Foundational Fridays: Prohibited Acts

Understanding what you cannot do is just as important as knowing what you can. Join Eddie Montes Travis and Marylyn Lee Trotter as they break down the critical boundaries every professional must respect to stay compliant and protect their commission. This episode clarifies the fine line between helpful service and illegal activity. • Unauthorized Practice of Law: One of the most common pitfalls involves giving legal advice or drafting documents, which can lead to severe legal penalties. • Conflict of Interest: Acting as a neutral party is essential, meaning you must never notarize your own signature or documents where you have a direct financial benefit. • Incomplete Documents: It is strictly forbidden to perform an act on a document that contains blanks or missing information, as this opens the door for potential fraud. • Post-Dating Certificates: Every certificate must reflect the exact date the signer appeared before you; falsifying dates is a major violation of state laws. Mastering these prohibited acts ensures you maintain your integrity and professional standing in the industry. By avoiding these common errors, you safeguard both your clients and your career. Please make sure to subscribe and like the podcast for more essential tips every Friday!

Show Notes:
• The dangers of providing unauthorized legal advice.
• Why you must never notarize documents with blank spaces.
• Identifying and avoiding conflicts of interest in your work.
• The importance of accurate dating and record-keeping for compliance.

Buy Becoming a Notary on Amazon

Notary Knowledge Reference Guide and Notary Bible on Amazon

Your Sunday Notary Reading:
Notary Public Foundation: Essential Guide to Core Duties, Ethics, and Commissioning on Amazon

Your Monday Notary Reading:
Notary Operational Excellence: Mastering Certificates, Journals, Ink, and Copy Certification on Amazon

Your Tuesday Notary Reading:
Notary Fraud Shield: Real-World Tactics, Red Flags, and Refusal Strategies on Amazon

Your Wednesday Notary Reading:
The Mobile Notary Blueprint: Launching and Managing Your On-Demand Business on Amazon

Your Thursday Notary Reading:
Notary Niche Navigator: Your Guide to Loan Signings, Apostilles, I-9s, and More on Amazon

Your Friday Notary Reading:
Notary Law & Liability: Understanding State Regulations, Insurance, and Avoiding UPL

Your Saturday Notary Reading:
The Future Notary: Mastering RON, eNotary, and Complex Scenarios on Amazon

Quick & Easy Solutions: How to Increase Mobile Notary Business for More Success & Profit: with 37 Professional Tips on Amazon

Executive Producer Derrick Spruill
Writers Marylyn Lee Trotter and Eddie Montes Travis
Graphics & Illustrations by Eddie Montes Travis
Music by Thomas Bynum
This Show is Produced by Magnificent Workz
Business Solutions

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:03

Know the notary laws and safeguard your notary business. Introducing the book Notary Law and Liability, Understanding State Regulations, Insurance, and Avoiding UPL by Derek Spruel. What you don't know can destroy the notary business you've been building. Get your copy of Notary Law and Liability by Derek Scruell from Amazon.com, Barnes Noble, Books of Million, Bookshop.org, Mobile Notary by DerekSbruell.com, or download from Kindle today.

SPEAKER_02 0:36

Imagine you're uh you're a bouncer at a really busy nightclub.

SPEAKER_03 0:40

Okay, I can picture that.

SPEAKER_02 0:41

Right. And your singular, like highly important job is to stand at the door, check the ideas of the people walking in, and, you know, make sure they are exactly who they claim to be.

SPEAKER_03 0:52

And that they're walking in willingly, right.

SPEAKER_02 0:54

Exactly. But now imagine if you suddenly just abandoned your post at the door, marched all the way back into the kitchen, and started inspecting the chicken to see if it was like cooked to health code standards.

SPEAKER_03 1:07

That would be a massive disaster.

SPEAKER_02 1:09

Right. You wouldn't just be wildly out of your lane, you'd be creating chaos. And today, we are exploring why stepping out of your lane as a public servant won't just get you fired, but it could literally land you in jail.

SPEAKER_03 1:21

It is a huge deal.

SPEAKER_02 1:22

It really is. Welcome to Notary Knowledge. I'm Marilyn Lee Trotter here with Eddie Montez Travis.

SPEAKER_03 1:27

We are so incredibly thrilled to have you joining us for this exploration of the sources today.

SPEAKER_02 1:31

We really are. But uh before we get into the core of today's show, we want to make sure you're fully plugged into our entire educational network.

SPEAKER_03 1:39

Yes, absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 1:40

So be sure to check out our video podcast, No Notary, with Eddie Montez Travis, as well as Marilyn's 90 seconds of notary for those quick, like bite-sized tips you can use when you're out in the field.

SPEAKER_03 1:50

Exactly. And you know, if you are genuinely serious about building a successful rock solid practice, you absolutely need to buy the Notary Knowledge books by Derek Sproul.

SPEAKER_02 2:01

Oh, they are must-haves.

SPEAKER_03 2:03

They really are. They're the essential comprehensive guides for navigating this profession safely and successfully. You can find those books and, well, a wealth of other resources by visiting the Notary Knowledge website.

SPEAKER_02 2:15

And while you're at it, please take a quick moment to rate the show, subscribe, and share the podcast with others.

SPEAKER_03 2:21

It really helps us get this vital information out to the people who need it most.

SPEAKER_02 2:25

It really does make a huge difference. Now, um, if you're new here or you're just starting out in your career or maybe feeling a little overwhelmed, take a deep breath.

SPEAKER_03 2:34

Yeah, you are in the exact right place.

SPEAKER_02 2:36

You are. We keep things highly conversational and relaxed around here. You do not need a law degree to follow along with us.

SPEAKER_03 2:41

Thank goodness for that.

SPEAKER_02 2:43

Right. In fact, today is Foundational Fridays. So it's designed specifically for the entry-level professional.

SPEAKER_03 2:50

We are stripping away the complicated jargon and just focusing on the absolute bedrock principles of the job.

SPEAKER_02 2:56

Exactly. Now, in prior sessions, we spent a lot of time talking about what you must do, right?

SPEAKER_03 3:02

Right. Specifically the rigorous ins and outs of identity verification.

SPEAKER_02 3:06

Which is obviously the undeniable core of the job. But today we are flipping the script entirely. Today's focus is on prohibited acts.

SPEAKER_03 3:14

Aaron Powell So basically what you absolutely cannot do.

SPEAKER_02 3:16

Yes. And this is where so many incredibly well-meaning people get tripped up.

SPEAKER_03 3:21

They really do.

SPEAKER_02 3:22

Because there's this massive society-wide myth about what our official stamp actually means. Right. Like people think that when a notary stamps a document, it means the content of that document is, you know, true or fair or legally bulletproof.

SPEAKER_03 3:38

It's a remarkably common misconception. People assume the official seal is a stamp of approval on the fairness of the deal itself. They literally think you are endorsing the contract.

SPEAKER_02 3:47

Right. But let's go back to that bouncer analogy from the very beginning.

SPEAKER_03 3:51

The nightclub.

SPEAKER_02 3:52

Yeah. We are just verifying that the person standing in front of us is who their ID says they are, and that Noah's like holding a proverbial gun to their head to sign.

SPEAKER_03 4:03

We are definitely not the health inspector checking the kitchen.

SPEAKER_02 4:06

Exactly. We don't verify if the recipe of the business contract is fair or if the terms of the mortgage loan are a good deal for the buyer. We just check the ID at the door.

SPEAKER_03 4:15

That is a brilliant way to conceptualize it, honestly. And you know, if we connect this to the broader global picture, we can understand exactly why the public is so confused.

SPEAKER_02 4:25

Where does it all come from?

SPEAKER_03 4:27

Well, a lot of this confusion comes from a profound misunderstanding of the office internationally.

SPEAKER_02 4:32

Oh, like in other countries.

SPEAKER_03 4:33

Yeah. A United States common law notary is radically fundamentally different from a civil law notary, which you'd find in Latin America or most of Europe.

SPEAKER_02 4:42

Right. The system is totally different over there.

SPEAKER_03 4:44

Exactly. In those countries, a notario publico is actually a highly trained elite lawyer.

SPEAKER_02 4:51

Wait, like an actual lawyer?

SPEAKER_03 4:53

Yes. They literally draft the legal instruments, they dispense legal advice, and their authorized documents essentially carry the weight of a court order.

SPEAKER_02 5:02

Wow. Which is a completely different universe from what we do here in the States.

SPEAKER_03 5:06

Completely different. In the U.S., our core function is strictly purposefully limited. We are impartial witnesses.

SPEAKER_02 5:12

Just witnesses.

SPEAKER_03 5:13

Right. Our job is to verify identity, ensure the signer's willingness to sign, and check for basic mental competence.

SPEAKER_02 5:20

So our whole purpose is basically just to deter and prevent fraud.

SPEAKER_03 5:24

Exactly. Not to dispense legal counsel or shape the transaction. Which actually brings us directly to the first of our three bright lines for Foundational Fridays: the unauthorized practice of law or UPL.

SPEAKER_02 5:35

Ah, yes, the UPL boundary. Because we aren't lawyers, we cannot act like them.

SPEAKER_03 5:41

Exactly.

SPEAKER_02 5:41

It sounds so simple in theory, but signers will constantly, and I mean constantly ask things like, um, is this the right form for me? Or what exactly happens to my house if I sign this deed?

SPEAKER_03 5:51

Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_02 5:52

And answering those questions, like even just trying to be a helpful human being is strictly prohibited.

SPEAKER_03 5:57

Precisely. Let's look at the mechanics of this for a second. Okay. If a document doesn't have a pre-printed notarial certificate attached to it, you cannot tell the signer which one to choose.

SPEAKER_02 6:08

Wow. Really?

SPEAKER_03 6:09

Yeah, you cannot recommend a girl over an acknowledgement. That recommendation is a formal legal determination.

SPEAKER_02 6:16

Okay, let's actually pause and break those two terms down for our newer listeners because that can sound like intense legal jargon if you are just starting out.

SPEAKER_03 6:24

That's a great idea.

SPEAKER_02 6:25

What is the practical on-the-ground difference between a girat and an acknowledgement?

SPEAKER_03 6:30

That is a great clarifying question. So an acknowledgement is simply a declaration. Okay. The signer is acknowledging to you that they signed the document willingly and that they understand what they are signing.

SPEAKER_02 6:41

Got it. And a girl.

SPEAKER_03 6:43

A girat, on the other hand, is much heavier. It requires you to administer an oath or affirmation.

SPEAKER_02 6:49

So they're swearing to something.

SPEAKER_03 6:51

Yes. The signer is actively swearing under penalty of perjury that the contents of the document are entirely factual and true.

SPEAKER_02 6:59

Okay, so one is basically saying, I sign this of my own free will, and the other is saying, I swear to God, everything written on this paper is a fact.

SPEAKER_03 7:07

Exactly.

SPEAKER_02 7:08

And choosing between those two carries vastly different legal weight in a court of law.

SPEAKER_03 7:13

Right, which is exactly why making that choice for the client crosses the bright line into practicing law.

SPEAKER_02 7:19

So what can you do if they ask?

SPEAKER_03 7:21

You can read them the definitions of those acts from your state handbook, but the signer has to make the ultimate choice.

SPEAKER_02 7:27

Wow. Okay, let's move to the second bright line, which is temporal falsification. Or in plain English, messing with the dates.

SPEAKER_03 7:35

This is a big one.

SPEAKER_02 7:36

Now I have to admit, when I first started looking into this, my brain completely tripped over it.

SPEAKER_03 7:41

How so?

SPEAKER_02 7:42

Well, I really wanted symmetry. Like if a massive lease agreement says January 1st at the top, but the parties are standing in front of me signing it on January 5th, my instinct is to just make everything match.

SPEAKER_03 7:53

Right, to tidy it up.

SPEAKER_02 7:54

Yeah. It feels incredibly messy to have two different dates on the same paperwork. Why is the law so incredibly strict about this?

SPEAKER_03 8:02

Because the legal ice here is incredibly thin, and you have to separate the concept of the document date from the notary date.

SPEAKER_02 8:09

Okay, break that down for me.

SPEAKER_03 8:11

The document date is when the contract actually takes effect.

SPEAKER_02 8:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 8:14

That timeline is decided entirely by the parties involved, and it can legally be in the past or the future.

SPEAKER_02 8:20

Okay, that makes sense.

SPEAKER_03 8:21

But the notary date, the date written on your official notarial certificate, must always reflect the exact factual calendar day the signer physically appeared before you.

SPEAKER_02 8:31

No exceptions at all. Like even if both parties beg you to match it.

SPEAKER_03 8:35

Zero exceptions. Predating, which is backdating and postdating, are explicitly illegal in all 50 states.

SPEAKER_02 8:42

Wow.

SPEAKER_03 8:43

It is quite literally falsifying a government record.

SPEAKER_02 8:46

That sounds terrifying when you put it like that.

SPEAKER_03 8:48

Think about the mechanism of what you are doing. You are making a sworn statement under oath that a specific human being stood physically before you on a very specific day.

SPEAKER_02 8:57

Right.

SPEAKER_03 8:57

Falsifying that timeline destroys the chain of evidence and can lead to severe civil liability and even criminal charges.

SPEAKER_02 9:04

Wow. We're gonna see exactly how dangerous that gets in our scenarios later.

SPEAKER_03 9:10

Oh, definitely.

SPEAKER_02 9:10

Okay, the third bright line is self-notarization.

SPEAKER_03 9:14

Right. Impartiality is the absolute non-negotiable bedrock of the office. Which means you are commissioned by your state as a disinterested public servant, therefore you cannot notarize your own signature.

SPEAKER_02 9:28

Makes sense.

SPEAKER_03 9:29

You also cannot notarize any document where you have a direct financial or beneficial interest.

SPEAKER_02 9:34

Because you just can't be a neutral, objective witness to your own life events, right? It fundamentally breaks the entire system of trust.

SPEAKER_03 9:42

Exactly. You are the third-party verifier. You cannot be the first party and the third party simultaneously.

SPEAKER_02 9:46

Okay, we've covered some genuinely heavy foundational rules here.

SPEAKER_03 9:50

We really have.

SPEAKER_02 9:51

The boundaries of UPL, the strict reality of temporal falsification, and the absolute requirement against self-notarization.

SPEAKER_03 9:59

A lot to take in.

SPEAKER_02 10:00

It is. Let's just take a breath right here. Let those concepts really sink in for a moment.

SPEAKER_03 10:04

Good idea.

SPEAKER_02 10:04

Just relax and absorb those bright lines because next we are going to see how they actually play out when you are face to face with a client.

SPEAKER_03 10:12

Theory is one thing, but practice is where the real test begins.

SPEAKER_02 10:16

Exactly. So let's dive into a fan favorite segment of the show. Good question. What would you do?

SPEAKER_03 10:23

I love this segment.

SPEAKER_02 10:24

Me too. This is where we tackle real-world high-stakes scenarios submitted by entry-level professionals from all across the country.

SPEAKER_03 10:33

These are the tricky on-the-ground situations where those bright lines we just established get seriously tested.

SPEAKER_02 10:39

Exactly. What's our first one?

SPEAKER_03 10:41

Our first scenario comes from Whitney in Wisconsin.

SPEAKER_02 10:44

Okay, hey Whitney.

SPEAKER_03 10:45

Here is the situation she faced. Whitney's client brings in a property deed that needs to be notarized. But the deed is incomplete.

SPEAKER_02 10:54

Uh-oh.

SPEAKER_03 10:54

Yeah, there is a glaring blank space right where the property address is supposed to go.

SPEAKER_02 10:58

Oh boy.

SPEAKER_03 10:59

The client looks at Whitney, hands her a pen, and asks her to just, quote, fill in the missing property address real quick before she applies her stamp.

SPEAKER_02 11:07

Just to save them a step.

SPEAKER_03 11:08

Exactly. Just to be helpful.

SPEAKER_02 11:10

Now, I'm gonna play devil's advocate here because this is exactly how we get trapped. Let's hear it. Come on, it's just a property address. The client clearly knows what house they're talking about.

SPEAKER_03 11:17

Sure.

SPEAKER_02 11:18

Doesn't good proactive customer service mean helping the client out with a minor clerical detail?

SPEAKER_03 11:24

That right there is the ultimate helpfulness trap. Is it? Oh, absolutely. And what's truly fascinating here is how quickly good intentions turn into a severe violation of the law.

SPEAKER_02 11:35

Wait, it's a law violation.

SPEAKER_03 11:37

Yes. Completing blank spaces in the body of a legal document is the unauthorized practice of law.

SPEAKER_02 11:44

Seriously. Just filling in an address.

SPEAKER_03 11:46

Yes. A notary's completion authority is strictly, legally confined, to the blank fields of the notarial certificate itself.

SPEAKER_02 11:54

Like what?

SPEAKER_03 11:54

Things like the venue, the date, your signature, and your seal. You cannot touch the text of the document.

SPEAKER_02 12:01

So she can't even write in an address or a zip code or a middle initial.

SPEAKER_03 12:05

She absolutely cannot. If a document has blank spaces in its core text, the notary must actively refuse to proceed until the signer or the document's legal originator fills them in.

SPEAKER_02 12:17

Wow. Why is it so strict?

SPEAKER_03 12:19

Because a blank space is essentially a weapon waiting to be used. Blanks can be altered later to commit massive fraud.

SPEAKER_02 12:26

Oh, I see.

SPEAKER_03 12:27

Exactly. Let's look at how that actually plays out.

SPEAKER_02 12:29

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 12:30

Imagine Whitney signs off on that deed with a blank property line. The fraudster then takes that notarized deed, and instead of writing in the address for a tiny vacant dirt lot, they write in the address of a 500-acre family farm owned by an elderly relative.

SPEAKER_02 12:47

Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_03 12:48

Right. By applying her seal to a document with a blank space, Whitney's seal just became the engine that facilitated the theft of a farm.

SPEAKER_02 12:55

Wow, she has to say no.

SPEAKER_03 12:57

She has to.

SPEAKER_02 12:58

That is terrifying. Do not touch the document text. The liability is massive.

SPEAKER_03 13:02

Huge liability.

SPEAKER_02 13:03

All right, scenario two. This comes to us from Connie in Connecticut.

SPEAKER_03 13:06

Okay, Connie.

SPEAKER_02 13:07

So Connie needs a certified copy of her own college diploma for a highly competitive job application.

SPEAKER_03 13:12

Okay. Fairly common request.

SPEAKER_02 13:13

Now she is a commissioned professional herself, so she wants to know if she can just notarize the copy of her diploma herself to save time, money, and you know, a trip across town.

unknown 13:22

Ah.

SPEAKER_03 13:23

Honestly, to me, that sounds a whole lot like grading your own driving test.

SPEAKER_02 13:27

That is the perfect analogy. It is exactly like grading your own test.

SPEAKER_03 13:31

Right.

SPEAKER_02 13:31

Self-notarization is a physical and legal impossibility. Think about the underlying mechanism we discussed earlier.

SPEAKER_03 13:38

The impartiality thing.

SPEAKER_02 13:39

Exactly. The core job is to objectively verify identity and serve as a thoroughly disinterested witness.

SPEAKER_03 13:46

And you can't do that for yourself.

SPEAKER_02 13:48

Right. You cannot objectively verify your own identity, and you certainly cannot be a disinterested witness to your own life achievements.

SPEAKER_03 13:56

Trevor Burrus Because obviously Connie has a massive vested interest in her own diploma-looking official for that job application.

SPEAKER_02 14:04

Precisely. If she were to stamp it, doing so voids the notarization entirely.

SPEAKER_03 14:09

It totally ruins it.

SPEAKER_02 14:11

It completely strips the document of all its legal credibility, and it might even cost her the job she's applying for.

SPEAKER_03 14:16

Wow. So what does she do?

SPEAKER_02 14:18

Connie must seek out an independent, completely disinterested third party to certify that copy for her.

SPEAKER_03 14:25

No shortcuts, even for yourself.

SPEAKER_02 14:26

No. The system only works if the witness is truly neutral. Okay, let's move to scenario three, which deals with our old friend time.

SPEAKER_03 14:35

Oh, temporal falsification.

SPEAKER_02 14:37

Yep. This is Tyler from Tennessee. Tyler is doing a complex mortgage loan signing, and he's physically meeting with the borrower on a Thursday evening.

SPEAKER_03 14:45

Okay, Thursday.

SPEAKER_02 14:46

But the loan signing agency reaches out and explicitly asks him to date his notary certificate for Friday so that the paperwork perfectly aligns with the bank's official closing date.

SPEAKER_03 14:56

Oof. This raises that critically important question about temporal integrity that we unpacked in the first segment.

SPEAKER_02 15:02

The notary date versus the document date.

SPEAKER_03 15:05

Exactly. If Tyler agrees to date that certificate for Friday, he is actively falsifying a government record.

SPEAKER_02 15:12

But wait, what if the agency is the one paying his invoice? What if the client literally demands it?

SPEAKER_03 15:17

It does not matter if the agency demands it, threatens him, or bugs him. No agency instruction and no client demand overrides state law.

SPEAKER_02 15:26

Wow.

SPEAKER_03 15:26

Remember the mechanics. The certificate is a sworn statement under oath. Let's play out the worst case scenario here.

SPEAKER_02 15:32

Okay, let's hear it.

SPEAKER_03 15:33

Imagine Tyler bends to the pressure and dates his certificate for Friday. But late Thursday night after the signing, the borrower tragically gets into a severe car accident and falls into a coma.

SPEAKER_02 15:44

Oh wow, that changes everything.

SPEAKER_03 15:46

Suddenly, Tyler's official sworn certificate claims that he physically verified the identity, checked the mental awareness, and witnessed the signature of an incapacitated person on Friday afternoon.

SPEAKER_02 15:58

That is just outright perjury.

SPEAKER_03 16:00

That is outright undeniable perjury. Tyler must absolutely date the certificate for Thursday, the factual day the signer physically appeared before him.

SPEAKER_02 16:09

But what about the bank's Friday deadline?

SPEAKER_03 16:11

If the agency or the bank needs the loan to legally take effect on Friday, the lawyers can legally establish a Friday effective date in the text of the contract itself, but the notary date must remain Thursday.

SPEAKER_02 16:24

That really puts the liability into crystal clear perspective. It's not just a minor clerical error, it's a false statement under oath with potentially devastating chain reactions.

SPEAKER_03 16:33

It really is.

SPEAKER_02 16:33

Let's take another conversational breath right here.

SPEAKER_03 16:35

Yeah, that's heavy.

SPEAKER_02 16:36

I really want the gravity of those legal liabilities to truly settle in for our listeners before we hit our last two scenarios.

SPEAKER_03 16:44

It is a lot of responsibility, but understanding the boundaries actually makes the job much safer and easier.

SPEAKER_02 16:49

Very true. Okay, we are back into it. Scenario four comes to us from Mary in Maryland.

SPEAKER_03 16:55

Okay, let's hear about Mary.

SPEAKER_02 16:56

Mary is presented with a very dense, highly complex power of attorney document. The signer is sitting across the table, looking it over, clearly stressed.

SPEAKER_03 17:06

That happens all the time.

SPEAKER_02 17:07

Yeah. They point to a dense legalistic paragraph, look up at Mary and ask, What does this section about my estate actually mean?

SPEAKER_03 17:16

Oh man. This is perhaps the single most common UPL trap people fall into.

SPEAKER_02 17:21

Because you just want to help.

SPEAKER_03 17:22

Right. Mary wants to be a compassionate, helpful professional. And she might actually know exactly what the paragraph means from her own past experience.

SPEAKER_02 17:29

But she can't say it.

SPEAKER_03 17:30

But explaining the terms or the legal effects of a document is definitively providing legal advice.

SPEAKER_02 17:36

So what does she do? She just stares at them.

SPEAKER_03 17:38

Mary needs an exact, memorized script to safely navigate this without alienating her client.

SPEAKER_02 17:45

Oh, a script. So what should her go-to response be?

SPEAKER_03 17:49

She should look the client in the eye and say exactly this. I am a notary, not an attorney. I cannot provide legal advice or explain the effects of this document.

SPEAKER_02 17:58

That is solid. Let me actually repeat that. So everyone driving right now or taking notes can hear it again and burn it into their memory.

SPEAKER_03 18:05

Good idea.

SPEAKER_02 18:06

I am a notary, not an attorney. I cannot provide legal advice or explain the effects of this document.

SPEAKER_03 18:12

Exactly. It is polite, it is profoundly firm, and it draws the bright legal line so clearly that no one can cross it.

SPEAKER_02 18:20

Right.

SPEAKER_03 18:21

You must never choose the certificate for the signer, and you must never explain the document's provisions. And, you know, there's a deeper mechanical reason for this.

SPEAKER_02 18:30

What's that?

SPEAKER_03 18:30

Think about the core duties. You have to verify willingness.

SPEAKER_02 18:34

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 18:34

If the signer doesn't understand the document and is asking what it does, Mary must halt the transaction.

SPEAKER_02 18:40

Oh, because they don't know what they're signing.

SPEAKER_03 18:41

Exactly. She cannot truthfully verify that the signer is signing with full, uncoerced understanding if they don't even know what the document does.

SPEAKER_02 18:50

That makes total logical sense.

SPEAKER_03 18:52

A power of attorney gives someone else the literal power to sell their house or empty their bank accounts. If there is confusion, she has to tell them to consult an attorney before proceeding.

SPEAKER_02 19:01

You can't verify willingness if there is fundamental confusion.

SPEAKER_03 19:04

Exactly.

SPEAKER_02 19:05

All right, our final scenario for today's exploration. Scenario five. Emily from South Carolina.

SPEAKER_03 19:11

Okay, Emily.

SPEAKER_02 19:12

Emily is fully bilingual, which is a fantastic and highly sought-after skill.

SPEAKER_03 19:18

Very much so.

SPEAKER_02 19:19

Because she speaks fluent Spanish, some of her local clients refer to her affectionately as a notario.

SPEAKER_03 19:24

Oh no.

SPEAKER_02 19:25

Yeah. They come to her office, trusting her completely, and ask for her help filling out their complex immigration forms.

SPEAKER_03 19:31

Aaron Ross Powell This is a scenario with massive, almost unimaginable stakes.

SPEAKER_02 19:36

Why is that?

SPEAKER_03 19:37

Well, we touched on the civil law notary concept earlier, but here is where it becomes a crisis.

SPEAKER_02 19:42

Right, because of the translation.

SPEAKER_03 19:43

Because a notario publico in Latin America is a powerful, highly trained lawyer who can secure property and influence courts, using that term in the U.S. creates immense dangerous confusion. Wow. It misleads incredibly vulnerable immigrant communities who don't understand the difference in legal systems. It's actually prosecuted aggressively as notario fraud.

SPEAKER_02 20:06

So even if Emily is literally just trying to translate the English words on the form into Spanish, is that still dangerous?

SPEAKER_03 20:14

It is incredibly dangerous. Emily must absolutely refuse to provide immigration advice or help fill out those specific forms.

SPEAKER_02 20:22

Even just translating.

SPEAKER_03 20:23

Yes. Translating the English instructions into Spanish might seem like a harmless linguistic favor, but interpreting what those instructions require legally is practicing law.

SPEAKER_02 20:32

I guess I never thought about it like that.

SPEAKER_03 20:34

These clients are trusting her with their right to stay in the country, their livelihood, and their family's unity. Furthermore, in states like South Carolina, and famously in California, there are incredibly strict punitive laws preventing exactly that.

SPEAKER_02 20:47

Just how strict are we talking? What kind of laws?

SPEAKER_03 20:49

In South Carolina, providing unauthorized immigration assistance can result in a harsh civil penalty of up to $1,000 per individual violation.

SPEAKER_02 20:59

$1,000?

SPEAKER_03 21:00

Wow. And in California, the Business and Professions Code strictly prohibits non-attorneys from literally translating notary public into Spanish in any of their advertising.

SPEAKER_02 21:10

That is super specific.

SPEAKER_03 21:11

It is. Moreover, immigration consultants who happen to hold a commission are completely legally barred from advertising those services at all. The fines can reach up to $1,000 a day.

SPEAKER_02 21:22

A day.

SPEAKER_03 21:23

Yes. Emily must politely but firmly correct her client's misunderstanding. She is a U.S. commissioned official, not a notario, and she absolutely cannot assist with immigration forms.

SPEAKER_02 21:34

Wow. Those scenarios really truly bring those foundational rules to life.

SPEAKER_03 21:39

They do.

SPEAKER_02 21:39

It's one thing to read a dry paragraph about the unauthorized practice of law in a manual, but it's an entirely different reality to sit across from a bilingual client who just desperately wants help with a visa form.

SPEAKER_03 21:50

Or a friend who just wants you to fill in in a dress line.

SPEAKER_02 21:52

Exactly.

SPEAKER_03 21:52

And that actually brings us to a really crucial final provocative thought I want to leave everyone with today.

SPEAKER_02 21:58

Oh, what is it?

SPEAKER_03 22:00

We live in an incredibly fast-paced, high-demand world. Everyone expects instant customer service, they expect quick fixes, seamless digital transactions, and for professionals to just bend the rules and you know make it work.

SPEAKER_02 22:12

Right. The attitude is always just stamp the paper and let's go.

SPEAKER_03 22:14

Aaron Powell Exactly. But in that kind of high-pressure environment, the simple, disciplined act of looking a client in the eye and saying no to a prohibited act, whether it's backdating a loan, giving legal advice on an estate, or notarizing a document for your own spouse that no is actually the ultimate safeguard. Trevor Burrus, Jr.

SPEAKER_02 22:33

It's the bouncer standing firm and turning away the fake ID, even when the person is screaming at them.

SPEAKER_03 22:38

Yes, precisely. That refusal is the invisible glue that holds our entire system of commercial and legal trust together.

SPEAKER_02 22:46

That is so true.

SPEAKER_03 22:47

When you refuse an improper illegal request, you aren't providing bad customer service. Saying no isn't a failure of your job, it is the very essence of your job. Wow. It protects the signer from fraud, it protects the general public from exploitation, and it protects the absolute integrity of the document itself in a court of law.

SPEAKER_02 23:06

What an incredibly powerful perspective-shifting way to look at it. Saying no is the actual service we provide to society.

SPEAKER_03 23:13

Exactly.

SPEAKER_02 23:14

I love that. Well, that officially wraps up our Foundational Friday exploration of prohibited acts. We actively want to hear from you. Email your questions to Derek at Derricks Spruell.com. We will try to answer as soon as possible at the end of our shows.

SPEAKER_03 23:28

We really do read every single email, and your tricky on-the-ground questions might just end up on our next good question, what would you do segment.

SPEAKER_02 23:36

Absolutely. So keep them coming. Now, for our show credits, executive producer Derek Sproul, lead writer Marilyn Lee Trotter, Graphics Eddie Montez Travis, Music Thomas Bynum, produced by MagnificentWorks Business Solutions.

SPEAKER_03 23:50

Thank you so much for spending your valuable time with us today and for your continued dedication to doing this incredibly vital job the right way every single time.

SPEAKER_02 24:04

Until next time.

SPEAKER_00 24:12

Navigate the complex legal framework with confidence using notary law and liability by Derek Spruil. This essential guide provides a deep dive into state regulations, ensuring you stay compliant across jurisdictions. Learn how to properly use errors and omissions insurance and master the critical boundaries to strictly avoid the unauthorized practice of law. Protect yourself, your commission, and your business. Get your copy of notary law and liability by Derek Spool on Amazon.