Wingflation in Washington

Bryson Akins, Henry Brown, and Joshua Valdez hop on another episode to discuss the recent sing-and-trade that brought back Khris Middleton to the DMV. 

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Welcome back to another episode of All Wizards Talk, a podcast on the All Sports Talk Network. I'm one of your co-hosts, Bryce Snake, is joined alongside as always by Henry J. Brown and Josh Valdez. We had another trade happen. It was kind of something that no one was really expecting. Bringing back a familiar face, even though it's not Marvin Bagley, who we a lot of people were hoping was coming back. But it might be the Marvin Bagley replacement. It might be not big times of position, but the guy that just keeps finding his way back to the Wizards somehow. And the Wizards did a sign-in trade for Chris Middleton. They traded him into the Dallas Mavericks of the trade deadline last year for Anthony Davis, another blockbuster move that no one really saw coming. And we were talking about it beforehand. It's really complicated how it went down because it's a six-team trade. I know Josh, you had some of the details regarding that, what all was actually sent out to who and where.

SPEAKER_02 0:54

Yeah, so um this is it's I was just writing about it. It's pretty, it's pretty wacky. So um the Wizards sent out uh the Angelo Russell to the Grizzlies. Um, he had accepted his six million dollar player option, but we all knew he was not gonna report to the team. He never reported. Uh and the person who broke that was actually Henry Brown, who that he was never gonna be. Yeah, we all get to be the insider for a moment here today. How cool is that because he because once upon a time, a few months ago, uh the man himself, Will Dawkins, general manager of the Wizards, said, Henry, that was a good question. Uh, he won't be reporting for X, Y, and Z. Um, and so he never did. He was true to his word. Everyone knows. No, yeah. I mean, it was never like it made sense.

SPEAKER_00 1:40

Did he even step foot in the city?

SPEAKER_02 1:43

Nothing.

SPEAKER_01 1:44

I should have put a closer watch that's two's Instagram stories.

SPEAKER_02 1:46

I wish I didn't know. Only thing I saw was that he was hanging out with uh Jake Paul this offseason. That was all but yeah, obviously neither side had really interest there. Um so D'Angelo goes to the Grizzlies, um, and Middleton comes back to DC on a sign and trade. Uh it's a three-year deal just above 17 million, but only the first year is guaranteed. So it's really only for this season. Yeah. Uh the second year is partially guaranteed, third year is not guaranteed at all, according to our boy, our man Josh Robbins from the Athletic. Um, yeah, and then the Wizards also sent uh to the Mavs a um future second round pick and a future second round pick swap, uh, both in the 2030s, I believe. Uh the pick. And D'Lo went to Memphis, right? Yeah, D Lo wants D'Lo went to Memphis, yes.

SPEAKER_01 2:37

Following in Marvin Bagley's footsteps, by the way. Another time the Wizards send Memphis. Uh yeah, that this is this is a very similar to the Bagley lore.

SPEAKER_00 2:47

It was just interesting seeing Middleton be the guy that they go out and acquire to bring back to the team because it's not like they need another wing or forward. It's not like that is the position group they are dying to get. But it's also such a low-risk trade where it's like there's nothing to not like about it. We were talking about it before we came on here. It's like it's one of these trades where it's like, we like it because what is there to dislike about getting Chris Middleton off for D'Angelo Russell, who was never going to play for you, and two second round picks.

SPEAKER_02 3:17

Sorry, so uh the Wizards, uh again, according to Josh Robbins, um, they're sending a 2029 Lakers second rounder to Memphis, um, and then their own 2033 second rounder, but then they're also receiving a 2033 second rounder from Dallas. So they're getting they actually got a pick too.

SPEAKER_00 3:37

Yeah, they got a pick back. So they sent a basically they sent a second round pick into Angelo Russell, a guy that was ever playing for Chris Middleton. Um, so like that that's a good deal. We we take that. And like we mentioned, do is there a need for Chris Middleton on the squad? No. No. Alright. Does it help to have some more depth in case injuries happen because injuries are always bound to happen? Yeah. Is he a guy that's gonna give you 20 minutes tonight off the bench? No. But he's there. It's it's still valuable to have him there as a veteran presence. He's already, you know, he knows the organization very well. He has a championship as a second option, by the way, to where that can actually provide valuable insight. If this team is trying to, you know, have their end goal be win the championship, which it should be. We hope it is. We hope that's what they're planning for. So it's valuable to have a guy like that just around and in the locker room, anyways, to help out with the young guys be like, hey, like, especially like let's say they make the playoffs, for example. Having a guy like Middleton to kind of help coach him around, who's been there a million times, basically be like, hey, this is what the mindset you gotta be in, this is how you get prepared for it, stuff like that. It helps to have guys like that around on the team, especially for a team that's so young.

SPEAKER_01 4:50

Yeah, I they're they're very young. However, they are sort of accumulating some of these more of these veterans as the offseason goes on. And this isn't gonna be anywhere near the list of most, you know, enticing storylines as the season approaches. I am, however, extremely curious to see how he fits into the rotation because last year he started out as like a general starter. He actually checked that. He started every single game he he stepped foot in as a wizard, all 34 games he started. Granted, his minutes were closer to like, you know, 24, barely above 20. They realized as it went, you probably can't tax this guy with regular minutes if you want him to have his legs in his jump shot. And I'm really wondering how they're gonna fit him in, considering the wingflation that they already have and how sort of full the rotation was getting to look with the last couple days of moves.

SPEAKER_02 5:31

The wingflation, maybe. I like that.

SPEAKER_01 5:34

Yeah, like I I really play different roles, but if you're looking at Keyshawn, Champagny, Balal, Will Riley, and Um AJ, then and and you know, Middleton's more forwardy than most of those guys besides Middleton. I'm really wondering how those minutes shake out. Someone's gonna get stuck at the at the bottom of this log jam, and they're probably gonna have to figure it out fast. I assume we're gonna, they're gonna play like at least 12 deep the first couple games, I'm gonna assume, because there's just a lot of questions to figure out.

SPEAKER_00 6:06

They might even go 13 deep just to figure out stuff.

SPEAKER_01 6:08

And that's part of what's so good about this rotation is the wins are proving they're not in the business of wasting any roster spots. These things really are at a premium. And, you know, our our Josh over there talked a few days ago about potentially buying out D Lo, and now there's no need. Like they show that they can not only get out of this jam without having to spend any extra money, but they can get a guy who actually does want to play and actually, you know, does still, you know, fill sort of some self-creative scoring need off the bench, assuming they wanna they want to delve deep into that again.

SPEAKER_02 6:36

So by the way, uh so according to uh Bobby Marks from ESPN, um so he said they likely are using the $13.4 million Kelly Olympic trade exception that was going to expire on the 9th. So uh, you know, that because basically what happened was uh the salaries from Ayton and uh Middleton add up to just about that amount, 8.1 and 5.3. So uh from this they can basically create more uh um exceptions because you know you basically can use uh exception at least for like one or you have like a one-year deadline to get and to use an exception every time you get it. So now you know uh they can create new ones from this because they're using that one.

SPEAKER_01 7:24

So do we know which Keller Linux trade that's that's stemming from? Because he was like dealt twice and really shortly.

SPEAKER_02 7:29

Yeah, so um well, I actually good good question. Let me let me let me make sure. But yeah, but basically last year, last offseason, they got him from the Spurs and then traded him again. So that that was what came from that.

SPEAKER_01 7:42

But basically the second one because he was like the biggest outgoing asset the second time around when he was rerouted to San Antonio. That's the thing, is that you you get these exceptions when you send out more money than you get back. Yeah, so that's probably what it is. Because all they got back was CJ. Well, no, no. From the second one, no. The second one, yeah. They got back Branham and Blake Wesley.

SPEAKER_00 8:04

Yes, I think I don't know. I don't have it in front of me.

SPEAKER_01 8:08

Yeah, and well, while while while Josh is Josh is stalling trying to trying to find some answers. Um I just want to I know that there's more bigger wizards questions to talk about, but I just I have to talk about the Luca trade for a second here because the league moved so fast. Every single member of the Anthony Davis trade between the Mavs and the Wizards is now gone from the team they were traded from, except for Anthony Davis. If you think about it, everyone, which now includes uh Jaden Hardy, who was just traded for Aiden to Los Angeles, D Lo, who's now off to Memphis, and Dante Ecton, who never never made it off the train here, yeah, are all not on the Wizards. And if you look at Dallas's return, Chris Middleton is now back in DC. Um, Malachi Branham, as we said, I just checked, it's actually on the Cavaliers Summer League roster. I had no idea. AJ Johnson just traded as a part of this deal. Um, I think he's also going to Memphis.

SPEAKER_00 9:00

To Memphis because that's how they get Santiago Dominic. The league, the league moves so fast. No, it is it is wild. Like we mentioned, it's a trade where it's like it wasn't really necessary, but it's not a bad trade. It like it's it's a good idea to bring him in for the veteran presence. It's not really someone you need, but I mean, shoot, if you can turn D'Angelo Russell in a second, you know, into Chris Middleton, you do that deal. You you do that, especially for a guy that just didn't want to be in DC anyways, to begin with. So like it just it makes sense to do that trade every single time. And something else, they still have a roster spot with 11 million in space before they hit the luxury tax.

SPEAKER_01 9:39

Uh yeah, Bryson, I wanted to ask you about that because in your trade grade that you put on Wizards on SI's website, um, you said that you still believe that they could be in the mix for Russ.

SPEAKER_00 9:49

It just it's the fact that A, you need a backup point guard right now. And it's not saying he is the backup point guard. It's not saying he is the answer, he is the solution. Not saying that whatsoever because you need to give Will Riley a shot to see if he can actually run a point guard role at his size. You need to see if he's able to do that. Maybe Bub Carrington improved as a playmaker and he can run the point guard position. You need to see if they can actually do that, especially if you want to be a team that's considered serious. You need a backup playmaker. You need a backup guy that can make these extra passes here.

SPEAKER_01 10:20

And I want to ask, yeah. So if I can, if I can also ask you, Josh, I want to hear from both of you. Do you really want now that Middleton could be in the mix, probably will be in the mix, to play real minutes? He's told us before, because we we've alluded to, you know, how do you how have you approached your veteran leadership status? He's he's he's pushed back on us before and said, I'm here to play. Like I'm not here to just be the fuzzy old guy. Do you guys welcome, if there's you know, another point guard potentially on the table to fill the last roster spot, do you guys welcome one more guy who also could fill minutes, or would you rather have that kind of role player like an Anthony Gill, who'd rather sit on the bench and make his off-court contributions?

SPEAKER_02 10:55

Sorry, before I answer that, I just want to circle back to the money again one more time. Um, so yeah, so I said it wrong before. So you create the uh exception when you uh trade a player for a uh cheaper player. So basically, when you're like adding money. Um so so yeah, so they based on so on July, last July 2025, they got uh Kelly Olenek from the uh Pells in the CJ McCollum trade with pool. They got and then and then you're right, Henry. They traded uh Kelly to the Spurs for Branham and um Blake Wesley. They didn't keep Wesley, but they traded Branham in the Anthony Davis trade. So it all it all connects, man. It's crazy. Um, but yeah, so they uh this like whole Kelly Olinick trade exception. Um basically they they can use that and then create more exceptions because they didn't the the salary they sent out today, or like with this and the Ayton deal, it's not gonna like count. You know what I mean? Like basically they it's like they didn't have to, you know. So now like they can do another move where they're not like adding more salary, basically. Yeah, they're not hugged up against any of the aprons right now. That helps. Yeah, so yeah, hopefully that makes sense. It's it's crazy, man.

SPEAKER_01 12:09

But it's it's a lot. I I do some reading beforehand because I was like, I gotta make sure I understand the trade exceptions before I before I before I go on here.

SPEAKER_02 12:16

Yeah, I know I know it's a lot, but yeah, basically they can create more exceptions from this because they would just use this before it expired, you know what I mean? And now they can use use more in the future, likely.

SPEAKER_00 12:26

But um, so just just to confirm that the since they trade D'Angelo Russell, that turns into a trade exception now, or no? Just so I'm all cut up.

SPEAKER_02 12:36

So basically, like what what Bobby Marks was saying, like the the whole um so it's Aiton and uh Middleton salaries add up to the the Kelly salary. Um yeah, so and then now um the outgoing guys of uh Hardy and D Lo because because because because because Jane uh Hardy was in the the Ayton trade, so those two outgoings will sort of like add up to a new one, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_00 13:01

So 12 million, yep.

SPEAKER_02 13:02

Yeah, yeah. So Hardy and and D Lo were basically yeah, making six each, so the new one will be about 12, like a little bit less than the Kelly's was like 13.4, but it's the same thing.

SPEAKER_01 13:15

What happened? Are we gonna call it the D Lo trade exception or the Hardy trade exception? Or is it the Anthony Davis trade exception because he created all this?

SPEAKER_02 13:21

Yeah, it's it it all stems from AD, really. That's mostly what it is. Um but yeah, um, so yeah, it's overall good, good, good cap work by the whiz. I'm no I'm I'm no I'm no I'm no capitalist, but you know, from what I can tell, it's it's cool.

SPEAKER_00 13:37

It's just good that they did all this, and there's still, like we mentioned, that one roster spot left with 11 million in space before having to hit those tax penalties. And I I just don't think Ted wants to pay the tax this season, nor should he, because this isn't the season where it's like, yeah, we're trying to make the finals or Eastern Conference finals. This is the season that is like, let's get to the playoffs and get this experience. If we can do that without having to go into luxury tax, you do that, you take that because that is just another year as an owner where it's like, yeah, I can save a little bit more money, save up a bit, and then boom, once we're ready to pay the tax, I can just use what I say from this, put it into those tax penalties. Because they're yeah, they still won't hit the first apron probably for another two seasons.

SPEAKER_02 14:22

Yeah, so that's so that's the thing about this, is that it's just it's it's good, it's good moves in the margins because whenever you can like um absorb salary without sending stuff out, but you're not gonna hit some like apron penalty for that. That's really good, you know. Yeah, um, I mean they're not they're not close to the first apron, but they are a little bit close to the tax, like you said. So uh but so it still applies in this case, you know. You just you want to be above uh I mean you want to be like under as many of these like you know new uh CBA thresholds as possible.

SPEAKER_00 14:51

And we're gonna have a new C BA in two seasons as well, right? And so a lot of these penalties could go away.

SPEAKER_02 14:58

Yeah, I hope I hope I was gonna say I hope the next CBA is like the second apron's different or something because yeah, I think it will be.

SPEAKER_00 15:04

Everyone needs to be.

SPEAKER_02 15:05

Nobody really likes it, you know? Like it's kind of dumb.

SPEAKER_00 15:07

No one likes it. So yeah, and so I just want to go back to oh, go ahead, Josh. Go ahead.

SPEAKER_02 15:12

No, I was gonna say I I I understand like that the NBA's had eight different champions in eight years. That's like that's cute, I guess, but you know, I I think they're like it's like a little too aggressive, you know, to to make it. Yeah, that's that's fair.

SPEAKER_01 15:22

Let it stop while Josh's Knicks are on top.

SPEAKER_00 15:25

It just it just ruins scene building. It gets really hard because it's supposed to be there to help, you know, keep your homegrown players. Even then, it still gets hard because like we're seeing with you know the Jazz, for example, they knew they were gonna have some second apron stuff to take care of in the future, and they decided it's like we know Kessler wants this much, but we're not willing to pay him this much because we also have you know JJJ, we have Hori still, Darren Peterson's gonna need his extension, Keontae George is about to be extension eligible, and he might command the same amount as Kessler. So it's it's stuff like that where it's like even for trying to keep homegrown players, it's extremely hard. The Thunder are gonna have that problem as well, with Casey Wallace with how much he's broken out over there, where he's gonna command 30 to 35 million in free agency, and the Thunder, if they want to do that, they've got to move off with some players. And so it just gets harder to build teams, even if you are uh, you know, growing them from the draft. Um, but I just want to circle back to what you're asking, Henry, if you don't mind repeating that.

SPEAKER_01 16:23

No, you're good, you're good, you're good. We I think we're caught up on updates unless uh Bobby or Shams hits us up with anything else. Uh our our phones are open. But I was asking Bryson, Josh, that um, you know, if we're talking about Russ, we're talking about another point guard, someone else to eat up that final mid-level exception they still have open, the final 11 million before they hit the cap or the tax. Um, would you rather have that other guy, or do you want some kind of role players happier to sit on the bench and not further disrupt how many other players need minutes? Because right now you're looking at a lot of guys who are expecting to play.

SPEAKER_02 16:57

Yeah, I I've still before, like I've said before, I'm not like I don't think it's uh crucial that they sign a backup guard. Um, you know, I like you know, I I know uh Chris isn't gonna like take you know important minutes from young guys, but I just think there's there's enough there's enough cooks to be honest. Like if they sign Russ, I understand. Um if they sign like Gabe Vincent, I just I don't think it's gonna be that beneficial, honestly.

SPEAKER_01 17:25

Um I don't think either is just let I say let like the the wings and the forwards just get a bit more touches because now again, Middleton is someone else who isn't a point guard, but he likes having the ball. So you might as well just spread the love a bit when TM's not around.

SPEAKER_00 17:36

I also want to add in. I also want to add in if you don't bring in another guard, it forces a guy like Bub Carrington to evolve as a playmaker. It forces him to be like, hey, you have to improve upon this, or else we will be looking for a replacement. Which I know that sounds like really harsh, but that is the one thing this team is missing for the future. Yeah, it's true. This this is the one thing this team is missing for the future is a backup, you know, point guard, a guy that can help facilitate the offense. And whether that be Will Riley at 6'10, if he can handle the point guard ability and you know, position, if he can actually handle that off the bench, I think he has potential to. Or whether that be Bub Carrington, who's a better shooter, which I would rather, you know, want that out of my point guard off the bench for him to be a really good shooter, because the stats show it. We can't deny it because we have seen it with our own eyes, and the stats do show it. Bub Carrington is a fantastic three-point shooter. He is. He shot he shot 41% from three this past season, which is absurd. On, I think, five attempts a game.

SPEAKER_02 18:35

Especially for someone in their second season.

SPEAKER_00 18:37

Yeah, like that is that's great to see. We just need him to be a better playmaker. We need him to, you know, like I'm fine with him getting five assists. That like I can live with that if you just don't get two and a half turnovers per game. Let me the turnovers. And get to the rim. Yeah, it's just it's these little things where they they the team desperately needs him to approve upon that, or else it's like, hey, if you can't do this, we will find someone that can't. It's harsh, but that's just how the NBA works. It's you know, you're trying to put out the best possible team out there, and if Bob Carrington can't be your point guard, you've got to find someone else that can't. Unfortunately. I love that.

SPEAKER_01 19:12

You're right. Especially with like rookie sanctions coming for the third year, guys. Um, it's really making me think about a few other past Wizards move moves. Um, like we talked about Watkins, they got sort of a steal getting him on another two-way deal after he proved he could be an NBA player, like even right now. And now it makes more sense that's another guy that you don't really have to throw into the mix of uh the forwards and the wings who want minutes. Now he you know he works his way up. Now there's more guys from to contend with when he does make it up. And it's really making me wonder um who's pushed towards the outskirts of the rotation. And I'm starting to think about Riley here because like there's a chance that he starts a little deep in the depth chart. Would you guys be shocked if he had to like start as like the 12th man or maybe I don't know, G League touches to begin the very start of the season? He's not he's not going to the G man that it can't.

SPEAKER_00 19:58

Yeah, there's no way he goes to the G in the second. I I got it. I I understood it last season. I understood it as a rookie, especially when you had Cam Whitmore who when he was healthy, he was looking like he was improving, getting a little bit more used to it, looking like a guy that's like, yeah, we can throw him in as like the ninth man, the rotation. And then he gets injured, and all of a sudden you have Will Riley take these minutes and you're like, oh, Will Riley looks legit. This looks like a guy we can actually play when it matters here. Let's keep on developing a little bit. I would be surprised if he's the 12th man. I would I would be really surprised if he's coming that low off the bench. He should be in the top ten of the rotation, in my opinion. I I think he has the goods, like I mentioned, he has the potential to pretty much be the point for the you know bench unit running the offense. I think he has that playmaking ability and passing ability for his size. I understand it's gonna look a little weird with someone that large, that tall, being out there running the point. But if he can do it, let him let him run it. Why not?

SPEAKER_02 21:02

Yeah, I think you know, the the whole the whole thing with not having a pure backup point is that you can try things out. Last year they tried it with Bub in the beginning, it didn't work out that well. But I think if Bub can play the one and two and and mix up with that as a combo, you know, you you you know, same thing with with Riley, he could be a wing or you know, run some point as well. Um I I I just think I should think they submit they should try everything, mix everything up. I understand they're trying to win this season, that's fine.

SPEAKER_00 21:27

But but you have 30 games at the beginning of the season to try to see what's gonna work.

SPEAKER_02 21:31

And also it's like, you know, the young guys that have the goods, like they'll help you win anyway, right? Yeah, that's the whole idea.

SPEAKER_01 21:36

I agree. No, yeah, first take style prep aside. I also think Will Riley should be getting regular minutes. Um real talk, though, the guy who I have seen in my brief looks online, um, and we mentioned this before we went on. Some people were really hoping someone like Whitmore would be in this deal, just for our sake and his, just someone who also really wants minutes in searching of a redemption story. He's looking to score two, and he is a guy. Who real talk, um, you really wonder how far he is in the depth chart, even after Jaden Hardy's department.

SPEAKER_00 22:05

See, I I did not want them to include Whitmore in the deal because he was part of the same draft class as uh Balal. He's extension eligible right now. And so that's the thing where I'm like, I it doesn't really make a lot of sense to extend him right now. It doesn't because, you know, he unfortunately had that blood clot that put him out. We can't do anything about that. All right, really unfortunate injury to happen to him. Um, but beforehand, he was looking pretty good. I was liking what I was seeing from him. I know the defense is a struggle, but it's the fact that, you know, at the start of the season where it looked like he could care less about playing defense to eventually, you know, 15th game in, it looks like okay, Whitmore's actually putting a little bit more effort on the defensive end, and you can see, or like he's at least putting it towards it. He's actually trying to be better on defense instead of just being a body out there. And I really appreciate that. We know the offensive, you know, game of his is there. Improve upon the three-point shot a little bit, and he will be a great offensive player. It's just that defense is the question mark where it's one of those things I look at and it's like, man, I might want to keep, you know, keep Whitmore around because he is this kind of like Joker. He's this Joker card out there where it's like you don't really know what you're going to get with him. And I just want to see another year of him. I just want to see another year to see in a season of trying to win basketball games, can he actually be a guy in this rotation?

SPEAKER_02 23:28

I I agree because honestly, like I I'm I'm a huge believer in Whitmore. Like, I know he's not like perfect or anything, but like he's but talent and athleticism, it's like he's he's up there with like with the top dudes. Just if you just like pure talent going to the rim, it's like high high level stuff, like super explosive. He can truly play above the rim, you know, which not everyone does in today's league.

SPEAKER_00 23:54

I I am so high on him, I think he has starter potential. Like he could be a starter for a team.

SPEAKER_02 23:59

I think if he yeah, if he actually works out, and which he still very well could, you know, he's still very young. Um, like he could be a serious piece on a good team. Um, the the issue with the wizards is that they have like a little bit too many pieces.

SPEAKER_00 24:13

Um like when like Henry mentioned, wingflation.

SPEAKER_02 24:16

Right. So I do think, you know, I don't think he's like a long-term guy with the Wizards, most likely, but you could at least play him and you know, use him in a deal or something or get some value. Like, right, don't just dump him in a in a Middleton signing trade, like you could actually use him for something that you're gonna like use moving forward, you know.

SPEAKER_01 24:35

He deserves a chance. Yeah, he had it tough last season, and just like he deserves that shot to prove himself and shake off some of the Houston stink after he didn't really work out with the Rockets. Um, the coaching staff also, I think, deserves a chance to really keep working with him because as Brightson mentioned, you saw his defensive focus sort of shift. I think his his his offensive focus has also needed sort of like I don't know, like like an overhaul.

SPEAKER_00 25:02

Him and Keith used to butt heads all the time at the beginning of the season. First five games, you would see Keith kind of get onto him the most. And a lot of it was for you know defensive missed laps. That's what it was. All right, and you you would you would notice that a little bit after they're really like big kind of you know, you know, jawing at each other, you that is when you notice Whitmore start to buy in a little bit more, and I think that's a good sign from Keith to kind of do that because uh just coming from you know someone that played collegiate sports now. Not I wasn't very good, but was wasn't very good at it, let me be clear. But anytime I had a coach yell at me, I knew it was because they actually cared and they saw something where it's like, oh, we we just want more from you, we know you you have more. If I had a coach, I was just kind of like meh, whatever. Like, that's not gonna get me motivated to get better. That doesn't show me that you have faith in me. And so I think that's a good thing from that, you know, the coaching staff actually does believe in Whitmore, the fact that they get onto him so much when he was playing.

SPEAKER_02 26:03

Yeah, I mean, there's a reason they traded for him, you know what I mean? Like they believed something, yeah. They didn't have to do it, yeah. They didn't have to do it at all. It wasn't like some cat move either. It was like a serious like they're interested in him. He was the centerpiece of that trade, right? So um, you know, I and I I think that um again, he showed a lot of flashes last season. It was it was up and down. Um, you know, and and like you said, Bryson, you know, like like Keith would get on him. But I remember after um, I remember after like that that whole kind of drama, it was it was very much like Keith was working one-on-one with him, like they were very much locked in before he got that blood clot, you know. Yeah, um, so yeah, and I I think that could be it could be the same this season. It's gonna be in a very different context. It's not like he's gonna get a ton of minutes, probably. No, but uh, you know, there's enough games where you you can try him out off the bench and see what happens, you know. Yeah, especially considering that sort of the ego first bryson.

SPEAKER_00 27:00

I was just gonna say the good thing is too, like let's say he does work out and you sign him back, he's not gonna get anything over 10 million a year. Right. It's not like he's gonna be this guy that breaks the bank to keep him, all right. That's the thing. Yeah, like he's gonna be a cheap role player. If he does, you know, succeed and show improvement and you want to keep him around, he's gonna be cheap to retain. If you do lose him, it's like, okay, we still got a ton of wings on this roster that can slot in and fill in here. We still have O'Reilly, we still have Jameer Watkins, you know, we still have a lot of these guys out here. So it's not like it's the end of the world if he does end up locking free agency, even though he'll be a restricted free agent. And so the Wizards could just match any offer sheet gets. And like I said, I don't envision him getting anything over 10 million a year. I just I just don't, especially if he like, and that is saying like if he does come out there and show I'm a rotation player, I can give you seven points a night. That that's where I see from it. And then also, if he isn't working out, you can just train him at the trade deadline for a second or two.

SPEAKER_01 27:58

Yeah, or include him with something else. And that's the thing that he represents right now, low leverage possibilities because it's it's sort of a low-risk high reward thing. They're not depending on him to be in the rotation. And it's not like they were last year either, but he had a way straighter shot at impacting minutes last year when the minutes looked a bit more wide open. And because his luxury beforehand was he's this crazy athlete with potentially untapped potential as a composed scorer. Now they have AJ DeBonsa, so you don't really need that above-the-rim guy as much as you did. So his road to nightly minutes definitely doesn't look as clear as it did last year. Again, another advantage for the Wizards. Now you're making this guy prove it to show he's got it again.

unknown 28:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 28:37

And if he does work out, great. If not, like you know, I mentioned you mentioned either you include him in a trade for someone else as filler, or you go get a second-round pick or two and return that, you know, and just pretty much replenishes the second that you traded in this Chris Middleton deal.

SPEAKER_01 28:53

And yeah, back to back to Middleton. It was cool. We we texted about this. All three of us ended up giving it an A. Do we still feel cool about that after more details came in?

SPEAKER_02 29:02

100%. It's like, I mean, there's it's literally nothing wrong with this. Like, you know, he's not gonna take minutes from young guys. He's not gonna take important minutes.

SPEAKER_00 29:11

If you're mad at this deal, then there has to be something else going on in your life to be mad at this deal. There is no reason to be upset at the wizards making this deal, trading D'Angelo Russell. I know there's one guy out there on Twitter who had told who straight up told me they would rather have D'Angelo Russell than LeBron James right now, which is just blasphemy. That that is just blasphemy. Like, bro. Like, I I swear, like, it's someone's burner account if that is the case, if they truly believe that. Alright, and so it's like you gave up a guy that didn't even want to be here, didn't want to play for the Wizards, for and a second round pick for Chris Middleton, who willingly was like, yeah, start and trade me here. Like it's like it just it's a good trade. There's nothing to be mad about it uh about this. There's there's nothing, nothing at all.

SPEAKER_01 29:59

Your keywords willingly, because that's what sticks with me. Yes. Like that I guess that's that's like my final thought is we've heard before the wizards called people want to go to Washington.

SPEAKER_00 30:07

It's it's James.

SPEAKER_01 30:08

CJ said it during his latter days as a wizard. Um, everyone's alluded to it. We already saw Bag do this before. Guys come back, they they say they like it here, and they actually, you know, they they walk the walk. And you and you're watching Middleton, who originally when he showed up to DC, he was coming off uh just a few a few tough bucks here. The injuries are really catching up to him. And he showed up as as in exchange for Kalakuzma, and everyone's like, wow, how did Chris Middleton end up here? And now he's walking right back through the door to put contribute to his third and potentially fourth and fifth seasons with this team. It's just sort of wild to see how quickly, quickly that changed. That's the thing about this, is like he did not have to like stayed in Dallas, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 30:49

Like he could have been like, I want to play with Kyrie and Cooper Flag, whatever.

SPEAKER_00 30:52

Like there were plenty of other teams out there that could have paid him the 7 million he's making.

SPEAKER_02 30:57

Right. Like that that's pretty crazy. And honestly, I was surprised because I was like, Wow, he won't he wants to like come back. That's pretty cool. Yeah, like you know, like Henry said, it just goes to show that you know they these vets really like the organization, truly. Because it's like they he did he just there's so many other things he could have done, you know, like get take some cheap deal somewhere else or whatever, but no, he was like, I want to be he could have taken that same deal and gone to a contender because there are still contenders out there with that cap space to give them, right?

SPEAKER_00 31:24

Like there are still play like bona fide playoff teams where it's like, yeah, we'll pay you seven million to come here. Right, like and so like that's what gets me about it. And like I was saying earlier in the episode, it's like it's one of those things where it's like, is he playing immediately? No, but he's gonna fight his way to get into the rotation. Of course he is. He's that kind of you know player, he's that kind of person. Let's say, you know, let's say Bilal, Riley, and um oh Keyshawn go down with injury at the same time for some reason. Chris Middleton isn't bad to have, you know, coming off the bench. It's not like he's a horrible player, he's a good option to have off the bench in case you have injuries happen, and injuries are gonna happen, especially later in the season where it's like, look, we have our spot secured for the play in our playoffs. Doesn't matter at this rate. Let's you know rest our main guys and you know throw Chris Middleton out there for 25 minutes. It doesn't hurt to have that and still potentially win a game.

unknown 32:18

Right.

SPEAKER_01 32:19

You're replacing a guy who's happy to play with someone who wasn't on the team, if you ever look at like the bench. That's the thing.

SPEAKER_02 32:25

Like like the swap of D Lo and Chris Middleton, that's what has to be looked at here. Like that's that's it's a sign and trade, not not a signing or just a trade. Like D Lo's off the books, they don't have to pay him anymore. Nope. He didn't no you need neither side wanted that marriage.

SPEAKER_00 32:39

Create another trade exception, like you mentioned earlier.

SPEAKER_02 32:42

Create another exception, and you get a guy who actually wants to be in DC. And and who's like a good vet, right? It's like it's it's kind of like an Anthony Gill situation, but he's also like you know a bit of a better player still. So you know. With that said, Gil watch is still on. That that's still on very much so. There, there's still a spot open.

SPEAKER_00 33:00

So they yeah, and there could be another trade. We never know.

SPEAKER_02 33:04

You never know.

SPEAKER_01 33:04

You never know. That's back-to-back trades.

SPEAKER_02 33:06

But that's the thing, it's like it doesn't hurt to have AG and Middleton in the building again. Why not? That's like super vet presence right there. That's like ultra vet energy right there.

SPEAKER_00 33:16

Yeah, it doesn't it doesn't hurt to have AJ AG who wants to be there. He wants to be there, he loves the city, he loves the organization. You know, he's pretty much become a legend for the franchise already, even though the stats don't show legend, but he is, you know, beloved. All right. It doesn't it doesn't hurt to have him still here. It doesn't hurt to have him around. If that's their next move and their final move, I'm fine with that. It's already been a great offseason.

SPEAKER_01 33:40

I'm excited for Middleton. He never got to play alongside uh Trey Young during the month and a half they spent as technical teammates. And he never got to play with Anthony Davis after getting traded directly for him. So we're gonna see some fun little veteran looks this year.

SPEAKER_02 33:54

Can you imagine Middleton?

SPEAKER_01 33:55

Sorry to heck, yeah. Imagine Middleton playing with Davis, how that's gonna look. That's so funny because they got traded for you. Yeah, I can already hear the the unction songs from my TikTok edits.

SPEAKER_00 34:06

But that was a good one. That was a good one. Anything else you guys got before we call it?

SPEAKER_01 34:10

Yeah, it's an interesting little trade. Good uh another another bit of uh cat cat management. So our hats off. It's nice.

SPEAKER_02 34:16

Um well I I I did go to the Summer League minicamp today. Oh, yeah, it was it was dope. I mean, yeah, so we talked to Will Riley and Trey Johnson. Uh, very, very nice comment. I also saw uh Patrick uh Ewing in the building while hanging out. Uh that was pretty dope. Yeah, I mean it's it's dope, man. Like, I mean, that's all time great. And he's just on the coaching staff. That's pretty epic, man. I mean, you know, I I mean, I just as a fan of the NBA, how do you not like that? You know, and it's and fans online are like, oh, well, it's like, you know, like all of his coaching stints didn't go that well. It's like, okay, guys, it's human. Can't we enjoy this? Yeah, yeah, like it's he's not the head coach of the team. It's it's it's okay. Like, you know, he's just consistent.

SPEAKER_00 34:58

Like, that's all it is.

SPEAKER_02 34:59

He's a helpful guy in the area, right? Um, you know, so that was dope. But yeah, uh, Will basically said that he thinks AJ is very smart. Uh, he he understands defensive coverages already really well, which is something that he that he said that like it was harder for him, you know, in the beginning to understand that, but AJ, it's like he already gets it. So that's interesting because you know, AJ's defense is a is a point of uh nerves, you know, for fans. So uh, you know, I'm definitely excited to see how he defends in the summer league, uh, which will start for the Wizards on Thursday against the Jazz.

SPEAKER_01 35:31

Yeah, I was gonna say next time you hear from us, Brest and I will be in Vegas sharing one bed, one pillow, no one toilet.

SPEAKER_00 35:39

I know, I know that sounds amazing, Henry, but no, we got two bugs. We can push them together if you want. If you really want to cuddle, we can push them. Please, like little mice in a shoebox. We can we can be like sardines.

SPEAKER_01 35:51

Oh, that sounds so sweet. That's cute. All right, yeah, we'll live stream from the hotel pool, all right? Oh my goodness.

SPEAKER_00 35:58

I don't think people have to.

SPEAKER_02 35:59

And then um, yes, and then Trey said that he wants to work on his defense and physicality and all that on on ball pressure. Which he's gonna get that in that first game in Summer League.

SPEAKER_00 36:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 36:15

But well, that's the thing. Like, if if Trey becomes like a you know, at least a average or solid defender, and and he still has that crazy jumper, that's that's good stuff. That's a good player. That is we'll take that. Uh but yeah, that was that was pretty much the main the main deal with that. I mean, and it it's it's also just uh it's gonna be cool to see you know Trey and Will play with AJ in summer league. That's yeah.

SPEAKER_00 36:39

I'm I'm I really want to see if they can connect a few times, you know, like as a cutter. I I really wanna I really want to see that. Because I do think it's an electric summer league roster that they can get. The electric summer league starting five of Will Riley, Trey Johnson, Jameer, AJ, and Juju. That's electric.

SPEAKER_03 37:00

That's funny.

SPEAKER_00 37:01

That is that is electric. That is a fun lineup with Felix off the bench and long of Kodari. That is fun.

SPEAKER_01 37:08

That's a lot of that's a lot of board getters, too.

SPEAKER_00 37:11

Oh, yeah. I also want to like have my end note be is I am really interested interested to see what Julian Reese does in summer league. Because I believe. I I have this weird like inkling in my body where it's like I believe in him. I I want to see him work out. I do. And so I'm really gonna have a lot of focus on him to see how he does against, you know, and like you know, against other, you know, rookies, second-year players as well to see what he can do against them.

SPEAKER_02 37:47

Yeah, I mean, you know, I think Reese is has has has the dog in him for sure. I mean, there's no doubt.

SPEAKER_00 37:52

It's the rebounding ability. I think that just really separates him from everyone else.

SPEAKER_02 37:55

Yeah, he he he just has to develop in general, you know. It's because he's obviously super raw, you know. I mean, because you know, it's like he just has to get more skills under his belt, you know, because like rebounding is kind of his main deal right now. So you know, but at a post mover too.

SPEAKER_01 38:10

Yeah, but but but very, very, very worthy two-way player, absolutely. 100%. Yeah, two-way spots seem filled right now. Akara, Reese, and Watkins. Yes. Yep.

SPEAKER_00 38:20

Yep. Uh anyone else have anything.

SPEAKER_02 38:23

Glad to be here. Will said that he wants to keep getting stronger. He's like he's never he's he's never happy with it. He always wants more. We're all in lockstep. Everyone wants the right thing.

SPEAKER_03 38:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 38:33

Uh but honestly though, it seems like the players are self-aware. That's kind of what I like. It's a good common thread. You're right. Same frame, same for AJ. He's talked about defense himself already. Right, cuz yeah, because it because AJ, AJ was telling me, like, hey, you know, I gotta get better on off-ball defense, gotta lock in. Sounds good, you know? So I'm just I'm just excited to see it all actually play out, you know. Because like as they say, you know, talk is one thing, but let's let's see the let's see the fact. But what do you got? What do you guys think is gonna happen on Thursday? How's that game gonna go?

SPEAKER_00 39:03

Oh I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 39:04

It could be fire in his belly. It kind of depends what Utah does.

SPEAKER_01 39:12

I want to see.

SPEAKER_02 39:13

DP looks nasty, man.

SPEAKER_01 39:14

Sorry to sorry. I mean, he's Utah, he even had smoke for Cam Boozer. Who Cam Boozer got picked after DP, and he was still like, yeah, I knew they were.

SPEAKER_02 39:22

But what you say he was like, yo, I'm I know I knew Cam was gonna come after me because he's number three. So I I couldn't allow. I was like, bro. Yeah, so you hear that and you're like, he's legit be ready.

SPEAKER_00 39:30

He's he's legit. I'm just curious to see what you like who Utah actually puts out there because they've already played three summer league games because of their Salt Lake City exhibition.

SPEAKER_01 39:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 39:40

And so I'm actually curious just to see who is actually gonna play for him. Because like Cody Williams is on that summer league roster. Are they gonna play Cody Williams for a fourth game to start Vegas?

SPEAKER_01 39:49

I want to see if uh AJ, how much defense AJ plays on DP. Because we saw one outing in college. AJ started on him.

SPEAKER_00 39:56

I just know that gym is gonna be packed, man.

SPEAKER_01 39:58

Yeah, we gotta get good seats.

SPEAKER_00 40:00

Yeah, that gym's gonna be packed. But that's all I got, guys.

unknown 40:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 40:06

I I guess next up will be our live summer late episode there. Looking forward to it. Bye.

SPEAKER_00 40:12

All right. Well, thank you guys for listening, tuning in as always, and we'll see see you guys in the next one. Peace.