When Your Workplace Culture Conflicts With Your Values | Kamia Morris

Navigating being a Christian in the workplace can be challenging when your environment doesn’t reflect your values. This conversation offers practical insight on handling that tension with wisdom, through setting healthy boundaries, making intentional changes, and staying anchored in your faith. It’s a thoughtful look at what it means to remain grounded while finding your purpose in God, even in seasons of misalignment.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:01

Welcome to the Vanderblumen Ladies Leadership Podcast, where we help Christian women grow in confidence, calling, and leadership. If you want to excel in your career while staying true to your faith, you're in the right place. Thanks for being here. Let's dive in.

SPEAKER_02 0:17

Hello everyone. Welcome to another episode of the Vanderblumen Ladies Leadership Podcast. I have with me today, I know I always say it's one of my favorite people, but it's one of my favorite people again. Um, this is Miss Camille Morris, and she is one of our senior executive search recruiters. And Camille, I think you've been here, I was just thinking about it now. Two and a half, is that right? Yes. Gosh, the time flies. Does it seem like longer or shorter to you?

SPEAKER_01 0:41

Uh it definitely seems like longer. That's a good thing. I don't mean that. It's just a lot of shared experiences and great times that we've had with our team.

SPEAKER_02 0:49

And we've been planted here for such a long time that we're kind of like, we're part of the part of the scenery. Yes, you and me. It's true. Well, we have an excellent topic today that I think will be really of interest to to listeners of all ages. Um, this is when your workplace culture conflicts with your values. And this is something that I have dealt with a lot in my life throughout my different careers. Um, and Camille, I know that you have a lot to say on this too. So maybe we'll just start out um talking about I have experienced workplace cultures where the culture did not align with my values, and that's happened more than once. And it's really challenging. Something that I often talk about is cognitive dissonance. Do you you kind of know about what that means, Camille? But like where you're do, you're taking action, but it doesn't align with what your mind and your body think you should be doing. So your mind and body are like, this is how I need to be acting, this is what I want to be doing, but you're being forced to because of the situation around you act in a different way. And that creates that dissonance, and that is so that is so unhealthy and unpleasant.

SPEAKER_01 1:48

Yeah. So I mean, just talk a little bit more about just the time when you have experienced that in the workplace. Yes. Yep.

SPEAKER_02 1:55

I can think of a couple different examples. Um, many of you know that I worked at Lush Cosmetics and I loved it. It was 10 amazing years of my life. I really loved it. But there were definitely parts of that culture that didn't align with my values. So Lush isn't a Christian organization, it's not a Christian company. Um, Vanderblumen is the first company that I've worked for that has a religious tie-in, that's a Christian organization. So I remember sometimes um, we were also in our 20s, we were younger, and there was really a party culture. There was definitely a party culture, and I did not participate in that. So at the end of the day, let's say we traveled, we were in Vancouver for work, and maybe after work people went out for drinks. And I didn't, I didn't do that. I went to work out. And I that was just a way for me to do self-care for one thing, and then also to have a really good reason to not be involved in that that I didn't necessarily feel comfortable with. And I remember toward the end of my time at Lush, um, my we had gotten a new boss at the time, and she said, Jen, you need to participate in those type of events because that's part of the relationship building. And I said to her, that's just not something that I necessarily want to be part of. And everyone in the company still feels like I'm have strong relationships. So why do I need to do this drinking, this party culture when it doesn't align with my values? Right. Yep. So that's that's one example. Um I can think of others, but that's one.

SPEAKER_01 3:10

Yeah, I as you were talking, I thought about not only just uh underlying culture, but mission.

unknown 3:16

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 3:16

Sometimes you can be part of an organization and it's like, I'm not really aligned with the mission, the goals, what we're trying to achieve. And we can put on this external face for compensation for only so long. I think people who are values driven that you're gonna just find that cause cost say it again.

SPEAKER_02 3:36

Um the cognitive dissonance. You know, to me, I was I was recording a podcast with Adelaide the other day, and we were talking about how the younger generation really takes a lot of times takes jobs because of the mission.

SPEAKER_01 3:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 3:47

And people that are a little bit older, you know, we see jobs as maybe a means to an end, but the younger generation sees it as an end in itself that I want to be working for an organization that I believe in. And I feel like everyone could be better served by realizing that your job really should line up with who you are in order for you to have a fulfilled life. I'm reading a book right now, um, it's defining your life or fulfilling your purpose or something. Designing your life. And it's about designing a life that matches with the values that you have. And how studies have shown that if you are actually aligned with your values and your day-to-day actions, you're gonna have so much more happiness. You don't have that cognitive distance, you don't have that emotional drain, and you're able to kind of capture everything that God has for you and use that in your daily life, in your job, and in your personal life. Yeah. So that's what I'm searching for, Camilla. How do we get there, Camilla?

SPEAKER_01 4:34

I I think it's baby steps too, because I recently had a conversation with my manager just about the activities that I really enjoy doing. Yes. And the things that may not bring me as much joy. And those are constant conversations I think we can have with our teams, because it may not be, oh, I need to leave this company or this drastic shift, but just like what are the micro changes that we can make that align better with our values and give us life as opposed to kind of draining from a Camille, that's brilliant.

SPEAKER_02 5:01

Let's everyone start using that word micro changes because this like this podcast is an example of a micro change. You know, if if you have a job that tends to be a certain way and maybe doesn't align with your values or maybe drains you, if you can find something that does energize you, I was doing an activity I talked about about um what gives me energy and marking it down at the end of every day, what activities drain me and what activities energize me. And then if you can put more of those activities that energize you into your day, that can be a little bit of a buffer, even when the culture of the company and the values don't necessarily align with what you feel like is in your heart. Right.

SPEAKER_01 5:35

Yeah. Right. But I think the problem is, Jen, we wait too long and the pressure builds up and the feelings and we annoyed for so long, and we're talking with our family and our friends, and everyone says you should leave. Yep. But you haven't had maybe enough conversations before then to even find out what's triggering you and it's so true.

SPEAKER_02 5:55

It's so true. It's almost like a slippery slope. And I think that there are lots of cultures that are negative, but I think the more that you think about them and talk about them without a positive change occurring, it makes it worse. So part of me, part of my advice is like if you're in a culture that is really toxic and that doesn't align with your values, my first piece of advice honestly would be to find out about that before you take the job. So my belief is that God does not want you to be in a place that doesn't align with your values. Why would He? Why would God make you a certain way and then say, well, now you have to go in this environment that's gonna make you uncomfortable every single day. It's gonna rub against you the wrong way. Maybe there's a season of that, but I don't think that it's supposed to be the whole lifetime. So if you can be discerning in the job search process and find out about the mission, the values, and the culture beforehand, you can maybe avoid getting into that situation. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:44

What are some questions people can ask in that, you know, discernment process?

SPEAKER_02 6:48

My my advice on this is if you can go in person for the interview, that's really gonna be a benefit. And something that we like to do at Vanderblumen, we've recently started, and you and I both really like it, is we kind of have round robin interviews with candidates. So we have them come in and they meet with different teams. So they first of all they see our office culture and then they get to interact with people on each team and they get to kind of form their own opinion of the culture and see if these are the people that they'd want to work with and see if the daily activities and basically the values that we espouse are in line with them. And we have had people who have like, oh, who said, oh, maybe, you know, maybe this isn't right for me. And we've had other people that say maybe this is right for me, and giving them the opportunity, an interview should never be just one person making the decision, it should be both sides trying to find a really good connection. So that's just one example. This topic's so juicy, Camille. Um, Camille, what do you think some common ways are that workplace culture can conflict with personal values?

SPEAKER_01 7:45

That's absolutely good. Um, I think so. There are a couple of things. Yep. One being when now we say work life harmony, it's changed from work-life.

SPEAKER_02 7:54

Oh, that's good too.

SPEAKER_01 7:55

So some cultures they're like we work hard, we play hard. Some cultures there's an expectation that you're working nights and weekends. Yes. Um, so just really understanding what the ask is, also the value of transparency. That's something that I've really valued in the past. Some cultures have a lot of red tape and bureaucracy, and some are just like, you, Jen, you're very open and transparent. And we don't feel like anything is hidden from us, which is good. I think we feel com comfortable and safe and cared for in that type of environment. Other things that may not align is work style. So we do work in genius here, so we can, you know, best position our teams to kind of mix with various work styles. But some organizations we've seen, like a previous organization I was a part of, we all leaned in one way that we worked, which could probably be triggering for someone else that comes in and doesn't have that work style.

SPEAKER_02 8:48

Well, and then you kind of get an unbalanced team where everyone's really good at this, but then people maybe, maybe this is a skill set that people are lacking.

SPEAKER_01 8:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 8:55

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 8:56

So there's some ways.

SPEAKER_02 8:57

Yeah, that's that's really interesting. I would say for the workplace culture side of it, other questions that you maybe can ask when trying to figure it out is am I going to be treated like an individual here or am I going to be treated as a cog and a machine? Yeah. And to be honest with you, during interviews, people, you can ask these specific questions and it kind of helps show the employer what you're thinking of. Because I want to be managed as a whole person and I want to be in a culture that values and respects all the different parts of me. And I so I think that that's something else that we can kind of keep in mind.

SPEAKER_01 9:27

That made me think of when you're in an organization and you may start to sense some misalignment. Yes. Sometimes we spend so long gaslighting ourselves. Like, oh, maybe this is not what I see.

SPEAKER_02 9:38

Maybe this episode is brought to you by Camille's buzzwords.

SPEAKER_01 9:41

Yeah. Maybe. Oh, am I just making this up? Right. We spend weeks trying to fact-check whether what we feel is true or not. And instead of just honoring our feelings, and and the Lord gives us those feelings so we can lean or things. It doesn't mean that we allow them to control us, but we should follow up and see what it's telling us as opposed to just pushing it down. And that's where I've fallen into just traps in the past because you just you let your mind spin for too long and you don't really do anything about it.

SPEAKER_02 10:10

This is what I this is what I'm thinking about that topic. I think it's really important in your work that you have at least one other coworker that you can be honest with and they can be honest with you. Yes. But that's very different from gossip. Yes. As soon as you get into gossip and drama, that is, we do not stand for any of that. That is not, no one would support that. And it's not healthy. It's not healthy. But if you have a work, I have um Sarah, as you know, I have someone at work that that really knows me well and I really know her well. And we're able to check against each other this gaslighting type of situation. Like, this is how I'm seeing this. Could I be seeing it in another way? And she's a wonderful friend, and she's really able to say, Well, Jen, you could be thinking about it this way. And a lot of times she's right, and it's just I was in my own head about it and didn't have the right perspective. So I think making sure that you have at least one person that kind of knows you and knows the organization well enough to be able to test you on that. Because if you feel like you're being gaslit, you kind of get into a situation of, should I just be trying harder? Should I be doing this differently? And then you start to overthink it. And I think women tend to do that a little bit more than men.

SPEAKER_01 11:10

I think we should lean in there. How do we find our person that works? One thing I thought of with you and Sarah is you both have a very balanced, unbiased opinion. So you can come in and be very objective about it. Um, and the other thing is there some people when you tell them something, they go and they heighten the situation even more. So you leave even more upset or yes, more upset than before. But what is something that you've seen in like your people?

SPEAKER_02 11:36

You know what? That's a great question. I have um I've had a couple different people here over the time that I've been here, a little over four years now, that I've kind of connected with. I think one thing you need to look for is someone that is stable. So, really stable. Like you said, when they heighten the situation, they think that they're helping, but they're not. And a piece of advice I got one time that I use almost every day, Camille, is what advice would you give your best friend? So when you're looking for your person, it needs to be someone that you know will give you unbiased information and that can deliver the hard messages. Because I can't tell you how many times Sarah has said, oh, Jen, you might not be looking at this right. Not in a mean way, but in a way that really helps me reevaluate. So someone that's stable, someone that's shown consistency, and I think also someone that leads with grace. Sarah's great at leading with grace. She really is. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:24

For herself and for others. Yes. I think she shows it very well.

SPEAKER_02 12:27

And she also is a good advocator for others. Yes. So I guess my answer to this is that everyone should just find Sarah. I'll give you her email address and everyone can have it, we'll put it in the on the couch. We'll put it in the chat. Everyone, you you find your own Sarah.

SPEAKER_01 12:40

Another question I thought of too is so when you talked about the two different generations we have in the work. Yes. So there's a generation of folks who are just trained to like stay through it all.

SPEAKER_02 12:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:50

Regardless of what happens. Right. You got a pension, yes. You got your retirement at stake. Right. It just doesn't matter. Um, I'll be on vacation soon enough. But then you have the other generation who I'll say they're used to this triggers me, or maybe a little bit uh averse to adversity in the workplace. So, how do you balance knowing when it's the time to leave, or if this is something that I should try to allow the Lord to refine me through and trust my network to support me.

SPEAKER_02 13:21

Yeah, that's really great. I am always in favor of having a really good manager. And I know that a lot of people don't, and I think it's I think probably, I don't know, they've done studies. Maybe 50% of managers aren't really very supportive. So hopefully you would have a good manager. If you have a good manager, there's gonna be two different options. If you have a good manager, I would talk to your manager and I would just let them know how how you're feeling at all times. The people that work for me have no hesitation of telling me what what the what their specific challenges are. And then we can figure out, okay, is there something that I can do as the manager? Is there something that I can do for the culture? Is there something that the company can do to help help you? I think that goes back to what you're talking about, the micro changes. You know, and maybe your manager is able to say, okay, Camille, well, let's pivot you to this and this. And you couldn't necessarily make that change yourself, but your manager could. So I would say your manager would be the best person to talk to. If you don't have a manager, I really think you rely on family and friends. I have been in positions where my family and friends beg me, are begging me to quit. Yeah. Because they can see, they see the spark in me and they see the sparkle in my life and they see when that's not there in a particular job. And it's hard when you're in this situation because I'm the kind of person that could put up with literally anything for any amount of time, which is not necessarily great, but I think a lot of women are. You know, we can suck it up and deal with it. So I think I can handle a little bit longer. I can handle a little bit a little bit longer. But if you really trust that your family and friends who've known you for a long time and have your best interest at heart, they see a brighter future for you than you see for yourself. And the Holy Spirit works through people. So if you're just being la, la, la, everything's gonna be fine, everything's gonna be fine. But meanwhile, you're having heart issues or you're you can't sleep at night because you're so stressed. We really want to focus on having faith in these types of situations. And we really have to have faith that God has something better, and then if we jump, He will catch us.

SPEAKER_01 15:08

Yeah, yeah. Yeah. I I love that. And I think you and I both have found safe spaces and managers that we've had in the past. I want to speak to the person whose manager is not a safe space, and they're maybe listening and they're like, Well, I I can't talk to them, I don't trust them. And so you talked about, you know, you don't have the manager, you can talk to your family. Um, but also, you know, having courage. I think sometimes you can make a judgment call about a person or manager based on what you assume, but you haven't really given them the opportunity to show up for you. Um, so really testing yourself and and pushing your limits a little bit there. But also, how can we speak to the managers who may say, I have so much work on my plate, I don't even know if I'm being valuable. How can I help someone speak truth to power when I don't even know that I can do it myself?

SPEAKER_02 16:01

Two, I have two suggestions here. And I hope everyone is enjoying my creaky chair every time my chair is creaking. Um, one thing I would say is that you have to, you as the employee have to establish a posture of humility.

unknown 16:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 16:11

So you never should go into any meeting with your manager with a position of um kind of arrogance or entitlement because that immediately shuts a manager down. So you really have to come in with humility. The other thing that I would recommend is having something specific that you're asking for. So I have one employee that I've been managing for a while, and this employee oftentimes brings up a lot of concerns, but the employee never comes with solutions. And if you come to your manager with a million problems and no solutions, what do you expect them to do? Yeah. Like their job is not to just figure out all your problems, they're trying to manage the company and manage other things. If you come with easy, kind of like, I wouldn't say uh very small, but if you come with a bite-sized, easy solution, like let's say, Camille, that you have realized that you love doing phone screens and you just wish that all 40 hours of week you'd be on a phone screen. Then when you go to your manager in a position of humility, you can say, something that I really enjoy and that I feel like I'm really good at is phone screens. And my goal is to accomplish 20 phone screens a week. Would it be possible if I re if I could rearrange my schedule so that I could get more phone screens done? And maybe you know that that's meaning like you're changing your hours a little bit, maybe you're doing some more remote time, but all you're doing is coming with a simple ask in a spirit of humility. And it's always good to say what the benefit is going to be to the company. Yes. So I you interview more people than I do, Camille. But I recently interviewed someone and everything was about what was best for them, what they need. Well, that you don't you don't need to, that is not the way to get what you want. So present your ask in a way that will benefit the company.

SPEAKER_01 17:41

That's so good. I don't know why it made me think of therapy. Yeah. It maybe because the last time I was seeing a counselor, um, I'm very proactive, just like we are here. So I would come with already with like my questions that I have or things that I want to work on, or when we'd follow up, I'd have kind of, you know, follow-ups that she told me to do. So I think I want to pause here and advocate because sometimes we think of therapy only for things in life. But normally your insurance may cover some sort of like where you can talk through workplace issues. If you, even if you don't feel like you have a good sounding board in your family, you can use, you know, your insurance to cover time for someone to talk to you through workplace issues.

SPEAKER_02 18:20

Camille, I think that's real smart. So you might not have a coworker, you might not have a manager, and you might actually not have someone in your life. But what we were talking about, the key of Sarah is that kind of stable, impartial. That's what a counselor would be. So I think that's a great idea. Yeah. This is this is brought to you by the Counselor Association of America. I love this topic. Camille, okay, let me ask you a hard one. Okay. Look at my list and see, oh, this is good. Okay, so this is internal tension. Okay. What does that conflict feel like? If your workplace culture conflicts with your values, how do you know it's happening? Oh my god. Oh, that's you you put your name on this question, but this is a hard one.

SPEAKER_01 18:56

Yeah, and you kind of hit on it some earlier. I'll talk about signs that I feel in myself. Um, I get like a knot in my knots down here, down right here, right? Which are like tells and signs of like something is off in your intuition. Yeah. Um, or I'm just always anxious or I'm tense. Yeah. Um, so those are kind of some internal, and you talked about losing sleep. Right. You're waking up in the middle of the night thinking about certain things, um, or you're revisiting. So that's something I talked about in counseling too. Conversations that you revisit so many times, like the processing loops, that's because something is unresolved there. Maybe um push past what an area that you're convicted in too long, or you didn't say the thing that you needed to say. Um, so those are good signs. Sometimes it takes a while to get to those signs because we don't sit down with ourselves at the end of the day and maybe debrief that conversation. But it is good to have those conversations and not push past those feelings. I think that's really good.

SPEAKER_02 19:54

Camille, something that I thought of when you were talking about that is by that, we kind of mentioned at the beginning, by the time it gets to that point, it's so much harder. Yeah. So, you know how we were talking about like the interview process? I also think something that might help people is between jobs or maybe before their maybe these are just some people that haven't had their first career. Write a list of what values you want your job to have. Like something that I loved about Lush was that the actual values that the company had were values that I completely was in alignment. And I then worked every day. Whether or not you like your manager, if you believe in the mission and the vision, you're able to, you're able to work really hard. And then some of the people issues become smaller because you know you're working toward the greater good. And I think a lot of people in church probably experience that. I'm working unto the Lord, so it doesn't necessarily matter. I say that in the office a lot, at least I used to do that. We're working unto the Lord, we're not working unto our human masters. So making a list of your values and then the kind of job that would align with your values, if you get in a company that you believe in from the beginning, then all the stuff that we're dealing with, you wouldn't, you wouldn't have even gotten to that point because you're working for Disney or something like that, you know?

SPEAKER_01 20:56

Yeah, yeah. I'll also tell you a way to cheat based on what you said, and it's something you're not a huge fan of. But AI. Oh, yeah. So in that conversation that I had with my manager, where you talk about you need to come with solutions and how this adds to your company value, I put the prompt into AI. So it could kind of talk me through. Did this actually happen? This actually happened. Well, tell us how it was like you didn't have to say the specifics, but was the resolution good? The resolution was good. I she wrote it down and she said that's actually a great idea, and we can try to lean in to see how we can get you more of the things that energize you. Yeah.

unknown 21:30

Come here.

SPEAKER_01 21:30

We need to position it as like, oh, this activity makes me burnt out or I hate doing it. You spun a positive. Yep. So it didn't seem like, you know, just a venting session or something that I was complaining about. Because I didn't want the message to be lost. Of course. I really enjoy my job, but I just enjoy these activities more.

SPEAKER_02 21:50

And all managers, I will speak on behalf of all managers everywhere. They want positive employees and they want solution oriented employees because the last thing you want is a manager, in addition to all the things that you have to do for your job. The last thing you want is an employee that's going to drain you. Right. And it sounds like you really prepared well for that and that it worked really well.

SPEAKER_01 22:06

So use the tools.

SPEAKER_02 22:07

Use the tools that you've got. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:08

Oh, I want to ask you a question. Sure.

SPEAKER_02 22:10

Oh, all the rest on the sheet. J, J, Jay. All the shades.

SPEAKER_01 22:14

Ooh, this was real I when I saw this, I thought of you. So if you're not in a position to leave right away, how do you protect yourself?

SPEAKER_02 22:23

Yeah, that's great. So I am a big fan of boundaries. And what that means to me is that at work, that is my work time. So people who love their job and are just like all about their job, maybe the boundary isn't necessary for you because it's not draining you. If you have a job that is draining you or that is not in alignment with your culture, the best friend that you can have is boundaries. And that means setting specific times that you're available. So I'm available from nine to five, maybe 5:30. And to people I really like a little later than that. But that's when I'm available to work. And I set that expectation before I got hired to my boss. And I've set that expectation for my employees too. I just recently hired a new executive assistant and I said, I will never bother you after 3:30 unless it's an emergency. And I haven't bothered her. So I think the best thing you can do is set actual time boundaries. And that also means you're not checking your email at night and you're not answering. If someone calls you outside of your working hours, you're not answering. I understand in the church space that might not always be possible, but you can set specific boundaries. Maybe on Fridays you take the day off. Because if you don't shut that part of your life off, that part that's draining you, it's gonna bleed over into every other part of your life. And it also starts affecting your relationships outside of work. And then instead of just your job not going great, then your relationship with your husband is not going great, then your relationship with your parents is not going great, then you drop out of activities. So the other thing I would say when you're if your job is, if the culture is not in alignment, I would say the activities that you choose to be a part of outside of work should be life-giving.

SPEAKER_01 23:52

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 23:52

And and you really should be involved in some because if you have a job that doesn't align with your values and outside of work you don't do anything else, all you're doing is ruminating. It's the feedback loop you were talking about. You're just ruminating on the problems. If you get to go to choir and look forward to being with a whole different group of people that are positive and that you're you know making music together, then that gives you a respite and your brain respite from thinking about your toxic environment.

SPEAKER_01 24:15

That's so good. I question I thought of too is once you establish these boundaries with your team or your manager, it's one part of the process. But then it takes time for people to get used to your boundaries. It does. So how do you have those follow-up conversations?

SPEAKER_02 24:29

You don't even have the conversations. You just don't reply to them. You just don't reply to them. So if someone calls you after this is very dramatic and someone's gonna tell me this is dumb. But if after five, if you tell people that I'm sorry, I'm not available after 5:30 unless it's an emergency. So I'll give you an example of my good friend Yvette. My good friend Yvette sometimes calls me later in the day. So she called me later in the day yesterday, and I said, Yvette, I have five minutes. And I talked to her, and at the end of five minutes, I said, okay, I've got to go. And then and and because I had set that expectation before, it was much easier to follow up on. You maybe can't do that with your boss, but this would be a tip I have with you when you take the job just at the beginning, just say, I'm so happy to give you everything that I've got during these hours. And then I usually will not be available on the weekends unless it's urgent. Something like that. That's good. Yep. Yeah. Good luck to you. All right, Camille. I think we've probably gone over time. Alex is giving Alex has given us the pause. Um, but we do have a question from the audience, and I don't know if it's for you or for me. Okay. Or maybe we should both answer. Okay. Producer, what do we got?

SPEAKER_01 25:31

Thank you. Okay. So I think this is for you, Jenny. Of course you do. The culture is super off at my work. There's a lot of people who seem to treat it just as a job, but to me, it's a calling. Should I stay because I believe in the mission or leave because my coworkers are terrible people? And who is that from? This is from Carly Arono. Yeah. Okay, Carly.

SPEAKER_02 25:57

Um, my answer to this is that you should stay. If this is, we've talked about how it's it's difficult to find a job that is in alignment with your values and where the culture is in alignment with your values. It sounds to me like you're saying, Carly, that the vision and the mission of this company are in alignment with your values and it energizes you. So you need to do do a little bit of boundary setting and don't necessarily interact as much with those people. So my opinion would be that you keep doing your job really, really well over here. And if possible, feedback up to your manager that it would be great if we could get more employees that have these type of qualities and maybe steer the manager into to hiring for a different type of person. If you really like the mission, I would really stick it out. Yeah. That's that's my opinion. If the people are um really bad, like that they um are offensive to you or that they persecute you in some way that is not palatable, well, then I think that might be either a harassment issue that you bring up to your manager or that might be something maybe you throw up feelers for another job. But it really is not easy to find a job that aligns with your values. So if you found that, I think you should consider yourself lucky, at least in the organization.

SPEAKER_01 27:06

Yeah, I think that's communicating. Just the same as you said, we're not talking about if this is toxic or unethical environment. Yeah, but just if there are personality differences, um, it's definitely something to consider. And you can become a change champion or maybe a culture champion. We have a great culture team here.

SPEAKER_02 27:23

We do make it. I don't know if we mentioned that. We do have a culture team at Vanderbiltman and it's done wonders.

SPEAKER_01 27:27

Yeah, yeah. So there's maybe you can volunteer to head up an organization that helps shift the culture as you know, as opposed to just feeling like you're a bystander and missing.

SPEAKER_02 27:36

That's a wonderful idea. Put your hand up to try to make it better rather than I was like, put up a boundary, go over here and just do your job. And you're like, well, maybe you can help everyone else get better. Yeah. I stand corrected. Camille is right. There's multiple ways to do it. Camille, thank you so much. I love speaking with you. You did wonderful, and it's just so glad. I'm so glad to have the time to talk with you.

SPEAKER_01 27:55

This is fun.

SPEAKER_02 27:56

Thanks, ladies, and as Camille and I like to say, lead on.

SPEAKER_01 28:00

Lead on.

SPEAKER_00 28:02

Thanks for joining us. Have a blessed week and lead on.