2 Vintage Sports Guys - Episode 16

E16: Join Joe and Paul as they hammer out the crazy things going on in MLB. Do bats need hats? How many times can the Cubs count to 10 this season? Oh, and the NBA and NHL Playoffs. Yawn....

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:07

Good afternoon, everyone. This is Joe Rendacci of Two Vintage Sports Guys. Welcome back. Glad to have my partner at Crime back here, Paul Gallagher. Kicking it over to you, Paul.

SPEAKER_00 0:19

Hey Joe, how are you? Yeah, I'm the other uh I'm the other vintage sports guy that's easily replaced, though. Good job on getting some guest speakers in. I enjoyed listening to Ricky and the gang. So very good. Very well done.

SPEAKER_02 0:33

Thank you. It's all AI, but I shouldn't have probably said that.

SPEAKER_00 0:36

Ricky's not AI. He would be insulted.

SPEAKER_02 0:38

So I wish I could make him AI. That would be a better relationship. But anyway. All right. So we have the heat of the NHL and NBA playoffs, but we're going to kick it off with baseball because I think there's some quirky things going on, as you and I have discussed. And let's uh let's share it with the audience. So I'm going to kick it over to you. You lead, I'll run fuller.

SPEAKER_00 1:00

I yeah, I think I think now that we're out of the horrible, horrible April month, and which I think you touched earlier on another episode is is cold and rainy and and not ready for baseball. But um, you know, the old saying goes, You can't win the pennant in April, but you can lose it. And I was I was nervous that some teams did. Yours team already did, which is great. The Mets are done. Uh, enjoy the rest of the summer.

SPEAKER_02 1:25

But for the rest of baseball, hang on, you're not gonna just sweat by with that, but I will agree with you. They are done, they are not recovering, they'll be lucky to get back to 500, and they don't deserve to be a playoff team. Continue.

SPEAKER_00 1:38

Well, speaking of 500, I mean, that's what struck me today, and you might have touched on it in the last episode, but every team in the NL Central is above 500, and then there's just a smattering of teams across the rest of the divisions that are. I think there's two in the AL East and and one um in the uh NL East. So I think this is where things start to even out a little bit. Um, Donny Baseball has gotten the Phillies on a 7 and 3 run in the last 10 games. So I think maybe it's scheduling quirks, maybe it's the weather, maybe it's uh cold bats coming alive, things warming up. Maybe it's a a manager being fired or two or three, right? Red Sox, Phillies, there's probably another one, but it's early to be firing people. Um, but in in the Phillies case, uh Mattingley's gotten them back on.

SPEAKER_02 2:30

So is it too early to fire people? Because to your point, no, Billys are playing better. Now, we could probably argue or andor agree that usually just firing the manager is not really making a difference, other than maybe the player is getting a little bit of a wake-up call that if you want some cohesion in there, don't let us have to keep firing the manager and play better.

SPEAKER_00 2:56

It's a it's a mystery, really. I don't understand what I understand why you change and why you fire managers in the Phillies case. I think it was okay because um, you know, he he took the job as a one year and then they started winning, and you know, his his his message probably got old and stale. But what is it? We're making one change, not even on the field, and maybe there were a couple small changes in the lineups or or whatever for Red Sox and Phillies. But why do they go on a win streak?

SPEAKER_02 3:28

Well, let me let me ask you this. If we delve into baseball for a second and we'll put other sports aside because it could be a little different. But with baseball, I've never put too much stock into the hitting and pitching coach. But really, at the end of the day, are teams as prepared as they need to be for the pitchers they're facing, where they throw, what they like to do in certain counts, or are they just going out there with and they think their five-tool God-given talent's going to be enough to smack a home run and win the game, no matter who's pitching out there? Or are they prepared? Same token. Are all your starting and relievers, do they know where Bryce Harper likes to hit in a clutch situation in the seventh? Where is he swinging and protecting? And it counts. Like, do they do that work anymore, or are they just at the point where they just will think they can rely on their talent?

SPEAKER_00 4:22

No, I think I think they do the work. I see them looking at iPads, you know, different and and talking about where the pitcher is, and if they're at the dive, if the dugout is lively, then they're talking amongst each other after they either strike out or get a hit. Where it's at, I think they are putting in the work. It's easy now to put in the work because it's all there on an iPad.

SPEAKER_02 4:44

Uh, I'm I'm just gonna remain on this thing with the coaches and and the prep work because I was at a conference last week, and I forget if I told you it was somebody else, so you may have to hear it again. But they had Andre Agassi up there as the one of the guests, and now he's big into pickleball, uh, just like he used to be you know, the tennis star he was.

SPEAKER_00 5:06

Just like you. Yeah, pickleball king.

SPEAKER_02 5:09

Yeah, but anyway, he was talking about tennis, and he was talking about he was going to play this finals match against some guy that he really never watched play. And he's driving to the stadium, and he looks up and is a big billboard of the guy on there, just in a still photo of hitting his shot, you know, just and he he then spent the next five minutes, Agassiz, just telling us how when he looked at that photo, he saw that he was holding the stick a little wide and a little low and across. And because of that, he's thinking I could go further down the line against this guy because he's gonna put long story short, he said stuff in five minutes that actually amazed me because I get out there, I look at the other guy, and I go, okay, I'm playing a man or I'm playing a woman. That's about as much like well analytics as I put into it.

SPEAKER_00 6:03

But that right there is the greatness of a player or a coach. Similar story. I watched, I watched a little clip on Don Mattingley at first base talking to Bryce Harper, moving them a little bit, knowing something that, and I'll use your favorite word, perspective, gives you in a different perspective of being the Andre Agassi old guy looking at something. Yes, drawing on his God-given talent, but drawing on the experience to say, if I make this change or if I have this strategy, I'll do it. Baseball's the same way. We watched Shohei Otani during the uh during the WBC go to one of his teammates, who's now who's on Detroit, and changed his stance a little bit, moved his elbow up. And by that simple moving of the elbow up, guy went out the next bat, crushed a home run. I think he's got 10 home runs and he's batting 290 right now. Um so there's there's the greatness of a player that that sees everything a little bit differently and is able to do a simple fix, which others don't see. Agassiz able to do it on the swing, and uh and and otani or don Mattingley or or that's and so we get back to your point of a coach. What's a coach's role? It's to see the things that other people don't see and be able to relate to as players in order to change them. We can talk about hockey and the young players. What are they doing? You've got young teams in the playoffs, and you know, what can the coach do to get those young players who don't have the experience to see the game a little bit differently?

SPEAKER_02 7:43

A lot of times you you can't, and it's just a natural well, I got maturity to get up there and one more story to this point about coaching and noticing. And I had to look it up because I I didn't remember this level of detail. In 1996, do you remember R. A. Dickey, the pitcher? Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's a little while. Yeah, he was drafted by of all teams, the Texas Rangers, and a team doctor spotted his arm hanging awkwardly in a baseball America magazine cover photo. This disc I'm reading it offline. This discovery revealed that Dickey had no ulnar collateral ligament, causing his $810,000 contract to be immediately pulled from the from the doctor looking at how his arm was hanging in a magazine cover. Did he go on to be a knuckleballer? Dickey.

SPEAKER_00 8:42

Changed his whole career. Didn't he go on? Did he was he a knuckleballer then?

SPEAKER_02 8:45

Did he turn in the wound up being a knuckleballer? Yeah. He was a standout pitcher for the 96 Olympics team, but that the contract was gone, and then he had to reinvent himself with the knuckleball. But could you imagine, you know, sort of like the coaching. You know, they say football is a game of inches on the field. Well, it's a game of inches the way this guy's hanging his arm, and what you just said about Mattingley and Harper at first.

SPEAKER_00 9:10

Yeah, yeah, yeah. It is, I think, and that's the the crux of it all is a coach can make a difference if he relates to his players, understands where they are, and makes subtle changes that don't cause huge shock waves through the team, but different ripples. And that in baseball, I think, can be the lineup, where they are, who's hitting after. I looked at the lineup, and we've got a the only guy hitting over 300 is in is in ninth. I don't understand that, but I'm gonna trust that Don Mattingley's a little bit smarter than me in baseball and and and will do it. But I would put the guy in first and I would put Schwarber in fifth, and yeah, we'll see. But that's what the managers uh you know do is I think they subtly influence things and subtly make changes, and then by doing that hold everybody to a little bit higher of a standard. And there you go. That's what separates the great ones from the younger ones, and again, the vintage uh managers from Joe Torre. And and and while we're on the subject, I just flashed on my phone that uh the the great Braves manager uh just passed away. So, you know, Bobby Cox had all those years of winning, not by being demonstrative, and and although he was on the field sometimes getting thrown out of games, he just had a way with with nudging players in the right direction and probably had great relationships in the in the thing. So pour one out for old Bobby Cox.

SPEAKER_01 10:40

Didn't help that didn't hurt that he had three all-star uh pitchers, Hall of Famers on his roster there. Yeah, I have still best fan.

SPEAKER_00 10:49

But you can lose with great ones though, right? And you mean that's what that's what uh that's what happens, and that's what gets managers into trouble when they think they don't have to do anything or they do too much. It's management in general, but yeah.

SPEAKER_02 11:02

So I think well that goes back to you said Joe Torrey, right? Joe Torrey was a bum as a manager until he winds up on that Yankee dynasty.

SPEAKER_00 11:10

And I'm not saying he didn't have obviously he had a lot to do with it, but you know you could say he's a bum, but he's coaching the Braves in in the 80s, which you know, Bob Horner's their best player. So, you know, you have to have the combination of talent, people that want to be coached and and and and do the right thing. And then by the time Tory gets to New York, he's got a wealth of experience to draw on, and the whole baseball climate change. I mean, he's got great players getting paid 40 million dollars a year and has to manage egos and and everything else, and he and he did it the right way, and his calm demeanor allowed him to do that. That's age and experience. But you know, you don't stop being a great coach if you're fired. You're just it's a change of scenery.

SPEAKER_02 12:00

Yeah, I mean, but coaching, it goes back to the classic Phil Jackson conversation. Is Phil Jackson a great coach because of his triangle offense and what he brought, or is it because he had Jordan and Pippen and then Kobe and Shaq for all those championships?

SPEAKER_00 12:14

I I think he's a great coach because of the triangle offense and also what I was touching on with Tori. His Zen-like ability to manage that particular team where you've got everybody from Dennis Rodman to Michael Jordan, the greatest player ever, his his style and his Zen philosophy allowed him to be one of the greatest coaches ever. So I think it's this idea of experience, how to handle ego, how to handle winning, how to not make changes and make subtle changes that really show the best coaches, whether you're a dick from and you're always gonna have extremely high talent, but you still can lose with that high level of talent. You've gotta, you know, you've got to win the championships. And I think Phil Jackson's an excellent point to that of a combination of experience and bringing something different to the game with the triangle offense.

SPEAKER_02 13:12

Couldn't do anything with the Knicks when he got it.

SPEAKER_00 13:15

But again, do you know you did the do the you know it's not all on him? Did the Knicks not buy in? I don't know, I don't know the Knicks. I don't want to know the Knicks under Phil Jackson, but did they buy in to what he was coaching? Did they accept? Did they do what needed to be done? Now there's the other side of the coin would say, did Phil try to put a square peg in a round hole in in New York? I don't know. I'm not familiar with the team, but I would I would argue that if Phil Jackson's a genius in Chicago, he doesn't stop being a genius in New York.

SPEAKER_02 13:46

Maybe he does when he does when he does have Jordan Pippen.

SPEAKER_00 13:51

Yeah, I think you're giving giving all the credit to yes, the greatest player in the game, and but he also got Kerr and he also got other role players to do extremely well. Also, I I still think the coach has a big impact on a team like that, and it's not all the players. And I would need to do some research, but I bet you I could find great teams with great players that didn't win championships three times in a row or do the best thing that they could possibly do or reach their peak. And so I think Tory and Jackson and those guys are great coaches because of that, they manage egos.

SPEAKER_02 14:31

All right. Well, let's take it over to some hockey egos and uh look where we sit in playoffs right now. What's your thought on what's going on in the playoffs?

SPEAKER_00 14:40

Well, I I I think it's a lot better than what I heard you say the other day. You know, I think that you'll look at something like Philly going down 3-0 to Carolina as a total failure, but it's it's steps. And I think you're seeing an old guard change out, so Edmonton's out, Tampa's out, um, and you're seeing the young teams try to step up. But let's face it, when you've got 18, 19, I'm sorry, not 18, 19, 20, 21-year-old players for the Flyers on the same ice as Carolina, Carolina should win. But it is a huge step and a great step to get through round one, get the experience under your belt of what does it take. And you're making some rookie mistakes. Tockett talked about penalties that were taken, forcing them in a bad situation. So the Anaheim Ducks, um, you know, now they're down, I think, two to one against Vegas.

SPEAKER_01 15:34

Warren out last night at home.

SPEAKER_00 15:36

But but they're taking the right steps. The teams like the Flyers and the Ducks, and now the Canadians are even going to take it more. They're tied one. But there's a team that's been young for the last two years and haven't done it. Now they go in, they they they go toe-to-toe seven games with the Lightning, toe-to-toe again with the Sabres, although I would argue the Sabres don't have near the talent the Canadians do. Canadians will win in five.

SPEAKER_02 16:01

Um, really, if that's what you think. So even though Buffalo went from worst to first from last year to this year, came back and spanked the Bruins. I think Buffalo's still gonna win this series, but I think Montreal, I think it's a seven-gamer.

SPEAKER_00 16:17

So new um we will we will place a bet offline on that one. Um, no, big believer in the steps Montreal's taken, the talent level that they have. Um, yeah, Buffalo won at home, right? Did they win at home? No, they got spanked. Montreal beat them pretty badly the other day. Now they'll go back to Montreal. Yeah, I think Montreal wins both at home, and uh then we'll see. But that's a team that while they're young, they've been doing well the last two years. So they're taking the next step on the ladder. Ducks, Flyers took their steps, Oilers, Lightning stumbled a couple of steps because their window is is now closing. And it's a changing of the guard. I think it's a I think it's a great one. What about Colorado?

SPEAKER_02 17:05

I still I still pick Colorado to win the whole thing, and they've been hanging in there, and they're gonna blow Minnesota out. They're up 2-0, and I think they they either sweep it or win that in five.

SPEAKER_00 17:14

Yeah, and another great example, right? Minnesota gets past Dallas, does really good. Um, you know, they just got Hughes in the in the middle of the season in the big trade. They've taken the next step up, but you you run into a buzzsaw in Colorado. I mean, that's just an unbelievable team from the goalie on out. And you've got some of the best players in hockey. So probably we'll see uh Carter Hart and Vegas against Colorado. I think we'll see Montreal and Carolina. And Carolina plays a game that is a little bit like Jersey. It's a boring game. Florida Panthers, Jersey. Um, they're a big team, they're a good team. They do have uh Aho and some very talented players. They play a slower game, so the Carolina-Montreal matchup should be pretty interesting.

SPEAKER_02 18:05

Carolina's window is closing, but they've had this this team on the ice for a while. They're ending that veteran phase of uh Pooper get off the pot. And I think it'll be good. I think it's Carolina and um Buffalo. Well, you think it's Montreal, I guess and Carolina.

SPEAKER_00 18:24

Yeah, I think Montreal beats Carolina too. I think Frederick Anderson is on on a hot streak that is unbelievable. He, you know, it's not like Carolina's blown out Philly. They won an overtime in the last minute of overtime, two to one. They they they think they won three to one the other day. Frederick Anderson has been standing on his head after a mediocre regular season. So um, I yeah, I'm I'm gonna I'm gonna differ from you on the on the Montreal Buffalo, and I'm gonna say Montreal beats uh Carolina as well and advances to the final. Okay. And colorado. Would you have an all-Canadian final? How about that? Montreal, Edmonton.

SPEAKER_02 19:07

I would be I'd be shocked.

SPEAKER_00 19:09

Edmonton. No, I mean Edmonton. I didn't mean Edmonton, I meant uh no, no, we can't. So it'll be it'll be Vegas. Um you think Vegas takes Anaheim? Colorado and Vegas. Oh no, we wouldn't. We would have Colorado and Montreal. So you'd pick Montreal over Colorado. I would not. I didn't go that far, Joe. I didn't go that far. So the old Quebec Nordiques versus Montreal. How about that? That's what I'll think about.

SPEAKER_02 19:37

Yeah, fake a little little uh 93 there. Uh all right. All right, I think that about covers it. Anything else you want to stick in there?

SPEAKER_00 19:49

Playoff basketball. My my the Knicks look like they'll win, but uh that's a shame. Uh horrible thing going on there. But you know, your Knickerbockers will win. We'll root for whoever plays them in the next round. Playoff, it's playoff season, it's nice. We have a good mix of high tempo basketball and hockey. Um, and then everything is leading up to the World Cup in June. So we're gonna have a pretty good month of May.

SPEAKER_02 20:15

So we're gonna have Detroit Knicks, Eastern Conference Final, and then it's it's a toss-up, whether it's uh Thunder versus San Antonio or Thunder versus Minnesota. I think it's probably Wemby and San Antonio versus the Thunder. Yeah, and that'll be a good question.

SPEAKER_00 20:36

And then Thunder wins. Thunder wins the whole thing anyway. A thunder. I think that's that's a that's a good guesstimate. Yeah, my guy in Tulsa will be happy. They'll they'll they'll they'll say is that stallone. Good guy, good guy in Tulsa. Go from the rodeo to the basketball arena, remember? So that's what they got. You got a guy about the thing? Well, it's not it's stallone in Tulsa, I guess. Is that what it is? Yeah, there you go. All right, all right. Goodbye, Paul.

SPEAKER_02 21:11

All right, everybody. Uh follow us and look forward to your next episode of Two Vettering Ports Guys.