, it is, I love it, actually.
SPEAKER_05I do too. I do too.
SPEAKER_01So yeah, whenever I did my time at the feed yard, I decided one day that I'd pack up, leave the the Texas panhandle, and I moved to Oklahoma. In Oklahoma, I ran a heifer heifer development program, and that's kind of where well, I guess arrow you could say Arrow M really kind of took route. Um I had always kind of had my own cattle and dabbled in different things like kids do when they're raised in it, you know. But I really actually took off whenever I moved to Oklahoma. Um, I supplied a lot of cattle to cutting horse and rain cow horse trainers, um, mostly heifers, got them developed after they got gentles down and got game put on them. Um, and then it was my motto that if it didn't breed, it'd feed. So that's kind of how the Farm to Fork Bill came about. Rock on a little bit longer, and my husband and I, we um met in 2022, got married in 2024, and we moved to Colorado to follow his job. He is a uh pretty well-known ranch hand through multiple facets of the industry. He currently works for May Enterprises. When you have time, look them up. They're one of the largest um ranching families in the state of Colorado. They have 4M feeders and many, many, many ranches from Nevada to Wyoming to eastern Colorado. Um, I believe they've got another feed yard outside of Colorado, which would be over in Nebraska. Um, long story short, it's a pretty big deal here. And we've got it worked where I can continue my AirOm deal, continue to do the farm to fork beef situation, and uh continue my education online and through podcasts and other educational content and whatnot. Um I don't know if you're a new follower. Um I we haven't really able been able been able to have just a whole heck of a lot of conversation since this is kind of the moment. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_05But I yes, I am a new follower.
SPEAKER_01Okay, perfect. So I didn't start the educational content until like November of last year, where it was more producer related. Um, my goal with Arrow M, and this was right when COVID hit, I kind of like you know, fear mongering is a thing, right? We shortly briefly discuss that. Um and I wanted the consumer to understand that production agriculture is not scary. Production agriculture is much like hunting and fishing, where you often leave the environment better than what you found it. Um how you know there is one way to feed the world, and the old-fashioned way that our grandad great granddads did it's probably not it. And so the science is ever evolving and ever changing, and you know, large-scale agriculture is just not scary. And so I started producing a lot of content geared towards that. Well, then I kind of started seeing a trend where producers would get in on these different posts and start commenting and um engaging, and then I kind of saw that there was a major gap in producer education, and it just kind of boils down to one of those things, you don't know what you don't know, right? And so I kind of took it upon myself back, I guess, November of last year, to gear my things that I post more towards that. And it's been a wild ride, I'll tell you that much. Um, I get a lot of little old men in my comments that want to fuss, fight, and argue. Um, but then there's a lot of stuff that I didn't know that other people didn't know, all because one voice gets in the comments and says, hey, this is what we did or this is what we saw. And it leads to really, really great conversation. So it's kind of just become a space for a ton of producers. And I'm not talking like owners, operators, I'm talking about boots on the ground, cow hands, you know, your farmers, um, people that live this lifestyle from all, you know, from all the way from the top all the way to the bottom. Um, where they can come and meet and like, for lack of a better term, fellowship, have these discussions and kind of like bounce ideas around and learn more. So, anyways, that's kind of a summary of AeroM and where we came from and what we're trying to do.
SPEAKER_05Well, that's uh pretty robust. And uh and all you write all these posts yourself. Um I've got a communications degree, but maybe I should have got an animal science degree and I would have been a better writer because it that some of this stuff is really it's fantastic, and the way you've presented is is great. I encourage your listener, if you're listening to this, go check them out on I'm finding I'm finding Arrow M on uh Facebook, but there's uh Instagram and other other social media, but it's ArrowM Cattle Company. And um so great job. I mean, I think that's the I mean all these ag advocacy groups, the farm bureaus, the cattle raisers, the cattle feeders associations, I mean, they're they're always talking about educating the consumer, but uh a lot of times, you know, the producer also needs engagement and there needs to be producer-to-producer engagement. And uh there's so few of us left um nationwide that uh you know we we've gotta we've gotta share our knowledge and uh come together because there's uh there there's just frankly too much at stake to to be divided and and to operate in the silo, which we're all guilty of at times, I'm sure.
SPEAKER_01But um absolutely, absolutely, and thank you for commenting on my writing style. I uh don't know how much you dove into the page, but I was in a massive wreck with a horse back in the past. Yes, and so all of the writing I have really bared down over the last year and a half, maybe two years, writing more often or regularly, um, to kind of exercise my brain a little bit because during that time I sustained a massive traumatic brain injury. And so all the rig and row that comes with that, I was like, you know what? You are not a dumb person, you are a multitasker, you're a high functioning individual, like why are you this way? And so one of the things that I found that really helps that is actually writing. And so that's how all of that kind of came about. It's not necessarily that I loved to write, it's not necessarily that um, you know, I've always had a diary and all that kind of stuff, but at the end of the day, it ended up being really good therapy. And once I kind of realized that people actually liked that, well then I kind of put it to use.
SPEAKER_05So well, it's it's uh it's a been a good use, obviously. And I look forward to looking through uh more of it later on. I got as far, well, I got further than this. I didn't just stop at the steak finger picture. But if you're if you're looking on Facebook, you you've got to go check out the picture of the steak fingers. And my wife makes some amazing steak fingers. Um, and I gotta be careful how I say this. But these stick fingers, they look pretty good. I mean, I think they could they could give them a run for the money. So um we'll talk about steak fingers in a minute because I want to uh before we run out of time, I want to talk about uh what's going on in the world right now. And I, of course, I'm sure everybody listening or most everybody listening is aware that uh officially confirmed uh there's there's now been a screw worm, New World Screwworm case out of LaPryor, which is about 20 minutes, 20 miles, 30 miles south of Uvaldi, which is you know our west of uh San Antonio. And so uh we've known this was coming for months at least now, if not a year plus. And so it's no real shock to anybody who's been paying attention that screwworm is here on the show. We've talked a lot about you know what the ifs and what might happen and uh talked with folks. Uh Dayton House with house rules will be on the show later. Uh talked about the first year he saw in in Mullen. It was in you know 1968. Uh so we know what it's done in pat in the past uh decades to decimate uh wildlife populations to really hurt uh livestock populations, and and it was a huge threat back in the 50s and 60s. And there's folks alive today who still remember doctoring cattle who you know have those bags of tar on the saddle horn. And um, you know, I was talking to a good friend of mine earlier, and he said, you know, a couple differences. One, there's a lot more brush now than there has has ever been for a lot of reasons that we'll get into in on another show. And then two, uh there's a lot less labor out there right now. And so as it relates to livestock um production, I think that those are two immediate challenges that come up is is and uh frankly, there's a lot more absentee landowners. I don't know about in Colorado, but in Texas, we've got a ton of them.
SPEAKER_01Yes, absolutely. I think one of the biggest things that we see trending right now is the fact that people are investing in land while they're sitting in the office in a metro area. Right, if that makes sense.
SPEAKER_05Absolutely does. We see it all the time. I mean, we see it I see it um in my day job, people coming in the office and uh just moved to the area from San Antonio, Houston, Dallas. Uh, what brought you here? Well, we bought some land. And, you know, they come come by the office after leaving the extension office asking, and my buddy Scott Anderson, if he's listening, he'll appreciate this. But you know, the the folks from town by 20 acres, how many cows can I put on it? And you know, he'll well he'll say, Well, where you're at, about three quarters of one, you know. Right. And they they're thinking they're gonna put 20 cows on 20 acres and and a lot of that kind of stuff. So there's some education components to this. It's gonna weed out a lot of those people, though. Frankly, I mean this is this is gonna, if it if it gets serious, it's gonna weed out the casual cow person. It's gonna take, uh, in my opinion, it's gonna take people who really want to do this. It's gonna separate the the wheat from the chaff if we want to get you know biblical about it.
SPEAKER_01But absolutely. It's gonna, it's not gonna be for the faint of heart or the soft. I'm telling you that right now. Um back if if you've had conversations with old timers, they will tell you you go through a lot of horses and you trot a lot of miles. Um, and people that I have kind of picked up on and think that, oh, well, we'll just, you know, go out and gather our cattle, run through the sheet real quick via four-wheeler or side by side or whatever, call them into the pens, whatever works for their operation. But honestly, truthfully, I don't think that that's gonna be one of those situations that's gonna be super efficient when working with the new new world screw worm. Um, I see that there's going to be a lot of people who are gonna have to more or less backslide a little bit and go more into the traditional styles of stockmanship um in order to really manage this. That's and that's just my perspective.
SPEAKER_03Stay tuned, right here. Lone Star Trail will return after these messages.
SPEAKER_05If you follow the podcast, or if you're new, either way, we talk a lot about trapping. You're gonna find that out. Uh, we've got our own predator issues out here in Brown County, we try to mitigate, but I want to talk a little bit about Texas Farm Ranch Wildlife Solutions. My good friend Philip Woods out in East Texas. Uh, he's an expert when it comes to managing predation on Texas farms and ranches. If you've got trouble with coyotes, with bobcats, with uh beaver, if you've got nuisance predators impacting your bottom line, you need to call my friend Philip Woods, 713-208-3517 is his number. That's 713-208-3517. You can email him at woodscattlecompany at gmail.com. Uh, Philip Woods out there in East Texas, he does a great job, but he's statewide. If you got problems in South Texas or the Panhandle, uh, professional trapping services, Texas Farm and Ranch Wildlife Solutions, that's who you need to call. Call my friend Phillip. He'll set up a visit over the phone, talk about the issues you've got going, and make a plan to put money back in your pocket. So give Philip a call. Check him out. Whether you're looking to buy your next hunting property or have acreage to sell, you need Brian Clark and Ranch Pro Real Estate in your corner. They use the latest in technology to make listings easy for sellers to maximize value. In the market to buy that perfect ranch or hunting getaway, call Ranch Pro Real Estate at 325-642-3630. That's Ranch Pro Real Estate at RanchPro Real Estate.com. The land is their life. Okay, well, that's interesting. I want I want you to I want to pause right there and and I want you to define uh traditional stockmanship.
SPEAKER_01From my perspective, and this is just my perspective, I'm sure there's people out there that are gonna have differing opinions, but I think that in today's time, we have lost the art of cowboying because we have not had to go out and prowl through our cattle. We have not had to go out and you know, teach them that it's okay to walk through them, it's okay to be amongst them or whatever, and check things out, check horse, you know, be horseback, check waters, fences, whatever else via horse. In today's age, we are all about hurry up, hurry up, hurry up, hurry up. So we have been the last, I don't know, 20, 30 years, it's been more about side-by-side and four-wheeler use. Buzz through there, go check your water real fast, go check your mineral real fast, maybe put some eyes on some cattle or whatever, dart them, do whatever you need to. But at the end of the day, all a side-by-side does is, yeah, it makes them move around and go wherever you want them to, but you have to put a lot of pressure on them. With horse, it's different. You can walk through them, you can look at them closer, more on an individual basis, and they're not gonna be scattering like quail. The other thing is with a side by side or a four wheeler, people are like, Well, we'll just take 'em straight to the pens and we'll doctor 'em. Okay, that's fine. But how are you gonna get 'em to the pins? You're gonna have to chouse on 'em. And after about the third time of doing that, them cattle are not gonna wanna go to the pins. Increase cortisol levels. Um For the person out there listening that may not understand what I'm really talking about, it'll become a very stressful situation for them, and then they're prey animals, they don't want to be there. Um, with a horse, it's different. You can handle them a lot easier and a lot more stress-free. Um, my husband is a very, very good example of this. He um packs a rope everywhere he goes, his cattle that he that he takes care of, know him, know his horses. He can walk up through the middle of a mama and a baby, and that mama will never pick her head up and get upset. Um, she'll keep eating. You run a four-wheeler through there, what's the first thing a cow's gonna do? She's probably gonna lift her head and kind of see, okay, is it time to go somewhere or am I getting fed? Like, what's going on, you know? My husband, like I said, he he packs rope everywhere he goes, and he's really good about getting from, you know, here to the end of your pickup from one and just sneak shotting one, stepping off, doctoring it, letting it up. It can go back to its mom or wherever it needs to go back to, you know, the herd or whatever. Um, so really and truly the herd's not disrupted, nothing's super stressed out. It's not having to run 10 miles back to the pens. It's getting doctored right then, right there, and gets gets up super quick. The other thing that I think that don't shoot me. Um, I spent a lot of time in West Texas, but I think that a lot of these little West Texas cow punchers that do it for the grim are also gonna get their butts handed to them. Um because you've got to find that balance. Because I know that the people who know cattle that are listening to this right now are gonna say, yeah, but you can cause just as much damage with horses, you can't afford with them, and that's very true. Um, you see those TikToks and thrills all the time where somebody's striking out across a pasture, going to rope one and throwing them 20cc as a nylon and flipping them over backwards. Well, that's just as stressful as an end, right? Um, it's good for the views, but it's not good for the animal. Um, so I think it's gonna calm a lot of that down as well. I think that people are gonna kind of see the management aspect. And the other thing that I really want people to take into consideration isn't necessarily just the stockmanship per se, is all the secondary side effects that come from good or poor quality stockmanship. If you go in there and it doesn't matter if you utilize a horse or if you utilize a side by side when you stress those cattle out, it's not just about the screw word anymore. That's not gonna be your issue any longer. Well, it will be in your like you know, in a primary type way, I guess. But your secondary issues are gonna be okay, you stress that animal out on that newborn calf that had a raw navel and you chasing 10 miles or whatever to get him doctored. Well, how is that calf gonna do as he's still on his mama? Is he gonna look burnt and be a poor doer or a hard doer? Um, is he gonna max out his gain? Like, what are you looking at financially on the back side when you're stressing those cattle out? And I think that it's gonna be a learning curve for a lot of people really quick, especially right now in the summer. And the closer you get to weaning and when you go to wean, your weaning weights are not gonna be as high as they were the year before. Well, then people are gonna have to start looking into their management practices and kind of see in exactly what they did and what they can do better. So hopefully that makes sense.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, no, I hear what you're saying. Uh I'm also hearing all the guys that, you know, well, I've got mine cake broke, they come right to the ranger side by side. I don't have to, I don't need a horse. I'm 72 years old. I don't, I'm too old for a horse. I'm too, you know, and that's kind of ties into the the silver lining component, I guess, to your post on Facebook, and that is really kind of twofold. One one, the market for a cowboy, um, if this screw worm gets to be a real issue, and I don't want to get into the politics. I've got an opinion and nobody cares about my opinion about this. But point being is that it there's a there's an issue how it gets addressed with the government and the treatment and the sterile flies and all that, or or the timeline is still up for debate. But point is if it does continue to spread, uh market for a a true, sure enough cowboy is gonna go back to what it was and maybe not what it was, but what it close to what it was back in the 50s and 60s. And frankly, there's just not enough of them out there because we've gone, as you said, so long. Um uh places have gotten broken up, big ranches have been sold off. I mean, just the natural order of things has changed so much in the last 50, 60 years that it's gonna be like starting all over again. And there's there's some potential for people that have those skills uh to really capitalize, maybe for the first time ever in a generation. Um I I work in a corporate setting and uh related to fun the financial world, and uh I got an email today that mentioned contracts, cowboys, ranchers in a positive or affirmative uh way, and uh as advice to uh customers to be to be encouraged to contract with cowboys to put eyes on livestock. And I mean, I never would have thought I'd ever get a corporate email that said that in today's world, but here we are. And you know, in your post you talked about um the kind of horses too, and I'm not an expert on horses by any means. I will never claim to be, I'm I do good to to stay on top of one and and uh and sort some gentle cows out occasionally, but what what you talked about was the development of horses that um have some stamina and can work. And you know, I was talking to a guy earlier today at a baseball game, and and he's like, We've got a Yellowstone market, we don't have a real ranch cow horse market. And so talk a little bit about that, what you may see, or what you what what's your opinion about that moving forward?
SPEAKER_01So I do believe that there's gonna be a huge shift in needing more boots on the ground, cowboys out in the middle of nowhere putting eyes on the cattle. Um, and the reason being is because those cowboys, those horses can get places that ATVs cannot get to. Um and that's just a fact of the matter, right? Especially South Texas, southern New Mexico, southern Arizona. And I think that a lot of people, especially in my part of the world where we're at currently, where you can get on a four-wheeler or side by side and buzz across pasture real fast because there's no yucca, there's no mesquite, you're not getting knocked off side by side or whatever, you're not going down in these big, huge draws. Um you can do that really easy on a four-wheeler or side by side, but they're not seeing the country that those cattle are currently in, that those the wildlife and the you know, the deer and the birds and all the things are in, um how brushy it is and how thick it is. That's gonna be your number one indicator of the need for horses, right? So the next thing is the type of horse that you need. And I think that we're starting to kind of see this in the equine industry. And I actually listened to a podcast several weeks ago with Nick Dowers on it. Um, I don't remember the name of the podcast specifically, but he was talking about how where he's at, they need a horse with a big motor, and that he'll have clients send him horses constantly saying, Hey, this horse is too much horse in the arena. Like it needs to get out, it needs to see some country, yada yada, yada. Well, Nick is he's a NRCHA professional, like he's a professional ranked cow horse trainer, but he also cowboys for a living. And he will take in these client horses and then he will say, you know, I took this horse out and the owner said it had no bottom in the arena, but then as soon as I got a quarter of the way done with my day, like the horse petered out on me. And I found that really interesting because we are starting to see these ranches specifically. I don't know so much about Texas, maybe maybe there are um in West Texas. I know like the Tongue River and all those guys, obviously they have their ranch Bermuda, but the guys in Arizona and New Mexico, like the Diamond A and Arrows and all those big outfits, they'll have their Remuda. And what they're doing is they're breeding for a horse that's suited for that country. And they're breeding for a horse that was born and raised in that country. They're not buying these horses that are bred well and were born in south central Oklahoma and then shipping them to Arizona. Does that make sense? Absolutely. So those horses, as soon as you saddle them up and ask them to ride off, they know the footing, they know the ground, they know, you know, the wildlife and the plants and the heat and all the things. So that's one shift that I'm starting to see in the equine industry that is gonna actually probably help us still a little bit better. And I think too that the guys that live down there or that are planning on going down there to help are gonna find themselves contacting these ranches saying, Hey, I need these desert horses. Hey, I need that horse that you know has a size one foot and weighs 1,250 pounds or whatever. Because the thing is, is um those desert born and raised horses, they're not gonna peter out like these little cutting bread horses do. And so that leads us to the next topic is training. Um, I think that a lot of guys are gonna be able to get a lot of horses rode. I think that they're going to be able to um be gifted with the luxury of a large string again. Yeah. Um, I know that that is kind of a hot topic amongst cowboys right now, is not being allotted an appropriate appropriate amount of horses. Um, and so you have like here for our family, my husband's allowed two horses, and I'm allowed, you know, my horses, but they're not on the ranch time. Like they don't pay for hay or feed or anything, even though my horses do go to work. Um, and that's kind of commonplace in this part of the country. But the thing is, is they're he's expected to ride his country every day and look at his cattle. And we're not talking like a hundred head of mama cows, we're talking like, you know, 600 pears spread across 20,000 acres.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Um, so it takes a lot of horsepower in itself for him to do that in this country. Now imagine if you're in southern Arizona or New Mexico or South Texas, and you're in mesquite country, you're in rock, you know, um, it's not flat, it's not rolling hills, it's pretty, pretty trashy, pretty rough, pretty rugged country. And so you're gonna basically need more than two horses. You're those guys back in the day, back in the 50s and 60s, when the screw worm first was pretty prevalent, when those guys were battling it back then, they were riding, they had a string of 20 or 30 head horses, and those horses were tough, they were tough bodied, they were tough-minded, and truthfully, I think that we're gonna be able to kind of see that come back into trend a little bit. Like we're already kind of seeing it, but I think it's gonna open the gate for a lot more of that, if that makes sense.
SPEAKER_05So sure. And that's an opportunity. I mean, that's a I think that I take that as a one of the possibly positive things about um potential screw worm outbreak. Obviously, none of us want that, but if it's here, you know, we're gonna combat it in um whatever way we can. So and you know, and and ranchers across the country. I mean, that's if you could if you could probably narrow down one one attribute, it's adaptability. And so I think that's that's that's what's allowed ranching, American ranchers, to survive uh as long as they have. And so I think it's gonna continue, whatever that looks like.
SPEAKER_01Absolutely.
SPEAKER_05Uh before we uh wrap up, I I wanted to kind of get your your take. Uh, you're in central Colorado. Uh the news broke this week about the South Texas screw worm. What's what are you hearing up there from, you know, you you talked about your your dad being an order buyer. What what what are you hearing about up there in in local markets, uh sale barns and other other ranchers uh online. What do you what are you hearing? Just what's the what's the feeling up there in your part of the world?
SPEAKER_01Well, uh the cattle market is as volatile as it's ever been. Um it's no surprise that our herd numbers are the lowest that they've ever been. And I think that this could, it could, I'm not saying it will, it could damage our herd numbers even further. The cool thing, the positive thing in all of that is that the science is there to crack it. Um the science is there to kind of take over. We produce a heavier carcass now than what we've ever produced. So that's one reason why our herd numbers are down. Um our feed efficiency is, you know, astronomical, genetics are better than they've ever been. Um that being said, you take into consideration losing animals to this deal, the screw worm, um it would cause our herd numbers to shrink even more. And then what happens, supply and demand, right? Your herd numbers shrink, then the cost of beef goes up. So I think right now, being in Colorado, one of the main concerns is shipping in cattle to these feed yards and what that's gonna look like. Um, like for us, I don't really know what the protocol is gonna be. Um, I don't know that we're too worried about it right now. Um, but we do get cattle in from Arizona and New Mexico and all over Texas. Um, that being said, we're not gonna stop just yet. We're not gonna stop from shipping cattle north.
SPEAKER_05Florida has already put a moratorium on uh cattle from Texas. And I expect other states in the coming weeks probably to follow suit, but um, you know, we'll see. We'll see what happens.
SPEAKER_01And something that I want to push home is for the consumer, not necessarily the producer, but the consumer needs to understand that this probably will cause the cost of beef to increase from the fear-mongering and obviously the supply and demand. Right now, I don't think that it's gonna be that big of an issue, but if it does take hold over the summer months, um it really may become something that's pretty tough to deal with financially going into winter. So I do want consumers to kind of take that into consideration. And if they have the capacity and the ability, it may not be bad to stock up now, you know, just just going in and being prepared per se.
SPEAKER_05Right. And you know, there's been so I mean since COVID, and I think all of us experienced this during COVID, when we walked into some grocery store, for me, it was in it was in HEB in uh in Belton, Texas, in early 2020, or uh maybe about this time of 2020, and there was uh like one loaf of bread left, no milk, there was no beef left in the case. It kind of woke all of us up, even those of us who grew up farming, ranching, whose families have done it for a long time. It's like, you know what, maybe we need to have a plan B. And so I think you saw a lot more of the um direct to consumer producing folks startup. And and I know I know you have, uh, you've done that. My parents do that. They've um it for them, it's kind of an insulator against live the live market, right? So right now, today, they're they're probably losing money selling beef directly to consumers. I mean, because they're they're trying to stay competitive, they're trying to do uh as close as they can to what um what the market will bear. But uh, but when the prices for live cattle do eventually go down, and you know, who knows when that's gonna be. Hopefully it's a long time from now. But I I think any of us who've raised cattle that for any time know it's a cycle and know it's gonna at some point it's gonna it's gonna drop. When that does happen, the direct to consumer beef folks are gonna be in a position that um there gonna be some there's gonna be some insulation against that that price drop. And and and you know, we I want to talk more about this with you maybe on another show about all the benefits that that come along with with knowing where your beef's coming from and who it's coming from and how it was raised and what's in it, what's not in it. You know, those there's a lot of other great benefits to that.
SPEAKER_01Absolutely. And something that I do want to touch on though, right now, while we're on the topic topic of screw worm, I need the consumer to understand that does not mean that they are gonna get screw worms in their beef. Of course, right. But we have USDA FDA regulations that all beef has to follow. So no matter what, that beef that they're getting at Sam's, that they're that they're getting at Walmart, HEB, Kroger, wherever it may be, it is antibiotic free, it is hormone-free, and most importantly, it is screw word-free. So we can we can talk touch on all of the nuances that surround the uh the you know the antibiotics and hormones and all that later. And in fact, I've got a really good resource for that. Um, somebody who does the actual like beef programs and like for labeling and whatnot, all of your organic and you know, all natural, yada yada yada, all of those programs. Um, she actually writes and audits different certificates for ranches so that they can be USDA certified in those different areas. So she may be a really good resource for you to have on at some point. Um, but I would like the consumer to understand they will not get beef that is contaminated.
SPEAKER_04Right.
SPEAKER_01So for them, yeah, maybe prepare for a price increase, but don't worry, like there's not gonna be bad beef.
SPEAKER_05So Brazil, they raise a ton of beef. It's mostly grass-fed and it doesn't taste as good as ours, in my opinion. But it uh, you know, even their processing is not as safe and is uh their inspection process is not as thorough as what as what we have here. And so we're we're very, very blessed to live in a country that that takes um our food inspection processes very seriously. And and every time you see a recall, you think, well, our bay f beef isn't safe. That recall is the fell-safe, and the the fact that we have the recall is proof that the system is working, and so we got we got a lot to be thankful for, honestly. And sometimes we don't know how good we have it.
SPEAKER_01Absolutely, absolutely.
SPEAKER_05McKenzie, we could talk for hours, and I definitely want to have you back on the show uh for sure. But thank you so much for for uh your time this afternoon and and just the the insight and uh all your knowledge and and and thanks for what you do on social media because it's it's important, maybe more important now than ever.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, absolutely. Um anybody that kind of wants to follow along, they're welcome to check out Arrow M Cattle Company on Facebook. If they have questions, comments, concerns, anything like that, they're welcome to message me on there. I think my phone number is also on my page. So yeah, and thank you for everything that you do. I don't know, but I do a lot of stuff for hunting as well. I'm actually a state representative for the state of Colorado and the Jack Russell Terrier Association. I travel the country hunting with my dogs.
SPEAKER_05Oh man, we got to talk about that next time.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah, absolutely. So I say that and say thank you for all that you do for the outdoors then.
SPEAKER_05So well, it's an honor and it's a lot of fun for me. So it's it's uh it's great. And and uh, you know, uh meeting people outdoors whether you're on a horseback or your outfit or hunting, I mean, it's just it's a privilege and an honor to enjoy the natural resources that God's given us. So you're listening to the Lone Star Trail and it's time once again for house rules with Dayton House. Dayton is a retired government trapper, a firearms expert, an outdoors enthusiast, and a true textan. At 76 years old, he's still going strong and enjoys sharing his passion of the outdoors with others.
SPEAKER_02The last 20 years I've devoted my life to hog hunting. I've made a joke about the wife. I have more fun now hunting hogs than I did on my honeymoon. And the wife said, Well, I do too, but when I get out of the house, she can watch, she's in control of the remote. And so she enjoys herself, and uh I enjoy hunting, and we've got along real well. But years ago, I liked a uh Thompson Center 22 rim fire rather than the 1022s. Several of my Rugers have jammed, and I don't clean them uh as often as I should, and the Thompson Center, I put nearly 20,000 rounds through it before I ever cleaned it. And I abused it, but it had a uh red dot side on it, and I loved that thing. It was really accurate. Nephew and I tried shooting shotgun shells out of the air. He had had some that got wet, and he'd throw them up, and it took me about 80 rounds before I hit the primer of one in the air and made it go off. We were goofing off and uh uh having fun as teenagers, and uh that that's fun. And I was probably 60 then. I still enjoy that. Now, if you you could go anywhere you wanted to tomorrow, what would you do and where would you hunt? And what would you hunt for?
SPEAKER_04Oh man, that's a tough question.
SPEAKER_02All paid expenses. Everything's paid. Yes. I'll let you think about it. I'd go to Colorado River or Cinn Sabba River and Hog Hunt. Would like to take the Y. And for the reason, she'll sit here and she can watch me on the rover and see what I'm doing, and then I can wave at her and she'll come down there and pick me up. I don't have to walk back to the pickup. So it's a team effort whenever she goes along, and I appreciate that. But uh hog hunting is is my passion now.
SPEAKER_05You know, you talked about Mart Martin earlier, and uh he on the on the show when he was on, he talked about hunting uh leopard in Africa, in Tanzania, I think. And uh I think uh a a big my my dream is to kill a mountain lion. I mean that is my the ultimate. So I think it would be probably somewhere up in the up in the mountains, whether that's Colorado or Utah, further up into Montana, Wyoming, but I'd I think somewhere up there to to hunt mountain lion.
SPEAKER_02The wife saw a mountain lion between Democrat and Comanche, the Democrats south of Comanche during the daytime. It crossed the road, jumped the fence, and sat there, and she stopped and watched it, but forgot to take a picture of it. And I've hunted for 70 plus years and I've never seen one.
SPEAKER_03And all these nights out with a thermal, and yeah.
SPEAKER_02I go out almost every night with thermal, and most of the time just walk around the house. And uh, if I see a critter, I shoot, and two or three times a night I'll walk around the house. And you'd think as many nights as I've hunted, I would have seen a mountain lion. And God forgive me, if I was on Interstate 20 and one crossed the road, I'd probably stop and shoot it. In front of the game warden, even. That's how desperate I am to kill one. But uh there's not that many out there in this area.
SPEAKER_05Well, and they're so you know, they're so secretive. And as many cameras as I think everybody's got out now, you start to see and hear of more sightings here and there, but I don't know how many have been killed in Mills County.
SPEAKER_02I would say less than five or six that I'm aware of. And not even one sighting a year. There are more now because of the game cameras that are out there. And I hear reports of various ones, but no one ever kills one. Got to ask an embarrassing question now. What was your most embarrassing moment in your entire life? I'm gonna put you on the spot here. I've got mine listed here.
SPEAKER_05I've got way too many to just narrow it down. I mean, maybe we should get my wife to, I mean, just in the time she's known me, and she can probably fill three or four podcasts for full of embarrassing things. I call the I call people by the wrong names a lot, and then I don't realize it until much later, and then I uh I do that a lot. That's one of my kind of my normal embarrassing things. As I get older though, fewer things embarrass me.
SPEAKER_02Yes.
SPEAKER_05I don't know if if you find that to be true or not, but oh yeah.
SPEAKER_02The I see you gown that you have to wear in the hospital, they call it uh I see you because when you walk down the hall, then they really can. I see you. So that doesn't embarrass me like it once did. I wanted it pinned up and uh but we get used to those things. Uh my embarrassing moment, my wife didn't want me to tell this, but I told her I was anyway. Twenty-five years ago I was north of Fort Worth near Lake Worth working on Richard Waltz, uh W-A-L-S-H. Richard's 10 years older than I am, and I think he's still alive. I looked on the address the other day and saw his name and address and phone number there, and he had lots of property in that area, and I needed to go to the restroom or do a number two. So his place was right there on the right, and I pulled in there and left the gate open and went behind the first tree and just got squatted down, and the foreman came in behind me. He had seen the gate open, and he and another man drove on by and stopped. And so that was probably my most embarrassing moment that I got caught with my pants down. Literally. Literally. And so that's pretty embarrassing. Yes, that was. Nowadays that's common practice. I'm glad I live in the country. I wouldn't make it in the city.
SPEAKER_03No. No, you wouldn't.
SPEAKER_02You wouldn't like it in the city.
SPEAKER_05Oh, I wouldn't.
SPEAKER_02All right. Uh dreams. What are you gonna be doing 30 years from now or 60 years from now?
SPEAKER_03Well, 30 years from now I'll be nearly 70.
SPEAKER_05So I hope I'm uh chasing grandkids. Honestly.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. That'd be my dream, really.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, chasing grandkids, and uh I hope I've got, you know, uh 10 or 15 by that time, and we've got to build a second barn to keep them all in. And you know, that'd be a I think that would be the dream. Family is we've got a big family, especially for this day and age, and I think family is so important, and it's it's a blessing, um, even on the hard days. We homeschool, my wife homeschools, and and that's a challenge in of itself, and I mean it is hard, and I couldn't do it. Um I I go to work every day and and leave her to educate the children, and and it's a huge responsibility, and but it's also a huge blessing.
SPEAKER_02And so y'all take it more serious than most homeschools. Y'all uh renovated an old deer cabin and turned it into a schoolhouse. It's about a half a mile from your house. Do they walk to school?
SPEAKER_04Uh when it's nice, yes, they do. Uh walk uphill both ways. Both ways. In the snow or yeah, they they do walk.
SPEAKER_05Um, and that's part of the school too, is and that's we talk about on the show a lot is getting kids outside. Is there's there's a lot of scientific data that shows the benefits of cognitive ability and learning and just just associating with the world around you.
SPEAKER_02The old rule was that you're limited by God on your days that you live, and for every day that you hunt and fish, God's not going to take that day away from you. So if that's true, I'm going to live longer than Methuselah.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_05Well, you know, I there's there's probably something to that.
SPEAKER_02Uh we grew up eating right. Mother and dad were both farm-raised kids, and we raised most of our own foods and no preservatives. And nowadays, most kids they eat that artificial stuff. I believe it's got to have an effect on your longevity.
SPEAKER_05Oh, I think it does too. And it's hard. I mean, as a as for parents, uh trying to find stuff that is a affordable that doesn't have all of that stuff in the preservative, that's right. It's very difficult. We were talking earlier about eating out versus eating at home, and I mean, there's just no comparison in affordability for sure, but also quality. I mean anything my wife makes is much better quality and nutrient-wise than whatever we're gonna find water burger or whatever.
SPEAKER_02I didn't get one of her cinnamon rolls this morning.
SPEAKER_05She'll have to make you a special, that's right, yes. They're good. I told her she had to get them out of the house because I was gonna eat three or four of them.
SPEAKER_02My mother always said, You are what you eat, and I believe there's a little bit to that. Yeah. Yeah. And so we've enjoyed home cooked meals and always will.
SPEAKER_05What's your what's your favorite thing your your wife makes?
SPEAKER_02I've often said my dying wish would be to eat her spinach salad, and people have said, why spinach salad? Well, you've never eaten hers before, or you'd know. Her mother got me started on this. They take baby spinach and put cottage cheese, eggs, onions, a little bit of ranch dressing, bacon bits, and it's uh as fresh out of the garden as you can get, and uh it's almost a full meal deal. And growing up I never liked spinach, it's always cooked and it's stunked and tastes terrible. But uh this baby spinach isn't cooked and it's really good, so I think spinach salad would be my favorite.
SPEAKER_05Yeah. So it's really bacon salad.
SPEAKER_02Yes. Bacon and eggs. Yeah, I can get behind that. Now, I wouldn't mind throwing a pork chop in on the side. Uh, I'm kind of like you. I like the white meat if quail and turkey, the white meat of a turkey, right, are my favorite game. And we don't get to kill many quail. I hear a few whistling every now and then and hoping they're making a comeback.
SPEAKER_05Yes, I hope I hope so too. We see I saw a no, it was back in, I guess it was back in November of last year, I saw a few on our place, and that was the first I'd seen in ten years. And I sure don't want to kill them. And I I mean, I want them to grow because I'd love to get them restarted again in this area.
SPEAKER_02Two years ago, we had a pair that came in the front yard. I'd had a bird feeder, and they would come there every day. And we got to notice, and when the air conditioner had come on the overflow, they would go drink out of that air conditioner overflow. And they might dust in the ground over there for several minutes till it came back on. And so they had adapted to living right there among us. And one day I was mowing the lawn, and one of those birds was on the ground within three feet of me and did not fly while I was on the mower. But I never saw any chicks that were born. I don't know whatever happened to any of the young ones or whether they ever got to complete a clutch of eggs or not.
SPEAKER_03Don't possums, don't they raid quail nests?
SPEAKER_02Oh, and skunks, yes.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Skunks are one of the things I like to target when I walk around at night. I killed one this morning at uh four o'clock, and last year I killed 84. My goodness. And this year I've probably killed close to 40. I write it down on the calendar. Everything I kill, I keep a record of it, and that probably goes back to the old government trapper days. You had to keep a record. That's right, yes.
SPEAKER_04I told you we went to that rendezvous up in Childress in April.
SPEAKER_02Mike was there then. He was, yes.
SPEAKER_05Yes, that's the first time I met him in person. But they uh talked to one of the trappers that was up there about skunks in the skunk pelt market this year, for whatever reason, it's gotten pretty high. They were bringing for finished out pelts, they were bringing 60 to 70 dollars. You're kidding. No. And so uh Kelton, my 10-year-old, went with me to that deal and he heard that. And so, boy, all the way home, that's all we had talked about is how we were gonna start skinning skunks. I told him he's gonna have to he have to build his own treehouse or something to live in.
SPEAKER_04Have you ever skent one? No, never.
SPEAKER_02I haven't and never will. I don't care if they get $500. The same way. Now, oh man, I'll tell this on myself. They used to say if you'd hold a skunk up by its tail, it wouldn't spray you. And one night the dogs treat a skunk behind the doghouse, and the doghouse was right next to the kitchen. And so I went out the back door, and the skunk was there pinned up against the house in the doghouse. And I reached down and grabbed him by the tail and lifted him up and carried him 100 yards out there and let the dogs kill him then. But he never sprayed me. Yeah. And so there may be something to that.
SPEAKER_04Did you when you grab a skunk, did you have a backup plan?
SPEAKER_02No.
SPEAKER_04For sleeping that night?
SPEAKER_02No, did not. I've told people when you catch one in a live trap, if you'll be real careful and walk up there slowly with a blanket or tarp or anything to cover the trap, the skunk will never spray. And then you can pick it up. And some of our personnel years ago in the urban area, they'd catch one in the Dallas Fort Worth area. They'd put it in the back end of the station wagon and it'd never spray. And I've tried it several times, and they never spray till you open the trap and they run off. See you or turn back, well, then they may spray you there. But uh, we've had good luck with being real careful and slow and picking them up and carrying them where you need to.
SPEAKER_05My my friend Dr. Greg Bailey, he's got a he's got a show on uh KOXE also. But uh when he was a younger man, he would uh trap live trap skunks, so he's got a method to to get them, and it involved covering them, I think, with a sack or a blanket or something.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_05I've tried to get him to show me in real life, but he's he won't do that.
SPEAKER_02Father-in-law years ago opened the back door and a skunk ran in, the kitchen, and he got the broom after it, chased it into the living room, and back out the same door pushing it, and the skunk never sprayed.
SPEAKER_03Oh man.
SPEAKER_02And I don't know, it may be something that once they go into a small area or enclosed area, they refuse to spray because they'll have to smell it themselves. Could be. And so he got lucky that night. Yeah.
SPEAKER_05You think insurance would cover that?
SPEAKER_03I doubt it. They'd find a way to exclude that.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, fire hazard would be more apt to cover it. Well, Nathan, thank you for the interview. That concludes all my questions. I've got a number of my own experiences, and we'll get that at a later date then. Yeah.
SPEAKER_05Well, thanks. This was fun. Well, I hope it was. Turning the tables on me.
SPEAKER_02That's right, yeah. I did this uh without any Nathan's approval or uh No warning. Well, no warning at all. So we weren't that's all right. And uh checks in the mail, Nathan. Okay, promise you.
SPEAKER_05Just like yours is.
SPEAKER_02That's right.
SPEAKER_05Well, that's all the time we have for this week's episode. Thanks for stopping by. Me and old Hank the Guardog will catch you next week at the same time, same place. If you can't join us on a local station, find the show on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you find podcasts. Also, you can connect with us on Facebook and share your hunting and outdoor photos and stories with us at Lone Star Trail Radio at gmail.com. Until next time, for all of us here at the show, so long.
