GOLDA Girls

Temple Dues and Hunky Jews with Noam Ash

• GOLDA Media • Episode 7

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GOLDA founder Stephanie Butnick, journalist Gabby Deutch, novelist Esther Chehebar, and Rabbi Diana Fersko break down two hot topics: the rising cost of Jewish life in America, and Sacha Baron Cohen and Brett Goldstein’s unlikely turn as the summer’s leading men—and what it means when our funny guys are also the hunks. 

Our guest is Noam Ash, the screenwriter and star of Bookends, which premiered this week in New York City and is heading to film festivals across the country. He tells us about working alongside Oscar winner F. Murray Abraham and The Marvelous Mrs. Maisel’s Caroline Aaron— who play the grandparents Noam’s character moves in with after a breakup—and what he learned while workshopping his film with the Jewish Writers Institute (applications are open for their Digital Storyteller’s Lab and Screenwriters Lab).

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GOLDA Girls is presented by Nu Reads, a new Jewish book subscription series curated by the Jewish Book Council that brings remarkable literature straight to your door. Use code NuGolda at checkout for 15% off your subscription. Visit NuReads.org to get started today.

This episode is also sponsored by: 

  • Joyva, a fourth generation family business that crafts tahini, halvah and confections in Brooklyn, NY. Get your deliciousness today.

GOLDA is a Jewish lifestyle destination built around one idea: making Jewish life bright, beautiful, and full of meaning. Subscribe to our newsletter at www.goldaguide.com and follow GOLDA on Instagram at @goldaguide.

Sign up for Diana’s snail mail newsletter Modern Jewess here, and Gabby’s Substack here. Get Esther’s novel Sisters of Fortune here and Stephanie’s book, The Newish Jewish Encyclopedia, here.

GOLDA Girls is a production of GOLDA Media. Our executive producer is Ariel Shapiro. We’re edited by POLDHU. 

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Intro

SPEAKER_04

Before we get to today's show, I want to tell you about our presenting sponsor. New Reads is a Jewish book subscription series that brings remarkable literature straight to your door. I'm still thinking about Porcupines, the latest pick from debut author Fren for Brisky. Check out her interview in the Golden Girls feed. I can't wait to see what's arriving in my next New Reads box. It's all curated by our friends at the Jewish Book Council. With New Reads, you're not just getting books, you get exclusive access to experiences with authors and a community built on a shared passion for Jewish storytelling. New Reads is offering Golda Girls listeners 15% off their subscription. Just use the code NewGolda at checkout. Visit Newreads.org, that's n-u-re-a-d-s.org to get started today. Welcome to Golda Girls, the podcast for Jewish women with a lot to say. I'm Stephanie Butnick, the founder of the Jewish lifestyle newsletter Golda, and I'm joined by my three fabulous co-hosts, novelist Esther Shahebar. Hi, Steph. Hi, everybody. You didn't think you were going first there. I saw you lean back, you got relaxed.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I usually go last, but happy to go first. You know, it's on my toes.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, changing things up. Uh Rabbi Diana First Go. Rise and shine, listen to Golda Girls. And journalist Gabby Deutsch. Hello, welcome to June, everyone. Welcome to June. Uh today's guest is Noam Ash, who wrote the film Bookends, which just had its New York premiere and is screening at film festivals around the country. So each week on Golda Girls, we start the show by talking about the things we can't stop thinking about. Then we answer a listener question, and then we end on a sweet note with good for the Jews. But but before we get to all that, so let's check in on the Golden Gals. Diana, I got something in my mailbox that came from you. I do a newsletter online. You actually do a sort of an old school newsletter about it's called Modern Jewess. And it's it's my favorite thing that arrives in my mail, my actual mailbox. Tell us about that.

SPEAKER_02

Sure. About a year ago, um my colleague Rabbi Karen Pearlman and I decided to start a newsletter. As you said, it's called Modern Jewess, and it's seven pages, one for every day of the week. And it's meant to be slow, take a day, read a page, and it's a combination of um sort of goodies inside. It's essays, it's poems, it's Persian rice recipes, it's wisdom from you know, Jewish sages. You've written in it. Um, we've had some incredible authors featured, and we use it to talk about what Jewish life is like for women in an October 8th world. Um, as I said, we started like with 180 women last year that we just figured like let's mail it to and see what happened. And it's grown completely organically over time, and um, we're approaching a thousand women strong. So it's pretty cool. That's amazing.

SPEAKER_03

Masletev, Diana. I am one of those women. I have not yet checked my mail, but now I will be excited to do so. You've got almost a thousand women reading this, or perhaps also some men, but are you stuffing all of the envelopes? Okay.

SPEAKER_02

In the beginning, we did. We were like, oh, it's just seven pieces of paper back to front. We can fold them, we can stuff them. And, you know, I employed like every family member to do it. I had like a team of teenagers in my apartment just like folding and um, but now we have grown to a mailhouse. So we are grown-ups now, and um, we're grateful for the folks that help us do that.

SPEAKER_04

It's funny because so the the envelope arrives in in our mailbox. We brought it upstairs in the elevator, and Edith was holding it. It's very into the mail, um, and she was looking at it, and it's it says on it, you know, she she'll sort it. She'll be like, Oh, mommy, this one's for you. And I and she said, What does it say? And I said, It says modern Jewess. And I sort of was like, is it time for my five-year-old to understand the phrase Jewess? Like, I think maybe it is. Absolutely. I love a Jewess. It's like a lady Jew.

SPEAKER_02

First of all, it combines with our conversation last week about hair. Like a Jewess to me is some like glorious woman. Maybe her hair is flowing, like she's powerful, she's sort of royal, uh, maybe a little mysterious. Definitely has a lot to say. And like, we're here to to welcome every Jewess. It's it's exciting. Wait, and I forgot to say one thing, which is one of the most exciting things about modern Jewess is that it allows me to interact with incredible people. For example, it's how I met Esther.

SPEAKER_01

What? I was gonna point that out. That's that wait, did we meet at the dinner beforehand?

SPEAKER_02

Right. We met at a dinner and she told me about her book. And I was like, Oh, I've heard of your book. So I then got the book, read the book, obviously loved Um Sisters of Fortune. It's on my, I can see it from where I'm sitting right now on my bookshelf. And I like gently reached out to Esther and I was like, hi, I have a snail mail, like newsletter. Would you like do me the honor of talking to me? And then when I talked to her, I was like, and could we be best friends and hang out all the time?

SPEAKER_01

I loved every minute of it. And I just want to also point out that the only mail I currently get that is not a bill is some sort of like Jewish publication that is that whose aim is like, let's go back to our analogs. So like I get the tablet magazine, I get Verklemt magazine, Modern Jewess. I just think that like there is something to the Jewish community hankering for like the olden days where people love the book. So I'm all for Jewish texts in my mailbox. I love it.

SPEAKER_03

It also refreshes the age-old Jewess question. Oh, yeah. I actually remember an unorthodox conversation back in the day that Stephanie did about like, is it sexist to say Jewess? Which I would say definitely not. My college, the the group chat of my college friends from Hillel is called Jewesses. There are also two gay men in it. We have an expansive definition. Yes. Just that, that one word. So I am all in for team Jewess. We should all be saying it. I think there is nothing wrong with it. That's my personal position and perhaps the official position of Golden Girls.

SPEAKER_04

So, okay, here's where I'll complicate this a bit. I think Jewish is not good. I think if someone's calling you a Jewess, it's not Jewess. It's just like Jewess is like, yes, we're taking this word back. It's one of those terms that maybe was was used negatively, but to me, it's like Jewish said that way is someone saying it in like a bad way. It sounds like it's like in, yeah, like in like der Sturmer or something.

SPEAKER_01

It sounds like you're also saying like Jew-ish.

SPEAKER_04

With a hyphen.

SPEAKER_01

Uh right.

SPEAKER_04

Right. I'm so sick of that.

SPEAKER_01

It sounds unsure, which I don't like.

SPEAKER_04

Hot takes left and right. I do have to say, like, I run an online newsletter, but I'm very pro yours because I do like, I like, I like which, I like what you're doing. But yes, still subscribe to online newsletters for sure. There's room for all. All right, let's get to

Rising Cost of Jewish Life

SPEAKER_04

the things we can't stop thinking about. Okay, so a recent Instagram post caught my eye. Um, this is from one of those accounts that just like makes a lot of charts, Jewish-themed charts, one of those niche accounts. Title of this chart is Estimated Tuition of Jewish High Schools 2026. Now it says in really tiny words that the source of this information is AI. So take with it what you will, but I do think this is significant if only for the massive amounts of discussion on Instagram that it generated. It basically lists these high schools across the country. We have Milky and Lafell, Ramaz, Solomon Schechter, uh Frisch, S-A-R. There's a the Y-axis is tuition scale. The lowest ones on the bottom are past 20,000, the up ones up at the top are closer to 60,000. So this obviously gets into this discussion that's been going on a lot about just the cost of Jewish religious education, of Jewish day schools, of things like that. There was an article in the Times of Israel this week that the orthodox middle class costs associated with, you know, keeping kosher, kids, sending your kids to Jewish school. Um, and I think this is something that's very much being discussed right now. Um, but there's so much to get into here. So I don't want to say anything more about that without opening the floor. But is there anyone I imagine this is a to hot topic for a lot of us here on this chat.

SPEAKER_01

The subject of an affordability, the skyrocketing costs of tuition is a topic and a discussion that's been like riveting my community, you know, personally for years. But we actually have an organization called uh Safa, Sephardic Education for All. It's only recently sort of like taken off and gotten its like the momentum it deserves. And the concept is basically, you know, we have multiple generations who live amongst one another, and so we send our kids to primarily like three schools. The idea is that grandparents and parents will each pay a designated fee per year, depending on how many children you have, you pay per child. And the idea is that it all goes into like this communal fund essentially that works to lower the cost of yeshiva for everybody. In order for this to work, we need a minimum of, I think the number was like 30,000 people to sign up for Cepha. Um, so there are a bunch of there's a big effort underway to sort of get the word out and mobilize the community to take part in this. And it's really important because we count people who are like part of our community, is by counting the students who attend their yeshiva. Like that's literally how we determined, okay, who is a part of the Syrian community in Brooklyn, let's say. To have these tuition costs that are essentially unaffordable seems really unfair, right? Because you're you're pushing people out. My husband and I take part in it. We pay a fee per child every single year. We get a discount on our tuition. It's been a struggle to sort of like get the majority of the community on board. I don't think it's dramatic to say that like the future of the community and if communities sort of like depend on it. And Diane, I'm curious to hear what you have to say because you're you're very much in it and you have multiple perspectives.

SPEAKER_02

The first thing is I want to broaden the conversation. Yes, day school is shockingly expensive, education is expensive, but actually a lot of things in the Jewish world are expensive. It's expensive to be Jewish, and I think a lot of the institutional world is actually tilted towards people who can afford it. And I have a problem with that. For example, and and it's I'm not blaming anyone here. I there's plenty of blame to go around. Synagogue life is quite expensive. It's, you know, a couple thousand dollars, maybe a few thousand dollars for membership. Then you got one kid, two kids, three kids in the Hebrew school. You got to pay tuition. Maybe you have to pay separate for high holidays. Obviously, they right. Like it's not the synagogue's fault. I'm running one. I understand the way budgets work. Like, it's not the Catholic Church. There's no top-down funding, it's all from the community. Our financial system is not set up to support middle class or lower class Jewry. It actually is relying on upper class donors and funders to come forward and subsidize the whole entity. I think it's like an excruciating pain point with day school, just because the nature of education, like the sort of like starting price point, is so high, but it's pervasive in the Jewish world. Um, and I know there are a lot of interventions being made. Federation is offering a subsidy for day school in lots of ways. There are different, you know, middle class synagogues like the one I run, making lots of noise, saying like this system is not sustainable for us. I think Brett Stevens made a big speech about this. The community is becoming more and more aware of the problem, but it is like nowhere near fit.

SPEAKER_04

It's also really interesting right now in this moment because I know there are a lot of people who five years ago might have said, like, no, I'm gonna send my kid to my public school wherever I am, or you know, a secular private school, but who are now like, oh, wait, maybe I actually might want to go to a Jewish day school. I might want to, you know, do sort of Jewish education. And I think that is compounding this discussion as well, right? Because now more people want this product. And, you know, the interesting thing about that Instagram chart was I actually thought it looked low. Like, I don't think those numbers were correct. And the funny thing is in the comments, people are like, what about this school? What about this school? Like, add these schools into the mix. And I think it's really, really hard if if Jewish education becomes associated with like a class thing, right? Because it's like if you want to send your kid to one of these schools, you have to have this kind of money. And I think that perpetuates all sorts of set aside harmful stereotypes, actual harmful realities in a community, as you say, Esther. You know, like that's how we keep kids connected. And I think, you know, you didn't mention camp, Diana, but I think that's a big, that's like another cost. I think it's really a way people, you know, get their kids engaged in Jewish life, particularly if they're not in Jewish day schools. And I think what you've seen a lot is people like on Instagram being like, fun Jewish day schools, fund Jewish, like, and I think there's this expectation that there's like a pot of money somewhere that should go to Jewish day schools. And I I know a little bit about the Jewish communal world. I don't know that that's even possible. Like, I'm wondering what, you know, Esther, I think that intervention you're talking about is so powerful because it's within a specific community and it's like, this is how we get our community to go to schools. I'm just I don't even know that that's possible in a broader landscape where it's not like you know the people who you're helping with those donations the way you do.

SPEAKER_01

But I think that it could go both ways. When you have a certain subset of a community, let's say subsidizing uh another subset of the community, it it brings up a lot of tensions, right? Because then you get to say, you know, this person can afford to pay full tuition, but they can afford to send their kid to camp or they can afford to go on break for a Christmas break. They can afford to go on vacation. And so it brings to the fore, you know, a lot of other uncomfortable conversations where you're sort of pouring over someone's life. If you are subsidizing someone's education, does that give you license to sort of dictate how they do spend the rest of their money? I mean, I think this is a very, very uh complicated topic. And I do think, like Diana said, it's a much broader one, right? Because it sort of, you know, magnifies this larger issue, which is being Jewish is expensive, quite literally, but then it's also the expectations that we put on ourselves as Jews, you know, a lot of times in these coastal communities and the certain lifestyles that we lead and the pressures that that we face, right?

SPEAKER_02

I do want to add a couple other things. One is that I can't say enough about the value that I've seen from these institutions, whether it's camp or whether it's day school. Part of why they're at such a high price point is because they're wonderful. And to be that wonderful costs a lot of money. So I don't want to get into the territory where we feel like they're like price gouging, you know? And the other thing is they're very much subsidizing in a lot of cases. All of those schools you listed, Steph, I'm sure are giving huge amounts of financial aid as much as they can. So it's not as if people are adversarial to each other. I think it's like a known problem and everyone's trying to solve it. And I actually think that like the philanthropic world can solve this problem, especially in light of what you're talking about. Lots of people are suddenly interested in day schools that never were before. So, like, let's get together and help.

SPEAKER_04

I'll put my cards out on the table. My daughter is leaving a Jewish preschool right now and is going into a New York City public school. There were a lot of factors that went into that decision, but it's it's something I'm thinking about, which is okay, you know, leaving a Jewish, very, you know, warm Jewish space, going into a public school. I think there's a lot of benefits there, but I'm also really cognizant of what I will now need to offer to sort of supplement that. I don't belong to a synagogue. I've always been very open about that. I dabble because I love going to different programs at different synagogues. I always make a donation where I go, but it's like these are decisions that are so complicated. And I think a lot of the time we make those decisions when kids come into play, right? It's like, oh no, I need to, I need to actually do Hebrew school. Let's figure out where we're gonna go and let's pay that bill. Uh let's pay that, you know, pay those dues. And I think that that's not uncommon, right? People who are really, really interested Jewishly are not doing day school, but are also trying to find these other ways to supplement that for not just their kids, but themselves.

SPEAKER_03

So I will weigh in as someone who did not go to Jewish day school and does not have children yet. For me, when I was when I was growing up, I went to public schools my whole life. But Stephanie, to your point about the ways that you might have to step in for your daughter when she's not immersed in the environment all the time of being at a Jewish preschool. I was incredibly lucky that I grew up in a family that cared about being Jewish and made it central to our lives. Everyone I knew growing up was Jewish for the most part in Boke. I would have people come over for Shabbat dinner, friends of mine. A lot of times they would get a little uncomfortable. They maybe hadn't said the blessings since they were having their bot mitzvah, or even perhaps in some cases, since they were a kid in preschool and felt almost like they didn't really know how to engage, like it didn't quite belong to them. It was never really taught to them in the same way that it was to me and my siblings because of my parents. So then the conversation becomes much broader about educating the community. And I think one of the reasons we've seen Chabad grow in huge ways in recent years is because they offer Judaism without any barrier to entry and a warm and welcoming environment. And people just show up, and it's not the typical Jews-based structure of a synagogue, and they just want people to connect and feel Jewish and you know, raptofil in and light Shabbat candles. And there's more to it than that, but that's I think the basics. And so, how do you there's been a lot of conversation in the Jewish world in recent years from people like Dan Senor who say, like, the solution to everything right now is for all the kids that go to Jewish day school, for all the kids that go to Jewish Shummer camp? Uh, I I agree on the Jewish Shmer Camp piece, but realistically, it's not possible and it's not going to happen. And public schools are great, and even aside for money, like not everyone wants to be in that environment. They want their kids to be somewhere more diverse, for example. So, how do you keep everyone engaged and feeling connected, even if they're not making that financial investment in the same way?

SPEAKER_01

You know, it's funny, you mentioned Jewish camp. And, you know, for me, because I send my kids to a Jewish school, a very Jewish school, I don't send them to a Jewish camp because I do crave that diversity for them. And I think it's important. Of course, they go to camp with a lot of other Jewish kids, but it's not a Jewish camp. And I think that's equally as important, even though it's, you know, it's only for two months out of the year. I think that a lot of our decisions fall on us as individuals, as parents, and there's no one way to be Jewish, but I do think that in a post-October 7th world, as Diana said, a lot of younger parents, you know, especially like in my cohort, what I'm seeing is really leaning into okay, how do we, how do we make sure that our kids are being taught how to how to live Jewish lives and reinforcing that?

SPEAKER_02

I think the most um important institution of Jewish life is the Jewish family. To Gabby's point, and if you don't believe me, you can read the book of Genesis, chapter one, chapter two, chapter three, chapter four.

SPEAKER_01

Diana, you started your point saying in the beginning earlier, and I thought you were gonna launch into Bereshi. I oh, listen, I can't help it.

SPEAKER_02

Thanks for noticing as a book recommendation. Um yes, please, please note. Um, no, but the most important institution of Jewish life is the Jewish family. It's like that's the core of the core of the core. The problem comes when there's lack of inherited tradition or lack of Jewish knowledge, lack of Jewish behaviors, like in the family, then the family is left to say, like, well, what do we do? And that's where institutions can really be helpful in saying, like, well, this is how you celebrate Shabbat. You know, these are the Jewish texts, and this is a Jewish culture. I think both in the United States are interacting with each other, but I completely agree with your point, Gabby. Like, what happens at home is the transformative factor to what happens in the future.

SPEAKER_04

So you're saying what happens at home does not stay at home. I really hope not. I love that. Let's let's get to our second topic

Sacha Baron Cohen, Brett Goldstein, and the Summer of Hunky Jews

SPEAKER_04

because this one is a little spicy. Something strange is going on. It's the summer of the sexy Jewish leading man. I don't know how I feel about it, and I need to bring this to the group. Uh, Ted Lasso's Brett Goldstein is starring as J Lo's Love Interest in this new Netflix movie, Office Romance. The newly buff Sasha Barron Cohen, uh, which is something I think we're all processing in different ways. He's starring in Ladies First alongside Rosamond Pike. I have it's, I think it's sort of like equal parts thrilling and off-putting, having these like hunks be ours, be our people, be the Jewish guys. I feel like we grew up on media that told us Jewish guys are the nerds or like the writers behind the scenes making the show happen, you know, decidingly like not the leading men. But here they are, they're on screen, they're hunky, they're hot. It's kind of freaking me out. Uh, and I'm curious, what's what's what's everyone's thoughts on on all of this?

SPEAKER_03

I do think that Sasha Baron Cohen, coming of age, if you will. Oh, well, that wasn't the point that I was going to make. I was gonna talk about Borat. I don't know that hot is the word that personally I would use, but that being our idea of him, and like he's so associated with that character, I feel like, that it's hard to associate. And that character is I mean, he's not Jewish, but he's this weird guy who looks kind of weird and speaks with a little bit of a funny accent. There's something Jewish in there. This whole Nebishy Jewish man idea that we all have. And I'll say the main example there being Adam Sandler, who recently showed up to the premiere of a movie that his wife is in wearing a bright orange sweatshirt. So he's not quite having But is that Nebushy or is that like Schlumpy? But Nebishy and Schlumpy sometimes the same thing. There's a Venn diagram, yes.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, there's a Venn diagram. The post called him the Schlub Hub, and this is actually at the premiere of Office Romance. Like this is all coming back to the same thing. Like Breckold seems a star in that movie.

SPEAKER_01

He's gone to the Oscars in basketball shorts. This is his thing.

SPEAKER_03

Schlubby chic? Power move, maybe.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, he's Schluby She. I think it's that that Jewish, the Jewish men we've seen on screen typically have it's not like they weren't hot, but I think there was like a subversiveness to it, right? It wasn't like your typical version of. Like a GQ man.

SPEAKER_04

It was like Jeff Goldblum and Independence Day or Jurassic Lap. Yeah, yeah. It was subtle.

SPEAKER_01

It was subtle. It was subtle. There was like a nervousness about their hotness to it. They weren't like very overt about it. And that was part of the appeal. You know, Sasha Barron, he wore that. I don't know if you guys remember, he wore that Leotard in Bora. Shirt. Okay. And I have a take on this. Like he's he's always been attractive, in my opinion. But I he just like he just shaved his body. He has some new muscles. He was so many muscles. So many muscles. Um, if you haven't read his profile in Men Health, I think it was from like last summer or something. Just go through that. He he he goes into detail about his his work at Regimen and his midlife crisis, which is what this is.

SPEAKER_04

I mean, yeah, I think he and Isla Fisher got divorced. He's now like something's going on. I'm literally watching.

SPEAKER_01

Getting TikTok stars.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, there's like something going on there. But it is interesting because he, you know, we talked about our own versions of like Jewish beauty last week, right? Hair is part of that. And I almost think we're doing like the inversion of that, right? Which is like these were guys who were like Jewish hot because they sort of were like Seth Cohen, they were sort of nerdy, they were this, and now Sasha Byron Cohen is literally lifting weights on Jimmy Fallon, being conventional hot. And I almost feel like is hot the new funny, like, is there something that's happening where these guys are now aspiring to broader beauty standards or broader men's attractiveness standards?

SPEAKER_03

I don't know. Is hot the new funny is a great way to put it. The other, there's a whole other class of the Seth Rogans, the Jonah Hills, who are funny and right, like they're right, the whole image of yeah, Jewish guys aren't the hot guys, but they're the funny ones. And for the right girl, like that's the right kind of thing. And is there a world where now they're just moving in into the hot with Sasha Baron Cohen? Although, as Esther would say, perhaps he's always been hot, but it is to take someone from one category to the other, yeah, it's confusing. It's a bit disconcerting. And also, I'll just add, like Sasha Baron Cohen, someone who is a proud Jew who speaks about it, who cares about anti-Semitism, and not just Jewish because he kind of looks Jewish or makes jokes and has a vaguely Jewish sense of humor. Like he seems to have a Jewish Nishama. That's hot. A Jewish Nishama and abs.

SPEAKER_04

Yep. And abs. Nishama plus abs. But what happened to his chest hair?

SPEAKER_01

He's it's it's gone.

SPEAKER_04

It's gone. He's there's he's like in leather on in Instagram with in your merch, like, where did it go? He's very shy.

SPEAKER_01

It's yeah, and like how often is he waxing or shaving? I feel like he's waxing, but I think it's also like to Gabby's point, it's no longer enough to be like funny and a little bit cute. You now have to be like strong as like a like a Jewish man, right? I feel like it's a return of the bear Jew in Inglorious Bastards, who like for those of you who don't, first of all, if you haven't seen Inglorious Bastards, then finish this podcast first and then go watch it. The Bear Jew is like this tough, like baseball wielding Nazi fighting Jew. And I feel like in the age and moment that we're currently in, I'm all for, you know, don't just go beating people up, but I'm all for like an overt display of like strength as Jews, men, women, whoever. That's my feeling on that.

SPEAKER_02

All right. Well, I have been listening and I'm trying to relate to this topic. I would just say that it's not something. When we would lose you. Well, I it's not something that's lasso or gold students. No, no, I know what that is. I know. I just I've not put a lot of thought into it. Whereas with a lot of our other topics, like they've come up a lot for me in my life. So, like, this is interesting, you know? And I think a few things, perhaps these are ways I can contribute. One, like in ancient Israel, there were like three defining markers of a Jewish man circumcision, obvious. Not eating pork, always attractive, and having a beard. I think the beard is a foundational element of like being Jewish man attractive. Maybe that's changing, but I still see it a lot. One thing I object to is like, this isn't about looks, it's about like Jewish men in general. I don't like how Jewish men are often globbed in with sort of male-focused negativity in general. The whole idea that men are bad in one way or another. Yes, of course, there are some bad Jewish men, but like mostly what I see in Jewish families are like menshy men who care so much about their partners and their children and are like dedicated to the family and being a provider and are smart. And I think those are all very attractive qualities for like somebody that you would want to be with. And I feel like defensive of Jewish men that they're just lobbed into this like anti-man energy. So you're saying not all men. Yeah, exactly. Not all men.

SPEAKER_01

It's a really good point because I think to go even further back, like let's let's like Adam evolution. We could talk about Adam, but we could also just talk about how the rise of the schlubby tech brom, the Mark Zuckerberg of the world, this idea of the muscular male specimen who was gonna like change the tire in your car or whatever, way back when um the the male who was typically attractive was like the strong one who was gonna be able to protect and provide for his family, right? And I think the the Jewish male has perhaps benefited from the the turning of that on its head with the analytical, smart, you know, male who was sort of adapting to like the new times we were in where your set the set of skills for male dominance, I'll say, have maybe shifted a little bit.

SPEAKER_03

Esther, I I regret to tell you that Mark Zuckerberg seems to have also hired a personal trainer and had a glow up.

SPEAKER_01

Those pictures are very disturbing. I I don't care. He can glow up all he wants.

SPEAKER_03

But for men wearing sweatshirts over button-downs, he's done so much. He's done changed the hood.

SPEAKER_04

But I like what you're saying, which is that the idea of like the guy who's gonna change your tire now, then it's like the guy who's gonna code something that's gonna help us, and we're almost like gone, kind of coming back from that.

SPEAKER_01

We're coming back.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04

I do think that like what we're keying into is something real, right? Which is just everything is changing or everything's evolving in this moment. Like, what is attractive? What is what does it mean to do the things that men are, you know, traditionally supposed to do? And I'm I'm thinking that the two examples I gave, Brett Goldstein and Sasha Barron Cohen, are British, are Jews in the UK. And I think that's also kind of interesting to this. Like Sasha Baron Cohen's Jewishness seems deeper because I think he's from a different place, right? He doesn't have that like American Jewishness that's sort of like jokes about pickles. Like there's sort of, it's it you it's sort of different there. And and and he seems more religiously literate. And, you know, if I think about Brett Goldstein, he had a stand-up special. Um, he's one of those guys who you saw on Ted Lasso were like, wait, his name is Brett Goldstein. He's so like buff and cute. Like he's not supposed to look like what Brett Goldstein looks like. And he has like a joke about that in his stand-up bit, which is that in in the UK, no one knows any Brett Goldsteins. And then he says, you know, I came here to America, and it turns out Brett Goldstein is the guy you hooked up with at Summer Camp. Right. Everyone knows Brett Goldstein. Yes, everyone knows Brett Goldstein, but I kind of like the idea that he's like starring against J-Lo and his name is Brett Goldstein. Like he doesn't have to, he's not that's not his name in the movie, obviously. There's just something I think valuable about that. And like even Sasha Baron Cohen on his sort of like post-divorce Nevish looks maxing is sort of what I'm terming it. Buff Sasha Barron Cohen. Can we do a good for the Jews, yes or no straw poll right here? Yes.

SPEAKER_03

I'd say yes. He's talking about being Jewish, he loves being Jewish, and he's also buffed. Great.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I'd say yes. I think he's owning it, which is the key part of all of this. Like, don't shy away from it. If you're gonna do it, you know, go big or go home. And um I'm I'm I'm here for it. Yes. I I'm here for it. Do whatever you want, it's your body. Live it up.

SPEAKER_04

Live it up. I love that. Um, I will I will represent our producer Ariel Spiro's opinion, which is that he was always attractive, and what he's done now is sort of like an abomination and a betrayal of his like shlubby self, which was his charm, right? This idea that he could embody all these characters, and now the character he's playing is like toned man, totally different. Yeah, but are we are we sure that's not also a griff in a riff in in some way?

SPEAKER_01

Right. I was gonna say, have have has anyone seen the movie?

SPEAKER_04

No, and this could all be like Joaquin Phoenix style performance art to promote a movie. Yeah. If so, it's working. It's working. We're here talking about it. So we got Schlubby Chic, Adam Sandler, we got Nebish Looks Maxing, which is like the Zuckermer Berg thing. We got a lot, we got a lot to talk about. These are important terms.

SPEAKER_01

We're very good about objectifying men. Right.

SPEAKER_04

Stay tuned.

SPEAKER_03

Stay tuned for Golden Girls and our unified theory of Jewish men. We'll come up with it someday.

SPEAKER_04

All right, stick around. I'll be back in a bit with Noam Ash, the screenwriter and star of Bookends, a new film screening all over the country. All right,

Ask GOLDA with Noam Ash

SPEAKER_04

today's guest is Noam Ash, who wrote and stars in the new film Bookends, which just had its New York premiere and is screening at film festivals around the country. Welcome, Noam.

SPEAKER_00

Thank you. I'm really excited to be here.

SPEAKER_04

So, okay, this movie is so sweet, so smart, uh, so perfect for the moment. You're, you know, you play our protagonist. He has a bad breakup with a boyfriend. Uh, we don't have to get into the details because people should watch. Um, and you move in with your grandparents. Because this is a movie, you get to have your grandparents played by F. Marie Abraham and Caroline Aaron, famously of uh Mrs. Mazel, and you're in their retirement community. Like, set the scene for us. Like, what happens once you get there?

SPEAKER_00

Uh, the character that I play, his name is Nate, and he arrives at the retirement community. It's a Jewish retirement community in an unnamed upstate location. You know, Nate is very much uh a fish out of water. I mean, this is the exact opposite of the glitzy, glammy, millennial lifestyle that he's tried to cultivate for himself in Manhattan that all came spectacularly crashing down on him. So, you know, he's like gone through the looking glass. He has no idea uh what to expect. This is about as weird a place as he could possibly imagine being. F. Marie Abraham and Caroline Aaron play my grandparents, and they are just absolutely sensational. And it's really kind of a generational clash uh between the two generations, but also it then it turns into what can the two generations learn from each other? And as it turns out, the people on opposite ends of life's journey are oftentimes the best suited to help each other really grow up and find what they need. So Nate goes in there being like WTF, um, and he and he finds home.

SPEAKER_04

There are all sorts of funny moments, like when you're trying to drive their car, which is like 40 years old, right? You don't even know what to do with all the buttons. Uh or I guess there are no buttons. That's the problem.

SPEAKER_00

The stick shift.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah. Yes, exactly. You're just like, what do I do with this? Even putting the key in the car, I feel like seems sort of anachronistic these days.

SPEAKER_00

Totally. Yeah, my car doesn't have a key. Yeah. No, I mean, yeah, there's there's all of these elements.

SPEAKER_04

But then you learn like the character of your grammar. She says, like, you when you take care of things, they last. And I feel like there's this sense that things that are a bit older, they last longer, right? You know, they they might be a little bit less shiny, but they're like, there really is a lot of quality there.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. And I think, you know, there's several uh thematic journeys that go through the film. Obviously, also, you know, when Nate shows up there, he's very disconnected from his Judaism or any sort of Jewish tradition, and he learns a lot from his grandparents. Um and I think part of the journey is that he realized that there's merit in the old-fashioned way, not to say about, you know, everything, but he really starts to learn from his grandparents to slow down and really value things that last and stay true to values and stay true to himself and learn self-reliance, as opposed to more of the clout-chasing lifestyle he previously led in in the big city, as they call it.

SPEAKER_04

And there is sort of a return to a deeper Jewish identity for our character, right? And so he goes to temple. I mean, sort of talk to us a little bit about that Jewish journey that the the grandparents really represent.

SPEAKER_00

Absolutely. And I think it's also reflected in the linguistic journey of the film. So um the film starts in German because Nate is uh learning German for his his Swiss boyfriend. Um and then as he after he moves in with his grandparents, uh his grandfather, played by F. Murray Abraham, starts moving.

SPEAKER_04

Gotta say that every time. It's so good. Oh my god. F. Murray Abraham. He's a genius.

SPEAKER_00

Watching him is is just unbelievable. Um, and uh so he starts to have some issues with cognitive decline, and he starts slipping into Yiddish, which was his uh, you know, he calls it his Bammalushan, right? His the language he spoke at home as a kid, which can sometimes happen with dementia. And then towards the end of the film, we end with a Hebrew prayer. Nate's overall journey is really connecting back with who he is. And that doesn't necessarily mean that he becomes religious, but he starts by not really knowing who he is, losing himself in a relationship that isn't right for him, and he comes home to his grandparents and his culture and his faith, and he sort of finds himself and discovers who who he really is and learns to stay true to himself. And so I think that that is the biggest thing that his grandparents really give to him is his real sense of self and sense of community and sense of belonging.

SPEAKER_04

There's a scene where F. Marie Abraham describes Yiddish as a warm bowl of chicken soup, um, which I thought was such a nice metaphor for the whole experience of sort of going back to a place that actually is really comfortable, right? That the the sort of the grandparents' house, the community, the fitness center, like there, there is something really, really warm and rooted in those places. It's interesting watching your character who basically has sort of shunned a lot of that, being like, no, no, I want to be in the city, I want to be fit fast, this, that. And I'm I'm kind of amazed because F. Murray Abraham will mention him again. He is not Jewish. He and he played he has that sort of like ambiguously ethnic vibe that he's played everything and all sorts of roles. But here he is speaking Yiddish on screen. So tell us about that.

SPEAKER_00

He showed up completely off book for the entire movie. Caroline and I at the table where we were like looking at each other in panic. I was like, was I supposed to do that? Like, was I supposed to like is this a play? He, you know, he is a master of his craft and he he takes it incredibly, incredibly seriously. And he showed up, he had all of his recordings for the phonetics, you know, he he knew it backwards and forwards. He was absolutely incredible. And you're right, he uh Murray is not Jewish, but he Wait, does he go by Murray?

SPEAKER_04

Yes. Oh, that's amazing.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, you know, but he told us all these stories of going to the Yiddish theater, and you know, he's really in his soul, he he has a Jewish soul to me.

SPEAKER_04

And and then and Caroline Aaron, who has really perfected sort of like the Jewish mother-in-law um in Mazel, she's a Jewish actress herself. Everything about her is so perfect, like the way she bites into a bagel. I'm like, oh my god, she's so Jewish. How did she do that? How does she do that?

SPEAKER_00

I don't know. You know, she is like a Tasmanian devil on set. I mean, she shows up and immediately she grabs onto every little detail and just imbues it. You know, I'll walk in, she's like, oh, that's the shirt I got you for your birthday. That's excellent. You're wearing it. Like she's just constantly making up all these details and and infusing her work with it. And it's really extraordinary, extraordinary to watch. And also, I think, you know, we had a lot of fun together. We we filmed the film uh down in Georgia, and none of us really knew anyone there. So it was kind of like adult summer camp. We were all in a hotel, and it was wake up, you go to set, and then it's like, okay, lunch, dinner, nightcap. There's no one else to hang out with. It's like new. Yeah. Yeah. So we're all just, you know, in hotel rooms right next to each other. And we really, we, we became a family.

SPEAKER_04

That's amazing. And I want to sort of go back a little bit because this is actually the first produced film to come from the Jewish Writers Institute. You're part of the screenwriters lab. So I want to sort of go back to the beginning of the process and tell us a little bit about like grounding this Jewishly from the start. And and again, just like, you know, Murray, I'm calling him Murray now, Caroline, we're there to sort of help guide you, the sort of other people along the way who sort of helped craft this film into the, you know, the beautiful thing that it is.

SPEAKER_00

The Jewish Writers Institute was absolutely instrumental in making this film. Um, I had heard about it. It was the first ever cohort of the screenwriters lab. And they were looking for submissions for stories that had to do with Jewish identity or culture in some way, shape, or form. And I had already started working on this movie about my grandparents, and I was like, oh, I think this would be a really good fit for the program. And it was sort of kismet that it all, as I was starting work on this, they were accepting submissions. And I was lucky enough to be accepted. And it was really a remarkable program. We had a lot of mentors that would come in and talk to us about craft, but also about, you know, Rabbi Wolpe was one of the people who came in to speak with us. And that talk really influenced how I structured my film because we had a fascinating dis discussion about what actually makes a story Jewish? It seems like a pretty simple question, but we spent a lot of time on it. Is it a Brooklyn accent that makes that makes a movie or a script Jewish? Is it comedy? Is it trauma, generational trauma? Is it Holocaust? Like, is it that there's a Shabbat candle scene? Like, what actually makes a film Jewish? And the thing he said that really stuck with me is that Jewish stories tend not to have endings because we value the continuity of life. Without too many spoilers, we leave um our family at the end of the film in a place where we don't know exactly what's going to happen. But hopefully, if we did our job right, you sort of get the feeling that everyone's gonna be okay, that they they each learned from each other what they needed, and that whatever the challenges ahead are, they're going to be able to address them.

SPEAKER_04

I love that. So it's June, it's Pride Month. Uh, this film had its New York City premiere at Newfast Pride. There's, you know, obviously a lot of queer themes in the film. I'm excited to have you here for our segment, Ask Golda, which is when a listener writes in with a question. And I thought this was something that you might be able to help us tackle. This question comes in from Becca in Philly. She writes, Dear Golda, it's Pride Month, which I normally always look forward to. Do you know where this is going? Do you know where this question is going? Maybe. I have an inkling. I have been out for a long time and have never second guessed my ability to navigate queer spaces until October 7th. I'm fine marching with people who might be carrying Palestinian flags or who don't like the Israeli government. I'm no Netanyahu fan myself, but I have family in Israel and I care deeply about their safety and what happens there. It's a big part of my Jewish identity, and I feel like there isn't space for that at Pride events anymore. How do I celebrate both my queer identity and my Jewish identity in this situation? I have to imagine that this is not an unfamiliar question to you, Noam, and you're sort of navigating the world with a piece of art that deals with both, you know, sort of queer themes, Jewish themes. And I'm curious what you would what you would tell Becca.

SPEAKER_00

I would take uh Jonah Platt's advice on this. He's a good friend, and he's also a co-EP on our film.

SPEAKER_04

I know I saw him in the credits. I was very excited about that.

SPEAKER_00

Yes, he's incredible. And he really says the only antidote, and it's kind of ironic that we're talking about this, but it is pride, and he talks about Jewish pride. I don't know anything else to do other than be unapologetically who you are, which is both queer and Jewish, and to show up and be proud. And the world can sometimes be an ugly place. Um, but I think the more light that we bring into it, and the more love and joy and pride in who we are that we bring, only love can defeat hate. So show up. Sometimes really unpleasant things happen, but that's that's where community comes in. So find your community, find the people who are equally proud to be queer and Jewish, show up, even when other people might make it uncomfortable. That's when it's even more important.

SPEAKER_04

There's a line in the film, I think, that's like Judaism means is about never being alone. Did I get that right?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, you know, so yes, yes. So there's there's a line in the film. Um, it takes place during uh date scene between the character that I play, Nate, and Dr. Green, who is the grandparents' doctor, and there's also a love affair between the two of them.

SPEAKER_04

By the way, Jewish grandparents always love a doctor.

SPEAKER_00

Always love a doctor. Right? And there's a pretty hysterical, if I may say so myself, scene in the synagogue where uh the grandmother Caroline Aaron orchestrates Yes, in a way that is so yeah that in a way that is just so delightfully embarrassing. And uh you know her delivery is of course priceless um as as always. Um but so so during this date, Dr. Green says that he needed a community, and he sort of expresses that to him Judaism means never being alone in the world. And that was a line that actually the Jewish Writers Institute, and specifically our our mutual friend Rebecca, we workshopped that quite a bit. There was there were other versions of that line, and I remember it was a week before production, and I got an email from her and she said, You can do whatever you want, you know. But think about that line. I don't, I'm not sure it's quite there yet. And this was a week before, and you know, we have a million things to do. Murray's going down to Georgia. Murray's going down to Georgia, you know. There's but I sat with it and and we went through multiple, multiple versions to sort of distill personally, I am not a religious person, but I'm very proud of my Judaism and very connected to my my heritage and my culture. I was like, well, what does it mean to me? And so we went through all of these different versions of trying to figure that out. And we landed on it means never being alone in the world. And I think that speaks to the power of community and peoplehood and a feeling of a shared destiny.

SPEAKER_04

I love that. Well, Noah Mash, I love I love that your film is making sure that we are never alone in the world. You're you're sharing the story and it's it's it's really delightful, very sweet, very entertaining. Um, where can where can everyone watch bookends? Where can we be going to screenings? Tell us where to find it.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, so right now we are on the festival round. Next up, we will be at the Toronto Jewish Film Festival in about four days. Um and then later in the month, we'll be at Frameline in San Francisco, which is a phenomenal, phenomenal festival. And then we have a whole slew of upcoming festivals throughout uh the US and Canada, a couple international as well. We're not allowed to announce yet because we can't steal the thunder from the festivals as they announce. But on our bookends movie Instagram, there's a link tree that which has all of the upcoming dates. We also have a mailing list that you can sign up for if you want to be notified when it goes into wide release and theaters and streaming. But the link tree is linktr.ee slash bookends movie, and you'll see all of the upcoming screenings there and, of course, updates on wide release.

SPEAKER_04

Noah Mash, thank you so much for joining us on Golda Girls.

SPEAKER_00

Thank you so much for having me.

SPEAKER_04

I have to say, you're the first guy to be on Golda Girls, so you are our honorary Golden Guy.

SPEAKER_00

I was gonna ask, you know, I was looking through and I was like, I don't want to make a mistake, but I'm pretty sure I feel very honored.

SPEAKER_04

Welcome. I love that.

SPEAKER_00

A Golda Guy. Thank you. You're a Golden Guy. Thank you, thank you.

SPEAKER_04

Yes, and Mazatov on the movie. All right, that was so fun talking with Noam. His film bookends is so sweet, so charming. Dare I say, good for the Jews, which brings us to our final segment of the show,

Good for the Jews

SPEAKER_04

good for the Jews. Good for the Jews. I will not stop saying that phrase, good for the Jews. We need to say it as much as we can. Good for the Jews is sponsored by Joiva, the fourth generation family business making gel rings, marshmallow twists, halva, and tahini right here in New York City. That is decidedly good for the Jews. Um, I'm gonna kick us off today with something that goes that sort of calls back a little bit to our conversation about education. I have a shout out to the Saul and Carol Zabar Nursery School at the JCC at the Marlene Myerson JCC Manhattan. My daughter, Edith, is graduating pre-K there. Yes, the preschool is actually named for the Zabars family.

SPEAKER_01

That's incredible.

SPEAKER_04

Here we are, another week on Golden Girls, where we talk about Zabars. We talk about the Zabars. Bagels forever. Locks for days. I have to say, I love this place so much. Edith started nursery school at the JCC in this in the fall of 2023, when sort of everything a month later really, really shifted in how we saw ourselves being Jewish, how we experienced being Jewish. That place has been just like a warm hug for our family. And I think it's so special. You know, it's just such a warm environment. There was Shabbat Singh every Friday morning where all the families would come, and um there would just be like music and and like singing, and you just realize like this is the beauty of Jewishness. And kids get it so easy, right? Because it's so, so simple for them. And I think that part of this is seeing my daughter get a little bit older, right? She's gonna be five, which is not so old, but I think that there are changes in how we sort of see ourselves, how we understand our Jewishness. And I'm so protective of how she sees her Jewish identity. I love how much she loves being Jewish. I just, I love it for her. I'm I'm so grateful to this place. And I'm like really gonna miss being there. And so, my good for the Jews is Jewish preschool, you know, like this this just magical phase of life. I used to say before I even had a kid that you're never more Jewishly literate than when you're in preschool, because you're most likely doing it in some parochial place. You're doing it like in a church basement or a synagogue basement, and you're like steeped in it. And I do feel like I'm understanding now that, like, okay, we now need to keep, if we want to do Shabbat as a family, I have to do that, right? Like, we have if we want Kala, it's not just gonna show up in her cubby. It's gonna be something that we either buy or make. And so to me, I'm trying to take inspiration in this the all the new things that we can sort of add into our lives with a little bit more um thought going into it now. So good for the Jews. That is beautiful.

SPEAKER_02

Well, maybe I can continue on our Jewish life cycle theme. Circle of life. You started with preschool graduation. I'll move it ahead. So, in my job, I'm a congregational rabbi, and one of the things I get to do is work with a lot of Jews by choice, a lot of converts, people who are becoming Jewish. And this month, I converted not one, not two, but six Jews by choice. Whoa. Something's happening in the Jewish world. Like it's not just me, like there's a lot of rabbis that are noticing like an increase in conversions, which is fascinating. You know, there's these these people are remarkable. They're becoming Jewish with their eyes wide open about what it is. You know, it's always a little surprising to like choose to opt into being a minority, but especially with like the climate right now. And I'm just inspired by each and every person. They all come from their own path. Some people are converting on their way to marriage. Some people are converting, you know, after many years of raising Jewish children. Um, some people are doing it because they've always, you know, they grew up with Jews and they've been to Passover and like it speaks to them, you know. Some people are spiritual seekers, like it's for all of these different reasons. But every single time I go to the mikvah and I hear their stories and I hear their commitment to the Jewish people, to the state of Israel, to building a Jewish home. I'm just so moved. And so it's like they're not only good for the Jews, they're great for the Jews, and I just love them.

SPEAKER_03

Beautiful. I will share a pop culture good for the Jews, that is a little bit perhaps less meaningful than Stephanie and Diana, what both of you said. But there's this incredible scene in the latest season of Hacks, which for those who don't know is a fabulous TV show on HBO with this young millennial female comedian who basically gets canceled, and the only job she can get is writing for kind of a washed-up older comedian and ends up going to work for her in Las Vegas. They become best friends, but also kind of frenemies. It's so good. It's so funny. This is the final season. And one of the newer characters to come into the show is played by the actor Robbie Hoffman, who is a Jewish woman who grew up Hasidic in New York and is no longer Hasidic, which is the exact character that she plays on this show. She joins a Hollywood talent agency as their office manager after coming from Hasidic Brooklyn out to Los Angeles and ends up becoming amazing and sort of saving the office and being a dynamo, and it's just hilarious. And in the final season, this is not a spoiler to anyone who has not watched but is a listener of Golden Girls, um, the main character, Deborah Vance, is going to do a big show in New York City, and everyone is trying to get tickets sold. It's coming together last minute. And Robbie Hoffman's character goes to Brooklyn, is shown walking the streets of Williamsburg, not the trendy Williamsburg, and goes up to a group of clearly super orthodox women, starts talking to them in Yiddish, like on the show, and says, Come to the show, come see Deborah. She wears a wig just like you. Uh, because the part of the character's whole bit is that she keeps her hair really short and wears a lot of different fun wigs. Um, so that all played out in Yiddish. I thought that was fun and just like a little good, a little good Jewish scene. We could use that right now.

SPEAKER_01

I'm so happy that you brought up Robbie Hoffman. I'm a huge fan, and I love the fact that she's married to former bachelorette Gabby Wendy, and they have the most beautiful love on Instagram, and I'm I'm here for all of it.

SPEAKER_04

Good for the Jews, Robbie Hoffman.

SPEAKER_01

Seriously. So good for the Jews. Um Diana, this my good for the Jews goes out to you. I think I think you'll like this. So I recently chaperoned a second grade bowling trip uh with my son in his classroom, which was I'm still sleeping it off. And before we got off the bus and went into the bowling alley, the great advisor made a speech to the kids and she invoked this term, uh, Khilul al Hashem, which uh means, you know, when we go out as publicly Jewish um figures and people, because you know, all of these kids are wearing tzitzit and kipa, we have to act in a way that honors Hashem and our Judaism. So she explained to the children, you know, um, you say please and thank you to all the employees of the bowling alley, and you pick up after yourself. And she made sure not to give out the snacks or the water bottles until we were leaving the bowling alley. And, you know, she was really drilling into the kids for like five minutes on this bus about how important it is to like you know, act conduct ourselves in a respectful manner and to, you know, speak to everybody kindly and be appreciative. I love that I invoke this um this term of Khilu al-Hashem all the time to my kids and just you know to make sure that when they go out into the world, they're conscious of you know who they are and how they want to be perceived. And I just thought it was really great for her to like take out this time and sort of make sure these second graders who are very rowdy um and don't always mean to be sort of, you know, uh messy or maybe a little bit obnoxious, not in a bad way. They're second grade boys. And uh yeah, I thought it was really important and something that I try to drill in myself at home.

SPEAKER_03

Esther, can you use Hilo Hashem in a sentence for our listeners who are new to that word and spell it for us. This is a spelling bay.

SPEAKER_01

Oh, Hilo in in Hebrew? No, in English. Um this is P T S C. It's bringing me back. In English, I have no idea. I would think it's like H I L U L.

SPEAKER_04

C-H-I-L-L-U-L.

SPEAKER_01

H I L Hilul.

SPEAKER_04

All right, define it, define it, use it in a sentence.

SPEAKER_01

Um define it. Is when you do something as a Jewish person that desecrates Hashem's name and use it in a sentence. Alex, I cannot believe that you just toss your gram cracker wrapper on the floor in this beautiful bowling alley that is such a Khilu al Hashem. And you did not even say thank you when that man put those bumpers on for you. Let's all act accordingly. Well played. Yeah, well incredible.

SPEAKER_03

The scripts national spelling be happening to the sweat method. You you could be on it.

SPEAKER_01

Thank you.

SPEAKER_02

I also really love this game. Like, feel free to like put Esther on the spot and like ask her to use Jewish phrases in a sentence. It's been done before.

SPEAKER_04

Esther and I did an event together. It was the kickoff of our Golda residency at the Harmony Club. This really, really iconic historic uh members' club in New York City. And she was one of the three authors I had in our first conversation. And she did manage to call Leonard Cohen a baddie in the course of this conversation. And it was the best line of the night.

SPEAKER_01

I meant to say daddy, and I don't know which one would have been worse. But I swear daddy would have the audience until I said that. And then it was your pin drop. They loved it. Stephanie backed me up. She's a pro. And you know what? I stand by it. Leonard Cohen, original daddy baddie. Love it.

SPEAKER_03

They're jealous that they don't know how to use baddie in a sentence. Why did this not come up in our earlier?

SPEAKER_04

I just got over it. Honestly, amazing. Baddie's everywhere. I mean, that's it for our show. How can we, how can we top any of this?

Credits

SPEAKER_04

Um, I'm grateful to the three of you for yet another hilarious, insightful, unexpected uh conversation. Golden Girls is a production of Golden Media. The show is hosted by me, Stephanie Butnik with Gabby Joyce, Diana First Go, and Esther Shahabar. Ariel Shapiro is our executive producer, and we're edited by the amazing team at Puldu. Get more Golda and subscribe to our newsletter online at Goldeguide.com. Follow us on Instagram at Goldeguide. Leave us a review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify, and we'll send you a Golda sticker. Send a screenshot of your review to high at goldeguide.com. You can also send us your Ask Golda questions there, high at Goldeguide.com. Thanks for listening and stay Golda.

SPEAKER_03

That's a Golda podcast.

Head Shot

Diana Fersko

Host
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Esther Chehebar

Host
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Gabby Deutch

Host
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Stephanie Butnick

Host