Why Value Beats Product Every Time

Most first-time founders start by building a product. Marcello nearly did too.

He came to DQventures with an idea for a social listening platform — another piece of software in a space he already knew inside out from 15+ years in pharma and biotech, including roles at Novartis and Biogen. What he left with was something different: a business built on the real-world patient insight he already had, not the tech wrapped around it.

In this episode, James Green talks to Marcello about:

• Why "too much polish, not enough answer" is the trap most agencies — and most first-time founders — fall into
• The moment he realised the software itself had no value: "It's just workflows that have been digitised"
• Why he skipped procurement entirely and sold directly to biotech CEOs on LinkedIn
• Why deep domain expertise, not seniority, is the real advantage experienced founders have
• Where Common Synapse stands five months in: two paying clients, three delivered projects, and case studies in hand

Find out more about Marcello's work at commonsynapse.com

If you're thinking about starting your own business, explore DQventures.com

#entrepreneurship #startups #derisk

• Watch this episode on DQventures YouTube Channel
• Thinking about leaving your corporate job to start your own business?  Apply to DQventures
• Follow James Green on LinkedIn 
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Transcript

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The other point that you made me realize, well, I shouldn't go for another piece of software myself, but I should work more on making that piece of real-world data usable. One of our core processes that we do with almost every founder is to niche down. Most people come with a really big vision and they're picturing their business in five years time. I think it's so important to start with a really thin end of the wedge and start with that, that one audience type that can really benefit and that you can really add value to on day one. internal gap I was seeing when thinking about agency work that I was purchasing, it felt like too much polish, but not enough answer. It's actually really difficult to get your first client. It's always, or nearly always the hardest one. I got to that session not with the intent of saying this is what I intend to sell, but rather this is a clear example that the market is ready for this now. When someone says, you know, you're 40 or if you're 45, if you were an entrepreneur, you'd already have started a business by now. You're not an entrepreneur. It's nonsense. And well, first of all, it's nonsense. But second of all, older people generally have an advantage over younger people because Hi, I'm James Green, co-founder of DQ Ventures. If you're an experienced professional thinking about starting your own business, then please listen to this before you quit. Welcome back to Founder Stories with DQ Ventures, where we talk to the founders of real businesses as opposed to 99% of the content that you see online, which is with people who founded a business that realistically you have no chance of building, which is funded by Sequoia Capital, probably about to do an IPO for billions of dollars. It's a great story, but it's not something that most of us can relate to, unfortunately. So today we're gonna talk to a founder from the DQ Ventures portfolio, Marcello, who has founded a business very much within his area of expertise. And Marcello ticks a box that we consider very important at DQ Ventures, which we call founder fit. Now, founder fit means are you the right person to build this business effectively? And I can give you an example of why Marcello is the right person to build this business, because we've made a bunch of introductions for Marcello to people within our, our wider network, and Marcello has taken those introductions and immediately jumped into a bunch of, um, pharmaceutical specific jargon that I have to say I don't understand. But fortunately, the people he, he's talking to do understand, and this is the important thing. If you're building a business in an area that you really don't understand and know deeply, you're gonna be selling to people that do, and y- immediately you're gonna lack credibility. Marcello is the antithesis of that. He immediately has credibility, he can talk to anyone within his industry, he can open doors, and he can sell, and those are some of the most important things in building your own business. So without further ado, let's hear from Marcello. Most biotech companies focus on the science when they're building a clinical trial. But at the same time, one of the most expensive mistakes you can make is getting patient reality wrong or getting it too late. Hi, I'm Marcello. I'm the founder of Common Synapse. I worked, uh, in the healthcare space, uh, pharmaceutical companies, uh, biotechnology companies for the past, uh, eight years, and focus now on the moment before key decisions, uh, get locked in by using real-world patient needs, uh, real patient language to pressure test hypothesis, to pressure test assumptions about how a disease is actually experienced. If you are a, a biotech company designing a clinical trial or in the process of shaping your positioning or preparing for, uh, investors negotiations, you can find out more at common synapse.com. I think most founders overestimate how easy it is to build a business. Um, even if, even if it is in their own domain, to be honest. But, um, there are some things that separate people that s- that succeed from, from those that don't. And, and even within the context of DQ, we see some really strong themes. And, and building in your area of expertise is probably the single biggest qualifier, uh, for someone who's gonna succeed or, or not Um, the knowing, you know, if you, if you're building in a, in an industry that you don't know intimately, there are so many unknowns and, and unknown unknowns, uh, that you just don't know what's gonna trip you up. Whereas, you know, what you're doing, Marcello, uh, building in, in your area of, of, um, expertise and, and what you spent your whole career in, e- even though they're unknowns, you know what they are, and you know the, where the gaps are and what gaps you have to fill. So I really wanna dig into that. Um, and then I know w- we talked before we, we, uh, started recording about, uh, you getting made redundant from your role. Um, and I, I'm keen to dig into that as whether or not starting… Y- you know, knowing what you know now, whether you see starting a business as a good option, as a backup, um, or not even as a backup. Like I, I'd like to, I'd like to get your view on, you know, what, what you feel is actually safer, uh, being employed or, or working for yourself. And I know there are risks with both, but I, I think there's this, this misconception that you're safer when you're working for a big company. Um, but i- in actual fact, as long as your company's good, if you, if you work for yourself, your boss is very unlikely to let you go because it's you. Whereas if you work for someone else, then they're gonna be thinking about themselves and their own targets. So I'd like to talk a bit about that and then a, a lot of stuff in between Uh, and then for the, for the benefit of, of the audience, um, Marcello is one of our more recent founders at DQ Ventures, uh, building in the life science space, and he came to us with, uh, an idea. It was actually for a, for a software platform really, wasn't it, initially? With an idea, a, a social listening platform with a difference. Um, and I'll let you explain what that difference is, Marcello. Why we liked it was Marcello was already an expert in the, in the area that he wanted to build in, and he was already thinking about narrowing down. And within DQ, one of our core processes that we do with almost every founder is to niche down. Most people come with a really big vision, and they're picturing their business in five years' time and serving all these different types of customer and types of user. Um, and I think it's so important to start with a really thin end of the wedge and start with that, that one audience type that can really benefit and that you can really add value to on day one. Um, and I think you'd already, you'd already started doing that, so it made this one a very easy one for us to start working on. So welcome. Thank you for agreeing to chat to us. Thank you, James, for the, uh, intro. That was very generous actually. Um, and echoing a bit, uh, the, the context you were, uh, laying out, uh, uh, yes, it is true that, uh, uh, it wasn't planned, uh, uh, for me to, to, to go into this journey, um, so to actually, um, start my own, uh, um, company around my idea. Uh, but for certain… Um, so it wasn't new, but for certain, yes, redundancy accelerated, uh, the process and forced me to start giving it more, more clarity. Along the way, one of the things, um, that occurred to me was at a certain point to, um, turn to LinkedIn, uh, for, in search for co-founders. Uh, so 'cause I, I, I didn't want to turn, uh, necessarily to people I knew that kind of ga- ga- were giving me that comfort Of, uh, I mean, being known to them, uh, for my, my qualities. But I wanted to measure myself with, with a new, a new context. So that's when DQ, uh, DQ Ventures actually popped up in, in my, my, my results on LinkedIn. When I, um, uh, started the, the, the journey together with DQ, uh, what I, what I found, uh, uh, very, very interesting was, first of all, as you were saying that, uh, DQ was able to, uh, re, um, focus my, my initial idea. Uh, that was indeed, uh, uh, that of a, anoth- yet another software, yet another application in a realm that I knew perfectly well, so the, the social listening space. Uh, with the addition of, uh, uh, generative AI as, uh, one of the key stakeholders to be listening to, so not just what patients and, and doctors are saying, but also what is, uh, um, generative AI, uh, platforms, um, answering. What, what are their, their key answers to patients, to doctors. But then from, from, from, from then, uh, I, I, I thought maybe I should not, uh, focus too much on the technology and, and that was thanks to, um, uh, DQ's, uh, process in which, uh, you made me realize, well, actually it would make more sense to turn this into a, a, another, another type of, um, um, proposition, business proposition. And, uh, and, um, in first place to steer away a bit from the label of social listening or, uh, as we know, it's, it's, it's very, it's very, um, fashionable at the moment, uh, generative engines optimization. So into, into something that, uh, echoed more into, um, uh, patient lived realities and possibility to, um, access these, uh, as a support in decision-making, particularly at early stages. This is to me now a, a very interesting stage, uh, particularly because I'm, I'm starting to collect the first, uh, uh, client's feedback. A- actually together with DQ, uh, we started, uh, packaging the first, uh, case studies. Actually, we have two of them already approved by the, the first client. Previous to what you're doing now, yet you worked f- with some big companies buying these services. Was that what led you to the idea? Was there something that they were doing that was missing that you thought really, I really want a supplier that does this? To me, there were two set of factors. One was, uh, of ex- internal nature, and another one exactly was, uh, agency related, so more external, uh, type. So the, the internal one was the realization that, uh, uh, patient insight matters most, uh, uh, pre-clinical trials and pre-market. Uh, this is when, uh, it can still, uh, uh, shape direction. And, and I realized that, uh, multiple times, uh, uh, during my experience, uh, at Novartis, during my experience at Biogen Uh, and I realized that inside big organizations, uh, um, it often comes, uh, too late. And as a proof of that, uh, the budgets for this type of, uh, market research sits with the commercial organization, so that is supposed to support the mar- the in-market stage, not the clinical trial one. But at the same time, for those very few occasions in which I could collaborate with the, um, clinical development teams, I could see, uh, there was huge value for them, uh, in the-- in this type of real-world data, uh, I was, uh, providing them. The other aspect was that, uh, um, these type of information was landing, uh, too far from key decisions. So it was reaching, uh, teams that were managing campaigns, brand activation, um, ev-ev-events, uh, congresses, et cetera, but it was really remote, uh, from the decision-makers. And, and that was, to me, a big gap because very frequently the answer was, "Yes, this is very interesting, but we don't really know what to do with this information." Um, so this was, again, the, the internal gap I was, I was seeing, uh, repeating Externally, as you were, uh, already anticipating, uh, when thinking about agency work, uh, that I was purchasing, it, it felt like, uh, um, too much polish, uh, but not, uh, uh, not enough answer. Uh, so there was a, a huge attention to, uh, uh, how the data were pre-presented, making sure they, they could offer, uh, the buyer any p-possible facet to display it, uh, in a fancy way as well, using automation- Mm-hmm uh, of dashboards, uh, and everything. But in the end, uh, um, the, th-th-there was little adherence to what the original business question was, uh, and, uh, and therefore, uh, little support, uh, to decision. This was the other point, uh, that you made me realize, well, I shouldn't go for another software, piece of software myself, uh, but I should work more on, uh, making, uh, um, that piece of real-world data usable for making, uh, uh, decisions internally. I stopped at a certain point during our journey together to focus too much on methodology like an agency would do, so making sure I had a super robust, um, uh, dataset, uh, I could access, like the very first, first step of my company building, and instead making sure with the little des-data I can access, uh, to, um, provide something meaningful, valuable, and actionable to the initial clients. That has been to me, um, a, an, a very important shift, and this consideration came out of the interviewing process that DQ, uh, pushed me to, um, uh, conduct before delving into the, uh, the product itself. What if, uh, instead of going to, to big corporations, uh, where I, I couldn't reach, uh, the, the C-level, what if I could instead, uh, go to selected, uh, um, early biotech companies where, um, th-there, there is good funding, uh, so that there is good, uh, budget allocation for this type of, uh, um, discovery. Uh, but at the same time, uh, I could have more, um, opportunities to talk directly to the CEOs or the chief scientific officers of the case. Well, what do you think would've happened if you'd… I-if we hadn't met and you, and you'd carried on going down the software route and got the product to where you thought it needed to be and then brought that to market? What, what do you think would've happened? Uh, best case scenario, I think I, I, I would have, uh, got some, uh, a very nice former colleague, uh, uh, getting me, um, the opportunity to pr-present, to pitch this, uh, inside big organization. Uh, may-maybe, maybe running a, a pilot for this, but it would have stopped there, I'm, I'm pretty sure. I don't want, uh, anyone out there to think that, that, uh, the team here at DQ have got anything against software. We, we love software- No, no, no … and we've been, we've been software investors for a long time. But I think the way you, you articulated it is perfect that, uh, and, and before I talk about that, we get so many applications from people who have identified a generic problem and then the value is the software. They come to us and they say, "Here's a problem, and I'm gonna get some AI, I'm gonna solve the problem. And the, and the AI is gonna do the work." And then you s- I always find myself saying, "Yeah, but the, the software doesn't have any value. The software is just w-workflows that have been digitized effectively. Where's the value?" And so I think what you've articulated there is that we're not necessarily, uh, going away from software, and h-hopefully this becomes a product and becomes extremely automatable and scalable. But before you can start building software, you have to deliver the value, and then you work out how, okay, now we know how to deliver the value. How do we do that in a digital way, in a, in a productized way that is less hours for money and more value for money? Um, and then the business can scale. So I love the fact that, uh, that we've gone through that process. Um, and we haven't been doing this that long. W-what, what month are we in now? Is it four or five or? Well, yeah, five. Yes. Yeah. Since, uh, November last year. Yeah. So, so you're, you're kind of bang on track. I mean, you're, you're ahead of schedule really, 'cause we always say we wanna try and get the first paying customer within the first four months. Uh, and you've already delivered work for two customers, three different projects, case studies intact. You're, you're well on your way. Um, and like you say now it's about how do we productize that and then turn this into a repeatable business and repa-repeatable sales motion. One, one thing I wanted to ask you that, that when we, when we exchanged some, some notes before, before talking, you said that, um, you've been, you've been mulling this over for a while, and you've been kind of working almost like an agency internally as an employee selling your, your concept internally to try and get people to use it 'cause you saw the value. And so it wasn't a massive surprise that to… You knew exactly what business you would build externally What, what made you believe that when you couldn't sell it internally as effectively as you wanted, that you would be able to sell it as an external provider? Or what was, what was your thought process there? I've been working, uh, for, uh, about 15 years now into, into these type of setups, meaning, uh, first time into a bigger organization, that was Nestle, early, uh, 2011. And the aim was to roll out a soft- a piece of software actually, uh, for, for social listening. The reason why I, I really liked it was that I, I could be the human in, in the loop, uh, in a, in a way, so to prove value of that software 'cause, uh, uh, people, people were not… Initially, people were not buying the dashboards. So initially, uh, within Nestle from the headquarters, it was, uh, attempted to, to be, um, adopted as, uh, at, at local level as a set of dashboards, and they were saying, "Yes, we have standardized metrics," and, and so forth. People were not buying it. In the end, I, I, I started, uh, acting as a, as a, as a sort of an example saying, "I work in the business. I'm not from IT, and I can show you how I, I take out value out of it, and it helps me in my daily or weekly, um, uh, type of decision-making." Yeah. And that, of course, uh, um, repeated a bit itself in, in different contexts, uh, uh, at pharmaceutical companies, at biotechnology companies, although I, I, I was delving more and more into, um, the insights as opposed to the technology. When you… I, I don't know what the redundancy process was, but I'm sure it's always slightly shocking and disappointing and hurtful, but when that, when that happened, did, did you look for more jobs or did you already know, "Okay, no, I'm… This is the, this is the moment I needed. This is the kick I needed"? Yeah. No, I, I was very resolute, uh, I have to say, uh, to, to start something myself because with, uh, AI nowadays, I mean, if, if I'm thinking about doing invoices and taking care of all the administration part, uh, just to make an example here- Yeah … a few years ago, it would've been, uh, much more of a burden to me to, to, to think about or even to, uh, pull together a, um, a little contract, uh, or a, um, an SOW. All these, uh, administrative sla- slash sales, uh, uh, tasks, uh, were alleviated a lot, so… And of course, all the, all the marketing pieces, uh- Around, uh, having a, an online presence with a, a website that doesn't look nice, but it's, but at least it's something and it's there. Uh, so all, all, all these bits and pieces made me think maybe, maybe I can, I c- I can get into it without, uh, waiting to have the perfect, uh, conditions with me. And of course, redundancy sort of, uh, um, accelerated the problem, made it more urgent, uh, and, uh, avoided, um, hesitation, uh, f- for sure, and forced me to clarify this. And, and this is why, again, getting to, um, uh, the DQ Ventures, uh, um, partnership really helped me with, uh, forcing that clarity. But, uh, back to your point, yes, it was a, a fairly immediate thought I had because, also because a few years earlier, I, I was considering this with, uh, a couple of other colleagues. But back then, um, i- in the end, uh, I, I was e- even changing roles, so I had a even better opportunity in, in, um, in the corporate world. So I, I, I kind of, uh, uh, put it aside. Well, I like that point you made that, that, you know, there's nev- never been as good a time to start your own business because of all the administrative stuff that you can get done so much easier now than, than in the past. Not really heard that talked about much. No. Um, but you're, you're right. Uh, and actually, I was, I was re-watching a recording with Rob, uh, our first, first portfolio company founder, and that was one of the things that he found really difficult, was actually creating an invoice. Yeah. And he said it took him, it took him ages to create an invoice, and he's like, "I didn't even know how to do it," or, "I didn't know anything about it." And it sounds pathetic i- in his own words that, uh, that such a thing could, could be a problem. But when you've worked in the corporate, you never have to think about anything like that. It's just, it's all done. It's all taken care of. Yeah. I mean, a- you still have to do it now as an entrepreneur, but it's so much easier than it was. One question that we always tell our portfolio companies who are later in the journey to ask, uh, um, try to ask ourselves, is talking to customers who bought, uh, or, or customers who, who bought their product or who signed up for their service What made you nearly not buy or what made you nearly not sign up? With, with DQ, you came across DQ. What, what was it about us that made you nearly not sign up with us? Can you remember? I, I was trying to understand, uh, how DQ Ventures was operating, your business model. Actually, I, I was looking at your, um, videos, uh, on the website, uh, James, uh, uh, with your recorded, uh, voice- Yes um, so to, to understand, uh, more in detail what the process was. Uh, so I, I, I was doing, yes, some, some, uh, pre-work for sure. Uh, but once we, we started, uh, engaging, no, I didn't have, uh, I didn't have moments in which I was asking myself, am, am I doing the right thing or not? Um- Ooh, that's great. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No Again, it, it's not because I'm, I'm talking to you in, in this kind of setting. Yeah, the pressure's on. No pressure. I'm sure this will come up later, later on, but it'd be a good thing to ask the customers that you've landed for, for Common Signups. Like, what, what was it about, uh, your service that made them almost not, not buy it or consider looking for alternatives? For, for certain, yes. Well, let's talk about that first client 'cause I, I… Most founders will probably find that they go through a lot of… A, a real high when they decide to start their company, and then they think about product and service and, uh, all that exciting stuff. People tend to ki- to bat away the difficult part, which is talking to customers. And as you know, we're quite forceful at, about having those conversations right at the beginning. And the reason that the founders then have this kind of slump is that it's actually really difficult to get your first client. It's always, or nearly always the hardest one. Yeah. You've got no case studies. You've got no testimonials. It's just you and an idea, and you trying to convince someone. How did you get your first c- client, especially in, in an industry that's known for long procurement cycles and being difficult to sell to? One of the benefits of going for smaller, early-stage biotech companies, of course, is that they were more agile. Yeah. Um, so I never, I never, um, uh, engaged with a procurement, uh, team. I've always liaised directly with, uh, with the CEOs in both, both cases. It really came out, uh, to me after, immediately after the, uh, discovery phase in which we were doing interviews, uh, mostly with my, uh, former colleagues, uh, to start getting, uh, their inputs and their feedback on the initial idea. And then at a certain point, I, I said to myself, "Maybe, maybe I should go outside of my comfort zone and, uh, a- and try and, uh, and ask, uh, people in the industry." So in a very selected way, for sure. So I didn't just go for, uh, uh, biotech, uh, but I went for neurology within, uh, within biotech, uh, startups. So that, of course, uh, uh, gave me a certain, uh, um, certain, uh, possibility to be regarded as, uh, yeah, as an expert anyway. I was doing a, a targeted outreach, uh, to a number of, uh, um, CEOs, uh, in the neurology space on LinkedIn. So I was, uh- Mm. Messaging them in this case, uh, of the first client, I, I was genuinely interested in, in getting, uh, his feedback. Uh, at the beginning, he actually responded to me very nicely and, uh, um, we organized an in- an intro session. I, I got to that session not with the intent of saying this is what I intend to, uh, sell, uh, but rather- Yeah, you brought- you were bringing value … I was carving out, out for him already some, some pieces where, uh, he, he could have, uh, uh, used the data for, uh, for decision-making, uh, in, in his upcoming trials. And I, and I could see that there was, uh, there was good, uh, engagement, uh, from his side on, on the data I was, I was showing him. So yes, it, it, it came out, uh, I, I have to say not through mass outreach, going straight to a decision maker, of course, uh, within my known space- Mm-hmm … um, of expertise, making sure I, I addressed a specific angle, not, uh, going generically on saying, uh,"This is, uh, all the possible, uh, types of analysis I could conduct for you." Steering away from saying social listening, uh, out in the open and trying to prove immediate relevance. I lo- I, I love so much about what you just said, and there's three things that really stand out. And hopefully I don't forget the second two by talking about the first one. The, the first one is that if you position yourself as offering an XYZ service, the person you're, you're presenting to is-- just immediately thinks, "Am I looking for an XYZ service?" So am I looking for a social listening service? Don't think anyone's talked about that. No, it's nice meeting you, but no, now's not really the time. So positioning around the, the value rather than a service is just such a good move The, the second point is that you, you really went deep into your area of specialism where you could add va- where you could really nail that value. So n- rather than just talking about the service that you could describe your service as, you, you focused on the value, and then you went deep into neurology and the area of neurology that you really knew. So really leveraging that, that expertise. And then the third point is why we started DQ in the first place, is that you, uh, you approached the CEO, and my question for you is, could someone without your expertise and without your seniority have pulled that off? This goes back to the considerations we are making for, um, agencies, uh, in, uh, my agency's perceived gap. I, I would say maybe yes, uh, but it would be, it would be harder, uh, in terms of the fact this is not just, um, uh, analysis, but more a matter of judgment, a matter of timing. Timing is, is, is very important because, uh, the other aspect I was considering was, uh, understanding how close, uh, these companies, uh, like my first client, were to key decisions, uh, like filing for clinical trials or About to initiate phase one, uh, clinical trials, just, just, just as an example. So, uh, timing is, is another, uh, very important factor. And if you are, um, a, a, a, a company or, or, or somebody that is building a, a similar business, uh, uh, without that type of background, uh, um, is less likely to, um, uh, succeed, at least in, in, for example, in, in, in getting the client in, in the first place. But also, uh, another, uh, very important aspect is always relevance. Uh, and it's, it is also why to me, uh, many agencies, uh, uh, were failing, uh, uh, in my case, uh, back, uh, at my corporate days because very good, technically speaking, um, they're very good, uh, as part of the process they, uh, um, conduct. But, uh, they don't necessarily, uh, have the right relevance, uh, to the industry, for example, in, in this case. That in my opinion be- comes before the software, particularly nowadays where software is so readily available to anyone. Relevance becomes more, more and more important. It's not about, uh, being a super robust, uh, uh, social listening, uh, uh, background type of person. Yeah. Uh, but rather, uh, making sure that what, um, what you're, uh, selling resonates and, uh, helps taking that, that decision. Yeah. And, uh, it was probably a bit of an unfair question because, uh, yeah, obviously agencies can, can win work. But, uh, the, the, the point I really wanted to, our listeners to take away is when, when someone says that y- you know, you're 40 or if you're 45, if you were an entrepreneur, you'd already have started a business by now. You're not an entrepreneur It's, it's nonsense. Uh, and, well, first of all, it's nonsense, but second of all, older people generally have an advantage over younger people because they've acquired that expertise- Exactly … and the credibility that comes with it, and the ability to open the door of a CEO, because my, my mates, who used to be junior useless people in all sorts of companies, are now CEOs of businesses with 2,000 employees. It's, it, it's just what happens in life, and it, it does make life easier. Completely agree. I mean, experience is, uh, is absolutely key part of what I was mentioning before. A- absolutely. You cannot, uh, get that, uh, with, uh, with education, uh, like compressing education at your early years. Uh, it's, it's a matter of, uh, acquiring it, uh, through, uh, uh, really through experience. Okay, let's take a quick break and hear from one of our portfolio companies. Most people think great leadership is about turning up and learning on the job. What I have learned through my 35 years of working in very complex environments is bringing a systems thinking approach to looking at the whole problem and the whole system. The second I would say is looking at clarity. How do we translate business vision into deliverables at every level? And the third one is commercial performance. Every business exists to make money, and we have to make it a thriving business. How do we make sure we protect for that? If you do one or the other, it doesn't quite lead to success, but time and time again, I've seen when people do all three, it leads to a successful outcome for everyone. Hi, I'm Anoop. I work with senior leaders, executives, and C-suite leaders to solve complex problems in organizations that are scaling up. If you're scaling your business and growing beyond where you have been before and you need a trusted advisor by your side who's been in the journey, then I'd love to work with you, and you can find me at anoopchoudhuri, that's A-N-O-O-P C-H-A-U-D-H-U-R-I .com. What do you think the biggest gap was between how you thought that this would, would work and actually h- what you've learned now and how you, how you're doing it now that, that other people who might be thinking about starting a business might fall into the same trap where what assumptions are you making that actually turned out to be, to be quite wrong? I would say something that I learned that I also applied to my potential customer. At the beginning, I, I was too much concentrated on the product, uh, itself without a clear need, uh, uh, in mind, uh, that I was, uh, fulfilling for a, for a, for a potential, uh, client. So that, that was something, uh, I, I was getting wrong. Um, but at the same time, that was also something that led to, led me to, uh, rethink my ideal client from, uh, again, being the classic, uh, corporation, uh, uh, type, corporate kind of client, uh, into the startup, uh, um, biotech. Uh, why? Because they, they have the same, uh, approach. They, they concentrate so much on the science, and they kind of lose track of what the, uh, needs are, actually are from patients, and it was the same for me. So I, I said maybe, maybe I could bring value in the same way there because I know what, what is the, uh, thinking process in, in, in that sense. So just as, uh, my- myself, I was, uh, too much focusing on the product and not that much on, on the, on the final, uh, user. Uh, at the same time, uh, in the same way, typically, uh, biotech companies that are starting up are really concentrated on the science almost exclusively that they, they kind of lose focus on the, on, on patients. So I always said, "Maybe I could bring that lens in and, uh, help them, uh, not taking, uh, wrong decisions or anyway when it's too late, uh, or bringing the right decisions when it's too late, uh, or the right information when it's too late." What I like about that is that i- it doesn't preclude or, or exclude doing business with these big businesses later. Yeah. And in fa- and in fact, once you've got a few case studies under, under your, um- Is it under your sleeve? I've lost my, uh, my English. Up your sleeve. Uh, under your belt, that's what I was thinking. You've got a few case studies under your belt, then, then it's probably much easier to go back to the bigger organizations and, and pitch a service rather than going in cold. Yes. Actually, in one failed selling e- experience, uh, with a, with a company where actually at, at the intro call, the chief financial officer was there as well, so it was, like, uh, quite a, yeah, quite a number of, uh, um, C-level, uh, team members of that startup. I didn't succeed, uh, uh, but, uh, they, they were quite structured in that, in that, in that sense. Um, I was- And they obviously were taking the idea quite seriously to put so much- Yeah … resource in the room. When you think about Common Signups now, do you think of it still being an idea, or do you think of it being a real business? No, I, I, I think, I think of it as a, as a real business for sure. The main, uh, aspect, uh, still I'm, I'm, yeah, I'm, I'm trying to, to, to improve, uh, uh, together with DQ, of course, is, uh, how to turn this from, from an isolated freelancing opportunity- Yeah into, into something repeatable, scalable. Of course, we mentioned it before, but, but yes, the, the, the feeling I have is, uh, is of course, uh, it's, it's… it feels more and more like a real business for sure. Uh, and what's your, what's your kind of, uh, underlying emotion i- in, in yourself? You know, how do you feel in yourself? I know y- you're a little bit different to s- to many of our founders because you're, you're on this full-time. You're not, uh, you're not still in your day job. Uh, d- I guess that creates a, a, a stronger sense of urgency. W- what's your underlying emotion when you're i- in your, in your day-to-day? Just how, how do you feel about the way things are going? Of course, I have moments of high excitement, uh, uh, for sure. Just to mention, like the repeated business with the first client, the referral to the second client, those are f- for certain. And, and I have to say, even linking t- back to the, um, to the value that I can see is being brought. So when, when I, when I see during the readout, uh, that, uh, um, a client is telling me, "Oh, um, you're do- uh, we, we're doing this competitive intelligence, uh, analysis, and, uh, we brought you a set of, uh, competitors and, uh, you, you, you, you, you gave us a, a real world view on an off-label competitor we were not thinking of." Uh, or, uh, in another case, uh, uh, another client saying, uh, "Oh, we identified a, a new patient segment we were not thinking about that we're gonna bring to the, uh, investors, uh, in our conversations with them." So- Really? Those are, uh- That's amazing. Yeah. Fantastic. I, I didn't understand quite the im- the implication of when you said before what that was, but that, that's incredible. These moments feel very rewarding, so exci- excitement for sure is, uh, is at, uh, its highest. Then, of course, there are those waiting times in, in, in between that I'm not super used to. And at the same time, uh, you know, th- I think the other, um … Emotionally speaking, I, I, I think I should start to be better at, uh, like, uh, my schedule of work. Uh, like, 'cause w- when, when I'm into one, uh, piece of work, I, I tend to, uh, uh, concentrate 100% on it, and I, I lose focus of e- even the, the DQ, uh, uh, tasks, for example. But, but even, uh, I, I should be, for example, thinking about, uh, my, my, my, my outreach, uh, selling piece. Uh, that should be part of my, um, like maybe even daily journey But, uh, if I'm focusing really, uh, into, into, into a project, uh, for me it's a bit difficult to abstract and, uh, abstract myself and, uh, um, and, um, uh, turn into something else. Or, or the administrative parts. Although, of course, with, uh, with AI it's, it's much simpler for me. Yeah. Um, so, uh, uh, this kind of multitasking part, uh, this is where I, I need to, to improve and, uh, uh, e- emotionally as well kind of as a, as a toll for me, uh, I have to say. Um- Yeah. Yeah. So I just wait for- All of that of, yeah, of, uh- Yeah … of, uh, highs, um, because of the exci- excitement of the moment. Yeah. It's so true. I mean, uh, it's, uh, it's lonely and, uh, it is an emotional rollercoaster. It's hard to switch your brain off. Yeah. If you could go back in time and talk to yourself at the very beginning, at, like, the moment you, you were made redundant, what, what would you say to yourself? I would say probably to myself, yes, this will feel, uh, destabilizing for, for certain. Uh, but, uh, I'm, I'm not, uh, on the wrong path. Um, so yes, the, the, the, the direction was already there. To, to, to me that's, uh, mm, that's the, that's the whole, uh, that's the whole point. Because, of course, the, the first, uh, the first reaction is always, uh, yeah, I'm, I'm, I'm on, I'm on the wrong, I'm on the wrong path. But, uh, no, uh, I think, I think this is, um, this is how I would, uh, I would approach it. Uh, and yes, uh, it's not a matter of misalignment, uh, really. An accelerator in the end of other, other, uh, dynamics. Particularly, particularly nowadays, uh, I, I think because it's, uh, it's a moment, uh, uh, most of us, I would say in, in the corporate world are, are, are going to face, uh, at, at a certain point. Yeah. Yeah. I think so. I think we're, we're on the brink of a time where there's gonna be a lot of people in the same position, and I think entrepreneurship probably is a very obvious option for many, many people. Uh, and in your case, like, like you said, well, we've got to… Well, our focus has to be, yeah, over the next six months or so, is turning you from a consultant that goes through the typical consultant feast and famine. You're delivering, and if you're not delivering, then suddenly you realize you've done no business development, so you need the next project. Is turning from that into a repeatable sales motion, a lot of which is automated so that you're, you're getting leads rather than having to chase that next project as soon as the last one's delivered. But, uh, so I'm excited to, to do that with you. One last question. Rather than saying what, uh, talking to yourself when you started this, this mission, if you met someone else who was in a corporate career and thinking about starting their own, their own journey, their own, their own business, what would you, what would you advise them? What, what, what would be your one piece of advice? Um, I, I know, I know I mentioned this, uh, repeatedly already, but, um, for certain, uh, uh, to, to focus on the value you're, you're bringing, uh, ultimately even, uh, uh, before the product, even before the com- the market landscape, uh, so the potential competitors. So what's your distinction, distinctive point really to, to focus on the value first, um, that you're, you're, you're carrying out, uh, with your, uh, uh, business, uh, before, before anything else. That's to me the, the, the main point. Um, and, uh, and yes, the, the, the other, the other thing is, uh, is, is for certain to, to search for, um, um, s- somebody else to share this with, for, for certain. Uh, 'cause, because you absolutely need a, um, a dialogue, uh, to develop i- uh, your idea. Um- Yeah … so that, these are to me the two main things. Yeah. A thought partner, and that doesn't have to be a DQ Ventures, it could be a co-founder. Yeah. Yeah. No. Uh, uh, yeah. Exactly. It could be an advisor. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Or somebody. Yeah. But with the right people around you, it just can be really good fun. Sure. Okay. Brilliant. Marcello, thank you so much. Really enjoyed listening to you and, uh, it's completely different to any of the other conversations that I've had. Some really telling insights. You're, you're a very reflective person, and, uh, you clearly, you think really clearly. It's really interesting to hear you talk. And if you liked that interview and you'd like more of the same, look for Founder Stories on YouTube under DQ Ventures Official, or find it wherever you get your podcasts.