What Makes a Dad? Love Beyond Blood

In part two of this special series, Josh, Britt, and Jerod open up about fatherhood from three completely different perspectives. From adoption and step-parenting to co-parenting after divorce, this episode dives into the moments that truly define being a dad. The guys share emotional stories about loss, blended families, learning to show up for their kids, and realizing that fatherhood is about far more than DNA. This is an honest conversation about love, growth, sacrifice, faith, and the responsibility of raising children in a complicated world. Whether you’re a biological dad, bonus dad, adopted dad, or someone still figuring it out, this episode will hit home.

We appreciate y’all listening. If you got something out of this, share it with someone who’s still figuring it out too. We’ll catch y’all next time.

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:01

Welcome back to another week of Still Figuring It Out. I'm Josh. I'm with my co-host Britt. We've got Jared still. This is a two-part series that we're doing. You know, I thought last week's episode went really good. And I'm honestly really excited to see where this episode goes. You know, last week's episode was What Makes a Man. But now, today, we're going to talk about what makes a dad. And so we all come from kind of a different background with being a dad. And I'm I'm really excited about this one to see where this one goes. You know, this one might be a little tearjerker for one, maybe two, maybe even three of us, you know. So, because we all really have awesome stories, you know, and they're all very different stories. So, you know, I'm a dad of five. You know, I'm not going to talk about my wife in this one as much because, again, this is about being a dad to our kids. I've got five kids, you know, I have my oldest who's adopted, and then I have my second oldest who is mine, but I share her with Jared that's with us today, and and her mom. And then I have my three little ones who I have with my wife, you know. So that's me. And then Britt, you want to go ahead and tell them kind of your situation, and then Jared, you can kind of tell them your situation, then we'll go from there.

SPEAKER_00 1:33

Yeah, me and my wife just have the one, Gabby. She's seven. So biologically, she is my wife's niece. Her my wife's sister, which would be Gabby's biological mom, died after her pregnancy. So we have her, and that's all I've got. Just the one.

SPEAKER_01 1:51

Yeah, and Jared? Yeah. First off, thank you guys for for inviting me back again. Last week was was a lot of fun. Really enjoyed the conversation. It was good, good, good stuff. But yeah, I am a father of two. As Josh had mentioned a few minutes ago, we share one. Her name is Riley, she's 16 years old. And since then, my wife and I have been able to conceive another one. His name is Tristan, and he is three years old. So a little bit of an age gap between the two, which makes life very interesting. But yeah.

SPEAKER_02 2:26

Yeah. So, so, you know, that's kind of who we are and what our situations are. But now I'm going to to kind of get in a little deeper to each situation. I'm going to kind of tell my story of how I had mine, and then Jared, you'll go next. And then Britt, you can kind of tell your story. So, so, you know, I was I was previously married to Caitlin. We had Riley. We had her at a really young age. Looking back at it, I I don't think we were ready. You know, we were super young. I mean, Caitlin wasn't even 21 years old, and you know, and I was just turning 21. So like we were young, but we had Riley. You know, we fast forward a few years. We get a divorce, you know, we just figured out we were better off separated, you know, and and I'm by myself. I'm now what you would consider a single dad, you know, because I have her every other week is what we was doing at first. And and and then Steven came along, you know, and Steven was a kid that I coached from third grade, fourth grade, fifth grade, you know, just moving up through pee-wee football and and and you know, I ended up loving the kid as a kid, just as an athlete, because he was a hard-nosed kid, tough kid, you know. We kind of had the the same type of childhood. Now his was a little rougher than mine, but he was just a fighter, you know, and like I said, I wasn't much of a fighter, but you know, we we he reminded me of of me a lot, you know, and needed some help. Yeah, and and so, you know, when he was a seventh grader, his mom committed suicide, you know, and and he moved in with his uncle, and he just wasn't happy, you know. He wanted he wanted more, and I wasn't in a position at all where I could give him that, you know. You were coaching him at the time? No. So at this time they've they've moved off to silo. He was going to silo, and you know, his mom actually reached out to me and was like, is there any way Steven can can move in with you? He doesn't like silo, he doesn't, he doesn't like going to school here, he he wants to be in Medil, he wants to play football, he's just not happy where he's at. And, you know, I was like, well, we could talk about it. And I that was on Facebook Messenger. I still have the messages, and and I'll tell you more about this in just a second, as we get into this story a little bit more. But, you know, that that happens. Well, I never hear from her after that, you know. And then 10 months later, I believe, is whenever I find out she committed suicide and and that Stephen didn't have anybody. His his biological dad was in and out of jail and prison and and just didn't have much going on, you know. And so he moves in with his uncle, you know, and his uncle loves him, obviously. You know, he still he still talks to his uncle. There's nothing nothing bad about that situation at all. I mean, he's close with his grandma still, you know, they they live in Tichamingo. And and well, I see Steven one day, and he's at Medille, he's at a basketball tournament. Now we went to go watch him. My friend and I, Terry, he has a son at Steven's age, who's Steven's best friend. Well, we go watch, and and Steven's there playing basketball, and I get to talking to him, and you know, he just he wasn't happy. He he wanted more, he he knew he had a bigger purpose. He he knew what he he wanted to be in Medil. He he wanted these things that he couldn't have where he was at. And him and I got to talking, and I'm like, dude, you know, yeah, you can move in with me. Like, we've got to figure it out, but I'm I'm okay with it if we can figure it out. So I get a hold of his grandmother, and his grandmother was like, you know, I I don't I don't know. Like, I know you was close with him when he was younger, and you know, pee-wee, and and I know you coached him and everything, and I'm sure you do love him, you know, but like that's asking a lot, you know, you have a you have a daughter, you know, so on and so forth. Well, I showed her the messages where his mom reached out to me and was like, can he move in with you? Like, you know, he you are what he needs in his life. And, you know, and she's seen that and she got emotional, and she was like, you know, if that's what my daughter wanted for her son, he can move in. You know, he's yeah, sure. So we get to that situation. I contact an attorney who goes to our church, and and we start talking about, you know, what do I need to do guardianship-wise, all this stuff. So he tells me, you know, this is the steps, this is what we gotta do. I was like, well, what about adoption? And he, you know, he was like, Well, if you adopt him, just know that you, you know, he won't qualify for social security, he won't qualify for his medical stuff that he got his sooner care, whatever that was, you know, you make too much, then he won't get financial aid, he won't get old promise, you know. So I'm like, oh, okay, maybe we just maybe we just be his guardian where he gets these things because I feel like at the time where I was in my life, like I said, I recently got a divorce, and and so I didn't know how I felt about raising two kids by myself. You know, granted, I shared, I shared Riley, so I had help there, but every other week I needed I needed that help. I didn't get that help, you know, I was just me with them. And so I was like, okay, so I talked to Steven about it, and Steven, you know, he's been he's been a blessing. He was the stars really aligned with Steven, you know, because my dad committed suicide when I was seven years old, you know, so I was like, wow, you know, they they committed suicide kind of, you know, so that's that. And then I got to thinking, well, our parents committed suicide just a few days apart, you know, many years later, obviously, but just a few days apart. There's a bunch of little signs. Yeah, well, so it gets better. You know, my dad's name was Stephen Wayne Sisko. Steven's name was Stephen Wayne Condit. You know, so like, I mean, you're just like God's putting all these things in the city. I lied. My dad's name was Stephen Ware, and my middle name is Ware, but my granddad's middle name was Wayne. You know, his name was Donald Wayne Cisco. So, I mean, I think there's just too many things connecting dots. So I'm like, you know what? Like, it's crazy because all this stuff kind of lines up. Well, then his birthday is May 12th, which Riley's birthday is May 13th.

SPEAKER_01 9:19

I'm like, dude, like it's it's all it's all too too good of a story. Like, like not to mention he's a ginger.

SPEAKER_02 9:26

Yeah, and and I, you know, and look, it just so happens to be that I'm a ginger, you know. So, like, so all these things are happening and lining up. I'm like, dude, this is this is what it's meant to be. So I couldn't change his name at the time, you know, and and so he was a condit legally, but the school was like, no, you know, if he wants because he wanted to be a Cisco. Steven wanted to be Steven Cisco. You know, he he didn't want the name Condit because and and and I hate to say it like this, like you know, it had a bad name. He didn't want he didn't want to be associated with his dad. He wanted to first start. And and and you know, and and I get that because I knew what he was going through because again, I went through that when I was a child, you know. So I was like, if you want to be called Cisco, we'll put your legal documents as Stephen Condit, but you know what, the school is okay with calling you Stephen Cisco, and you'll be a Cisco. So he went through 7th, 8th, 9th, 10th, 11th, 12th as a Cisco. You know, but legally he was Condit. Well, fast forward up until this past year, August 12th, August 21st of 2025, we officially was able to change his name to Cisco. So now he is my true adopted son. And granted, he's 21 at this time, you know, so it's three years afterwards. Like, so he is officially a Cisco now, and you know, which I could I could have beat him, you know, as a conduit, but now I can beat him as a Cisco if he gets out of line, you know, which always goes on. But but like I said, sorry, but uh, but yeah, so that's kind of where I got Steven. And then, you know, obviously I got him in seventh grade. Well, his junior year. I I'm married, I get my current wife, we have kids, we start all over. So now I've got a an 18-year-old, a 14-year-old, and babies, you know. So I I started all over. So that's kind of kind of Steven's story with me and how I got him, you know. So that was that was fun and and everything else. So now Jared, kind of talk about where you were, you know, in life and what you were doing and everything else, and then talk about your experience with Gidden Riley, and then you know.

SPEAKER_01 12:12

So, yeah, I moved here uh to the area in 2017 for work. Was kind of, you know, uh I at the time I wasn't dating anybody. I I I I hadn't been married previously, no, no previous children from any previous relationships to my knowledge. But yeah, I moved to a new place. I didn't know anybody here. I was by myself. Lived here for about a year, year and a half, I think it was. And I met Caitlin, she was uh waitressing at a local restaurant here in town at the time. Started to pursue her a little bit after I found out that she was single. We started dating and things moved pretty quick. In fact, we I say this all the time, and it's really not a joke, it's true. I I actually met Riley at a fifth quarter after a high school football game before I had ever met Caitlin. And you know, Riley was just this little kid at the time. She was six years old, full of life, energy, sweet as could be. And in fact, she was actually helping her mama that night. She was working, obviously, can't be paid. I think they were just letting her have some fun. And I had ordered a pizza, and I had asked for some ranch, and she went and got me some ranch. Anyway, so met Riley first, and I saw her mom walk through the restaurant. I mean, obviously, at the time, it was very easy to identify that you know that she'd lose a carbon copy of her mama, and I looked over at my buddy I was with that night, and I said, I bet that I bet that's her mom. And so I started talking to mom very innocently. It wasn't really at that particular time, everything I was focused on doing was was for my career. We were trying to, you know, revitalize a business. I wasn't here to try to find a wife, but you know, that's kind of how God works. I watched both my sisters at a very young age, kind of like you and Caitlin, you know, fresh out of high school. They, you know, had kids, got married, and I obviously, you know, as I'm going through my 20s, you know, they're they're younger than I am. But as I was going through my 20s, I kind of saw, you know, the struggles that they were facing as a young, you know, young couple from young marriage, you know, with kids. My my middle sister, she had three kids. I mean, just one right after the other. And my baby sister, she had a kid a couple years out of high school. Both presented different challenges. It worked for them, you know, in the long run. But for me, these were all kind of things that, you know, I I don't know. I I told myself in my 20s that I did not want to get married until I had established myself. Whatever that meant to me at the time, for me, you know, in your 20s, it's having a lot of money. But that was kind of the thing that kind of kept me from, you know, ever pursuing marriage. I got close a couple times, couple girls that I fell in love with and loved them, you know, to the best of the ability that I knew how to love at that particular time in my life. But, you know, they weren't they weren't the right relationships, so obviously they came and went. But, you know, when I met Caitlin, we moved pretty quick. You know, I I met with Josh right after Caitlin and I had started dating because it was very important to me in hearing their story, you know, they were pretty I mean, you guys were only about a year outside of out of divorce, you know, which for me I wouldn't call it a red flag, but I wasn't really thinking that this was gonna turn into, you know, a marriage. Not not not as quick as it did. But it was important to me because I was gonna be spending time around somebody else's child that I had a relationship with that person, and that was, you know, very important for me to establish with Josh early on, and I think that it's helped, you know, as we've continued into where we are today. So yeah, Caitlin and I dated for nine months. I asked Riley if I could propose to her, and Riley said yes. So I proposed to her and we got married that following January of 2019. 2019, yes. It was a hindsight being 2020. I was that person that grew up was gonna marry a you know, a woman that I didn't think that I could marry somebody that had been in a previous marriage with another child. And not for any insecurity, you know, of drama or anything like that, but more so because I did not know if I could possibly love that child as if it were my own. And that's because that's what that child deserves. I didn't know if I was capable of doing that. God disproved me, because I I fell in love with Riley. I fell in love with Riley before I fell in love with Caitlin. So that for me was kind of one of the those things where you kind of you know, stop, you look at your life, and you're like, well, I swear I'd never be able to do something like that, and I did. So, you know, at that point I was able to identify and realize that God had a different plan for me, and it wasn't gonna be under my terms, it was gonna be under his terms. Because I did not think that Caitlin would be the person that I would end up with just for the very simple fact that I didn't think that I could possibly love somebody else's child as if for my own. I was wrong about that. So at that point I just kind of you know, I carry underwood, said, you know, Jesus take the will, kind of thing. And he took it. And Caitlin and I got married. I told Caitlin, you know, I'm in my I'm 40 now. When Caitlin and I started started dating, I was 33. By the time we were married, I was 35. I was getting to a point in my life where I did not necessarily want to have. I felt like my days were were numbered on how much time I had to have another child because I didn't want to turn 40, conceive a child, and then be 55, 60 when that child's getting out of high school. You know, I you know, I just thought my time is now. If we can do it in a year or two, and that's in God's plan, great. If not, that's not why I'm marrying you. I'm not marrying you for children. I've got I've I've I've got I've got Riley. I found that. You know, I didn't think I could ever have that with somebody else's child, but I found it. So, you know, that that satisfied my need for family. So it was really about marrying Caitlin. And of course, you know, she's a woman, and instinctually that's what a woman wants to be able to provide to their husband is children. We struggled with that for a couple years. She had two miscarriages, and at that point I was 36, going on 37. And we sat down and kind of basically, you know, I had a very hard conversation with her. And I said, Look, you know, I married you for you. We've tried to have children, and maybe it's just not what God has planned for us. And I'm okay with that. I need you to be okay with that too. For her, she it felt like a sense of failure. You know, she felt like she wasn't able to produce child. And I there was some history with her in having Riley. There were some challenges there. So I knew it was gonna be, you know, risky to some degree. And I didn't want to continue to put that kind of kind of strain on on Caitlin because I I really truly I had found my I had a child and I had embraced Riley as my child. Josh allowed me to do that, he gave me free reign with her and trusted me. Has never challenged me or at, you know, questioned my ability to be her stepfather. So, you know, I I had that with Riley and I was okay with that. But again, as God has it in his own little way, he uh you know he finds ways to to throw curveballs at you. We had just purchased a new vehicle, I wanted to get her something that she wanted. It was small and sporty, not something that was conducive to a growing family. And a month later she pulled up to the dealership with like 16 pregnancy tests, and they were all were positive. At that point, I didn't. I was trying to be realistic because we had been on this emotional roller coaster twice before. So, you know, I didn't allow myself to get overly excited about it. But after we got through her first ultrasound and we were able to register a heartbeat, and then the second ultrasound, you know, things started getting real. You know, I was I had to realize, hey, this is this is happening, we're gonna I'm gonna have a kid. And she gave birth to Tristan in July of 2022, and he is now three years old. So yeah, that's that's kind of my story of how I got here and where I am today.

SPEAKER_02 21:06

You know, and and I want to add something to that, like with you becoming in getting in Riley's life and being her bonus dad, like, you know, that was something that I prayed about because I was like, man, God, just please, please allow us to have someone in Riley's life that's that's a good person, that has the same values that I have, the same expectations that that I have for Riley, you know, and and it couldn't honestly like it couldn't have worked any better, you know, because when I mean he came to me and was like, I wanna I wanna meet you and kind of introduce myself, you know, because I w I didn't want to be the guy that was like, hang on, Caitlin, who are you dating? Who is who is this guy? You know, like he he reached out to me first. And so I had a lot of respect for that because he came and he was like, I don't want to be, I don't want you to think I'm stepping on your toe. It was like, I understand that you are Riley's dad.

SPEAKER_01 22:02

And that was something in getting to know Riley before, you know, I was coming to the the decision to ask Caitlin to marry me. I knew Riley had a father. We talked about this a little bit pre-show. I knew Riley had a father. I knew she had a daddy and and a good one. And she wasn't in need of a of a dad. Her situation is the exact opposite of what Steven's situation was. My job was to come be an extension of that, you know. Seeing what Riley was about, you know, being faith-driven, going to church every time the doors were open, wanting to serve the Lord. Like I knew I knew what the foundation of this family was constructed of, you know. And it it didn't it didn't hold, but I knew what it was built on. And it was everything that I would have built my family and foundation on. So for me, it was just it was easy for me to I don't want to say take a back seat. I don't I don't feel like I'm in the back seat. I feel like, you know, we're correct me if I'm wrong, but uh, you know, I feel like I I walk right next to you with her. Yeah. You know, and she's she's allowed me to to teach her, you know. That that's been my only my only purpose in her life was to help her grow, get her prepared for the real world and everything that's good about it and everything that's bad about it. And my mandate is that's some she had the daddy. I didn't have to be that. She needed me to be that for her, I would. If something would have happened or whatever, I would have definitely stepped into that role. Because he he sometimes had to have done that, you know, but now yeah, but you know, I I I you know I kind of just let it flow to me. You know, where I need to be there, I'm there. And and and and it's worked, I think it's worked out really good. I I've I've got friends that have gone through similar situations, and we talked a little bit about this briefly, too. Their situation isn't near as good as what I've been blessed with, or what we've been blessed with, you know. And I know that there's a lot of listeners out there today that, you know, we're not the only ones that are going through this. You know, there's there it's a statistical fact. 67% of Americans are divorced. That's a high number. So there's a lot of people out there that are in the same boat that we're in. And, you know, I don't know that everything we're saying here today is a recipe for success, but it's worked for us. And I think that, you know, that's that's that's part of growth is being able to hear opposing opinions, have conversation, and hear it from different perspectives. I think all those things help us grow and mature in life. That'll help us answer those questions that we sometimes look up and we're like, what do we do? For sure. For sure.

SPEAKER_02 25:02

Britt, I mean, kind of tell us, you know, how stepping into fatherhood, you know, after a family tragedy, like talk talk us through that situation and that story and how that came about.

SPEAKER_00 25:14

Okay. Man, so I guess I better start from the start if I'm gonna. So before I was born, my mom got married to my biological dad. They got divorced before I was born. She remarried again when I was two. John Paul was his name. And so that, you know, initially that's who I knew as dad. Got divorced again, I think within like a year and a half. So I took his last name, his last name was Bozeman. Well, she got married again when I was five, uh, to Richard Moore was his last name. So, you know, as far as as John Paul's involvement, you know, it'd be kind of like I'd go see him every two weeks type of deal. He got remarried to my stepmom Rhonda, and really she's kind of the only reason I felt like I really ever really wanted to go see him. I'd go see him and I'd just hang out with her and he'd kind of do his own thing. But you know, he he was big on like, you know, if if he once my mom married Richard, I kind of started using the last name of Moore, even though my last name was still Bozeman at the time. And so he he just he wouldn't really come to ball games or anything because you know they would say more and and I guess he would kind of feel embarrassed. So I don't I don't know. Uh that's just kind of Richard definitely became my dad because I mean he he was better than 99% of the dads out there. So when I was seven, you know, I had Richard and my mom had Clay, my brother, and I felt like he did a great job. Not really something you notice as a kid, but you know, kind of looking back when you get into adulthood, like a great job of being equal for us both, you know, not favoring him because that's his child. So, you know, fast forward to adulthood and I started dating Danetta. And so the time we started dating, I want to say I never met her sister. She died before we started dating. It was probably maybe six, eight months before that. And she had kind of mentioned her sister and and having having Gabby, and I think Gabby was living with their grandma at the time. Well, after maybe a year, you know, she talks to me and she's like, hey, you know, grandma's getting kind of too old to take care of Gabby and there's no one else that can do it. What would you think about us taking her? And I I loved the idea, you know. I I thought, well, you know, absolutely. I'd met her a time or two, I think. So brought her over and just loved her, you know. As far as I was ever concerned, that was my daughter, and and so, you know, things things been pretty smooth. You know, I I've kind of been at the point to where like she still has her her the last name of her dad. Her dad ended ended up in prison, I think, and so he's totally out of the picture. She still has his last name. That that's you know never been a thing to me. I I don't think you know, kids that are in that situation, I don't think they should be pressured into picking one last name or another. You know, that wasn't a situation they were brought into. But I guess what what would kind of make mine the opposite of Jared, where Jared was like, Man, I don't know if I could ever take a child that's not mine. You know, I've I've always felt like, man, I don't know if I don't know if I would want us to have our own child because I I I feel like I might favor Gabby. You know, because I don't know. That's just how I'm that's that that sounds strange.

SPEAKER_02 29:18

And and you, you know, of course I'm thinking of a child that doesn't exist to compare it to, but but you know, sorry to interrupt you, but like you talking about you having a guy that stepped in, kind of like Jared, and and treated you as his own, like I feel like by doing that, you know, that could have even gone on last week's episode with but being a man and stepping in and doing those things. Like, do you think that you'd have been it'd have been had a different thought about it if that wouldn't have happened to you? Oh, I'd have definitely had a different thought.

SPEAKER_00 29:54

You know, I would have, you know, all those stereotypes about a a stepdad or or stepkid, you know, having to raise a kid that's not your own, uh, would have definitely been in the picture. But you know, being raised by someone that wasn't my biological dad and and seeing how good of a job he did, man, it it just made it made it so smooth.

SPEAKER_01 30:16

Well, see, and that, you know, for me as I look back on it, you know, my stance at the time, it just goes to show my my ignorance, you know, uh for me to think that way. You know, uh but again, you know, in last week's last week's episode, we talked a lot about, you know, there's different and there's so many different seasons seasons that we go through in becoming a man and how we define that, how it evolves, you know, and a lot of that just comes through time and experience. Yeah, you know, you had a totally different experience than I had. I was raised in a family where you know I come from a from a biracial family. My mom is Caucasian, my father is African-American, black. They did it in a time that it was completely taboo to the entire world. You know, they kept their marriage in secrecy for two years, and the only reason it came out was because my mom was pregnant with me. You know, and I was raised in the church. I was raised church of Christ, which is extremely conservative. And it was, you know, you you wait till you're married to have sex, you marry one time and you marry forever, you know, and these are all sacred things. And again, that goes back, you know, that because that's how I was raised, it later translated into ignorance and me completely closing off the idea that it could even be possible for me to fall in love with a woman and another child that didn't belong to me. Yeah, yeah. So whereas because that you were raised in that environment, yeah, that's that was almost all I know. That's all you knew. It was it was normal for you know, for me, it was completely foreign.

SPEAKER_00 32:00

Right. You know, yeah, you you see a lot of a lot of people that can't have kids and you know they don't even think about adoption because it's like, oh, you you don't really know what you're getting, and it's like, man, to me, you don't know what you're missing out on.

SPEAKER_01 32:12

And we, you know, Caitlin and I, we went through a little phase in our life where we were trying having to try to accept that. Now, you know, I was able to to blanket that with the fact that, well, I've got Riley, and that's good enough for me. But there was a time where, you know, we had, as I stated earlier, we had two miscarriages, and now I'm having to think about the idea of life with not being able to have a child of now, you know.

SPEAKER_02 32:36

You know, and it's it's funny because it's all God's timing. When it's said and done, we our plans can be thrown out the window. Like we have tons, you had a plan of never having a lot of gone. Any in anything like I thought of, you know, and I and I had a I had a plan in my head after I got a divorce, guys. To me, marriage was I'm the furthest thing from your mind.

SPEAKER_01 33:01

Probably didn't want to do it again.

SPEAKER_02 33:03

I was living great, I got paid good. I mean, I was like, dude, like I'm good. I don't need I don't need nobody, you know, and but but God's timing, man, like it's funny how he works, and and you know, and and Britt and I have said before this is not a Christian podcast. I mean, we are Christians, but we don't, you know, do everything. But our lot of our principles are Christian principles, and and it's it's just funny, like when people tell me he's not real, and I'm like, guys, I'm living proof.

SPEAKER_01 33:35

I don't you know I can't ever I'm not not I can go down on a huge button. Right, yeah, and that can that can be a whole different segment. You know, just uh there's any uh anyways, but no, but but he shows his face in every in everything we do.

SPEAKER_02 33:52

I mean, just look at how the human body works, you know what I mean but you know I'm getting I'm what what I'm what I'm getting at is is you know I'm at Infinity and we were not dating long at all, you know, and she hits me with we got something going on, and it ain't an issue between you and I, but we are having a baby, and then and like, oh geez, we've been together like a month, maybe two months, uh well, and and you know, and and and again, this that could be a whole different thing because Infinity is a God-fearing woman who who does so good all the time, you know, and and not only we having one, we come to find out we're having two the first go-around, you know, and you're just like, oh geez, Lord help me, because you know, because she was like, I I need to be married, I'm supposed to be married, I'm supposed to do this, you know, and and and life happens, and and God has a plan for everything.

SPEAKER_01 34:55

And and you know, one day I'm gonna get infinity on and let her tell her testimony because it's it's a great testimony, and and I want I want not just guys that listen to us, but the women to hear like it's okay to fail, you know, and it is okay, and despite and I'm not trying to go too much further into Christianity, but despite the fact that maybe it was against his teaching and what he wanted us to do or wanted you to do, it still was his plan.

SPEAKER_02 35:22

But it still happened in his time, and he uses that for his good because you've seen my kids, they are they love the Lord, and they're four years old, but those children, those little bitty kids, man, they they love they love church, they love, they love worship music, they love God, they they just love anything God, godly, you know. But what I what I'm getting at, I mean, like I said, we can hit different rabbit holes on this topic and go 10,000 different miles in each direction. But it's it's funny because all three of us guys have three different paths, but at the end of it, we all have this like similar responsibilities. And that's and that's just being a dad, you know. So obviously we were young men once, and we were young dads once, but but when did you feel or first feel like a dad? What was your first I'm a dad moment, you know, because obviously I was before you two, you had, you know, you had you was a stepdad, a bonus dad, you came in with a lady that had a sister who had a kid. Well, I was there for my first child's birth, you know, like so I I was there, but I don't think being a dad quite hit me yet because I was so young, you know. So like when when did you first feel that dad moment?

SPEAKER_00 37:03

I think when she she quit calling me Brit and started calling me dad, I remember the first I remember that exact moment, the first time she said that, and I was like, oh, yep.

SPEAKER_02 37:14

Was it like a tearful moment, or was you like shocked?

SPEAKER_00 37:16

Yeah, I was a little shocked and I just had to sit there and think about it for a second, and I was like, Yeah, I am. I like I like that. And it just it just clicked from there. Yeah. Yeah, that's all I got on it.

SPEAKER_01 37:29

For me, it was it was with Riley. Me, I am naturally an affectionate person. I'm a hugger, I like to hold hands. I I my love language is physical touch. With Riley, you know, I I I I let her I let her make all the first moves with me. I really did. I didn't push it on her. I didn't ask her, you gotta call me stepdad, or I didn't make her hold my hand. I wanted her to naturally do it on her own, on her own terms. And I'll never forget. We took her out to they had a reenactment out at Washitaw Point, and they do it every single year, a Civil War reenactment or something. Rendezvous? Yeah, something like that. It was raining that day, it was cold. Her and I were walking around, and her mom was behind me, and her mom's got a photograph of it. Um it's a photograph of I will have forever. We were walking around going to the next tent, and she just walked up and and grabbed my hand. I wasn't looking for it, I was looking around, and next thing I know, I felt a little hand grabbed my hand. And I stopped and I looked at her, and she looked up at me and she kind of smiled, and I just kept on walking. And in that moment, for me, that was the first time I felt like a dad. Yeah, that's all it was simple, it was nothing big. She didn't, it wasn't a she messed up and called me dad. It was just she we we we broke through in our relationship. We took a step in our relationship that day, and that was the first time that her and I'd always been friends, you know. She I was cool and I was funny and I was quirky, and you know, she could be herself around me, and I'd give her all of my attention, and you know, the friendship was very easy. But when she started to show affection, is when now I felt like she she's let she's let her guard down. She's opening her heart up. Yeah, you know, kids are we say I love you, and we take it for granted every time we say it. I say it every time I'm on the phone with my wife, I say it to Riley every morning before I leave for school, it just falls out of our mouth.

SPEAKER_02 39:29

But you know, when you feel it, you feel it, you know, and that was that was it for me. Yeah, and and so again, having different paths and different moments like that, were you ready to be a dad? See, because again, I was 21 and I I wasn't I wasn't ready. So like I had I had to grow up quick and I still was slow on growing up. You know, I look back now with with Indy Ivy and Jersey, and and I don't want to say I'm upset about it, but I'm like, man, I could have done so much better if I was a little bit more mature. I could have done so much more, or I would have I would have cherished those moments and valued those moments because I will never be able to pick up Riley and hold her again like a like she's my baby. And we're getting to that these little ones now. Right. And so, like, but now I'm more aware of those situations. I make sure I cherish those those little moments with my little ones that I wish I could go back and have with Steven, or wish I could go back and have with Riley that I can't now. And and that's hard. That's hard to swallow. That's a hard pill to swallow sometimes, you know. Those horse pills that are toughening down. That's it's two of those at once, you know, and it's and it and it sucks.

SPEAKER_01 41:04

And and you look back and like, man, like you start asking, like, did I do everything I could to that's coming from a state of reflection, and really and truly, I don't know that you could I I don't I don't necessarily believe that we're ever 100% ready. Yeah, but I can tell you what I can tell you is you're you're wise in identifying that you got that moment once before, and you're looking back on it and saying, Man, did I miss out on something? But now you're taking advantage of it because you've got a second opportunity at it this round with the with with the little ones. You know, I I'll never forget. I remember as I was preparing for Tristan to come into this world, you know, people would say, Take as many pictures as you can, take videos every time that he's you know gooing and gone and talking and stuff, because it's gonna come and go really fast, and you're gonna forget what he sounded like whenever he was a baby. Yeah, you're gonna forget what he looked like when he was a newborn. And of course, he gets here, and I'm like, Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know. And I'm paying attention, I'm cherishing every moment, enjoying it, and then he starts to crawl. Rerolls over, then he starts to crawl, then he starts walking, and you're excited because he's doing all these new things, and now I'll scroll through pictures back in when it, you know, a month or two after he was born, I'm like, dang, I don't even remember him looking like that. Yeah, and I'll watch a video whenever he's cooing and calling because his mom's dangling a you know rubber giraffe or something, and he's making, you know, a little baby noise, and I'm like, I forgot he sounded. So even me at 30, 40 now, I'm 40 years old. And I thought, because I made a commitment in my 20s, I'm not gonna get married until I'm ready. I'm financially stable, I'm mature, I've gotten all the wild crap out of my system that you want to do in your 20s, be selfish for myself, travel, do all those things. I did all that stuff, and then I got to my 30s, I'm like, okay, now I'm ready to for that next chapter. I'm ready to settle down. Here I am at 40. And I'm I catch myself doing things that people are discouraging me of doing. Don't don't wish it away too fast. Don't don't wish for him to go from crawling to walking. Don't wish for him to be able to read and stuff like that, because you're not gonna get that stuff back. So for you, Josh, I think really and truly, I think, I think you're wise in identifying that, you know, maybe at 21 years old or 20 years old, however old you guys were whenever y'all had Riley, maybe you weren't ready for it. Probably not. What 18, 19, 20 year old is? But what's crazy is is when it happens, kind of just make yourself ready for it. Right. And that and that's the thing is I wasn't ready for Riley. Yeah. And she grabbed my hand that day. I'm like, oh shoot, here we go.

SPEAKER_02 43:54

Yeah, and now I gotta be ready. And that's the thing is you know, when you look back and reflect, are we? Ever really ready? No, I don't think so.

SPEAKER_01 44:03

Because for me it was, you know, I'm juggling two people's parts, not just Caitlin's. Yeah, maybe if it was just me and her, we date, break up, heartbroken for six months, a year, move on to the next. But now I've got a little kid. Yeah. A little kid. I can't bounce in and out of that child's bike. Right. So I better make sure I'm I'm pretty darn ready.

SPEAKER_02 44:28

Well, I and I can tell you this from I mean personal experience. If if it wasn't for the three little ones, and Vinny and I might not have made it out past that dating stage because we had different we were at different levels of our life, you know. I mean, I'm I'm older than she is. I mean, she she calls me an old man.

SPEAKER_01 44:45

But when them when a woman has a goes through lab, you know, goes through pregnancy and labor and stuff, they they basically grew up by five or six years overnight.

SPEAKER_02 44:56

Well, and that's and that's the thing is, you know, our kids have really helped Infinity and myself. And you know, like we still struggle, obviously, at certain times with certain things, but we all do. But who doesn't? You know, so I don't I don't think it's the fact that you'll never be ready. You just have to be ready to work on that moment.

SPEAKER_01 45:17

That's I mean, that that that's that's the that's that's life in general. We're never ready for anything that happens in life. You can be as prepared as you think you are. Yeah. You can get as prepared as you want. I I thought I was I had Tristan's bedroom set up six month months before he he was here, and I had every diaper and in place and I knew where everything was. I'm ready. Go have him, bring him home. I wasn't ready. I was going to Walmart every day because I didn't have this, I didn't have that. So you can try to get prepared, and it helps, but I don't think we're ever 100% ready for anything else. And I I do agree with that.

SPEAKER_00 45:57

Yeah, it's just gotta be uh an uphill, you know.

SPEAKER_01 46:00

It's reactionary. I mean, it's everything you you can you can do things to be proactive, but life in general, it's catch. We're catching and then responding. Right.

SPEAKER_02 46:12

What and you know, you you kind of hit on the first emotional moment. You know, what would you say? You you're do you have a first like emotional moment of of becoming of that reality of being a dad?

SPEAKER_00 46:26

No, I mean, probably just what I'd said when whenever she called me dad, that's kind of when I started thinking about you know, or I get now, I guess the first one would be when Danetta asked me, you know, if we wanted to think about taking her in. And then, you know, you start having those thoughts of of all the stuff you gotta do, and you know, start thinking about man, I I've got to what was your moment later?

SPEAKER_02 46:50

So uh real fast, later that night when y'all went to bed and stuff, you told Danetta, did you like she called me dad? Like, was that was that like was that meaning was that like the thing?

SPEAKER_00 47:00

No, I don't even think I really talked to her about it. I should have. Um I just you know, it it just when my mind starts going and I'm thinking, I'm like, oh man, I you know, I do remember thinking, I gotta, I gotta grow up now. Of course I'm in my 30s at the time already, but still it's like okay.

SPEAKER_01 47:16

It's just one of those moments that kind of punches you in the gut. You know, it's just like ready for that.

SPEAKER_00 47:22

She was she was two at the time, so we're kind of getting, you know, kind of towards the end of potty training and skipped a lot of that, but there's still a still a long way to go.

SPEAKER_02 47:31

Yeah, you know, I've so I've always grown up wanting to be a dad because I didn't have a dad, you know, and I that's like I told y'all, like, so I would always like I that's all I wanted to be. I wanted to be a good dad. That's all I wanted to do, you know. So like not ever having that dad, that was my that was my goal. Now, was I ready? Like I said, no, I wasn't ready, but I just wanted to be a good dad. And I my first I my serious first father moment was when I hailed Riley for that first time. I was like, this is this is my kid, like this is my child. Like, this is this is me, you know. So like I was like, wow, you know, like like I said, and I wasn't ready to be a dad. Now I can I mean again, I will never be ready completely, but but that moment, you're just like, dude, like I'm holding a baby, you know, and and I think my I I don't want to say favorite moment, you know, because that's hard because when you have five kids, like you can't have a favorite or whatever. But like I think this last one with having a son, you know, and and you've recently had a son, so you get it. Like like every dad, I think, wants a wants a boy, even if they don't say it out loud, like it's it's different, you know. So it's like getting Jersey. I was like, dude, this is my son. Yeah. You know, this is this is my son. How about those moments with jersey? This is my this is technically like my first boy. You know, this is the kid that's gonna carry my bloodline, carry my last name, which Steven, but at the time Steven was still a cond, you know, so like this is gonna be my son that carries my tr my last name to the next, you know, so it's just it's different. And and do I love Jersey any more than I love Steven? A hundred percent no. I can tell I can truly tell you that. Do I enjoy Jersey a little bit more than Steven? 100% because Steven talks back, you know, and Steven's 22 himself, and and he's a man now, and he, you know, he questions some of those things that that Jersey doesn't, but I don't love Steven any less. Give it 10 years and see if rolls reversed a little bit. You know, because because Steven, I mean, a hundred percent, he's my kid, and I, you know same way with Riley.

SPEAKER_01 50:10

I love her as hard as I do. I love her. I look, I would say honestly, and the sound's gonna sound terrible coming in my mouth. I I I love her harder than I do Tristan, and that's simply just because I've known her longer. Yeah, really. I mean, that's really what it's about. Yeah, there's there's there's so you see what I was saying earlier. 100%. It's undeniable that I Tristan is my biological, you know, flesh and blood, but But here's the thing with that. Riley's been here. I've known Riley for that. That was when you became a dad. That's when I became a dad. So yes, Tristan is my first biological child, but he's not my first child. I tell her that all the time. She's my no she is my number one, and I mean that. I don't say it just to make her feel good. Yeah. And I'm harder on I'm probably harder on Tristan than I am her. And some of that's natural. He's three, he, you know, you've got a structure and foundation and stuff like that at at this age is is important, but yeah, I I I totally get where you're coming from. She was the first time I experienced being a dad.

SPEAKER_02 51:13

The beauty about it is is I can relate. You can this is something we all three can relate on. Is I didn't I chose Steven. Yeah, you chose right. I commend you for that. You chose Gabby, you know what I mean? So like we chose those kids. Our our actual kids, we uh we didn't choose, they're they're just ours, they're not blood. But I I chose Steven. So I love Steven Harder. I mean, you know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_00 51:39

Yeah, I kind of I mean, I don't know. I mean, I don't know that I'm not sure. The word harder is probably I feel like God put her, yeah. I feel like God chose her for you, you know, which would be a thing for your kids. But I'd be like, But you still had to trust that, and yeah, and you had to choose. He could have walked away from it. That's true.

SPEAKER_01 51:57

And and especially in your situation with all the hoops you had to jump through and the challenges you were facing, it was easy. It could have it would have been hard for you to have to look Steven in the eye and say, hey, bud, this isn't gonna work out. But you could have you could have chose to go a different direction, just as I could have chose to go a different direction with Riley. You know, I I made Tristan. I knew what I was doing whenever we all we know how to make a kid. I knew what I was doing, but I didn't choose to have him. And in fact, I and I said this earlier, I I was I was turning the page. I I didn't think that that was in God's plan for us. You know, we had tried and miscarried too, so I was I was kind of starting to view life and the future in a different lens. And so then whenever, you know, it happened, it happened, and that's why I always say, you know, God, God, everything works on on his terms and his time.

SPEAKER_02 52:55

And and that and that kind of transitions to our our next one, you know. Um my next heading I had was is fatherhood beyond DNA. And and my question was, is biology is biology overrated in fatherhood? And and that just answered our question. 100% it is, you know, and we all agree on that. Like, I don't think any of us have any doubt about that. Like, I don't think being blood makes you a dad. Correct. And and I think each and every one of us are proven examples of that because each one of us has an adoption or a a stepped-in role that we have chosen to accept. Like I said, it was a god.

SPEAKER_01 53:46

Because like I said, you know, prior to Riley and Caitlin, I I it was a fundamental belief of mine that just what you're heading is that fatherhood was DNA. Yeah. And God completely blew that that fundamental up. Completely blew it up.

SPEAKER_02 54:01

And that's something that I hope any kid that doesn't have their biological father or has a biological father and a bonus dad understands like that just because just because you're not their bloodline or you're not their biological child doesn't make you any less valuable or any less important than a child that does. Because from experience, I can tell you I truly 100% love my adopted son just as much as I love my other four.

SPEAKER_00 54:41

You know, right. So let me give you a hypothetical and and I want to see what you guys think. Let's say once you and Caitlin got divorced and split, you're kind of lukewarm with Riley. You're not, you know, you see her every now and then, but you're not really much in the picture. Do you think it would just be better to just not be in their life at all than to kind of and to let Jared just be the dad instead of making her think that you're you're the dad when you're really not?

SPEAKER_02 55:18

Yeah. So it's and which I guess everybody's a little different. So so with Caitlin and myself, our situation was a little different because I did make more money, you know. And so Caitlin, he said, you know, end up being a waitress for a while. So a lot of nights, Riley would come to my place, even if it wasn't my week, she'd come to my place because her mom had to go be a waitress. Okay. So with that, I was able to be dad and have that transition. And never ever got to that point. Right. It never got to that point.

SPEAKER_01 55:55

And and I get, I get what you're asking, which is why it made it easy for me because that's why it was so easy for me to recognize that she's got a daddy because she he is very much still involved in the picture.

SPEAKER_00 56:06

Like for me, my biological dad, I mean, the best thing he could have done is what he did is to just vanish because that he he wasn't someone that I, you know, would want to be able to do that. Same is probably true for Steven. Sorry. Right, you know, right. If he was gonna be lukewarm and it's like, well, this is my dad, you know, I I think that that would screw up my relationship with well.

SPEAKER_02 56:29

And and you know, like that was something that Kaylin and myself had to work out was Riley would when we got a divorce, Riley would just stay the night at my house, you know, because again, she would she worked nights. So I would drop Riley off in the mornings, Riley would get ready there, Caitlin would take her to school, pick her up, I would go get Riley from her house and take her home because Caitlin had to go to work. So, you know, for a little while, it was it was hard on it was probably that'd be a better question to ask Caitlin because it was harder on her because again, she she had a she had work nights, you know, but Riley's already changed. She was just trying to figure out how to survive.

SPEAKER_01 57:13

She was trying to yeah, she was in survival mode at this point. So really she was more in that position you're referring to than Josh was.

SPEAKER_02 57:20

Yeah, and a lot of times, and a lot of times it's the other way around because usually the kid goes with the mom and the you know the dad, dad's the mom. Well, and she's a girl too, you know, so naturally you're gonna and and that was one thing whenever we did get our divorce and had our custody battle, which we did, we Caitlin and I, we it was super simple. We didn't argue about anything. That's good.

SPEAKER_01 57:42

But we nothing's been court ordered, yeah. And we've always, you know, we came to a you know, like he said early on, it was we'd hand up or we'd switch every week. And then at one point we came together as a family, and Riley expressed to us that she felt like she was always having to bounce back and forth, and she never felt settled. And we had a grown-up conversation and we all agreed, well, let's let's what we asked her, what do you think the solution is? And she said, Well, I'd I'd like to spend two weeks at each home. And we looked at each other and we said, Okay. And we've been doing that for five years now.

SPEAKER_02 58:17

And and you know, and there are times that she'll come and stay the night with me during the week and or need something, and and vice versa. Like, so it's not like nope, it's my rule to it. She knows both doors are open at any time. Lucky in that, no, and and you know, and what I was gonna say about that was I was talking about the custody deal. Well, we you know, you had to go see a judge, and Caitlyn could have gave it to me good. I mean, because the judge was like, Well, judges are always gonna favor mother over. Yeah, well, he's he said he said a lot more. You know, you make Josh makes three times more than what you're making. How much money are you wanting? She's like, it's not about that. Like, on my weeks I take care of her, on his weeks, he takes care of her, you know.

SPEAKER_01 58:59

And we've continued to maintain that our entire life. It's never been about money, it's never been about ego, it's always been about what's best for her. Yeah, and providing her the most structured environment that you could possibly create in a blended home. Yeah, that's really been our sole objective, and that's we've we have stood by that rule since day one, and that's why we have such a good one.

SPEAKER_02 59:25

She just finished her sophomore year. This was in first grade, you know, because I and I and I'll tell you how I remember exactly it was in first grade was because we did that, and and that judge was like, Well, I just feel like you know, Caitlin, you you need to be with Riley, and you know, the dad can have custody every other weekend. And Caitlin was like, Oh, that will not work. Caitlin knew that she had a relationship. Riley, Riley and I, they were attached to the children. We're tight to him. You know, we're tight. And she was like, and Caitlin, this is where Caitlin like was like, that'll never work. She's like, I'm gonna go check Riley out of school and bring her up here and let you be the guy that tells her that she can't see her best friend and see her dad except for other other weekend. He was like, Well, I don't want to do that, you know. He's like, I don't want to do that.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:10

Why is he trying to to dictate right?

SPEAKER_02 1:00:13

And and that was and you know, he used he used the excuse, well, you know, I made more and but that I I worked more, but that that wasn't the case, you know. Like I I literally worked from 7 a.m. to to 3 p.m. 3 30. Like it wasn't the case that I, you know, because she was a waitress and she waitressed on Thursday, Friday, Saturday night. You know, it was just like he just kept making excuses and and we stuck to our guns, Caitlin and I had that conversation going in. Like, this is what we want, this is what's going to be best for our child. We didn't want to allow a court system decide what was best for our kid.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:50

Well, seeing that right there, that decision you guys made, which was a very mature one, in a time that emotions are very high, elevated, you know, lifestyles are going to change, everything's going to change. She could have taken you through the ringer if you wanted to be that person, but you guys, you guys set the tone for how the future was gonna go. I just was plug and play. Right. Really and truly. Uh it this was easy for me to step into. You guys made it about Riley. Yeah. So there's no sense for me to come in here and say, Caitlin, you should be getting X amount of money from this dude a month. You know what I mean? Like, yeah. It was everything was working the way it didn't work.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:27

I don't know if Jared knows, but like after we split up, Caitlin and I lived together for like two or three months. Yeah. Now we we didn't, you know, we didn't sleep in the same room, sleep in the same bed. I slept downstairs, she slept upstairs. Like we we stayed. They were trying not to disrupt Riley's environment. But you know, a lot of times people do these sit do these things and they like they they get a divorce and they split up and they move. And one, it makes it so hard on the kid. You know, but as an adult and as a parent, you've you've gotta put your kid you know in the best situation.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:02

Well, the biggest problem I see peer parents that are freshly divorced, they're they're weaponizing the child, they're using the child as a weapon to be destructive to get back because they're they're hurt, their heart's broken, things are changing, and that's why I commend you and Caitlin both because that was a very hard thing to probably do in that time. Yeah. You guys were much younger. She didn't know what the future held for her, you didn't know what the future held for you. You're in a position where you know you two have been attached to the hip, and now there's an opportunity where that can be taken from you. I mean, I know that's gotta run through your mind. Caitlin wasn't a vengeful person, you weren't vengeful. You guys made it about what was good for Riley, and that's that's why it worked.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:49

And and you know, we didn't end on bad terms, we just knew that. You realize you were better friends than you were. It wasn't gonna work, you know, and and and and that's and that's fine, and that's that's a blessing because if if if Caitlin and I tried to force things and make it work, we might still be together today, but we would one, we would resent each other, two, he never would have came in the picture. Three, infinity never would have came in the picture. And our our younger children, I like to do that.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:17

Not only that, Riley would have felt that. At some point, parents that sit here and say we're gonna hold it together until the kids, you know, grow up and get out of the house. I I might one of my best friends, his parents did that the day he the day he graduated, he was the youngest one. The day he graduated, they filed for divorce. They stayed together for 10 years. 10 years because they thought that that was the best way to keep the home together. But Robbie knew it the whole time. He knew that they hated each other. So what is that teaching him? Well, what what values is that instilling into him on what a marriage is supposed to be?

SPEAKER_02 1:03:51

Right. And I didn't, and that's that's the key. I didn't want I didn't want my daughter growing up thinking that's how a marriage is supposed to be. That's, you know, I want my daughter to find a man that loves the Lord, that puts God over family, you know, like, and that that's what I wanted for my daughter. I didn't want her to think that, oh, well, it's normal for for husband and wife to fight. It's normal for husband and wife to sleep in different beds. It's normal to do these separate things, you know, like, and that's something that Infinity and I, we, we work on constantly. Like, we want, we don't want our kids to see us argue or fight. We don't want to disagree. At the end of the day, we obviously we do it for ourselves, but we do it for those kids on this picture behind you. You know, like we want, we want them to see what Riley is going to know what a man, how a man is supposed to treat a woman. I mean, and and do obviously I mess up and and I may I don't want to say scream at my wife. Like that's I'm not gonna do that. But like I may kind of raise my voice. Um one, I'm loud anyway, so and I know my wife can hear us, you know, talking, and and she's probably like, uh well, you know, but but I mean, if she she'll say, I don't scream at her, I'm not gonna scream at her, especially in front of my kids. I will, you know, I don't do that. Like so, so like I said, I I do think Riley's a special situation, but I'm glad it happened how it did, because you know, Jared and I have formed a friendship over this. We've we've we share a daughter, our our younger kids who are the same age are are friends, you know, and like Tristan and Indy Ivy and Jersey get to share Riley, but they also get to be best friends growing up, you know, and and he never would have Met Caitlin who he loves and and wants to be with forever, and I and I know I never would have gotten with Infinity. And it really just just turned out to be a beautiful thing. God God turned a disaster into a a blessing for everyone involved. You know. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:16

But it took I mean it took all five of you to it does, and I don't want to, I don't, I don't want our listeners to to be misunderstood.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:27

We there's times that we've we've had challenges or disagreements. We don't always agree on on everything, but we're all old enough and we respect each other enough to listen and then figure find common ground. And that's really the key to it. It's not about well, I'm right and he's wrong. It's about okay. Because that's the definition of an argument or a debate. It's two people starting from two opposing opinions or places and coming to the center on something. And nine times out of ten, if you can remove emotion and you can stay rational and and work with off of facts, you can get there a lot quicker and really and truly look back on it and say, We're really kind of arguing for the same thing. It was just from a different place. You know? Right. So that's that that's really just been the biggest key. You know, we don't we we don't always agree on things, and that that's okay. You know, that's that's within any relationship you have with anybody. I don't agree with all the things that my mom tells me, but I love her, I respect her. Yeah, I'm gonna hear her, and we'll find common ground. It doesn't have to be hard and ugly. That's that's what I want people to to take from this. It doesn't have to be an ugly thing. You can we're we're walking proof of it. You can have a blended home and still maintain the family unit and it be cohesive and it works. But it starts from the top, and you everybody just has got to be on board and and and put the child first. That's what it that's really what it puts out.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:01

Yeah. My my next thing is is that maybe the the hard parts that nobody really talks about being a dad. You know, whether it be the financial stress of your kids are doing so many activities or something along those lines, they're doing something they don't they want to do. And sometimes it's it's hard to fund those things, you know, because those travel baseball can get expensive. Vocal lessons can get expensive. Luckily, I honestly I have no idea who pays for vocal lessons. I couldn't tell you. I mean, rallies and vocal lessons, I've never nobody's ever mentioned like who I paid. I don't know. I'm guessing everybody pays. I'm guessing he pays. I don't I don't know. You guys pay for stuff that we don't know about again.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:44

Again, back to a conversation we had early and often that we didn't want to make any of this about money.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:49

If you at any point, again, it's not about feelings. It is about feelings, but if at any point you feel like maybe you're carrying more of the financial burden than I am, just talk to me about it. It's not out of malice or to be malicious. It's well, I didn't realize that, Josh. So let's figure that out. And that's you know, uh, if but it's always been a thing where we always, you know, well, we don't make it about the money.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:15

Well, let me rewind. I'm okay, we don't have to talk about that. You can keep paying for it. Okay, just play it. No, but like, you know, and you talk about that, but like Riley comes to Infinity and I because Riley goes to the church that we attend, you know, First Baptist. And and so, so whenever there's something going on, she's like, Dad, can you can you pay for this? Which obviously I don't mind. I I I'm I'm fine with it. But my only thing that I tell Riley is like, okay, this falls on your mom and Jared's week. First ask. Yeah. And make sure that you're not going out of town or something. Because you know, his like he said before, his family's in the city. Caitlin's granddad lives well, lived in West Texas.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:00

I thought she was gonna say, first ask them for money.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:02

Yeah, yeah, yeah. First ask them. No, no, but but like I so we just want to make sure we're communicating. And you know, that was that was that was uh last week's episode or two weeks' episodes where we talked about communicating with our family and and how we suck at m as men for the most part. We don't do we don't do a very good job of it. But but like like I said, I mean we just gotta communicate and just make sure, hey, are you gonna be gone this week or am I gonna be gone this week or can I go to this? And then and then we'll go from there, you know.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:36

So and if it's a big thing, like we're talking a thousand dollar mission trip or something like that, then we you know, even if it's on my week and it's a big it's something that costs a lot, then yeah, I don't have no problem saying, hey Josh, this one's kind of expensive. You mind helping out a little bit, or vice versa. And nine times out of out of ten, you know, we're if if if it's if we can financially afford it, we're gonna we're gonna do it, you know. Um and that's you know, finances are always always probably one of the larger struggles of of of most marriages. But and there's all that um that that that's always going to exist, but you know, communication is really just I I think has probably been the biggest thing. And both sides respect each other's time with her, you know. Yeah, yeah. I mean, we we both respect it. And there's times that she spends a little more time over here. Because really and truly, Riley's at the age now, she could choose one house or the other. Sure. But she doesn't feel like she needs to make a choice because she's happy in both.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:43

You know, she loves being able to come spend time with us and and and see her brother and do stuff with us, and she loves coming home and and being around all these kids. She loves she loves both houses equally, I think. And because we we try to keep everything as close together as possible, structure-wise, she doesn't feel like she can get away with one thing over the other. There's been a couple times, we've talked about it, you know. We set a rule in a while back that she wasn't supposed to have her phone out past nine o'clock and needed to be on the kitchen counter plugged in. We did a poor job of executing that, and Riley, you know, basically called us out on it. He called me on it, and and now we've made it more of a point. You know, so again, it's it's not about feelings. It is about feelings, but it's not about feelings, it's just respecting each other's wishes and and and mirroring mirroring both households the best we possibly can. Right.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:38

So let me ask y'all like stepfather slash adopted father conversations, you know, like how did that work with, you know, not just building your relationship naturally, but and not forcing things, but like learning your role over time, you know, like because even whenever I f first got Steven, I didn't know what I could or couldn't do because he was new to the house while you know he was my I was his guardian, like I didn't want to overstep, you know, I didn't want to say this is my son or hey, I'm his dad, you know, like because Steven, like, so Steven don't call me dad, he calls me papy, you know, and but whenever he's talking to others, he'll be like, well, let me talk to my dad, or let me, let me call, let me like, this is my dad, or the, you know, he introduces me as his dad, or like, hey, where's your dad? Oh, he's right there. But he don't call me dad, he calls me papy or Josh, so you know, sometimes like, but he's over recently it's been more pappy because again, I don't know if it's because just naturally he's used to me being there and and I've now officially adopted him, so he is officially my son. So like I like how do you navigate those waters? You know what I mean? Like Jared, like, because Britt, his daughter's biological dad is not in the picture at all. So it was probably easier for you, right?

SPEAKER_01 1:14:18

I mean, you know, but I mean, but where you you had me, like did you was you like, I don't want to step on Josh's toes, or if I uh I you know, as I'm thinking on that, I'm trying to even come up with an example, and I I don't know that I can really even with one.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:37

I feel like you and I do a really good job of communicating and talking and just calling.

SPEAKER_01 1:14:41

I guess if I've ever felt like maybe this was a situation that would be stepping on your toes, I usually pick up the phone and call you and say, hey, this is what's going on. What are your thoughts on it? And you know, if your thoughts line up with mine, I'll just say something as simple as that's exactly what I thought. Yeah, and then I'll move on. And I don't think we've ever had a disagreement. I can't think of one that we've ever had. I don't know if you call that luck. I don't know if you call that because we do a good job of overcommunicating. I don't know. I've yeah, you know, I've always told even when when Infinity came in and we all sat down as a family, and you know, we were kind of plugging her in and getting her up to speed. I felt like, you know, I've I've always stressed overcommunication is better than no communication.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:22

Yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:23

And if at some point you say, Jared, you don't have to call me on every little thing, then then I know okay, well, I'm well within my boundaries.

SPEAKER_03 1:15:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:29

And and I'm curious, you know, maybe we have another spinoff a while down the road and have Jared back. I was gonna say also also have a dad that has that issue and and have, you know, how does he navigate those waters? How does how does he go about working with a parent that is on the other like that biological parent, or vice versa?

SPEAKER_01 1:15:52

I'd love to think on that because I because I I'd like to bring I'd like to think of some real life examples, you know, just so you know listeners could get full perspective.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:02

Sounds like we got him in an episode too late. We should have had him on three in a row and done the community.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:07

Yeah, no, yeah. I'll come back anytime you guys want me to. We'll definitely, yeah, because it's it's been really good. And I think we've it's you know, Britt and I have a friendship, and Britt and I are kind of wired a lot the same. It's nice having that third voice that is not wired like us.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:27

You know, because but I do think we think a lot. I mean, we've agreed on a lot of a lot of a lot of the discussion that we've got.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:35

But Britt and I've known each other forever. It'd be like you and Brian. I got you. You know what I mean? So I see what you're saying. So like it's nice having that new face and that that new side and that new angle. And I don't know, it's just nice kind of changing it up. I mean, it's like last week and this week have been really good and it's been good conversation. You know, it's been we've gotten in depth some, we've we've loosened up some. I mean, you know, like Jared said last week, he was like, I'm I'm really nervous, but now I don't think he I think he feels at home, you know. If you if you look at him, you know, he was fidgeting, he's not fidgeting anymore. I'm relaxed. He's like laid back, just like, you know, so so it's it's been good. Like, so you know, maybe maybe we talk off-air about maybe bringing somebody else on with us and and doing that, or because I'm I'm really curious. And if somebody that you're listening to, please reach out and and let me know. And because I would love to hear your side of the story, and because dads are so many different angles, you know. It's like it's like Lake Dad, you know, how many rivers and streams run into Lake Dad, you know, like we all come in from different viewpoints and different walks of life. And I mean, from from your employment to your your education level to your you know, your background. I mean, there's just so many, your your ethnicity, like I mean, there's so many different things that come into effect that that could be how you father or how you dad. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_03 1:18:11

So like so.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:13

I would love to to keep this on, like, man, I feel like we could go do a 10-hour episode of it. You know, it would be brutal. We could go on a bender on this. I mean, like, there's just so many different areas and things we could hit that we definitely need to keep open and and and table, you know.

SPEAKER_01 1:18:35

And are your listeners uh able to provide any feedback, comments, or anything like that?

SPEAKER_02 1:18:40

So a lot of our listeners are people that we know, you know. So I'm really excited to get these out because when I tag you and you share it, you're gonna have people that live wherever that listen to it and it'll just continue to spread. And they might message you, but you know, we obviously they they can leave a review on, you know, we're on Spotify and Apple Music or Apple Podcast and I'll heart radio. I mean, we're on a ton of different things, and and so they are gonna be able to find it wherever they listen to it at. Or Facebook, they can't do it. Yeah, they're they're more because you know, I'll I'll make a post and I'll usually have like a little bit of the episode of what they're gonna hear. And and so I'm just I'm just curious, you know, people that don't know that our our episodes drop every Sunday morning at 7 a.m. So, you know, if they want to listen to it getting ready for for church or if they gotta work on Sunday, I mean whatever they're doing. I mean, you know, because the more the more listeners we have, the more the more input we can get and the more ideas we can talk about. Because I I truly believe these last two weeks with having Jared, having you on, like it's been it's been really fun and really good. And yeah, and you know, our our episodes are usually anywhere from 35 to 45, 50 minutes, and I think both episodes have been over an hour and 20 minutes, you know. So it's it's been it's been a lot of fun.

SPEAKER_01 1:20:06

Yeah, this has been great. And I really as these posts, as these get posted, I definitely would encourage, you know, questions, anything anybody wants to ask.

SPEAKER_02 1:20:14

If you're not if you're not comfortable commenting on the post, which I I well, I don't know why you wouldn't unless you got like a scandalous question that I don't know to answer. You know, but like but don't be afraid to you know message you know Jared, Britt or myself and ask, like, because you know, like we want to know, like we we want to know other people's opinions because it we're just three guys who have our own opinion.

SPEAKER_01 1:20:40

Well, and like you said, you know, everybody's situation is is is so much different, and how you know everybody's path is different, you know. That's something I think about a lot when I especially like when I'm in big crowds and stuff, and you just look at people. I'm a people watcher, and every person, I mean, think about it, every single person has their own story. Yeah, every person, how many billion people are there on the planet?

SPEAKER_02 1:21:02

Yeah, eight eight point six or something like that? There's a ton. There's a bunch.

SPEAKER_01 1:21:05

I don't know how many probably billions of people on this planet, and they all have their story, and they're all relevant, and they all, you know, are share something in common with with with ever the things that we've discussed. Yeah, I mean, there's a lot of people that, you know, you're not I guess what I'm saying is you're not alone, you know. There's a lot of people out there that that that are trying to get answers to these same questions that we've you know discussed and talked about today. Conversation is good. That's one thing I think that that the world loses or has lost a little bit of is our ability to have conversation. Good conversation.

SPEAKER_02 1:21:39

Yeah, and and I feel like this is exactly what these you know these last two episodes have been is good conversation. I mean, they were easy, they they weren't forced.

SPEAKER_01 1:21:49

I mean, they I can tell you some of the things that you guys have have said in in our conversation. I'll I'll I'm gonna I'll take back with me. And I heard you say it earlier, I'm gonna get a notebook and jot some stuff down. And I mean, these are things that you know you guys are are teaching me to look at at certain things a different way, you know, from a different perspective. And you know, I'm we'll find ways to apply it to my environment and my life. And I just think it's you know, that's that's a part of growth. I really do. No, I I agree.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:21

Britt, you have any anything to close us with? I mean, no.

SPEAKER_00 1:22:25

What about we are over an hour 20? Yeah, dude. We've got a little time, man. Time time flies in here. No, I I don't have anything else if you don't.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:37

Jared, you got any last words?

SPEAKER_01 1:22:39

No, I'm supposed to the week. I really thank you guys for inviting me on. I'll I'll tell you, this is completely outside of my bubble. I'm in my comfort, my comfort zone. I'm not, I don't don't really like the sound of my voice, and I don't like uh I don't I don't do a whole lot of social media stuff. So um thank you guys.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:58

Yes, well it's it's funny you say you don't like the sound of your voice. Britt and I say the same thing about ours ourselves, and you know, I hear my voice, I'm like, ah, do I really sound like that? And Britt's like, I sound terrible. He's like, You sound normal. I'm like, I don't sound like that. Tell me that.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:10

Like it's rude. I I still struggle listening. So man, it I'd skip through my stuff and listen to Cisco mostly.

SPEAKER_01 1:23:17

I'm excited to listen to this back. I think this has been a really, really good thing. Yeah, I appreciate you coming on.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:22

Thank you. It's been fun.

SPEAKER_02 1:23:23

Well, you know, I'm gonna I'm gonna finish with this, you know, just being a dad isn't always about how you become one, you know. It's it's about who keeps showing up. And and I think it's safe to say that all three of us do a solid job at continuing to show up and and supporting our kids, whether it be our biological kids or our adopted kids or our our bonus kids, you know.

SPEAKER_01 1:23:46

So You said it best, showing up is the biggest thing. That's what these kids need is showing up consistency and and love.

SPEAKER_02 1:23:54

Yeah, for sure. Well, I'm Josh, my co-host Britt, and our guest Jared, and I appreciate y'all listening to still figuring it out.