Episode 03: Leadership AND... Chris Failla

Finding Your Why: The Conversation That Changes Everything

What if one of the most important questions you'll ever answer isn't "what do I do" or "where am I going"?

What if it's simply: Why?

In Episode 3 of the Leadership, And… Podcast, Josh Donovan and Patrick Ibarra sit down with leadership coach and author Chris Failla to unpack the story behind one of the most transformational tools in the Lighthouse ecosystem: the Why Process.

What begins as the story of how Josh and Chris first met quickly becomes a deep conversation about purpose, identity, vulnerability, trust, belonging, and the hidden wounds that often shape our greatest gifts.

Together, they explore why so many people spend their lives chasing "what" and "how" questions while never slowing down long enough to ask the question underneath them all: Who am I?

This episode is part origin story, part masterclass, and part invitation to do the deeper work of understanding yourself.

Because when you find your why, you don't just discover what you're here to do.

You discover who you are.

In This Episode:

• The meet-cute story of how Josh and Chris first met
• Why the Why Process became foundational to Lighthouse
• The difference between purpose, vision, and goals
• Why most people ask the wrong questions about their future
• How wounds often reveal our deepest gifts
• The role vulnerability plays in connection and trust
• Why organizational culture starts with individual clarity
• How core purpose and core values work together
• The relationship between strengths, identity, and self-leadership
• Why asking for help is often a gift to the people around you
• Chris's upcoming book, RE:Stress, and a new way of thinking about stress

Timestamps:

00:00 — How Josh and Chris first met

05:00 — The unexpected experience that changed everything

09:00 — Josh's search for a coach

12:00 — Patrick hears about "this guy you need to meet"

14:00 — What the Why Process actually is

18:00 — Chris discovers Simon Sinek's Find Your Why framework

21:00 — Why purpose is a place to come from, not a place to get to

26:00 — Lighthouse, organizational clarity, and core ideology

33:00 — The structure of a Why Statement

35:00 — Who should do a Why Process and when?

38:00 — Family Why sessions and leadership at home

41:00 — Origin stories, vulnerability, and connection

48:00 — Why vulnerability literally means "the ability to be wounded"

52:00 — Josh shares his Why Statement

58:00 — Patrick shares his Why Statement

1:06:00 — Chris shares his Why Statement

1:10:00 — Why finding your why requires other people

1:17:00 — Core values, strengths, and self-leadership

1:33:00 — Introducing RE:Stress

1:39:00 — The connection between stress, purpose, and belonging

1:50:00 — Why asking for help is actually a gift

2:05:00 — Chris's brother, grief, and the message behind the book

Notes:

Brené brown Anatomy of Trust video  (https://brenebrown.com/videos/anatomy-trust-video/)

Family Guy roadrunner episode  (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YPqkHlBcpzs)

Nike Trained Simon Sinek episode  (https://open.spotify.com/episode/4NzraIzotFdP9Z5FpbE8qM)

Re: Stress by Chris Failla (Lighthouse Publishing) https://lighthouseinstitute.com/publishing/

About Lighthouse Institute

Lighthouse Institute exists to shine light that ignites connection, inspires hope, and transforms generations.

Through leadership development, coaching, facilation, and organizational training, Lighthouse helps individuals and teams grow in self-awareness, emotional intelligence, communication, trust, ownership, and leadership effectiveness.

The Leadership, And… podcast explores leadership through the lens of real life: work, relationships, parenting, purpose, conflict, growth, and the human experience.

Follow along for more conversations about leadership, parenting, relationships, conflict, growth, and the human side of leadership.

Transcript

SPEAKER_04 0:01

Most importantly, leadership is relational and it's human. And then we'll hear yeah, but. Right? Because we're kind of obsessed with that word but. Right? I hear you, but. I love you, but. I'm sorry, but thank you, but. You're doing good, but.

SPEAKER_03 0:24

But just deletes everything that was previously said. So we really need the word and. I hear you and. I love you and I'm sorry, and thank you, and you're doing good, and I'm Josh Donovan with Lighthouse Institute.

SPEAKER_04 0:42

And I am Patrick Ibarra with Lighthouse Media. And we're excited to dive into leadership through real conversations. It's all on the table.

SPEAKER_03 0:52

Work, parenting, marriage, conflict, friendship, personal growth. Because wherever you go, there you are. Leading yourself and leading others. So really, this is leadership and everything else. Okay, episode three of Leadership and Getting Ready to Come Your Way. This is the first conversation that Patrick and I invited someone else in to join us. And you actually have already heard us talk about Chris Phaela. I'd imagine some of you are like, who is this guy, Chris Phaela? And when are we going to get to meet him? Today is that day. We knew right away, and it actually comes up in this episode that we Chris was a conversation we had identified early. How do we get him in here? How do we have this convo? Uh thankfully he's on our team, so it wasn't too hard to track him down and and get him in to make this happen. What do you anything you want to share with our audience as we're thinking about on-ramping into this one?

SPEAKER_04 1:57

Yeah, this episode is one of my favorites that we've recorded. Um just Chris Fail is just an amazing human being. I've learned so much from him, and this episode just unpacks so many amazing tools, uh, so much of his life and like the examples that he gives us. Like it's an incredible episode. Like I cannot wait for you guys to listen to this one.

SPEAKER_03 2:17

Yeah. And like others, just a reminder, this was recorded back in uh about the middle of March. So this will be uh going live June 1st. And there are some exciting things happening in Chris Fela's world uh that you're gonna hear about in this episode. You're obviously gonna hear about how uh we both met Chris and how he made his way into the Lighthouse team. Um, but there are some very exciting things happening. Uh preview, he wrote something and it's making its way out into the universe, and we're gonna be talking about that on today's episode. So uh we hope you enjoy it. Let's go shine bright. All right. Well, I I mean, how many different times have you and I been in conversations, Chris, where you have said this needs to be recorded and this needs to be a podcast episode? I've lost count. It's been a lot. So this has been a long time coming uh to sit down at a table with headphones on, microphones on, and capturing our conversation. And I figured you'd probably want to tell one of at least the story I have is it's a favorite story of yours to tell about how you and I met.

SPEAKER_00 3:29

Yeah, considering we are literally at the same building, at the space, yeah, same building in the room, right on the side of us. And yeah, I don't I don't remember the timeline though, because it feels like 20 years ago. Yeah, feels like yeah, the beginning of my life. I was invited to share my story with a group of entrepreneurs, and I knew one of them, kind of was that great. Uh yeah. We'd had one conversation before this. So I came into a room, no relationship, no context. He's like, just come share your story. So there's maybe what 15, 15 guys in the room. And about 45 minutes, I'm deep dive into all the the dirt, all the goodness, all the treasure, all the trouble of of my life. And at the end of it, this uh and this guy, so Josh is sitting there across from me the whole time.

SPEAKER_03 4:20

Okay, wait, though, because the same guy, the same guy who I know hits me up, right? So this is we're at we're at Bloom co-working space, which is where Lighthouse has an office now, which we've talked a little bit about in the previous two episodes. And so we're but rewind, and Greg Squires is texting me and he's like, We're doing this uh story hour at Story Labs. We've got this cool guy coming in to tell his story. He basically does what you do. And I'm like, what does that mean? He goes, Oh, you know, he's a he's a leadership coach, he does speaking, he's like really into Gallup, like clifting strengths, and I'm like, oh man. Like, oh, okay. I honestly I don't even really know 100% why I said yes. I that's that was exactly what I was gonna ask you is why'd you say yes? I I mean Greg is kind of he's one of those connector guys, he you know, he he's really good at creating excitement. Uh and so I was like, all right, and and but I I say that because I don't think that my whole posture and body language had said yes when I'm in the room.

SPEAKER_00 5:22

Not at all. So say more about when you walk in. So I remember I walk in and I do my thing of introducing myself to everybody. I'm just vibe-checking, right? Like, what's going on in here? What am I stepping into? And you're sitting on the couch and you're there, wasn't a dark cloud over you, but there was not an openness. It was just like you were like, you're just there, but you weren't like there. And I introduced myself and and it was you're cordial, but it was it was quick, you know what I mean? Like you kept it pretty tight. And so I'm into my story, and at the beginning, right? I don't want to mess up the microphone, but we got arms crossed, we got a little bit of that, you know, sitting back and kind of taking it all in. Uh I won't say criticizing, um, but I would say evaluating. And closed off. Uh, and and pretty closed body language. And softened a bit as I'm sharing, right? But still, I I could see the walls. We're up. And so I share, and I'd mentioned something about some of the healing process I had gone through in my story and and some of the ways that that had come through my life for others. And the guy, not the guy that invited me, but the other kind of host. Tom. Uh, so Tom, he he looks at me and he's like, Hey man, and he's got tears in his eyes. And he's like, Hey, that whole healing thing you mentioned, do you still do that? And I thought he meant like, is that still a part of my life now? And I was like, uh, kind of. I mean, I hope so. And I I shared a story, an example of what that's looked like for me. And he goes, No, like, thank you, but no, I mean like right now. Could we do that? Oh and I'm like, um, sure.

SPEAKER_03 7:04

Yeah, and I'll take this one. Then Tom gets up and goes and grabs a box of tissues, comes back into the room and like slams them on the middle of the table and goes, let's go. And and I'm like, Where? Or what are you talking about? I'm like, Tissues, come on, man. And then like two guys get up and leave. Well, I mean, the time container was that time. And and I actually, and I I just recently told you this actually for the first time just a little bit ago. I had a coaching session booked that that hour. Oh, and that was a coaching session. Okay. And something just told me, like, stay in the room.

SPEAKER_02 7:44

Stay.

SPEAKER_03 7:45

And and I have never punted a coaching session. And I I texted that particular client and was like, hey, uh, I got something that came up. I'm gonna need to meet up with you tomorrow, right? Um, this was actually outside of the lighthouse ecosystem, just as a little asterisk. Um I stayed, and I'm really, really glad I stayed.

SPEAKER_00 8:09

Yeah. So what happened next? So what's interesting is Tom gets up and grabs tissues, and I'm kind of like, what does dude know? I don't know. He and I had had zero conversation, I never met the guy. And so it wasn't like we had rehearsed something that we were gonna drop on the room, right? And I was like, Well, y'all uh up for doing a little thought experiment. And they're like, Yeah, let's go for it.

SPEAKER_03 8:38

And so I walked them through what, maybe 10, yeah, 10, 11 minutes max. And he actually used one of he he said thought experiment, but then he used a word that hit me kind of weird in that moment, but I've come to learn that it's one of his favorite words and one that I've come to adopt as well, which is he said, Do y'all want to play? And that was like, uh, I don't know if I can confidently say yes to that right now, but I I definitely was feeling the pull to stay in the room and do y'all want to play? And there were enough people that said yes. And there were people, here's another key factor, there were people in the room that I had pretty high respect for, um, outside of Chris, right? And I didn't know him yet. And so, yeah, probably eight to ten to twelve minutes, I don't know, I blacked out. Uh, you know, a a visualization exercise, some some personal reflection, some contemplation, just like it was deep. And and I found myself unlocking in ways that I didn't know needed to be unlocked. Um, if you had told me that I was going to end up full weep in that room that day, if you told me that that morning, I'd be like, yeah, you're hilarious. That's never gonna happen, right? And and there was just really, and again, a word that we'll come back to later, just because I know this guy is something was being summonsed from me for sure. And interestingly, I had for about the two months prior to this, I had really been looking for a coach of my own. I I had told myself, like, I really need to sit in the in the coachy seat. Uh, kind of got fast-tracked into Lighthouse and you know, got my coaching certification. And I did do a ton of work on the education front and and you know, growing who I was, but I had never actually been coached. And in all honesty, I've learned that that's a pretty big gripe that the coaching industry has is how many people just kind of smoking what they're selling. Exactly. Well, or they find themselves into coaching, like they've never even been coached, or they start selling it and they've never actually coached anybody. So, like one of the first things I tell people interested in coaching is start right now, like pick someone and and start coaching with them now. But funny, I had been reaching out to someone locally and not having much success.

SPEAKER_00 11:00

Somebody, incidentally, that I found out later is literally named in Brene Brene's TED Talk that we use.

SPEAKER_03 11:07

Yeah, yeah, which is crazy. It's crazy. And so there's a video we use called The Anatomy of Trust. If you want to look it up on YouTube, it's phenomenal. It's it's literally less than 10 minutes, and Brene Brown breaks down the anatomy of trust and she puts a definition to it. But she says in the on-rip, she's like, Charles Feltman has this definition around. And I'm like, wait a minute, that's the guy. That's crazy. That's who I was trying to. We had just been playing bone tag over and over and over, and and the stars hadn't aligned, we couldn't connect. Then I end up in this room, Chris Fela, he does this whole thing with all of us, and I left that day going, he needs to be my coach. I I need to work with this guy.

SPEAKER_04 11:48

Wow.

SPEAKER_03 11:49

So the next day. So did I have your phone number? No. You did not. Okay. That's the other important piece of this, for me at least, right? Is I actually messaged Greg and was like, hey, whoever that weirdo was in the room yesterday.

SPEAKER_04 12:04

The guy that made me cry.

SPEAKER_03 12:05

Yeah, I need his phone number, right? And so shared it, shared your number. No, I reached out, I called. And as crazy as this is gonna sound to everyone, you answered the phone. And that was a super big deal to me, right? Like I had been playing phone tag with this other guy for, I mean, literally, it'd probably been eight to ten rounds.

SPEAKER_01 12:24

Wow.

SPEAKER_03 12:24

And so Chris answered, Hi, this is Chris. And I'm like, oh my gosh, this is real. You know, and I'm like, hey, Chris, like this is you probably don't remember me. This is Josh, like from yesterday. And he's like, Oh yeah, I remember you. And he goes, I'm on a walk on the beach right now with Mitch. Mitch Jansen, who was in the room, who is one of those guys that I've known. I mean, Mitch was Mitch was on Chris Furry's coaching staff for my uh JV football team. So I've also known Mitch for decades, yeah, you know, almost 30 years. So two things. One, he answered his phone. Two, he was with Mitch and answered his phone. So he was like, he was signaling this is really important, I care about this, and he just handled that conversation really beautifully, also, which was like, Hey, let me call you back. Uh, you know, this is really important to me. I definitely want I'm with Mitch. I want to honor this. And I just remember leaving that conversation going, this is a done deal. Uh, you know, it doesn't really matter what he tells me after that.

SPEAKER_00 13:23

Well, I wish I would have known that.

SPEAKER_03 13:25

Yeah. And I think honestly, I think it was like four days later, you had me come out to Moral Bay. Yeah. I remember because Brianna was out of town and I had to bring the three people. Single down it. Yeah. And I was like, girls, you can play over here on the park, and you know, so it was we sat down at that picnic table for almost two hours.

SPEAKER_00 13:43

It was like two hours. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 13:44

It was supposed to be 90 minutes. And then I learned about this guy's relationship with time. I have one of those?

unknown 13:50

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 13:51

I'll take that. Yeah. Yeah. So I mean, pretty immediate. Like, and and I would say very immediate that I started getting it's actually really funny. We had that that first meeting, I think we had a second, and then you were pushing me towards the why process, which we are gonna have a deep conversation about here. And I remember you kind of like coming back to revisiting the pricing and what I what I had invested and moving toward the why. And I'm like, yeah, in all honesty, man, I've gotten the value out of what you charged me uh after our first session, right? And so it was, yeah, it was all systems go for me. Uh and fast friends.

SPEAKER_00 14:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 14:31

Oh, dude.

SPEAKER_00 14:33

Yeah. Instant brothers, for sure. Yeah. Easiest yes I've ever said.

SPEAKER_03 14:37

Yeah. And then pretty quickly after us connecting, I was like, um, there's someone that I need you to know, and there's someone that I need you to know, and I wanted to connect you to. So, Patrick, let's hear from you on kind of the integration and connection of getting to Chris Fala.

SPEAKER_04 14:54

Oh man, that was uh so I believe it was in your birthday party, maybe uh some gathering where uh my wife and I were just talking to you and you had this different look in your eyes. This came up in I think our first conversation when we sat down. Yeah, yes. Where it was like, this guy, there's something, and and and you had come up to us and been like, I met this guy, that's how you led. And I was like, hold on a minute, like, what about your wife? You know, that's the first thought.

SPEAKER_00 15:22

Where is this going?

SPEAKER_04 15:23

Because it seemed that way, you know, like there was something deep that happened inside of you that I'm like, hmm, like it's either love or something, the same equal amount of uh just feels, right? And yeah, you shared, man, I met this guy, and my mind, my life has changed, my mind has been blown, and I was like, man, and you need to meet him. That's what you said. And I'm like, oh wow, like this sounds like I don't know, like it almost sounded, I know you're not Jesus, but it sounded like what maybe the apostles would have said to each other like you gotta meet these guys, you know, and with that, like that that emotion is just so contagious, that like feeling that I'm like, I need to meet this guy. I don't know who he is, but I just need to meet him. And so um you set up a meeting for us, and it was me and you though. Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_03 16:08

You and I went to lunch at a Thai restaurant. I remember, and it was similar. You were in this window of can I just I'll summarize it as trying to figure it out.

SPEAKER_04 16:18

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 16:19

Okay. There was a bit of like trying to figure it out. And I think you saw a spark or something in me that felt a little different, and then I started unpacking for you like the level of clarity that I had gotten in walking through my why process with Mr. Pela. Correct. And Sarah Fela. It was a team effort between the two of them, right? And so I I vividly remember that lunch and talking through having gone through that and saying, we need to get you to that why process.

SPEAKER_04 16:54

100%. Yeah. One of the lowest, lows, and just all a bunch of different areas in my life. Um, and so it was just very interesting how it happened at that time where you're sharing about a why. And in my mind at that point, it like it hit, but it didn't like stay and dive deep. It was just like, oh, this is something that kind of just like, I don't know, I guess I just put like a pin on it, but it wasn't something that I was like, oh yeah, that's probably what I need right now in my life. I just knew that it was important, but I wasn't fully processing yet until we met. Right. Once we met, it was just like all the walls just came down. We went through the white process, which I don't remember how many hours it took, but it was a long, long, long process. But it was five of them, I think. I think so. But it was so beautiful and worth every single minute. Um definitely something that I believe everybody should do. It's it's an important piece of like knowing why we do the things that we do. And I I I cannot explain it um any better than it's probably the most important questions you can ask yourself about yourself. Wow. I think that's amazing.

SPEAKER_03 17:57

Oh, I love that. The most important questions you could ask yourself about yourself. Uh but let's let's push it back over to you, Chris, on the what is a why process? Why, why, why, why why is the why the first thing that kind of came to mind when you and I started talking? Why was that the the starting point? Kind of maybe your your background and relationship with Mr. Cynic.

SPEAKER_00 18:21

Yeah. Lots to pull on there, uh, and lots of emotion opening up for me. I'll bet going back to the rooms of both of y'all. I can still I still know both of your wives by heart. And so they're running through my mind and my heart right now, and uh it's not activating my allergies at all. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 18:39

Um it's this it's the time of year.

SPEAKER_00 18:41

Yeah, yeah, it's gotta be that. So I had been leading an organization for three or four years at this point, and the vision question kept coming up. What's our vision? Where are we going? And and I've always had a mixed, uh, a bittersweet relationship to the vision idea because it always felt like at its best, it was kind of manufacturing something to to run after. Um I sidebar. There's this there's this great y'all watch Family Guy. Oh yeah. So there's a there's a family guy scene where Wiley Coyote catches the roadrunner. Right. You know, you know the show, and Wiley never gets catched roadrunner. And a family guy, he catches the roadrunner, and at first he's stoked, right? And then it fast forwards a week or two, and then you just watch as his life just lapses into meaninglessness because that was his whole purpose. And it's you you gotta look it up, YouTube it, but I will put in the show notes maybe on a lot of. I love that. It's hilarious. Uh, but at some point, literally, you see Wiley Coyote just sitting on a lazy boy with like he's gained like 80 pounds, he's got like just crumbs all over him and open beer bottles all over the room, and and it's like he caught the carrot on the stick, and a it wasn't everything he thought it would be, and b, then what? Right. And so this whole question of where are we going, what's this thing we have to get to when we get the carrot? And I was like, there's gotta be a better question than that. And so the way Simon tees up the whole why idea is it's a place to come from instead of a place to get to. And you can never run out of the energy of a place to come from, you can never outrun that, right? And it can never run dry if you tap into that place to come from. So I love to talk about when you find your why, it simultaneously summons you, use that word a little bit ago, but it also sources you. It's something that you you get pulled by, but you also get pushed by. And so when I heard about it conceptually, I was like, we need to try this. So I invited a couple of people on my leadership team and I said, okay, here's what we're gonna do. Uh takes three of us. I had actually tried it by myself. So there's a guy named Shane Hipps, who I'd signed up for some coaching with. And so Shane incorporated this uh the find your why process in his um in this journey I was on, but it was a something you do for yourself. It was just you go through, you answer these questions, and I got no traction with it. It just was I was coming up dry. There was no life, no energy. And I picked up the find your why book that a couple of Simon's team members wrote, and they were like, You can't do this alone. This is a relational process, this is a participatory process, basically. So that's when I went to two of my leaders, I was like, Hey, here's what we're gonna do. The three of us are gonna walk each other through the process. So the two of us will do it for you, you two do it, and and we're gonna have this little why trio. Well, and it rocked my world to be able to sit there and share my. My most shaping, my most scarring, my most sacred stories. And to have these two friends two and a half, three hours later, and me be able to look up at a whiteboard and put language to all of that. And I'm sitting there and I'm like, that's literally like my heartbeat on a whiteboard in a marker. And I I still, if I share my why, even today, it tears me up. And I was like, this is this is gold. Like, this is the most sacred treasure hunt you can ever go on with a human. And I had I never felt so seen. And so much I could say there. Um, but it it literally shaped the lens of everything I see in my life. Um, I remember even the very next day, little um kind of tussle, uh little little rumble with uh my middle son, who I think was probably nine, ten at the time. He's the reason behind all my gray hair so that you can't see anything. But and I remember uh my initial inclination was to to get annoyed with him. And then I just paused for like three seconds, and my why, I brought my why to the front of my mind, totally shifted my my being towards him, my posture towards him, totally shifted the trajectory of our interaction right there. And it's literally become the distillation filter for everything um that I see, that I say, that I choose has has come through that. Um I know there were a lot more no, it's questions to your questions.

SPEAKER_03 23:47

That was beautiful. And you inadvertently answered one of the other questions, which is like, you know, why does why become the starting place? And it's I mean, everything that you're describing that you experienced and that you felt, and that I mean, there's healing there, there's unlocking there, there's new possibility there. And so that that kind of creates this through line to you going, oh, okay, well, if this is everything that it meant to me, then as I continued to work with other humans, I'd, you know, pretty clearly see this as worthy, a good starting place. Um, so yeah, that that makes total sense.

SPEAKER_00 24:22

Yeah, it became it was like an instant, it was like a Mario Brothers green tube, it was like an instant accelerator to what I knew as my best me. Man, everything inside of me wanted to make the sound effect, but I did just second guessed my ability to do it. We'll let Patrick wear it in later. Put that in there, would you have a good time? Um, but just that that warp zone ability of like getting back to to my best self so much more quickly. It was just this portal of possibility. And one of the I I work with a lot of clients that are kind of in that midlife zone where they're asking the big questions about their life. And they they often come to me with questions about the what and the how, right? It's like, what should I be doing? I feel like a job, I feel like a restlessness, I feel like a job transition coming up. And you've probably talked in a previous episode about about sign, about the golden circle, right? But what on the outside of those three concentric circles and the how in the middle, and then the why in the core of it. Another way to look at that is the what and the how are like the containers of our lives. Like we're and we put so much focus on what is a container? What's the container for my next life? What's the next job I'm gonna get? What's the next career I'm gonna have? What's the next this, the next that? It's so container focused. And the why is a content conversation. It's like, who are you, who is the you that you are bringing to whatever container you're invited into, that you step into, that you manufacture for yourself, make for yourself. That's just such a game-changing conversation to have clarity on the content that you can bring to any container. That just settles something deep in your soul. It settles a lot of those questions that that we spend so much time and money and curiosity and some words I can't say, some uh mischief to put it lightly, right? Trying to figure out those are why questions. Last thing for now. I always go back to Mark Twain's beautiful quote. You know, yeah, you know this is coming right now, but two most important days of your life are the day you're born and the day you find out why.

SPEAKER_03 26:32

Yeah, well, and so many people I think take the second half of that for granted, right? Like I've heard people use that quote around like why I had a kid, and it's like, oh, this is the day I found it. It's like, yeah, ish, right? And right, it's like, yeah, for sure that informs why you're alive and those things. But it's I think it's probably worth explaining a little bit about what you found in that find your why workbook and what ended up coming on the heels of that. Because I joke in rooms that I'm in, like Simon's book, Start with Why, wildly popular. I mean, all over, right? You have to have kind of been under a rock to not know about Start With Why. Yeah, but his workbook, Find Your Why, almost the direct opposite. Like, got no traction. Yeah. And that's a gold mine. It is a gold mine. And it's it's a workbook, it's an actual workbook that takes you through and gives you the instructions and guidelines. Um, and to your point, it really strongly advocates for somebody facilitating that process for you. Yeah. Um, Simon calls out that it is a process of an origin story that that comes from pain. Like it says that, right? And then um share that other quote about a man's yeah.

SPEAKER_00 27:46

Uh Robert Bly, where I'll I'll I'll say it the original way, but yeah, where a man's wound is, that's where his genius will be. And so much RY is forged in the the what we want to see healed in the world. And to be able to articulate that and be able to come back and and transmute that from a complaint to a quest. So powerful. Huge.

SPEAKER_03 28:11

And that was a big piece of him and Sarah facilitating my process and unlocking some things in me, right? That where my wounds are, there also my genius can be. Like that was not something I had been contemplating, right? Um, and and I came to you asking what questions, yes, how questions, right? And so starting at why just open so many more things up. There's also some really interesting connection points and parallels to what was happening at Lighthouse at the same time. So I think just to give that whole picture, right? You asked about timeline. I went back and looked. Okay. Uh I was in your office April 21st of two. Wait, where'd you go? Uh 2021. Uh-huh. Okay. So I'm sorry, August. August of 2021. Okay. So what? Like almost five, yeah, four and a half, five years ago, right? Wow. There were some things happening in the world around 2020, 2021. Yeah. Right. Lighthouse had taken this opportunity to kind of go internal. We had we had done our leadership series virtually with two clients during COVID, but we were re-evaluating how we were having the core ideology conversation inside the leadership series. Okay. So in the leadership series, we we talk about greatness and being in the pursuit of greatness. The that's the G in our Lighthouse model. What does the pursuit of greatness mean? And we we were using Simon Sinek's TED Talk about why and the golden circle, why, how, what. And it's it was a great setup, but we kind of skipped over the core purpose idea and we went directly to core values. So, you know, previously, the call it 20 years prior to this conversation in 2021, leadership series participants were spending time getting clear on their core values. But there wasn't really this opportunity or invitation to explore core purpose. From a definition standpoint, core ideology is your core purpose plus your core values that makes up your core ideology. And so as we're looking at it, I'm like, hey, like, how come we spend so much time and energy here on values, but we don't get clear on the purpose? And organizations often have a mission statement, a vision statement, a purpose, a core value list that is usually like teamwork, safety, integrity, uh cooperation, yeah, yeah, collaboration, communication, right? I could give you like 10 words and they're gonna show up on most people's uh values, right? So it was just it's great opportunity. Um I'm it's super interesting because I had spent some time years prior, different business, different industry, exploring a study that Patrick Lencioni had done in the early 2000s. And the study Lencioni did, he called it organizational clarity. And really, if we want to shorthand it, make it a little more, he was talking about how do we measure cultural buy-in at organizations, this organizational clarity idea, right? And so he wanted to explore the business and the individuals. So, you know, has the company defined their core ideology? Have the individuals that work there defined their own individual core ideology? His suspicion going into the study was that you would have the lowest level of organizational clarity if neither party had defined it, right? That they were both just kind of like scrambling, like guessing, whatever. Just kind of winging it. Yeah, that'd be the lowest level. And that's not what the study showed, which was it was super surprising to him. He he what they learned was the lowest level occurred when the company has defined their core ideology and the individuals in their organization have not explored their own. And what happens as a result is the companies communicating, I'm finger quoting, communicating their ideology, and the people are just hearing it as like corporate noise. It's just speak because like they they don't they don't understand their own ideology, their alignment here. Yeah, it's like what? And so Lincioni said, or organizations need to carve out time and space and maybe even resources to help their people get clear on their ideology so that when the company communicates it, they can find alignment, right? Or we'll talk about this in a second, or they might find they're not in alignment. Now, going back to the study originally, in that scenario where the company's defined it and the individual has not, the company feels like their communication is not working, right? They're like, we're not getting this buy-in to our culture, our organizational clarity is low. They wouldn't have that language, but they'd say, you know, we're not getting buy-in. What do we do? And you know what they do? They just talk louder. Yeah, they turn the volume up, they they say we have to communicate more. And then what you what you learn there is that you actually erode your organizational clarity. You actively like downshift it. You inoculate. Yep. You you heard it. And so it's like, hey, company, shut up. Like stop communicating about it. Let your people explore their own individual ideology and be really intentional about coming alongside of them and helping them understand the organization's ideology so that there's alignment. So in this window of you know, 2021, 2020, like you and I are, I'm doing this on my own with you on a personal level. Um, we're we're exploring maybe how to revamp some of the things in the leadership series, and we say, look, this is really the framework that we need to be using inside the leadership series, because that is doing the best service to both the individual who's gonna get clear on their ideology and to the company because that's how you're gonna get higher buy-in to your culture. And of course, like this has been asked, right? As we have this conversation and and it's a real question, but Josh, like what if you walk them through that and they find that they're not in alignment with the company's ideology? And my answer is, you're welcome. Right? Because if that's the case, you don't want that person on your bus. If they if if they discover that, hey, the things that they believe to be true and that they value are not in alignment with your company, it's going to be better for that person, for their team, and for your organization if they self-eject. And that has happened. And that has happened. Yeah, 100% it's happened. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 34:48

Yeah. It's it's wild when you can give somebody an opportunity to find themselves within that larger Y, and they're not competing, and you can articulate that alignment for them, then it unlocks so much energy. Yeah. And when you're kind of guessing or when you're hoping, right, and when you're curious or you have the questions, those questions drain so much energy. Those questions cost so much in terms of energy and and connection.

SPEAKER_03 35:19

Yeah. So where we where we shifted the process to was both, right? So in the leadership series, now we we take the pursuit of greatness, the core ideology conversation in two parts. So in session five, we explore core ideology through the company lens by having typically either a company principal, it depends on the organization and size of the organization. So either a company principal, an owner, a C-suite executive, someone who's been through the program with us comes into the room to talk to the cohort about how the company got clear on their ideology, which is amazing. And in in some organizations, we've been a part of facilitating that for them. Right. So, like Rosenden, Chris Fela, and I got to spend an extra day with their 15 of their most senior leaders to get clear on their why. And then we bring those leaders into the room to tell the other rooms how they got to this, and we carve out time for them to explore that on an individual basis in the leadership series. I'll I need to name it here. We don't give everyone enough time to get clear on that, right? We're talking like we maybe carve out an hour or so.

SPEAKER_00 36:31

Like you start the conversation.

SPEAKER_03 36:33

100%. Yeah. Yeah. So let's speak a little bit to the framework of a why statement. And you take that one. Like what you know, when Simon Sinek talks about finding your why.

SPEAKER_00 36:42

Yeah. So two parts to a why statement. You have the the contribution, right? So we we show up to what's our contribution that we're bringing to the table, to the world, to the interaction, to the task, the project, and then the desired outcome, the the impact. So in a nutshell, it's it's those two pieces: contribution, impact. We try to put the majority of the emphasis on the contribution piece because that's what you have control over. But it's also incomplete that way, right? Because it's that that desired impact that helps you tap even deeper into this is why this contribution matters. This is why it's worth digging deep for this contribution when I don't feel like it, when my environment's not cooperating, when uh my energy is not there, my capacity is not there, it actually creates that capacity. So contribution, desired impact, holding those two things together create that why statement. I love it. So, what's the format look like?

SPEAKER_04 37:38

What is the format for it?

SPEAKER_03 37:40

Format for the same way. Yeah, well, it goes two. Yeah, okay. So, like two with a colon, right? And then that's where your contribution is gonna show up. So to do something that you're showing up in the world. And we're intentionally not saying anything because I think we're like, are we gonna share whys or how is this gonna go, right? Uh so that there is some desired impact on the back end, right?

SPEAKER_04 38:00

So yeah. I have a quick question, just a little more bird's eye view on the why. Um it's a two-part maybe. Yeah, it's uh who and when. So who should be doing a why, or and when shouldn't they be doing a why? Because I mean I can think of kids and I can think of grandparents, I can think of like I know that's a huge, huge, huge band, but like what would you say the who and when? Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 38:26

Can I brag on you a little bit?

SPEAKER_04 38:27

Sure.

SPEAKER_00 38:28

So Josh, because this this process was so impactful for him, one of the things that he's been doing for certain people in his life is basically entrusting me and Sarah and gifting them with the why process with us. And so we got to do it with Ashley. And she's 25.

SPEAKER_03 38:49

Yeah, she's my hopefully soon-to-be sister-in-law. Yeah, I'd like you share with it. And if my brother's listening to this, then he can go ahead and take that as as guilt and motivation to move that forward.

SPEAKER_00 38:59

And I'm pretty sure Ashley's fine with that. Yeah. So so mid-20s. And it was powerful. It was incredibly powerful. She has enough of that life experience, kind of variety of places, uh, spaces she's been in, relationships she's been in, um, to have something to pull from. I think any earlier than that, though, you might need a little bit more soil to dig through to really get there. Not that the process couldn't be impactful. I think that anybody could do some level of a Y process. But I think that it's it's that mid-20s, you're you've been out on your own for a little bit, you've been in a variety of containers, so you can kind of see which ones kind of align with the content of who you are, which ones don't.

SPEAKER_03 39:53

And um, so well, I I mean I have a thought there too, because well, I fully agree. Like that, yeah. I mean, you need to have some runway underneath you to kind of know something to have that conversation. And uh November last year, uh I asked Chris and Sarah if they would facilitate a family Y session for Brianna, myself, and the three girls. And that's so at that point, that's 15, 12, and and 11 for us as far as the kids' ages. And and listen, I I want to name this. Like, yeah, my kids consume me at home. And so they they may be there's some deep wells. Yeah, they have deep wells, they may be, you know, a layer above. I I declared some very clear intent on how I wanted them to engage with this process, right? But I mean, we spent an entire day in the office down in Morrill Bay with Chris and Sarah, and they did amazing work, they participated. Um, I learned so much about how I was showing up and what my family needed from me. You know, Rihanna learned a lot. In fact, honestly, it was that that family why session that was the catalyst to us getting a workspace and an office because I was listening between the lines of so many stories that were coming up in that room, and I'm like, oh, I'm the problem. And a lot of it has to do with that. I'm at home a lot trying to switch hats. Yeah, be in like three different worlds at the same time. Um, and that I'm the problem lands well in my house because the more important. I think every girl their age kind of loves what they want. But um, that was so I don't know, we we walked away from that, and Chris goes, we might have ourselves a new product here, you know, as far as a family why process is concerned and where people might be able to engage with it. I think about your fam, Patrick.

SPEAKER_04 41:49

And I feel like yeah, I've been thinking about that ever since I heard about yours. Like, yeah, I feel like this is something that, yeah, personal, absolutely. But if you're not also surrounded by that environment and there's not that alignment with your spouse or your kids or whoever you're spending the most time with, then I feel like it might like slow you down a little bit, right? Because then you have to re-explain and re-try to get them on that same bus. But if you all do it together, I think that's so powerful.

SPEAKER_03 42:17

Yeah. The I want to name another thing that points back to the to the leadership series because um around the same time, uh up to this point, like up to like the 2020 timeframe in the leadership series, um the origin story didn't exist. And so I know that was an interesting space for me right there. Um the up until 2020, they just did a final presentation on the last day, and part of that final presentation was embed some of your personal story into that.

SPEAKER_01 42:49

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 42:50

And honestly, what happened was when we did the two virtual leadership series, um, Christopher and I like completely lost control of the room and some of their mostly because it was virtual and we weren't there, and some of their final presentations were taking like 30, 40 minutes because they were sharing personally. Pulling up somewhat. Yeah, and we kind of we like ran short on time. I'm like, this isn't working. We have to rethink this, right? And so rethinking that final day, leaving enough time, having all the conversations we were having around why, organizational clarity, this and this. I just kind of had this idea to like, what if we have them tell an origin story throughout the process of the leadership series that actually informs their core ideology? And so we don't say that explicitly on the front end of the leadership series when we're assigning the origin story, but they end up figuring it out by the time they either share, they they tell their story, or we get to session five. I've had a couple people in the room be like, Oh, that's why you have us do that, right? The journey of revisiting their Story, going and finding pictures. I had a guy in a room last week say, I haven't talked to my mom about a lot of these things in my life in like 20 years. He's like, going back and having those conversations was so healing. And then he just looked at me and he's like, I get it. You know, I'm like, oh, okay. So that was really, I don't know that we understood the true value we were going to get out of it when we made that adjustment. And honestly, we made that adjustment in a window where we were, we were going virtual. And so we went back to in person in real life. There was a conversation about like, do we scrap the origin story so that we could go back to we didn't have to do the experiential learning elements when we were virtual. And I was pretty, I was pretty dogmatic. I was like, I was not negotiating on that. Like, I feel really strongly that the origin story has to stay. I'm I'm pretty glad it did. I'm pretty glad you did. I mean, it's almost to a person on the last day that people say origin stories are the most impactful.

SPEAKER_04 45:03

For sure, for sure. Yeah. And I mean, just think about the value that it provides to them, but also to their team to get to know. Yes. Like we've been in a room where it's like, I didn't know that you've done that for years, or that we connect in that way. That like it just starts like a whole new layer of just I don't know, openness and just like that togetherness with each other, even though they've been working together for years and years and hundreds of percent.

SPEAKER_03 45:28

So I mean, what I hear you saying is that it ignites connection, right? So if we come back to our core, we want to talk about why, right? Like, so last year, the Lighthouse team, as part of our retreat, we got everyone together in Avala Beach and Chris Fela helped facilitate for us for I mean, we probably spent four or five hours on that alone, and it was super cool. We got to talk about the history of Lighthouse, where it's been. I mean, Mel and Missy are there, and they've been a part of this from kind of the very beginning. So we got that, you know, history and foundation that brought us to here, but then newer team members, like you know, Patrick U and Laura. Yeah, Patrick literally was. Um, and and we got to wrestle with that language and say, hey, as a as a team, as a new team in a business that's been around for a long time, like what do we want our core ideology to be moving forward? And again, same structure to do something, so that what? So, what we got to is that our core con our core contribution is to shine light. And we know internally at Lighthouse, that means something to to us, to who we are. Those words carry some weight because of all the storytelling we did. Other people might hear it and go, cool branding, right? Yeah, to shine light. But it means something to us to shine light that ignites connection, inspires hope, and transforms generations. And you're 100% right, Patrick. Like in the room, people's willingness to tell their story ignites that connection. We say in the room, like, vulnerability is what fuels connection, that willingness to be seen, to to show my. I love, you know, he's an alliteration guy. He gave us three S's before it was like scarring, oh shaping and sacred. See, he had them right there. Like, I'm willing to share all those people see me, and now we are more connected. And I've I've had exactly how you just described it in the room. Like, I had no idea. I mean, I had one really powerful room where a guy shared some intense trauma that he had as a child, and another guy said, I thought I was the only one. Like I've spent, and this is a guy like in his 50s. He's like, I've spent my whole life thinking I was the only person keeping that kind of secret. And the power, I mean, I can't you can't manufacture that stuff, right? Like, I've got a story for you.

SPEAKER_00 47:53

Let's hear it. Yeah. My first leadership series, uh, I had done a you and I had done leadership retreat with about half of who was gonna be in the room. Good relationship there. I had asked for some volunteers to go on day two, which typically doesn't happen, but this is a larger group than normal. Apparently, one of the guys that I had asked to go on day two hadn't paid attention to who else was gonna be in the room. Uh-huh. So he had teed up. He had he had accepted our kind of invitation and and challenge to share pretty vulnerably. And he comes up to me, we're about to start at 7 a.m. He comes up to me at 6.57. He's like, hey, you got a minute? I'm like, uh barely. He goes, I didn't realize that some of my direct reports were going to be in this room. He's like, I'm rethinking how much I share right now. And I was like, okay, well, uh, here's here's what I would offer you. Just go 3% deeper into vulnerability than you feel comfortable and give them an opportunity to be worthy of the trust you show in sharing that.

unknown 48:57

He's like, oh damn.

SPEAKER_00 49:00

So the next day shares a story, pulls back the layers of being bullied as a kid, challenges with his dad, and deep dive, he's in tears, you know. And he had told me a couple of the people he was specifically worried about sharing this in front of. One of them got up and left the room right after the guy's story. And I'm like, as a facilitator, I'm like, oh damn, what's going on here? So the what I do every time we share the origin stories is is I give the rest of the participants a chance. I say, hey, what are you curious about? What do you want to double click on here in their story? And what do you want to celebrate about this person? And the guy that got up and left the room still hadn't come back yet. So the guy that had shared his story sits down. Then the second guy shares his origin story, and then I ask, same thing, what do you want to celebrate? What are you curious about? The guy that had got up and left the room speaks up, he asks for for the floor, but he points back to guy number one, who was his boss, and he goes, When you were sharing your story, I left the room because I needed to compose myself. I had been telling a story our whole relationship that you and I had nothing in common, and that you would never understand me. And now, after what you shared, I realized that we have so much more in common than we ever had. And I'm so sorry for the way I judged you. And I'm so grateful for what you shared. Wow. The whole room was just burst open. And I was like, I love my job. This is this is my why. And this is why we do this. And yeah, that that room, that that relationship never been the same. Wow.

SPEAKER_03 50:57

No, it's amazing. And I think like you know, what you were talking about, like that openness, that togetherness, that vulnerability, you know, like some definitions we use in the room. You know, Brene Brown says connections, the energy that exists between people when they feel seen, heard, and valued. And I I I do love that definition. I love me some Brene Brown. Um, I'm also in a lot of rooms, and I feel like sometimes the the terms feeling seen, heard, and valued have been kind of overplayed. They almost have a little eye rolly. Totally. They're almost like safe space. Almost make you want to crush your arm. This guy. Just saying. This guy. Um Jefferson Fisher, who a lot of people know I've been kind of hot on recently. Uh, trial attorney, wrote a great book. I mentioned this last time. Here it is again. Uh, he wrote, I did check. It's the next conversation by Jefferson Fisher. And when he talks about connection, he says it's you need two things. You need acknowledgement and understanding. Right. So your guy that you're talking about could have like walked out of the room and he could have come back and been like, oh, I mean, it just it was cool. Like, I realized that we had something in common. That would have just been acknowledgement. But what I'm hearing is he communicated the acknowledgement and his deep level of understanding around what had happened, and that creates connection. But you have to have both. I can also understand you internally, but not acknowledge it, and then we're not going to get it. Right. So back to what you were saying is I just see that exercise as a way of completely igniting connection in the room. Um, like you, I get some people who are really locked up about it. I mean, I've gotten phone calls. You want me to do what? Yeah. Say what, share what? Yep. I've legit gotten phone calls. Like, I can't do this. And I said, well, here's the thing. You totally can. It's your story. You can tell it however you want. You I'm asking you for vulnerability. It's all a challenge by choice. You can give us the most vanilla version you want. Like you, I encourage them by saying, and look, here's I just did this last week. Most organizations, most teams, most relationships are gonna say they want trust. Okay. That's like super common. I want, we want to be a trusted partner in the marketplace. We want to have high trust within our organization. Like in my relationship, I want high trust, you know, on our team. I'm here for it. Love it. Trust is super important. And connection is the wire that trust travels on. So we're never gonna get trust if we're not relationally connected, right? Uh, connection is the wire that healthy accountability travels on. Connection is the wire that lets us get to a high performing high, it's connection is the foundation of all of that. So I'm just gonna follow the formula. If you want trust, you have to have connection. What did I just say? Fuels connection? Vulnerability. So if you you're not gonna get connection without a willingness to lean into vulnerability, get a little bit uncomfortable. And when I run people back through that, again, I'm not here to judge you. I don't know what I don't know what your story is. So whatever you tell me is gonna be the the gift to me. Yeah, and it's not for me. It's for it's for the room, it's for the people around you. Yeah, and the people that lean in, they never regret it.

SPEAKER_00 54:19

Well, let me layer something on here. So we know what the word vulnerability originally means, right? Why we're so good when you do this. Come on. So vulnerability, and go back to the Robert Bly quote. Where a person's wound is, that's where their genius will be. So vulnerability literally comes from a Latin word vulnus, which means wound or to wound. Wow. So vulnerability literally means the ability to be wounded. And when you layer that back, right? Where a person's wound is, that's where their genius will be. Like we're vulnerability is literally an opportunity to pull back the curtain into what originally, right, maybe shaped us and has now become a gift to the world, to that that healing that can come back through.

SPEAKER_03 55:01

That's so cool. I've been talking a lot about uh Kinsugi. Have you heard about that? It's the well, you're gonna quote me. I think it's K-I-N-T-S-U-G-I Kinsugi. It's like a Japanese um pottery art form. And so, like, like here, if pottery or ceramics, if they break, like we're throwing it away. And in Japan, they have that this Kinsugi approach, which is when something breaks, they put it back together, but they use gold in the cracks, and they make this like beautiful piece of art, and and they there's a whole write-up on it. Um, and it says that they are intentionally highlighting those cracks and the fractures, the vulnerable pieces, and and they're celebrating that. And then so I've been using that a lot in the rooms talking about origin story of like we inherently think we want to hide those spots and we're embarrassed of them. There's shame there, there's guilt there, like let's tuck them away. Instead of saying, like, these are the things that honestly, these are kind of the things that make us beautiful. Um, and and this is a very long setup and connection like I'm I'm gonna share my why because I'm thinking about that story you just told about the guy in the room, the guy, and I just literally heard my why coming to life in that room you were in, right? And so going through what, like six hours of storytelling with you and your wife, and um, you know, my my childhood's intense and and colorful. And I I make the joke that my parents got divorced before it was cool, right? Like you know, like I was I was five, and I was actually I was in a private school, like he were on the campus of the school I went to, uh North County Christian School, kindergarten, you know, first grade. And I remember asking for like two papers to take home and having the whole room look at me like, what is wrong with that? You know, like I just need two papers, right? And so a ton of fragmentation in my life, like in younger years, adolescence, just I remember you know, well, I didn't realize I got told after that I kept doing this on the front part of my storytelling. And then as I got to like the second half of my life and and talking about things that really meant a lot to me, I was doing this with my hands, which if you're watching just audio, I'm bringing my hands together, right? And so after Chris and Sarah sent me on a walk and they brought me back in to kind of start playing with some language around what my core purpose statement might be. Uh, and there was a lot of iterations, and Chris loved to play with people and make them uncomfortable. And so, you know, we get to close our eyes and Chris reads the statements and we see how we feel about it, get us out of our head. And um, you know, it was mostly like it was to show up courageously and bring people together so that we can find freedom from our brokenness.

SPEAKER_00 57:53

And was that how how far we got, or do we have the change the world?

SPEAKER_03 57:57

No, no, it was just freedom from our brokenness. And it was like, huh. I'm like, yeah, there's there's something there for sure, you know. And um, but uh I and I have the gift of hindsight now, and and I could tell like I my answer wasn't really sufficient for for Chris, right? I there wasn't that we we hadn't gotten to the to the finish line yet, even though he said the goal for the day was like a C. Um and so I was like, huh, something something's not landing with him. And um he's like, Oh, I think I got an idea. Like uh close your eyes again. And and then he reads me to show up courageously and bring people together so that we can find freedom in our brokenness. And I went, like something felt incredibly different. And and then Sarah said, Hold on, I have an idea. And she's like, I don't I had spent more time with Chris. I hadn't spent as much time with Sarah quite yet. This was actually, I think, one of my first or second time spending time with her, and she she said, she's like, I don't know Josh super well, but I feel like he needs a mic drop on the end of this thing. And I'm and my eyes are still closed, and I'm like, talk to me.

unknown 59:07

Right.

SPEAKER_03 59:08

And so they scribble on the whiteboard, blah blah blah, and uh um Chris rereads, you know, to show up courageously and bring people together so we can find freedom in our brokenness and change the world. And I wept like un involuntarily, like tears just streaming down my face. Uh, and it was like, oh, there I am. Like that's that's who I am. And and I can say those words to some people, and some people go, I know that. That's you, 100%. And other people go, huh. And and any response is okay because it's not theirs, it's it's mine, right? And show up courageously, like sometimes that means walking into a room of 16 strangers I've never met, and they're at a an organization that's doing $10 billion a year, and I feel small. And that that's the courage that I need. But more often, like showing up courageously is walking down the hall and telling my daughter that I didn't handle that situation very well. Or it's being the first person to say I love you to my dad, who his dad didn't say it very much to him. Hi, dad. Uh, right. Like it it's it's going first. It's being vulnerable. Yeah, it's being vulnerable, it's leading, right? Like bringing people together. Sometimes it's uh sitting them around a table to record a podcast. Other times it's, you know, you know, like I've I'm gonna play pickleball for these two hours. If anyone wants to come, that'd be awesome, right? Um, but you heard that distinction between freedom from and freedom in. And that that's the big game changer for me, right? Is that I I don't think as a human I get free from my brokenness. I can only find freedom in that brokenness. And in the rooms, that's what I see people experiencing. When they say, Oh, you too? I thought I was the only one. Oh my gosh, I have been telling a story that is totally wrong about you, and I'm sorry. That to me is us all finding freedom in that brokenness. And and we, you know, sometimes that's a word that gives people a lot of pause. They raise their eyebrows and I say, Well, and I stole this from Chris Free, right? I said I work with human beings and I have yet to meet one who's not broken in some way, shape, or form, right? And I think we're all just trying to put those pieces back together.

SPEAKER_04 1:01:35

I love what you said about um finding your why helped you like like the phrase that you said, you said, that's who I am. But like inadvertently, you found who you are by finding your why do you do the things that you do? Which to me is beautiful because I don't think I ever went to that meeting with you too trying to figure out who I was, but I needed that more than anything else. So I love it. And I I share that with you 100%.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:06

Um, yeah, I just felt it.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:09

I was like, oh I wanna I love what you shared there. We're going back real quick to the right, we got the lighthouse, what'd you call it? Kitsuki. What's the Kinsugi. Kitsugi. Um there's another, there's a similar idea, um broken pottery, right? And it's the whole idea. I think the typical phrasing of it is um where the cracks are, that's where the light enters. But there's also the flip side of that, right? Where the cracks are, that's also where the light transmits or exits. And just the the light beaming through, right? The cracks, that perfection, that light's not coming in or out, but but through those fractures and fissures. And um that's powerful. I mean, you're actually all the all the emotion that comes back up as you take me back to that room. We're gonna have uh Patrick zoom in on this angle to capture that for you. And with what you said, right about so it's a really interesting Simons. So there's some there's some research going back to connection and the why, there's some research done around what is the most fulfilling facet of our work, of our lives, and that it's it's very much not the what we do. We know that it's not even the how we do it. Some people would say that it's not even the why necessarily, it's the with whom. And I found it very interesting that that there's no who in the golden circle. But then I realized that the whole process is a relational process. And so two pieces to this. One is I love how you said, like, I found out who I am through finding that language for my why. And you didn't even know that was a question you're asking, right? So it's like the the who is the page that the golden circle is written on.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:54

Well, he's also talked about making a fourth ring and just putting who at the center and then why and then how.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:00

I needed to have a conversation with Simon. I'll talk to them after, yeah. Um, but but I love the way you articulated that. The other piece of it though is for those of us that might not have the opportunity in the next month or a year or whenever to sit in a room with somebody that knows how to facilitate the actual why process as you do this self-exploration, the quickest path to your why is through who. Who do you show up for? Who summons the best of you? Who do you most not want to let down? Who would you step in front of a train for? And it's not there explicit in the golden circle, but it's it's literally it's the fabric, it's the texture that the whole thing is held together by is that who piece and that and that connection piece. I I just think that's really worth reiterating, right? That's what we're facilitating in those rooms. And yeah, we we need to figure out kind of where it it fits in the ecosystem, but it is, it's the glue that that holds it all together.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:59

I love it. So I mean, shortly, shortly thereafter of you giving me, well, we we got there together, the gift of the gift of my why, right? That's the spark that Patrick saw. And I keep saying spark because Chris Fela. Go ahead.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:15

That's literally what my last name means. But yeah, we can say more about that. There's some more plays, but there's more spark in your world.

SPEAKER_03 1:05:22

Um, so that was what you saw, Patrick. And I think you you were either the first or second person where I said, Okay, well, let's do this. And so tapped Chris's shoulder and said, Let's do one together. And then it's a bit of a snowball. Uh, I yeah, we you and I started kind of co-facilitating tag teaming the why process uh for a handful of individuals, then started kind of making that an offering within Side Lighthouse, where we started doing it for a couple of teams, and uh, we've gotten to do it for some organizations now. Uh, but yeah, Patrick, I mean you came and and Sat on the couch with us. It was actually one of two that we did at your parents' house. Um I I remember the couch you were sitting on. Um what do you want to share about your why?

SPEAKER_04 1:06:09

Oh man, there is so much to impact there. But um I mean the thing that I would share is that again, it it just felt like like I mentioned, like when you and I had that that meeting and we had Thai food, I felt like I was so thirsty for something. And I just didn't know where to get water from. And that day felt just like a well. I mean, not only like it like opened up, you know, that like those wounds, and I was just I had never met you. First conversation, first conversation, and I'm like, hey, here's me, here's my whole life. Yeah. Which was just crazy. But um, just you know, knowing Josh for so many years and just knowing who he is, like I've always said, I'm like, if he says jump, I'll just tell me how high, and I will. And so that was kind of that moment with Chris where I was like, Yeah, like you think this guy is worthy of just that time and that vulnerability, I'm in. Um, and so I think that that that's something I would say if you're thinking about doing your why is that you just gotta just go full in, like just jump in, like dive deep, don't don't hold back, just do yourself a favor and just be you and just be as vulnerable as you can, because that's the only way you're gonna get anything out of it. Um my why is to see and seek God in everything and everyone so that our hearts can be together.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:33

That's that's what I mean. You know what the the coolest part for me is uh getting pretty close to a front row seat to to watching you do that every day and like everywhere you go.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:45

Yeah, yeah, that's awesome. Thank you. And that yeah, and that like you said earlier too, about like with your kids and with everybody that anybody that I run into, I'm just it's the I don't know. To me, it's like putting that different lens on not seeing people as people, like uh me being in person seeing just another person, is trying to see them the way that God would see them, the way that God sees me, and that just changes everything for me. Like, I don't care who it is on the street, I will lend them a hand. I don't care if they've wronged me before.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:15

It happened two weeks ago, dude. He was here like cleaning up some stuff, and I thought I was supposed to help him carry this thing downstairs. And I'm like, Where is Patrick? Like, I could not find him. And so I'm like, okay, I'm just gonna go back to my desk and keep working. He comes back like 15 minutes later, he goes, Hey bro, sorry about that. Um, I had to give a lady a ride home. And I'm like, What? And he goes, and he said, Yeah, this this uh this older lady was walking down the sidewalk out front. He's like, I could tell she spoke Spanish, you know. And so I just asked her what she was doing and how her day was going, and and I'm just like, Do you need a ride? And she he said she lit up, was like, Oh my gosh, thank you. So I'm like, I of course that's what you were doing, Patrick. Like, of course you were giving that lady a ride.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:58

It just was so good.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:01

Zero surprise. Yeah, zero tremendous joy. Thank you. It's just we're all in this together, and you know, if we we don't remove those layers, those walls that we have, then we're just not seeing each other the way that we're supposed to be looking at each other, I think. So all right, you're up over there. We haven't heard yours yet.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:19

My wife? Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:21

Have to share it? Yeah. Well, I mean mine is myself real quick. Um is to create a healing space where people are seen, known, and summoned so that together we can experience the freedom and joy of living loved. When I had that language, I was like, Oh, that's good.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:58

Well, that was that part of the reason I used summoned in that room, because again, I didn't I didn't have his why language in that moment, but that whole like stay in the room, like I was just you know, feeling so like we've had a lot of conversations in the last five years, right? That that playback was like, oh my gosh, that was your why, like being lived out in that room, right? Uh and then yeah, and then quickly after teaming up to facilitate these things has has been wild. I'm thinking of Chris Wild, get it? W H Y L D. He can't stop Wild. Uh well done. I'm thinking of Chris Farkas. Um and and yeah, my girl's joke because I have too many Chris Fs in my line. So many Chris F's. Chris Fayel, Chris Free, Chris Farkas. Um, and he was he was an early Y rep for us. And I I always remember one of the things he texted us a couple weeks after is he said, it's it's so strange because it's new, but it feels like an old college sweatshirt. And I just remember being like, that is a great line. Like that that means we nailed it. Um for it to have a level of familiarity, even though it's it's new language that has never been used before, right? Um, that was that was super fun.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:18

Yeah. Well, it's like my favorite times are when you know you have people close their eyes and and you read it to them, and and there's this simultaneous, almost paradoxical response, which is it's usually tears or or just visceral, right? Like a like Ashley the day. Just this huge smile and then tears, and just her whole body just settled. And then, but at the same time, there's kind of like this duh. Right. And that's it just spans that whole gamut, you know what I mean? Of like the depth and the obvious. And and that's that's when you know there that you're like that you're getting you're getting somewhere.

SPEAKER_03 1:11:56

I love it. So so in the leadership series right now, we we do spend a decent amount of time setting this up. I I already kind of said we don't necessarily give an appropriate time container for people to get super clear on this. And sometimes that that comes up, right? They're like, well, what do I do? Like I, you know, you got me down the you got me down the track, but this feels like me a red pillbo, yeah, like walk me through what to do with it. Exactly. Um and so yeah, I mean, I think I would say like I think you brought up a good point, Patrick. Like, what if someone's thinking about this sounds awesome? Like, how do I how do I get my why? Um we do facilitate that process for individuals. Uh I'm gonna go ahead and say couples, families, teams, organizations, you name it, right? So um you could hit us up and ask us uh, you know, what that might look like to walk through finding your why in a facilitated container, have someone kind of you know steward you along the process. In the leadership series, we also point people to a couple other resources. Um there's a there's actually a podcast where Simon Sinek is on Nike Trained. And I love it because it's only like 30 minutes. Um we could probably link it in in our podcast, but it's it's a quick little like he just tells you a bunch of questions that you could ask people around you to help kind of start re you know, informing your why.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:19

Yeah, a vulnerable, a great vulnerable one is when I leave the room, what's missing?

SPEAKER_03 1:13:24

Oh that is I will say the questions we put up in the room, that one gets the most like, tell me more about that. And it's like, dude, when you're in a room and you've you've brought your best and you're you're crushing it and you walk out, what just left what would they all say is needed? And that one is pretty money.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:42

That's a tough one to ask. But the quick thing about this is one of my coaches used to always say, you can't read the ingredients from inside the bottle. Like it's even though our why feels done, even though, like Chris Fargus said, you know, it feels like an old college sweatshirt, once you see it, you can't unsee it. And it's always been there, but it's not something you can excavate down to for yourself. 100% true. It needs to be reflected back to you from somebody that can see the threads and and find the treasures and and follow those those trails. But it's it's not some people try to dive in and want to figure it out on their own, and then they get frustrated because they can't. That was me. Right. And it's like, no, this is something that this this comes through community. It's found in in the process of belonging and being known. And that's just something worth worth remembering if you're interested. Um, quick little sidebar. This is so important to me though. I remember asking, I was having a conversation with my middle son, and he was probably seven or eight at the time, and and I was like, Yeah, we're gonna help these people find their why. And he's like, Well, Dad, of course you're gonna do that. He's like, because your whys to help people find their why. Why little dude's paying attention? Little dude is paying attention. Well, big dude now, but very big. That I I will never forget that. That meant the world to me. And I was like, Wow, what a great why! Like it's it's my so in in Clifton Strength's language, belief is my number one, and belief really is that why strength of like it doesn't matter what you're doing, it doesn't matter how much you get paid for it. It's like, why? What's the connection? Who is this for and why does this matter? And so go going back to the beginning of the conversation when I found that process, and every time I'm in a room and I have the the honor and opportunity to sit and hear someone's stories and help them reflect back like what their magic is and what they're unique, how they're wired, W-H-Y-R-E-D, uh, how they're wired, I can't wait.

SPEAKER_03 1:15:40

Um we actually already talked about your your language last time. Yes, because Patrick was like, Hey, I want to use he's like, Can I use Chris Faylor's term and say I want to double click on this? I'm like, oh boy, here we go.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:53

Um, but it's there's nothing like it. Nothing like it. I can't believe that the yeah, the three of us that I've got to be a part of both of yours is just wild. My heart is full.

SPEAKER_04 1:16:05

Yes. Same. And it makes so much sense. I mean, you guys married me and my wife, which it's a huge testament of just you need to explain the whoa. We it's a four-way mixture.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:18

I married Brianna.

SPEAKER_04 1:16:19

That's right. That's right. Same one, same one. Um, I mean, yeah, that that day was so uh, and I was just looking at the dates right now, like when that happened, um when finding my why uh with you two guys, it was February 28th of 2022. Um and the more that that day keeps on coming up in my life. I don't know if it's just you know when that that whole thing of like, you know, you s you buy a car and then now you see it everywhere in the road and all that stuff. But um February 28th, if we go back a little bit, 2008, I was in a gnarly car accident where I rolled my car on the freeway, almost died, miraculously walked out of the hospital two hours later with just a stitched um piece of my ear that fell off. That's the story for another day. But um, a year later, exactly to the day, February 28th, 2009, I'm in the same hospital and my twins are being born. Get to see some of the nurses, share stories and all that stuff. And then fast forward, you know, 13 years later, February 28th, 2022, that's when I get to find my line. I'm like, just all these full circles for that day.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:29

And so I don't know that.

SPEAKER_04 1:17:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:31

I got another one for you.

SPEAKER_04 1:17:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:33

February 28th, 2026 was my little brother's memorial service. Wow. And so February 28th, four years before was the day that I gained a brother. Wow. I um quick sidebar about Patrick. So uh when I was 18 was the first time that I really had the opportunity to travel uh really outside of the country and savor it. And the first place I went was Chile. Went to Chile in Argentina, and I when I landed in Chile and when I spent a few weeks there, I was like, God, I was born in the wrong place. You you you missed. I was born in the wrong place. And and the moment I met Patrick, it was like it was there were no questions. There were no it was just this this is a brother. And then find out what a few months later, yeah, you're half Chilean, and I was like, of course he is. Um but the yeah, to to have been able to be a part of that process with you and for you to just dive so deep in the and the the way you land that line, right? Remember that that our hearts beat together. It's like that's what happens with like a really good oxytocin releasing hug, right? Is when you hold that hug long enough, your your biorhythms sync up and your heartbeats align, and and there's just something about that um that just there's something, and it was like it was instantaneous with you. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:19:12

My sister's been trying to sell me that it requires 15 seconds to get to that. I'm like, this is a long hug.

SPEAKER_00 1:19:19

I change I change the number based on who the hug is for. I uh a friend of mine actually is one of the foremost oxytocin researchers. Okay, he's like, there's not really numbers like any hug releases oxytocin. Okay.

SPEAKER_04 1:19:30

Um let those uh Disney characters know that one because do you have the rule that they have? The Disney characters, yeah. What's the rule? Um that whenever they hug a kid, they're not to let go until the kid lets go. So they'll wait there for as long as that kid is hugging them. And I've sort of magical. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:19:54

That's good. Disney does a lot of things, right? Yeah. We need more hugs in the world, and we need more like savored or savored hugs. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:20:02

Um, I wanna this will feel super random, but I do want to go back just to to the very beginning when we were setting up core ideology. I, you know, I mentioned core purpose, and we just spent a really good amount of time talking about why statements and that, you know, filling that core purpose ring. And then we said, hey, it marries to core values. And I kind of cheekily was like, hey, like I can tell you everyone's core value, like teamwork. And I think we should just hit on that for just a second as the second piece of core ideology and and why I kind of like messed with that a little bit, right? So okay, I think it would be worth going back a little bit, like in the beginning when we were setting up the core ideology thing, we kind of mentioned the the core values and kind of like dumped on them. Teamwork integrity, safety, blah, blah, blah. Um, but we we spent a good amount of time talking about core purpose or why statement, which from our perspective, kind of interchangeable. Why statement, core purpose. The second piece that makes up the core ideology is core values. And I just want to say a little bit as to why I was like, oh, teamwork, safety, integrity, blah, blah, blah. Oftentimes what we find, I shouldn't say oftentimes, but sometimes what we find is that core values are really like buzzwords in an organization. And uh, Brene Brown has done a ton of work around this to really make a strong business case for operationalizing your core values into observable behaviors. And she says if you don't operationalize your core values into observable behaviors, they might as well be cat posters on your wall. And right. So I feel like there are a lot of cat posters in organizations that say the same thing. Teamwork, integrity, collaboration, communication, safety, trust, safety, trust. Right. And what we invite organizations to do is to say, what does this mean to you? And uh some of the core questions we use is if this is a value, what do you expect to see people doing and hear people saying? Which is literally the definition of behavior.

unknown 1:22:10

Right.

SPEAKER_03 1:22:10

Behavior is what do I see you doing? What do I hear you saying? So organizationally, when they take that challenge to say, these are the things we actually expect our people to do and say as a result of this core value, the next layer is are you willing to measure against that when it comes to performance management, when it comes to hiring, firing, all of those things. If yes, then you will have people in your organization who believe those are actually the things that you value. If you don't, and we do see this quite a bit, is you will have something, let's just take like collaboration as a core value, but we haven't defined what we want that to look like in behavior. What do we continue to reward? Individual output, profit, right, the the wins, and and sometimes you will have reward systems inside your organization that are actually in opposition to what you said you value. And that, if you go back to Lencioni's world, if you're looking for a cultural buy-in, you're you're completely hamstringing it, right? You're eroding it because you're not actually behaving in ways that you say you want to behave. So again, from our perspective, that's really the definition of integrity. Integrity is doing what you say you're going to do, or having your behavior be in alignment with your values. That gives people some pause sometimes. They're like, wait a minute, that's the definition of integrity? Well, that's a definition for integrity, right? If you use that definition, you could have a really fun conversation about like, well, did Hitler have high integrity? Hitler behaved in in in alignment, in consistency with what he said he was going to do.

SPEAKER_01 1:23:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:23:54

You could argue that's high integrity. Horrible person. Right? But so again, that that's not really the sidebar.

SPEAKER_01 1:24:03

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:24:03

Side quest, yeah. Whole other Hitler episode later. No, nobody wants to do that. Um, so there's an opportunity, I think, for a lot of organizations to say, have we identified our core purpose? What is our fundamental reason for being an organization? What is our core contribution to the world? What impact do we want out of that? And we put the core values in the how ring. So, how you go about living that core purpose is by operationalizing your core values, giving them teeth, giving them teeth. Yes, into clear behaviors and then measuring against that. It's actually the same individually, also. So, you know, my core purpose, and then I have core values, and then I have to ask myself that question. If this is something that I value, how does that come to life? Where do what do people see me doing and hear me saying that makes that a real value? You know, one of my core values is curiosity. Okay. If curiosity is a value, how does that show up in behavior? Well, people should see me leading with questions, having a posture of openness, of curiosity, of you know, not spewing judgment of those kinds of things. Like, obviously, I've done this exercise. So those are those are some of the behaviors that people should. Does that mean I'm 10 out of 10 100% of the time that's how I show up? Absolutely not. Right. There's times where it's like I need that as a reminder of like, remember, Josh, you value curiosity. And so, yeah, this person said this thing, and you have you're having a reaction to that. How do you get back in alignment with your value? All right. What comes up for you guys?

SPEAKER_00 1:25:37

Well, one thing on that, real quick, is I love how even those values can can bring us back to themselves, right? You can get curious about why you're not getting curious. Totally. And then find your way back, right? But um, there is something really I love in in Simon's world, going back to the book you'd mentioned, you know, we got to start with why, everybody knows it. Embarrassing uh confession. I've never read it. Really? Never read it. Wow. Um, but find your why, but they they talk about how the hows they need to be verbs, right? It needs to be something that people can see. You're doing this, you're not doing this. And so one thing I've done with it though, that I found really helpful is I married basically my my top five Clifton strengths with my my core values and my hows, because each of our top five strengths have things that they value. So they all map onto each other. And what you'll what you'll have is some people's whys can sound very similar. Even some organizations' whys can can sound pretty similar. It's when you get out to that how ring and those core values that it starts to fill out the fingerprint a little bit more, and the uniqueness starts to the texture, the nuance starts to to layer in. So what I did, yeah. So for me, you know, one is playfulness. Like if I have a little post-it note on one of my monitors that says, Am I having fun right now? And if I'm not, I'm getting away, I'm veering from right a core value. One is resourcefulness. Um, there's always another way. There's always, you know, more interesting, more exciting, more exciting way. So those are some things that come up for me is like I try to anchor back to those values because I find that if I start drifting from them, my energy starts to dip, uh, my perspective starts to shift, and I'm just I'm I'm drifting from from my deepest self. Makes total sense. So it's signposts back, right? To to the me I want to be in the world.

SPEAKER_03 1:27:27

I love that. I yeah, I mean the so I said curiosity, core value, right? I've got uh input and ideation in my top five. So that as a core value integrates super well with with those two strengths who they have they have a tendency to to block some.

SPEAKER_00 1:27:43

I'm not saying anything.

SPEAKER_03 1:27:45

When we talk strengths language, uh one of there's so many things I love about Chris Fela sitting across from me, but one of the things that I really love is his language. You know, he like how many languages do you speak? Three. Three three languages. But you're c is it fair to call you.

SPEAKER_00 1:28:02

I I speak for, I speak phela.

SPEAKER_03 1:28:04

There it is, right? Language nerd. I'm not even gonna care if he says yes or no. And so yeah, I think just your your ability to say those things in ways that that really lands and pulling that out is is always super fun.

SPEAKER_01 1:28:18

Thank you. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:28:20

I love this. Um I love just using even the word core values because we are again diving deep, you know, looking inside, introspecting. Um and I love the practicality that you're bringing to uh and having those reminders for ourselves, you know, and doing the exercise of figuring out what you care about, what you know, like a aligning yourself with those values and with those strengths. But having those constant reminders, because it's so easy to then just kind of like put them in the back burner, maybe in some ways of like, okay, all right, I got I gotta figure out, and so I know who I am, and it's easy to just walk around the world just being like, I know what this is, but oftentimes the world ends up kind of consuming all of that and pushing those things away. And so having those reminders, I I like that I'm gonna steal that from you and just put it around everywhere, you know. Like the things that like am I having fun? That's such a good one. Like, you know, is this helping somebody else, or is this how I want to show up to others? Or, you know, even like the if if I was to be removed from this room, like what's left was happening in that room. Like I so love this.

SPEAKER_03 1:29:24

So the what I was gonna offer was your language around the the Clifton strengths. And so, you know, uh a lot of people in our lighthouse ecosystem have taken that assessment. They kind of know their a lot of them tend to know their top five and then kind of fall off after that as far as what they know or remember, right? But that's a lot to work with right there. It is, yeah. And there's there's 34 of them, so it's it's a vast language. But will you speak just a little bit to how you talk about the the starting five versus you know, like how people will cut sometimes say that they are their strengths, right? Right, right. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:29:58

Well, so it's yeah, when when you start to get that language, it's it's exciting, right? To find out, like, because we're we're all pretty good at the what I suck at conversation, right? Like if you if you ask me what I'm bad at, what I'm weak at, oh yeah, I could I could talk for a long time. And before strengths entered my world or I entered the strengths world, it's just it's difficult to articulate what we bring. It's difficult culturally, right? Because you don't want to teach your own horn. And it's also difficult because it's so natural, it's so innate. It's like we just think, well, doesn't everybody, right? So um, so to be able to have language for the strengths that we bring to the world is is really powerful. One of the ways though, one of the what people don't get though is that our greatest strengths are also our greatest weaknesses, right? So any strength overplayed, overdialed, overcooked becomes a weakness. So I I use this language, I won't give all the backstory now, but it came out of a session with a couple actually using strengths to help this couple connect more deeply. And the guy made a comment, he said, Well, because I'm positivity, one of the strengths, and and you could tell, right? It's all just it's all gonna go go sideways from there. And nothing good's happening, nothing good's happening because his his strength, he basically the problem was his strength was owning him, not the other way around. His strength had him, he didn't have his strength. So he was a basketball player. I was like, hey man, think about it this way. You are not positivity in the same way that a coach is not a player. And as soon as you think that you are that player, you're gonna hold on to the ball and you're gonna you're gonna hog the ball because you know everything, right? And you're the one you you think you've got what's best. A coach's job, right, is to deploy right the plays, the the strategy, and to to build the skills and to develop the players so they can do what they need to do. So like you, so I I offered that he strength think about his strengths like his top five, his his starting five on the basketball court. And it's his job to have some objectivity, some distance from them. And and so what's cool is within that you can kind of deep dive. You got your starting five there, and then you have kind of your team captains. Each of us have a couple strengths that that shine head and shoulders, you know, they're the ones that are like 6'10 and and ripped, right? And have the 44-inch vertical, and then some a little shorter, a little bit maybe less athletic. So we have our we have our team captains, but then we also have those strengths that ball hog. Those ones that, you know, uh that strength when it's overplayed, when when the wrong strength has the ball at the wrong time, um you know, the the 510 point guard should not be going in trying to dunk over uh the six ten center. That's ball hogging. So so that's where I love it.

SPEAKER_03 1:32:29

Feel free to and no, that you did it beautifully. And every time I, you know, I I work to give you credit on framing that up for people, and they just there's an unlocking. They're like, right? Or just saying, like, hey, in this particular situation, that strength might not be serving you. Like, who do you what other strength can you pass the ball to? And just that idea is like it's it's pretty big.

SPEAKER_00 1:32:50

There's some self-awareness there, some self-leadership, right? It's really self-leadership and action. I think it's so important to to layer that back onto core values because that's really where you know, our core contributions and our core values, they go hand in hand. They reinforce each other. So, so being able to, I think the more ways we can articulate it, the better off we are and the more access we have to it, the more available it is for us.

SPEAKER_03 1:33:13

For sure.

SPEAKER_00 1:33:13

That's why I think that's so important.

SPEAKER_03 1:33:14

And I use I'll use the it can be your superpower and your kryptonite. And you know, it's like or other people's kryptonite. Right.

SPEAKER_02 1:33:22

Right. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:33:23

Yeah. Um, okay. I wanna you the way the way you said that we're all really good at the WeSuck conversation. Oh my gosh, this comes up all the time. Right. And I just kicked off two leadership series simultaneously last week. So I did sessions one and two, and then the next day, one and two again. Uh, and in the second session, we ask participants, we're just starting to talk about leadership and give them a little list and say, hey, what's I want you to pick something on this list that you are really good at? What's something that you do well? And you can see them look up at me like, what? Can I answer this? Right. And I'm like, no, listen, trust me, I know some of you are are ready right now to tell me which one's your growth opportunity, which one's the gap, right? And and I have a pretty good sense that that's how your brain works out in the real world too. And so when when something's done, what's the first thing you look for? What went wrong? What's not good enough? How can we get better next time? And we have to strengthen this celebration muscle team. Like we have to reinforce this idea of things are going well. And sure, there might be some things that need some work, right? It's another opportunity for me to start building on the idea of paradox and how two things can be true at the same time. Um, but I usually will call out the idea of humility because it's one of the H's in the lighthouse model. And so needing to remind them that like humility is not thinking less of yourself. It's just thinking of yourself less. Or like the teens speak, right? The teenagers have these lines that they give. Yeah. And so it's like when they say, like, you're not the main character, bruh. And then I say, like, you have to say bruh, or it doesn't count, right? And I had to, I was in Virginia this last week. So I'm like, is this an East Coast or a West Coast thing? And they're like, no, brah's everywhere.

SPEAKER_00 1:35:12

Like you know, I feel like my dad my 12-year-old to his mom, right?

SPEAKER_03 1:35:16

Yeah, yeah. I'm like, I remember my dad being like, I'm not your dude. Like, stop calling me dude, because that was the and now here I am. I'm not your brah.

SPEAKER_02 1:35:24

Like, oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_03 1:35:26

But I actually really like that one. And I I tell the girls that I'm like, I really like this. You're not the main character. And and so from a humility standpoint, that's really all we're saying is like we're just not the star of the show, we're not the main character, but you can have humility and still be able to acknowledge your strengths and what you do well and what you bring to the table, or the family, or the job, or the world that that people are grateful for, right? And and all of us do because we have people around us that keep wanting to be around us. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:36:01

I'm gonna I'm gonna alleop from that. Yeah, please. My book on stress, about a few weeks out. So hopefully when people are listening to this, hopefully it's out in the world. Hold on a second. You're writing a book? Oh, I forgot to tell you. It's been a little stressful. It's been a little stressful. Um, one of the things that surprised me though, in all the research was that one of our greatest stressors is to have untapped potential or or locked up strengths. We just assume that stress is about the pressures, right, the challenges, but but it's crazy to think about that. The one of the things that weighs on us the most is having things inside of us that we don't have an outlet for. Interesting. So when you can articulate those strengths, you can unlock that. It's actually a de-stressing mechanism and move in your life to articulate and access that potential. And finding that.

SPEAKER_03 1:36:53

I was just gonna say, would you say like untapped potential, kind of similar as a stressor?

SPEAKER_00 1:36:58

Okay, so like untapped potential, or would you say like a strength that's being muted or yeah, something that either the environment blocks, you don't have access or awareness of. So that's just I I found that fascinating because when we think about stress, that's not normally where my mind goes. It's like what's on what's still locked up in me? But often, you know, you feel that that sense of restlessness, or there's I I can't pronounce the guy's name, but but there he was this Nobel Prize winner. But uh, he had this beautiful simple line. He just says, every ability brings with it the need to use that ability to express it, yeah, yeah to put it to use, to bring it to bear on the world. And so it's almost like it's just a different lens on the whole idea that that core values are a like an access point to our vitality. Totally. Right? Core values are those things that that help us that that the vitalize, right? That energize our lives, that that pull this the something else out of us that might be harder to access otherwise.

SPEAKER_03 1:37:57

Well, and I'm hearing you say that yeah. So I'm hearing you say it surprised you in your research. And you were a strengths coach for 20 years. Totally. You were yeah, you're coaching strengths and you're writing this book on stress. And so, hey, for some people, I mean, stress is one of those words that like that's eye roll. I don't think there's many people on the planet who would say they're not stressed in some way, shape, or form. Oh, for sure. Okay, so so then I could probably have their attention right now. Okay, okay, so stress one of the ways in which you could be stressed is that you might have a strength or some potential inside you that's wanting to do that. Or a value that doesn't have clear expression that doesn't have a way to be utilized. Fascinating. And I I bet there's some ways that you are going to help direct people to get unlocked from that. Is that true?

SPEAKER_00 1:38:48

Yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_03 1:38:48

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:38:49

For sure. Well, so I mean, there's a couple things you do with that, right? It one doubles back on that question of when I leave the room, what's missing? It's really powerful to to in community let other people reflect back to you. One of the other ones, though, that I find really interesting is pointing people to this idea that what frustrates you about the world is a signpost to what fulfills you, you know. And sometimes we feel yeah, you know, and there's there's mindset layers to that. There's um where's that line between complaining and kind of the the quest, right, or going to to be a champion about something? But uh the ability, so let me let me approach this this way. If you find yourself in a season where you want to get clear down your core values, one of the most profound questions you can ask yourself is what angers me about the world? And what would I love to uh what would I love to heal? What would I love to help? What would I love to transform? That's an interesting question to ask right now, especially on your social media feed. Right. We can ask it on in so many places. No, I can't.

SPEAKER_03 1:39:59

But that's that's a core values it it helps us point to identify that negative emotion is being informed, likely, by a value, by a belief, by a yes, yes.

SPEAKER_00 1:40:14

Okay, let me let me give this, let me approach this one other way. So that frustration, we can also do this with our fears, right? Because the question is, okay, if we want to know ourselves better, if we want to become black belts in self-leadership, what does that look like? What does it look like to have that clarity about identity and core ideology? So you can do this with with two F's. Anytime you notice yourself expressing or feeling a fear or a frustration, what you do is you don't stop there at that level, you excavate a layer deeper. What is the desire underneath it? What's the desire underneath the frustration and what's the desire underneath the fear? But don't stop there. Deep down, excavate beneath the desire. Every desire is held in place by a value. So anytime you feel a fear or feel a frustration, you have basically a pathway down to a value. And if we can start to do that work, imagine how that would heal the world if we would stop our conversations from just stagnating at frustration and fear and bring it down to the level of value. Don't you think we'd find so much more to work with together?

SPEAKER_03 1:41:24

100%. And there's like a part of me that wants to just let's go and let's keep diving on this. Let's scratch the surface. Okay. From your perspective, what level of and this is a weird question, but like what level of comfort or familiarity do you think people have in exploring their desires?

SPEAKER_01 1:41:43

Hmm.

SPEAKER_00 1:41:46

Yeah. Are they grown up in a religious context or not?

SPEAKER_03 1:41:49

Uh well, that's a that's a that's a I mean, I'd speak to it because I think I mean that's fair. That's on the table. A lot of people have. And so a lot of people that have had call it that side, right? There's almost a shutting that valve off. And that's not important. And that's not what you're saying.

SPEAKER_00 1:42:05

So I'm gonna I I'll give you this this picture and tell me if this is going anywhere near what you're asking and if this gives us something to work with. But as it relates to desire, I think of it as a river, and you can make mistakes on either side of that, right? You can either dam up that river and you can dam up desire, and then you just get this pent up, you get this frustration, that untapped potential, right? That frustration. Um, but you can also let it flood its banks and you can let it run wild, let it run amok, and then there's carnage. And so the I think there's I think that's where right the core ideology comes from and the values come back to is when we know our why, when we know our hows, those desires have something to flow through that doesn't get dammed up and also doesn't do damage to the lives around us. That becomes the the the boundaries. Um boundaries are simply an indicator of self. If you think about boundaries from the lens of our immune system, like your immune system is is a built-in boundary. Totally. It's built to say this is where you start and end, and this is where something else begins, right? Yeah. Like this is this is you, this is not you. So some foreign thing comes into your system. Your immune system says, nope, not you. Get rid of it, right? Boundary. So desire is another one of those indicators that needs to fall within the boundaries that can be found within core ideology that stops us from either living a life that we don't recognize because we've lost our connection to desire and felt like, well, that's that's not for me, not something I can access, or not something that I am uh able to or have permission to express or bring to bear on the world. But then on the other side, um, if it's just like anything goes, right, right, and we we break past the bounds of our core values or core ideology, um, we lose our sense of self that way as well. Totally.

SPEAKER_03 1:43:53

No, I love the way you said that. I could I I'm hearing uh this has come up a lot. This was really part of Tim's language inside the leadership series, but I I I like it in certain spots, right? Is I'm I'm hearing you describe a way to navigate desire in an honoring way, right? That it it becomes honoring for the people around you. Um, because I'm hearing it, right? If you just the bottle up, I think makes total sense, but the the flowing to the banks and if anything goes can also you know create if anything goes, everything goes. Right. Yeah. Oh, well said. Yeah. Yeah. That's super interesting. And I just think, you know, like you know, my two favorite coaching questions, who are you and what do you want? Another way you could say what do you want is what do you desire. Now, that's going to be a much more eyebrow-raising question for a lot of people, but that is kind of what we're itching at.

SPEAKER_00 1:44:44

And that sequence is important. Very important. You have to ask that one after you ask the first.

SPEAKER_03 1:44:50

So let's let's play there for a second. The who are you question for me? Because some people are like, uh, I'm I'm Chris, like I'm Josh. Like, what do you mean? No, like the who are you? And it accordions out, right? So that that who are you is what's your why? What do you believe to be true? And you know, based on our last conversation, that who and why are so closely intertwined, right? So when we get clear on that why process, we start answering that who are you question. You've identified what you value, what you believe to be true there. It's like that kind of fills that out. And then you say, Well, what do you want? Right. Or what do you desire? That outer. You start, you hit that outer piece. And it and so many people work the other way in. What are my goals? What's next? What job? What do I want? What relationship? Like what place should I live in? You know, and it's all like when you move from the inside out, from why to how, what you learn and see and discover is that what actually becomes pretty minimal.

SPEAKER_00 1:45:52

That's way less important. At least it's right-sized. Exactly. Let's put in perspective.

SPEAKER_03 1:45:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:45:58

Good.

SPEAKER_03 1:45:59

Okay. So you mentioned this thing, like you're working on a project. Uh, we definitely want to hear more about it. So I will say I am super grateful and privileged to have been one of your early readers and read a draft of re-stress. So let's let's map that's R-E colon stress, which is some very playfulness coming from this guy. That could be like regarding stress. That could be like reframe stress, reply to stress, reply to stress, right? Like the subject is love it. So tell us about this project, tell us like why restress.

SPEAKER_00 1:46:39

Yeah. Well, the other layer to restress is the in the sense of like what you put a highlighter to, right? The there's two, there's two types of stress, right? There's the stressors in our lives, but there's also like, I want to stress that or I want to emphasize. Like the the another definition of stress is emphasize. So the whole idea is that we're we're in rooms where we see very similar problems, right? We've we've kind of culturally backed ourselves into a handful of corners, but so the way I play with it is we've how have we gotten ourselves in trouble, and what's our pathway out of it back to our best selves, best communities, best relationships, best cultures, best organizations, best teams. So one of them, for example, is for a lot of reasons, right? We've emphasized, we've stressed results, profit, productivity. That's great. And to balance that out, we need to re-stress connection, relationship. Like re-emphasize. Re-emphasize. Do this again. Um another one is right, we we stress time management. We stress being punctual, being in the right place at the right time, right? Having a healthy relationship to our calendar, our commitments. That's amazing. And we need to restress the energy and the capacity that we bring to those containers we step into. It's one thing to be somewhere on time, it's another thing to be there with the time you're given it. So that's the second re-stress. The third is going back to the golden circle. We stress the what, what we're doing, we stress the how, how we're doing, but we need to re-stress the why and the who. And so I call that our spark. To me, that combination of finding our why and our who. So it's it's that that thing that lights us up, that that path to purpose, but it's also the people in our lives, the people in our lives that expand our capacity, that can put some fingers under the couch of the heavy lifts we're doing. I call that our spark. So that's the other thing we re-stress is the moving from the what and how. It's great. Let's also re-stress the who and the why. And the final thing is we stress independence, we stress strength, we stress being able to just handle shit, right? We need to, because of the nature and the size of the challenges we're facing, we need to re-stress vulnerability and trust. And so nothing wrong with these things over here, as long as they are held in tension with and in relationship to the things that we're invited to restress. What's fun about that is if you go back to everything I just said, moving from responsibilities to relationship, from time to energy, from what and how to who and why, and our spark, and then from independence and strength to vulnerability and trust, you pull those together and R-E-S-T spells rest. And if you take the word stressed and you spell it wrong, and you spell it S T R E S T, same sound, different spelling, you find that the word rest is hidden within our stress the whole time. Because our stress isn't going anywhere. So our invitation is to find a more restful way of being within it so that we can stay in our best selves, our best brains, our best hearts, our best values, even when the pressure's on. Find more rest in our stress. So that's how we're trying to play in the book. I love that. And it's been so it's been really fun. Really challenging.

SPEAKER_03 1:50:00

If we I'd imagine so. If we are integrating the conversations, I'm I'm hearing you say that one of the components, one of the pieces of restress is actually getting clarity on why core ideology, that process. Um, and I believe, uh, because I think that's how you actually asked me to read the first right. There's a chapter where you were just talking through why everything we just did. And then I'm like, bro, do I only get to read one chapter? And you go, Do you want to read the whole thing? I would love that. I'm like, yeah. And then I had to ask another question. Uh, how do you want me to read this? Right? Do you like, is this providing edits? Is this comments? And so whatever you got for me. Yeah. And and that was great permission from his part. That's a small little side quest nugget for people. Um, that like, how do you want me to engage with this? For me, yeah. Or I have had this is almost exclusively men in the room that have come back to me and said, the one question you gave me of how do you want me to listen has changed my marriage.

SPEAKER_01 1:51:07

Oh, for sure.

SPEAKER_03 1:51:07

Right. And so I encourage gentlemen on the front end, and if you know, because I'll here's what I'll hear a lot. I'll hear like, my wife just starts talking and she's gone. And like, I, you know, I give her a solution, and then she's like, I don't want you to solve it for me. And then he's pissed off. I mean, it's like I said, hey, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Just just at the very beginning, just say, Let me pause you for one sec. How do you want me to listen? What do you need from me right now?

SPEAKER_00 1:51:31

And sometimes you're like, I don't know. And you say, Do you need to be helped, heard, or hugged? Helped, heard, or hugged, right? Sometimes they're like, all three. Three H's.

SPEAKER_03 1:51:39

This guy just can't stop, won't stop. Um, but but guys come back and say, that one question gave me everything. Like it saved four fights this week, you know, or whatever it might be. Because when she says, I just need you to listen, put your feet up on the table, grab a beer, and give her your full attention, right? And you will, you're welcome. We'll just leave it at that. Yeah, you're welcome. Yeah, so, anyways, that was kind of how it opened up into like, okay, so you know, read the draft. Um, we're super, I'm super excited. The team is getting really excited. Um, we are essentially gonna be pushing the book out as part of like lighthouse publishing, which I'm finger quoting, right? And and just it's a new thing and it's super exciting. So, what else do you want people to know about the book project?

SPEAKER_00 1:52:29

I hope it's helpful. Really. It's it's a way to think differently about stress that doesn't make us afraid of it, but also gives us some uh some support, some scaffolding around all that we carry and some permission to actually receive support into our lives. So one of the ways that I talk about stress in the book is that stress is the way we experience the gap between our commitments. So for those of you that are not watching the video, you know, one hand up high across the top is like the the commitments we we make or the responsibilities we have. And then beneath that, our capacity to meet those commitments or the resources we have to meet our responsibilities. Stress is the way we experience that gap. So the invitation is to learn to close that gap. And often it's not by taking more off our plate, it's by getting a bigger plate. It's by expanding our capacity, it's by by finding resources we didn't know we could tap into. The the the dirty little secret about it all is that the resources is found not only in us, but right around us. Going back to vulnerability, trust, and connection, finding that it's it's within people around us that uh this here was another surprising piece. Okay. So we talked about um our strengths being uh untapped strengths being a stressor. One of the surprising pieces for me was that it's so common for us to be afraid to ask for help because everybody else has so much on their plate, we don't want to be a burden, right? Why would I ask something of someone else when they have so much going on? And and here's there's a researcher from Harvard that found this that actually being trusted to be brought into someone else's heavy is actually a de-stressor for the person that that receives the trust. Can you say it louder for the person on the front, please? No, for this guy. We're gonna talk about it. Say it again so that we can talk about it. So so our story about others is everybody else is already caring so much. So why would I ask this of them? Why would I put this on them? Stress research shows that within a trusted relationship, it's actually a de-stressor for both the one asking for help and the one being asked to help. To be invited to put some fingers on the couch of the literal or emotional move.

SPEAKER_02 1:54:41

So, real life example, Patrick. What story did you have in your head over the last three days?

SPEAKER_04 1:54:47

Man, over the last 40 years. Uh the story in my head that it's really hard. I I have a really hard time asking for help. Uh I need to dig deeper on that and figuring out why that is. Uh, I have some ideas, but um what were you doing this weekend? It's hard. So this weekend, uh some door doors open up for us, and uh we moved um from one town to another, and I did not ask for help. And as a matter of fact, I had a different friend um that found out through my wife, and he actually messaged me. He's like, hey man, like the heck, like I'm here, like I'm ready to help. And I was like, dude, I'm so sorry, I just don't have a plan yet. I was not giving him excuses, but I was trying to find some excuses of like why I haven't asked him yet. Um, and then I was like, you know what? Like, if you want to come tomorrow, that's fine. Uh, but I just don't know the whole plan, and just kind of like beating around the bush, right? And then I have my best friend that I didn't even mention to him that I was moving. And not only that, I used him as a reference to try to get to the next place, and just all of this just bottled up, just kind of like put it under the rug, kind of thing of like, you know what, it's fine, nothing, you know, like I just don't need to ask anybody for help. I I can do this with my own. Like, I've moved so many times, I've got a truck, I've got this, like I can just do it. And man, I'm today's day three, actually, today's day four, and like my body's so exhausted and mentally and everything is just like drained right now. And we had a conversation this morning, literally, right before we put these heads up.

SPEAKER_03 1:56:31

Right before, yeah. So and I was telling Patrick. Um, so this last week I had a nightmare day getting home. Um, it was Friday the 13th. We're recording in March, right? So it was Friday the 13th. I was in Virginia trying to make my way back to California, and all the airports in the DC area had a ground stop. Like all the ones that were in the air got rerouted to like Philly, North Carolina. It was let's go. It was bad. The airport was straight chaos. People were so upset. I mean, you could like hear arguments and a little bit of stress. A little bit, right? And I'm like, okay, like I have no control over this. Um, I'm alive, I'm well, right? Um, I have another buddy who this last week um went in under the knife to get his arm amputated. Like he had cancer in the shoulder. They literally were taking off his arm on like it was Tuesday or Wednesday, I can't remember. But this is fresh on my on my mind, right? I'm like, I have all my limbs, I am healthy, like this is gonna be fine. But I did do a Facebook post kind of summarizing that. Like, hey, I ran into this lady, she was super frazzled. I kind of gave a summary of all my stuff, right? So Patrick reads my reads my Facebook post on Friday and he starts telling himself this story that Josh has a ton going on, which is which is not untrue. Josh does have a ton going on, right? Um, what he couldn't see was that three days prior, I had taken the phone call from the prospective new landlord saying, Hey, what's up, do you know Patrick Ibarra and his wife Christina? I'm like, um yeah, I'd give them my house if I could right now. So, like, whatever you need from me in order to get them into this place, like these are gonna be the best tenants you've ever had. For sure. Right. And I mean, it was, and so I knew something was on the radar, but then you know, the the ask never came. And so Patrick comes in this morning, and I'm like, all right, man, check it out. I love you. We're good. And and I I get how you got to the point that you were at. But what I need you to know is that the opportunity to come help you move is a gift to me. And and actually said, you robbed me of the opportunity to show up for one of the people I love most in the world. Said, no, there's no negative impact, and I don't want to make you feel guilty for you know what I mean. It's a tight, that's a tight threat needle to thread in that conversation where I'm not saying, like, look, dude, you didn't do anything wrong. And I just I want you to know, going back to what you said, like we have the kind of relationship where there's only like three or four things I could possibly be doing that I wouldn't completely abandon to go help you move, right? This is one of what do they say? There's like four major life events, and this is one of them.

SPEAKER_01 1:59:18

For sure.

SPEAKER_03 1:59:19

It's like moving, getting married, having a kid, or or death, I think, right? Like those are so good that you said that. And we just had this live timing example, right? And we're really, really, really good close friends. And so the reason I say that is I I'd imagine for a lot of people listening, this is at play for something in their life, something where they've written a story about not asking for help, or you know, it comes up a lot with some other people on our team that will say, Josh, I know you're so busy. And so I'm just trying to respect your time. I said, Well, my time is mine to manage, right? My time is mine to decide what I want to put energy into and what I don't. And and I would very much appreciate you giving me that opportunity to decide if I have the time or not, instead of you making that choice for me. Right. And it's a hard combo because it's great intentions. And say it the way that you said it again, that the what the research showed.

SPEAKER_00 2:00:23

Yeah, well, just that so think about it this way. We're afraid to ask for help because right, we don't want to be a burden. We know that everybody's so busy, we want to honor that. But if you flip the script and you go back to the time that somebody you deeply care about trusted you with something, even if you weren't able to execute on it, even if something got in the way of it, likely you are honored to be asked. And so if you can take that beat, step onto the other side of the equation and say, okay, at least let me give them the gift of. And this is I'm not, I'm not there's not fit in here. I'll say this here, right? The next time you find yourself challenged with wanting to reach out and ask for help, and you find that roadblock, step into the other side and remember what it felt like when somebody you cared about invited you into something, whether you could meet them in it or not, the the being asked is such an honor. Like Josh saying, it's such a gift. So that's the reframe that we need is that um one of the ways that we can actually expand other people's capacity and be a gift to the world is by letting them into our lives and letting them come around and support us and scaffold us in the things we're carrying that are heavy.

SPEAKER_04 2:01:32

So good. Such a beautiful lesson that yeah, I I honestly like it's hard to live it, but it's such a great reminder of you know all the things that we're talking about in this podcast that is just right there, it's right in front of us. And it's it's for us to make those decisions and to take ownership and take action and actually do what we're preaching, right? Which is such a such a huge invitation.

SPEAKER_03 2:01:58

Um I think there's also an invitation to believe what people are saying, right? Like we have the relationship where I say that to you and you're like, you know what, bro, you're right. I believe you. I know I can ask you. Not everyone's gonna have that level of relational equity. And so you have to kind of start somewhere in saying, like, hey, you know what? I'm just gonna trust that when you say you want to do something for me that you do. And then there's a there's a pretty, there's a pretty intricate dance of like being able to ask, but not attaching yourself to the expectation of the outcome and the answer. Right. So then it's like, oh, well, if I do kind of lean into some courage and I ask for some help and my answer is no, then then do I just write a story like, well, there it is. See, I'm never gonna ask again, right? Um, and and there's a dance to that. Um but so there's I think there's layers of of invitation there. Um, I'm really, really glad this came up because that would it's a it's just a really practical live example that we just lived. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 2:02:58

Uh side quest, yeah. ADHD tangent, Trump on the tangent. Yeah. Um, one of the things that was super fun is so with stress, with a stress conversation, something comes up a lot as saying no. There's actually a book called Reinforcements by a lady named Heidi Grant. She says, when you need reinforcements in your life, the best person to go ask for something for help is the last person that told you no, because nobody wants to be the person to tell somebody no twice. So then they told you no once, the likelihood of them telling you no again is is super low. So go back and ask them. And I'm like, okay, I see that manipulation. But what what I've played with, I remember I learned this because I have a chapter on boundaries. You know, a lot of so uh I I have clients or have you know teams and and they'll be like, yeah, we we had this forced stress management workshop. And I'm like, so what do they teach you, right? Because I know all those conversations are the same. And this one guy would like to do it. Self-care and boundaries, self-care and boundaries, basically, right? Which self-care. So here's a sidebar on a sidebar. Self-care as an antidote to burnout doesn't work because self-care just becomes more reason for guilt. It's another capacity. We don't necessarily need, yes, we need better breathing and stuff like that, but but the the way out of burnout and stress isn't more breathing exercises and bubble baths. Those become more things on our to-do list so we feel guilty for not doing. What we need though is we need more belonging because I found that I will take better care of me for you than I will for me. So if I remember that me pausing and taking a beat and recollecting myself is in service of my brother Patrick or my brother Josh, I will find more energy and less guilt to engage that and and regroup and to pull myself together and resource myself. So the antidote to burnout isn't self-care. It's it's belonging. Um, the other piece though is we never have to say no again the rest of our lives. So I I have this, I have three boys. I have a 20-year-old, 16-year-old, and and 12-year-old. Um, especially my two, my my middle guy, my youngest one, whenever I ask them, Hey, you want to go for a bike ride or go shoot hoops or whatever, if they can't do it in that moment or they don't want to, they don't say no. They say something completely different. They say, I'm good. And there's so much in that response because one of the reasons saying no is so hard for us is because of the shame of letting someone down. The impact, yeah. The impact, the perceived impact of letting someone down. That's that was one of the first things I discovered about stress that made me want to write the book was realizing that I used to think that our stress levels were about our to-do list and our responsibilities, but really our stress levels are about our relationships and who we're afraid to disappoint. And if you can trace all your stressors back to that, to who you're afraid of letting down, changes the conversation, gives you clarity, gives you capacity to do the thing you need to do. So what that has to do with boundaries is my boys, instead of saying no, they just say I good, I'm good. And it's it's not only um a boundary that they're holding, but it's also a a subtle reminder to themselves that there's no room for shame in this. It's a it's an identity reminder that even if they might be letting me down, they're still good. So I don't really so I I don't say no anymore. Or at least to if if it's something that doesn't, if it isn't alight in alignment for me or if I don't have capacity, then it's you know, thank you for asking, but I'm good. I think there's there's a lot there's a lot to unpack there. Yeah. In terms of shame, identity, disappointment. Um, I don't even remember what your initial question was, but but those felt like they they layered in in some ways that at least I had to run with.

SPEAKER_03 2:06:37

No, it's super good. Um I don't know either, and it doesn't really matter. Uh what I want to say is like I I think part of today, there's a hope of you know, kind of a broader introduction of Chris Vela, like bringing you in here and and getting to do this, which is so much fun, like incredibly fun. This would be one of many for sure. Let's go. Um, and then I think like I I believe people will get a sense for who you are and how you roll. And my suspicion is that's gonna come out as reading the book as well. So one of the things like I tried to say is like it just feels really conversational. Um, you know, I read a ton of nonfiction books.

SPEAKER_02 2:07:23

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:07:23

You know that. Um, and some are great, some are good, and some I could, you know, never recommend. Yeah, coasters. Yeah, exactly. Uh and some can be really academic to the point where you're getting so many citations and pointing back to other people's work that you're like, dude, what did a homeboy do here? You know, and and so one of the things I really enjoyed about going through your book was it just felt like talking to you. It felt super now. I have that benefit of on a pretty deep level, um, but I I really think that's gonna come through. It's a it's a very uh tangible, digestible read. Um, it's very practical, it's conversational, it's uh there's a lot of storytelling embedded into it. Um so yeah, I just I personally can't recommend it enough for uh multitude of reasons. Um and I just I think it's gonna be a big gift to the world and I'm excited for people to pick up your words.

SPEAKER_04 2:08:22

Yeah, but yeah. So when when does it come out and where can people find it?

SPEAKER_00 2:08:26

Still working on some of those details, but uh so it's it's March. What are we today?

SPEAKER_03 2:08:32

Today's the 16th. We'll we'll we will do an outro, Patrick. So um on this episode, we'll record an outro and make sure that everyone knows exactly where to find the book. Um we'll probably even have some opportunities for people to get some some special copies as a result of this episode. Yeah. Um potentially like some some signed stuff. And we're also gonna be working on um like a local launch party for for the book. So cool, cool. Um one of the things, team, for YouTube, but anyone listening for this to know also is just that with this podcast, there's also an accountability layer, right? So like if I say something like that and I know that it goes out into the world, then uh we're having a local launch party. So stay tuned.

SPEAKER_00 2:09:13

So I have to so I have to finish the book. Exactly. The book is done. Uh it's it's been proofread, so it's in the hands of the designer right now, putting all the finishing touches on it. Uh, and we'll we'll have copies in hand in April. So so we can put in the show notes what where people can find it. I think the the last thing that I would say with that, the I was struggling. I was struggling to finish it. Uh, I was having a hard time, and then I got the news about my little brother. And the challenge with my little brother, one of the many challenges with my little brother's passing was that he carried so much in silence. He he was afraid to be a burden, and so there were things that he didn't let us in on. And so when I was able to dedicate the book to him, it it was that last piece of of motivation that I needed to say you're too important to carry your stuff alone. Like, don't feel like you can't ask because people would if if people if we really knew what each other was carrying, we would drop the things that that we think are so important and and we would really show up differently for each other. And that's not to trivialize the the things that that make up our day-to-day, but it just really put in perspective. Like um, I wish my brother would have asked for more support. And I he gave me a gift though, the the last conversation we had in person, uh, he was in the hospital, the social worker came in to ask him some questions, and she asked about his support system. And he the first thing he said, I don't ask for help, lady. First thing he said, and then he's self-aware, super self-aware, if he was always honest, uh that to a fault. Um and she said, Your brother, is your brother part of your support system? And he said, I have the best blanking brother in the world. And and I've held on to that. And the thing that I would want for everybody listening to this is to know that that there's nothing you're carrying that's too heavy for someone that cares about you to come alongside and want to be with you in it. And that's what this has been an opportunity for me going through losing my brother has been. Um the I would say the the biggest grief of my life. Um, and the support I found through through the lighthouse team, through these relationships. I've literally had to step into and lean into and practice. what I'm preaching in my book. It's tough. But I can't imagine. There's no way I would have I wouldn't be here right now without that support. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:12:12

We see you in that room. We're super grateful that A, you're not trying to do it on your own. And B that you are sharing that wisdom with the world because I I know for a fact that too many people are trying to carry their junk alone. Right. And and what I hear you saying is that this book is going to shine light that will ignite connection, inspire some hope, and will transform generations because if we can get people to start navigating and managing their stress different that chang that has ripples in their families and their teams and their marriages and their lives.

SPEAKER_00 2:12:54

And the person that's seeing the mirror.

SPEAKER_03 2:12:55

100% right so um thank you. Uh thank you for leaning into the process of writing and finishing the book. Thanks for your courage and sharing about your brother today. Thanks for showing up and and doing this with Patrick and me um when we you know re-established this uh runway it was like how can where when do we get Fela? Like we get the calendar and let's get him in here. So uh this has been an absolute joy. Like I said this will be one of of many. Any parting thoughts from you Patrick?

SPEAKER_04 2:13:31

Thank you for your vulnerability. Thank you for your brain for all those cool words that you just awaited you throw them at us. It's like you you are a black belt for sir and all kinds of things. So that's one of them. So thank you. Thank you.

SPEAKER_03 2:13:45

Any parting thoughts from you Mr. Fela?

SPEAKER_00 2:13:47

Just thanks for being my brother just thanks for the conversation and thanks for shining bright and um yeah so much so much goodness in this conversation. My heart is full and I hope it's a gift to whoever comes along the journey with us.

SPEAKER_03 2:14:01

100% until next time all right everybody full awareness that this episode ends on a bit of a heavy note while it's super exciting for Chris's book to be making its way into the universe uh it required him walking through one of the most challenging darkest seasons of his life and I don't know that he's fully on the backside of that yet. Losing his brother at the beginning of this year was devastating. You know coming to that and just been a been a really hard season to to walk through with him to to watch him walking through. And you heard Chris mention that you know when he was able to dedicate the book to his brother that that was really the thing that kind of helped him push through to the finish line. And so I just thought it'd be valuable here as part of the outro to read that dedication that Chris was ultimately able to include. And so it says 1984 to 2026 to my little brother Daniel that others knew as Simon I'm sorry for the hand life dealt you and grateful for the heart God gave you. Even the autopsy confirmed it was enlarged. I already knew there will always be a hole in mine. Love you Bubs it's heavy it's really heavy and I think the thing I want to point back to is how you know Chris mentioned that his brother was just carrying so much alone. I don't ask for help lady right I mean that's what he said to the nurse in in in the hospital and I just think so many of us have that posture. We have just such a hard time asking for help. We have a hard time believing that other people want to help us and I know that like Daniel there's other people thinking they have to carry their their stuff alone and that they don't want to ask for help. And I think the absolute best way that we can honor Daniel that we can honor Chris and and the work of his book is if we are willing to ask for help. If we just lean into that idea of tapping one shoulder and saying hey you know what I'm carrying something and I want to let you know about it. And if we can also lean into creating that environment where the people around us might be able to ask for help. Even just asking a question of somebody hey how you doing you know the sense I have is maybe you're carrying some extra weight right now. Is there anything you want to talk about? But I just I feel strongly that that is the way I mean he's not here now right we can we can say this without him he recorded the episode with us but I just think the best way that we can honor Chris and his brother and his work before even thinking about going and getting this book is is human to human being able to say hey I could use some help or I'm here to help you. What do you think about that?

SPEAKER_04 2:16:58

Yeah absolutely I think that um we're all just so used to just you know being so superficial with each other and that's not really how you build connection like connection is built when you dig deeper into people and so um yeah take that extra 30 seconds a minute five 10 whatever it takes to just dig a little deeper into somebody else today um it could be in your family it could be your kids it could be a stranger at the grocery store like just spend that little extra time because you never know how much time we all have left and so that that'd be my encouragement to you to just dig a little deeper there.

SPEAKER_03 2:17:34

And you're really good at that. You are my brother okay let's end on a little bit of a high note where do we want to find this book restress it is here it is live I have my advanced signed copy already. Hopefully you can't see too much of that because that's a private note for me. But we want to give you the ability to get an advanced signed copy. And so as of the publishing of this episode there will be a landing page on our website lighthouseinstitute.com forward slash publishing forward slash I did check this morning on if you're supposed to say forward slash or backslash. It's a forward slash okay so uh lighthouse.com slash or sorry lighthouseinstitute.com forward slash publishing and you will be able to order an advanced signed copy of Restress for anyone local to the San Luis Obispo County the 805 there is actually going to be a local launch party Friday June 5th so it's coming up very quickly if you are listening to this episode as it releases and that is going to be Friday June 5th from 6 to 830 p.m at the Colony Sandwich Company formerly Colony Market right there on El Camino Traffic Way nice outdoor space it should be phenomenal weather so from 6 to 830 the lighthouse team Chris Fela is going to be down there. You'll be able to buy a copy get it signed get a photo do any of that fun stuff and we would love to have you join us for that do that again.

SPEAKER_04 2:19:04

That was a total accident but there we go that was yeah that's when uh accidents just uh fit right in with how they're supposed to love it so anything else you want to say about the book or making it available man I don't want to give up too much on the book but it didn't give away anything really but it's incredible it's been shifting my mind and the way that I see stress now like incredibly like what a what a what a beautiful work Chris did with just reframing it like I I'm I again I don't want to give away anything because you you gotta read it but it's incredible. So yeah tip my hat to my buddy Chris love him.

SPEAKER_03 2:19:40

Awesome all right team thank you so much for listening to episode three uh as always we are super interested in your comments and your feedback any ways that we can make the podcast better for us or for you and regardless of where you are or what you're doing or who you're with we hope that you go shine bright.