What is an Abundant Life?

What does it really mean to live an abundant life?

For many of us, abundance has come to mean visible success—health, provision, opportunities, momentum, and prayers that get answered the way we hoped. We imagine abundance as the season when everything finally works out. When the breakthrough comes. When the circumstances change. When life feels full again.

But what happens when life looks ordinary instead?
When the prayers keep going up and the situation stays the same?
When faithfulness feels quiet, hidden, and sometimes even disappointing?

In this first episode of Wine Into Water, we begin by questioning the definition of abundance many of us have carried—often without realizing it. Together, we explore how our expectations about the “good life” can quietly shape our faith, our disappointment, and even our understanding of God. We talk honestly about the tension between what we hoped life would look like and what it actually looks like right now.

Through conversation, personal reflection, and Scripture, we consider the possibility that abundance was never meant to be measured by outcomes, comfort, or visible blessings. Instead, we ask a different question: What if abundance is the presence of Jesus with us—right here—in the middle of the ordinary, the unresolved, and the in-between seasons of life?

This episode is for anyone who has wondered:
Why doesn’t my life feel abundant?
Am I missing something spiritually?
Is God still at work even when nothing seems to be changing?

Whether you're in a season of waiting, wrestling, rebuilding, or simply trying to stay faithful in the day-to-day rhythms of life, this conversation invites you to rethink what fullness really means—and to discover the quiet, steady abundance that can exist even when circumstances remain the same.

Welcome to the beginning of the conversation.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Sometimes we pray for the miracles. We wait for the breakthrough, the healing, the answered prayer. And when it doesn't come, when life feels ordinary, heavy, or quiet, we wonder if something is wrong. We read about water turning into wine. But most of us are living in seasons where it feels like the opposite. Where the celebration fades and the glass feels empty. Where faith isn't traumatic. It's dishes a mistake, laundry that never ends. Prayers whispered into the silence. But what if the miracle was never the point? What if it's really like the life? It's a living water. And the middle of the mundane. Questions feel unfortunate.

SPEAKER_01 1:22

And we kept having these conversations, just the two of us, and we realized we can't be the only ones who are asking these questions.

SPEAKER_00 1:30

So we decided to invite you into the conversation. We're so glad you're here.

SPEAKER_01 1:38

Jen, our question for today, and it's one that I have grappled with for quite a while myself, is what did Jesus mean by an abundance? Right? He comes to or he's talking to his disciples in John 10. And he says, I come that they might have life and have it more abundantly, or there's different transit translations, right? But it's basically a rich and satisfying life, an abundant life. What do we as Christian women do with that when life doesn't feel very abundant?

SPEAKER_00 2:32

Yeah, I think we've talked about this before. And there's two things that come to mind for me that make it hard to find. I think one is we we live in a country, in a society that is ridiculously and absurdly blessed, like what we have, so many would treasure. Like there are people praying for the lives that we have today, and yet in the midst of that, it doesn't feel abundant. And we have kids at home, and we have spouses, and we have aging parents, and we have, I don't know, like a myriad of obligations that have a tendency to just mean like we have very, I was gonna say full, maybe full schedules, but it doesn't feel like a full life, I guess, if that makes sense. Like we're we're just busy and squeezed from all sides. And so then I think I sit and think, where is the abundance in this?

SPEAKER_01 4:07

And if I could play Devil's advocate for a second, if we were to take that to the opposite, right, and say, okay, if we could just move to a desert island um and not have all of that, win the lottery, move to a desert island, right? Have you know somebody to cook and clean and take care of us, and we can just stay on the beach all day and read or whatever. Jim, the truth is I that would be I would love that for a vacation. Like I'm not gonna lie. I don't see that as an abundant life, right? So I wonder, that makes me wonder if it's less about the circumstances that we're in. Um that we find abundance in a different way. But at the same time, I don't think that means that God doesn't care about the our day-to-day existence, right? He I think he very much cares about all the things that we have to do and take care of. I know. What do you think about that?

SPEAKER_00 5:28

I think um, you're right. So I was like doing research in advance of our conversation to see like what I could find. And so it's not John 10, it's actually from John 1. So um, but it was this idea that abundance flows from Christ, not from circumstances, and so I think you're right, because each of us have, I don't know, I guess our own set of complicated circumstances as a human. And all of them look different. And yeah, I think we still wrestle with the same question. And so I think you're right that it's not it's not circumstances, it's something, it's something else, something deeper than that.

SPEAKER_01 6:22

And I think this is where the church or other Christians um can give us really what seem like really easy answers, right? Like, so the answer to that and this may very well be the answer, Jim. The answer to that may be that the abundance is Jesus himself, right? Um and I and I, you know, I I went I went and read around the abundance verse, I'm sure you did too, so that I kind of got the context because a lot of times we take Jesus out of context, right? Take Jesus out of context, and and he's talking about the shepherd and the sheep, and he is the good shepherd. And um so I I don't think there's any doubt that he's talking about himself, right? So that's one answer the church can give. It's just well, abundant life is Jesus, right? And then number two, uh I think sometimes they might you know we might hear um Jesus isn't talking about life here. He's he's he didn't come to work. I've heard you know he's not worried about our day-to-day distance here. He came to make sure that we had eternal life, and yes, that's an amazing thing, and I'm so grateful. But I don't get the feeling with this verse that he's talking about eternal life. He may be talking about eternal life, but he's not exclusively talking about eternal life because it's in the present. Um so I don't I think both of those answers that we get are true. But they're not they don't teach us how to live in the here and now when the stock market's going insane, or when we're we see our cities in chaos, or our kids are failing out of school, or another kid's on drugs, or we're about to get a divorce, or we lose our jobs. Like I think Jesus absolutely speaks to all of those things, and we don't, as Christians, always speak of those things to each other.

SPEAKER_00 8:49

What do you mean by that?

SPEAKER_01 8:51

Well, uh going back to what I was saying at the beginning, like the church sometimes tr gives us the easy answers like oh well the abundant life is Jesus. Now go on your merry way, right? You that's it, you that's all you needed to know. And I d I think that that's true, but you gotta help me understand like what do I do with that? Like for 10 years for a child that has wandered away to come back and I'm not seeing any plant happening. Where's Jesus and where's the abundant life in that? Right? Like that's that's where we just don't always get the answers we need. Sometimes we get the easy answers.

SPEAKER_00 9:50

Why is the abundant life the thing that we're all searching for? And I think I don't know, I think it's just really easy to sit wherever you are and think, man, like there has to be something more than this. Like, is this it? And that doesn't it it doesn't matter whether it's work circumstances or personal circumstances, right? So, like I don't know, I'll take my own circumstance, right? We our kids were hard fought for, like all the drugs, all the specialists, all the things, right? And we finally get these two little miracles who live with us, and you would think that I would reflect on that every day and think like those little beings were answers to so many prayers that I had. And instead, like it's Sunday morning, we're going to church, and what's on my mind is like I folded that laundry three days ago, and it's still sitting outside of your room, like you are a miracle. Put your clothes away.

SPEAKER_01 11:11

Oh my gosh, you just voiced like every everyone, every woman is thinking in the entire country, I think. Jen, except except for the women who are still sitting where you sat. Right? And are still praying for those miracles, or they prayed and it's too late and they're not getting up there. And it's hard for them to understand how you could not wake up every day and be like, I get to spend the day with these little miracles, right? And I am right there with you. Like um, I have 13 children and 11 of them are adopted. And I mean, adopt international adoption is a very hard process. And we felt God was leading us into it and we did it. Like, I mean, we had to pray our way through it same as you. Like there was I mean, there were you know, there were children we never brought home because of this or that. So um I understand, and then I am exactly the same. For me, it's not the laundry, it's the dishwasher, right? It's like the dishes are I mean, you can imagine not all of our kids are still at home, but most of them are, so you can imagine what the sink looks like, right? When everybody comes to me for a sack. And yeah, I mean I and it I literally am angry. Like it's not like it's like what is wrong with these people? Um I can yeah, dishes make me feel like life is not very abundant, or maybe maybe that's too abundant. I don't know. The dishes are abundant, life doesn't feel very abundant. When I have to do the same thing over and over again, right? Load the dishwasher, clean up after everybody else, put away everybody else's lottery.

SPEAKER_00 13:05

Um but then I think like what we're saying is the abundant life doesn't come from the things that we have, it's not derived from our circumstances, and it's not it's not even found in answered prayers.

SPEAKER_01 13:33

Oh my gosh, Jen, that is I think we need to sit with that for a second.

SPEAKER_00 13:38

Well, so like the thing the thing that keeps running through my mind is like the verse right before the verse, right? So I like I pulled the ESV version, but there's like this contrast in it, and the verse before says, the thief comes only to steal and kill and destroy. I came that they may have life and have it abundantly. And I was looking at like Old Testament passages, and so there's this psalm, it's Psalm 1, 1 through 3, but it's like the it's the same echo of words. So that one says, Blessed is the man who walks not in the counsel of the wicked, nor stands in the way of sinners, nor sits in the seat of scoffers, but his delight is in the law of the Lord, and on his law he meditates day and night. He is like a tree planted by streams of water that yields and yields its fruit in its season, and its leaf does not wither, and all that he does, he prospers. And then, like the message translated that second part to instead you thrill to God's word, you chew on scripture day and night, you're a tree replanted in Eden, bearing fresh fruit every month, never dropping a leaf, always in blossom.

SPEAKER_01 15:14

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 15:15

And so I thought, like, I don't can you hear the echo between the two of them?

SPEAKER_01 15:20

Yeah. And the replanted in Eden, that is stunning, Jen. I don't feel I'm gonna be honest, I don't feel like I've been replanted in Eden. I certainly don't feel like my leaves never gone.

SPEAKER_00 15:38

Right. Right. And so I don't know, I think like it's almost like he teed up a choice.

SPEAKER_01 16:10

And then that feels that feels a little bit more like a trilogue, right? Because I think as Christians that's who we talk about is we're saved or we're not saved, right? Or we um followers of Jesus or we're not followers of Jesus, we're followers of followers of the world, and we know who the prince of the world is. So that brings to my mind in some ways probably the biggest question of my life, like the one that I that I grapple with um which is one there are verses, and I don't have them pulled up at the moment, but there are verses that talk about the fact that we are like we have eternal life now. Because we as Christians have eternal life now. There are verses that talk about us being seated in the heavenly places, and we're seated there now. It's not something that we get when we die. Like we eternal life started for us here already, right? We have a veil that we'll pass through, but it says we will never die. We we have a physical death, we will never have a spiritual death. So I will be honest, I don't live like I have eternal life right now. I don't live that way. I don't live like I'm seated in the heavenly earth. I don't live that way in my spirit. At the same time, that makes it feel like we shouldn't really be worried about anything here. Like we should be completely just thinking about well, you know, let's get to heaven as quick as possible. We're already there. That's not how Jesus lived. He was very much present when he was here. He knew what his ultimate goal was. And he was always moving towards the past, always. But when he stopped to interact with someone, they were his whole focus. So it's like we're living in this tension. This constant tension. We already have eternal life. What does that look like? Or my husband just walked out and what do I do? Or even in just the day-to-day, like not the big things that happen, but even in those little things of I've got to get everybody to where they're supposed to be and get the laundry done and go to the grocery store. How do we as Christian women live in that tension?

SPEAKER_00 19:31

I don't know that I have an answer, but the like the thought it triggered in my head, um, I was in this group coaching program, and one of like one of the quotes from the guy running it was this theory, which I think is true in my lived experience, but how abundance attracts people and scarcity repels them. And it was real, it was like a business development thing, right? But if you operate from this place of scarcity, no one is going to buy from you because maybe is creepy, I think, are like the the word.

SPEAKER_01 20:16

Yes, a word.

SPEAKER_00 20:19

Um, but as I think about like this abundant life, and then the like the picture you just paint of Jesus, right? How like he knew he had everything that he needed. He was not striving or searching or hustling, like he just was, and in his being, he would sit face to face and connect with people one on one and just be with them. And I do think there is something which like I like I struggle with scarcity all the time, and I think that that's part of it in my life, is I I want the things that I don't have, whether that's the next client or the laundry put away. Like I want the thing I don't have. And maybe part of the lesson is when I am wanting over things I do not have, I am operating from a place of scarcity, and I am not I am not following in the ways of Jesus because what he would do is he would simply be and connect with the person in front of him because he operated from this place where like of not of not want, I guess.

SPEAKER_01 21:55

That reminds me of um a verse that I've been been thinking to feminine prayer that I've been talking with him about lately. Um the the one it's in Matthew and it's in slightly different angle but it's basically where Jesus is like you are awful wicked people. But if your child asks you for a loaf of bread you're not going to get enough stuff. Right? So what in the world? Like why are you worried? Your father is perfect and good and all you have to do is ask. He is going to give you a good thing. And that when I read that it convicts me everything because I do not always act like God is a good father. There are times that I act like he can't wait to take something away from me if I just if I make one mistake he is sitting right there ready to just yank that back. And that's not his character. That is I mean that is completely opposite of his character. And Jesus knew it Jesus knew the fat and I think the reason he could sit in the abundance and sit in the you know I know I'm going to be cared for and provided for was because he knew and the father's character is never one of I'm just waiting to give something back as soon as you do that wrong thing. Or you know sometimes we see him as stingy like he's got he's got everything like we know he's got everything but he is not going to part with it is so not God at all. Like he can't wait to give to his children. I think part of our problem is that we don't ask so we just it says that I mean it says your good your father will give to you when you ask well I don't always ask I think that's for sure part of it.

SPEAKER_00 24:13

I think the other thing that is probably related that I've been wrestling with is like I I think in the modern day church we focus a lot on Jesus and I think sometimes we view this like old testament God as different and judgmental and the like waiting to get you but when you actually like read the old testament the heart of God is always like him chasing his people in relationship with his people him wanting the hearts of his people to just turn away from the thief and the evil and the lies and death and like turn back to him and there was like this there's this other verse that I pulled from um deuteronomy and it says um hang on so it's 18 no 17 but if your heart turns away and you will not hear but are drawn away to worship other gods and serve them I declare to you today that you shall surely perish and I think like today we look back at like those old testament idols and we're like God I am not fashioning cows out of metals like that's not I don't have idols and yet I like look at my life and there are idols everywhere. Right? Like I can create an idol out of a clean house or out of success or out of comparison or wanting what someone else doesn't like has that I don't have and I just wonder if I like go back to the psalmist like when they were talking about like when you take your eyes off of God who loves you and we give you anything if like you just ask and all he wants is your heart to be focused on that and to trust that he's got you. And instead we've built lives of idols everywhere and maybe Jesus' point is those things will never satisfy and as long as you keep chasing them and turning your heart away from me you will never have this thing that I promised you that hurts right that was the first thing it was the belief you know it was the belief that God was reporting something or that God wasn't really going to take I mean if we go back to the sin that the first sin that Adam and Eve committed I mean you can look at it in a lot of ways but it was basically I don't trust you.

SPEAKER_01 27:37

God's not trustworthy I have to take care of it myself. I have to get what I want I have to go after it and they that's really what an idol is is whatever I mean it's what I want more than I want. And it's what I feel like I have to do. Like like you said you can create an idol out of work. Like it could be I I have to do this. God's not gonna do it for me. I gotta go you know I gotta go hustle and make this happen. It's the it was it's the first sin. I think that's you know maybe that's why Jesus really took the time to to talk about that because he knows that's a first tendency is to believe that that's not enough.

SPEAKER_00 28:34

He doesn't love us enough I gotta take care of myself so okay so let's circle back where does all of that leave us with the abundant life then I was trying to look up the verse I can't find it it doesn't matter but we were our pastor a couple weeks ago in church was talking about Adam and how God put him there to work and subdue the land or till and subdue the land but when you look at the Hebrew the word till is actually the same word as serve and so I think like part of what we see Jesus do is sit and connect and serve in whole bunches of ways some miraculous and some just mundane and it feels like for us we can go chase the idols we can go play the comparison game but I think your point is every time we do that all it says is that we don't trust God to provide and I do think like you can you can find plenty of scripture references that God expects us to do the work absolutely but I think the work is what he asked Adam to do which is like your job is to go serve like I have provided for you abundantly and you see this all through Jesus' ministry right like you need to go take care of people who have less than you need to forgive debts you need to go serve the people around you not because God needs it but because God wants those people's hearts. And I like the thing that keeps coming back to me that you said earlier was how Jesus just sat and connected with other humans and how like simple that is and how rare that is in our society today. And I think that that's like all maybe all he ever asked us to do is like go love people and go serve in my name. Like that's it.

SPEAKER_01 31:30

What's kind what are you walking away with I'm gonna have to sit with the screen replanting because I think there's a connection there between that curse and what we talked about with the fact that we actually are already living in eternal life. I too often see a huge separation between my life now and my life after I die.

SPEAKER_00 32:25

I don't always see that they're really just one life I've already lived no I'm not home right maybe he has replanted when I made the decision was I replanting an evening how in the world would that change how if I replied how about you I like the the thing that keeps coming up for me is this like idea around choice and it was echoed through a couple of the scriptures that I pulled but like you have a choice in front of you goodness in life or death and evil and then I step back and say like okay so we're clear on the abundant life is not from our circumstances or our possessions or the prayers God answered like that's not where we find abundance and like I don't I don't I don't know how to say this in like an articulate way but I think God has already seen the way that our life plays out and he knows when we're going to choose life and when we're going to choose death and so I think the net result of us making that choice probably changes nothing in the course of how our life is going to play out other than our perspective on the way that it does. And so like some days I sit with it and just think like we can choose to see all the bad or we can choose to see all the good we can choose to believe it's all random and happenstance or we can choose to believe that it's God's hand at work and so I think the thing I'm sitting with is that every day and every moment it's like we have this choice of what we want to believe about ourselves about God about the world around us about what abundant life looks like and I don't think that it's like a clear or straightforward answer. But like that same psalmist when you look at your tree replanted and eaten concept the line before that literally says just chew on your scripture yes right and so maybe it's like there is no clean answer to the abundant life but maybe part of it is choice and part of it is truth and part of it is trust but like those are all choices that we as humans make I think that's a really good place for us to end choices right it's like when I get up in the morning am I gonna get on my phone and start scrolling around and God lets me do either one. Like there's you know and there may not even be like an immediate like he's he's not gonna strike me with lightning because I kicked out my phone right instead of opening my Bible but the truth is there will be a consequence to it'll weight the attitude that I go into the rest of my day and my beliefs about abundance and scarcity are going to be impacted about whether I was looking at the news or I was reading his writer just is I'm I'm sitting here thinking how much more self-control might I have if I knew that if I scrolled social media he would strike me with lightning wouldn't that be an easier way to live I love that and I know I know we have to end this at some point and we could literally go on all day but I feel like that's that's maturity right like as a child you know you may very well get punished for you know doing something that you're told not to do but as an adult you're expected to have the maturity to make the right decision which then comes back to that's a choice we can make whichever one we want but we will fear the consequences of that choice.

SPEAKER_01 38:30

I think that's what Jesus was saying