Shelby the Psychic Attorney

In this episode I interview a dear lawyer friend of my mother's who, after over 30 years, randomly and serendipitously mentioned to my mother that she can see the future. As per her request for anonymity I have changed her name and obscured her face.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

The first time I recorded I was wearing like a Leon Trotsky t-shirt and no makeup and and now I tried to like put on some makeup and now I look like the horror of Babylon. So I've Yeah, I knew her. I we're the same generation. So I've gotta find a happy medium. Look fine. Oh, I feel like the Horror of Babylon.

SPEAKER_01 0:19

Oh, I put the name I want to use on there. Shelby, okay. Yep, that's the one I used when I was a psychic friend.

SPEAKER_00 0:25

No kidding. Alright, so um welcome back to Cats Never Die, our podcast about all things um psychic. I don't have a tagline yet, but um I am here with Elias Shelby, who is a very close friend of my mother's, and I just learned recently, after um 33 years of my life, that Shelby uh is psychic. Can you just kind of tell us about how you first discovered that about yourself? Yes, I mean me.

SPEAKER_01 0:50

I guess I've kind of always known. Um I think the first um actual recollection I have was um back in the day in the 60s, we used to hold neighborhood um fundraisers for muscular dystrophy, and somehow I came to be the um the the fortune teller, the gypsy. And um there's a uh I have a a photo that was in the newspaper at the time of me in a turban and a wild gypsy-looking costume with a crystal ball. And I remember telling fortunes and several people saying excuse me, saying, wow, that's accurate. And then um and then I would also read friends' palms, and uh I somehow had a deck of tarot cards, and people would tell me I was pretty accurate, and so I guess that's it.

SPEAKER_00 1:36

When and why did you get into um professional psych psyching?

SPEAKER_01 1:41

Well, um I my my mother mentioned to me uh because I was I was um early in my career, in my professional career, and um I was mentioning that I felt like I had a lot of free time because I don't sleep well. And I said, yeah, I just wish there was something I could do in the middle of the night. And she said she had a friend that was a psychic friend. And uh would I like to uh her to ask her how she got involved with it? And I don't know, my mother and I had never really talked about the whole psychic thing, but um I interviewed for it and um then I became a psychic friend.

SPEAKER_00 2:16

So your mom didn't realize you had any psychic connection, she just offered that as a I I think she just offered it.

SPEAKER_01 2:21

We'd never really discussed it. I knew my grandmother had some psychic abilities, my mother's mother.

SPEAKER_00 2:26

That was um that was gonna be my next question. Do you feel like it runs in the family? Oh, absolutely. Yeah. Can you tell us a little bit about your family's psychic connections?

SPEAKER_01 2:33

My grandmother never really talked about it a whole lot, and I basically heard it from other people, but she uh she had the beyond the grave uh, you know, psychic abilities. She seemed to get communications from um deceased close friends or family members, and it really upset her. It frightened her. Um and my mother never mentioned having any abilities. However, after my mother's death, two uh close friends of hers and mine uh told me that she reached out to them in dreams with messages to me. And they both asked her why she didn't communicate with me, and she said she knew I wouldn't listen to her, but I might listen to them. Which was probably more accurate.

SPEAKER_00 3:18

Wait, so do you know what the the nature of the of the mediumship messages were? Like in in dreams, or would people appear? Would she just hear voices or just she would appear.

SPEAKER_01 3:26

She would appear, and uh I was I have a little bit of a warped sense of humor, and I said, Well, were there flames around her? Uh and they said, No, no, no. There was an aura of light. And I said, Are you sure she was deceased? They said, Oh yeah, yeah. She was coming from heaven or whatever beyond. And um at the time, I I guess I was able to connect it with what she was talking about. Um, my own encounters with psychics where I've been to three psychics in my life. And the first one I went to was many years ago. I would say, gosh, probably 40 years or more. And uh he was a pretty well-known psychic that traveled around the country and you made appointments with him. And he kept saying, There's something interesting, there's something connected with your blood. There's something really important that you need to know about with your blood. No idea what he was talking about. I figured I had some dire disease that was going to come out. And, you know, I thought of I had thought about it three years, but never really connected with it. And then um a few days after my mother died, I found out that uh I had been adopted by the man I thought was my father. And so that was the blood connection, apparently. And my mother was telling these friends to tell me to she wouldn't tell them what it was about, but she said, Leave it alone. Tell her not to stop asking questions and leave it alone, because I was searching for my biological father or his family. And she wanted me to leave it alone.

SPEAKER_00 4:49

Yeah. Did you ever find him or did you leave it alone?

SPEAKER_01 4:52

Well, he was deceased, but I actually did find that I had some siblings out there, some half siblings, who didn't know about me. Um and I I met a couple of them. And um Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:05

Were they smart like you? Did you get that from your dad?

SPEAKER_01 5:09

Uh they each had their own special abilities. Um I often tease that I knew the first one um had to be excuse me, had to be a sibling because I had her uh take a DNA test and uh she failed the test three times, and I said, Well that's got to be my sister because she didn't have any sense. But um because all you have to do is spit in a stupid tube, you know, and I I sent her three different tests. But at any rate, uh yeah, uh no, you know, one of them is an author and one of them is a musician, um, and another one runs a very successful business. And so I ended up meeting two of them, and um we really connected very, very closely on the phone, but then when we met in person, they acted rather peculiarly afterwards, and I guess come to find out I look a great deal like our father, and they all looked like their mother, and it it really bothered them because my uh biological father was married to their mother, but not to mine. And so uh Yeah. Anyways, I mean it was uh uh Interesting. Who knows? But um, you know, I've done the whole DNA background thing.

SPEAKER_00 6:13

So what about the two other times you saw psychics?

SPEAKER_01 6:15

That I saw psychics? You said you um those were less dramatic. Uh they they did provide information, but um nothing, you know, nothing as dramatic as that. Do you have any good stories from your time as a as a phone psychic? Yeah, some of them were pretty interesting, I think. Um and I I there were a couple of interesting times in person too that were were interesting, but um on the phone I can remember one time that I uh I said to someone, I wow, you know, I don't usually say this because I don't like to make these type of predictions, but I I see a a a large, large uh winning around you, a large um monetary thing. And she says, you know, uh the reason I'm calling is because last week I I won a lottery and it was, you know, tens of thousands of dollars, not hundreds, but tens. And then another time a woman was looking for um a wallet, and I said, you know, I I I keep getting this visual of a uh of a floral uh chair, large chair, a small love seat. And she said, Well, just a minute, and uh these are the days before um cell phones. And uh but she was able to reach and she pulled cushions off of this chair, and she said, Oh my gosh, it's wedged, you know, down in this chair, which was kind of fun.

SPEAKER_00 7:36

Um So that so people would call with specific questions, uh or would they just say, What do you what do you see for me?

SPEAKER_01 7:43

Well she obviously wanted to find a wallet, but yeah, usually they would call because they wanted some information about something, you know, a love interest or a job or something like that. But sometimes they just said, you know, I just feel the need, you know, tell me something.

SPEAKER_00 7:58

And uh so there was that. Did you ever d just not get anything and have to make something up to do your job? There's usually something.

SPEAKER_01 8:07

You know, it might be it might be relatively insignificant, it might be something bigger. Um but usually I could get something. I I would just, you know, say, start talking, start telling me about yourself. And then almost immediately within a sentence or two, you know, something would come.

SPEAKER_00 8:23

So I have heard from a lot of uh various types of practitioners that they can get energy over the phone or video or sometimes just by thinking about the person.

SPEAKER_01 8:34

I but we had spoken last week and you said something about it being harder when you're not in m in person, or maybe for me it's a little easier in person, but it's just kind of um I don't know if energy is the right word. It's just almost like if you mention a person's name, then you get a visual in their head, you know, of that person if you thought of a family member. It's it's very similar to that.

SPEAKER_00 8:57

Okay, so it would be easier for you to read me looking at me like this than when we were just talking on the phone? No, in person isn't yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_01 9:07

I'm really good with palms and I'm really good with uh the uh tarot and and even a regular deck of cards, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:14

How do you read with a regular deck of cards?

SPEAKER_01 9:16

Uh they each have sort of an assigned meaning. Usually the aces, but not always the aces. Um but they're just different cards that have different meanings. They they sort of equate with tarot cards. If you've ever seen a deck of tarot cards, they are similar. Woo-hoo. They're many of them are sort of um have similar symbols to uh a regular deck of cards, you know, like the spades and diamonds and clubs and things. So if you see diamonds, it generally does have something to do with property values or or you know, I hate to say money, but that kind of thing. Uh hearts, of course, love. And um spades is usually not good. You know, it's it's usually uh death, but I don't I don't er I've never told anybody, you know, about death or dying.

SPEAKER_00 10:02

But I know for well, yeah, but you do have a story about knowing someone was gonna die and then it happened.

SPEAKER_01 10:08

Yeah, I had a uh co-worker and it was a day that we were just sitting around and I and somebody somebody just said Vicky just always you know, this person always seems to know. And so I I uh read his poem and I I looked at the poem and I just knew that the uh lifeline was very short. And uh at the time the person was in their you know, late 20s, and I thought, oh my goodness, this is you know, not gonna and I I later commented to a friend slash co-worker that I didn't think he was gonna live past his 30s, and uh sure enough he had a heart attack and died in his 30s. And uh that was uh sort of starting. I what I told him was that his life was gonna take a vastly uh divergent course in his 30s.

SPEAKER_00 10:55

It was divergent, it was divergent, nothing is not divergent.

SPEAKER_01 11:00

But he he got married a few months before he uh he passed away, and he told me that he remembered that, you know, when he was trying to decide to get married. So he he did get married uh less than a year before he died. And uh he said he he attributed it in part to remembering my message.

SPEAKER_00 11:16

Oh goodness, but at least his wife inherited something, so um so you said uh just in particular you are good at n knowing when people are gonna die. That's like one of your special things, which sounds horrible to me. But yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:34

It is and it isn't. It's just I just know. Um I uh particularly I I I don't really know why it is. It's not connected particularly with cancer, but uh as soon as I hear that somebody has a dire illness, I just immediately know this is going to end well or this is not gonna end well. And uh there have been some people who have had relatively minor uh types of cancer that are normally survivable, that I have just immediately known this is not gonna end well and it didn't. And then there are others that had pretty dire diagnoses that did not appear survivable and they did, when I just knew they would. And I've never I've never told them or anyone else. It's just an awareness, and it's usually excuse me, it's usually within um you know two or three years.

SPEAKER_00 12:27

And do you have to like engage with the question? Think about it specifically, or when you see a person, will you say, Oh, they're gonna die in two years, or they're gonna live to be 105, or just have that information kind of pop up?

SPEAKER_01 12:39

No, usually, well, nobody ever says, you know, am I going to die? But if you told me, for instance, that you were diagnosed with something, yeah, I would immediately know. I just say the either the end I I would know to myself, either this is going to end well or this is not gonna end well.

SPEAKER_00 12:54

But and uh don't answer this question, which he won't obviously, but if I asked you, do you know now when I do have an idea of about when I'm when I'm gonna die? No diagnosis. Do you know me? All right, I look good.

SPEAKER_01 13:04

No, I just it's just if they tell me something about themselves, I have X, I would think and it's not necessarily just uh death, but if you told me I have X illness, I I either like I say I either get this feeling, either it's gonna end well or it's not gonna end well. That it's like this just this message this is gonna end well, this is not gonna end well, which sounds a little weird, but that's kind of it. And so when when it's something that is a serious diagnosis, um and it's not gonna end well, that usually you know pretty well says they're not gonna be around much longer. Um, but it could be something minor, um, I don't know, eczema or something. And I can say this is gonna end well, it's not gonna end well, you know, and that doesn't mean you're gonna die from it, but it means you're not gonna recover from it or you're gonna be strong with it.

SPEAKER_00 13:45

You're gonna be ugly for a while.

unknown 13:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:47

Um this is I just so so this is what this is one of my weirder tarot decks. It's called Monchiati or something. It's like Florentine. And it's got like horoscope cards, and I don't know what the heck to do with it. It did not come with a manual, but I it's like can only I mean I try to I try to read for myself, but I can only do it when I'm like reading from a book, obviously, and I don't I don't know how to do it.

SPEAKER_01 14:06

I've never been able to I've never been able to read or diagnose for myself ever, ever. I can do it for other people, but I can't do it for myself.

SPEAKER_00 14:13

Oh, that's so interesting. I mean I'm for I'm I'm I I'd probably do it with a small degree of accuracy. I mean, certainly I haven't predicted anything big yet. I I have tried once or twice, but no. Doesn't seem to exist for myself. Interesting. Um so do d you don't ever get messages from dead people. That's not a thing that happens to you.

SPEAKER_01 14:37

I I I have not. I've never tried because I I know it it it sounds a little peculiar because I'm pretty fearless, but uh I just know how how very upset my grandmother was by it, and I've just never I thought if I ever opened that door, I might not be able to close it, and I don't want to open the door.

SPEAKER_00 14:55

But you think you could you could there's a door to open.

SPEAKER_01 14:58

It's not just I think probably probably is. It's just one I've I don't open. It's just that's just information I don't feel that I should have for some reason.

SPEAKER_00 15:10

Well listen, Shelby, I'll tell you, I'm really frustrated because it feels like everybody I talk to has some ability or some experience, and they say, I don't want to deal with it, or like, you know, I don't want to get spirits following me, or I don't want to know this, or I don't want to know that. And here I am trying everything under the sun just to have some sort of, you know, paranormal psychic experience and just not nothing. You know, I've got like crystals and sage and tarot and readings, and I don't know. I guess you guys don't feel lucky that you have um a gift. Right. But frustrating for me.

SPEAKER_01 15:44

Um well it's not to say you might not acquire it at some point in time, but um it just uh my only caution is beware because you might be uh trying to contact one entity, but the next thing you know you're gonna be h hearing from all kinds of entities. And for instance, if you have family members, as most of us do, that have had horrific deaths.

SPEAKER_00 16:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 16:09

Um, for instance, someone who had um uh family members that were in the Holocaust. In my case, I have had three family members who've died from um very sudden, very painful deaths. Um I'm not sure I would want to to know that. Uh because it might it might be a memory, we all have memories that we would love to get rid of and we can't.

SPEAKER_02 16:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 16:34

And um uh that's my feelings. And so I'm more worried about the people who've had horrific deaths. And the people my grandmother was hearing from all had pretty horrific deaths. You know, they didn't die naturally in their sleeps. They they died of sudden bizarre reasons reasons. I've had a lot of bizarre deaths in my family, and I don't necessarily think I'd want to know. Um And they might that might not be what they're telling, but that I and I don't know uh because my grandmother never told me. She just told me she saw them and she didn't want to see them, and she that's the only thing she said is I want to get away from them, I want to get away from them. I can't stay in this place. In particular, her husband, my grandfather died of a pretty horrific death, and uh I never heard what he said, but she said, I I can't, I I don't I don't want to. Which I knew she loved him very much, but she just did not want to know.

SPEAKER_00 17:27

I think she was afraid of hearing about this painful death, and I have a really good friend who says that she I mean she sleeps very badly and she says she just doesn't sleep because every time she sleeps, dead people come and give her messages to give to other people, and she just can't deal deal with it. See, that seems rather unpleasant to me. Yeah, I yeah, well, you know, uh eating grass is greener, etc. etc.

SPEAKER_01 17:50

But well, exactly. Exactly. You know, I mean I I I have a uh a grandson that is incredibly tall. Um and he looks like a basketball player, but he has absolutely no interest in basketball, which surprises a lot of people, but you know, he's not interested in basketball. Just because you're tall doesn't mean you have to play basketball.

SPEAKER_00 18:07

So I think I told you I started this whole spiritual journey that I'm on because my favorite cat was hit by a car and my brain kind of broke, and I just couldn't accept that she didn't exist anymore. So that has never happened to you? That you've like really wanted to communicate with someone or something, or you've always been confident in the idea that they still exist and that's comforting to you, or how do you feel about that? Death?

SPEAKER_01 18:33

I guess I think of it almost like in it it's not the same thing, but almost like they're just in a deep sleep and they don't want to be disturbed. And if they want to be disturbed, they'll let me know. Um, can I ask what it is you want to know about your cat?

SPEAKER_00 18:47

You want to know if cat's okay or the cat still loves you or Well initially I didn't want to know anything. I went because I I went from believing in absolutely nothing to actively trying to believe that there is something out there. And so um I I was I was trying to contact her, and then once I think I got through. I mean, there was one medium I spoke with that uh it was weirdly accurate enough. And then after that, though, honestly, was that that precipitated another crisis because I realized well like what now? Like I mean I'm not gonna like call her on the phone every day, like what you know, it's like what so what what did I think I was going to get out of that? And I just I'm I'm still not quite sure what the answer is, but I uh you know, I still talk to her and sing to her, but I don't have this idealized feeling that you know, she's like crouched next to me where when I sit down, you know.

SPEAKER_01 19:40

Uh a a favorite dog a number of years ago that um died of a sudden illness. And when I think of her, when I think of my grandmother, I get this feeling of immense love all over all over me from both of them, and that's the closest I will come to it. Um but it's just an immense feeling of love, of s of sadness that they're not with me, but immense love. And I'm satisfied with that. And I don't know whether it's their love for me or my love for them, or maybe it's mutual, but it's it's it's just a if you want to call it a connection. And it's comforting to me.

SPEAKER_00 20:15

Yeah, no, I feel profound emptiness when I think about her. I mean, I still cry most of the time. Yeah, and I guess fundamentally I was looking for a way to stop that. I mean, like, this whole now multi-years long campaign has just kind of been an extension of like the second phase of grief. Like, what is denial is the second phase, or you know, I just seven stages, yeah. Seven stages, yeah. I think this has just been like a really, really elaborate way of um denying that she's dead.

SPEAKER_01 20:49

Well, or it might have been a way of introducing you to this new line of of of uh discovery or contemplation.

SPEAKER_00 20:56

I have heard that from um other practitioners suggesting that perhaps her life's purpose was to introduce me to all this. That seems nuts though. That seems like very me centered, that somebody else's life purpose was for me to do something. Do you know what I mean? Like that doesn't make sense to me. It it does it see, it does to me.

SPEAKER_01 21:13

Okay. I think we're I think that I've always thought, even from a small child, that every contact we have with every other human being has some impact on that human being or or animal or whatever. And you know, I I want my impact to be good, but I've been a little nasty to a couple people along the way. And there may have been a reason for it. Um I've I've used a um I've used an example though that like if you know somebody that's a true asshole, I've never known anybody that I could say, boy, Sophia, you're a real asshole. And you go, Eureka, I had no idea. Thank you so much for telling me. That doesn't work. But uh, if I introduced them to new kinds, it was sort of like um I spent a lot of years dating, and every person I dated left me with, you know, maybe this one taught me to water ski. When I don't know how to swim, or this one taught me to rock climb when I have a fear of heights. We all get something from someone else, and it it you know, it doesn't necessarily have to be what we went into it for. So that may very well be. Um that wasn't her sole purpose, but that was her purpose for you.

SPEAKER_00 22:16

Just a thought. No, I know I I I mean we could keep talking about it, but I will start crying, and that's gonna make for difficult audio. So um Can I can I say what you do for a living? I don't have to. Yeah, but that's all right. Well, I mean, I so I if you change your mind, we cut it out. Um Shelby is um a very, very competent attorney, if not brilliant. This is um this is a very uh kind of fluid subject coming from a very concrete person, if that makes sense.

SPEAKER_01 22:46

Um well to that end, I will tell you then one more uh phone incident that happened, and I I usually my legal knowledge didn't get in the way of or didn't come into my psychic thing, but one day someone called and said, There was a card on my door from my parole officer. Is this a problem? And should I call them? I went, mm-hmm, yeah, yeah. Don't ignore that.

SPEAKER_00 23:08

You don't have to be psychic to know that.

SPEAKER_01 23:09

I mean that Yeah, I thought this is not anything I need to call them.

SPEAKER_00 23:15

That's so funny. Right.

SPEAKER_01 23:17

I've had some other experiences like um in reading palms, and that was in person. Uh another place that I worked, a co-worker asked me to read her palm, and she said, Can you tell many children I've had? And I was doing that with everybody, and um I said, Oh my goodness, you've uh I said, You've you you have three. And and uh there were a few other people in the room, and they went, No, she doesn't, she just has one. And she says, actually, I had twins that died shortly after birth. So I indicated three. And I would say with some people, I kind of can't tell. It's it's like it's like if I read it one way, you've got two, but if I read it another way, you've got five, and it turned out that they had foster children or adoptive children. And so it it was something that it depended on how you interpreted the how they how they meant the question, how I meant the answer. So it's all a matter of interpretation, like this guy that told me I had a blood issue, and I was like, what in the heck with that? Well, it turned out uh, you know, and and when I related back to it, I remember my father getting upset with me and um my mother when I asked them questions about, you know, I said, this doesn't make a whole lot of sense. The uh one of my children was doing a a a family tree that listed blood uh as part of the family tree. And I said, it something doesn't seem right here. The blood doesn't seem to match up. And they went, leave it alone.

unknown 24:33

Okay, no problem.

SPEAKER_01 24:35

You know, and and didn't I mean people asked me after I found out about the adoption, did I have a clue? And I said, you know, there were probably some clues, but I sure didn't pick up on them. You know, I thought my dad was my dad.

SPEAKER_00 24:45

I forget why he was gonna ask you this, but do you believe in past lives?

SPEAKER_01 24:49

Sometimes. Or at least past experiences uh that uh we're aware of. Kind of like um I've read books that I may not remember, but that something comes up and I think, oh, I've read that or I've experienced that.

SPEAKER_00 25:01

So yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:02

Like when you say sometimes, do you think you mean it's only some people or I think experiences that either we have forgotten from our childhood or that somehow we have knowledge with. I I sort of think of the universe as being um not a linear experience, that it's a you know, ongoing continuum. And so it may circle around, it may take centuries or millennium to do, but um, you know, we've all experienced a lot of things at some point in time that we wonder how do we do how have we done it? You know, and when you think about it, you see children who've come from very abusive, horrible, uh deprived childhoods that turn out to be really amazing people, and vice versa. You've seen people who came from, you know, amazing families that just turned into a grubworm. And so, you know, uh there's got to be some something there. And I do think that, for instance, babies' children are born with certain uh abilities or character traits that may or may not be connected, that sometimes don't seem remotely connected to their parents. And so is that part of this whole thing? I don't know that psychic is the word for it or past lives, but there's a there's a connection of all of us, and it's just where does that connection meet?

SPEAKER_00 26:14

I have always, since I was a child, just understood Shakespeare. I have memories of explaining it to my parents and at intermission, King Lear and people like gathering around to, and I don't I guess that's a thing.

SPEAKER_01 26:25

Where did it come from? Exactly. And so, you know.

SPEAKER_00 26:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:30

And that that may very well be it part of the way. I interpreted that as everybody else is is dumb. Well, and there there may be something to that.

SPEAKER_00 26:39

Right, that's always that's always what I told myself. Yeah. I also, and this might is probably nothing, but I'm like obsessed with Latin, like ancient Roman Latin, and I'm terrible at it. I have no affinity for it whatsoever, but I just I feel it in my bones. Uh but that might be because I was obsessed with John Adams as a child, and I know he studied Latin, and so I decided I want to study Latin, and that's you know, it's more explainable, but um I don't know, but I've always been terrible, terrible at mathematics.

SPEAKER_01 27:04

I mean, I can do it, but it's it's almost painful, it's almost physically painful for me. But um, one of my sons is is is absolutely brilliant at it. And I can remember as a small child, he was taking uh violin lessons, and I found this Mobius strip, which I don't know if you know what that is, but and it had like looked to me like chicken scratches on it, so I started gathering up throwing away and he started screaming at me. I went, good grief, what is your problem? He says, Well, that's jingle bells. Excuse me. And he would write binary, and so and he was probably like six, and um he um he was just amazing at mathematics and could do converts things into different bases and knew some formulas that I remember in middle school that his teachers told me he came up with two theorems that had never been done before. And he certainly didn't get his mathematical ability from me, and his dad was a little bit above average in it, but certainly not amazing. But he he is quite amazing and he looks at the whole world that way. Um and for me, I look at things as in colors. For instance, you have a color, you have a fruit that I connect with you that maybe isn't even a fruit you like, but I look at numbers as colors and words as colors and things as colors, everything's colors to me. But my son looks at everything in numerical abilities, which you know what does that mean?

SPEAKER_00 28:20

It's kind of all in there. Wait, okay, so like I have a color when you think like when you conjure me in your mind, or also when you're looking at me?

unknown 28:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 28:29

What can I ask what my color is?

SPEAKER_01 28:31

Well, you're uh the the fruit is apricot, so it's sort of that color. But sometimes it's a fruit, sometimes it's vegetables, usually fruits, but some people are vegetables. I knew somebody that was just a perfect butternut squash, just a perfect butternut squash. It just and when I explained to somebody else that he was a butternut squash, they went, you know, I've never thought about it, but that's exactly what he is, huh? Wait a minute. Because it doesn't have a lot of its own flavor, it picks it up from other things, it's a large vegetable, you know.

SPEAKER_00 28:55

It uh it's like I feel like an apricot is kind of sophisticated when you get right down to it.

SPEAKER_01 29:01

There you go. There you go. And it's a sophisticated color because it kind of blends in. Yeah. You know, it's not uh it's not an orange, it's not a lemon, it's it's an apricot.

SPEAKER_00 29:11

So there you go. There are like certain things that I'll see as shapes, like when I think about a person, it'll be like square, circle, circle, and I uh it's not consistent, and I've never been able to really articulate it beyond what I just said. But um I think that might actually be pretty common. But do you do you think that um that's just the way your brain like remembers things, or do you think there's any connection with like the essence of a person, the fact that you get a fruit match every no idea.

SPEAKER_01 29:36

See, I think I think it's an essence of a person. I don't know, but uh but somehow that's how we're connecting. But yeah, everybody has a everybody's a fruit fruit or vegetable in color to me. And sometimes it can be a bit distracting, but it also helps me figure out who's gonna get along with whom because you know I certainly wouldn't mix some vegetables and some fruits together.

SPEAKER_00 29:56

That's incredible. And this is like even did you litigate? Did you go like go to court? Oh yeah. Lots. And and so the judges and the and opposing counsel were fruits and vegetables? Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_01 30:10

Yeah, a little distracting, but yeah. I mean, you know, it's just it's just a part of everyday life, so yeah. Like, you know, kind of like a smell or something. You just that's what they're doing.

SPEAKER_00 30:19

And are there certain vegetables are there certain vegetables that are like always bad? Like you stay away from eggplants or like something like that.

SPEAKER_01 30:25

No, not necessarily. But you just know that there's certain things you can't do with them. You know, an artichoke, there's only certain things you can do with an artichoke. And it and it can choke you if you eat the wrong parts of it. So you've got to be careful with an artichoke. It can be absolutely delightful, but it can also be kind of miserable. Fascinating. Have you Googled this before? Has anyone else talked about that?

SPEAKER_00 30:44

I'm I'm gonna do that after this.

SPEAKER_01 30:45

I know the color thing I I heard one time, you know, and auras. Yeah, uh the the color. And mine is not an aura thing, but it's just people have definite colors, fruits. Well, for one more thing. There's a sort of uh when I was younger, there was a hierarchy to it. Like the darker the color, the more intense the person, but I I don't feel that anymore.

SPEAKER_00 31:05

Wow, that's so interesting. Um so I had my aura photographed a couple weeks ago. I talked about it on the last episode, um, and it it was orange for the record. Interesting. Yeah. It was pink pink around my head, but mostly bright orange. Um so okay, I'm just kind of running down the list. Do you believe in um meanings of dreams or astral projection or any of that stuff? Some of them, not all. Yeah. What do you want to can you can you tell me a little bit about your thoughts?

SPEAKER_01 31:34

I have a lot of dreams that appear to be the uh the end of the universe, but yet that I go on. Um and I'm aware of people's suffering and pain, but that I the essence of me continues. And it it's been a a thing I've had for many, many years, and I hate it. Uh I I wake up very disturbed, but it's so often um you know, that um and it in the in the end of the world it's not always the same ending. Where I end up is not always the same, because sometimes I'm floating out in space and sometimes I'm going down almost into a cavern and it's um hot and flaming. But it I don't I don't think that has to do with an afterlife per se like kind of thing. It's just a it's just uh this is the end, but yet the and I I'll know the you know the split second before it occurs, but yet my essence goes on. And I guess that's the meaning to it, is that we we we go on, it's just in whatever capacity, because when I feel the other people's pain and agony, I can't do anything about it, but I feel it. I do too. Not fine, but and I've only met one other person that that told me she had the same dream. And we and we're very different people.

SPEAKER_02 32:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:48

Um, but we were all one day again at the office sort of describing dreams, and most everybody had similar types of dream where you haven't taken a course and you realize it's thinking you have to go back, or various things like that. But she and I had these end-of-the-world dreams where we went on afterwards in some in some form, not in a corporeal form, but in an essence.

SPEAKER_00 33:08

So d do you believe in like signs, whether in dreams or in general from the universe? Sometimes. Not always, sometimes.

SPEAKER_01 33:15

Okay. So I'm just But then again, I I consider speed limits to be suggestions. So I can probably slow down.

SPEAKER_00 33:24

So signs are fluid, right? Yeah, absolutely. Um well, because like before I went to bed last night, um, because I talked to my guides and angels now, because why not? I asked for some sort of guidance or um like motivation, suggestion, or sign or something. And in my dream, and I didn't think about this until a little bit after I woke up, but my dream was that there were these special crystals, and whenever I would pick them up, like swarms of fireflies would like flock to the window and like light up and like j something that just seemed like like kind of like comically auspicious in a good way, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_01 34:02

So I you know that I think very well could have been my subconscious doing that, but well I think again it's it's it you know, if I if I listen to this thing, there'll be uh illumination. Um but I have to listen to it or actively pursue it. Uh uh, you know, the light lights aren't always there unless we turn them on.

SPEAKER_00 34:18

Are we saying that about my dream or in general?

unknown 34:20

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 34:22

That's what it says to me is is you you have to you have to reach out uh these crystals. They you know, and and that they have more meaning if you reach out to them.

SPEAKER_00 34:34

Okay, so so I was myself trying to interpret what the crystals could be, and that makes sense to me, but like people, actions, habits, like any anything more specific than reaching out to water.

SPEAKER_01 34:51

No, no, no. It isn't an exact uh it isn't an exact science. One plus one does not always equal two.

SPEAKER_00 34:56

I appreciate the the spontaneous dream interpretation that no, that's great.

SPEAKER_01 35:00

Well, I don't know that I'm accurate, that's just what it would mean to me.

SPEAKER_00 35:03

Yeah, okay. And but also my cats were there, and whenever the fireflies came, my cats were like very happy. Which is like just specific. Well, maybe they're you know, maybe they're happy when you're thinking of them. So you know Yeah, I'm rarely not. So Do you believe in signs from people who have passed away, or is that just closed off as part of the you don't I don't want to talk to dead people thing? I I just no. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 35:26

I it's not that I don't believe it, it's just that I don't experience that.

SPEAKER_00 35:29

Yeah. Okay. And I don't want to. So what do you do with this now? Do you still read for people or friends?

SPEAKER_01 35:36

They ask.

SPEAKER_00 35:37

If they ask, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 35:38

But I mention it to people uh, you know, in passing when they You know, it's sort of like if you if you ha if you know somebody that makes a derogatory that says the N-word, you know, that I think that we have a responsibility to say that's not acceptable. So if I hear them being if I hear somebody being derogatory about um psychic abilities, I say, well now wait a minute, you know, let me stop you there. Uh and then sometimes they go on to ask me to do something, and sometimes they don't. It's not something I generally volunteer to do.

SPEAKER_00 36:06

Well, I mean, m I think you and my mom are know each other quite well, and she just learned this about you the other week. Presumably she was talking about the book I'm working on. Right out of the case.

SPEAKER_01 36:16

Yeah, I think she mentioned that. Uh-huh. And I said, I said, I don't know if I've ever mentioned this, but this is something I did. And I did see her eyes get rather large. Because it doesn't seem to fit my normal nature. I think most people think of me as being, you know, kind of conservative or reserved.

SPEAKER_00 36:32

Yeah, political nature. I mean, you're not. Not politically, but just in nature, you know. I mean, you're like a very well you come off as like a very logical attorney. Most of the time. Can I does my mom have a colored fruit or vegetable? Oh yeah. Can you can you tell is that private information? Can you tell me? Oh no, she's a blueberry. That makes sense. I see that. Yeah, I think I see that. What about my dad?

SPEAKER_01 36:53

Never really thought about your dad, but yeah, he's kind of an orange.

SPEAKER_00 36:57

Yeah, I'm Okay. And is there any relation to the fact that his color is orange and my color is orange? No. Okay. Alright. And so wait, I love this so much. Or do certain fruits and vegetables tend to like pair off with each other? Do you notice patterns like that? No. Okay.

unknown 37:16

No.

SPEAKER_01 37:18

Squash and a blueberry probably wouldn't go well together.

SPEAKER_00 37:21

Probably wouldn't go well together.

SPEAKER_01 37:22

Probably not. But you'd have to you'd have to add in some other uh because I like to cook and I think of it as almost a cooking concept. It's like, oh no, that wouldn't work. But it might, you know, just about anything will work if you give it some effort.

SPEAKER_00 37:34

So do you are there other blueberries you can call to mind, other people you know that are blueberries? Uh yeah, none that you know, but nothing. Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_01 37:42

Yeah, very definitely. And do they resemble each other in any way? They have very uh forceful dynamic personalities, yeah. Um that's that's the the thing with the deep colors like that. They usually have very um uh uh strong uh forces, life forces and abilities.

SPEAKER_00 38:04

Yeah. So that's like an innate quality of a blueberry, is what I'm what I'm getting to. Um how many other apricots do you know?

SPEAKER_01 38:12

Nine.

SPEAKER_00 38:15

Great. All right. Well, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 38:20

So your Shakespearean apricot will be just fine.

SPEAKER_00 38:22

My Shakespearean apricot is the next time you meet a Shakespeare expert, it's gonna be an apricot. You know, this reminds me of um instruments in the orchestra. You know, I play the bassoon very casually, but um bassoonists are like always like really, really nice. And like flautists are always kind of ditzy and like violinists kind of have sticks up their asses, and I I obviously that's not completely true, but I just um people would talk about the type of people who played instruments were, and I don't I I don't I I think I'm an atypical basoonist. I'm not I'm not like the kind patient um person in your life. And you're not reserved particularly. Quite the opposite. Uh you know, I could I could stand to be a little more reserved sometimes, many times. Um okay, that's I know I disturbed you with this whole apricot thing personally. No, no, no, no, no. I listen, honestly, uh my instinct is to say, tell me more about myself, but I don't want that, just like that's not that's interesting for nobody except for me. Another time.

SPEAKER_01 39:25

Another time you might not want to you might not want to put that out to the world person.

SPEAKER_00 39:28

No, but what I but I will say, for whatever reason, that pleases me very much that I am an apricot and that you don't know other apricots. Um, and the second you meet another apricot, please text me.

SPEAKER_01 39:38

I will let you know.

SPEAKER_00 39:39

Because yeah.

SPEAKER_01 39:40

So maybe I actively go out and kind of think, oh, you're a this and you're that, it just it comes to me.

SPEAKER_00 39:45

Yeah. So the I guess like when this happens to me, like when I think of someone as like circle, square, square, it's like y'all be thinking about them in my head, and it'll just be like, oh, circle, square, square, top two name or whatever. So you just picture communications among produce. Yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_01 40:06

Um I had an art teacher tell me once that um that everything in nature is either uh, you know, uh like even if you look at a leaf, it's it's a circle and then two triangles, you know, at the end. Everything is a square or a circle or a triangle or a cone. And if you really think about nature, that's pretty accurate. And so what you're doing is not really that. It's it's again part of the essence. Right.

SPEAKER_00 40:29

So that doesn't sound like a revolutionary observation to me.

SPEAKER_01 40:31

No.

SPEAKER_00 40:32

But that means some people, you know, they might not think that everything in nature is a square or a circle or a cone or something. Well, but when I and I cannot for the life of me think of a specific example, and maybe it'll never happen again. But when I'm talking about this, I'm picturing them lined up next to each other horizontally in a way that does not at all create a human figure. But no irregular polygons there. All you know, within this, they're all standard kind of um high school geometry kind of shapes.

SPEAKER_01 40:59

Square peg and round hold, huh?

SPEAKER_00 41:01

Yeah, right, exactly. Um this is a broad question. Do you have any other like psychic stories or stuff or things that we haven't covered?

SPEAKER_01 41:12

I think that while there are probably some, those are some very good examples of how things kind of you know have peculiar sometimes things don't have a very clear meaning to me or to the person, but if we put them together. There was one other person that I that they had lost something, uh some car keys or whatever. And I said, you know, I I just these it it's near water. And the person kept saying, that doesn't make any sense. It didn't make any sense. And it turned out it was near a water heater that was in the garage. Okay. Well, you know, and and even when I was thinking of it, I was thinking a pool of water, a lake, and thinking, we you know, and the person's going, I haven't been near any water, you know, no. And so, you know, maybe we try to be too literal sometimes with things, but um, you know, it's near a hot water heater, uh, it's got water in it. I I don't know, you know, but that's uh that's the way it works, sort of. There's no clearness.

SPEAKER_00 42:10

The stereotype is that psychics who call in to help like solve murders or cold cases will say it's near water. Um do you have any experience with that? Like, no, no? Yeah, I guess that's really the really virtual thing.

SPEAKER_01 42:24

Or have had some cases where people are murdered and we we don't you know we never find a solution. And and uh but that's not my area of that's not my thing. I don't look for it. Um I mean if it came to me I would probably share it, but no.

SPEAKER_00 42:37

That's oh well that's that's another question. Have you ever had a psychic epiphany that was work-related?

SPEAKER_01 42:44

No, just for the people I I work with. Or this is gonna end well or this is not gonna end well. There's people that you know, I I like to think I can I can help people with, you know, if it's if it's within my area of expertise. Um like I don't do personal injury, but but yet I I there are some people that even though they're very nice, I can think this is not gonna end well. And and if I've continued in the representation, I've wanted to hurt them by the end.

SPEAKER_00 43:09

So you're right.

SPEAKER_01 43:09

So you're talking about like specific clients and cases, like Yeah, yeah, that like this is gonna be and and and they may not seem like they're any easier or harder, but uh we but you know attorneys talk about red flags when they take cases. Um so I'll I'll either have that this case is going to end well or not well, or the or my relationship with this person is gonna end well or not end well. And I'm usually pretty accurate about that, to my chagrin. But if I were to type- I usually don't listen to myself and I'm usually proven accurate. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 43:36

So if I tell you about a decision I have made, would you get an instinct about it, or it's just gotta be a very specific type of decision?

SPEAKER_01 43:46

I would I would know this is gonna end well or this is not gonna end well. That's just that's it's just a yin or yang.

SPEAKER_00 43:51

Can we can we try?

unknown 43:52

Sure.

SPEAKER_00 43:53

I I'm cause I'm I'm I'm dropping out of this program because I have three degrees and I don't want to be in literature classes anymore. And um What do we think about that? That's gonna end well.

unknown 44:05

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 44:05

Thank God. Because I was gonna yeah, I was gonna have to I was gonna have to cut that out of the episode if it was gonna add poorly. How did you meet my mom? Through through mutual friends. Like lawyer friends? No. Really? Blueberry friends.

SPEAKER_01 44:27

Yes, actually, now that you say that, I think this friend would be probably closer to a blackberry, but yeah.

SPEAKER_00 44:32

Okay, so is it right? So it was it you you ran into the berry hoard. My my mother was. Wait, do you have one for yourself? No. Couldn't tell you. Couldn't tell you. Not a color or a fruit or vegetable, no idea.

unknown 44:47

Nope.

SPEAKER_01 44:48

Um oh I'm my immediate family, by the way. That my my husband's children don't have one for them. But as soon as it gets outside, my immediate family, yeah, everybody's a fruit or vegetable.

SPEAKER_00 44:58

So yeah, so you can't be if you're too close to the thing, it's yeah. Can't see it. Can't see it. Wow. Um, how do you feel about crystals? Do you have feelings about crystals? No. No. Okay. Do you have not negative, I just don't have any. You you just so you're not like they don't work or they do work or they do nothing, or yeah.

SPEAKER_01 45:19

Numerology, cards, palms. Can we talk about numerology? You haven't done that one a long time, but um it there was a time when I was able to read people by um doing their names, and um uh there were certain numbers associated. It's been an it's been many, many years, and I can't remember how I did it, but I was very good at it. I had a book on it, and it and it just seemed to be very on point. But it was more to do character type traits. You know, I could I could tell you the type of person, if I just met you, the type of characteristics you had by doing this numerology thing, but I haven't done it in, gosh, probably 35, 40 years. So I can't remember. It's the advantage of getting older, you forget a lot, so you can make room for more things.

SPEAKER_00 46:02

Well well what that makes me think of is I mean, your parents give you your name, obviously, and then there's some people who feel like their name doesn't fit them, but you're saying the name of the thing.

SPEAKER_01 46:10

Well, yeah, and actually apparently when I when my uh father adopted me, they changed the spelling of my name. Huh. Yeah, I think I think uh a little bit like my son does, I I think that uh letters have numerical relations. That's because a little bit, yeah. Uh-huh. And um there was a there was a uh system I learned when I was a kid that was called casting out nines that you could use to um to to check to see if you'd done a mathematical problem correctly. Um and it was, you know, had taking the numbers below above the line and below the line, and if you cast out nines that they would all they should both end up in four or three or whatever it was. Um and so it's a little bit similar to that when you do names. Um and you can kind of it it it it often seems to correlate with the year um and month that they were born. And um what microscopes do you do do you think about those? Not not particularly. I read them, but they're more of a curiosity than anything else. Yeah, I I don't have any real pattern of anything. Just no, that's right. Just some things that work and some that don't. It's sort of like art, you know. It's just like, oh, I like this kind of painting and I'm not refunded of that kind.

SPEAKER_00 47:24

So um so in numerology, the first thing that sprung to mind for me was like seeing a certain number everywhere, or but that you're but you're referring specifically to like m math, ironically. Right. With names. And numbers have colors. Do they?

SPEAKER_01 47:43

Okay. Do ages have colors? Uh what's the person? Never really thought about it, but um, yeah, I suppose they do.

SPEAKER_00 47:51

Can you tell me some colors and numbers?

SPEAKER_01 47:53

Well, yeah, I mean like uh zero is white, one is black, two is yellow, three is sort of a mauve, four is blue, five is green, six is red, seven is sort of a really dark, dark purplish bluish, eight is kind of a kind of a tan or brown. Uh nine is a dark brown.

SPEAKER_00 48:14

Okay, wait, wait, but when you start having two digits, is it multiple colors or is it one color?

SPEAKER_01 48:18

You have like a four and a five would be a little bit.

SPEAKER_00 48:21

So what would seven be?

SPEAKER_01 48:22

Switch together might be a turquoise, but it's also a four and a five. You know, I mean it's a it's a blue and a green.

SPEAKER_00 48:27

Right. Wow. I don't have a follow-up yet.

SPEAKER_01 48:31

It's deeply troubling, I know. It's troubling, yeah. So it's just not something I think about a whole lot, but if I put some thought into it, it's like, oh yeah.

SPEAKER_00 48:38

But that's always it's always like that. That's not like the color. It depends on the background. But I mean, if I ask you in a month, two is still yellow. Okay. So this is just that's the way it's always has been, always will be. It's gotta be. Is it like a specific shade of yellow? Vicky? Okay, so I'm texting Vicky. Uh I said, lost you. She says, Yep, I guess seven was pissed. So um I'm gonna tell her that she's discharged her civic duty and doesn't have to come back if she doesn't want to. Hey, she says My pleasure, good luck. I didn't I didn't say thank you. I I mean I might maybe she knew I was thinking thank you. Um I don't love good luck. That feels like she's doesn't necessarily have confidence in me, but maybe I'm overthinking it now that I know so much about her and um how she sees the world. Uh I don't know about you, but I am fascinated. I am gonna start thinking about symbols or colors or whatever I associate with people or numbers or Yeah, I don't know. Anyway, uh we learned something new once again here on Cats Never Die, and catch you at the next one. I'll try to cover up next time.