General Election Now! - Farage Slams Burnham’s “Peaceful Coup”

When Keir Starmer suddenly resigns as Labour leader, Andy Burnham moves quickly to sneak into Number 10 without a mandate, but Reform UK leads the charge demanding the British people have their say in a General Election.

Ray Addison reports on another chaotic week in Westminster, with Richard Tice exposing Burnham’s hypocrisy and Nigel Farage reflecting on media bias at the Alliance for Responsible Citizenship. The episode also features Reform’s Shadow Chancellor Robert Jenrick addressing business leaders and Brexit veteran Gawain Towler remembering the historic vote on the 10th anniversary of the EU referendum.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

It's Monday morning, the 22nd of June, and a lecten is being carried out and placed in front of number 10. When Keir Starmer finally steps out, he's clutching his resignation speech, the sixth delivered by a British Prime Minister in less than a decade.

SPEAKER_12 0:21

Every decision I've taken has been about putting the country I love first. That is why I will resign as leader of the Labour Party.

SPEAKER_02 0:32

Meanwhile, 200 miles north in Manchester, the man Starmer was too scared to fight, was about to step onto a train.

SPEAKER_16 0:40

Will you announce your intention to stand today? I'm going to get onto the platform, I think.

SPEAKER_02 0:45

The departure board read London Houston, but everyone knew Andrew Burnham's compass was already pointing firmly at Downing Street.

SPEAKER_16 0:53

So Burnham, are you preparing for a contest or a coronation? Thank you, everyone.

SPEAKER_02 0:58

Despite refusing to answer Sky News, just a few minutes later, Burnham posted on X, confirming he would put himself forward to replace Starmer. Just three minutes later, former Health Secretary Wes Streeting released an open letter backing Burnham and revealing the pair had been in talks for days.

SPEAKER_14 1:20

Labor are about to coronate a new Prime Minister who is nothing more than Starmer in jeans. Burnham has no manifesto. He has no mandate. He is another career politician being foisted on you without your consent.

SPEAKER_02 1:43

Reform leader Nigel Farage responded to the chaos with a video message of his own. While reform led the loudest calls for a democratic vote, both the Tories and the Lib Dems went suddenly very quiet, almost as if they were terrified of what would happen if the British people were actually allowed their say.

SPEAKER_05 2:44

Are you ready to be Prime Minister, sir?

SPEAKER_02 2:46

Challenged by journalists and members of the public asking if he was mounting a coup. Great news! We've done it! We've got Starmer out. While Westminster buzzed with speculation, College Green, the famous patch of grass opposite the Houses of Parliament, was packed with the world's media.

SPEAKER_07 3:04

It looks like there's going to be a coronation of Andy Burnham, who two-thirds of the Labour Parliamentary Party don't know because they've never experienced him in the House of Commons.

SPEAKER_02 3:14

Right in the middle of the frenzy was reforms deputy leader Richard Tice giving interview after interview.

SPEAKER_07 3:21

We're calling for a general election because nobody has voted for the sort of hard-left, hard socialist tax raising policies that Andy Burnham is talking about.

SPEAKER_02 3:33

I managed to grab a quick word with him as he waited to go live. What do you think Starmer's legacy will be?

SPEAKER_07 3:40

Uh the most disastrous two years as Prime Minister has frankly made us poorer domestically, internationally, and yeah, he's he's done. It's good that Starmer has gone, that's what we ask people to vote for us for. But the idea that Andy Burnham could just be coronated and then carry on for three years pursuing a sort of program of hard left, hard socialist policies that require significant increases in taxes is outrageous. We need a general election, we need it as soon as practical, and we'll be ready. And our viewers bring it on. Isn't it interesting that both the Tories and the Lib Dems they're a bit frit, they're a bit terrified, they don't seem to want an election. They're just part of the Uniparty cosy consensus in Westminster. We need change, we need disruption, we've got to save our country. What do you think a Burnham premiership would be like? I think it'll mean higher taxes, I think it'll be vacuous, full of waffle, it'll be sort of just um what you'd expect from a sort of uh flip-flopping, U-turning socialist.

SPEAKER_02 4:39

Obviously, reform's calling for an immediate general election. If there isn't one, um what do you think? We'll keep calling for it. Yeah, but what'll keep calling it?

SPEAKER_07 4:47

Well, I think if he'll be rapidly, he'll become as unpopular as Starmer because he doesn't stand for it. I think we've got to come to me.

SPEAKER_02 4:53

Later on Talk TV, Richard revealed something very telling.

SPEAKER_07 4:57

I've got an interesting tweet. There's always a tweet, Julia. Yeah. If I can just read this out to you from Andy Burnham, we need to start demanding a general election at the end of this Tory leadership election. Well, well, well. Uh that was Andy Burnham actually four years ago in 2022. So we're saying uh stick by your word, be consistent, Andy, and uh when you're Prime Minister, call a general election because you've got no mandate whatsoever to impose upon the nation uh your vacuous, wishy-washy socialist policies. Uh not that anyone knows actually what you stand for, except that you want to change the existing policies, um, put them to the British people and uh and reform will will beat you and we'll save Britain.

SPEAKER_02 5:38

Similar calls by dozens of Labour MPs, including Keir Starmer himself, were uncovered, all demanding a general election when the Conservatives changed leaders without asking the public in 2022.

SPEAKER_16 5:51

I swear by almighty God that I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to his Majesty King Charles.

SPEAKER_02 5:58

The hypocrisy was glaring, as Burnham was sworn in later that day, now positioning himself to become the next PM with no mandate and no consent from the British people. Two days later, Nigel Farage was in London to speak at the Alliance for Responsible Citizenship. Held at the Olympia, the annual event brings together thinkers and politicians from all over the world, focused on national renewal.

SPEAKER_08 6:37

I just said in the chat, we had a bit of a celebratory lunch yesterday.

SPEAKER_02 6:41

Having spent the previous day reflecting on the tenth anniversary of the Brexit referendum, the conversation in the green room turned to the biased media coverage of the time.

SPEAKER_08 6:50

When you actually look back at the daily onslaught from the BBC, you know that you're going to lose your job, lose your house. I mean, it was unbelievable.

SPEAKER_03 6:59

Oh, they were going to be cues, you wouldn't have enough medicine, everyone would die because there wouldn't be any prescriptions.

SPEAKER_08 7:04

Super gonorrhea. Oh yes, they told us we'd all get super gonerrhea. Because the drug to treat it came from Germany and therefore they've done it. But you know, everything that's happened in the last since May the 7th. So May the 7th, we wipe out Labor in all the Brexit voting northern Midlands. And it's still the aftershocks of the earthquake are still going through the system. The two parties have never really managed to adjust to it.

SPEAKER_02 7:29

That same day, Labor MP Darren Jones joined Wes Streeting in ruling himself out of any challenge to Andy Burnham, making a coronation even more likely. However, a new Ugov poll found that 48% of voters believed there should be a general election if Burnham became Prime Minister, while only 35% did not.

SPEAKER_08 7:50

I think I'm in the right place on this. I think I'm in the right place on this. Have you seen the Kenby staff the last couple of days? Weird. That they're now fighting for centre. They're actually getting very worried about losses to the Lyd Dems in Surrey, Hampshire, Berkshire, Dorset, Devon. They're terrified of that. So it's almost a strategy of holding on to what you've got. Do you see what I mean?

SPEAKER_02 8:16

Before he took to the stage, I asked Nigel about the seismic events of the last few days. Looks like it might be a coronation for Burma.

SPEAKER_08 8:24

Yeah, bad. Really bad. I mean he wasn't elected on the 2024 manifesto. We've no idea what he actually stands for. The only way we get any clue of what he's going to do is if there is a contest. And then for a debate. Just to go straight into a coronation, I mean, it just looks extraordinary. It's it's it's almost sort of a strange, peaceful coup. It's remarkable. Never seen anything like it.

SPEAKER_02 8:50

Do you think he can realistically get away without holding a general election, especially if he doesn't actually stand on the 2024 Labour manifesto?

SPEAKER_08 8:56

Well, I think that's the point. Is there is going to be no mandate for him whatsoever. So I'm pretty loud in my calls for a general election. Um the Tories don't want one either. And I just don't think it's acceptable for this game of musical chairs to go on in Downing Street. I think uh the country looks on and just shakes its head. So I I think I, you know, an election would be very popular.

SPEAKER_02 9:16

I saw a post from Andrew Neal, who's obviously a very respected journalist, and he was saying he understands that Burnham had asked Starmer to delay his resignation to give him a bit more time to sort of figure out what he was wanting to do. I mean, the man's had no end of time to figure out what he's doing.

SPEAKER_08 9:32

And it's not how we do things. Normally in this country, the delivery vans at the front of number 10 Downing Street and the removal trucks at the back, and it's all done within 24 hours. So it's unprecedented in every way, but clearly he's not ready.

SPEAKER_02 9:45

Do you want a word just on why you're speaking here today?

SPEAKER_08 9:48

We've been invited. I came to spoke at this event last year, and it seems to be attracting a really interesting international crowd, um, and also quite a lot of young people, well organized, good people behind it. Um, and it's interesting the sort of ethos of this is actually our Judeo-Christian culture and roots matter that underpins much of what ARK is, which, as you know, is very much in line with where I've been for some years.

SPEAKER_02 10:14

And I'm gonna go and speak to some of the participants and see what they think about you know what's what's taking place in Britain at the moment with Andy Burnham as well. And it's all about citizen participation in politics as well, isn't it?

SPEAKER_08 10:25

Yeah, oh, big time. And it's and but but this process that we're going through with Labour is as if the citizens don't matter.

SPEAKER_02 10:31

As Nigel prepared to go on, an extraordinary coincidence occurred. The photographer who'd captured that famous image of him on the morning of the Brexit result was backstage.

SPEAKER_04 10:41

Did you shoot that? So I used to work for Boris. Oh wow. He took this picture of me ten years ago. When we came in the building, yes. Wow. I worked for Boris. Well, I went in number 10. I did four Cameron Boris. Four in the morning. Made the last edition of the mail on the front. I remember it. It was yeah, they had a 5am edition. That's right. That's what it was. Yeah. That's coming out. And then we went over to um Brexit HQ. I remember Father Fucking Boris watching Cameron resigned. And gun. And they regretted it. I can't comment on that. But yeah, well, you were right in the middle of it all. Yeah, well, I did. Cameron May Boris is in number 10. Liz is a role of film, but yeah.

SPEAKER_02 11:36

Once on stage, Nigel was interviewed by Baroness Stroud.

SPEAKER_00 11:40

You have spoken about the importance of this cultural moment, of this civilizational moment. Why do you think we need to defend Western civilization today?

SPEAKER_08 11:53

I I think that what we developed in Western civilization and the way in which we developed it over centuries to become democratic, where we had the right to choose our leaders, to fire our leaders, has produced the best civilization that humanity has managed. In the two million years it's been around, and it seems to me that's something worth fighting for and worth and worth defending. And the extent to which Western leaders over the last few decades have lost sight of this. Uh almost don't care. I mean it was interesting, wasn't it? It was it was Alistair Campbell in the late 90s, we don't do God. Yeah, we don't do God and the promotion of every other culture and every other religion to kids at school.

SPEAKER_06 12:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 12:41

But no fundamental teaching of what we are and why what we've created is is is has really been so wonderful. So yeah, no, I I I I think I think we're in real danger.

SPEAKER_02 12:52

Afterwards, many delegates told me that they were worried about the current state of UK politics.

SPEAKER_11 12:57

It has been interesting to hear here how many times you have been changing your prime minister during the last decade or so.

SPEAKER_02 13:05

It's gonna be like seven times now.

SPEAKER_13 13:07

It's crazy. Well, I think it's very sad for the UK that's just utterly chaotic. It's another prime minister that's disappeared. Uh I doubt that Andy Burnham's gonna be any different as soon as he gets in there. And he'll just uh preside over more of the same.

SPEAKER_02 13:21

Do you think it would be right for Burnham to become Prime Minister and then not hold a general election?

SPEAKER_13 13:26

I think it'd be very hypocritical considering how many Labour Party capital ministers have to come up with the same thing when it was happening to the Tories. I mean, look at the number of statements from Angela Rayner demanding to have an election. Well, what's changed now?

SPEAKER_01 13:38

In the long term, I think a lot of people will be disappointed not to have any say in this, that it looks like it will be done and dusted inside the Labour Party, and so I think it's disappointing that there's not a wider, more open discussion, and I I I suspect people will say that in the weeks to come, but maybe some challenges will emerge.

SPEAKER_09 14:00

It feels like the beginning of um social tensions which are getting worse and worse because I see the inability or the unwillingness of the UK governments to actually take the actions that are necessary.

SPEAKER_10 14:17

If we were in Bulgaria, you will have new elections in a few months, as we did. We are in political crisis in Bulgaria, so I guess people should stand up, and if they don't want this Prime Minister to be in charge right now, then there should be voted a new one.

SPEAKER_02 14:35

Hello. If you're enjoying the show, please like, subscribe, and hit the notification bell so you never miss an episode. Leave us a five-star review and a comment too. On Thursday, I tagged along with Reform UK's Shadow Chancellor Robert Genrick as he walked from ReformHQ to the QE2 Centre, where he'd been asked to address the leading lights of business at the British Chambers of Commerce Global Annual Conference.

SPEAKER_03 15:02

We're off to meet the British Chamber of Commerce, which is one of the groups that represents businesses all over the country, uh, particularly ones which you might say are more in the real economy, like industry, small, medium-sized businesses. And I'm going along to put a reforms case. They've had Rachel Reeves this morning, which was not entirely successful as far as I can tell. Uh she was asked by Sophie Ridge, the journalist, what tips she has for her successor, and after a lot of umming and aring, she said that she doesn't think anyone would take advice from her. Which was a rare moment of honesty from Rachel from Rachel Reeves, exactly. Um, and then there's uh there's the Tories and um Ed Davy, and then after me there's Zach Palansky.

SPEAKER_02 15:57

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 15:57

So that will be interesting. See what I've absolutely no idea. Um but we're we're gonna set out what reform wants to do to get the economy going again. Are you enjoying your brief? It's very exciting because I I believe in my heart that although the country is in a mess, we can turn this around. And while some of the challenges facing the country may take a generation to fix some of the social and cultural damage that's been done by mass migration, for example, there are examples elsewhere in the world where governments have been able to come in with a very clear sense of mission, a proper plan, good people, and turn around economies quite fast. It's what's called catch-up growth where all of that uh economic activity, all the dynamism that's been pent up like a kind of caged tiger is suddenly let out, and everybody gets out there, creates businesses, employs people, spends money in the shops, gets going again. And I think that's what a reform government can do.

SPEAKER_02 17:01

And of course, by speaking to the business community, the idea is that you are gaining their confidence ahead of reform assuming government.

SPEAKER_03 17:10

That's right. It's very important to reassure people because look, they've been badly burnt by Rachel Reeves and Labour, and they will be naturally skeptical. We're also a new political party, so I understand why people want to really get to grips with what we what we would do, and so there's a job to do to reassure people, um, but you know, be in no doubt, we're we're gonna be radical. People want real change, and that is from working people right the way up to the bosses in these big businesses. People know that the economy is in a mess and needs serious radical change, and so I want to set that out and hopefully excite people that a reform government is not going to be the status quo, uh, which has failed for the last 20 or 30 years, but it's gonna bring about the revival that our economy has been crying out for. Fresh thinking. Exactly, exactly.

SPEAKER_02 18:11

Do you get much of a response from people when you're walking down the street? Like much uh next welcome or unwelcome interaction.

SPEAKER_03 18:18

It's a bit of both, um, but mostly positive. Yeah. Uh in fact, almost always positive actually. You occasionally get, you know, some some haters.

SPEAKER_02 18:28

Then people come up to you with sort of clever ideas and things like that.

SPEAKER_03 18:31

They do, they do. The main thing people actually just come up to me is to say keep going. Yeah. You know, you get cabbies, you get people, you know, workmen, people on the street. It tends to be like working people. Okay. And they just say the same thing that we would, that country that they love is in peril, keep going. Yeah. And that they need reform. Yeah. They also say get that we won't get labour out, you know. It's a big responsibility being Prime Minister, it's the ultimate responsibility. And I think some of these people they craved it for its own thing. They want they'll enjoy the status, but they had they really had no idea what they wanted to do with it. That's what I find. It seemed to be eaten up by by the job and became diminished. But I find it astonishing that someone who, you know, dreamt of this when they're a teenager had no understanding of what they wanted to use this awesome power to do.

SPEAKER_02 19:31

If you told a general, you know, member of the public you're gonna we're gonna give you 10 million pounds in six months, right? They would have a list of what am I gonna do with this? I'm gonna create a maybe I'm gonna create a fund for my kids for college, university, first calf, marriage, you know, the wedding, all that kind of stuff. They'd work it all out. That's right, that's right.

SPEAKER_03 19:51

But he was aspiring to the highest office in this country. Well, but Stalmer wasn't alone. In that sense, he was in the same tradition as a lot of our recent prime ministers. The country's got a few very big problems, and they they just haven't really had a plan as to how to grapple with them, and so they've split the difference, they've tried to paper over the cracks, and as a result of that we found ourselves where we are, and that's not good enough. That's why reform exists, because we're not prepared just to split the difference. We actually want to take on those challenges and fix them once and for all, or else we just decline inexorably as a country, which is where we are at the moment.

SPEAKER_02 20:35

During his speech, Rob explained how the chaos and failure of Keir Starmer's government had been the symptom of a much greater disease.

SPEAKER_03 20:44

We've had seven Prime Ministers and eight chancellors in ten years, and no business could survive, let alone thrive, with such a rapid turnover in CEOs or CFOs. So we're going to have employers and national insurance contributions or British workers. We're going to raise the V A D threshold to a hundred and fifty thousand. We're going to do not only have that rate of the V A Didn't have a good job.

SPEAKER_02 22:00

Speak to a man who'd been at the very heart of the referendum campaign.

SPEAKER_15 22:03

I set up a magazine in Brussels called The Sprout. I was the private eye correspondent in Brussels. When Farage came to me in the pub one day and said, You take the piss, you're a Eurosceptic, you're a journalist, will you work for me and do that? And I said yes.

SPEAKER_02 22:14

Duane Tola is the former head of communications for the Brexit party and now sits on the board of Reform UK. How did you feel approaching the date of the referendum, the polling day?

SPEAKER_15 22:26

Oh. It had been a whirlwind, obviously. Um it was astonishing we managed to uh bounce Cameron into a referendum in the first place. We found that the official leave campaign were panty waste. Uh they wouldn't go, they wouldn't go, oh, let's wait for Dave to come back from Brussels, and that's going to be May. We've only got a month to fight an election. Well, referendum, don't be dark, we've got to get going, get moving. Um, this sort of stuff. Um then there was the Battle of the Thames, which was possibly the most bonkers day of campaigning anybody has ever done, been involved in, or seen. However, that moment where Bob Geldof turned up and flicked his V's at Nigel, and I was able to suggest to the press he was doing it to the fisherman, I think gave us five points. Because it encapsulated everything that um that we were campaigning on, the arrogance, the contempt of the the rich and famous for the ordinary hard-moking men and women of the country. Um and then Joe Cox was murdered. Yeah. Uh and that rather took the wind out of everybody's sails. Uh and the Remain Lot tried their darnedest to pin that on us. Um on the same day the famous Turning Boat poster was put out, and though there was no fuss in the morning, as soon as the news that Joe Cox had been murdered came through, they tried to pin her murder on that poster and the remain the leave campaign. So it became well, everybody was working their socks off and running around like blue ass flies, um, and doing what we could do. And then come the day itself and go down to Kent uh for opening of polls, and I've got photographs of Nigel before going to vote. This is not a man who thinks he's won. Really? Absolutely not. Like a show. Um but it's it's like a like in the theatre, you you come off the the backs and you go on stage and you slap on your smiley face, you go out there, and there's the world's media, the cameras, the snappers, and all the rest of it, and he goes in and votes um with a big grin on his face.

SPEAKER_02 24:34

The show must go on.

SPEAKER_15 24:36

The show went on. Um and we went and had tea uh in a nice little pub that I think's closed now, um, and then made our way back into town. And there's not much you can do uh on the day of voting, and that you've got Elcom rules about not being able to do politics anyhow. Uh so you're sitting around and twiddling and worrying and worrying and worrying, and speaking to people up and down the country and how they feel it's going, and the polling stations, da da da da da da da and all that. Um and then well, we knew we knew that some of the big hedgies had done some massive exit polls that spent 100 grand, 200,000 on big exit polls. Yeah. So one of the things I was watching was the pound. And around about 2 30 in the afternoon, there was this weird spike because all the polling, all the betting markets were going romaine. Everything was going remain. And as that was happening, the pound was going up. And then mid-afternoon there was this it dropped significantly, but only for a very short while. And I was phoning around the village journey saying, Look, look at that, look at that, look at that, look at that, look, look, look. That's the hedge fund exit poll. They know we've won. We they know Leaves won.

SPEAKER_06 25:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_15 25:44

And then within half an hour, that blip had gone.

SPEAKER_06 25:48

Right.

SPEAKER_15 25:48

As the betting markets and the polling all went the other way. And so within an hour I'd forgotten about it. It's just there was so much going on. Um, and then we had the entertaining business of well, there was a party not far from here, just off the horse ferry road, where one of the party uh people, leaf.eu people, was hosting a party. And I was walking towards that, and there was another party going on in Milbang Tower, the top of Milbang Tower. Uh that was the that was the formal Leaf.eu party. Aaron had got the four tops or something, and all sorts of stuff, and all the hacks were upstairs here. Um but we had the sort of private party in somebody's house about 200 yards away. And as I walked to the door, polls closed at 10, and at about I got there about ten oh one. But between ten and ten oh one, my phone exploded.

SPEAKER_06 26:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_15 26:42

Because Darren McCaffrey on I think it was Sky had announced that Nigel had said that he thought Romain had shaded it.

SPEAKER_02 26:52

I remember this.

SPEAKER_15 26:53

And now he'd spoken to Darren at 8, but of course it couldn't be reported because of reporting restrictions. And so my what my phone exploded. Every journalist on the planet's into a phone then at that minute. Um, what's going on? Um he hadn't conceded, but that's how it was sold.

SPEAKER_06 27:10

Right.

SPEAKER_15 27:10

Farage has conceded. No, he said, according to the polls and according to the Beckett market betting markets, it looks like they might have shaded it.

unknown 27:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_15 27:18

However, this was seen as a concession. The markets moved by, I think the pound lost or gain gained 2%. All the hedgy is just cleaned up. But and then he was accused of saying that to get his friends in the hedge fund market lots of money. It was rubbish. Yeah. Absolutely rubbish. It was just he was just looking at the real reality as it was on the ground. But anyhow, we had that party and it was great fun. And then we came here, and Aaron Banks was annoyed because we were late. And so therefore the banded book had done deemed that stuff and all the rest of it. Um, and then we were upstairs, and then the first results came through. Now I had written a what happens if we lose press release? Yeah. I had not written a what happens if we win press release.

SPEAKER_02 28:00

Oh, really? So you you weren't massively confident.

SPEAKER_15 28:04

I'd forgotten what happened in the afternoon.

SPEAKER_06 28:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_15 28:07

And then that result came through. Newcastle came through. We were supposed to lose Newcastle by about eight points, and we lost it by two. And then a quarter of an hour, ten minutes later, Sunderland came through. We were supposed to win that by two points, we won it by ten or more. And after those two results, we knew. Well, the rest literally is history.

SPEAKER_04 28:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_15 28:24

The rest is history. Nigel uh made we decide, I think there's only a button. Very few things had come in by then, but the numbers were, you couldn't gain say the numbers. We were going to win. Preston came in, we won it. Blackburn came in, we won it. And it's just, okay, we've done this. Yeah. Oh my goodly aren't. Good lord. And then we have the press conference here in Milbank Tower upstairs. Absolute chaos. The media pack was is just febrile. It's like teeming, running around in circles. Nigel does his a new dawn is breaking over his.

SPEAKER_06 28:57

Daddy Dream.

SPEAKER_15 28:58

All that stuff. We are. Maybe we've been celebrating. Maybe there's been some celebration going on. And the the the voter, not the official, they did nothing. So we went downstairs, and there's photographs on the front page of every newspaper for the next day of Nigel coming out. For the first time as a press offer, the first time in my life, I pushed myself to the front. Because I thought, well, I've been working this feat for God knows how many years. For the first time, I want to be seen as I want to be part of that rather than always hiding in the background. And so a couple of the front pages up there on the front page with just by Nigel. But the Freddie Barclay had invited us to the Ritz for breakfast. It's a celebration of breakfast. So we all go up to the Ritz. Uh and this is dumb o'clock in the morning, but it's a beautiful day. I knew dawn was in breaking. I've got a I jumped off the bus, or got jumped off the taxi out of the taxi, ran onto Lambethbridge, and took a photograph of the dawn breaking over Westminster. So I have that photograph.

SPEAKER_06 29:58

Fantastic.

SPEAKER_15 29:59

So we went up and there was a there was a sort of private room for breakfast where he gave us kiffers and champagne for breakfast. And that was the one sort of room, and then next door was all the staff, they were also getting kiffers and champagne. And then from there, we made our way to College Green for the big press conference at College Green, where Nigel calls for Cameron to go and so on and so forth. And and that basically was it. And then I think some of us moved from College Green to the Mog. And by around about eight, nine o'clock that evening, I started to make my way home.

SPEAKER_12 30:37

Don't remember much of the.

SPEAKER_15 30:38

Well, I I promised to go into the I lived next door to a pub called the Lord Nelson on the Orkent Road, and I'm wrecked, and I haven't slept for 48 hours, and I must have been drinking for 30 of them. So I got there, opened the door, and poked poked my head in. A huge cheer. Now, that constituency is the most romaine constituency in the country, pretty well. Um, old Bermansey, and yet this pub was not a Romaine pub. It was a it was a mill pub. Uh massive cheer. Can I buy you a drink? And I just went, no. And crawled home, and that that was the rest of my day. Wow.

SPEAKER_02 31:17

When you think about that speech that Nigel gave, the the sort of dare to dream moment and all was that written, was that just off the cuff?

SPEAKER_15 31:26

He never writes anything, does he? Nigel's speeches, I mean you're though he's doing a he's much more formalised now, but in the in the past you'd get journalists say, he's got a big speech tomorrow morning. Can you send us a no? Why not? Because I've no idea what he's gonna say. I can't give you a pre-brief of the speech, a pre-briefing something we didn't do. And he'd normally write he'd think about it. Of course he would. Um but normally can I see the notes? And there's four words on a piece of paper for a 40-minute speech. So the I I d I don't think that was prepared. I am sure he had considered during the day at some point, what if, and he will have considered it, because he's no he's not an idiot. Um and these things I he is very much off the cuff, he is very much of the moment, but that is based on a considerable amount of thinking pre-doing the event. Yeah. Can you imagine you've been working for 30, 25 years and you've just done it? What's going through your head? How can you think straight when that's all going on? But that speech, I think it was next temporary, but it wouldn't surprise me if he had more gained in his head the previous two days.

SPEAKER_02 32:36

Just finally, then, um, when you look back on it ten years ago, what's your perspective on on how it's gone since then? Obviously, we had the May government and and Johnson.

SPEAKER_15 32:47

I mean, there was that horrible moment in, I think, October 18 when Nigel and I had a drink and he just said we're gonna have to do it again, aren't we? We thought we'd done it. The big mistake that Nigel made, and I certainly made, um, and he's mentioned it, is that we thought we thought our politicians were better than continental politicians. We knew that on the continent, when they have a referendum and it goes the wrong way, they get another say. They get another go until they go the right way. We knew that they overturn democratic decisions in order to go the right way and stay in Europe and stay Europe. We thought our politicians were better. We literally thought, you know what, if this country votes to leave, it doesn't matter if the politicians wanted to stay. They would do what they're told because they're British politicians and they're good people. Well, how wrong were we? That was the biggest disillusion.

SPEAKER_06 33:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_15 33:36

Um, that our politicians did not take the instructions. They felt, they felt that they were elected, or not elected in the House of Lords case, to protect people from their own decisions, to roll about to know better, to be morally better, to be more intelligent, to be just generally better, and to protect us from our democratic instincts, because our democratic instincts were just wrong. Um and so, and this is what I fear for uh when a reformed government comes in, is the same people will feel that it is their job and duty to block the results of the democratic instincts of this country because they are bad things, and those those people are good people, and therefore good people should make the decisions no matter what the country says. And when you see what happened, and when you see that our negotiators went into the room thinking, how do we mitigate the disaster of Brexit rather than how do we take the opportunities of Brexit? Then of course the negotiations were done very badly. Um we we saw that film of the the the EU negotiating team laughing at us because they knew they'd got our negotiators on the hop because our negotiators would not leave the room. Whatever the decision was, they had made it clear they would not leave. So how do you ever win how would you ever do a good negotiation when the other side knows you will bow in the end?

SPEAKER_02 34:59

And then to switch that around and say that everything that didn't get negotiated properly was the fault of Nigel or that Nigel kind of walked away.

SPEAKER_06 35:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_15 35:08

He had huge experience of Brussels and the European Parliament, the people that they were negotiating with. He knew them, and what's more, in many cases, he got on with them because he's that sort of bloke. Um and they rejected it, Ray rejected it. Well, their problem. Because we're going to change the world.

SPEAKER_02 35:24

That seems like a brilliant place to end it. Thank you so much. No problem. The Reform UK podcast was produced and presented by me, Ray Addison. Thanks to Nigel, Rob, Richard, Gawain, Zia, and of course, most importantly, you for listening. Today, Reform announced our fantastic candidate to replace Andy Burnham as Mayor of Greater Manchester. You can find out more about Cyan Astley on our YouTube page, and please show your support by leaving a comment. If you'd like to help Reform demand the general election that the British people deserve, please consider joining the party. You can find all the details at reformparty.uk. And if you'd like to chat with other listeners about the show, you can join the Reform UK podcast community on Facebook. We'll be back on Monday. Goodbye.