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In this episode, we talk about " Onions, relationships, healing, what boundaries are needed with in-laws..."
*We are long-distance besties - we talk for hours, record the calls, and POST! We do not edit our audio.
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You didn't take notes? No, we're gonna wing it today. That's scary. I know.
SPEAKER_03I feel like we're a good winginits though. Is that a thing? Well, right now, especially because we got lots going on. Or at least I do.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, definitely. I feel like we should do just like we were saying, you know, different times and stuff. We should try to do one that's like late at night or something, like a 10 p.m. record or something.
SPEAKER_03That'd be fun. Yeah, because you know I think your emotions obviously change throughout the day. Like I think I'm the most confident and um happy at night.
SPEAKER_02Oh, really?
SPEAKER_03In the morning I feel but I feel stressed out, anxiety a little bit. Yeah, I feel like I insecure.
SPEAKER_02I feel like I feel like a little piece of shit every morning when I wake up.
SPEAKER_01I feel really ugly.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, just feel so bad. Yeah, no, I feel like the morning sometimes is my thing, and then the second I look at my phone, I'm like, oh man. But I'm listening to, I told you, the four agreements, and oh my god, I know this is the third time now, and this time I'm actually listening. Just man, it makes me like such a good book. I know, and I need to get better. Like the first thing he said, impeccable word, and I'm like, I talk shit all day, every day, and I'm like, oh, and then they were saying one of the things he said today is like if you a sin isn't just like what we think it is of the Ten Commandments. He was saying, like, a sin is like going against yourself, doing something like against yourself is a sin. And I was like, oh, we never even thought about it that way.
SPEAKER_03So there's I just found it. There's a combo five. So um for anyone that's listening, it's funny. Uh New York Bookshub.com. I just found it for 40 bucks. You can get hired. All five books. It's the four agreements is the first one. The mastery of love, the fifth agreement, the voice of knowledge, and the circle of fire. Those are all five of them.
SPEAKER_02Oh, okay. So we have the four agreements and the circle of fire. Just so us, the beginning and the end.
SPEAKER_03I know. Yeah. I actually have all of them, but the fifth agreement, I can't find it. But um God, they're life-changing books.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_03They really like knock you on your ass and make you realize like look into yourself and then be like, oh yeah, maybe I'm the problem sometimes.
SPEAKER_02Well, and it's like it kind of gives you that perspective, you know, it's not just you being a problem. Like they were talking about in the park, just because I just started the domestication of like we think it of like a wife or something, but really they're like you're doing it even as a child, you're being domesticated in your life, and you're constantly told, no, no, no, no, no. And if you don't have parents that reward you, it's constantly no, no, no, you're wrong, you're wrong, you're wrong your entire life growing up.
SPEAKER_03Hold on, let me grab this book. Okay, so oh my gosh, what is it? Um another good book. I swear in like times of trouble, obviously the Bible, but there's some books that I have been reading that have been life-changing. Yeah, which ones I'm gonna find them because I got all crazy and started packing my stuff the other day. Oh, shouldn't it do that? Oh okay. How to heal after narcissistic. So it's by Carolyn Strawson, so we give her credit. Um but anyways, it's a good thought. But hold on, there was a part I read and just keep talking because I'll find it. Um but it talks about that, about domestication, about basically having to undo yourself and rebuild, but you can't be the person you are meant to be, and you can say all day long, oh I'm healed and I'm working on healing, but you never I realize never actually do that until you go way back in the past.
SPEAKER_02You gotta it's like an onion, you know. And sometimes you have to to help you understand, you know, because sometimes it's like I don't know, you know, you don't know or understand something, and then it's like, oh, well, if you were treated this way throughout, you know, some important growing years, or even you know, in your relationship as a young wife, you know, if you're treated that way, it kind of warps your perception and your understanding and your beliefs.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. So I guess but I was trying to figure out like how to, yeah, I agree. Um best way to put it was like moving from like a freeze state of mind to thawing out. Is that kind of that's kind of weird? Yeah, yeah, like you're frozen in um because you have you put your your nervous system into shock. And so you're just being like you always say, going to survival mode, right? Yeah. Well, figuring out what put you in survival mode, and then you're not just in survival mode, you have these survival responses. There's things that I realize I do that I think are normal and they're not, and they're literally just respond responders of what I never healed from. So, like being like uh an inner critic of myself, overly a caretaker, addiction, anxiety, depression, um, disassociation, anger, impatience, all the OCD, all these things are to me. I think people keep telling you, oh, like you're um you that oh you're just that's just who I am. Oh, like that's just who I am, or that's who you are. Or you know, it's not. It was a way of coping. So if you can go back and uncope those things, you know what I mean? They're called like emotional wounds, exiles or whatever, then you can actually heal. And then I found like in this book too, tools to actually do that. Obviously, breath work, journaling, meditation. But um, a lot of people are coming back around to doing freaking vision boards, and I seen for the first time it was probably about all my stuff. So did I. Okay, we need to do that. There's an emotional vision board, it's not about your goals, it's about yes, uh I read it today. I was like, I love this. It's like all the self-care.
SPEAKER_02I should show you a couple old ones, but keep going. Sorry, yeah.
SPEAKER_03So it's a it's called a self-care vision board, and it's you just only focus on that, and then uh I thought that was so cool to do. And while you're doing that, it asks you to like within it, you know, tell yourself 30 good things you're 30 things you're good at. You know, I couldn't do that. I sat there with an index card and I listed maybe five, and I was so upset with myself because I couldn't list 30 things.
SPEAKER_02No, but there's thinking about, I'm sure, too. Like, you know, you but what that's sad.
SPEAKER_03That's how little we think of ourselves, and then yeah, but then you write a list of not apologizing because I'm an over-apologizer. I always go, Oh, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, and I shouldn't be saying sorry all the time. So thanking instead. So I wrote another list to the 30 things I was good at, and then what I'm not apologizing for. I'm gonna say thank you for forgiving myself. I'm not gonna say sorry anymore. I'm not I said thank you for being patient with myself, talking to myself, thank you for staying healthy and focused. Thank you for loving me, thank you for not comparing me, and thank you every day for gratitude. So those were two little things I did today, they were little projects, but the three things I struggled bad and I was upset about it.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, well, it's hard to see sometimes, especially when you're feeling bad, but I can list like probably a million things about you. So don't get discouraged.
SPEAKER_03So I think that's yeah, that should be could be something we add in our little our uh maybe it's a thing. We can give everybody little things to do to build confidence. That could be one of them.
SPEAKER_02Well, even like maybe we do like a say something nice about yourself or something that you're proud of. Um there's a funny movie that's um the way they do it is really funny, but the idea is really good. And it's you've probably heard of it, like they do peaks and valleys. Like, okay, tell us your peaks and valleys on the project. Highs and lows.
SPEAKER_03What highs and lows, yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_02So people use the words like peaks and valleys, you know. What are your peaks and valleys on this project or whatever? It's like a work thing or something. I like that better, but yeah, we could even do our peaks and valleys in life, like you know, our peak. Oh, we started another, you know, here's our next episode. That's awesome. You know, the valley is going through emotional stress to get here.
SPEAKER_03Okay, okay. That's how we could start. Let's start, let's rewind. Okay, I got hey, I mean, hey, what's your peaks and valleys? Um okay, let's start with your peaks and valleys. You're you go first.
SPEAKER_02Um okay, my peaks.
SPEAKER_03Um, and my that's the most unorganized introduction on the planet. Yeah. Um, hey everyone.
SPEAKER_02Um by the way, my peak.
SPEAKER_03That feels like I'm telling everyone how unsecure I was. Yeah, right.
SPEAKER_02What is that? Um, what did they say? Emotional dumping or whatever word vomit. I just vomited from the mouth. I didn't, that was terrible. Um sometimes um once you get it out there, um, other people can help you sort through it. The good people will help you sort through it and tell you, like, okay, yeah, this is a yes, yes, and this like no, calm down, you know. Um the good people will help, but um okay, peaks, peaks, peaks, peaks. Peaks. Um oh I trying to do that. I'm trying to get another shirt made. Who knows? It could be a scam.
SPEAKER_03Um no, it's not. Not again, not again. So crappy.
SPEAKER_02Um, but yeah, so hopefully I'm getting another shirt done, so that's exciting. And then valleys. Um I I was just telling Justin, I think I'm going through metamorphosis, uh, metamorphosis or something because I just feel like my body's changing. The way I'm thinking is changing and like my mind, and I'm going through things that like normally I wouldn't, I don't feel like I would experience as strongly or whatever. And so I my valleys are I told you, I think I have a Leo emotions. Um they're just very strong. And when they're great, it's great. But when they're not so great, towards what? What? Explain towards what? Um, just like in general, yeah, just like in life. Like even like okay, me and Justin, you know, being engaged. Um, you know, I'm going through this is like for me, like my first, like, not my first serious relationship, but my first serious, you know, healthy relationship. Um, and so you kind of like I sometimes think of like the things that I went through. And you know, sometimes like I need Justin support or I'll feel insecure about something, you know, or whatever. Um so like learning to like lean on him has been oh, because you've been so independent for so long. Yeah, and just like everything now, like you know, um that's scary to do.
SPEAKER_03Like I Andy has a cousin that I'm gonna I don't want to say names because I don't want to be disrespectful. People don't want to be talked about, but it's not a bad thing. Uh he has a cousin that was like it was just her and her kids for however long, you know, 15, 20 years. And then she gets into a relationship, same thing. I think she seems pretty happy, and they're I think they got married actually recently, but um it was you could tell it was a scary thing for her because she spent so much long being independent, and that's such a hard thing to do as a woman in this world. And then when you finally feel like you're not you never master it, but when you feel like you got it down to let that go, it's scary, probably. I can't imagine that for me. I feel like I've lived the opposite life, and it's that's scary for me now on the other end, because now I'm 40 years old and I'm like, oh, I have to not lean on somebody.
SPEAKER_02Not that I feel like I ever could fully, anyways, but yeah, no, and I was thinking, like, I I mean, obviously I wasn't married for 20 years and stuff.
SPEAKER_03Um, but yeah, the I need that's a strong thing to do though, to let that go. So your independence because you're you're a very independent, strong woman.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, and it's like, and I know you know, we kind of like the way we think, like I was kind of explaining to Justin, like the way I think, the way that I am, like, it's got me to hear, like I have to trust myself, you know, and yeah, and that's where like and sometimes it's like okay, well now I have to trust this other person, has my well-being, you know, at heart as well. Um, and I know we've been together almost five years now. Five years, it'll be five years in January, yeah. Wow, it was fast. Like, yeah, and I'm like, but I feel like in the beginning, especially because we had so much going on, some of those things it was different. And now that we live together, it's a little different, you know.
SPEAKER_03Like, I feel like I we guys live far apart too. Yeah, so that was different, yeah.
SPEAKER_02And so now that we live together, um, I'm like, oh, okay, here's some unresolved things that now me and Justin get to work through together. What a sweetie I am. We bring him over. You didn't know this about me? What are you talking about? But to be fair, and Justin can probably vouch for me, like I was very clear, like about everything, how I am, like what I need, and that stuff. So I felt like I wouldn't have been doing that in my 20s, you know what I mean?
SPEAKER_03Do you think that came with age and experience, or that came with fear? I always wonder if any everything I do is based from fear or experience.
SPEAKER_02I know, and that's what that book talks about is that how we all live in fear. Um, and I definitely feel like that, um, like with fear at the top of my mind. And I do know there was like a while where and it was like right when everything was kind of I was leaving Colorado, I was so good mentally and like so strong mentally, I felt like oh, I was just in such a happy place. Like, even if bad things were happening, it was kind of like it wasn't real. I don't know how to explain it. Yeah, I was like, Yeah, this totally fucking sucks. You were the observer of it, of your life. Yeah, it's like it sucks. And sometimes, like, I you know, I wasn't always sleep perfect. Um, but I have to say, I wasn't listening to music, like I did not listen to I listened to a little bit of Taylor Swift back then and like a little bit of stuff, but I mostly listened to classical or like healing frequencies, and so and I remember getting like so irritated with people when I would like be in their cars or whatever, and it's like boom, chaka, boom, choke, and I'm like, oh my god, I feel like my grandma right now. Like, are they giving you a headache? And it was like, I can't see, yeah. And then obviously, and which is so funny is I resorted back to like you know, a better version of myself, obviously, a more mature version, but just back to those all those instincts that I was before I even left Colorado once I moved back, you know. I had to like rework it keeping them and someone stayed.
SPEAKER_03Did it make it harder coming back to your hometown? I always feel like I swear I drive just one hour away, and I don't I'm not a fan of where I live right now because I'm not I like the heat, but man, yesterday I went back to where we grip and I cannot stand that place. It doesn't it make you like feel like it gives me yuck, like ick. Like I don't even know how to explain it. And it's like I shouldn't be that way, but it's like, gosh, people are so awful there. It makes you not want to be there. Like it's I don't know. I just go through there like thank you for the growth and bye.
SPEAKER_02You know, like I don't know how to explain it to people, and sometimes like I know I'm a little bit drama and stuff, like I get it, but I do like when I look back, I would, especially when I was in Colorado, I would felt like it was sinking sand, like when I was there sometimes. And like, oh my god, like it's literally pulling you down, like you know, yeah.
SPEAKER_03Um it's like you go there and I swear to God, I don't care who you are, it's like you never get to get past that like time period of your life. It doesn't matter what you do, where you are, how old you are. The second you go there, it's like, oh hi, I'm gonna treat you just like you I did when you were 18. Yeah, like no, that's not how like no. And that's something I feel like that towns cursed, I swear.
SPEAKER_02I know they do have like some interesting things. Um, it was so weird though, right before I moved to Florida, like in 2022, I was so happy out there. It was the happiest I had been until like since I had moved back from Colorado, like the happiest, like in a good place with all of my friends, like all of the stuff. I mean, I was single, I wasn't even dating anybody. It was just a good place. Like me and Kel were in a good place, you know, just the animals, everybody was in a good place. And before you made back from Colorado? That was no, when I that was like in 2021. Oh, okay. Like around 2021, it was I know COVID was happening and all that stuff, but I felt like I was getting along with my mom, hanging out with my brothers and their wives, and um stuff like that. But and I know it sounds weird, but I'm like, it doesn't last, you know, because you have things that go on in life, and then I sometimes, you know, attribute it to them, like, oh, you guys are the problem. It's this fucking earth over here. Um, but sometimes just being so close to family, you know, can cause that stuff. Just because everybody, nobody gives. Well, it's not that we don't, but you give like your your straight fucking no filters, you know what I mean? Like raw emotion to family.
SPEAKER_03And sometimes I think sometimes family has no boundaries. They just like think they can just be all open your shit.
SPEAKER_02My mom. I didn't tell you what my mom I was talking to my brother and his wife, and she's like, You know what your mom did. I'm like, I don't know what you do. And and then Justin, my brother, gets on the phone and they're telling me um that him and my mom called Britney's ex, whatever, they have a baby together or like a son together, he's like 10 or 11. They called the ex and wanted to talk to his mom to see how what she thought of Britney. And I was like, Wait, what? Why exactly? What the fuck are you guys doing? And they're like, Well, because Britney always talks about how nice it was there and how great it was over there. So we want to know. And I'm like, you guys, first of all, like I can't, I don't even have words, but the words that I am gonna find is you don't reach out to someone's ex-mother-in-law to find out about them.
SPEAKER_03That's probably the worst person you can call. They're gonna always have something bad to say.
SPEAKER_02Well, and then like if Britney and her think like Britney thinks she has a good relationship with her, and you're gonna come back and tell her, like, oh, by the way, she's a giant bitch, Brittany. You know, it's like you don't need to crush her little cigarette. Yeah. Oh my gosh.
SPEAKER_03Well, that's like the number one not person to call.
SPEAKER_02Oh, and this is even funnier. I actually did a really good job. You'd probably be proud of me. So Justin, I told you I met his ex that he has with his his daughter with, and his mom or whatever we were at the thing, she's like, Oh yeah, I remember you and Justin, you guys like sugar. And of course, I'm irritated. So I'm like, oh, instantly. And I'm like, okay, calm the fuck down, psycho, psycho kitty, and just you know, whatever. And so we're leaving, and I just couldn't wait to tell Justin. And so we're walking out, and I was like, Your mom said made sure that everybody knew that you and her like sugar, sugar, sugar. Then um, Justin's like, and he's like, Yeah, I forgot to tell her not to mention things from 30 years ago. And I was like, and this is why we don't hang out with in-laws. I'm like, this is why the moms aren't around around.
SPEAKER_03Why did she say that about sugar though?
SPEAKER_02I don't know. Yeah, I'm confused. I know they were talking about something, and of course, another I was like, of course, I have what they're talking about the ex? Yeah, she was talking about why like oh yeah, I just love sugar. I swear to god, like Yeah, I know, but that's why I say you'd be proud of me. All I said is, yep, and that's why we don't hang out with moms or with in laws.
SPEAKER_03Well, I swear I told you this before, like I've learned everything not to be when I become one. Yeah. You know, yeah. But I do look at things like Much as we love our sons, if my when my son comes home with someone, if I see that he is happy, or I I'm not gonna know every detail because I'm not there all the time, nor am I gonna try to because it's not my business to, but I will know one thing, I would never try to make that person feel bad. I don't care what's going on. So, like her doing that to you, it's like, what the fuck? Like, why? For what reason? Did you have to be a total bitch right now?
SPEAKER_02I told Justin, I don't obviously I don't think she would do that on purpose, and I'm like, but it can definitely make somebody feel a certain way when they're sitting there next to you holding his hand. I'm like, let his hand go. Ew. Like sugar.
SPEAKER_03I love sugar until I heard that's I just actually was listening to a podcast that said uh about the um narcissist. I'm on this narcissist thing right now. It said most there was a study done, and 90 plus percent of narcissistic men have a toxic relationship with their mother. Oh is that crazy or what? Oh I believe moms do the most.
SPEAKER_02I hope not because sometimes I worry about you know telling crews how they're quiet and stuff. I'm like, are they fucked up or are they just quiet and kind?
SPEAKER_03Yes, are we destroying them?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, but um, I think dads obviously can with men too. Um, but yeah, I think sometimes like a lot of times you hear stuff and it's like the mom was, you know, beating them fucking awkward, weird to them.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, yeah, I think so. Um that's a whole nother episode, I feel like my emotions are pretty high and strong on that topic right now, so I don't think I should talk much about it.
SPEAKER_02Like, yeah, we'll come back to that one. I'm a little too back later in a couple months, maybe a year, because emotions are flying right now on that one. That's why I told Justin, I was like, I can't really talk about things until I got to a point in my head where they can be funny, you know. Like I was telling and I laugh at morbid stuff too. So yeah, we definitely have a twisted sense of humor, so we can just both comedy and like you know, the twisted stuff, definitely.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, so when we both say, no, we're not talking about that, it's glaring. Okay, must be really fucked up still from that. Really bad because yeah.
SPEAKER_02I was actually telling Justin, I was like, sometimes I don't like, and I don't know if you do this, but sometimes if I have an emotional something that makes me feel bad, I get angry first. I'm like, I get so angry, and I'm like, and I don't like that, and then like later I'll cry and be like, but I'll act like a beast for a minute. And I'm like, but I told him, I was like, I think because I say the brain doesn't know the difference between real pain and emotional pain. And I was like, imagine walking down the street and somebody punches you in the face. If you're sitting there crying, you're gonna get fucked up, and so you have to get mad.
SPEAKER_03I read that a lot lately, and it actually freaks me out when I think about when it keeps telling you, not just with that, but with a lot of stuff that your brain cannot determine basically what's real and what's not. Like you could sit there and close your eyes and be like, you know, imagine this whole situation, and your brain does not know emotionally if it did really happen or not.
SPEAKER_02So I'm scary. Like, well, that's where manifesting comes, you know, and you got to use it for the good stuff. And sometimes we're so negatively thinking in our minds we can't go there. Um, but that's why manifesting and thinking, and it's hard for me to do, but they'll tell you, like, you know, picture it in your mind, um, you know, what you want and what you and it's like you have to exercise that in your mind, and then your body will start to feel it and you'll start admitting that, and that's you know what you're embodying for that empty vision, super crazy. Freaks me out things, how powerful our minds are.
SPEAKER_03Um I feel like I don't even know what to bring up because there's so much stuff we can talk about. I'm afraid to bring up one topic and then it just fly off into the deep end. Yeah, no, it just no I did that I wrote uh Pastor Matt Brown. Um, you know, he can talk about stuff on his podcast, the debrief, right? Oh, okay. And he'll yeah, so you can go on his website and you can ask him a question. And I asked him a question about my personal issues right now and my marriage and life, and curious if he writes back because he doesn't write back. Him and his wife, they're writing back is they are on the debrief live talking and they'll open up your question, read it out loud, and it's on their episode. Oh wow, okay, would you write? Sorry, I'm getting starting to um I don't think it's gonna let me reread what oh actually well, never mind. I did save it. Hold on. So this is getting real unreally personal. Okay, you don't have to, but I don't care. No, it's fine because this is what we our whole thing's about is being real. If anyone has questions, they can ask me. I don't have anything to hide, so I said, Hi, Pastor Matt Brown. I don't know his wife's name. I felt awful because I think she says it in the thing, but she's not always on there, so then I I just said, Um, I've been watching you and your wife, so I made sure to include her, you know. And I just said, uh, man, my husband are on the verge of I don't want to say the D word, but I don't know where we're at right now after 24 years together. And I said, I'm 40 and we have two children, 18 and 19, and we've always been an extremely close family, traveled together, supporting our kids, and all they do. Professional off-road racing has also been a huge part of our lives that brought us close together. We have always been very involved parents. About a year ago, my husband unexpectedly decided we were moving from our hometown, and where we brought up the kids for almost 20 years. It was a difficult move, but we supported his goals, his ideas, and what his motive was. So we moved out here, um, started our new life and building our new home. And then I said then I began feeling that something wasn't right. I discovered some things over the past two or three years, and then I listed those things. Oh um I went to detail about the things that I felt I discovered. Oh but I did because he talks about it, yeah. Right? It's something he talks about and think is fucking weird sometimes.
SPEAKER_02What you're going to the church to get answers, and that's where you should probably be the most honest if they are the church they are, you know.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, and then I even said I may be wrong. Um, you know, from what he's saying, I'm wrong. And but I just don't feel like I fully am, and only because I know what my eyeballs seem, and I also know when people get very defensive, that's usually not a good sign, right? And so I said that, and then um I said when things escalate, when there's confrontation, he usually leaves, goes to hotel, I don't see him for days or weeks. I said, I'm in no way, shape, or form pretending that I'm have been perfect in this marriage. I haven't. What I am asking is, am I caught in a painful cycle of wondering whether confronting him is destroying our family or whether staying silent would have been slowly better, although it would have slowly destroyed me. Sometimes I regret ever saying anything, but I also know I couldn't continue living with this pain, uncertainty, and feeling like I don't know who I am married to. You're gonna cry. And I said, um, I think that I need to seek help if that is what I need to do. If I really am crazy and saying things, I need to know this, you know. And I need to know it from a non-biased. My mom's gonna tell me what she what I want to hear. He's gonna tell me what I don't want to hear. I mean, there's always all these people, but I need to know like, am I fucking crazy or am I not? Like, this is not okay. So I said, my all in all, my question is can someone who continually denies a deflex eventually become willing to face the truth and be honest with their spouse and family, or will everything continue to turn around and be my fault? And I will always play the villain in my story. Oh I said, I've leaned on God and my faith more than ever through all this, it has given me strength, but watching my family that we built over 24 years potentially fall apart is still one of the most painful things I've ever experienced. And I need to know if I am the villain or if I can continue to do this cycle. So that's what I wrote him yesterday. We'll see if you guys got I feel like it was pretty in-depth. I'm hoping maybe he will be like, Oh wow, this is a fucked up situation. Let's make an episode on this, you know.
SPEAKER_01Oh, that's gonna break my heart. Oh yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02Okay, well, I feel like you are going to the right places, Jess, you know. Yeah, sometimes I know like sometimes self-destruction is the easiest thing, and just like you know, having a drink or something or acting wild or doing something shitty, um, sometimes seems like it's gonna make us feel better. Um and we know it doesn't. And I'm glad we're at the age now where it's like we turn away instead of like, you know, let's go act crazy.
SPEAKER_03I have been staying so close to God and like level headed. Um yeah, I'm not I'm in sober everything. Like I am staying solely focused on my health, my well-being, my staying clear-headed because I really want to get to the bottom of this. You it's just been 24 years with somebody and not just focusing on the person, but building an entire life and your entire identity around that is scary to then sit there and say, like, it's discouraging to sit there and have built all that and then go, Oh, I feel like I'm looked at as a villain. When even my own daughter like won't speak to me now, and it's like I know I've made mistakes, but I have spent my entire life genuinely loving and caring for these people, just to be made out to go to bed every night and be like, I'm a horrible person. I don't feel like that's true, and it's unfair for me to carry that weight, and I'm tired of carrying it, so I'm like, the only way I can actually get through this is by staying clear-headed, focused, healthy, and honest with myself, God, and everyone around me. And I'm hoping in all that that his truth will come out, and whether we stay together on it through the end of this or not, I I'm not even scared or worried about that. I just want I want us both to be happy, and I don't think he could confidently say that. I maybe he can, but I I truly do want him happy. I don't think he wants the same for me, but I'm in a place in my heart and mind now where I want that for both of us, whether it be together or not. You know, but I just cannot handle living like I'm the villain anymore. So I'm tired of it. People are human, they make mistakes, and and you know, with all that said and done, I think people like we talked about earlier, no woman or man, but mostly women, don't wake up and go, you know what, today I want to be an awful bitch. Yes, I want to be shitty to everybody, I want to be in a fucking bad mood, I want to be an asshole and make everybody's life difficult. Like, no, I don't no one does that, and I didn't do that the last however many years or to this day. I didn't wake up and want to be difficult, a bitch, financially annoying. I don't want to do any of these things. This is also thought because of reasoning. I think we learned that in science, right? For every cause, there's an effect. You know, you don't just I mean that's common sense. And it can't be the effect can always be, well, what did you do? What did you what are you guilty of?
SPEAKER_02Okay, in the book, Jess, that I could read it again too. Um, he talks about humans being, and I'm guilty of making people pay for this too. But anyways, humans being the only species on the planet that has to like um like live with their sins like over a thousand times. Most things like have a mistake and they get there nothing happens, their life, you know, they move on, but humans have to relive it a thousand times because of the way our brains work, and then because other people are rubbing your face in it and whatever. And I was like, so true. We just sit there constantly feeling bad about feeling bad.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, it's not it's like I just don't and here's the thing, I do, and people say it all day long like people only make you feel bad because it makes them feel better about what they feel bad about. And I true, I truly do believe that is a thing. But at what extent do you look in the mirror and go, I'm tired of fucking making other people feel shitty because I don't want to take accountability for the shitty person I can be. Yeah, I don't and I've done that, like I'm tired of being like blaming everybody or like dang, you know what? I made fucked up decisions because I chose to make them. I'm gonna choose to be a better person. I'm not gonna go, well, I made that shitty decision because you did that. Like, no, you can't, no, no, that's not how this always works, you know. Definitely, so like that's a hard, hard truth to I think a lot of people have a hard time facing, and that could be a make or break of people's relationships, of how they feel about themselves, about their sobriety, about a lot of things. If you simply can't be honest with yourself and take accountability for all the good and bad, not just all the good you do. Because that's like where I'm at right now. It's like, okay, everyone, I have taken accountability for everything I'm shitty at all the time. But I feel like that's a new thing.
SPEAKER_02Huh? I constantly will relive the bad things I did. Well, you did this one time, so they should probably be allowed to treat you like shit.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, but like, what about all the good stuff I did? Like, does that not matter? I mean, like, it's so crazy to me how roles are set like that with people. And I feel like in my life relationship right now, it's always been set I'm the villain and Andy's the the six villain, you know, and it's like, no. Well, but I think that's also composure because I don't explode, I don't ever want people to look at him bad, you know. I just said something so mean.
SPEAKER_02We're gonna have to cut that. I can't even. I hope you were talking over me. I'm not gonna repeat someone because I'm like believe I said that. Um God stopped recording.
SPEAKER_01Um yeah, um, you're good, Jeff.
SPEAKER_02You were young and made mistakes, and sometimes honestly, because I do know some of your mistakes, sometimes I don't even think I give you all the grace you deserve. Um, because I think back, like I remember you we both were staying by ourselves, sleeping together in bed, like pregnant, you know, and like how hard that is. And I'm like, dang, you were sitting there having to do all this stuff, and you had stuff going on with your sister and your family, you know, there was like a lot of stuff going on at that time.
SPEAKER_03No, I never next like I don't all those things that make you who you are, make you a stronger, better person, right? It shouldn't be the very things that crucify you, and I feel like that's where I'm at in my life. Like instead of looking back for me, I do look back and go, getting all that stuff made me a better, like stronger person, made me who I am. I I wouldn't change some of it, I would, but for the most part, not any of it because it did make me who I am. But that's for me to say, I don't think the other things should be things I should be crucified for, judged and labeled, and did and uh determine who I am, and they do still. And I'm like, who do you think you are, or you guys think you are, to dictate who I am based on things in the past, especially people that don't even put the effort into be around me enough today to know who I've become? They just say they know, but no, you don't. I mean, yeah, like okay, here's a question. Do you remember I asked you this? I told Andy, hey, who's your best friend? Remember? Oh yeah. Of course when he asked me that, I'm gonna say you too. Like Mosa, and he said, you know, two of his friends, and um I was like, okay, that's given, because I don't know for a man, it's not like oh my wife's my best friend. It's not gonna, they're not gonna say that. But then after a second, I'm like, okay, well, I said you. And he's like, Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, you too. Like, how it's like, oh, but I feel like he didn't really feel that way. Are you supposed to feel that way for it to be like a real good relationship? I don't know anymore.
SPEAKER_02So I know this sounds like awful, but I'm always like measuring people's relationships, like just by little things, and I feel like I'm super fortunate because I have so many friends that I'm really close with, you know. And I get to I feel like sometimes like I'm peeking through a window at their life because I know you know it's stuff. But I feel like not that we all say the same things because like we don't, um, but I feel like we all do kind of have that like we want to be that person, but it's maybe not, or I don't know how to explain it. Like we all have like our girlfriends are our best friends, you know what I mean? And yeah, the boys are like, yes, they're friends and that, but you know, they drive us nuts in some sense, but you know, you love them in the other sense, and so I feel like it doesn't like you think friendship is important to have. Do you think that's like a make or break in like a absolute friends, absolutely a thousand percent be friends and be able to hang out and all those things, but like some stuff I talk to people about, I don't talk to Justin the same way, you know what I mean? Yeah, and not like not because he's not my best friend or whatever, it's just like you and I, you know, we've known each other 30 fucking years, you know, or men think different. Like I know my dad definitely thinks different than like you know, women think you grew up with brothers and stuff like that, you know. And so, like, if I were to tell my dad, like you know, like Jessica's worried about Andy's cheating, well, she shouldn't worry about that stuff. Like, what the fuck? But why? We need answers, why it would just be like sometimes men just women, you know, worry about things, and men are just like, oh, this and that. Yeah. Um, and that's where I feel like the friendship thing. It's like, yeah, best friends, absolutely. Justin, we hang at him and Justin and I hang out every day, like this and that, you know.
SPEAKER_03But I could see you like that's so that's where I feel like that. Like, I hate that I'm like, God, like I feel like that with I don't remember we're talking about we're so simple. I really fucking am a simple person. I just wear the god frustrates me. Like, so simple. I just hey be nice to me, I'll be nice to you. I've said this to my own kids. I'm a dragon, like you call me sometimes. Like a dragon, because you are a little shit. That's why. So, like, if you're nice to me, I'll be nice to you. If you're generous to me, I'll be generous to you. If you're considerate of me, I'll be considerate of you. Like, I have my back, I'm gonna have your back. It's not that hard. But if you disrespect me, I'm not gonna disrespect you, but I'm not gonna treat you the same anymore. I'm not gonna be open to you, I'm not gonna be all these things. I don't know why that's so hard for people to understand.
SPEAKER_02I was just listening to this thing or reading this thing or whatever about um kids and parents and like how the love goes, and that if you are constantly just giving love to your kid without them reciprocating or showing appreciation, they'll never understand, and you'll kind of always have that relationship. And like you have to you have to teach them that.
SPEAKER_03And I actually think that you did a good job teaching Bella and Cruz that, like you would kind of I think I'm lucky, a very respectful, super nice, like like I mean, not always nice, I guess. Um but no, yeah, I don't know. But yeah, I think we both you did too. I think we got very lucky with our kids, but um we're gonna always have some things, challenges, but we got super lucky with them. But when in other things like friendships or relationships, I don't get it. I'm like, why am I? And I always like actually ask myself because uh recently, especially recently, being told you don't think you're look, you're the problem. And I actually sat there and asked myself that like, am I? But I don't have all these problems in all my relationships or friendships, just the one or the two, yeah, just the one or two, which is why you didn't cheating doing shitty things, yeah. Like just you and and your mom, like having issues with the same fucking people over and over. I don't think it's me, no. I actually don't, I don't think so. I think it's not normal the relationship to have as a grown man with your mother. So say it.
SPEAKER_02So put this out there.
SPEAKER_03Put this out there right now because I am so afraid. It's raining here, by the way. Yeah, we have like monsoon weather right now. I love it. Uh lucky. I like cooled it down by like 10 degrees, so it's not 140, it's only 130 now.
SPEAKER_00Oh lucky.
SPEAKER_03I wish we'd get thunderstorms. I keep telling Jess that we're barely getting any thunderstorms. I love it. It's like making me have that feeling because I went to the store the other. Oh, I go to the store all the time, but I'm gonna go to the house.