Suchit Bachalli on Empathy, AI, and Building Unilog | Hidden Foundations Ep. 9

In this episode of Hidden Foundations, Kendall sits down with Suchit Bachalli to explore how family, education, entrepreneurship, and early sales experience shaped the way he leads today. Suchit shares how he built Unilog brick by brick with his father, what boarding school in India taught him about independence, and how selling software on the streets of Mumbai became the foundation for his belief in empathetic leadership.

The conversation moves through family business, working with a father, private equity, board structure, company culture, AI, social media, parenting teenage daughters, and the future of education. Suchit also explains why Unilog hires for empathy, why business leaders need to work on the business instead of only in it, and why critical thinking, imagination, and being more human may matter even more in the age of AI.

Chapters:
 00:00 Cold Open: Empathy, AI, and the “Done Deal”
 00:46 Meet Suchit Bachalli
 01:12 Building Unilog With His Father
 03:03 Working With a Father and Founder
 05:28 Boarding School and Early Independence
 08:37 Education, Values, and Family Expectations
 09:33 Selling Software on the Streets of Mumbai
 12:29 How Sales Built Empathetic Leadership
 14:44 Building a Culture of Empathetic Experts
 17:13 Amazon, Distribution, and Customer Relationships
 21:12 Peer Groups and Growing as a CEO
 24:38 Private Equity, Boards, and Letting Go
 29:26 Protecting Culture Through a PE Transition
 32:53 Teaching Kids Business Through a “Done Deal”
 37:05 Money, Values, and Raising a Daughter
 40:26 Social Media, Algorithms, and Teen Independence
 43:26 Culture, Performance, and Partnership
 48:30 AI, Time Distortion, and Business Transformation
 51:00 AI, Education, and Critical Thinking
 54:20 Where to Find Suchit
 54:32 Advice for the Next Generation



Hidden Foundations is a weekly podcast hosted by entrepreneur and investor Kendall Schoenrock, examining how family systems, early adversity, and childhood dynamics quietly shape high-performing adults. Each conversation uncovers the “invisible wiring” behind resilience, ambition, leadership, and grit — told through candid stories from entrepreneurs, athletes, creators, and leaders.

Guided by the thesis that strength is forged early at home, the show uses a consistent framework to explore emotional environments, money narratives, family roles, conflict patterns, and early challenges. Every episode delivers at least one practical, repeatable insight for parents, leaders, and anyone seeking to understand how greatness is built long before it’s visible.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

How does selling software on the streets in India lead you to be an empathetic leader?

SPEAKER_00 0:05

I'm like, hey, Amelia, I'm heading out to a meeting and she'll be like, okay, is it gonna be a done deal? Are you gonna are you gonna do a done deal? I'm like, you know, hopefully. I do think education in and of itself is gonna transform because as knowledge becomes more democratized, I think um uh critical thinking, imagination, being actually more human is gonna matter a lot more.

SPEAKER_01 0:31

This is Hidden Foundations, a show about how family, childhood, and adversity shape figures. Because before they became who they are, their foundation was already being formed. This is Kendall Schoenrock with the Hidden Foundation Podcast. I want to sincerely thank the Franklin on Written House Hotel for providing accommodations for me and the crew. Thank you. Welcome back to another episode of the Hidden Foundations Podcast. Today I'm joined with Tsuchik Pachali, who with Unilog here in Philadelphia. So tell me a little bit about how you got started in the business and the foundation and where this all came from.

SPEAKER_00 1:11

Sure. Um, you know, it's been a long time. Um I started with the company uh early 2000s. So I was in my early 20s. Um, and we found this little niche where um we provided data services to companies that were doing big paper catalogs in the industrial space. My father uh is an engineer by trade, um, and and so we we found this little thing that we could build on, and uh probably some of the best times, like working with him, trying to build a business. We have we could we come from a family of academic overachievers. Nobody had ever had a business, nobody was ever an entrepreneur in the family, and so it was an amazing, amazing ride um starting out unilog and uh building it brick by brick. I love that.

SPEAKER_01 2:02

So take me back. You and your father, you do you s deliberately see this market opportunity, and both of you at the same time say, There's cheese in the maze, let's go run this together, or how did that come about?

SPEAKER_00 2:16

Um, I would say a little bit of um sort of subject matter expertise, given my my father's background in the engineering space. Um, he had built large petrochemical plants in the past, and so he kind of understood the the subject matter expertise needed in the in the sort of product catalog space. And then some of it was accidental, right? You kind of follow um the the trends in the industry, you you kind of land yourself in sometimes a lucky spot. So I would definitely say that there was a little bit of uh luck and a lot of grit.

SPEAKER_01 2:50

Yeah. So was your father CEO to start? Yes. Yes, yes. So uh what was that like working for him and being cultivated by him in that journey? Talk to me about how that started.

SPEAKER_00 3:04

It was a very collegial environment. Um, you know, we kind of fed off of each other's energies. Uh, he's a very thoughtful person, uh, a very charismatic leader. Um, and I was young and energetic, and I thought anything would be possible. Um it was amazing uh the amount of trust and faith he put in my abilities, uh, even as a young person. Um and I see that a little bit with my daughter now. Uh you know, I feel like she's so much better than me in so many different things, even though she's only 14. Uh, last night I was trying to set up a printer, uh, and uh I was floundering with it. And I was like, man, I used to be good at this kind of stuff, and uh, you know, she she is just a little bit more um better at me in in technology, even though I run a tech company. It's it's it's it's fascinating.

SPEAKER_01 3:56

My daughters are the same way, it's so intuitive, right? They grew up with it and they just get it. Yeah, it's great. So um think back to to when you founded the business with your father. Give me one point of conflict where you guys disagreed, and how did you approach conflict resolution with your father? And how did he approach that with you?

SPEAKER_00 4:16

Um, I don't remember a lot of conflict, to be honest. Um, in a lot of ways, the the primary difference uh was and maybe still exists with me and my board a little bit now, is you know, he was a realist um and and always wanted to make sure that the business had the right fundamentals. And um I was a little bit more aggressive with uh our uh desire to grow and and to do new things. Um and so sometimes we would have challenging conversations, but I would not say in in the many years that we worked together that there was real conflict. Uh, I think there were challenges. Uh, but I I thought we we did a great job just having good conversations over it and getting past it. And I do feel like in a lot of ways, he let me sort of take that on and say, okay, fine, I'm a little here are the risks that I see, but if you feel con convinced about a certain idea, let's go try it. Um, and so that was that was great in the early years.

SPEAKER_01 5:23

Does that go back to how you were raised as a child as well? How was conflict in the home?

SPEAKER_00 5:28

So I have an interesting background. I went to boarding school early in my um uh childhood, so I didn't quite grow up at home. Um, a lot of my core memories are with uh some of my best friends in boarding school, and um that school uh was a great place for me to um, you know, find and learn new things. Uh, I remember the first computer I ever saw was at the school. I had friends and we did all kinds of fun things uh back in the day with uh COBOL and GW basic programming, and it was a great time. Um so I don't have sort of this uh the conventional um uh notions around family life or um you know how I grew up was a little bit different. Um I still think um you know my friends and my experiences in boarding school shaped a fair bit of who I am.

SPEAKER_01 6:25

Before your parents made the decision to have you go to boarding school, how did they set that up with you? How did what how was that approached? Was it mandated? It was a directive, this is what's going to happen? Was it a conversation and collaborative?

SPEAKER_00 6:40

How how did that unfold? It was uh it was an amusingly two-way decision. Um, I was not the easiest kid to have home. Uh I think if you asked my mom, she would uh second that. Um and uh so when when the conversation came up, I was like, ah man, let's go. I was happy to get out of the house. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:04

Was there conflict prior to that?

SPEAKER_00 7:06

No, not not much. I mean, um, you know, we we grew up in a very middle class family in India. Um, I have a younger sister, she's six years my junior. Um and so it was just, you know, growing up, uh I was very strong-minded, as was my mother, and so we butted heads a fair bit. And uh uh I think my dad thought, oh, maybe uh it's easier to have you um in in boarding school. And I was like, amen.

SPEAKER_01 7:33

You have a uh younger sister, is that correct?

SPEAKER_00 7:36

Uh same path for her? No, she is the the star of the family. She is a you know, she is a anesthesiologist, so a lot of my family, I mean, I I think at the last count maybe 12 or 14 doctors on both sides, which isn't com, you know, which is uncommon for the South Asian community. Um, so my my sister is an anesthesiologist, she went to med school, um, and yeah, so we're very different paths, uh, but I would say my mom's a little proud of her.

SPEAKER_01 8:09

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_00 8:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 8:10

That's fascinating. So this is this is kind of the entire reason I want to go on this journey, because I'm trying to figure out. Do you have two very successful kids raised in a completely different way? You go off to boarding school, she stays. Um, what is it about the relationship that that set you up, both of you, independently for success? Tell me about the relationship with your parents. What do you think they did to help cultivate and shape that?

SPEAKER_00 8:37

Um, so I think our our parents um, you know, a lot of focus on um education, uh uh a lot of focus on just being good human beings. Um, I I think the the times that we got into trouble were the things that we should have gotten into trouble for. It wasn't so much about whether we did something or we didn't complete a chore or a task, but it was you know things that when you look back, you're like, don't lie, don't steal, like don't, you know, make good friends. Like those were the kinds of things that they uh they tried to um instill in us, and I think those values have uh paid off uh a huge dividends. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 9:24

So go back, you you finished boarding school. Um how fill the gap between when you were you were done with school and and when you started the business with your father.

SPEAKER_00 9:33

I was always interested in business and and I wanted to start something, and um my first job was actually selling shrink-wrapped software that came in a stack of CDs on the streets of Mumbai. You know, that that's what I wanted, you know. I I just fell into it. Um, that's what I wanted to do. Um, and it was amazing uh to have four years of no's and failing and stumbling. That uh excuse me, that that really set me up for uh what my career would become. Um I genuinely love um being not just in a sales position because I think um sometimes that that has a negative connotation. Um I see it as being in that awesome position to help. Um and to me that's what uh it came down to. Anytime I was in front of a customer and we could find us, we could find a problem and we could you know troubleshoot and solve it for them, I think that makes for a really good business model. Um and that's that's what I learned in those early years uh in my career.

SPEAKER_01 10:43

Let's go back to selling software on the street. Talk to me about the hustle. What what how did you how did you get into that? What did you learn? Yeah. What were some of the key takeaways?

SPEAKER_00 10:53

Yeah, I had a I had um, so I landed up in Mumbai um late 90s, and um I I knew some people, my my dad knew some people from from his uh work. Um, but the most pivotal moment for me was I had a I had a mentor. Um, and so the initial days it was uh all about like you know making phone calls, and back then it was a landline, it was a fax machine, there was no email, it was the internet was this ethereal thing. And so it was all about you know in-person relationships and going and meeting customers and meet as many as you can and try to impress upon them that we can we can solve a problem for them. Um, and what I learned was uh that you have to lead with empathy. Uh, that was the biggest takeaway, and that's something that I've really um held close to me, even at Unilog today, 25 years later, we think of ourselves as empathetic experts. Like we know the space, we know the industry that we serve, but we have to lead with empathy. So if you can't meet with a customer and understand the challenges that they have, uh, the cash flows that you know are constrained, the EBITDA goals that they have, and you don't have empathy for that, then you can't really solution for them. And that's what I learned in those early years uh was to lead with empathy.

SPEAKER_01 12:28

Joel, Joel, a little bit deeper for me. How does selling software on the streets in India lead you to be an empathetic leader?

SPEAKER_00 12:37

When I would need customers, um they would tell me sort of all the challenges that they had in their business or in their personal lives. And those challenges were not something that a piece of software could solve. Like if you had five challenges in your business, maybe there's one of them that my solution can solve, but what about the other four? And so becoming that advisor and saying, listen, I have a solution for this one problem, but let's park that to the site. Let's talk about the other four things that you have. And oh, by the way, I can introduce you to this person and I can do that for you, and I can really help you navigate through all of those. I think that's where it comes out, where you're not being a pushy salesperson saying, Hey, this is the problem, here's my solution, buy it now. Uh, I'm more interested in building that long-term relationship where um I'm the first phone call. Um, and and that's uh had we've had great results with that because uh A, you you build long-term relationships. I have people that have moved from company to another company, but they'll always call on us.

SPEAKER_01 13:56

Yeah. So it it sounds to me that one of the key points of learning was the ability to interact with a potential customer and pull out the pain points, figure out what solutions you have that would fit, and then figure out what solutions you don't have or don't fit, and then separate those two, and then solve their problems. Yeah. That's a core foundation of Unilog and your business now. Correct. As the leader, as the CEO now of that business, how do you pass that mentality from leadership to the employees, and how do you get them to adopt that solution selling or that system of uncovering the problems and figuring out where you can provide the most value?

SPEAKER_00 14:44

Yeah, so uh a lot of our um coaching and and training and onboarding is around the notion of empathetic expert, right? And so when someone joins Unilog, we sort of walk them through what it truly means to be an empathetic expert. Um so so one, I don't think you can um you can change behavior. So I always say we're in the behavior identification business, we're not in the behavior modification business. So to begin with, I want people who are naturally empathetic, right? I that's the kind of person that's a great fit culturally for us at Unilog. Um I leave the behavior modification to therapists. That's not who I am. But when we do find the right candidate, it's really about making sure that they understand that the that a good business principle is to make sure that we are um able to identify problems and then lean in and ask the question, similar to what you're doing now. Like you're asking me to dig deeper, you're asking me more and more questions and unraveling more truths about our conversation. That's where it's at because that's how you build relationships. And it's really about uh helping them ask the right questions. So we we do a lot of coaching around what kind of questions should we be asking? How do we um how do we sort of measure if they're actually telling us everything everything? Can we ask some more clarifying questions? So when we do discovery calls with our customers, it's a lot of uh questions that we're asking and probing, and we do it in a way that hopefully makes our customers feel like we're invested in understanding their business more.

SPEAKER_01 16:36

Right. And then so let's let's drill into how you then apply your solutions to solve the the business problems of of others in that sales process. The key magic that I just heard was pulling out the problems and then identifying where you can provide the most value. What are some examples of that as it relates to your your current business? And since I know Amazon is kind of in the in the mix there, maybe maybe talk about how the Amazon uh 800-pound gorilla impacts that conversation.

SPEAKER_00 17:13

Yeah. Um so we serve mid-market wholesale distribution companies, and they have you know three primary challenges, right? One is that they are competing against national distributors, they're competing against the likes of Granger and uh Watsko and Ferguson, um, who are investing hundreds of millions of dollars in digital. The second big challenge that they have is even if they had sort of an e-commerce solution, product data is a big issue. Like the catalog sizes that the nationals have versus our customers have, that's a big, big challenge. And the third is they don't have the digital talent in-house to be able to do the kind of kinds of things that that they do. So what we are really focused on is saying, okay, how can we solve these problems? And our competition is not other commerce providers or other um solutions similar to ours. Our competition really is fear, uncertainty. Um, and sometimes I joke that a that a business owner that's third generation, that's focused on profitability, sometimes the competition is, you know, share of wallet. Like where do I spend the money? Every year it's one important priority. One year it could be CRM, one year it could be e-commerce. Heck, one year it could be the the warehouse needs a new roof. You know, so what are those things that that are that are challenges? And so identifying those blockers and saying, okay, um, maybe it's not the right time. Maybe next year is the right time for you to do this, and just being that empathetic expert and understanding their business. And that's why we love hiring people from the distribution industry, because I think they really understand the space well.

SPEAKER_01 19:11

And and how how are you navigating Amazon and the the Amazon play?

SPEAKER_00 19:16

Um, so I think um Amazon, there are certain categories, there are certain product categories that I think that they're a good fit, right? So um when when you have product and widgets like a safety glove, uh maybe a good place uh in Amazon, maybe a good place for um to buy safety gloves. A lot of our customers, even in the safety vertical, are solution providers. They're not just looking at moving widgets, um, they're building relationships, they're providing complex solutions. So whether it's a piece of equipment and it's the long-term service and warranty and installation, um, or it's even in cases like safety, it's like solutioning a, you know, a safe work environment for their customers. That's where the value add is. And um, you know, try calling 1-800 Amazon when something goes wrong. I I think that that relationship is what our distributors. I would go out on a limb and say, we're mirroring what they're doing. I believe our distributors are the epitome of uh empathetic experts.

SPEAKER_01 20:28

So they do it better.

SPEAKER_00 20:29

I think they are the best at what they do. Yeah. I I love the space. I get to meet so many um uh CEOs in in the wholesale distribution space, some of my favorite people. Um, salt of the earth, wonderful, wonderful leaders. Right.

SPEAKER_01 20:46

So we we we've touched on the subject of how you identify and attract the right talent. Let's talk about cultivation. So you and your father, your father's obviously cultivating you as a leader in this journey. Um, what's your dedication to improving yourself as a leader? What type of other groups, vistage or similar, do you lean into for uh improving yourself as a leader and owner?

SPEAKER_00 21:13

Yeah, I've been uh very blessed to be part of Vistage. Um I think next month will be 10 years. Um I joined when I was 36. I was green behind the years, and um I just can I wrap what is Vistage for somebody who doesn't know? Oh, sure, it's a peer-to-peer group. Um, it's um, you know, 12 to 15 CEOs, you meet once a month. Usually there are no competitors in the room, so you meet people from different organizations, businesses that don't look like you. But the fascinating thing that I found was that we all have the same problems, right? It could be people, it could be strategy, it could be vision, it could be um finance, like the challenges are. Are similar. And that's what I when I when I first got in, I was like, I don't know what I'm going to learn from a you know construction company. But when you talk to the leader, uh, you understand that it's the same challenges, regardless of the business vertical. Um, and so uh my group, uh, which is one of the oldest in vista, really blessed that I got into that particular group. It's uh Vistage 341 in Philadelphia. Um, it's been around for over 40 years. It was prior to it being Vistage, we used to be called tech. Um, so the the foundations of the group are very strong. A lot of people have been there 15, 20 years. And so it's been a great um place for me to come in, learn from others, and contribute where I can. Um, but that's one of the ways in which um I've been able to grow as a leader on the shoulders of some of my peers.

SPEAKER_01 22:57

If you're a leader, if you're if you're a business owner and you're thinking about vestige or YPO or something similar, um, one of the counter-arguments I heard is I don't have the time to take, how often does vistage meet? Once a month.

SPEAKER_00 23:13

Once a month, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 23:14

I don't have the time to drop off a full day per month to work outside of the business. What would you say to that person?

SPEAKER_00 23:22

Um, I have I struggled with that, right? It's always there's always competing priorities, there's a lot of travel, you have so many other things going on. But every every time I I you know I say to myself, I'm you know, 29 days of the month, I'm working in the business. This is the one day of the month that I get to work on the business, right? I get to see it from the outside in. I get to meet with other businesses and and other CEOs. And sometimes all you have to do is listen. And if we're issue processing and there's a there's an issue that another CEO is bringing, you can learn so much from that. And so it's the one-day investment a month that has uh paid huge dividends for me.

SPEAKER_01 24:12

So you'd you'd recommend a similar group?

SPEAKER_00 24:14

Yeah, anything that works, there's so many of them out there. Uh, but anything that uh a founder, CEO, entrepreneur can do to help improve their own um abilities, I recommend that. Um and and I I I would do it all over again.

SPEAKER_01 24:33

What's your board structure and and how does your father fit into that piece?

SPEAKER_00 24:38

Yeah, so um my my father's uh you know turned 76 this December in a few days, in a few weeks. Um so uh so we we were acquired by private equity in December of 2020. Um our partners are Invest Corp. Um, they're a very large multi-asset manager, about $80 billion assets under management. And they've been a phenomenal partner to us. So part of that transaction um was uh for my father to sort of um take a step away from day-to-day, and uh he's been a great advisor. He sits on the board of the India entity, uh, the the the headquarters or the the Unilog um holding, which is the holding company. Um that's a board formed um between myself and the InvestCorp partners. Um but uh the board structure is important. I think uh a good functioning board is critical to a business's success. Uh again, it's one more place where you can get to work on the business, right? I think there's a part of uh I've been part, you know, I've been on good nonprofit boards like the Franklin Institute, the that that's a very well-functioning board. And you get an opportunity to obviously look at the numbers and the metrics and how things are performing, but that's always in the rear view mirror. Like you're always getting that information as a past signal of what has transpired. I think a good board, and we spend a lot of time thinking about where's the puck going, which way is the wind blowing. And our partners are very good, they have a large portfolio of companies, and so we get to see a lot of things and what's happening in Europe, and what's happening in North America, and what's happening in technology, and um, and and they do a great job of bringing those inputs to us so that we can refine our strategy year on year.

SPEAKER_01 26:40

Talk to me about your father's headspace during that transition. So, what I found is that oftentimes founders have very deep emotional connections to their business. It's them, it's part of their character, it's who they are. And when there's a transition, letting go of that sometimes creates a lot of cognitive dissonance where they don't feel they're needed as much anymore, and that causes them lots of pain. How does your father navigate that? Is that accurate for for your in in this scenario for for your dad? Or talk to me about that, please.

SPEAKER_00 27:14

My my dad is a is a very unique person. Um first of all, he's he's practiced Eastern spirituality for over 30 years. Um and one of those few rare human beings that I know where he he gets joy in letting go. Like he feels that that's part of life. Um, and I think his emotional connection was not so much to the brand or the company or the PL. His emotional connection was and has been, you know, is today to the people. Um uh he lives in in Mysore where we have a large operation. Um you know, people still go and see him on occasion. He's mentoring a bunch of other small companies in the local area, and he's very active and very involved. Um, so I think for him, um one I think, and I can't speak for him, but I I do feel like he feels extremely proud of where we have come and what we've been able to accomplish. And just like with your kids, you know, he he feels a certain sense of um gratitude and and pride when he sees uh, you know, letting go and go do your own thing. Um and and but I I I get to talk to him uh a fair bit. In fact, I'm gonna be in India for a couple of weeks and looking forward to spending time with him. That's great. That's great.

SPEAKER_01 28:52

How did it impact you in terms of the decision-making process of I assume that you shopped it to multiple private equity firms? We did not. Just the one. We it was inbound. It was inbound. So you you were you received the call, they did the full due diligence. How did you, with the dedication to the employees that I just heard, as a core fundamental aspect of the business, how did you ensure that your new private equity partner was going to maintain the same level of commitment to your team?

SPEAKER_00 29:26

Um, great question. Um, and and I think um very early on the deal structure itself was the biggest signal to me in terms of how InvestCorp was uh approaching the transaction. The fact that there are no you know, tiered equity struct, you know, flavors of equity with preferences and um you know they holding a certain class of equity versus us holding a different class of equity. Um there was a comment that uh the managing partner of our un made uh early on. He said, we're all gonna be in the same boat, we're all gonna own the same class of stock. And to me, it's one thing to say that you know we we we want the culture to thrive and all of that, and then it's it's another to act on it. And the fact that the the deal structure maintained that um um notion that we would be rowing in the same boat together, we're all going to be incentivized the same way, and the class of stock that we're gonna get, this is the exact same paper that they hold, I think that spoke volumes to me.

SPEAKER_01 30:40

So if you had to describe our daughters are about the same ages, if you had to describe the concept of different classes of stocks to your daughters or to my daughters, what would you say?

SPEAKER_00 30:54

Uh um it would be like saying um I'd probably pick a card game, um, and I would say, you know, um you have a deck of cards, but you have a joker, and that wild card is anything you can want it to be. So if you're if you're missing a card, it can be the ace of spades, if you want, it can be the jack of clubs, and that is a different class of stock. And so out of a card deck of 52 cards, if I give you uh 25 and I had 25, and then there were two jokers, whoever had those two jokers or the that two separate class of stock has the winning hand. That's how I'd explain it.

SPEAKER_01 31:42

Yeah. And basically it's the tiers or the the the one class has preferential treatment or more voting power, more rights that the others don't. And so in in the example of what you're saying with your private equity, everyone gets the same strength of card. That's right. So all the deal terms are the same. That's right. And so everyone's treated fairly. Yeah. Then the ownership portions may be different, yeah. But they there's not one subset that has preferential treatment over the others.

SPEAKER_00 32:10

Yeah, that's right. And I'm not saying that there's anything wrong with having preferential stacked equity. Um, there's there's many reasons to do it. Um, but I I do feel that it's easier and more simpler um to make sure that everyone's aligned. So the options that we give out to our team members, uh, those options are the same class of stock that in the score below's.

SPEAKER_01 32:33

Aaron Powell So you made that transition five years ago. Your daughter would have been nine at the time. Yes. How how much did you share with your daughter about this specific transaction? Yeah. How did you get into it? How transparent were you? Is she aware of your business decisions? How are you cultivating her in terms of leadership?

SPEAKER_00 32:53

Yeah, um, great question. So we did the entire transaction during COVID.

SPEAKER_01 32:58

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 32:59

So uh uh the the the Philly Business Journal actually reported on it. Um I didn't meet anyone in person until March of 21. So the whole deal was done online basically. Um, and you know, during COVID, um my daughter would be home a fair bit. So um her mom and I are not together anymore, but we are have a very close relationship, and so my daughter would go back and forth, and um and I think Varun, who's my counterpart at IBC, we we kind of went through the same experience because I think my daughter knows his name as well as his daughters knowing my name, um, uh because we were uh in sort of constant Zoom after Zoom. Um, and it's funny, um, she was young and um she used to have this little phrase saying, uh, oh, is it gonna be a done deal? Like she used to hear me talk on Zoom all the time. And so even today, uh, I'm like, hey, Amelia, I'm heading out to a meeting, and she'll be like, okay, is it gonna be a done deal? Are you gonna are you gonna do a done deal? I'm like, you know, hopefully. Um, but so she's had that uh exposure just by listening in terms of I'm not sure she would comprehend much of it, but now I I see that she's quite interested and she's in part of a lot of entrepreneurial groups in school. Um, she's started, you know, web storefronts and businesses ideas, and she she loves it. So I'm hoping that just by listening and having it around you, she's uh hopefully fascinated by it.

SPEAKER_01 34:49

Yeah. So in our business, um we just purchased the old hostess headquarters in Lanexa, Kansas, Kansas City. And uh we're gonna lease that to the state of Kansas for the Department of Children and Families. And that's the real estate project that I'm I'm currently focused on. And when we went to uh finalize the bank financing, I brought my two daughters with me and I showed them the promissory notes and the mortgage and the deal structure. And I I don't want them, there's no way they would comprehend everything, but I wanted to expose them to the concepts of this is where we're getting the financing. We don't technically own the building, the bank owns the building, we're gonna pay the bank. This is the structure, this is the why.

SPEAKER_00 35:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 35:37

Um, just so they start to understand there's a book of legal contracts that go behind these types of deals. And I just think it's good to have exposure, yeah. Um, you know, just so that they're somewhat aware of how these pieces of the puzzle fit together. Um I don't know if that's right or wrong, but it's it's how my wife and I are approaching it. I think the more exposure the better.

SPEAKER_00 36:01

Absolutely. I think um, you know, the kids learn so much from just listening and just being around things, and they're so observant and they're catching on to things, and um, they may not even know it or recognize it, but i i I believe like it did for our child, like we learned a lot just by doing stuff or just being in the room. Um, and I think that it's gonna it's gonna be great for them to have that exposure. Yeah, that's awesome.

SPEAKER_01 36:31

Right. Yeah, thank you. Um, so let me dive in and take this in a couple of different directions here. Um we talked a little bit about your your home life and and the parents and the influence. How was money discussed when you were a child? Was money used as a tool? Was it hidden? Was it uh was it leveraged? How transparent were your parents when it came to the subject of money as it relates back to? I mean, I'm obviously sharing with my daughters. He here's the the bank transaction or here's the mortgage. Is that similar to what you were raised?

SPEAKER_00 37:04

How you were raised? So I have often so a friend of mine told me to do this. He said, try and imagine um how old uh my I'm I'm 47 now. Uh and and he said, try and picture what how old you were when your dad was 47, right? And so I did that mental math and I figured out, you know, where I was in life and where he was in life. The thing that uh amazed me was you know, we didn't have much, like in terms of luxury, or you know, uh, first of all, we grew up in a in an India that was very different than it is now. Um, so what amazed me was I just didn't know how they did it. Like I have no comprehension of how they put me and my sister through school, like it was expensive. Um we never really wanted for anything, but but also like there wasn't much to the like it wasn't um there there wasn't largess or uh luxury or anything like that. But it was it was interesting for me to be like, okay, I had no clue. Like I I just it was I wouldn't say it was hidden, but I I think they took on the stress themselves, uh, and and they did sort of the things that just made our childhood a little bit more um easier, like you know, you don't have to worry about it, just go focus on school, and you know, my dad would figure it out.

SPEAKER_01 38:47

And how are you exposing money to your daughter?

SPEAKER_00 38:51

Um well, I think um every time I say no, I say, you know, no, we're not buying that. Uh I'm like, I'm I'm character building, is and she hates it. Uh um, but she's uh, you know, generally I think uh also her mother plays a huge uh part in that and a big influence. Uh and I'm really blessed. I mean, even though we're not together, um, she's a wonderful mom, she's a wonderful human being, wonderful person. Um, and she has instilled a lot of those values in our daughter. Um, so for me, I'm I'm trying to uh you know show that you know you get to buy things or get things when um on special occasions or when it's needed or desired. Um but generally, I mean, she was you know, went to her homecoming dance and they got a dress from uh a vintage store, like you know, just went in and picked up something for a few bucks. Uh no, and and she still loved it and and had a great part in that. Uh I I just feel like um, and I will be honest, I think her mother does a lot more than I do in terms of instilling those values. Um I I probably say yes to more than I should.

SPEAKER_01 40:12

Yeah. I'm guilty as charged, also. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 40:15

That's what dads are for, especially girl dads.

SPEAKER_01 40:19

Right, right. Um, how how are you approaching this subject of social media specifically for for teenage daughters?

SPEAKER_00 40:26

Oh, that's a that's a that's a tough one. Um, I think every generation it's something, right? Um I remember when if someone had you know called me on the phone, my mom would pick up the extension. Like, you know, it was always something. Um, I think the generation before my daughters, everyone struggled with the internet in general, right? Um look, I think I've been doing a lot of research on it. I think she's at an age where uh it is time for her to sort of establish her independence. And um, I think social media has um it's not a war between us and our kids. We're united, it's the war against the algorithms and the big social media companies. And I think if we can somehow explain to our kids that you've you do you want to be the product, right? Or do you want to have these big uh tech companies sell to you? Um, or do you want to control that narrative a little bit more? Um, and I think a lot of kids in that age group, I think, are coming around to that notion and they're identify their understanding that there's a lot of value in having a medium of communication with each other, hopefully in a safe and and sound manner. But the doom scrolling has not only negative effects for time and how you manage time, but also that it's really enriching the coffers of some person sitting in Silicon Valley.

SPEAKER_01 42:09

Right. You know, the one of the things that that disturbs me is just how much they're able to pull out the algorithms know about the the person and how they're they're using that information uh against you. And I I've talked about it before, but there there's research where if a person takes a selfie and then deletes it and doesn't post it, the algorithm knows that you potentially don't like the way you looked, and so then they start to advertise cosmetic products. Yeah. Or the or they know that, right, and so it's used. And so if your brain is not fully formed yet because you're a teenage girl and you're influenced by what you see in the algorithm, and the algorithm's now knowing potentially that you don't like the way you look, it's starting to shape and craft the message that gets delivered to you in what I would say is a potentially very unhealthy way.

SPEAKER_00 43:03

Agreed. Um, I think that as long as we can make them more and more aware of these traps, right? Uh, awareness is key, right? I think just them knowing in the back of their mind that this is what's happening, this is how it works, I think will lead them to eventually um understand it a little bit better and use it for for their benefit.

SPEAKER_01 43:26

Right. Yeah. So let's talk about the culture of the business. So you indicated um the uh transition to private equity was was very positive. Or that when you brought in your private equity partner, that you were able to maintain um uh the the protection of the employees. How did you establish along the way your core fundamental beliefs and the values of the business? Uh I somewhat define um Culture as the worst behavior that a company will tolerate.

SPEAKER_00 44:04

That's a great way to put it.

SPEAKER_01 44:06

How do you approach culture in your business and how did you preserve that in that transition?

SPEAKER_00 44:12

Um so I think uh very early on, um we kind of made it very clear that we have a very defined, definitive culture that you can feel, touch, and take. You you can you can feel it, right? Uh you can see it in all our people, and you will um it's noticeable. What was also interesting was that you know, Invest Corp also has their own culture, you know, and and it's different because they're a private equity firm, and so their culture is different from ours, as your company's culture would be slightly different than ours. Um, but I think it's it's like you know, cultures can come together, right? Cultures can coexist. Um, and it is the question of it's like you know, interfaith marriages, right? It can you coexist and have respect for each other's culture and still find a lot of common ground. So to me, it wasn't so much about this is our culture, take it or leave it, because I think that we approached it from the perspective of this is our culture. I'd love to know more about your culture and see if we can. And what I found was, you know, while we're so, you know, our culture is so about empathetic experts, and and their culture is very performance-driven. And um, and the talent that they have on their team is some of the brightest people I've worked with, right? Um, and real like quants, right? I mean, uh early on, I'll give you this um quick anecdote. Um, early on, like, you know, we we ran a really good business, it was profitable. We kind of knew the numbers like the back of our hand. But what was fascinating was in the first year or so, um, our partners would tell us exactly what was gonna happen financially 18 months out, like 12 months out, nine months out. They could pinpoint exactly where the cash is gonna be, you know, what the numbers are gonna look like. And that gave me a lot of, you know, it took so much like guesswork out of it. Um, and I was like, wow, now that I know that's gonna happen, I can do something about it today, right? So just in the FPA function, like they were phenomenal. But but where I was going with this is that if you have that genuine appreciation for each other's cultures, and say, hey, in this house, these two cultures can coexist and we can take the best of each other and we can find a lot of middle ground. And so when we run into a situation like, hey, here's a customer that's not happy, and we're gonna do anything that it takes, and it's gonna cost us an arm and leg to do this, and they understand that in the long run, that's our culture, and they have to allow us to do that. Uh, similarly, they will say, okay, that's great. Before making that investment, can we come up with an ROI that shows that that's gonna have a payback period? And we're like, absolutely. If we spend you know ten thousand dollars here, the lifetime value of that customer is gonna be X, and this is how we can do it. I think that's how two cultures coexist. I have gotten away over the years the dogma that your culture is sacrosanct and that's all or nothing. Uh I would I love companies that have different cultures and see if we can work together. Same with partnerships. Like we want to find partners that have cultures that are similar, you know, different enough that we can learn from them, and those are the best partnerships that we have.

SPEAKER_01 48:05

Yeah, I love that.

SPEAKER_00 48:06

Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 48:07

Um let's let's go back to the subject or the concept of time distortion, because there was something you mentioned about thinking about your father when he was your age that I found really fascinating. Do you use time distortion when you plan your goals of where you want to see yourself in five years or ten years or at the end of uh your journey?

SPEAKER_00 48:30

Um we we do a lot of um sort of vision setting and and you know, we also use EOS, so the entrepreneurial operating system. So we have a 10-year B HAG, um, a three-year plan and uh and a one-year PL. Um I actually find time distortion more acute when we look back. So it's when I look back, because in the day-to-day, it's sometimes you feel like uh it's it's we're we're you know hand-to-hand combat. But when you look back, it's like, oh my, like, wow, we have come quite a while, you know, we've we made a huge transition. Um and so right now we're going through this massive transition to take the company into being an AI first company. And you know, it was fascinating. We we had a meeting um um several months ago where we launched internally, we said we're gonna build these agents on on the AI platform and we're gonna do this. Um, and it's amazing to look back and say, oh, we said that, and look, here it is, like it's in the hands of customers. It's like amazing to see that transformation. So I find that time distortion uh is more acute for me, at least when I look back. Um, as I look forward, um, I we're very excited about where the industry is, all the things that are happening with AI. What a great time to be alive! Like it just feels um amazing to be here at this time leading a tech company. Um the world is our oyster right now.

SPEAKER_01 50:17

Yeah. So you're really leaning into AI and the business?

SPEAKER_00 50:20

Absolutely. Yeah, um, yeah. We everything that we're we're doing across every function finance, HR, um, product development, product management, me personally, like we're all in on AI just because we think it's such a huge productivity boost. And then the the example I give people is the first killer app with the internet was the was email. And the productivity gain that we got from one killer app was phenomenal, right? Changed the face of business. Um, and so we feel like these LLMs are that first killer app, but we're in we're in such an early stage, like what can happen going forward is amazing.

SPEAKER_01 51:00

Yeah, and then you take it 25 years out and you're cutting a private equity transaction on Zoom. Yeah, right. And the world's locked out. It's like look if you think about the evolution of communication on that, yeah. That's really interesting. How are you using uh AI with your daughter? And are there any are you you're encouraging her to use it because it's uh the next uh phase, or is there limited use because you don't want to sacrifice critical thought?

SPEAKER_00 51:26

Um I think it's a balancing act. I I do think that um there's a lot of benefit for the younger generation to lean into AI. Um similar to as I would say, like when computers and the internet first came out and and we were doing those fun things on those devices, it wasn't known to us that it would actually, in my case, like it would help me form an entire career in that, right? Um and so I'm I'm asking her to use AI in as many ways as possible, uh, within the boundary constraints of what school allows, et cetera. I do think education in and of itself is gonna transform because as knowledge becomes more democratized, I think um uh critical thinking, imagination, being actually more human is gonna matter a lot more.

SPEAKER_01 52:18

Right.

SPEAKER_00 52:19

Um so I I do hope that the the generation that's in school right now embraces it uh and not be afraid of it. And educators, I don't think, should be afraid of it.

SPEAKER_01 52:29

I completely agree. Completely agree. And one of the projects that my daughter worked on recently was to use AI to rewrite Dr. Seuss in the style of Shakespeare and Shakespeare in the style of Dr. Seuss. And then to act and perform a scene that she drafted. So you in that, right, if you if you deconstruct that homework assignment, it was you have to understand AI prompting, you have to understand the style of writing of Shakespeare, you have to understand how that alters and differs for Dr. Seuss, merge the two, but make make it unique and your own. Come up with the subject on what and then my daughter dressed it as the Lorax and redid uh a scene as Lorax uh in the style of Dr. Shakespeare. Yeah. And I was like, that is brilliant because it's an overlap of so many different elements. That's right. Right? And it's like that's what AI should be, yeah, right?

SPEAKER_00 53:24

Like we lean into it. Uh funny story, uh, so my daughter sent this Christmas wish list, which was uh you know, uh maybe 40 things on that list. And so I was like, uh, I need to respond to it. And so I went uh uh to to AI and then I wrote her response back in Dr. Seuss's poetic format, and it was hilarious, right? I mean, I was like, uh, because she made a whole argument as to why she should get all these things, um, and so I countered every argument with uh in in Dr. Seuss's uh poetic style. It was it's funny. There's so much fun that we're having um just with all of and she she definitely thinks that um everything I do is on AI these days.

SPEAKER_01 54:16

Sure. Where can people find you online? Where should they look for you?

SPEAKER_00 54:19

Uh LinkedIn's a great place. Um pretty active on it. Um so Suchit Bachali, if you look me up on LinkedIn, um happy to engage with uh any of you and would love to stay in touch.

SPEAKER_01 54:32

One uh closing piece of advice you have for my daughters, what would you like to tell them?

SPEAKER_00 54:38

Hmm. I would say again, I ghost back to this with with friends. Try and identify behavior. Just take a step back. I think friends are so I mean, we I was blessed, I had great friends, right? Um uh and and I think I I hope that they find the best friends they can, because I think those friendships will last a lifetime. And anytime they have any challenges, just to take a step back and identify behaviors. And if it feels like those cultures match and there's good behavior, like lean into those relationships and friendships. Uh what what what a great time to be 14, 15, 16. And uh, I just wish and hope for them to find the most meaningful friendships that will hold the test of time.

SPEAKER_01 55:37

Well said.

SPEAKER_00 55:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 55:38

Thank you very much. The best thing you can do to help us get the word out is like, comment, and subscribe. Talk to us. If you have specific questions, we'd love to respond. Thank you for watching this episode of the Hidden Foundations podcast.