SPEAKER_01 0:09

The Coaching for Life podcast with Monty Williams and Will Davis.

SPEAKER_00 0:17

Welcome back to the Coaching for Life Podcast with Monty Williams and Will Davis, a conversation that we pray encourages you to pursue the Christ centered life. And it's always a blessing to spend some time with my good friend and co-host Monty Williams. We just celebrated Father's Day, which is always a reminder of the gift it is to be a father. And today we want to talk about some of the qualities that make up a godly father. And like any of these conversations, we first need to make that disclaimer that we are not experts. I mean, we were we are sinners, we are imperfect fathers. I like how Dennis Rainey said, we are all crooked sticks, but God picks up crooked sticks and draws straight lines with them all the time. And so we've all made our share of mistakes. And so, Mani, where do we begin as we talk about the calling and the qualities of a godly father? Trevor Burrus, Jr.

SPEAKER_04 1:19

Well, I think you know what you said is so um important for anyone who's listening to us to understand that we don't consider ourselves experts by any stretch. And yet um even in the brokenness and mistakes that we've made, um God is, you know, He calls us to use those things also to be a benefit to someone who may be struggling, someone who might be doing well, uh a bit of encouragement. Um and and as you said, like as we pray beforehand, um there's men who are aspiring dads. Yes. Um and and I think as we think of those people and ourselves, um, to take a look at the standard um who's our heavenly father and what the word says um about him as a father. Uh one, he's in heaven. Yes. Uh Psalm 11.4 alludes to that. Um he is holy. Exodus 15, 11 says, Are there any gods like you, Lord? No. There are no gods like you. You are wonderfully holy, you are amazingly powerful, you do great miracles. Um the Bible also says that he is love. Uh 1 John 4 8, it says also he is good. Uh Psalm 107 1 says, Oh, give thanks to the Lord, for he is good, for his loving kindness is everlasting. He is all powerful, as one Psalm 147.5 speaks of. Um, He is gracious. Um that's something that I did not consider when I was um uh younger, and even when I became a dad, I did not consider the graciousness of God as a father. Um, and Psalm 103.8 says that um the Lord is compassionate and gracious, slow to anger and abounding in loving kindness. And there's so many other um attributes that we could attach to our Heavenly Father as a father. Um and that's the standard I think we should start with, like identifying um the standard. You know, I love dogs, you know, it's it's you've heard enough about my dog uh passion. But one cool thing about dogs, when you go to a dog show, um dogs are they're always compared to a standard. Yes. And that that standard is perfect. None of the dogs in the show ever meet the standard, but they just try to find the one that's the closest to the standard. Uh it's a bad analogy, but you get the point. Like our job is to get as close as we can to the standard that we've um had set before us, which is our Heavenly Father.

SPEAKER_00 4:12

Yes. That's the foundation that we want to start from. And perhaps some of our listeners haven't had the healthiest examples of earthly fathers, but we do have a heavenly father that never disappoints, he never lets us down. And I think it's also helpful to go back to the beginning in Genesis to the first father, Adam. Marriage was the very first institution established by God, as we read about in Genesis 1. And then we see the biblical mandate to have children. Genesis 1 26. So God created man in his own image. In the image of God, he created him. Male and female, he created them. And God blessed them. And God said to them, Be fruitful and multiply and fill the earth and subdue it. So these are the building blocks of a biblical family, marriage between one man and one woman, and then we see that command to have children and fill the earth. But being a father is so much more than the ability to procreate. That's simply a father in the biological sense. But God calls us as men to a much higher standard. He's looking for those courageous, godly fathers who sacrificially and selflessly love and serve their spouse and their children as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for us. Jesus was not a biological father, but it's his example that we are to emulate and we are to put on and clothe ourselves in his humility, as we see in Philippians 2.3. Do nothing from selfish ambition or vain conceit, but consider others as more important than yourselves as we look to the interests of others first. And that's pretty sobering. You know, when we first get married, we realize just how selfish we really are. And we're called to put our wife's interests before our own. And if the Lord provides kids, we discover it all over again, just how how selfish and how self-focused we can be. I thought it was interesting, you know, a couple of nights ago, you know, watching the NBA draft and and you're hearing the interviews with the players and the families and hearing from some of the dads talk about some of the sacrifices that they had to make in order to get their sons to where they are today, making the league. And you know, one father said, you know, it it wasn't about us, it it became about us, you know, helping our kids reach their goals. And obviously, you know, there's got to be balance in that. You know, we do want to set up our kids for success, but the greatest target that we want to aim our arrows at, our children at, is true greatness in Christ. So what else makes for a godly father?

SPEAKER_04 7:17

Yeah, as as a as a man who's married, um, loving your wife well in front of your children is a huge gift to your kids. And when kids grow up watching healthy, loving interactions between their parents, they they naturally will seek to um not just identify it as something that's normal for them, but then they they will emulate that um when they have their own uh situation. Even if you're a divorced uh man or single, you can still model respectful behavior in front of your child. Um that's another way in a in a situation that didn't go well. Um you can also you know demonstrate that if you're remarried. You know, if you had a divorce, you can still respect the lady that you got a divorce from and then still honor and love uh your next uh wife. And that that's a blessing to your kids. And and Ephesians 25, uh 5 and 25 and 28 says it so well. Husbands love your wives, just as Christ also loved the church and gave himself up for her. Like that is what we are to do. Um, and that is what I struggled with um and still do. Like I'm not gonna sit here and act like I have that one down. It is not something that um I think about um like I should, but I didn't know anything about it until I got married um back in 1995. And I was really struggling um in my marriage to Ingrid. I I I had a bad paradigm about marriage. I was in the MBA, I'm making money. My idea of marriage was, you know, provide for my family, uh buy the home, um, not ever mistreat my wife, but I just didn't understand um the part about loving Ingrid and now Lisa, the way that Christ loves the church. And Ingrid and her fearlessness and courageousness called me up. Um we had just gotten traded here to San Antonio. We had an unbelievably bad argument. Um my idea of a good marriage was make money and take care of my family, and like no one should ever complain. And and she she looked me in the eyes one day in the middle of an argument, and she told me, she said, You don't know how to be a man.

SPEAKER_05 9:50

Wow.

SPEAKER_04 9:51

And that was something that no one had ever said to me. And I was in a position as an athlete where to be straight, everyone, if not most people, were not willing to tell me the truth about things I needed to understand. A lot of that comes from the fact that I was in the MBA and I'm making the kind of money that I'm making. And she humbled me, and it was a humbling time. Um and so thankfully we did get traded here to San Antonio. We started going uh to church here. Her mother had recommended that we go um to Eagle's Nest. She had heard tapes of Rick Godwin, and we started going to Eagle's Nest, and they had a class there called Young Married. And it was taught by Randy and Sandy Ross, who I'm still friends with to this day. Like they're still important people in my life. And that that particular segment of our marriage and in my life um changed it forever. Um I I I was around uh Rick Godwin and Cindy Godwin, I was around uh Randy and Sandy Ross, I was around uh Wayne and Suzette Gordon, I was around so many older couples, um, forgive me for saying older, but they were older than Ingrid and I, and I saw what it looked like. Um, not to discredit anybody from my family or anyone that I had been around before, but maybe at this point in my life my heart was open to see it. Um up until then, all I had focused on was making it to the NBA. I wasn't thinking about being a godly husband based on the scriptures. And once I saw it, and they would use verses and we would go through teachings in class, and we would all talk about we'd be like sometimes 20 couples in our class. We met on Tuesday nights or Wednesday nights um at Eagle's Nest, and we would go through um verses like 1 Peter 3:7. It says, You husbands in the same way, live with your wives in an understanding way. Like I just, I just never thought about that. I got married without any counsel at all. Um, we didn't go through marriage counseling, we just got married. And because of that, you go into it with your own way of thinking, you go into it with your own historical examples. Not that, not that all of the examples from my past were bad. And the one thing that I can admit is that I really didn't want to know what a godly marriage looked like. And so when my marriage was falling apart and Ingrid told me that I didn't have a clue what being a man looked like, God had opened my heart with that humbling moment. And because of that time and having those examples around, um, I learned how to live with her in an understanding way. And now I learn I've learned to live with Lisa in an understanding way. And the Bible continues, it says, as with someone weaker, since she is a woman, and show her honor as a fellow heir of the grace of life, so that your prayers will not be hindered. And I can I can remember like hearing that part, like, okay, okay, I'll I'll get this right now because I don't want my prayers hindered. But there was a greater blessing in terms of loving her, uh, not that she was weaker, it says as a weaker vessel. But there was a greater blessing in loving her that way because in that I was taking steps toward being more like Christ. Yes. And not so much more like this paradigm that I had created in my own mind.

SPEAKER_00 13:34

Yes. That's a great testimony. I mean, we need to love uh our our wife who can often call us up, not not call us out, but remind us of of that higher standard that we are being called to as godly husbands and fathers. We we're all striving for that. And so we never stop cherishing them, we never stop pursuing them, getting to know them, dating them. And I think adding to that another quality of a godly father is displaying that unconditional love for our kids through our actions and through our words. And it was refreshing, you know, growing up, knowing that whatever it is I was involved with, you know, whatever sport or activity, I knew that if I did my best, if I did it with joy, if I did it with respect for the other team and the officials and and and the coaches, it didn't matter if I came home with uh a first place or a seventh place ribbon. The acceptance and the love would be unconditional from my parents. And I think that freed me up and and my siblings to pursue whatever it is that we were passionate about. And you know, sometimes when we parent, we can parent from that fear-based perspective, you know, fear of how our children will be perceived, or fear of how that their behavior reflects upon us. Instead of that grace-based parenting, and we got that from Tim Kimmel, it's not about what they do or how they perform. We show them grace and love based on who they are. Our child, uh ultimately a child of God, fearfully and wonderfully made. We love them just the way that God made them. And we need to verbalize that so often with our kids. I love you, I'm proud of you, I'm for you, I'm with you no matter what. And our words have such great power. You know, I remember the great Howard Hendricks who used to teach at uh Dallas Seminary, he once talked about how he was wound up as a child, maybe he was you know struggling with some ADHD before they they had that title attached to it. But one day he walked into a class and the teacher said to Prof. Hendricks, Your reputation has preceded you, but I don't believe a word of it. And he said that those words changed his life. This teacher believed in him. And it's those kinds of words of affirmation and acceptance that we need to speak often to our kids. And I love the quote that you shared with me. Our our kids don't have to be right, get right, or make it right for us to love them. So I I love I love that thought. And you know, I I just uh appreciate so much how you display that, you know, with with your own kids.

SPEAKER_04 16:51

Yeah. I mean I tr I try. Um I think if I'm if I'm being totally vulnerable without sharing too much, a lot of if I've made any growth in that area, it's come from mistakes. Yeah. Um, you know, I had to talk about grace pay based parenting, especially when you're supporting your kids in sports. Like we had to come up with the 10-minute rule. Um and that it came out of after games. Um I could blame it on my coaching side, but it was really just me being too much. And we came up with a 10-minute rule. Um after every game, I got 10 minutes to just kind of talk to them about what I saw, ask them questions about what they felt, um, encourage, teach, coach, and then that's it. We typically go get something that they want to eat and we flush it. And when I first explained that to Elijah, he you could you could just see like and at the time he was like 10. And I remember like the how we came up with it. We were after one of his games, we're driving home, and I'm I'm I'm driving and I'm talking, like, hey man, why'd you, you know, did you get back on the like why didn't you take that shot? And why'd you, you know, and I looked in the rear view mirror and I could see his eyes. Yeah.

unknown 18:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 18:09

And in that moment, I was like, I can't do this. Right. I'm gonna I'm gonna lose my kid. Yes. And so we, you know, a lot of the growth, if I've made any, it's come out of necessity. You know, I had to, or I was gonna get myself in trouble. One of the things that Pastor Bill Gebhart, um, one of my mentors, taught me a long time ago when I was struggling with some some parts of my parenting. He said to me, he said, Mont, you can't take the credit or the blame for your kids. And I was just like, like, what do you mean by that? And he was, he said, You're you're just to train them and teach them. It's stewardship. You love them for sure, but when they do well, that's not you. Right. You you're just stewarding the position that God gave you. It's God that brings the increase. If you've taught them and you've trained them and you and you're doing your best and they they make mistakes and make tough choices, like you can't take all of that blame. Now, if I if I've done something that's totally contrary to God's word, and my kids make a choice based on that, then yeah, I have to I have to step up to the plate and say that was me. But I I was talking to him in a scenario where I was giving my one of my kids sound wisdom on something and they were choosing to do something else. That happens. I did it. Um, I would say I don't know what percentage of kids do it, but a great percentage. And he gave me some wisdom that freed me up to just trust God through that time. And that if I, you know, the seed that was sown, which was God's word, it would not come back void. And I had to trust that. And I also had to trust the fact that God was in it and he was going to bring my child through this situation in his timing. I wanted it like right now. And he that that really taught me a couple of things. I'm to train them and just rely on Proverbs 22, 6. It says, train up a child in the way he should go, even when he is old, he will not depart from it. So that that that you know gives me one aspect of my parenting as a father. And then the other one is to teach them. And you you just you used this the other day as a compliment verse to a teaching we had um a Sunday ago, um, Deuteronomy 6, uh six and seven. It says, These words which I am commanding you today shall be on your heart. You shall teach them diligently to your sons and shall talk of them when you sit in your house, and when you walk by the way, and when you lie down, and when you rise up. And that's that's our job. Like, it's not just teaching at the dinner table. It could be in the garage, it could be for it for for us where we live, you know, down at the creek. Yes. You know, when we're walking around and goofing around, when we're in the gym, like take time, uh, grab those moments, and and when something comes up, you know, use those times to to take God's word and show your kids, like, hey, you know, I hear I can see you want to do this, but this is what God's word says about it. Let's let's let's rely on this, let's pray about it and see what God says about it. And that really freed me up, that level of wisdom from Pastor B. Because I was I was in that mode of when they did well, I was, you know, I was I was popping my collar. Uh when they struggled, I was blaming myself for everything. And he he just he freed me up in a way that he didn't understand. Yeah, there's there's there's a emotional side of it when they do well or when they're struggling to be involved in both of those emotions. Yeah. But at the end of it, um trusting God, not just with my parenting, but trusting. Trusting God with my children has given me a level of freedom that's uh not only forced me to trust Him, but forced me to kind of release them once I've shared with them the wisdom that they've asked for or that I needed to give them at the time.

SPEAKER_00 22:16

And I think you said the the key word and all of that. Steward. Yeah. You know, ultimately our our children belong to God, and we hold them back up to the Lord with an open hand. I mean, they they are his. And I love that Deuteronomy 6 emphasis. You know, looking for those intentional moments. There's the formal instruction that might take place around the dinner table or or in the evening with the family. But then those uh informal moments, again, as you're sitting on the dock or or um you know, just before they go to bed. Uh you you let them see who you are. And that's something that I've tried to do more of now that our kids are getting a little bit older, you know, sharing those tough lessons that I learned, you know, and and and making sure they know dad has messed up. And and uh you you want to be be careful of kind of the stories you share, but the just showing that God forgives us, God shows us grace, and we have to extend grace to ourselves as well. And and as fathers, we can't get caught up in in the comparison game. We are called to be the courageous, loving, godly father that He wants us to be in our family for such a time as this. And speaking of time, you know, I think that's another key quality of a godly father, someone who is present and engaged with the family, uh, giving of our time, having that ministry of presence and our presence is more important than our perfection. And so whatever they're involved in, if it's sports, if it's art or science, you know, learn more about that and get into their world. Yeah. And take an interest in that thing, even if it isn't your thing. And you know, I love that about you, Mani. You know, whatever your kids are into, you're all in. You're coaching, you're training, you're guiding, you're providing advice and counsel. Um the time that you invest in them communicates love to them. Yeah. And it's these kinds of decisions that can have a positive impact. But sadly, we also see in Scripture that our disobedience can also greatly impact our family as well.

SPEAKER_04 24:55

Yeah. I mean, uh this is one I can relate to in such a tangible way. Um you look at the life of Jacob uh during a time of transition for him, uh, God gave him a pretty direct command. He tells him to go back uh to Bethel, uh to the place of his birth. He was with his relative Laban. And God said, go back um to Bethel in Genesis uh 31. And Jacob makes a costly uh decision. Uh as you uh we can read this in Genesis 33, 18 through 20. The Bible says that um Jacob came safely to the city of Shechem, not Bethel. And the problem with that um decision was it affected his family. One, he was disobedient during this important time of transition. And the Bible says that his daughter Dinah was defiled uh during that time. And there's some translations that even say she was raped. And because of that, um it it it um spurred her brothers um to commit murder during this time. And and those kinds of decisions um are tough when you look, you know, you can look I teach my boys like when we see stuff like this in scripture, you can look at it um in judgment or you can learn from it. It's best that you learn um because we're all susceptible to making bad decisions. And I can relate to this kind of decision um just based on my choice. Uh, years ago when I was with the Spurs and my contract decision uh negotiation didn't go well, um I thought I was gonna sign a contract here and all of a sudden it was just it just didn't go well. And so they had set it up for me uh to go to Chicago in a sign and trade. And I was so upset that I got, you know, in my mind, I got treated a certain way. Well, it was just business. Yeah, it was a decision that the team made. So instead of taking the sign and trade deal to go to Chicago, I took my own route and went to Denver. Well, right before I went to Denver, um, or playing, I'm playing pickup, playing some of the best ball in my life, at least I thought, which is pride. You know, I I mean the i I felt so good about myself that I started to get more prideful than I'm willing to admit.

SPEAKER_05 27:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 27:30

Um, took the contract in Denver with uh a hurt ankle because during that time, right before I was supposed to leave, I turned my ankle in a way that I hadn't turned it like this in a long, long time. So I got to training camp in Denver pretty much playing on one leg. And for the first time in my life, I got cut. And it was such a hard pill to swallow. Um, not so much that um I got cut, it was because I didn't take what God had provided for me. Yeah. Things didn't go well for me in my contract negotiations with the Spurs. I had a chance to go to Chicago and make actually more money than I took in Denver. But I was trying to carve my own path and wasn't really thinking about what God had provided for me. And I made a tough decision and it affected my family. And at the time it was just Ingrid and myself and uh Lael. And what the team didn't know and what not many people had known, we had just lost a child right after Lael was was born. Um we Ingrid got pregnant, we got pregnant um after that, and we lost that child. So we were going through a ton of stuff, but that decision affected my family. Now, in his goodness and kindness, um, after I got cut from Denver, uh, we moved to Orlando. Um, my former teammate Doc Rivers um became the coach in Orlando, and I was like the first guy he signed, which was crazy. Um and I ended up playing three years down there, which was so much fun. I had a uh life-changing experience there for sure. But um needless to say, a lot like Jacob, um I made a decision out of pride and it affected my family. Yeah. And those are the ones that keep you up at night. Those are the ones that you have a ton of regret about because being vulnerable with the Lord, because I can't I can't fake it in front of him. I can fake it in front of myself sometimes. I can rationalize a lot of stuff, but as God in a qu in a gracious way showed me that he had prov provided for me an option, even though it didn't work out here in San Antonio. I had an option in Chicago and I chose my own way, ended up getting cut and had my family all over the place for about a year until we settled in in Orlando. And so making these kinds of choices, as we see in the life of Jacob, um is an example of not so good fatherhood and parenting and leadership. Um, but my hope is that you know, through my mistake and through my silliness, that someone can learn. Um as Pastor Bill would often share with me, he he's like, Matt, you learn from observation and experience. It's best you learn from observation. And he was he would always say that to me, and I just I just shake my head. I'm like, I know he's trying to tell me something. But it's so true. Um I I've I've read the scriptures enough to know that when we make costly choices out of pride, they can get us in a lot of trouble.

SPEAKER_00 30:51

Yeah. And and God often has to get us back on the right path. That's right. And and in his grace, he restores us, and and we turn to him for forgiveness and for that humility that we need. And I also think of the negative example of King David. You know, his sin with Bathsheba didn't just affect him and Bathsheba and her husband Uriah, but that disobedience led to family chaos and great division and dysfunction. And you mentioned Jacob, and I think about the favoritism that he showed toward his son Joseph. That led to jealousy from the other brothers who then sold Joseph off into slavery. And there was a passivity there with Jacob and with David and an absence of boundaries and loving discipline. As godly parents, we discipline out of love and grace, not out of anger or hurt. And again, we seek to emulate the love of Christ, but we can't love like him until we first place our faith in Jesus and then we pursue him as a disciple. And that's another example or another quality of a godly father, someone who is striving after Jesus, someone who has that personal, growing relationship with the Lord, and we are called to be godly stewards of the home and the family. And that's not a role that we just pass off to our wives or the pastor or the youth minister or to the church. I mean, the our wife is a partner with us in this process, but it's our responsibility, our primary responsibility of leading the family spiritually that that rests upon our shoulders. And we can't impart what we don't first possess. And that's why we need to be in the Word. And we teach our children, but more importantly, we model what it looks like to seek Christ in every area of our lives. Jeremiah 29, 13, you will seek me and find me when you search for me with all your heart. So when our kids see us pursuing Jesus, when they see us seeking Christ and His word and trusting the Lord with all our hearts, they then want that for their own lives. And that's our prayer. And that's the greatest legacy that we can leave to our children, a legacy of faith. It's not about what we leave for them that ultimately matters, but what we leave in them, and we desire for that to be a contagious love and a pursuit of Christ. So as we close, what are some of those final words of application that we can give to encourage the fathers or those who want to be a father someday? What should they major in as godly dads?

SPEAKER_04 34:10

Well, the this kind of fathering, as you just said, godly fathers. Um, not that we are better, um, more of anything that's good. Um the only difference between us and those who aren't like us in this way is Jesus. That's just the way it is. And that that starts with a relationship with God, like number one. Um having that relationship sets the table for the rest of it. Um prayer is another thing that you learn as a father. You're going to pray. It might be on your knees, it might be outside trying to figure it out. Um, but voluntary, um, setting time aside, praying, um, and seeking his will uh above your own, as I talked about earlier, bad paradigm on parenting and fatherhood that might not um most likely doesn't fit what is needed in your home uh scripture in Bible study. Um something that has had a huge impact on um me. Um as I've talked to you about a number of times. I was just a Devo guy. You know, I just not nothing wrong with Devos, but God was calling me to a deeper relationship as I learned to get in the scriptures on a daily basis and see what he had to say uh to me and allow the Holy Spirit to lead me in that. Uh church attendance is a huge component. Um that that really blessed me to be with those men and women, but in particular, those men like Rick Godwin, Wayne Gordon, Randy Ross, uh James Williams, uh Guillermo Rocha, uh Bob Yarrington, who's still my general practitioner to this day. Like all those guys had a huge impact on me, and they went to our church and surrounding yourself with other dads, uh being around guys who are dads uh maybe on your level, maybe below you, uh, but hopefully above you in terms of wisdom and experience that can uh share with you um what you need to to know. And in the last couple, uh serving our spouses sacrificially, uh laying down our lives, um treating them as a weaker vessel. Not that they are, but as a weaker vessel, um serving them and and and loving them, washing them with the water of the word. Yes, and and then loving our kids as you talked about so well, loving them unconditionally. Yeah. Um, you know, and and there's more for sure. I mean, there's practical areas that, you know, we probably need like a part two, three, four, and five uh when it comes to fathering. We could spend part two, three, and four just talking about my mistakes. But I uh just just from a practical side of it, um those things have been huge for me in my growth as a dad, identifying where I need to grow, and then trusting God to help me uh by His Spirit to grow in this this this thing called fatherhood, um this privilege that I have to be a dad to six kids in a way that I didn't see in the early 90s when I first got married. I just I had no clue what being a father uh was really about.

SPEAKER_00 37:34

Well, fathers, we want to let you know that we're praying for you and we encourage you to keep chasing after Christ, uh keep pursuing your wife, cherish her, honor her, and then emulate Jesus as you sacrificially and selflessly love and nurture and point your kids to Jesus. And we want to just let every listener know that we're praying for you and and we are here for you. And let's pray now for our listeners. Lord, we just thank you for your word. Uh thank you for uh teaching us and and correcting us at times. And and Lord, we thank you for the fathers in our lives and for the gift it is to be a father. Help us to live up to the calling that you have placed upon us as we seek to emulate you, Lord Jesus, in your humility and in your grace, as we desire to love our wives and our children with that selfless love. And Lord, I pray that you would give every listener, wherever you have them, your strength to leave a legacy of faith to the next generation. It might be a father or a mother to a child or maybe a mentor, uh, and you have placed younger believers in their lives for them to steward and and to point to faith and to godliness. And Lord, we desire uh to be a faithful steward in wherever you have us. We want to do all this for your kingdom and your glory. We pray this in the name of Jesus. Amen. Well, thank you for spending time with us. And remember, wherever it is that you're facing and whatever it is that you have before you today, know that God loves you, He's for you, and He's got a good plan for you. And we'll see you next time.

SPEAKER_01 40:00

Thank you for joining us at Coaching for Life. And please subscribe wherever you receive this content.