Musings from the Cyber Trench
Musings from the Cyber Trench
Getting Zero Trust Right - Part 1 | Rajeev Paramathmuni | Musings from the Cyber Trench | EP 102
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In this powerful episode of Musings from the Cyber Trench, host Vishal Masih welcomes Rajeev, Senior Principal Architect at Accenture Federal Services, for a deep-dive into what Zero Trust really means — beyond the hype.
Together, they explore how Zero Trust architecture is transforming public sector cybersecurity, driving modernization, and reshaping how organizations defend critical infrastructure and mission systems. From AI and automation to human-centered design, this episode breaks down the real challenges and real wins in implementing Zero Trust at scale.
Whether you’re a cyber leader, federal technologist, or security strategist, this conversation delivers practical insights on building trust in an untrusted world.
⏱️ Timestamps:
00:00 – Welcome to Musings from the Cyber Trench
01:12 – Meet Rajeev: From architect to public sector strategist
03:05 – What Zero Trust really means in today’s cybersecurity landscape
06:48 – Moving from traditional perimeter models to continuous verification
09:22 – Real-world lessons from Zero Trust adoption in federal environments
12:15 – How AI and automation are changing cyber defense
15:37 – Overcoming organizational resistance and silos
18:44 – Building culture and communication around Zero Trust principles
22:19 – The balance between technology, people, and policy
25:06 – Future trends: Mission resilience and proactive cyber posture
28:40 – Key takeaways for cybersecurity leaders
30:12 – Final thoughts: Why Zero Trust is a mindset, not a milestone
🎯 Key Themes:
Turning Zero Trust from theory into mission impact
The evolving role of AI in federal cybersecurity
Breaking silos through collaboration and transparency
Why culture is as critical as technology in cyber transformation
💡 Call to Action:
If you’re passionate about cybersecurity, modernization, and mission impact — this is the conversation you don’t want to miss.
👉 Watch, subscribe, and share to stay updated with future episodes of Musings from the Cyber Trench.
Join the movement redefining how we secure the future.
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Responsible for ICAM, Zero Trust, or identity security in a federal agency, prime, or large regulated enterprise?
If you’re trying to move from strategy to execution, start with Zephon’s Zero Trust Readiness Assessment: zephon.tech/zt
Questions or guest ideas? Email defend@zephon.tech
Welcome to Music from the CyberTrank, a podcast that goes beyond surface-level talk to uncover the real challenges and breakthroughs of public sector cybersecurity. Each episode features fearless readers and visionary experts who are rethinking security strategies in some of the most complex environments. This is a space for honest conversations, fresh perspectives, and practical insights designed to empower and inspire. Get ready to rethink what's possible and join a community committed to making cybersecurity stronger, smarter, and more resilient. Here is your host, Vishal Masi.
SPEAKER_01Hey there. Welcome to another episode of New Things from the Cyber Trench. My guest today led multiple initiatives for the US Army and the Air Force for their secure cloud computing projects. He was also the lead solutions architect for a multi-billion dollar program for Lockheed Martin. Today, he is a senior principal architect at Accenture Federal Services. When he is not working, he likes to play at Batminton to the extent that he participated in the Washington PCU. With that, everybody please meet my guest, Rajiv Parmatmani. Welcome to the show, Rajiv.
SPEAKER_02Hi Visham. Nice to be on this podcast and I'm glad to share my experiences with you.
SPEAKER_01Thank you. Today, Zero Trust is everywhere. Especially in the field of cybersecurity. In today's episode, we will cover three things. First, why is zero trust so hot today? Why is zero trust a catalyst for bigger and better things? And lastly, how do you start and where did you start? With that, let's jump right in. Tell me, Rajiv, why is zero trust so important?
SPEAKER_02Good question, Michal. Zero trust nowadays, it's becoming a big term. Everywhere in every industry, every customer is looking for zero trust uh compliance, zero trust framework. Why is it so important? Just imagine uh the um cyber warfare that uh the warfare, the conventional warfare that happen nowadays. No one is uh going with the army gear and they are not getting into the battle with uh boots on ground and doing the classic battles. So it's just the press of a button, intercontinental ballistic missile will be launched, and that is how the new warfare is being fought at this time between the nations. So just imagine if an adversary has an access of that button and with a malicious intent, and if he does the same thing. So this is where the zero zero trust comes in. It's a cybersecurity uh architecture with the certain principles in place. Let me talk about little bit, let me talk about these principles a little bit. One of the major principles that we are looking at is we think there is an adversary that is there all already in your network. So if you have this sort of a mindset, the way you architect your uh your cyber defense is completely different. It's all data-centric, data that is originated from the laptop, data that has been traversed through the network, data that has been stored. It's data is a king, we need to always protect the data. And uh network boundaries, having security stacks is modern castle architecture, is not uh is not um an architecture that we could uh really protect the enterprise. So continuous verification, continuous authentication, user set user as an identity, not just simply relying on the network firewalls, uh, network firewalls, IDS and IPS intrusion detection and prevention is not good enough. So in in a nutshell, what I would say is ZT is is a frame, it's not a framework. It's like a it's an architecture with set of principles which always which will help you to protect your enterprise, which will eventually protect and save people's lives.
SPEAKER_01Okay. Excellent uh feedback. Uh and so uh the question I would ask is like you said that uh uh zero trust is uh is more of an uh uh is more of an uh an architecture. What do you say to vendors who say that hey, we can sell you zero trust?
SPEAKER_02Nice question. Zero trust is not a new word that you have been seeing. All these concepts were already there. Google and as well as NSA was on it, even Forrester, these people coined these zero trust principles way in 2010. At that time, there was no there were no products per se which could support these uh these principles zero trust principles. I'm glad that there are so many products are out there in various pillars. Zero trust is divided into seven pillars for user, you have an ICAM solution, which which really will deal with the users right from hire to retire and the movement in between. And how do we track the user? How do we interface or how do we integrate the user-centric controls to network? How does it act as an authentication gateway? And when you there are so many products are out there which could support those and network, network. There is there are so many products which could support SDN, SD Van, and SASI solutions, which could converge the network and security in one single layer. That was the biggest challenge at the time in earlier years. Now these products could converge, converge network and security in one plane and always continuously apply the security policies throughout. That is our network for data. How could we discover the data? How could we protect the data using the data loss prevention and data loss protection? Those capabilities uh there are multiple vendor vendors up there which we could pick and choose uh with um with the compliance requirements that you are looking at. Um, and as well as uh automation orchestration with with the invent of AI, automation orchestration has become has accelerated to to multifolds. Ask me why. Earlier, these correlations, right? When when there is when certain incidents happen, finding finding out the correlations is such a big event, right? Um, for that, there are some products, and as well as now with the with um with the advent of um AI, AI is on is on is on a RAM. We could use AI to uh quickly assess what is your security posture and do the correlations and give some meanings, meaningful insights uh for uh for uh enterprise to take uh to take an action on. So that is uh automation um and as well as orchestration, how do we integrate uh when there is an anomaly that is happening, right? Uh, when there is some zero trust is all about having a difference in depth controls. So, what it what it means is uh there are so many policy enforcement points which is which are distributed across the network, which is uh uh distributed across the enterprise. And how does this um automation and orchestration would could uh speak to um could orchestrate uh um um a response? Uh right uh so all of these things are coming together with various vendors who are uh right now are accelerating uh uh these uh these capabilities which could uh fit the ZT ZT architecture. And I mean, right now, um I would say if you ask this question a couple of years ago, I would say, yeah, there are only a few vendors up there. Now we could see there are so many, so many vendors with it uh with the advent of uh with uh with the AI is on on the RAM, you could see more and more vendors out there which are open source as well.
SPEAKER_01Okay, so based on your answer, what I'm getting is that these vendors are part of the solution, but they are not the solution.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, that's that that's correct. I know where you are going. See, one single solution, one single product cannot be a solution for you for your zero trust architecture. So it's a combination of tools, it's a combination of capabilities. The all of them coming together and work tune to the dance of tune and dance to the orchestrator to protect the enterprise, is what the ZTE is all about, ZeroTrust is all about, right? And there are there could be multiple tools, multiple technologies, as long as this integration works properly. That's that is the challenge that we are currently facing, and we are pushing for open API framework up there so that it could seamlessly could communicate between between these tools, but we are in the infant stage at this time.
SPEAKER_01Okay, so which vendors do you think are doing a good job with making sure that they use an open AI interface who are more willing to share their with other tools?
SPEAKER_02There are multiple vendors up here. One that could that I could think of is Zscaler, Class, Palo Alto, SASI technologies, and NetScope, Versa appliances. These are the ones which are they went ahead and acquired other capabilities which are lacking in the in their ecosystem or suite of once again. Let me get back to Zero Trust. In Zero Trust, if you I'm from DOD industry, and we are the pioneers, we we take defense, um, defense in depth and z um and cybersecurity seriously. So um there are so many so many uh so many uh people so so many um uh SMEs who work uh on this uh ZT framework. ZT framework consists of seven pillars and with 45 capabilities and with 152 activities. Let's let's talk about those 45 capabilities. Most of the products uh product lines are checking out like 80 to 90 percent of the capabilities if you are going with one single suite of uh tool uh tool set. Having one homogeneous system is not going to be a solution for you, uh, because in your enterprise, you you might be having current um uh cybersecurity tools which are doing some function of um uh the which which is which are protecting uh your uh digital assets. You need to make use of your current investments and make sure you get those capabilities. That's the challenge um that we are facing uh in in acquiring that those ZT capabilities. And there is a lot of lot of work up there. Um, every industry, every customer is different, every customer has their own investment, every customer has their own compliance, their business requirements are completely different. It's it's it's a challenging, and at the end of it, it's very rewarding when once we have uh one uh we have this uh ZT framework, a ZT architecture is in place.
SPEAKER_01You can have multiple products that work with each other, or you can have one suite which covers most of your do you see a risk in putting all your eggs in one basket compared to having multiple products and managing them?
SPEAKER_02I would I would say that never I will never put all my all my risk with one set one single vendor. One single point of failure is not an option, especially for uh for for the um um you know for the warfighters uh uh who are in the field. So we that's a that's a delicate balance. We need to make sure we are having certain tool set and we need to have a backup um solution as well. I'll give you an example of um multiple networks. There are multiple networks, multiple paths to get to your to your application uh to uh the um to the resource that you are trying to access. In zero zero zero trust and in SASI um secure access service search, there is something called SD van solution, which will is an overlay on top of uh the networks. So, what it does is it smartly ro route the traffic based on the available um available uh network path, which could be uh which could improve the user experience. So where I'm going here is with having uh the ZT Zero Trust in place, Zero Trust is a catalyst for you to improve your user experience as well. So, but if you you you uh you need to do this right, and you need to have a uh right vendor, uh right um partner uh who should uh be uh as part of your mission. Uh so choosing the right partner is is is very very important up here.
SPEAKER_01That is perfect segue for our next segment. You mentioned Zotrust is is a catalyst for bigger and for much better things. Can you share how?
SPEAKER_02Oh, nice question. So this is this is something that I was thinking about this concept. Uh I was thinking about it, uh, and ZD is really a catalyst to modernize your enterprise. How? Um see like like um uh movers and lever, uh, movers and levers are who are going uh who are changing their roles. In earlier dates, it's it's it's it was it was tough to track and what roles uh that they are currently having. So for that, ICAM ICAM modernization using the authorized um authentication and authorized authorization gateway is a natural path for you to modernize and how these users could access, and you need to know who should be doing what and why they are there on the network. So obviously, you you need to have a better way of authentic authorization gateway. So now you're touching uh use user pillar, is is improving that um uh SOD violations, um, segregation of duty violations, and uh keeping track of inventory of people and who is doing what. Just by having this ICAM modernization, you got that capability. Secondly, um, let's talk about data. We there is a data pillar up here. Earlier, uh, we data is scattered all over the place, like structured, unstructured. It's going to be now data, data owners and data stewards, they don't even know what set of data that we have that they have. So one of the one of the ZT um Z T activity or Z T capability is you need to know what data that uh you currently have. Where is it? Is it in cloud? Is it in data center? Is it um is it is it in um is it in a database and what type of data that you have? Is it a CUI data, is it a PHI data? You need to identify what data that you have and what type of data that you have, and where is it, what what type of policies that you have to protect that data sets. So once again, um just just by identifying the data, right? Doing this, having this capability of identifying your data sets will identify will will will uh will make you think that what set of policies that you should have to protect that data. So once again, data my um data is a king, you are protecting protecting uh the data. Now uh going to going into the network pillar. Um we just spoke about uh SD van as one of the uh solutions which we which is an overlay which could um give the user experience, and as well as right now, everyone, especially in the industry that we are in, they are heavily dependent on MPLS network, they're internal networks. No one is um no one is um uh you know taking the power of internet, internet is all over the place, and that's the backbone to reach the cloud. So that's because there is a trust trust factor up here. Now, using ZT uh ZT capabilities like um ZTNA, zero trust network access, network and security is converged. It doesn't matter where what type of transport that you use, if it is MPLS or if it is VPN or if it is internet or if it is SATCOM, no matter where you are, the same security principles are being applied throughout without compromising the user user user experience. That's the beauty of it. Now, the way you access the applications, the network is being modernized. So you could you see where I'm going here, right? So these are these are the things which which could really ZT principles and ZT capabilities will really accelerate, which really act as a catalyst for your modernization effort. Um, so you there is no other choice, but but we need to do this, right? The adversaries are becoming smarter using especially this AI. If AI um yeah, AI is use it's it's also a catalyst to um to um to as adversaries to think um different, uh think um out of the box, and uh they would be uh trying all sorts of things and um where you don't even know that attack attack vector attack um attack path is um uh I mean we don't even know those things and they would be exploiting those uh those um uh weak points using AI. So we need to we need we need to be at the speed of uh the adversary who is using uh complex um tools to break into your enterprise, and we need to be ready for that. And ZT is the way to protect your enterprise, have the resilient enterprise. Um, so yeah, uh that's why I would say ZT as a catalyst.
SPEAKER_01Would you say so? Like I understand the senior leadership wants to push for trust, but do you see like boots on the ground there is certain mistrust on these kind of programs? A are they practical or the feasible? In other words, do you see less trust in zero trust?
SPEAKER_02That's a good question. The way you put in it's uh very tricky though. Let me give you one example recently what happened. I don't want to name the names of the vendor. Uh, there is some VPN exploits that happen which which yeah, yeah, uh VPN uh uh VPN exploit exploitation has happened, and uh that made them to shut down that VPN service for a week. So in that you know, at that time I was there and I was the one who was looking for Z DNA sort of a solution. So what I did was I took that opportunity, went to the leadership uh leadership and said, Hey, Z DNA is not VPN. Z DNA will work differently, but at this time, what you could do is You could use that ZTNA technology for it as a VPN replacement, right? That's how we started off. That's how we started off bringing in the ZTNA, and we I was able to convince the uh customer what is the advantage? What is the advantage and why it is uh why the why it is more advantageous as compared to VPN, and I was able to convince them with uh uh with with the with uh battleground uh comparison. And so after a while, when they have seen the importance and uh what how powerful the ZTNA is uh with ICAM modernization, with um uh with with the policies that they are trying to enforce, and how um network availability is much more reliable, which less number of uh outages and stuff like that. We were able to say we are able to um you know uh scale it out for the come for the entire enterprise. The same ZTNA solution, what it is being used as a VPN replacement, is being um use is being replaced um through um uh through ZTNA across the enterprise. So earlier there is always that comfort that uh we are uh that um the operation teams who are very comfortable in what they do. So things like this, right? Um things um like whatever that happened will really be helpful for us to you know bring in the new way of uh doing things and bring in the newer technology in. So that is one that is one thing, and the second thing is I can give you one more example. Um DevSecOps. DevSecOps is such a critical component within uh ZT ZT um capabilities app in the application pillar. So what it says is whatever that comes, whatever um the code or whatever the instruct infrastructure that is being pushed into um into your enterprise need to go through certain controls and certain gates with a shift left mentality, and um it should be like an immutable infrastructure too. Uh meaning uh there should be no downtime and it should be uh easily be replaceable uh with other node. So what it means is we need to go, they need to go into container architecture. So um once again, there was there was there was an application which application which is um critical application which was sitting on a which was sitting on a VM uh which was down and which which was affected um uh the availability and uh messed up the SLAs, and of course more than an SLA, it it is affecting um the soldier uh the uh um uh the warfighters uh who are there on the battleground. So that is not acceptable. So that's when we pitched in the idea of uh yeah, using modernizing and refactoring your application using DevSecOps and DevSecOps principles, uh, DevSecOps pipeline. So that is that is one more uh, you know, you we just need to make use of the situation, we need to pitch in the right technologies, which is in line with um the ZT principles and ZT capabilities. So far, we are successful uh in uh doing so. Um that is one way of looking at it, and there are multiple ways of uh you know um gaining uh your um uh uh time to um time to get into the market, push push a certain product into the market. Um so these are these are some of the indicators that you could um uh look at and see uh at the right time you could push, you could you could bring in the right technology and convince your uh leadership.
SPEAKER_01In in the first scenario that you mentioned, would you say the lack of knowledge caused the lack of trust?
SPEAKER_02Both. I would say uh both. These are ZTNAs, uh it's whenever we say uh VPN is replaced by zero trust neck network access, people will shy away with um listening these big bit terms. There is there is certain uh pushback and there is some uh there is a skills gap. So what we could what uh nowadays what um what vendors are doing is uh they are being very they are giving away these freebies, they are training training uh the people who are network administrators or system administrators, uh, for them uh to be comfortable with the product. I can give you one more example. Um micro-segmentation, micro-segmentation within the networking, uh, network pillar is uh is um is a such a critical capability which could avoid uh adversary to uh move laterally. So there was a pushback uh saying uh we have ACLs, we have security groups, we have all sorts of uh VLAN controls, we are all monitoring uh at the micro level. Why do you need the micro micro segmentation? Once again, we need to go back and say the uh I mean there are some incidents uh that that happened, not only uh it need not uh have to be with the customer, but in the industry, these sort of things have happened. We we gave the um we gave we we gave some pointers and made sure uh there are some investments that are being done, and we identify the right partner, right vendor, and that vendor when they were if we when we were implementing micro-segmentation, micro-segmentation is uh the micro firewalling um uh on the workload so that uh the adversary could could not go laterally. So, for this, this is a new concept. These are new things that uh new way of uh doing things, and um network administrators are and system administrators are not that comfortable. They came in, they gave two-week sessions of uh training, they made uh all the people comfortable with the technology that is bringing in. Now it that really worked out, and it is right now it is operational, and it is scaled out to um uh across the across the enterprise. So, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Great story, great example of how getting buy-in from the team before starting out with a new program. Excellent, okay. People in the cyber security field, you and me, we are daily drinking from the fireworks. There is demand from keeping the lights on, then there are zero trust initiatives and programs. How do you see that as a challenge and how are and how do you see teams coping with that?
SPEAKER_02Good question. Now there are two there are two uh I could uh answer this question in two ways. When we are trying to advertise or when we are when we are having these workshops, right, um, with um with the right folks, to identify what set of cyber capabilities that they have and and to make sure that they are meeting the zero trust capability that we are looking at. At that time, not all the people um are available for for them to participate in those workshops. So fortunately for us, there are some deadlines that we need to meet. There is a there is a directive that is coming in from the top from from DOD CIO, that all the agencies must meet their target level maturity, ZD maturity by 2027. So in CIO made uh our our company uh our client CIO made that one as a priority that really helped us uh to uh to make sure that uh the people uh the uh the state the right stakeholders are right SMEs participate in uh in these workshops. And the second thing is and second part is when once we identify a solution, a capability during the implementation, implementation is is a greater great greater challenge. So they don't want to disrupt the current technology, but at the same time, we need to modernize how do we do this. So what we what what we did was doing the pilots, right? Small pilots on certain department or certain certain application, we test it out and we'll see, we'll see how it looks like, and we'll learn the mistakes from uh those pilots and optimize from the mistakes and make sure we give that comfort level to the uh to the leadership to scale out this capability across the enterprise in a phased manner. So using using pilots, you know, learning from the mistakes and phased approach uh and leadership buy-in, uh, all of these things uh need to come together for you to uh have a successful implementation of your zero trust. Yeah, that's all we did.
SPEAKER_01Sorry, go ahead.
SPEAKER_02No, no, go ahead. I'm sorry.
SPEAKER_01So far, you mentioned discovery, training, five programs. That would bring us to the final segment of our podcast in terms of covering our topic. How do you start and where do you start?
SPEAKER_02Great question. Um, this is the this is the question everyone will uh will have. Okay Zero Trust is a concept. Where do I need to uh where do I need to start? There are there are some assessment tools. There is there is about three months, uh three weeks assessment tools where you could where using those tools, they could assess the cyber capabilities and make sure where are some loopholes. I it's like a it's like a it's like a purple teaming sort of a thing. It's not actual purple teaming, but it's assessing how how good and how weak uh your cyber posture is, and uh map those requ and give give an extensive report on where you are currently. Based on that, when once you identify where you are, there is there is a frame. There are these activities that I just spoke, right? If you identify there is a network pillar, um is not having um is is not that great of uh um uh cyber posture up there. So you could you could um you could um identify what set of capability that you need to uh you need to first target on. There are uh is it a micro-segmentation, is it a micro-segmentation, or is it a SDN solution, or is it um um is it a discovery, is network discovery and to make sure that uh you you have complete visibility on where where what it is um uh where the traffic is flowing. All of these things can be prioritized, working with uh the right, working with the right folks, with the right teams. We could make it as a project and make sure that they they they acquire, they could either acquire the uh capability which um uh which is missing or use the use the existing investment to achieve that capability. Um so initially discovery uh uh discover in the discovery phase, uh identify where what is the weakness, what what are strong strong points, and what are the weak points, and find out what is the target, where you want to move, and um how do you and plan how do you get there um through a proper strategy up there? Great.
SPEAKER_01Understood. So when you are running these these assessments, would you recommend using a top-down approach or you would you use a bottom-up approach?
SPEAKER_02I would I would use um when you do the assessment, right? Um, I would use both, top-down and bottom-up. Let me start with bottom-up. You need to know, you need to discover the assets. You need to you need to know what assets are there, what type of um uh what's what type of incidents that happen, only the people who are on the field could could could give that uh details. And at the same time, at the top, right? Uh all in the middle, um, they need all the things, whatever that we are happening, the ZT needs to align with their their strategy as well. Uh, what is what is their five-year strategy, right? Um, so where does this activity that falls? Uh that that um uh so that they could prioritize their uh the their money and uh their people uh to these these certain activities. So it's a combination of um both. So first uh first I'll identify from from top, right? Uh get the buy-in and make sure that uh we could go to um uh go to the right people and um get access to those people um so that we could get right answers. It's it's uh it's all the questionnaire, uh, it's it's all the workshops that um would uh help us to get there.
SPEAKER_01Um do you think a typical uh zero trust maturity assessment would take?
SPEAKER_02It's very quick. Zero trust assessment. It's it's typically is done within six to eight weeks, not beyond that. There is the there are some standard templates that that we already have developed over the time, and we will when we do these workshops with the with the right SMEs, we will go boom or do you have this? And which will give you the maturity of where you are at for a specific killer or specific act capability that we are looking at.
SPEAKER_01Understood. In this mix, one of the biggest challenges I've seen is how do you bring legacy applications into the fold? How do you tackle that? And where do you start with those?
SPEAKER_02That's a very good question. Legacy applications. These are good candidates for for um for bringing uh them into the ZT fabric. That's that's that's the easy button. So either there should be a strategy um uh where you need to refactor them using DevSecOps, like we spoke about, using uh DevSecOps and containers and bring them on board uh into uh into ZT uh ZT fabric, or in in the interim, what we could do is with um that's that is the challenge that we are currently are uh if we if we don't if we need to keep the lights on while the migration is happening, right? So not at the cost of uh compromising the security posture. That is the that that is the um um that is one of uh the challenges that we are facing. What we could what uh we are trying to do is we are adding a bolt on on top of um uh on top of those app legacy applications so that they they are behind this resource authorization gateway. Um so that uh you would still uh I mean you would still know who is accessing who, what, when you um are being accessed um uh that application. So it's it's it's a method, it it it all depends on what stage it is and what type of uh what type of application, what are the timelines, um, and what's how how critical is that application. Um so all of these things will uh will um uh will help to make that decision on what is the strategy that looks like.
SPEAKER_01So it seems like it's really important to have some kind of it's important for these applications to have some kind of API access that you can put some kind of rabbit, right? Because understand the language of the application. You can't really do much there.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, that that is that is true too. Um so there are some uh once again, there are some ways that uh we could these modernized modern um uh resource uh authorization gateways, especially Okta, has different different connectors as well. You could use the um you you could use the legacy connectors and make sure you still have those controls in place while you are doing the modernization as well. And uh to your point on um the um the networking, right? Um networking and to some extent or to some time for some time uh you need to live with it uh with using poems. Um and uh as soon as you modernize, you could of course uh you could could solve those uh poems as well uh with with your modernization effort.
SPEAKER_01That was great, Rajiv. I have enjoyed our our our conversation focused on zero trust. But now let's get to know you a little bit more. Tell us where you go.
SPEAKER_02My my childhood's uh childhood was all in India. I had the best time. Um I come from the land of where uh spirituality uh is spirituality and um daily living will go together. Um so I come from a back background where um you know doing doing meditation, doing yoga, um, are going to the temples are part of our lives. And op and from that, um now I came to this country. Um now I'm enjoying the convergence of um both uh materialistic life and being still being still being in the in that spiritual realm, uh right, spiritual mindset. So having the common having having the combination of both is the best thing that I could have at this time. I'm really enjoying this this hybrid thing with the both both the cultures. One is uh the carpet culture and uh and uh having the spirituality and uh meditativeness uh mindset. Uh right now I'm converging both and whatever that I am doing, I'm I'm loving it.
SPEAKER_01How do you balance the war between materialism and spiritualism?
SPEAKER_02Good question, Vishwal. Materialistic needs versus spirituality. Yeah, so what spirituality tells me is just do your best and have this mindset of whatever that you do, you offer it to God. In that way, you are not entangled with the results, and you don't get bogged down. Oh, I should have done like this, and I should have you won't be bound to the results. So in that way, every time I approach a client, every time I approach a problem, I don't go back and see what happened before. Every time I'll go and look at in a fresh mindset, this is a new day, this is a new challenge. How could we do this without bringing the baggage, whatever that we had that I had before? In that way, I would be always being novel. It helps me to bring in the novel ideas.
SPEAKER_00and be we always on on the on our on innovating on innovation innovation mindset is being all i'll always approach every pro every problem with an innovative mindset so that's how the spirituality and the work that i'm currently i'm doing are being club and that's how i do it man i have a saying that i learned i don't know from where i i get this thing is that you enjoy the process more than the result excellent yeah that really helps put things in the right perspective because life itself is a journey that we are supposed to grow okay are you still into spirituality meditation and so on that is my daily bread and butter butter i don't start my day without without doing the meditation and nowadays i'm going to go to yoga too so there is a yoga studio yoga and meditation one one works on body and the other works in uh on mind right and it both needs to be lined up both needs to be aligned to have that zen mindset so like you said enjoy the process without without expecting the results this requires some sort of that mindset so I'm clubbing these two too that is not my day with meditation or going to yoga this really helps out my day through my why is it important for for you to not be focused on the result why is it so important for results will always be what you sometimes it'll if you have if you have expectations I mean results are expectations what you could do is uh what what you will end up not giving your best in the process right without without expectation without without thinking of the results think about the problem think about think about the solution focus on the solution to solve the problem that's how I think every single time whenever I I approach my client I approach my aid so in in that in that way I'll enjoy more and I can give the best version of myself to solve the problem which is true so by not thinking about the end result you are able to focus more on the problem at hand and give your best to it right I said yep awesome okay tell us about your family my family is um I have uh wife and two uh beautiful kids uh they are doing uh one is um doing uh engineering within uh at GMU and one is uh raising senior uh yeah now I'm dealing with uh two um grown up kids um yeah they they they're um it's challenging when they are when they are all there everyone has their own wants and needs and uh always not I mean they they they will expect uh we will cater for all the needs whatever that they have uh sometimes it becomes uh little taxing that happens with all grown up kids yeah yeah I'll be in the same boat soon yeah so any of your kids in following your your footsteps by moving into cybersecurity or IT yeah uh we're um my my daughter especially um she would be closely monitoring me uh she would be she would be asking me with a with a curious mindset and what I am doing that made her uh you know uh get into uh in in in STEM field right now uh she right now uh she's in the uh she chose this data science and she keeps asking how would you use data uh to make uh informed decisions how could data be useful and what are the use cases and I will be I'll be I'll be talking uh to her what are some use cases uh where we could use data to uh uh you know to have an informed decision within the cyberspace and how important it is and she she likes that um she wants to be in that uh realm she wants to be in that area I'm glad that I was able to influence her um for regarding uh son he he has um uh he has a business mindset and uh he keeps thinking about he keeps asking how how do you sell this how do you sell that how do you sell that uh this product and how could you make money out of it uh I need to uh I would be wearing a different hat uh for him uh for me to answer his questions yeah that's nice that's nice I think between your daughter and your son you have a strong team I hope so how people can reach you and please share your contact information yeah Raji Parmatmani you could uh uh know not many people has that uh long uh long last name uh you could uh reach me out uh on LinkedIn I'll be uh writing some blogs uh every now and then um I'll be writing some white papers in collaboration with uh CSA um so feel free to reach out if you need any guidance or any mentorship um I love to provide them and cyber security needs bright minds and we are here to uh give you some guidance and and to tap those bright minds uh please feel free to reach out yeah awesome I'm sure people will oh thank you thank you again Pajip I'm sure our listeners will love will love our conversation thank you again for being on the show thank you Ishal thanks thanks for taking time um and um love talking uh to you at the end of the day we we are looking for the bright minds or we love to um I'm um if I could um influence one one mind one bright mind uh from uh today's uh prod podcast uh I'm successful up here thank you thank you I appreciate that we have to train our avoiders of the future yeah next gen yep this brings to an end 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