Why Does Everything Seem to Change the Moment We Say it Out Loud?

Why does everything seem to change the moment we say it out loud?

Have you ever carried a fear, a doubt, or a story in your head for weeks—only to speak it out loud and immediately realize it wasn’t true?

In this episode of Wine Into Water, we explore the surprising power of confession, conversation, and bringing things into the light. Together, we wrestle with a question many of us have experienced but rarely stop to examine: Why do the thoughts that seem so overwhelming in our minds often lose their power the moment we say them out loud?

Through personal stories about anxiety, fear, shame, and the narratives we quietly build in our heads, we discuss how isolation gives lies room to grow. We talk about the stories we tell ourselves, the assumptions we make about other people, and the ways fear can slowly shape our hearts when it remains hidden in the dark.

Drawing from Scripture, we explore the connection between truth, light, community, repentance, and freedom. We reflect on why God designed us for relationship, why the enemy's strategy has always been isolation, and why speaking honestly with trusted people can become one of the most powerful tools for spiritual growth. We also wrestle with the reality that many people have been hurt by the very communities that were meant to provide safety, making vulnerability feel risky even when it's desperately needed.

Along the way, we discuss shame, the courage required to speak hard things out loud, and the difference between living in secrecy and living in truth. We consider how repentance may be less about informing God of something He already knows and more about stepping out of silence so healing can begin.

This episode is for anyone who feels trapped in their own thoughts, stuck in cycles of anxiety, shame, fear, or self-doubt. It's for the person carrying a secret burden, rehearsing conversations that never happen, or believing stories they would immediately question if they heard themselves say them out loud.

Because maybe freedom doesn't begin when circumstances change.

Maybe it begins when we stop carrying things alone.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Sometimes we pray for the miracles. We wait for the breakthrough, the healing, the answered prayer. And when it doesn't come, when life feels ordinary, heavy, or quiet, we wonder if something is wrong. We read about water turning into wine, but most of us are living in seasons where it feels like the opposite. Where the celebration fades and the glass feels empty. Where faith isn't dramatic, it's dishes in the sink, laundry that never ends, prayers whispered into the silence. But what if the miracle was never the point? What if what we're really longing for isn't the wine, but the living water? The presence of Jesus in the middle of the Monday. The abundance that doesn't depend on circumstances. This is a podcast for seasons that feel unmiraculous. For the questions we carry quietly. For the faith that keeps showing up, even when nothing changes. Welcome to Wine Into Water. I'm your co-host, Jen Asklin. And I'm your other co-host, Lydia Rosencreve. We're two women who have been asking questions, nobody seems to be answering. Questions about faith and seasons when life can feel unmiraculous.

SPEAKER_00 1:22

And we kept having these conversations, just the two of us, and we realized we can't be the only ones who are asking these questions.

SPEAKER_01 1:30

So we decided to invite you into the conversation. We're so glad you're here. But something always shifts in me when I voice them out loud, especially in the presence of another person. Lydia, does that happen for you?

SPEAKER_00 2:04

Oh my gosh, yes. Um I wonder if it's part of the reason that we both became coaches, Jen, is because we understand the power of speaking something out loud. Um and I don't know that I ever really thought of that as scriptural or spiritual, right? Um, so I'm I'm excited to explore today whether that is something that the Bible talks about.

SPEAKER_01 2:32

Yeah, I was doing a little bit of research before we jumped on on, you know, like where in scripture does it say this. Um and I think one of the things that stood out to me is for the mouth speaks what the heart is full of. Ooh. Because it always points to something deeper. And if I think about some of the moments where I've been at my worst, I have terrible anxiety, I have my entire life. And oftentimes what will happen is I will start to tell myself a narrative about a specific situation. It could be literally anything, but I will weave this narrative in my mind. And I think eventually what's in my mind starts to seep into what's in my heart and the way that I'm viewing the world. And then a lot of times when I finally say the thing out loud to a friend or in a small group or to my husband, literally, they don't even have to respond. As soon as the thing comes out of my mouth, I sit there and think, that is the craziest thing you have ever said. Like, you cannot believe that that is true. But I think oftentimes, like we are our brains, right, lie to us and weave these narratives that are untrue. But for whatever reason, I can never see the lie until I say the thing out loud and recognize how absolutely absurd the statement that I just made was.

SPEAKER_00 4:14

Oh no, I'm so I'm so there with you, Jen. Um, like you, I've suffered from crippling anxiety my whole life in various seasons in various ways. Um and absolutely, um, I've some of the things that I have thought were just they really were ridiculous, right? But they seemed, they seemed real when they were living in the darkness of my mind for sure. And I I, you know, God over and over again says that he is, you know, Jesus was the light. He is the light. Um, he talks about being the word and being the light. And I definitely don't think that's accidental. I think that he absolutely created us. He knows that when things are hiding in the dark recesses of my mind, that they can seem very real. Um, they can grow very large, right? Out of proportion to what they are. But when I speak them, that is the same thing basically as shining a light on them, right? And I mean, just like when we were children and we were scared to death of the dark or what was hiding in our closet or whatever. I mean, I think we still have that as adults. And just like when our parents would come and turn the light on and say, look, there's nothing there, I think God does that for us in the same way when we speak that out loud. He shines a light on it.

SPEAKER_01 5:50

I wonder if that's right, part of the root reason why he built us to be in community. Right. I think about him giving Eve to Adam to be her, his partner, his community. And I wonder if that's part of the divine design of why faith communities are such an important part of spiritual formation, because it gives you people who are immersed in the world, in the word, who are trying to follow Jesus. And then when you say the thing out loud that's absolutely ridiculous, you've got light sitting on the other side of that to provide you that external view of hey, that's not the heart of God. That's something else. That's a whole different kind of spirit. Um, but I wonder if it's the intentional design around why community is so important um to the faith.

SPEAKER_00 6:55

I don't think there's any question, Jen. I mean, I think you've nailed it. Um, but a couple of things there. Number one, I mean, Satan's tactic has always been to isolate, right? And he's good at it. He's been doing it for thousands of years, and we've only been here for a few. Um, and he's he's very good at isolating us. And I think we need to hold what you said very carefully, because um, I know that I've experienced this, and I imagine that there are a number of our listeners that have as well. Is our faith communities haven't always been that, right? Um that that I bet each of us at some point has experienced a time where we felt like the very last place we could speak our truth was in the church, um, for fear of being judged, um, for fear of being thought unchristian or um, you know, mentally ill, maybe even, right? Like for fear of being labeled or judged. Or rejected. Yes. Yes. And so I totally agree with you that God created us to be in community because it is how I mean, it is one of the ways that we fight the lies and the isolation. But unfortunately, um, so many of us have been hurt and our truth has not been believed or it's been ridiculed or rejected, like you said. And so we've learned to just be quiet and keep it to ourselves for fear of that happening again.

SPEAKER_01 8:36

There's two things that are coming up for me. One is I think sometimes the Christian religion, I'll be broad, has seemed to have forgotten that there is no condemnation in Christ. Amen. Um the second thing that comes up is how pleased the enemy might be with his current work in the church, that the very thing that is supposed to bring love and light to the world has fallen into traps that are maybe unhelpful. Maybe I don't know, going back to the same verse from Matthew, like, for the mouth speaks what the heart is full of. And if there is no condemnation and the heart of God is one of love, I think that that alone says a lot about this place we find ourselves in history.

SPEAKER_00 9:37

I think you're exactly right. Um I think we have fallen into one, it's it's almost like we we can't we have to go one way or the other. Either we're full of condemnation and all we speak is truth but without love, right? Or the other side is we're gonna accept everything because we love and we don't speak the truth that's needed. Um and it's I think you know, you and I can acknowledge that speaking the truth in love can be very difficult to do.

SPEAKER_01 10:20

Um it is. And I I think you articulated the dichotomy beautifully. Um, and I think that's really easy to see all around our world today. Um and so perhaps it makes sense that people have a hard time saying their things out loud, which then means you just have a lot of people who are spinning around in their heads, weaving all sorts of stories that are riddled with the enemy's lies. And none of those things are making their way out into the light, which might explain why so many people are afraid and destabilized because it's no longer safe to both speak your truth or to speak truth and love to someone who might need to hear it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 11:17

I think you're absolutely right. Um I think in especially today, right? Like there was a time where you know you might say something to someone, and one you you could I think there was more trust um than there is now. And you could trust that perhaps that person would keep it silent or you know, would work with it, would it would be between the two of you. Um now you never know who's recording. Um, you never know how something's gonna be taken out of context. Um, you never know what's gonna go viral, right? And it's like people are just waiting to pounce on something somebody says and destroy their life if possible. It's like there are it really feels like there are people who are just waiting for those moments. Like when somebody says something and I can take it out of context and I can I can absolutely make myself feel better. Um, I think it does create a little bit of fear of speaking something out loud. Um and I think you're absolutely right if if we can't speak these things out loud, they grow and they get so much bigger than they need to be in our heads. Um and I don't know I don't know how we solve that, Jen.

SPEAKER_01 12:48

Um I think you hit on something really important, which is in order for it to be a a place, a person where you can say the hard thing, there has to be a high degree of trust in that relationship. And when you look at trust in general over the last 50 years, what you see is that people trust far less today than they did even 50 years ago. Um, so you think back to like 1975, our trust not only in large institutions, but our trust in each other is like dramatically declined. And I think part of it is that same cycle we talked to, which is if you were always in your head weaving these narratives that are laced with lies in the dark, away from the light, well, no wonder we don't trust each other because it's impossible to assume positive intent in another person when that's where you're at mentally. And maybe similar to what's happened to me in really anxious seasons, that stuff seeps into your heart. It starts to shape the way that you see the world. And I think what you've articulated is the response you get, the speaking into the world that is happening, especially in the comment sections of social media, is coming from this heart that is held captive by these thought patterns and stories that are utterly unhelpful. And we know that there's power in speaking the truth and speaking it out loud so that we can shine a light on it. And so maybe it's how do you find trusted people that you can do that with? And that's probably not every person who's on Facebook and can see your comment. Like that's not that's not where you need to publish the crazy story the first time. You need to do it one-on-one with a trusted confidant, and maybe that's your husband, or maybe that's your best friend, or maybe that's your child. But like all of us have this small inner circle of people whom we trust who we can go say the crazy thing to. Um, and if you don't have that trusted inner circle, like sis, that too is the work of the enemy. Like you need you need people in your life that you can trust, I think is like maybe the first step.

SPEAKER_00 15:33

I think that is um extremely profound, Jen. And I think also is is missing um from the lives of a lot of people. I think especially since COVID, you know, we uh isolation became the norm in a way that it wasn't before. Um and I think some of us, I mean, even though it's been five years basically, right now, um, it doesn't seem like five years to me. It it seems much closer than that. Uh and I think that it did change our brain structures in some ways, right? To to think isolation is is safety. It's healthy. Right. I mean, because that's what we were told. Like you have to isolate so that you don't get sick and and make your parents sick who can't recover from it, or make your child sick who's immunocompromised, right? I mean, there there was so much fear. And and I'm not saying it wasn't, you know, I don't want to go into a COVID debate. All I'm saying is I think it's impacted us in that I think that we've started as an as a people to see isolation as safety in a way that we didn't before, where we used to think community was safety, now it feels more like isolation is safety. And I think we're seeing more and more people who are isolating themselves, even if it's not physically, if it I think in they are mentally and emotionally. Um, and that is the work of the enemy, there is no question. Because if we like we go back to what you said, you know, God is in community, right? He's the Trinity, he exists in community. And so when he created us, he immediately put us in community, right? He said it's not good for man to be alone. Um and so we do need to have at least that small group of trusted people that we can share our fear and our doubt and not feel that we're gonna be judged or um condemned, right? Um and I think that a lot of us don't have that anymore. And don't, and I think what's even worse is we may feel safer not having it than we did before. And I think that's something that as a church we really need to press against, we need to push against, we need to fight against that narrative. Um we're not safer in isolation. We're easy pickings when we are isolated. Um it's not how God created us.

SPEAKER_01 18:30

It's interesting. I I think the other shift that happened in COVID is all of the technology and social media on our phones became something that we used to stay virtually connected to all the people we weren't physically in proximity with. And I like we don't need to go down like a technology debate rabbit hole either. But I do think that like those applications are incented to have our attention, right? Like they are they are built to be addictive because that is how they make money. Absolutely. And I think sometimes we we get a dopamine hit when we get a like or a comment or a heart or a follower, and it pulls us back into it. And for a minute, that can feel like intimacy and connection, like you've been seen, but you haven't been seen. And so it's almost like we've let the virtual world replace our physical world. Like you even see it um in how kids play today, right? Like I think that we as parents have this fear about letting our kids go out and play in the neighborhood because we don't trust anyone. And so it's really scary for us to go do that. I like saw a TED talk a couple of weeks ago, and she's like, Do you know how many years your child would need to play outside unsupervised to get taken by the man in the white van down by the river? 750 years. Wow. Like the odds are so low. You can teach your kid to be responsible and let them like go be, right? We have like an intimate little cul-de-sac. There's like five families here. We've got 12 kids among us. Like, it's it's a wild place to live. We'll have we'll have the parents and the kids over for dinner, and then the kids will just like go and play outside and run around and play like ghosts in the graveyard, which I didn't even know kids did anymore, but they do. Um, but two things. One, I'm anxious the entire time in ways that I should not be, because literally they're out, they're outside. We can see them out our front door. And two, the first time that they did this, I was putting my son to bed that night and he goes, Mom, I was so scared. There wasn't an adult out there with us. It was just us kids. And so I think you're right. I think between like the social isolation and the technology and this lie that we've been fed that like it's not safe to be out in God's creation. You should stay inside. You should be, you give them a tablet, they'll be fine. And I think of like all of the dangers that live on that device, whether it's like diction or the predators or like all of like the yuck that like is out there for your kids to find. And somehow we've convinced ourselves that like it's safer if they're in our four walls than like out running around in the dark playing ghosts in the graveyard.

SPEAKER_00 21:57

Jen, I think that is like we could talk. All day on this one thing because I think it is you've hit something that's so profound. I think that we equate safety with physical safety. We don't equate safety with emotional safety or mental safety. It's all that really seems to matter is that we're physic or us or our kids is that we're physically safe. And the truth is, is that our emotional safety and our mental safety are probably even more important. And we're not taking care of those things. Well, and we're not taking care of them.

SPEAKER_01 22:43

This the physical safety than just isolates and rots and leaves you stuck in like super unhelpful thought patterns. And so we talked about having like a small trusted group, which is not your Facebook or Instagram followers, like actual physical people who can give you a hug. Um, so if that's like a part of it, what where else in your life have you felt like you had you had lies living in your house in your head, or you have stories in your head that you needed to say out loud? What allowed you to do that beyond just a trusted group of people?

SPEAKER_00 23:32

I think sometimes you reach a point where it just has to be spoken. Um where you realize it's like the the erosion of your well-being when you're living with something in your head that you're afraid to speak is slow for most people. I don't think it's like over, you know, it's not an overnight thing, but slowly it erodes your relationships, it erodes your spiritual life. You know, you may find I can't concentrate two seconds to talk to God about anything, right? Um it just it takes a toll, it steals your joy, it steals your peace, and it's not overnight. It's a slow, slow erosion. And then one day it's like you kind of wake up and you're like, how did I get here? And how do I get back? And those times that I've gotten to that point, I realize the only way, the only way that I get back is by speaking this out loud. I if I continue, so let me just throw this in really quickly because it might help somebody because it's it's been so helpful to me. But Brene Brown is like the authority on shame research. Yeah. And she says that there are three criteria for shame to grow and last, and those are secrecy, silence, and judgment. And so um speaking it out loud, I have found to be the only way to break that triad and get out of that shame cycle. Um and so I think it's not only you have somebody trusted, it's you get to the point where you just can't carry it by yourself anymore. And you have to speak it out loud.

SPEAKER_01 26:01

I wonder if that's why repentance is such an important part of God's plan for us. Not because he needs us to tell on ourselves or because he didn't already know because he knew he knew he knows everything. Yeah. But maybe it is a practice that forces us to not be silent or seek or secretive to know that there's no judgment, right? Like we are forgiven, yeah, but it feels like that practice is there because it it breaks that shame trinity. Yeah, it's not for him, it's for us.

SPEAKER_00 26:55

For us. I mean, you think about the first question he asked after the first sin, where are you? Right? And he knew where they were. It's not like he couldn't find them. They were, you know, they're hiding. I don't know where they are. Of course he knew where they were. Um, when God asks questions, it's not because he doesn't know the answer. It's because he needs us. We he knows that we need to speak it out loud. We need to, you know, I need to think about where am I? And am I am I in a place where I need to do what repentance calls me to do, which is to turn around, to stop walking in the direction that I'm walking, which is the wrong direction, and just turn back around. And he's right there. Like it's not like I have to walk all the way back to find him, right? Yeah. Yeah. If I will just turn around, there was I was listening to an amazing sermon the other day, and it was on Mary Magdalene at the tomb. And, you know, she didn't recognize Jesus at first, and she's basically just staring at the stone, and because that that was the problem, right? Jesus was gone. This she wasn't sure how she was going to move the stone, first of all, right? And then this, then the stones moved and it's and he's gone. And so it's this, she's just staring at the problem. And all she had to do was turn around. And Jen, Jesus was right there, right? But how often do I stare at the stone when Jesus is right there? If I would just turn around, if I would just repent, he's right there. But I keep staring at the stone. Something really powerful. And what she did was as soon as she turned around and she realized it was him as she spoke. Right, Rabbenai. She she confessed that it was him, that it was, you know. Um I I think that we so underestimate the power of speaking things out loud.

SPEAKER_01 29:11

But that made me think of is even if you don't have a physical person that you can tell it to. Yes. Like the god of the universe is all yours. And he's right there.

SPEAKER_00 29:31

He's right there. You don't have to walk around and try to find him. You know, you don't have to walk all the way back from um, you know, it's like the it's like the prodigal son, right? It's like the father ran to meet him while he has on his way back. The father ran to meet him. He didn't have to even come all the way to the house. We don't have to either.

SPEAKER_01 30:01

Maybe it's true for some of our listeners. Sometimes it's repentance for things that I have done. And even those things, like benign things, I can leave grand stories about in my head. Because there's always some like knot that the yarn starts to get rolled around. And those knots can be the most innocent, benign things. Like it always starts something, something you said, something you did, something you witnessed, something you judged. Like there's always like a knot that like starts this winding of the stories that we do in our head. And even when that thing is a good thing, we can still like we can still spin terrible things in our head because it's it's how it's how our brains work, unfortunately. Like, I'll I'll give an example. So I about six months ago signed a really big coaching client. Like, I like most I've ever been paid for coaching. And I went on a walk with my husband that afternoon, and I'm like, what the dumbest thing is? I signed a big deal. And literally the very next thought is better enjoy it. It's the last one you'll ever get. Oh, yeah. And so I think sometimes it's repentance for like the thing, but sometimes like the thing is actually like a good thing.

unknown 31:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 31:38

And it's more repentance from like, oh, I did not take those thoughts captive. I let that those thoughts weave into this giant ball of mess in my head instead of like taking the thought captive and making it obedient, because that second thought I had, that was not, that was not Jesus. Like that was the enemy. And I think we sometimes don't need to repent for the things that we've done because maybe the thing wasn't bad at all.

unknown 32:12

Right.

SPEAKER_01 32:12

But maybe the repentance is like, man, you got me again. I am so sorry, Lord, that I did not recognize that was not from you, that I did not take my thoughts captive and make them obedient to you. And then I think the moment that you speak that out loud, suddenly, like there he is running towards you, just like the prodigal son.

SPEAKER_00 32:36

Yep.

SPEAKER_01 32:37

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 32:50

We I mean we we're broken. Like um we are so broken, Jen. We live, we were born into brokenness, we live in a fallen world that we are not gonna think right thoughts all the time, probably most of the time. Like you said, we're wired, it seems it feels like we're wired to think wrongly, right? Um and that's why we just so desperately, desperately need a savior. And if I could truly believe all the time that there is now no condemnation, if I truly live like he's not mad at me, he's not disappointed in me, he's not punishing me, if I could live that way all the time, it would change everything. It would change everything.

SPEAKER_01 34:02

Um, listeners, when we started today, we were throwing out what question we wanted to answer. And we talked about the same, our head was on the same topic, but Lydia's question was what did you mean when you said then you will know the truth and the truth will set you free?

unknown 34:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 34:26

And it feels like that's what you've just articulated.

SPEAKER_00 34:31

I think you're exactly right.

SPEAKER_01 34:41

We have a world that encourages darkness, silence, secrecy. People can't be trusted, the outdoors can't be trusted, our our friends can't be trusted. And yet we know that there's power when you say the thing out loud, it shines a light on it. And all of that is helpful, I think, to understand why when you say things out loud, it shifts. But I think Lydia, what you hit on if I truly believed that there was no condemnation, it would change everything. I think that's what Jesus meant. I think you're right.

SPEAKER_00 35:54

Well, should we pray for our listeners, Jen?

SPEAKER_01 35:58

We should. Lord, we show up for these conversations with no idea where you will get us. And where we start is never where we end. And Lord, every time it reminds me that you love us for exactly who we are, you love our listeners for exactly who they are. But Lord, that you love all of us so much, too much to leave us there. Lord, we walk away with hearts changed, and I pray that the same is true for our listeners, that they recognize the power in saying out loud what they're weaving in their heads. Because Lord, sometimes it's based in shame over a thing that they've done, but oftentimes, Lord, it's something good that the enemy is using to weave lies about them, about those around them, maybe even about you. Lord, I just ask that as we repent for all of the things that we've done, or that we thought, or we've heard your voice and didn't listen, Lord, that we turn around and we see you, that you never left us. You were just there waiting for us to turn around. Lord, I pray that you give courage to our listeners to say their things out loud, that they don't have to live in the darkness or the silence or the isolation, that they've got people around them who you've placed to be trusted people in their lives. And Lord, if they can't yet find them, that they might know that you are there. All along, always willing, always waiting for them. In your mighty and hard life.