Part 1: Debunking More Assumptions About Pennsylvania Wines

Pennsylvania wine has a reputation problem, and we’re done letting old assumptions do the talking. We sit down with Jennifer Estelle at Endless Mountains Vineyards to unpack why so many people still think East Coast wine equals overly sweet “fruit bombs” and how Pennsylvania vineyards are proving otherwise with serious, balanced bottles grown on the land.

We get practical about what changes your experience in the glass: slowing down, tasting with intention, and learning to notice real signals like peppery spice, berry fruit, mineral character, tannin, and acidity. Jennifer shares her own learning curve, including the surprise that Pinot Noir doesn’t have to be a West Coast-only love story and that Pennsylvania can grow classic European varieties when the site and season cooperate.

Then we zoom out to the growing realities that shape flavor. West Coast vineyards battle drought and often irrigate; Pennsylvania fights rain, humidity, fungus pressure, and frost risk, which means sustainability looks like thoughtful tradeoffs, smart timing, and creative support like bringing in birds to reduce insects. We also talk about what it means to have vines on site, why grape sourcing matters, and how regional momentum, AVA goals, and the broader East Coast wine trail are changing the story.

If you’ve ever dismissed Pennsylvania wine, this is your invitation to taste again. Subscribe, share this with a skeptical friend, and leave a review with the best local bottle you’ve tried lately.

To learn more about Endless Mountains Vineyards visit:
https://www.EndlessMountainsVineyards.com/
Endless Mountains Vineyards 
296 Vineyard Lane  
Falls, PA 18615
267-785-3814  

Transcript

Welcome To Endless Mountains Vineyards

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Welcome to the Endless Mountains Vineyards Podcast, where the landscape slows you down, the wine invites conversation, and every visit tells a story. Join your host, Jennifer Estelle, owner and operator of Endless Mountains Vineyards. Nestled in the rolling hills of Pennsylvania's Endless Mountains, this podcast is an invitation into intimate vineyard experiences, small gatherings, meaningful events, and stories that live where people, purpose, and the land meet. Endless Mountains Vineyards, where life is grape and connection is intentional.

SPEAKER_01 0:42

Pennsylvania wine has a story most people have never heard, one rooted in mindful growing old vines and a landscape that produces far more than fruit forward bottles, people assume.

Why Pennsylvania Wine Gets Dismissed

SPEAKER_01 0:55

Welcome back. I'm Julie Schwenzer, co-host and producer, here with Jennifer Estelle, the owner and operator of Endless Mountains Vineyards. Jennifer, thanks for joining us and bringing this topic to our attention. So we're clearing up some long-standing misconceptions, would you say? Could you help us debunk the myths surrounding Pennsylvania wines?

SPEAKER_02 1:17

Absolutely. And I just full disclosure, I am still learning. This is my third year, actually my fourth season, but my third year. So I'm learning, and I always like to tell the story that the first time that I came to the vineyard, I didn't know there was a huge variety of grapes. I thought red and white. I knew I liked a dry red, and my Pinot Noir always had to come from the West Coast. And now I'm learning that we can grow a really good Pinot Noir right here in Pennsylvania. If you just look at the longitudinal plane, we can grow any of the European grapes that they grow in Europe over here. And you know, we're always battling Mother Nature and trying to stay ahead of her, but she always throws us a curveball. And I also learned that on top of the whites that we have, there's reds that we grow. We grow a cab franc and we planted some Pinot Noir because one of our friends over at Nimble Hill, they successfully grow Pinot Noir. And if you don't get a really deep red, you can always make it into a rose. So there's a lot of things that you can do with grapes and wine. And like you said, and I thought too, I never thought that Pennsylvania can grow beautiful grapes and make a really good wine, but I'm here to tell you that's not true.

Tasting Wine With Intention

SPEAKER_01 2:36

And before you've described Pennsylvania wine as a mindful experience, could you expand on that?

SPEAKER_02 2:42

Yeah, so for me, everything I do, I try to set an intention and I try to take the pause and slow down. And it's the same thing with food and wine. Um, and again, I'm learning what food to pair with what wines, but I always like to take the time to explain the wine and to tell people to just take the pause and let it kind of roll around your mouth before you swallow it. And what do you taste? Are you tasting some black pepper? Are you tasting some berries? Are you tasting a whetstone? All of those things that didn't mean anything to me three years ago are really important to me now. But like I said, I've learned in my 48 years of really taking a breath, taking a pause, and enjoying all of the things that you're doing. Um, so don't chug my wine. Appreciate my wine because there is so much hard work that goes into farming, which is that's what I'm doing. And I have a whole new respect for farmers.

How Sweet Wine Shaped The Reputation

SPEAKER_01 3:45

And why do you think that's been like that longstanding idea that East Coast wines are like fruit bombs? How did this even happen? And then do you hear that often?

SPEAKER_02 3:55

Yeah, I do. For instance, we had an event here on Friday, and I invited my neighbors. One's from Lehigh Valley, so they're familiar with Gallen Glen. If you don't know who they are, look them up. And his wife is from France, so you know, I want her to give me a thumbs up on my wine. But we had a Pinot Chardonnay white blend that we have, and they purchased a bottle, and then a day later they messaged us and they're like, This is really grown here and produced here because we can't stop talking about this wine. I was like, Yeah, I was like, it's grown here, it's produced here, it's Pinot Grit, and it's a Chardonnay blend right here from Pennsylvania. And again, mentioning Gal and Glenn, they won Best Pennsylvania Whites a few years ago and very influential in helping create the AVA for the Lehigh Valley, which is something that we want to do here in the Endless Mountains. The Finger Lakes was always something in my 20s. I would go to the Finger Lakes, but you're going to vineyards, and I think it kind of appeals to a group. And the reason why people go to wineries, you know, it's fun. You're not swirling, you're not tasting, you know, with intention. So I think when the winery scene started coming east, like to Pennsylvania, you don't have to have a vineyard to have a winery. So you can really use anything to create a wine. And what's appealing to new wine tasters is something really sweet. So I used to be a sweet wine person, and now I I can't do sweet wine at all because my palate's changed, my taste has changed. I think maybe that's where it got started. And then years ago, too, and we have different varieties here. The vineyard's over 25 years old. So we have some varieties that 25 years ago, that's all that they had. But with Cornell and Penn State, they've been doing a lot of research and a lot of grafting. I guess you can take certain roots and graft a plant onto it. And going back to the longitudinal plane, if they're growing it in Europe and we have the same climate, we can do it here. So you can grow the grape, growing the grape is one thing, and then making the wine is another. And that's where you kind of get to balance it out depending on what your season gave you. So there's a lot of science behind it, but it there's also a lot of fun in the wine making as well, when you kind of get to balance those things out. So I think honestly, it maybe is marketing. And I always tell people this too if you're going to a winery, where are they getting their grapes if they don't have a vineyard? So kind of pay attention to those things and not to, you know, downplay anyone that doesn't have a vineyard, but there's a lot that goes into the vineyard that pours into the wine making, which makes it special. And so for me, I think that's where the fruit bombs come in. Because if you're targeting a certain audience and you want them to like your wine, I guess maybe you make it sweet.

SPEAKER_01 7:02

It seems like that's one of the details that sets you apart, having vines on site and managing the whole process. Um, like you mentioned, compared to wineries that source a fruit.

SPEAKER_02 7:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:12

And I mean, you have a special relationship with that wine because you're there when it's like from the beginning before the beginning.

SPEAKER_02 7:19

Yes. So I like to say I touch all of our vines, I touch all of our leaves. Even when we're harvesting, we get to touch all of those grapes, and then that same intention goes into the winemaking. Yeah, it gives you a whole new respect for the wine and for the grapes itself.

West Coast Versus East Coast Growing

SPEAKER_01 7:38

And what do you think the major difference is between West Coast wines versus East Coast wines when it comes to taste, to texture, all that stuff? Is there any big differences that stand out to you?

SPEAKER_02 7:49

Mother Nature.

SPEAKER_01 7:51

Mother Nature, yes.

SPEAKER_02 7:52

So grapes really they like to be stressed. And on the West Coast, they have drought and they have dry soil. And one thing I always like to point out because every, you know, and I thought this myself too. I was like, I'm gonna have an organic vineyard, and Nimble Hill's doing some really cool things. We're really on the forefront of trying to be like more eco-friendly, but we do have to use some products because we have heavy rains and we have moisture in the air, which causes mold and causes fungus. And sometimes those things make a beautiful wine if you have a little bit of that mold and fungus in there, just like cheese, right? But the one thing that we don't have to do that California or West Coast does is they have to irrigate because they eventually will have to water some of their vines. We don't have to irrigate, but we have to use products. So there's kind of a little bit of that balance. So that's what I kind of like to say. And just because it's organic doesn't mean that they don't use unless they're 100%, you know, organic and they don't use any products, but we're very mindful on the products that we use and we're very mindful on how often. So that's why we brought birds in. We have birds that help us fertilize, that help eat some of the insects, so we don't have to use as much product. But I think that's the main difference between us and them. They can get a really nice robust red because they have high temps and dry, a lot of dryness, where you know, they don't have to worry about frost. We have to worry about frost. So if we're getting a frost, regardless of what our numbers are, we're always watching our pH and our bricks, so our acid and our sugar levels. We want those at a certain number so that we can pick our harvest at that time. But if we can't, that's where the really good wine making comes in. Or, like I said earlier, instead of having a red, we can make it into a rose because it's Mother Nature. Mother Nature is in charge, and we have to just kind of follow what she gives us.

Favorite Bottles From The Vineyard

SPEAKER_01 9:58

And what is your favorite Pennsylvania wine if you had a go-to just to relax after a long day? I know you're a busy, hard working woman.

SPEAKER_02 10:08

My favorite at the moment is our Cab Franc. It's a dry red. We started it in oak and now it's fermenting in our steel barrels. So that is just my favorite. And I love to say to people, we have a dry red, it has a peppery note and it makes you pucker because it has really high tannins in it. And I love when people drink it and they're like, This is made here. I'm like, mm-hmm. And then we have our Tramonette, which is a cousin of the Riesling. It is a beautiful white, and at the end of the season, it turns into like this blush color, and you can always get a rose note petal with it if we can, you know, hold off with uh harvesting. So I would say the cab franc and the tramonette are two of my favorite here that we grow and produce on site.

SPEAKER_01 10:59

Oh, that sounds wonderful. Um, it really does. And I invite you to uh discuss this in a part two because I feel like there's more we could explore about this subject. Are you open to that?

SPEAKER_02 11:11

Yes, absolutely. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 11:12

Oh my gosh, you're you're the best, Jennifer. Thank you so much. We appreciate you and look forward to learning more about you breaking down these misconceptions. I mean everyone have a good appreciation for this Pennsylvania wine.

SPEAKER_02 11:25

Yeah, I mean, that's what I'm here for. I mean, I like to debunk the pit bull myth, and now I'm debunking the Pennsylvania wine myth. We have some amazing wines, and I've also learned this too. There's a whole wine trail, the whole East Coast. It starts all the way up in like the Hudson Valley and goes all the way down to Virginia.

SPEAKER_01 11:45

Wow, I did not know that. See? This is why we need to keep talking to you. Well, thank you for that. And the the pit bulls give you a barkout, too. Thank you so much. Thanks, Julie.

Visit The Vineyard And Stay Connected

SPEAKER_00 11:58

Thank you for spending time with us on the Endless Mountains Vineyards podcast. Whether you're discovering Pennsylvania wines, exploring the beauty of the Endless Mountains region, or simply looking for experiences that feel personal and grounded. Endless Mountains Vineyards offers something a little different. This is a place where wine brings people together with purpose. We'd love to welcome you to the vineyard, share a glass, and invite you into the experience. You can call or text 267 785 3814 or visit Endless Mountains Vineyards.com to learn more about upcoming events and vineyard experiences. Endless Mountains Vineyards, where life is great and every visit gives back.