MIS(TER)GENDERED Season 1 E2 CONNIE BUNA

 Join host Sar White in conversation with Connie Buna, a devoted parent, real estate pro, and lead singer of Vancouver’s Queer As Funk, as they reflect on joy, music, and the connections that fuel their life.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

I gratefully acknowledge this series was recorded on the unceded traditional territories of the Musqueam, Squamish, and Slewatooth nations. Indigenous peoples have maintained stewardship and jurisdiction over these lands since time immemorial.

SPEAKER_00 0:18

I felt amazing. I can remember that it was in like on the dance floor of that bar that I like kissed a woman for the first time. First time at the bar. First time. You go. Yeah, I was really at a mission.

SPEAKER_01 0:41

Welcome to Mr. Gender, the show where we swap labels for lived experience and get curious about life beyond the binary. Today we meet Connie Buna. When she's not loving up her family or supporting her real estate clients, you can find Connie Groovin on stage as a lead singer of Vancouver band Queer is Fun. Let's join the conversation. Welcome, Connie. Thanks, pal. Thanks so much for being here. I'm excited to be here. Tell us who you are. Like give us, you know, a snapshot of who you are today, like how you identify your age, your right culture, ink. Kind of little bits that will paint a picture for us, right? Okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:18

I identify as queer. I use uh she they pronouns. I am a married mother of two. I am a business owner here in Vancouver. I am the lead singer in a band, which you may have heard of. Queer as funk.

SPEAKER_01 1:34

Best dance band in Vancouver. Thank you very much. So let's let's uh dig in a bit. Then I think it's really great to get a sense of where folks have come from and how they got to who they are in their comfortable skin, if it is, which it seems for you.

SPEAKER_00 1:53

Yeah. I grew up in Ontario, so I was born in Toronto. Both my parents born in Toronto. Um my father, first generation immigrant family from it from Italy, and my mom mixed European heritage. Um and uh, you know, we had a really awesome upbringing. I'm the eldest of of three. So I have two younger sisters, grew up in the city when we were young, and then we moved out to the burbs just before high school. Great time to move. Um, and you know, I think if I if I look back at my my upbringing in my history, I was always raised in a very warm, welcoming family. I was also raised in a very Catholic environment. So I went all through school in Catholic school from you know kindergarten through high school. Um as a young child, and and like I mean like as little as two, three, um, I was always, you know, what you may have called classified as a tomboy, let's say. Um I I definitely, you know, my awareness as a young person was that I just identified in my brain as I must be a boy because all of my play and all of my attraction was I wanted to be the boy in whatever the scene was that we were playing. I wanted to play with the boys, I wanted to play sports, I did not want to wear a shirt, um, I did not want to wear dresses, and I really liked girls. And then in when we did this big move out to the suburbs, um, was sort of a pivotal time in puberty for me, um, where my body started physically changing quite a bit. I developed like very large breasts to my absolute horror. Um, and I also it came to a point where I needed to stop and, you know, certainly stop not wearing uh like I had to wear normal bathing suits and all of those other things that I hadn't previously. And um, and I needed at that moment I remember having like privately making a conscious decision that I needed to alter the way that I looked because I needed to be more appealing to boys in my brain. I thought that that was the way that I would fit in and sort of blend in, especially because again, I was in a a brand new school environment and community environment.

SPEAKER_01 4:23

Did you did you know what queerness or gayness was then? I didn't. I don't think so. I didn't.

SPEAKER_00 4:29

I I think that I I didn't have any personal connection to anyone that was queer. Um, although, you know, as I got older, my mom would talk to me about, you know, uh gay friends that she had as a young woman, but those were not people as that were part of our family and our connection, and I had no other identifiable older people around me or peers even that were out or queer.

SPEAKER_01 4:59

So sorry, for year 46. So this is in the This was like early 90s. Early 90s, okay.

SPEAKER_00 5:05

Yeah, so moving in like 90, 91 in that time. Okay. And um, yeah. So I I think that it was, you know, I I I played lots of sports. I had lots of um, I always had lots of male friends. They were my primary sort of social groups, but it was a small community that we moved to, so like all the people hung out together too. So it was sort of a blend. I was very I was I was totally accepted for you know, in my in my efforts of trying to be feminine, I was quite a tomboy. And um But you had skirts, right? Catholics were well when I went to high school, this is where I really had to start. Yeah, this is where I really had to start confronting the idea that, okay, like, yes, I had to wear you could I at that point we were allowed to wear pants or a kilt was the other uniform option for girls. Um, and you know, at a certain point my mom bought me a kilt, and then I was like, okay, I guess I should start wearing it. Seems like that's what most of the girls are wearing. Right. Uh grew my hair long. I had very, very long curly hair. And at about 15, I I found myself a very sweet boyfriend. Just like a football player, lovely, lovely guy. We had, we were together all through high school until first year of university. Um, and it was in my high school experience that I, especially as I started getting closer to graduation, that I had this awareness. And and I was recently speaking with a friend about Lilith Fair. And I attended Lilith Fair in like I think it was 97 or 98. And it was the first experience I had ever had personally where I visibly saw lesbians. Okay. How old were you then? 17. Okay. So-ish. Uh-huh. And I think in retrospect, it cracked something. It cracked something open in me around it something I always knew, like inside my core. Um, but it definitely like I started really thinking about this idea of being a new person when I went away to university. And having the freedom to explore that.

SPEAKER_01 7:35

Hmm. So what happened with the boyfriend? And then what when did you did you go far to university?

SPEAKER_00 7:41

No, I didn't go super far. And it was within the first semester that, you know, my boyfriend at the time went to a university in the same town, but we weren't at the same school. And even before we went, I was having discussions with him, like it would be better for us both if you had some freedom in this time. And, you know, uh it's it's an interesting trajectory, but it was, you know, I I I entered university with um a very clear awareness that I knew that I wanted to explore this part of me. Um, I also was taking some women's studies classes at that time, that's what the it was called. Right. And um, and you know, naturally I met some of my first queer friends. There was one gay bar in Waterloo, it's called the Renaissance. Um, and it was in that first semester that I went to a gay bar for the first time. Um I felt amazing. I can remember that it was in like on the dance floor of that bar that I like kissed a woman for the first time. First time at the bar. First time. You go. Yeah, I was really I was at a mission. And and that was like again, it was a transformative experience for me. Um yeah, I I really like of the people that I have remained connected to through university, it was it was my friends within the queer community that became like my core people that I would remember, stayed connected with, um, had a huge influence on me.

SPEAKER_01 9:20

Well, and so thinking about your physical how you expressed or how you showed up, yeah, and was the hair still there? Like, was there a transition or a change in that how you presented?

SPEAKER_00 9:35

For sure, yeah. So I in my last year of university, I or excuse me, last year of high school, I cut my hair. It was it was uh an unfortunate my mom's a hairdresser, love you, mama. And she gave me a haircut that was horrendous. I like to refer to it as the Princess Diana haircut. Yeah, right. And I cried and cried. And then my best friend, Andrea's stepmom, was quite a bit younger, came to the rescue and cut my hair and like gave me like a full-on pixie haircut, which was very edgy. My mother was even like my mom was horrified. And even to this day, if I cut my hair too short, like she will comment on it. Like it's a trigger for her. It upsets her. Um, and I have had this particular haircut for like quite some time. Um, and so yeah, there, so I I I I cut my hair short. I knew that this was sort of in my path. I can remember I played high school basketball, and I can remember one player specifically on an opposing team at another school had quite a crush on. And I knew that she was also going to university in this same town, which was like weirdly like a very impactful part of my decision making around the university. I chose, which is great. I love that. Um, you know what I mean? Like everything works out. Yeah, priorities. Here we are. Um and so that, yeah, that I think it was a slow progression and and that physical presentation, like as I started meeting more friends that were queer and feeling the sense of freedom, I noticed that my, you know, my choice of clothing, you might remember these times. This is like um undershirts, like those white undershirts, uh bleach blonde, short, spiky hair, very harsh spikes, um, you know, cargo shorts, like that was the look. Right. Flannel, like that was that was the look.

SPEAKER_01 11:43

And was it were you aware of kind of coming back to your tomboy roots or your absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 11:50

In fact, I like kind of embraced it with enthusiasm. Uh-huh. Um, and it also felt really interesting to experience like attention while dressing in this manner. Hmm. Tell me about that. Well, it was my like again, uh, you know, I had never opened, allowed myself to be aware of that attention in the past. Um, and so it was a very interesting thing to be like, oh, people actually like this. There are people that find this attractive. Um, as opposed to like I grew up, and you know, I don't think my parents were trying to be mean, but like butch was not a good word. It was or good look. It was a derogatory term for a woman that was ugly, essentially, is how it was framed. And I wholeheartedly identify as Butch to this day. Yeah, now you do. Okay. Right.

SPEAKER_01 12:50

And so was it a bit of a a process to be able to reclaim that and not feel icky about it or feel like it was I think so.

SPEAKER_00 12:58

And you know, again, lots of these reflections happening now. And and I think in the moment I was just living in this experience of being away, of like opening my mind up and also like physically opening up to this vast queer community that exists in Kitchener Waterloo. I was really embraced by like this intersection of um activists and queers. And it was my first exposure to both of those broad communities. Um, and yeah, I was I was really welcomed there and you know, found friendship and love there. It was awesome. It was an amazing experience.

SPEAKER_01 13:44

Let's maybe fast forward a bit to tell us about being a parent and and being a birth mother and and that experience of being butch and yeah, and all of that.

SPEAKER_00 13:56

And yeah. So I mean, uh, so fast forward many, many years, I always, even through this sort of process of understanding my identity, there was something inside me that had a very powerful maternal draw. I was partnered for, you know, the better part of a decade with a woman that I met at Waterloo. We moved to Vancouver together. We had a like a very beautiful life together. And the sort of the breaking point in our relationship was that she didn't want to have children. And she was very honest with me. We got together when I was in my early 20s. Um, and we broke up when I just after I turned 30. And I had a visceral physical experience at that time of my life where I felt like I just couldn't turn off this feeling that kept hitting me of like, I want to have this experience. I want to have children, I physically want to have a baby. Um, and so when that relationship ended, um, and I found my wife, which was a beautiful experience of just like, you know, sort of introduction through friends. It was very organic and lovely. Like I had a very strange to me process of of dating where it was like a center point of conversations. Like, how to do this? Do you want to have children? Pretty much. Yes, no, in out. Pretty much. Yeah. Like I was like, I this is like I'm on this path. This is really important to me. And I didn't want to, you know, you know, my relationship ended really because of that, not because of other things. And so I didn't want to replicate that again. Um, and my wife was very, Taryn is very, very much, has always been very interested in having a family and um was very understanding of my desire to carry a child. It was, it was a very challenging experience. The process was to actually get pregnant. It's actually quite a bit harder than you are taught in Catholic school. Tell you that right now. Okay. And secondly, um, I I loved the physical experience. And it was a really dysphoric experience for me from a gender perspective, in that, like the obviously the the the overarching sort of um experience for birthing people are that you're a birthing woman and that you won't want to wear a moo moo around. And that's not my style. And so I wore like two pairs of maternal jeans and black and white t-shirts on top of open dress shirts for the entire duration of my uh um um pregnancy. Um, and you know, I it was also an interesting experience to see how people would read me in the world. Um I just experienced a bit more warmth than I typically do. And I am, as you know, like a by default, like I lead with smiles and warmth, as like it's my part of my core personality. But I just I did notice that there was a tenderness that I experienced broadly, people opening doors for me, you know, doing things I think that I I may not necessarily receive, just generally speaking, in how I typically present. Um did it's it's almost like it erased the butchness for this period of time. It I mean, out in the out I think in the outside world looking in, yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yes. Like you could go into a washroom, no problem. No problem, no problems, no problems. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 17:52

And tell me about that, just that how it is or was beforehand, and I'm assuming how it is now that you're not, you know, pregnant. Yeah. You're experiencing washrooms generally.

SPEAKER_00 18:03

So, like, uh you know, flashback to being a child. Like I have visceral memories of being a little child and you know, people looking at me and being like, you're in the wrong washroom and asking me to leave at like, you know, seven, eight, nine, ten, young. Like I can remember going to Canada's Wonderland one time and not using the washroom all day and waiting till I got home. And like that was not pleasant an experience. Um and I've learned to navigate that space with what I may say is like sort of dignity and care. Um, I'm not one to make direct eye contact on purpose, but I'm also not shy. So if I feel energy like somebody is looking at me, I will look right at them and smile and you know be very clear that I'm fully, you know, this is my space as well, let's say. Through your expression and body language, or do you through my expression of body language, maybe just also with like a high. Like if somebody's looking at me for a long time. Um recently I had the experience on a gig where someone in a bathroom like directly confronted me. That hasn't happened in a very long time. Now, I was it this was a gig. I was wearing a suit, and you know, they were I I think they were quite drunk, but regardless, they made like a big scene about the fact that they may have been in a w the wrong washroom. And I said, uh, I said, there's all kinds of people that use the washroom, and most people understand the hieroglyphics on the on the on the door. Like we get the memo. Right. And and and you're making a choice to go in one bathroom or another. I was just minding my own business, washing my hands. And then the friend said, Oh, that must have been rude. And I said, Yeah, it is rude. And like you should really rethink whether or not it's your place to challenge somebody when they're just trying to use the washroom. And then I left. And that I have not had that experience very often. But when it happens, you know, for the impact that it might have for future people, I've taken it upon myself to say something.

SPEAKER_02 20:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:27

Especially something as straightforward as like most people understand what washroom they want to use when they walk through the door. Yeah. They look around, they go eat into the washroom, they leave.

SPEAKER_01 20:38

Yeah. I mean, I r I've been thinking about this, and it is a little tricky in ways because women are afraid of men. If I'm to generalize, there's there is a potential threat. So if it really is a man, there's a threat to the women.

SPEAKER_00 20:57

Absolutely, which is why I try to be like very clearly friendly, open, like disarming. I I really try to do that. But on the other hand, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:11

It's, you know, when I think of like myself who's five, four barely, and I don't know. Like there, there's definitely uh a response that is not coming from a fear that of I might be attacked by a man. It's a fear of difference and it's a fear of I don't like how you look and I don't like this. Yes. Yes. And it's homophobia and misogyny and all of the things. So just clarify that I, you know, there may be some of that, but I I my sense of when people respond to me in an in a negative way, it's often I can feel the fear. I can feel the fear and the judgment, and you know, yeah. Yeah. So uh thinking about your butchness, um if you you know from that time. University and through the years up and today. Were there did you ever waver from that, or were there times where you were less comfortable with it? Totally. Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 22:10

Like there have been times throughout the whole process where I've explored like my gender presentation a little bit more. Um and it's been a very interesting experience to also um be partnered with somebody now who so enthusiastically loves me and um is very attracted to me and the ways in which I will present. Right. Um and so it's bit like I feel like I've really landed in you know an identity that feels very, very natural, very comfortable. I very sincerely have always and continue to feel like I am literally in drag when I'm wearing women's clothing. Like a like a dress, for example. Like I have photographs and memories and stories of my first communion. So this is a rite of passage, like a bar mitzvah in the Catholic world, where you wear like a little wedding dress, essentially, as a young girl. And I can remember that my mother negotiated with me that if I wore that for the ceremony, when I got home for the gathering, we would have a big gathering and party at the house afterward. I could put my my shorts on. And I have a photograph of me standing in front of the front door. And basically, my mom says ripping off the phone. I took we took that photo and then I went inside and changed immediately. And and you know, I still feel that even to this day.

SPEAKER_01 23:53

Yeah. Yeah. It's like for me, I call it like nails on a chalkboard. It's just, it's like an out-of-body, it's horrible experience. Yeah. And are there just in life in general, are there time or like do you ever consider where I'm going, what kind of situation I'm gonna be in? Do you ever think about, well, I might wear something different? I mean, not a dress, but like, do you ever are there any compromises or shifts just to, you know, take care of, protect yourself, I suppose?

SPEAKER_00 24:24

Yeah, for sure. Like, so sometimes, for example, I will um like I'm I know that I'll be wearing a tie to an event, but I have other appointments to go to, other things that I need to attend to. And depending on where I'm going, I may not put the tie on for the whole day, for example. Right. May just have a dress shirt on. That would be my like sort of standard uniform. Right. It's very out of character for me to not be wearing a collared shirt on this very day.

SPEAKER_01 24:55

Um yeah, interesting. And then what does that feel like? Because I I think it it's almost to me, and I can relate to it, where it's you've signaled to yourself, okay, I need to I need to blend in. I need to blend in, and I also need to read the room. I need to read who's here and what they're like and all of those things.

SPEAKER_00 25:13

Yeah, for sure. So, like, for example, professionally, this this happens to me often in my professional arena. Um, the vast majority of my clients are choosing me specifically, clearly. And so I don't feel I need to mask in any way there. But in other professional settings, going to conferences, going to uh professional events, for example. Um I'm definitely aware of what I'm choosing in terms of of clothing. Right. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:43

And that must be quite a contrast, I would think, between, you know, you kind of being in charge or in control of your of your work, and you could always say no to clients if you need to. Or no, for sure. Yeah. And you pretty much are the queer realtor so much. Um versus going to a conference and maybe talk about that or sort of experiences you've had in the kind of more general real estate world.

SPEAKER_00 26:12

Yeah, for sure. So, for example, like I've gone down to the US to attend conferences where there's, you know, literally tens of thousands of people and have definitely noticed, you know, I think it's we are so lucky in Vancouver that we have such a visible queer community. And it is always a reminder to me when I go elsewhere that I can go and be in a room of literally thousands of people. And I may be uh among, like on one hand, you can count visibly the queer people that you can see. And that's you know, there's all kinds of ways in which queer people will present, but just in terms of folks that like are very clearly outside of your typical binary. Um, and that can be sometimes a little bit uncomfortable. Again, I I do tend to carry myself with quite a bit of confidence. And so, and I don't invite negativity. Like I'm somebody that ha, and this is maybe a coping strategy, but like if I don't get a warm read from somebody within a moment of eye contact, we're not making eye contact anymore. You just move on. I just move right on. I will not look at you. I'm walking right by you. I'm not engaging with you, I'm not looking for attention. I'm also not looking for a fight, but like I'm moving past you like you're a stranger and I haven't even seen you.

SPEAKER_01 27:41

Can you describe that what you perceive or feel in that look? Because I do think there is a common look. Yeah. That people it's like disgust.

unknown 27:51

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 27:52

To be frank, you know, I should be clear about that. I was walking this week with uh another professional that I was gonna have a meeting with who is a trans woman, and we were crossing the street, and it and I like the the there were two folks that were walking past us as we were crossing the street, and they were like gawking. Like it was, you know, it was uncomfortable. I think lots of us have felt that feeling. So it's like that would say that's like that's a 10 on the one to 10 scale, right? But there's all kinds of other aggressions, just even just like again, if I'm looking, if we make eye contact and I smile and I don't get that back, like I'm just not making eye contact anymore. I think I miss a lot of connections that way too, but like I'm not looking for it. But I mean, I'm not a quick to eye contact without immediate warmth. Like I just will look away. It's like how I'm in the change room at the gym. I'm not looking for eye contact. So there it's more eyes down. I'm in there to change. I'm doing my thing. I'm not looking at you, you're not looking at me. Like we're just rolling through this experience.

SPEAKER_01 29:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 29:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:03

Yeah. It's interesting because you know, there's it's great that there are situations like where you where one can choose to just look down and avoid, but um, or where people don't have necessarily the freedom. Like you're at work and you're at a conference and you're supposed to get stuff done and meet people and network, and you're forced to kind of interact with folks who you can know in that moment are just not you know what I mean.

SPEAKER_00 29:30

You know, like the intersection of misogyny and homophobia can feel very stinging in some of those environments where, you know, for years and years, I would attend these networking events with my my white male cis business partner. And the experience and observations I made over the decade that we were in partnership together was that he walked into a room and immediately engendered credibility and respect. Um, and I always had to earn it. And that, I mean, that is the world, right? I'm someone that, you know, I'm a realist. And also it can be tiresome. And I think that, you know, I've really looked to it again as, you know, if we're not able to build rapport through the many strategies I have to try to be open and disarming and welcoming, um, and it's just not meant to be. Yeah. But have there been missed opportunities? Absolutely, of course. Undoubtedly. But you're doing okay. I'm doing okay. All is well. Yeah. I'm finding, I'm very deliberately finding my community, my people, and I'm I'm I'm very deeply committed to that.

SPEAKER_01 30:46

Talk a bit about the your experience with Queer's Funk, because I know you do a lot of small communities and you do the big ones here. Speak about your experiences with being in small communities and also what it does for you personally and how you feel. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 31:01

Um, so I mean, so Queerus Funk started as like a very small idea that's over the last 12 years grown into a really powerful movement that I'm just absolutely honored to be a part of. First of all, it was the first experience I ever had to be in a band and to be in a performance space where I could be wholly myself. Like it was encouraged to wear a suit and tie. Right. And if I could have told my eight-year-old self that that was gonna be my life, it would have blown my mind. Yeah. Yeah. Love that. And so the cool thing about it is, you know, we have made a very, very conscious effort to accept invitations, especially to small communities where we're being invited to create queer space. And the vast majority of those experiences have been overwhelmingly delightful and wonderful. We've done many small communities, their very first pride celebrations. And specifically, I can remember doing a show in Hope a few years ago, their very first pride celebration. And we were playing in like the back of a legion in like the theater part, gymnasium experience. And I remember at the at the start of the show, there was a very large man standing at the back of the room who like definitely looked like a biker to me. And I was like, okay, like we weren't sure who was coming, what it was gonna be like. And we learned later that he was coming as an ally to protect this space. Oh my god. Basically. Yeah. Wow. Like, I believe that we can create communities and and environments that we want to live in, that we want to be a part of.

SPEAKER_01 32:56

Because you're right. I mean, it is not just a band, it is a movement and it is impact, huge impact.

SPEAKER_00 33:03

Yeah. We we will be playing Vancouver Pride for 2026. It is a wonderful experience. Like that gathering with, you know, we've sold out the Commodore many, many times. That's like 1200 people in that room. Yeah. Um, and it feels spiritual. Like there's there's like a whole other level that happens both for us as performers and uh that I have heard from audience members that attend that they are like, this is amazing. Like the energy in here is electric and it feels so warm and welcome. And that's what we want. That's what we want to gather for. Yeah, for me, it's freedom.

SPEAKER_01 33:43

Yeah. You know, it's this, it's all the the my favorite things, right? Music, dancing, friends, people, but being entirely uninhibited. About my queerness, especially. Yeah. Um, but yeah, and it's so important to have those experiences, those places, those spaces. Yeah. Looping back to family, um, I know I'm a tad older than you, so um I'm and I because the reason I say that is um not to be annoying, but to because the times have changed and it's different for kids these days. But I'm curious about your kids and their experience of you as you know, a butch, a more masculine presenting parent. And if that's ever come up or considered or an issue. Like, is it ever, is it even a thing?

SPEAKER_00 34:37

Like it was when I was so much. Not so much. Like it certainly has not come up from them. I think that sometimes they've had comments from you know, kids at school to be like, oh, you have two moms. Um, and like, you know, we again our children are being raised in Vancouver. Like it's broadly, we live from commercial drive. Like it's pretty queer friendly. So we're lucky. But that was like a really important thing for my partner and I to be aware of. And I remember us like being very anxious, especially in kindergarten, to talk about inclusion and how are we gonna celebrate Father's Day and like what are we gonna do? And um, and so you know, the kids have the kids ever, you know, they ask lots of questions about identity. My wife is very feminine presenting and, you know, sort of typically femme. And so they ask me lots of they when I have shared stories about experiences of um, let's say, challenge or strife, I can say they have a very emotional reaction, like they just can't understand why that will happen. Um, but I think by and large, you know, the kids are just like they're just so cute, right? They just are like, okay, like this is just the way that it is. Like, and it's very interesting to me. Like, I can remember them in childhood play, um, having like a whole play scene where it was like a mom and a dad, and asking, like, okay, so like tell me more. And they were like, Oh, well, like, because you can't have a baby without a mom or a dad. And I was like, Okay. Honey, let's talk about our family. Right. Like it was just, you know, it's like lots of things, and parenting is like a moment of opportunity to teach them and talk to them and go deeper. Um, like, don't you know you're socialized chicken? Like, it's just like it's one of those things where I wish folks who think that we're trying to indoctrinate children, like even my own kids. We can't. We can't. Right? Like they're just they are who they are. Yeah. They are who they are. I had a hilarious conversation with my six-year-old last night about crushes and who she has crushes on. Oh my gosh. And like literally, she named 10 people. They were all boys. Uh yeah. It's not that she's not allowed. I mean, I didn't make any comment on it. I was just like, great, yeah, awesome. What does a crush mean to you? Uh-huh. Like it's just like, I wanted to like just have a little opening of a discussion, but it is, it is interesting.

SPEAKER_01 37:16

And how about clothes? Like, is do you buying clothes, finding clothes? How's that experience?

SPEAKER_00 37:23

I think that experience has really changed so much. Like, I can remember feeling very uncomfortable when people would come up and talk to me in a shop. Like, I don't want help. Please don't ask me if I want help. I'm on I'm good on my own here. Um, or also being like, you know, get giving you that feeling of like you're in the wrong place. You're on the wrong side. Yeah. Um, I'm not a big shopper. And so, you know, I've like, you know, I've found a few places that I know I can get reliable, like basics that I like. I love Potaloo. I support them and everything they do. So I buy lots of stuff from them. Amazing local queer-owned company, clothing company. Um, and then, you know, I just I do think there's been an improvement. But like, you know, again, drawing back to my childhood experience, like I can remember that it was my grandmother. She would take us every year for our for our birthday out for lunch, what at like the Zellers or Eaton's restaurant in the department store. And then we would go shopping for an outfit, and she always let me shop on the boys' side. Which was like grandma.

SPEAKER_01 38:32

Co-grandma. That's so great.

unknown 38:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 38:35

Well, those moments, hey, small, yeah, make a difference. Big time. All right. Well, how about some just you know, regular things like what do you do first thing in the morning? What do you do when you wake up?

SPEAKER_00 38:48

First thing in the morning, I'm pretty habit-based. Um, so first thing in the morning, come downstairs, make a coffee. Usually check the check the news, what's going on for the day. And then very shortly after I come downstairs, one of the kids will come downstairs because they hear me. Uh-huh. And so then we have a little morning moment. How about favorite comfort food? I can eat like pizza or pasta like seven days a week. Okay. So I'm Italian.

SPEAKER_01 39:17

It's deep inside me. That's what I'm saying. I thought that's my go-to.

SPEAKER_00 39:20

That's my go-to.

SPEAKER_01 39:22

Okay. Uh, favorite place to go or thing to do in Vancouver?

SPEAKER_00 39:27

Favorite thing to do in Vancouver. Go to a queer funk show. Okay. Slash. I mean, I love um, like, there's so many lovely little spots on the drive. Like, I'm pretty um I'm pr I'm pretty much a homebody in that regard. So, like, you know, go to Mom's the Word, meet friends for drinks. Yep. Um, we do a lot of fet gatherings at friends' places. Like go to the bird houses where all the kids are going these days.

SPEAKER_01 39:53

Right. Well, you have to stay up so like it starts at 10 30 or something. Shout out to Pony Boy for creating community for all these years. I know it's amazing.

SPEAKER_00 40:02

All these years. The whole time I've lived in Vancouver. Yeah, it's amazing. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 40:06

Really amazing. Uh speaking of which, do you have a go-to karaoke or just a Rolodex of the Yeah?

SPEAKER_00 40:12

I've got a Rolodex, but I'm I lean heavily into country. When we're doing karaoke, it's my sweet spot. Okay. Yeah. It's a little Chris Stapleton, Bonnie Ray. Oh, nice. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 40:24

Okay. And is there any particular kind of music or a song that just like gets you up dancing? Oh, you're up to dance.

SPEAKER_00 40:34

I love all kinds of music. I really like um like I love anything Beyoncé. We're big fans of Taylor Swift in our house. The girls are like big time Swifties, loving everything on the new album.

SPEAKER_01 40:49

So thinking about representation and you know, tell me A, why, you know, why it was important to you to do this, because we're not all I mean, you are a celebrity, but you know, there is an element of us being regular folks telling our stories, but like why did you want to do this? Like why what's representation mean to you? Why do you want to do that?

SPEAKER_00 41:13

Well, I'm just thinking about, you know, again, I'm thinking about how lucky we are to be here. Um, and how lucky I personally that I feel to have such an expansive community of queer people and and like mask of center identified people. And I'm hopeful that these stories resonate with folks that may not have that same um community around them. They may not have met that community yet for for for those folks, for people that are curious, they don't know folks in this community. Um I'm I love to share my story. Yeah. Nice.

SPEAKER_01 41:53

And I know you said you you had something you would say to that little eight-year-old or whatever it is, but other things that you might say, or to someone else who's like out there right now who's uh maybe wondering, thinking about how to embrace their own identity.

SPEAKER_00 42:13

You know, I think that for the most part, you know, certainly kids here I think they feel empowered that they can. And I think that if you're living in a place where you feel you can't, it's a great big world out there. Like, don't worry. Yeah. Grow, do what you need to do now to get yourself through and know that there is like a vibrant community on the other side of the rainbow. It's true, it's true. It's like I I didn't feel that or know that at 11, 12, 13. I didn't know that.

SPEAKER_01 42:53

Yeah. And there's an extra layer to being mask of center. 100%. You know, it's not it is another level of you know, being able to really accept oneself and show up every day authentically. It's, you know, it's not always easy.

SPEAKER_00 43:11

And there are, you know, I'm I'm quite aware that there have been so many people before us that have have beaten down that path. Yeah. You know, my first experience in Vancouver of being surrounded by butches, self-identified butches and mask of center folk was when I was in a choir. Right. Before Leadfoot started uh before Queerus Funk started, I was in a choir called Leadfoot, started by Ivan Coyote, who's a good friend of mine. And I had never been in a space of just mask butch trans people. Never. It was my first experience in my life. And that was like again, one of those moments of like kind of cracking open. Yeah. Um, that has that has changed, literally changed my life. Like that experience changed my life. Awesome. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:06

Well, thank you so much for sharing your story, and it's amazing to chat with you. Fletcher. Thank you. Thanks for listening to Mr. Gendered, the show where we swap labels for lived experience and get curious about life beyond the binary. On Instagram, Facebook, and TikTok, Mr. Gender Pod, webmrgender.com, email hello at mrgender.com. That's M I S T E R. The doc Notquite That is at notquitethat.ca. Free to watch at TELUS Originals, Optic TV, and Knowledge Network.