037 My One Day Has Become My Day One: Data Sharing & Entrepreneurship with James Robson

James Robson has spent the best part of a decade in data protection, most recently serving as the DPO for the Labour Party. But beneath the technical expertise lies a background in acting, film production, and yoga instruction—all of which have shaped his unique "storytelling" approach to data.

In this episode, James shares the "why" behind his new venture, Datum Longevity, and explains why he believes we need to stop treating data as a "no" department and start treating it as a "how-to" department.

Highlights:

• The Catalyst: How a gap analysis in Gibraltar led James to realize he could "wing it" and win.

• The Vision: Using secondary research data for pharmacological and societal breakthroughs.

• The Mindset: Preparing for independence by taking out eight credit cards "just in case" and finding the courage to jump.

• The Takeaway: James’s advice on why you should be the one to suggest data innovations in your own organization.

Connect with James: Find him on LinkedIn to follow his journey with Datum Longevity.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:04

Hello and welcome to today's show. I'm Jackie the Stockwell, CEO and founder at Leadership Through Data. I inspire and motivate information leaders across the world. I'm here today with James. Now, James, do you want to introduce him yourself?

SPEAKER_01 0:16

Sure. Jackie, thank you so much for inviting me onto the podcast. Yes, I am a data protection specialist. I call myself a data sharing specialist. I've uh just completed two and a bit years as data protection officer for the Labour Party, been in data protection for the best part of a decade. Before that, I was in cybersecurity sales and uh learning and development management there. And then before that, I was in television in London. So uh yeah, I've done a few things.

SPEAKER_00 0:46

You have done a few things, and I think what's great is that you've got such a broad knowledge and now you're where you are, and we it's what we're going to talk about today. Because I reached out to you because I really liked your strapline of the title of this podcast.

SPEAKER_01 0:59

Um, My One Day Has Become My Day One.

SPEAKER_00 1:03

Which I think is fantastic because actually, if you have a look at, you know, people in our industry that actually want to step out of their comfort zone, step out of a paid job and you know, work for themselves. Um, but always have this kind of like niggling fear of like, oh, I don't want to do that, or like leave that security. What I found really powerful for you was when you'd posted exactly that. I thought, wow, that is just sensational, and let's talk about that some more. So talk to me about you know the transition from your successful career to where you are now.

SPEAKER_01 1:40

Yeah, thanks. Thanks for thinking it was kind of a fantastic thing thing to post. I mean, it was scary and exciting to post it, uh, and it'd been something I'd been planning for quite a while and and thought about how to how to sort of announce it, because you get a bit of attention when you're the data protection officer for a political party, especially during a general election, election period, uh which I had the privilege of doing. It's been something that's on my mind for four or five years now, ever since I was in the research space, data protection and research. And I was the data protection officer of something called the Evidence Quarter, which had a number of research organisations, and um I was given the privilege of trying to build a data archive in the Office for National Statistics for an organization, it's changed names since, but for an organization that was called What Works for Children's Social Care. And that sort of landed on my desk. My first my first um uh reaction was I'm not sure this is my job. And then my second reaction was, wow, what a privilege to get this, because it opened my eyes to very different ways of using data, and then having to go through the whole data protection, data protection by design, data protection by default wrap of reusing that data in a national database. How do you get it in there? How do you manage that access to that data in the first place? And then how do you go through the data sharing agreement lifecycle of having it reused by another organization so it's a secondary use? What's that all about? Now, realizing that that ecosystem doesn't necessarily exist very substantially, there isn't a large amount of non-governmental research data going into the ONS, the Office for National Statistics in the UK, or going into the other large databases. They're usually large governmental data sets going into these locations where you can get access to them for further research. But that means there are swathes and swathes of other pieces of research and data being collected that can't be reused. And I think there's a huge gap in how data could be used for societal benefit. So external research mapping together with government data to then have further insights for societal benefit, and that's what my passion has become. And I set up an organization that haven't quite launched the time recording now. I haven't I've soft launched, if you like, I haven't hard launched. I have people I haven't really updated my LinkedIn profile either about it because I want it to be something really special, and it's called datum longevitus. Datum longevitus, of course, the longevity of that data that can be reused because if there's so much research being done and collecting all that data that is just lost. Now the research is great, that's not lost, you know. You have your paper, but the raw data behind it is lost, and so you do have a duplication of all these surveys, primary research, secondary research, um, interviews being collected that are then not accessible for the next bit of to reuse it and go, well, we don't need to do that, it's been done. We we have a it's catalogued here, that's what we need in the menu of our research, and then we can get further information and map it together. And then if we're really smart and there's some mapping in the background, maybe we can match it to the national pupil data set or the prisons data set or the you know the e-child data set, and you get into all these other kind of big map data sets within the ONS and things, and maybe healthcare. And can you match it through the NHS DARS process? Is that possible as well? So, you know, there aren't really intermediaries that are doing this stuff very successfully, or maybe there are, they're just few and far between. So there's a massive gap here. And then you think, well, what about commercial benefit? And you start to think, well, what if there's a pharmaceutical company that is trying to get access to the NHS database and monetizing off the back of all of our wonderful NHS data? Um, isn't that a bad thing? Well, you know, possibly it could be, it's for nefarious means, but then, you know, how else are we expected to develop pharmacologically and pharmaceuticals if that data's not used? So there are huge benefits around that as well. But just to extrapolate outwards, what problem do you have? And there's probably a data set out there that you can use to try and rectify that problem or mitigate that problem. The problem actually is how do you get hold of that data in a compliant way and preserving the privacy of the individual. That's oh, that's gold. That's what I want to do. That's why I stepped out, that's why I shocked label, went, no, I quit. That's why.

SPEAKER_00 6:41

That's why. You're such a good storyteller, James. Thank you. Just even that explanation of you know, I've seen you talk a few times and I was just kind of there with you following all the way through and pictures in my mind, and uh, you know, I think it's fantastic, and you know, I wish you great, great success with that because there's definitely definitely something in there. Um so let's talk about this inner conflict because you said the start you weren't too sure. So you used to be a yoga meditation teacher as well. How did your personal journey influence your decision to become independent today? Is it anything that you've pulled back from previous to help you today?

SPEAKER_01 7:18

Yeah, yeah, no, I I absolutely have. I mean, over the years I've I had a number of concepts and ideas and things like to do. I mean, I studied film in university and I came out of that with an idea of, you know, wedding videography was something that I could get myself into and then be really, really planned. Because I'm quite an organized chap. Um, sort of helps in the day of protection well being organized.

SPEAKER_00 7:44

Yeah, it does.

SPEAKER_01 7:46

And I thought, you know, I I could do that, but then I never pursued it. I like built a little business plan and a model and how how how would you do this to make it really efficient, really good. I remember printing business cards, I'm talking 20 years ago. And um never pursued it. And never quite realised why why didn't I just do it? Why didn't I just run at it? I mean, previous to that I had an idea before before the likes of mandy.com in the in the acting world for a concept. I was gonna call it limelight.com for actors to, because I come from an acting background as well, just throw that curveball in. How do you promote yourself through kind of a website? Um, I was gonna work with an uncle of mine to to build that and just sort of park that and did other stuff. And I'm like, why didn't I do that? You know, going back to my day early days running sales teams, you know, uh almost 15 years ago. Uh I I I was interviewing a lot of people, and I thought, you know what, I've interviewed so many people, I could probably train people on this and coached a couple of people and had a concept of something called the great interview. So it's like this entrepreneurial idea of like I can do that, I could do that, I could do that. Um and and I never really pursued it. I just did it kind of piecemeal and and and never ran with it. Again, yoga and meditation. I off the back of that I had the idea of and um, you know, I'm it sounds nice, but for me personally it wasn't right. But I came up with this concept of the suited guru because I'd done a lot of corporate stuff, I knew that world, and then there's the meditation yoga teacher. I'd done three years of teacher training so I could train in hot power yoga, so I could teach hot power yoga, and I thought, you know what, I'm gonna be a, you know, hate to say it but a possibly a Tony Robbins-esque meditation-esque thing, you know, and even during lockdown when I was working for a big corporate, I put on a 7.30am meditation, online meditation, and then a 1230 midday meditation for the corporate that I was in and did that for three months straight. Now that was quite exhausting and recorded loads of that. I thought, you know what, I've recorded all these meditations. I'm gonna put these up and it'll be on YouTube and it'll be wonderful, and I'm gonna start this the suited guru, and I like that I liked my umgo and branding, had that had that all sorted. But then just didn't didn't pursue it. I had a website. I I got as far as getting a website, but but decided not not to pursue it. And it came down to really a very personal journey that that I went on was quite scary, and I realized that was why I became a yoga teacher as well. There's these internal conflicts inside myself that meant that I had this sense of complete worthlessness that was pervasive throughout my entire life, and having to get deep enough and down further enough, far enough inside myself to um have that release through through my body, through the energy that's held within my cells, and only managed to do that within a vipassana 10-day silent meditation retreat. I've done four of those now, and that was the point where I realized those pursuits were were probably more about ego than they were about giving back and doing something worthwhile and you know, fending for myself in in you know, paying paying myself as a an independent soul trader, business person, whatever you like. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 11:12

I think you've distinguished between an entrepreneur and an entrepreneur because obviously you've all you always had those ideas, and like I think all the ideas that you have explained to me, I think that are absolutely amazing. But it's taking that next step, isn't it? And it's taking that next step, and as you described again through your storytelling purposes, is that it was that you that was holding you back and it was your confidence, and you took another step to try and rebuild that. And I think there's some really good synergies between the right time is now, which is why you've you've done it. And I still can't remember your tagline, and you've told me about a thousand times, but I think that's my um neurodivergent brain there. Um but um I think that's kind of really kind of key. And I think there's a lot of people in our industry kind of want to do the same thing, like what if? And and I always I alwa have always said when people ask me, like, what's the worst that could happen? I could just go back to a paid job, right? So you step out by yourself, you give it a go, um, and then you could go back. But there's something really rewarding about working for yourself, um, and sort of like picking and choosing your kind of work-life balance, because I know you've you you had um quite a high pressurized job previously, um, and it's nice that you can have that flexibility now. But you also told me the reason why you're a good storyteller is because of your acting career, which I didn't know that, James. So but beautiful. So you moved into data protection consultancy. Um and that cons uh coincided with the lead up to the EU GDPR. Was the impending red regulation the primary professional opportunity that gave you the confidence to go freelance, or was it simply the vehicle that you were planning?

SPEAKER_01 12:50

No, none of the above at all. None of the above. None of the above.

SPEAKER_00 12:54

Is that the question I got wrong? Is that the one that needed to be reworded?

SPEAKER_01 12:57

Quite quite quite possibly, but but not not in the way I'm saying none of the above. In fact, so you okay? The the reason it's it's it's none of the above is it was I I was coming to the end of kind of a sales career, and I wasn't enjoying one of the gigs I was currently in. So I'd moved from um I was working for Capita as inside sales manager and I'd built a whole sales academy with two teams and it was going really well. And I was like, okay, I'm gonna set step out and be become a a full-time account manager with a cybersecurity boutique firm and uh sell cybersecurity solutions, manage security solutions. And and I wasn't enjoying that, but it it was a foot previous boss that actually went, there's this thing called the GDPR. I've just set up a consultancy. Um, do you want to have a look? And I I don't think I clocked. This is why it does seem like it was sort of entrepreneurial for myself. I didn't clock that you didn't really have anyone else looking at it at all. And he was just saying, Do you wanna, well, if you pay for your own training and um I can find some opportunities, you can become my first consultant. So I wasn't doing the business setup bit, but I was doing uh while I did the first gap analysis. I remember after two weeks of training, I was being flown out to Gibraltar to do a three-day gap analysis in one of the gambling firms out there that they'd literally um got to the end of that first hour of presentation, which I could just about get through of what what is the GDPR, and then they're looking at me wide-eyed, going, what do we do next? And in my mind, I'm like, Yeah, I'm not sure what we do next. So I had to wing it and sort of learn on the job because they didn't know what GDPR was or what a gap analysis would look like, and neither did I really, and I hadn't been given a template, and I hadn't quite clocked that it was so early doors that I was making it up on the spot. But after making it up on the spot, and then I I I did a next one and then a next one and then a next one, and they had they were landing these opportunities. So I had the privilege of being one of the first people to really do the business in these companies, and we let we landed some massive contracts, which is incredible, and it became what um 15-20 person team um eventually. So I had that had the privilege of doing that. So that's why it's like although I didn't run the business, I did sort of set up and run that practice as as the first practitioner, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:16

Yeah, because the entrepreneur gets paid. There's no there's not much difference in my view. The entrepreneur gets paid straight away, the entrepreneur takes all the financial risk, but they all do the same things in terms of the business. So that's the kind of differentiating when I'm talking to like customers and you know, information leaders, actually, you're all entrepreneurs, you just have no financial risk, you know, you can deliver what you know is expected to deliver, and you can make that influence within the business as well. So I think you've articulated that uh really well. So looking at your new mindset um for your freelance, your new lease of life, what is the single most important skill or mindset change you are going to have to adopt um going forward as an independent data protection consultant?

SPEAKER_01 16:01

It's a really good question. The mindset changes, it's still a nine to five. There's just not the added pressure. I don't have somebody to answer to, I answer to myself. And that's I love that idea of the intrapreneur versus entrepreneur. I'm finding that intra to entre a little curious, and I think that's the hardest bit for me, which is I don't have anyone pressuring me really. Things to be done, absolutely, and clients saying we need this by X time. But there's only me going, well, if I don't do this, I lose client, I can't pay myself, I can't feed myself, I can't feed my family, I don't move forward. That's scary. You know, and I I I did things like, you know, before I'd even stepped out and I had clients, and to build up to this, you know, my one day being my day one, you know, I did side hustle data protection gigs to to be able to finance myself for at least three months before I could jump out or feel comfortable. I took out eight credit cards just in case I needed to use them, in case I run out of food, just in case. I don't need to use them, I'm really lucky, you know, fortunate. But it's all these like little foundation pillars that freaked myself out that I'm that I I was doing this stuff because I was so scared of not being able to feed myself and my family on that day one. But now I'm in the place, luckily enough, where I've probably got too much now that I've taken on that I've got to work my little cotton socks off. But that's a great problem to have, and then I can grow my my concept and my business and the idea. And I picked up a couple more contracts that'll keep me going. I'm like, okay, it's it's kind of working, but the mindset shift is it's all you, mate. It's all you.

SPEAKER_00 17:39

Yeah, and it's all on you. And then that goes back to the story you were telling earlier as to why you never conceptualize those ideas until you have that belief in yourself, because it is all on you. One thing I would suggest is obviously make sure you've got a really good support network because it can be a lonely place sometimes. So just make sure you have that support network. As a friend of mine, but yeah, and a couple of entrepreneur things that you can use as an entrepreneur, but now you're moving into the entrepreneur space. Profit First is a really good uh by Mike McAllowitz. Um, it's a really good methodology of keeping that three months in your bank, um, as you had said. And there's also a wide range of other books um for him, but I like the methodology of getting customers and then just keeping them and reoccurring. And there's a really good book called The Pumpkin Plan by the same person on that, James, if that's helpful.

SPEAKER_01 18:31

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 18:32

You're absolutely welcome. So I'm just gonna pick a last question because I knew this would happen when you come on. I'd just be just be chatting away and then uh we wouldn't get through what the kind of things So looking back to your first passion with your drama, online drama series, as your acting, does that early experience of creating content and community help in the digital space now and with your view of data and technology?

SPEAKER_01 18:57

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. So so so I I I wrote, produced, and directed it, um and it was a 15-part drama series as the first Wales's first internet drama series. You know, the the organizational skills around that, um you are uh I was recruiting actors and um people behind the camera, so the crew, so you've got that data. You've got all of the scenes, so the breakdown of what's meant to happen in every scene and why and how. Let's put that into a record of processing activity. What's gonna happen with that data, why, how, where, where. And then you codify it. So you codify the scenes, you codify the takes. So you can see like the real synergy of this organizational plan that you need to be able to manage data and especially data protection overlay in there. And then there's, you know, this is 15 episodes, there's 15 little projects. So you're generally gonna have multiple projects open and running concurrently when you're in data protection. You're updating your cookie banner, you're you've got a data migration platform migration going on in maybe uh, you know, one of the CRM platforms that might be going on. You may have a marketing concept where they're gonna be using a MailChimp or communicator or something else, a new mail merge system, and they're just gonna test this. And can they do it on live data or not? And so you you end up having multiple tabs open in your mind consistently when you're making a a show and when you are managing data. It's the same thing, really. You're still managing data, and you're still kind of directing people in how they should do things, and then they are free to make choices within that. So the actors are free to make choices in how they interpret your script. The people who are managing the data are free within the parameters that you've set them to use the data how they wish for their specific purpose. Um, you know, within that parameter that you've done the right risk risk analysis around it as well. So there's huge synergies there. And having the confidence to also go um have that iterative process with an actor, with crew, with cast, whatever, it's all collaborative. Has to be. You can't direct anything if it's not collaborative. It's just not possible. Same as being DPO. You cannot manage it if you're not collaborative, if they don't see you as the trusted focal point for how they're going to be using that data and coming straight to you. It's like, just this little thing, not sure. Sorry to bother you. You know, the amount of people, if I got a pound for everyone saying, like, I'm so sorry, it's such a little thing, um, just want to check this, I know it's silly, silly little thing. Oftentimes we joke, you know, within our sector, that silly little thing turns into a five-hour, ten-hour, maybe month-on project sometimes. And so it's never a silly little thing whatsoever. But to get that, you know, you it's like you direct data, you know, great. Come to the director of data, nothing else. That's all. I'm not going to encroach on anything else you want to do. I just want to make sure you're you're doing it within the parameters. It's the not a um don't do, it's a how-to. You know, to to quote John Nathan Edwards, the current information commissioner in the UK. That that's his he says that in almost every every uh every speaker gig that he goes to. Which which is which is fair. I think I think it's the right approach, really, because it is a data sharing manifesto, the G UK GDPR, Data Protection Act of 2018 in the UK, and now the Data Use and Access Act of 2025. It's the augmentation. And so it's almost you're adding that extra layer of let's uh clarify stuff and then augment it so it can be used in a better way. So going right back to the beginnings of you know being a writer, producer, director, actor, which was very egotistically uh driven for me back then, kind of touched on a previous point. There's huge similarities. Yeah, massive, massive.

SPEAKER_00 23:00

Great. And and I would just add to that, that because of your previous role, it helps you tell stories, it helps you train because of that role, and you bring that in. And and definitely for data protection officers, it is that you know, please come and tell me straight away. I'm not the no department, I'm the helpful and the open that communication. So I think there's some really valid points. So thank you so much for today. This has been absolutely sensational. One final point, James, to listeners. What's the one takeaway message from this session? Just do you turn your one day into your day one, if not?

SPEAKER_01 23:32

My one takeaway for listeners of this session is you're the people who know what your data is and you know what that data can do. Maybe better than lots of people in your company. So go innovate and suggest innovations on that data to make things better for you, the people around you. And if there is a societal benefit in there, probably know it. Be creative and go and sell that into your organization. It will benefit us all.

SPEAKER_00 24:00

Sensationally said there, James. Be your entrepreneur. So thank you so much. Reach out to James on LinkedIn. I would highly recommend you follow him. And thank you for today, James. It's been brilliant.

SPEAKER_01 24:13

You're very welcome. Cheers, Jackie.

SPEAKER_00 24:15

Cheers. Thank you for listening to the journals of the information entrepreneur with me, Jacqueline Stockwell. I hope you found this episode inspiring and helpful and have some takeaway tips that can be useful to you. If you liked this episode, please like, review, and share it with your friends. Your support helps us reach more information leaders to stay inspired and listen to great content. Want to test out your strengths and weaknesses and measure it against our Empower framework? Please complete the scorecard. It's a great way to improve and evaluate your skills. You can find the scorecard at the end of the description of this podcast. Stay tuned for new podcasts every Thursday and remember to be bold, be brave, and be beautiful.