Neutral Zone
Welcome to Neutral Zone!
A podcast about the people behind the Dentistry profession.
I'm Dr Fran Brelsford and I invite you to meet a different dentist with me on each episode.
We chat with the humans behind the drills and the instagram profiles.
No hustle, no ego, no clinical chat.
Just good old fashioned conversation, new questions, and genuine connection.
Episodes dropped on Wednesdays.
Because there’s more to life than teeth.
Neutral Zone
Tinashe Nhova
Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.
Meet Tinashe. A busy cosmetic dentist and general entrepreneur working across the UK. He loves to tell a story and boy does he have a story to tell.
We chat about everything from his upbringing to moving continents to malaria and private jets.
@drnhova
I'm Timashinova and this is Neutral Zone.
SPEAKER_02Hi Tash.
SPEAKER_01Hi.
SPEAKER_02Thank you so much for coming on Neutral Zone. I know you didn't have an option, really.
SPEAKER_01Glad to be here.
SPEAKER_02Let's dive straight in. So, how much of your identity would you say is tied to being a dentist?
SPEAKER_01I would probably say 40%. Whenever I can, I do like to steer away from being known as a dentist. Um, because you know, when you in certain places, the conversation always turns into, oh, you're a dentist, I've got this problem with my tooth. Can you help me out? And like usually that just drags on and it's told to the next person, it's the next person. So I like to stay away from that. Sometimes I do pretend to be someone else, uh, but most of the time, if you strip away the BDS, if you strip away um BS all the titles, yeah, all the BS, and you'll find that I'm just um average guy um who is uh funny, uh charismatic. I like to play jokes on people. Um and I like I do like to make people happy, make people smile. I think growing up, I was always that guy who when someone was struggling in class, I'd be like, oh, let me come and help you, let me, you know, help you with this math or this English problem. So I think that dentistry is just like a chapter of my identity. But my true identity comes from the way I've been brought up, my upbringing, all the things that I've gone through up until this point. And some people get to see that and some people don't get to see it. And I guess that's the point of this podcast.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, we get to an insight into the real Tash. I think for obviously we're pretty good friends. I think for a lot of my friends who've never met you and heard me talking about Tash, they've many of them have assumed you're a blonde girl called Natasha, so we're gonna have a shot. So you did your training and working since you're a teenager in in the UK, but you grew up in a completely different place.
SPEAKER_01Yep. So I'm from Zimbabwe, born in Zimbabwe. I went to school there. I didn't come to England until I was 18. My family at the time, my dad was in a really good place in terms of his job uh when I, you know, turned up into the world. Um, and he had a lot of money. Uh, we had like anything you could ask for. Like we had a big house, we had a number of cars, uh, we had a maid and a nanny and a gardener, two drivers.
SPEAKER_02Must be nice.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it was it was nice. Um, but uh the interesting thing is that at the time I didn't know that it was as nice as it was. So um the school I went to, yeah, I went to boarding school from the age of six, and that was, you know, it had it had its up and ups and downs. But the school, interestingly, was a school that was uh quite expensive when you compare to all the schools in the country. We my dad managed to get me into there uh because of his sort of high-paying job. Um, and I was a weekly boarder. So I went there on a Monday, and then the driver came to get us on the Friday, and then I'd be home for a few days. And I remember the first day I went there, um, my parents had been getting me ready for boarding school. So I went there and I could make my bed, my view, you know, with hospital corners, uh, the way the hospital the way the hotels would do it. Um, this was all sorts of skills that I had. Um, and then by the end of that day, when my parents dropped me off, they kind of had to sneak away. And I was playing with these other kids, and then I realized, oh, you know, I'm sleepy, I need to go home. So I looked for my parents, couldn't find them. And then I remembered that when we were parked in the car park, I ran over, and basically my parents had gone. And I just stood there like in shock. And the matron came up to me and she was like, Oh, um, don't worry about it, you know. Um, and she was like, I'll make you a cup of hot cocoa, and then um I remember falling asleep, and then the next day woke up and this bell was going. And I was like thinking, Where the hell am I? And that was the first day of boarding school. And and we all all these other kids there as well. We all had to like follow suit, get in line, put on our uniforms, and be like prim and proper. And you know, you had you had to sort of fend for yourself, look after yourself. Um but it, you know, thinking back it was good, but at the time I just it was it was hard because I just wanted to be at home.
SPEAKER_02Were you was that the same? Were you full-time boarding what six to eighteen pretty much?
SPEAKER_01So I was weekly boarding from about six to about 12. And then from 12, I was full-time boarding up until I was 18. Um, and that was a different, a whole different kettle of fishing in itself.
SPEAKER_02Um in what way?
SPEAKER_01Boarding school teaches you to look after yourself. There's no one to, you know, that your parents aren't there, you can't call them. This was obviously back in the age when there was no cell phones and stuff like that um at your disposal. So if you had a problem, you had to learn to deal with it. And either you could deal with it physically or you could deal with it um by being strategic. Um I always chose to kind of have like cunning ways of um dealing with my problems. So a lot of the time I would pretend that I was related to either the head teacher or one of the like really important teachers. So people would be like, so if like someone tried to kind of bully me, I would just say, um, you know, the head teacher or so-and-so, yeah, we're related to them, or it's my dad's best friend, or this and that. And usually that would, yeah, usually that would solve my situation. Um I remember one time I was in, you know, I was in uh Form one, which is um first year of high school. Um, there's a guy who came up to me and um he said some things to me, and um I turned around and I said, you know, this teacher is um a cousin of ours. And he said, I don't believe you. And I said, okay, I'll show you. I'm gonna go to his house and I'm gonna let him know what happened. So I turned around and I started walking towards this teacher's house, clearly calling his bluff. But I was just, I just knew that, you know, this has to land or I'm gonna be in trouble for the rest of high school. So I went on my way and I had to go up this hill. And as I was get as I got halfway, I think the guy just started to kind of believe that, you know, if this is a possibility, I'm gonna be in big trouble. So he came after me and he was he um grabbed onto my leg and I was like, please, please, please don't don't go up on. I was like, no, it's too late, it's too late. And I dragged him up the hill, and then when I got to the top, I was like, okay, this is enough. And I said to him, okay, and I forgive you, but never do that again. Um and then that guy became like my best friend and he protected me from everyone else. So like high school became this like place where I was really safe. I didn't have to worry about anything because he was always there to help me out.
SPEAKER_02You played that role, didn't you?
SPEAKER_01I played it really well.
SPEAKER_02So you were there till you were 60.
SPEAKER_01Yes, so I was I was um well, going back to boarding school, um boarding school time was was really good. Um and in my primary school um sort of period, I was like the class clown. I remember looking back at my reports, and my my teacher always said, Oh, you know, he's good, he's good at his math and everything, but he's always cracking jokes, he's always making people laugh. So that's how I got into trouble. I wasn't doing like anything silly, it was just like me being myself, and I think that I've carried that into like my adult life. I'm always trying to make people laugh, make people smile. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.
SPEAKER_02Do you believe it was uh mentioned in your best man speech at your wedding?
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Um so you know, being at primary boarding school is good. And you know, there's not many moments that you can remember, but I do remember one particular moment when I got really ill, severely ill, I had malaria. I was probably 10. Um and not yeah, probably 10 or something like that. But if you don't know what malaria is or the symptoms, like you get sort of shimmering, you're hot and cold, and it changes every like a couple of minutes. So my uh the head teacher called my dad and he said, Look, your son's really ill, you need to come and get him. So the driver came, he picked me up, and I got driven home. Um and I was in and out of it, um, as far as I can remember. And then eventually I got better and I had to go back to school on, I think it was a Tuesday. And then my dad said, uh, today the driver isn't taking me to school. And I was like, Oh, how we get- I thought my dad was gonna drive us to school, and he was like, No, we're gonna fly to school, and I was like, Oh, so I'd obviously I'd never been on a plane before. And so then we went to the airport and we got to the airport, and we just kind of went through some like a private kind of space, and then we got onto we got onto the tarmac, and it was like a private jet, and I was like, okay, so we get on the plane, and just you and your dad? Just me and my dad, yeah. Me and my dad and the pilot. And we get to now the thing is the school was like in in farming space, and the thing is the school next to the school was a farm, and the guy had built a like a mini airport. So private jet went and landed there. And my dad had told the school that I was coming, and so we had all the kids from my year, they were stood outside, they were watching me come back to school and this private jet landed, and then I got out, and the only thing that was separating the school from where we landed was like a big fence. So there was a taxi there waiting for me, everyone was clapping, it was like, oh, welcome back, welcome back. And then I got into this taxi only for it to go all the way around and into the school, and that like made me popular in the school because everything was.
SPEAKER_02Is there any way to uh have high school points and be up there? I mean, that's so unfair.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that was crazy.
SPEAKER_02All better after.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, the funny thing is, I then met one of the kids I went to school with when I moved to England, and we met at the same college, and I looked at him and he looked at me, and he was like, snashy. And I was like, Wow, you what are you doing here? And he was like, What are you doing here? And like we were just talking, and he suddenly said, Man, I remember when you came to school in the private jet, and I was like, Because I'd forgotten about it at that point, and he mentioned it and he was like, Yeah, and I was like, really? And he was like, Yeah, everyone was just like talking about it, they were saying like how how amazing it is, and I was just like, Oh wow, it you know, things like that really made an impact.
SPEAKER_02When's your 40th?
SPEAKER_01A couple of years.
SPEAKER_02So you mentioned going to Sheffield. How did you jump from Zimbabwe to Sheffield?
SPEAKER_01Um, so in Zimbabwe, I went to um Bride and Country School, finished there. We could we were always moving house, uh moving cities. So I went from that school, went to a school in another city that was like five hours away. Um that was boarding school as well. I then went, I then started to go to high school, and it was sort of at this point that um things started to change a little bit. So my dad is a mechanical engineer at this point, and he's doing really well. He's on the board of this big company, and he suddenly finds out that there's a bit of embezzlement going on, and my dad's like a really honest person, so there was some investigating that was done, and then so your dad found out about the embezzlement. He found out about embezzlement, and then a load of people lost their job. And then the next thing that happened is the president who knew my dad really well, and they'd worked on so many different kinds of things together, he then said he was looking for a minister of mining and energy, and he was like, I want he wanted my dad to take that position without any voting and things like that. But then other people heard that my dad was gonna get this role, and because they were probably doing some other shady stuff, they were like, not a chance. So to put things softly, my dad had to leave the country the next day after certain decisions were made, and he was told never to come back, otherwise, you know, things wouldn't end well.
SPEAKER_02Wow, okay.
SPEAKER_01So my dad uh went to the airport, came to London, and then that was it.
SPEAKER_02Had had he ever left to embark on it?
SPEAKER_01Dad was always traveling, he was with his business, he'd go to Egypt, he'd go to America, he'd go to Cuba, he'd go to all sorts of places. So when my dad left, for me it was like he's going on a business trip again. But then a year passed by and I hadn't seen him, and I thought, hmm, this is a bit strange. And another thing that happened was while I was at high school, there were people wearing these black suits, and they seemed to be following me. But I couldn't prove it, but I just felt like there was always someone watching me and following me, and I didn't think too much about it at the time. So then I asked one of my cousins, I said, Look, I haven't seen dad in a while, like what's going on? And then he told me, and he was like, Your dad had to leave, and you know, he he's not coming back.
SPEAKER_02How old were you at this point?
SPEAKER_01At this point, I was 16.
SPEAKER_02So GCSE is or or equivalent.
SPEAKER_01GCSE equivalent, yeah.
SPEAKER_02Okay.
SPEAKER_01So I was 16, getting ready for my exams, and I was like, Oh, what happened? And we told me. And he was like, But he's taking steps for you to come to London. At this point, when dad left, we basically lost everything. All his assets, um, all his money, all the bank sort of bank accounts were closed, and everything that he was doing while he was in England was like to pay for us to still be able to go to school.
SPEAKER_02So your life didn't change at that point?
SPEAKER_01You didn't know that far, you didn't life changed, but I didn't know it had changed because there were a lot of people working in the background to try and make sure that we were still going to these schools. So life didn't change and it involves, you know, a lot of movement of other people's money and things like that.
SPEAKER_02So just you or you're you have siblings as well?
SPEAKER_01So it's me and my two sisters.
SPEAKER_02Um you all in separate schools?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, we're in separate schools. I was in um what you probably argued me the best high school in the country called St. Ignatius College. Um and my sisters were in some other schools.
SPEAKER_02Um yours all boys.
SPEAKER_01I was also all boys, yeah.
SPEAKER_02Okay.
SPEAKER_01Um, and it was like really strict. It was, you know, the standards were really high. And I remember one of the one of the mantras of the school was 100% is not good enough. So, you know, when it came to exams, like I think the ethos was like you can always do more. Like you can get 100%, but you can always do more. You can help people, but you can always do more. Um, and I think that's something that stayed with me even up until now. So so all of this was happening. Um, my dad was away. I was getting ready for exams. Um, but it really, it didn't really shake me. Um, because I think I just thought, yeah, you know, dad is safe. He's in London, didn't even know where you know what London was like. And then I wrote my exams, did really well, and then I had to prepare to come to London.
SPEAKER_02So you finished your GCSE equivalence, and then what someone said you're moving.
SPEAKER_01So I started speaking to my dad, and he said, Yeah, I'm trying to get you guys over here. Um, we've kind of lost everything, so I need you guys to come here because you're gonna have a better life.
SPEAKER_02Um had you ever travelled?
SPEAKER_01No. Other than the flight to school. I never travelled, never left the country, I'd never been on a commercial flight. Um so it was it was interesting because dad didn't actually have any money to take us to London. Um and I became increasingly aware of it because there was a lot of things that we used to have or do that we no longer had. Um and we had to move house and all these things. So when we actually came to England, my dad didn't buy the the air tickets, it was the Red Cross, which is a charity organization which bought the tickets for myself and my sisters, and then we flew to England, arrived in Heathrow. Uh it was uh 2nd of March 2005.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I'm guessing you had passports.
SPEAKER_01Oh yeah, we got passports and everything. We got we got all of that stuff really easily because my mum had connections.
SPEAKER_02Um so we went from a private jet to having to flee the country essentially with the Red Cross.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. And Anthony, my mom behind as well.
SPEAKER_02Gosh. And you were what, 1718?
SPEAKER_01I was 1899 when we left. Um and we went straight to Sheffield because at this point my dad was a refugee and got resettled in Sheffield in Foxhill to be specific, which isn't um the most accurate of areas, is you know, to be blunt is like in a really poor area, and basically it it paints the picture of having to start again.
SPEAKER_02I usually ask people if there's a pivotal point in their work or life that's changed how things have um worked out in the end, but you've just answered that. So that that is the pivot.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_02You've gone from pretty much everything to almost nothing overnight. And were you put in sheltered accommodation?
SPEAKER_00I it was it was the that we lived in.
SPEAKER_01Um it wasn't too bad, but you know, coming from you know, living in a in where you've got loads of space and you can have a party and pretty much not going to disturb anyone to some flats where you can hear the neighbors shouting and screaming at each other. And that's when I learned about Asbos, you know. And you know, we had a few, we had a few people, we had a few Asbo letters come to our post actually. And it was like me and my sisters were just having fun watching TV or having a, you know, play music, having a dance. And it was like, oh, you're making noise past 10 o'clock or something silly like that. And like you're not used to that because you know, it almost feels like although you're in your own space, you are sharing that space with everyone else. So it was it was a big change.
SPEAKER_02Um massive change.
SPEAKER_01Absolutely massive change. Um because I came in March, I couldn't start college until September. But my sisters came in and they went straight into school. My other sister went straight into college. Um and I was at home and doing nothing basically, just waiting for September to come.
SPEAKER_02How how did you find it like the whole shift, culture, music, food, going from Zimbabwe to to Sheffield?
SPEAKER_01I think food was a difficult one.
SPEAKER_02Well it's got good in recent years, Sheffield, but I'm from there. At that point, we weren't known for to be a foodie city.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, the food was really difficult. Like um, yeah, food is very different. You know, everyone in others, any country that you go to is so different. But um I think it was the way the way people speak to each other, greet each other. I think for me, the real shift was I went from being in in an institution in boarding school. So I didn't even know Zimbabwe that well because I was always in boarding school. But then when I came to England, suddenly I had this whole big white world. I was no longer going to boarding school. I could just get on my bus and go from A to B.
SPEAKER_02Roaming free.
SPEAKER_01I could I could roam free, I could go shopping, I could do whatever I wanted. So for me it was like middle hall, yeah. So for me it was like a big shift. Um and I and I loved it, I liked it. Um, and during the time I was waiting to go to college, I had to find a job.
SPEAKER_02So you mean college, you're waiting to start to get do your A levels in the September?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so I was waiting to start to do my A levels, but I was gonna be a few months. So my dad said, we need to go look for a job. So I said, okay, start looking stuff up, called the Job Center Plus, and then um I got an interview, but I didn't have any clothes. So I said to my dad, well, I haven't got anything to wear for this interview. So I went to the job center and they gave me some vouchers which I could use to go to Meadow Hall to buy myself a suit and some shoes and some socks. So I went to went to Meadow Hall, got myself a suit. I think it was it was probably like a £50-pound voucher, so I had to make it work for everything, for everything, and I got what I needed. Um, it didn't fit really well. It was like big baggy suits and things, and went to several interviews, didn't get a job. Um, so it made it quite difficult to actually feel like life was starting because it was just like, okay, I'm getting a knock, getting another knock and another knock. Until eventually college started. So I applied for college and the college, um, I think it's still there called Longway Six Park. Yes, it was an experiment by the government at the time, and because Longley Park is in a really poor, deprived area, they decided to build this college um from scratch and they put in the best teachers they could find from all over the world. So they paid them loads of money, but all the students were from the deprived areas surrounding that college and in Sheffield. So initially, when we all applied, there were so many students. I remember going to my first time, I was like, this place is packed.
SPEAKER_02But I think were you used to like tiny classes in boarding school or how many what was the what was the difference?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, boarding school was like you know, 10, 11, 12 children, and then get to college. Yeah, get to college and there's like 40 students. But I think it was by design because the experience I think was showing that I I think they expected a lot of people to drop out for several reasons, and we saw that week by week. You know, the the numbers were dwindling in class, you'd be in the biology class, maybe there's 30 people, and then after like a month there's only 10 people, sorry, 20 people, and then you just put less than yes. Um, but for me this was perfect because coming from the college I went to back in Zimbabwe, I had this whole thing about I was disciplined. I I was always studying, I was always in the library, so I didn't need I didn't need anyone to hold my hand. You know, I already knew what I wanted to achieve. From when I was little, I wanted to be a neurosurgeon. And it came really from an advert that used to come on TV, and it was like, these kids say, When I grow up, I want to be a tennis player. When I grow up, I want to be this. When I grow up, I want to be a neurosurgeon. I remember looking at that and I said to my dad, what's a neurosurgeon? He was like, Oh, someone works on the brains. And I was like, people work on brains, and it was like, Yeah, yeah, sometimes the brains need fixing. And I was like, Oh, I'd really love to fix brains. So up until that point, I'd always thought, right, I want to be a neurosurgeon. Didn't really quite understand the steps towards getting that. And then it kind of came, you know, I stopped thinking like that. And I started thinking, okay, dad has been successful, dad's a mechanical engineer, and maybe I should do that. And that was one of the first things that the college asked us. So you had to fill in a form, what do you want to become? What subjects are you gonna do to do that? So I wrote mechanical engineer, biology, chemistry, maths, and then the first year finished. And then I got called in to um someone's office, and I thought I was in trouble. I had no reason to think that. But I went into the office and and I still remember his name, Phil Nelson, was sat there and he said, um internationally, and I said, yeah. And he goes, It says hey, you want to be a mechanical engineer? And I was like, Yeah. And he was like, um, why do you want to do that? And I said, because um my dad does it, so it'll make it easier for me when I go to university. And he said, I think you should aim higher. And I said, Oh, so I was a little bit offended by what he said, and I said, Well, what do you want me to do? And he was like, I think you should become a medic. Um, and I said, Medic? Like as in a doctor, and he was like, Yeah, and I said, Yeah, I don't want to sit behind a desk writing prescriptions, no offense to doctors, obviously. But this is the thinking that I had at the time. Um, and he said, Okay, so what do you want to do? And I said, Um, I wanna I like I like doing stuff with my hands, and he said, Okay, why don't you um be a dentist then? And I said, Nah, I'm not gonna be a dentist, I'm not you know, sitting there looking in people's mouths, yeah, that just doesn't do it for me. And he said, Okay, let's do it this way. There's a dentistry open day tomorrow at Sheffield University. If you go there, whatever time it finishes, as soon as it finishes, you can go home. And the reason you were saying that is because I used to receive EMA, which is education maintenance.
SPEAKER_02I forgot about EMA. What was that? 30 pounds a week or something.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so EMA is uh 30 pounds a week that the government would pay students to attend college, but it was a bit like going for a job. So you had to you had to be there from nine to five every day. But if you missed a day in the week, you wouldn't get paid. So he was basically saying tomorrow's Friday, if you go to this open day, and if if let's say it finishes at noon, you can go straight home, you don't have to come back to the college to finish off the hours. So I said that oh. What I'll do, I'll just go for an hour or two, and then I'll just go home and relax. So I said, yeah, I'll do it. So I um I left, went to Sheffield Uni the next day. It was in the orthodontic department, and I was there, I was watching them change the colour of the elastics. Uh they showed me before and after images of teeth being straightened. Um, and everyone was just really nice to me, and there were other people having a look, but I felt like it was just me there. And and then I thought, oh, well, let me ask them a bit about their lives. And like one of them was telling me they lived in this massive house, and I was giving a cake. And then another one was talking about a Porsche, and I was like, okay. I was like, I could see myself doing this. This this might be the thing that I want to do. So I stayed there until 7 p.m. Like I was one of the last people to leave, and they were putting out the lights and everything, and then I went home, and then on the Monday I had to go back into college and I had to report back to Phil. So I went to Phil's office, knocked on the door, and Phil was sat behind the desk. He had a big newspaper. I'll never forget that. It was covering his whole face, just you could see his hands from the side, and his feet were coming up from underneath the newspaper.
SPEAKER_02Like a broadsheet, yeah.
SPEAKER_01And it's almost as if he just knew it was me who'd come in to see him, and he said, Tanashi, um, so what do you think? And I was like, Um, I think, I think we're gonna apply for dentistry. And then he like scrunched over his newspaper and was like, right, let's do it.
SPEAKER_02Well, have you spoken to him since?
SPEAKER_01I haven't, no.
SPEAKER_02You need to find nothing else than Antalia.
SPEAKER_01I need to find more because I will definitely not be sat here if it wasn't for him.
SPEAKER_02It's so crazy, isn't it, that someone can have that much of an effect on where your life goes.
SPEAKER_01Absolutely crazy.
SPEAKER_02Good man. You saw something.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I saw something, definitely.
SPEAKER_02So you started dental school in what year?
SPEAKER_01So I started dental school in um 2008.
SPEAKER_02Um in Sheffield.
SPEAKER_01In Sheffield, yeah. The the journey from Phil Nelson saying let's do it to going to Sheffield wasn't like straightforward. So Phil Phil Nelson said yes, and then the exam results came out, and I got AAC. And I'd applied to all so I'd so I then applied to I'd applied to all these universities, including Sheffield, and I got rejected without interview, got four rejections, or is it five, something like that? So I was like, that's another, you know, I've fallen again, you know. So I started spiring and I was thinking, oh, it's not gonna happen now. Like I have to reset these exams, and yeah, it was it was um it was a tricky moment for me because you know I had to I had to believe in myself, but at the same time I had to be realistic about what was possible because in this moment I had so many different ways I could go to the point that clearing I I went on clearing and it was the last day of clearing and I was looking at optometry, optometry that's so interesting, yeah.
SPEAKER_02For those who are listening, that's what Tasha's wife does. Pretty much same field, yeah.
SPEAKER_01So I started looking at eyes, and I thought, you know, I've got the grades, I could do this. But then just when like the last few minutes were going through, I just snapped out of it. I was like, no, I I can't do that. I need to finish what I started. So I left it, closed the laptop, and I was like, right, I'm just gonna leave it and we'll see what we can do. That same day I went to college and I got called into one of the offices, and there were like three teachers sat in front of me and they said, Right, Tanashi, you know, you got the C in biology, but um, we really believe in you. We believe that we can that you together we can make it into an A and that you can you know get into dentistry. I was like, wow, so they believe in me, they must see something in me. So then I thought, yeah, I can I can do this because they believe in me. So I was like, cool, I'll come to the lessons where like you don't have to pay anything for it, and you know, you come in the afternoons and all this kind of stuff. We did we did that, got the C into an A, had to obviously apply again through UCAS, and then um And you'd found a job to do at the same time, yeah. So during during all of that, decided to look for a job because I was I was forced into a gap year basically. Initially, I was at home, I was being a bum, and I was just um yeah, I wasn't doing anything. I was just waking up really late and going to sleep really late. And um, during that time I was living with one of my cousins, and we shared this small room and it had one single bed, and we used to take turns um in the single bed. So he used to sleep on the floor one night, I used to sleep on the bed one night, and then we kept changing and changing. He was working at um what's it called, William Hill bedding shop, and I was I wasn't doing anything.
SPEAKER_02So this went on for like should have given him the bed, Tash.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, eventually he was like, dude, I'm working. I need to sleep on the bed. Um, so after two months, he came in from work. Um and I sat there, I was playing FIFA. I've been playing FIFA for two months, all day and all night. And he said, dude, you need to find a job. Like, you can't just be sitting at home. And I said, Oh, okay. So I printed off 50 CVs. I remember because I had to go somewhere else to print them in the shop. I paid for 50 CVs and I went to Medal Hall, and then I went to all these stores just dropping a CV. Hi, I want to leave a CV, I want to leave a CV, I want to leave a CV. And then by the time I'd finished, I had one CV left, and I thought, okay, couldn't couldn't think of anywhere else to leave the CV. So got on the bus, and then as the bus was getting home, there was one more like open place that I could possibly leave a CV, and it was um Healy Retail Park.
SPEAKER_02I know it well.
SPEAKER_01And Healy Retail Park has this big booster chemist. Um and uh and I wasn't gonna get off the bus because in my mind, like Boots has this like place where it couldn't possibly give me a job. Like I was like, I don't fit the aesthetic, it's just never gonna happen. But for some reason, I was like, well, I'm not gonna take this CV home. I can't, I'm not taking it through the house. So I decided to get off the bus. I went to Boots and I walked through the doors, and um, there was this lady stood there. She smiled, hi, welcome to Boots, blah blah blah. And I was like, Oh, hi, I'm Antasham, just came to leave my CV. And she was like, Oh, okay, yeah, leave it with me. She took the CV and then she like um smiled at me, and then she turned it on and she walked off. And I thought, yeah, she's putting that straight into the bin. Nothing's gonna happen. So uh got back on the bus, went home, and then I didn't think anything of it. Monday comes and I'm fast asleeping. I'm going through my routine of wake up late, play some feature, and then my dad calls me out, and I'm like, what? And he's like, Oh, someone's called you. And I said, Oh, no one ever calls me. Like, why? I was like, Who is it? And he was like, Oh, it's someone from Booth. And I was like, Oh, I was like, Oh, so got out of bed, dashed to the phone, and I was like, hello, and they were like, um, hi, is that Tanashia? And so yeah, and they said, Um, oh, um, you got to receive you, would like to offer you an interview? And I was like, Oh, thank you, yeah, thank you so much. Um, so I went for the interview. It was really interesting. Um, them talking about you know boots and all of this stuff, and they gave me a trolley and they said, Here's a list of things you need to find these things in one minute. So I went around finding those things.
SPEAKER_02Like a trolley dash. That's amazing.
SPEAKER_01I went around, got all these things in like 45 seconds, and they said, Oh, this is really good. Um, and then I so I'm I'm starting to thinking, oh, I've got this job, like this is easy. And then um, you know, as all companies say, Oh, we've got other candidates coming in. Um, so you know, we'll let you know next week. Another four, I'm thinking, oh gosh, definitely not getting this job. There's like 10 other people. There's no point in them picking me, surely you're not gonna pick me. So then I went home and I thought, and my dad was like, How did they all go? I said, Oh, they didn't offer me the job. They said there's other people, so I don't think it's gonna happen. So that week went by, didn't hear anything, and I thought, probably never gonna hear from them. Monday comes, dad shouts at me again early in the morning, Ashley, phone's for you. And I'm thinking, who is it? And then he's like, It's Boots. And I was like, Oh. So I'm thinking, oh, they're probably gonna tell me the story, you know, we weren't chosen. So I pick up the phone, like, oh hi, um, is that Smash? I was like, Yeah, and they're like, Oh, you know, you thought you did really well at the interview, like to offer you the job. And I went crazy. My dad was just looking at me like, what's going on?
SPEAKER_03And I was like, Oh, they're giving me the job, they're giving me the job, and it was like, Oh, congrats!
SPEAKER_01And then he just turned around and went back on the screw. Um, so then I started I started working at Boots, and that continued up until um I went to uni 2008. Um, and then you worked through uni. I worked through uni, yeah. I worked through uni, started off on the tails in boots, then I became a healthcare assistant, and then after finishing that, then I became a boots manager, bossing people around me. Um, you know, there's an there's a spill on L5, you need to go and saw your Hannah, you know, stuff like that.
SPEAKER_02Kind of went to your head, did it?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah, power went to my head. Power's always gone to my head.
SPEAKER_02So 2008 is when we all met you at Sheffield Dunderscore. So imagine if you had got the A the year before.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_02How different uni would have been. You'd have ne we'd have never the same group would never have formed.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Same group would never have formed. I don't even know where I'd be right now. It's interesting.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I mean, I'm thinking maybe be in the year above, but yeah. No disrespect to the year above. There's I'm already thinking of so many nice ones I can think of, but I just can't imagine.
SPEAKER_01I couldn't even imagine myself in that year. Because I remember um a bit later on, after we'd started and you know, established myself. I've got my friends thinking I could have ended up in the year above, but I just can't see anyone I could have got on with.
SPEAKER_02Um when we met Tash, he was uh I think you were a day or two late or something. Well, that's how I remember it in my head, or meeting you a bit later than the rest. But you were you were like sloped over this lecture theatre bench, like oh cool. You had this half your scalp was shaved into a star and these massive earrings, like brighter than the sun.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, back back then I had a very different um aesthetic. Um, I think everything I did was like kind of really based on America because in Zimbabwe it's all like a bit more international. Yeah, it's more international, it's more based on America and you know, hip-hop and 50s and all that kind of stuff.
SPEAKER_02You were exactly who I went to school with, so I was like, oh, this this guy seems cool. It's like, you know, who I've grown up with.
SPEAKER_01Um I showed I showed up obviously on on day one, and I had I had the barber uh a shooting star on my on my sculpt here, which I thought was really good.
SPEAKER_02Is that deliberate for fresh this week?
SPEAKER_01It was deliberate, yes.
SPEAKER_02I love that.
SPEAKER_01So I had this huge star here, um, which was done pretty neatly. It wasn't like some rubbish. Um and I had some earrings, back pen. Um yeah, and then like I just looked like I dropped in from New York basically.
SPEAKER_02You just you I think I'm laughing, I'm not laughing badly. I think you just had for one. Of better words, you just like swag personified. Like, oh, you don't want to hang around with this guy. How did you how did you find dental school?
SPEAKER_01Dental school was interesting because I think you know, it was totally different to having to study when you're at boarding school. You're trying to you're trying to use everything you know from the past in order to help you get to the things in your present and the future. So when I was at school, I was used to doing well, being top of the class. And it's something that I wanted to continue at university, because you know, everyone in dentistry, they're all bright heads, everyone's like really clever, it's so difficult to get to that point. But even amongst all those peers, you want to be the best. Um, so you're always trying to find where you fit in. Every point in my life I've had to find where I fit in. You have to make new friends, and you have to see which friends are worth having as friends and which people are just kind of your columns.
SPEAKER_02Why did you pick 99 then? Um Tash used to live at uh their house number was 99, and forever now they're known as the 99 boys.
SPEAKER_0199 boys, yeah. Um, so I picked, I don't know. I think sometimes you just kind of feel a vibe when you meet people. And the first person from the 99 boys that I met that I worked with was um Joseph. Uh Dr.
SPEAKER_02Nakanza.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, shout out to Yunker Nakanza. And I actually met um Dr. Nakanza maybe like a year before when we were back when we were going for the interviews.
SPEAKER_03Really?
SPEAKER_01So I went to the uni interview, and it was just me. My dad didn't come. I just turned up it was just me in this suit, and managed to borrow my dad's suit um because I could fit in the one that he gave me. I'd bucked up a little bit. Um and the first thing I noticed when I went to the interviews was I'd left something behind. Alright. Everyone had either the mum or the dad or both there.
SPEAKER_02Can I tell you a funny story about that in a second?
SPEAKER_01So I'm looking around, everyone's got someone with them, and I'm sat there and it's just me. Um and it could have easily shook me, but I was just like, well, you know, is what it is. And I remember seeing Joseph. So I sat there and I and I see this guy, and he's got this massive alpha. Didn't he? It was literally out here, I'm not exaggerating. And I'm looking at him and I'm thinking, you know, I'm looking, I'm I'm sizing up the competition. I'm thinking, okay, uh, they're gonna give people places. Um, there's another black guy there. He's got this after that doesn't look neat. So knock him out. He's out. So you know, that could be a place for me. So I just sat there sizing up because you know I had no one with me, so I just I was just thinking whatever I wanted. But evidently, obviously, we're friends, he's he's now a doctor. So I then I met him on you know this first day. I'm like, oh, this is the guy that I saw in the interview. So I woke up to him and I and I told him, I said, Oh, I saw you at the interview, he obviously didn't remember me. Um I said, I saw you in the interview, you had this new jaffo, and in my mind I was like, You ain't getting a place, and obviously you're here. And we I think we like kind of bonded over that.
SPEAKER_02And then I can just imagine him laughing, being like, Who's this guy?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah. So I was speaking to him and he was like, he was he he said those exact words, he was like, Who's this guy? And like, why did why did he think that he would get a place over me? Um, but yeah, we laugh about it now, but that's like my biggest memory from from applying. Um but I did enjoy uni. Uni was fun, um it was challenging. I think every turn we would have three or four weeks where it was really intense. So outside of those four weeks, went out, enjoyed life, you know, went to the lectures. But those those three four weeks we were in the library, we were sitting there, we were doing the hard work. And then when as soon as it finished, we went back to kind of living normal lives. And that happened all the way, first year, all the way through to fifth year. And obviously, fifth year came, did the final exams. And I remember being in the in the finals in the OSTs, and I was asked a question that I had studied really well for. You know, like when you get ready for an exam, like if someone had said to you, this question is coming, and you studied just for that question, and then that question comes, you'd think I'm gonna nail this, like you didn't 100%. That happened to me. This question came, I didn't know it was coming, but I'd studied for this question so much that when it came, I froze.
SPEAKER_03Oh.
SPEAKER_01And I sat there and I froze, and I could not answer the question. And and one of my tutors was there, and she knew that I could answer the question, but she also knew that the person who was sat in front of her wasn't the same person that she knew. So she was like, time out, let me have a baby here. So she took me to the side and she was like, Look, what's wrong? You've got this. You know, you I know you know how to answer the question because when we did A V and C, you answered this question like fluently.
SPEAKER_02Who was that?
SPEAKER_01I think it was uh Martin, Mrs.
SPEAKER_02Oh Rachel Martin, our lovely lady.
SPEAKER_01And she said to me, I know you've got this. Yeah, shout out to Mrs. Martin. She said, I know you got this. It's okay. You know, it's just nerves. And I was so anyway, I went back in there and eventually I answered it. And every you could see the whole room. I think there were three people in there. They were lighting up, like cheering me on, like, come on, you've got this. Like, finish off the colour. Like you say, say more, keep going. Um, and then like in the end, obviously, I I did pass, but it was like really emotional because I thought there's a chance that I failed this and I have to repeat. But luckily I came through, and then you know, dentistry, the real world started.
SPEAKER_02Quickly on that, I'm gonna tell you about my dental interview really quickly because I've forgotten about it till you said. When I went to my Liverpool interview, I was on my own. Went on a train, you know, it's quite a big deal, isn't it? You're only little, and um, I'd got this like outfit I'd planned, I can still picture over like black boots, this like cargo midi skirt types, black polo, cosmopolitan Starbucks, like fake Mark Jacobs bag, and I was going in. I sat reading my cosmopolitan and reading my Starbucks, and there's this guy opposite me, my first interview with his dad, firing questions, and I kid you not, he had a monocle. You know, I think I remember sitting there, like, I'm I'm done, I'm not gonna play. And this lovely scouse girl came to collect them from, and I can't do a scouse accent for the life of me, but she came and got me and we were in the lift, and she just looked at me and she's like, suck it to him, girl. I was like, okay. I'll try. But you know, those moments in your life where you're so sheltered, you only know your school, your friends, and you're suddenly out there. I remember my mum telling me, like, you've got to work really hard because you're up against private schools, you know, private tutors have got to get in there. And I don't think it registered till I saw them monocle. Those boys still part of your life?
SPEAKER_01Yes, the boys are a big part of my life. Um obviously lived in this house and yet eight of us. And we pretty much helped each other through pretty much everything, like through the exams, through nights out, through relationships, through you know, things happening in your personal life, you know. And even to this day we're we're always collaborating, always talking on the group WhatsApp.
SPEAKER_02Um if anything happens to anyone, we'll drop everything and we'll and we'll I do think what you guys have is is very special with outstanding sappy. Especially nowadays with um men's mental health and how important people talk about, you know, men's speaking. You guys do see each other regularly and look after one another.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_02I think it is really really important.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and I think it needs to be more of that because I think dentistry is quite isolating. And if you're isolated, there's a number of different ways things can go. Like um when you have a complaint and it can be difficult to overcome it and go you know. I'm sure lots of people have had complaints and it's quite difficult to sleep, quite difficult to like do anything really. But when you have people really close to you, it kind of gives you a perspective on what's happening. And nine times out of ten, someone's been in that situation that you're in, and they can help you to like overcome it. So it's been yeah, it's been really instrumental in taking me to where I've been, where I've been now. I've been doing dentistry for 13 years, um, and I couldn't have done it without them. And even these boys, um, you know, we we finished uni and that group grew into something else. We grew into another group of boys, and now that group has like five people.
SPEAKER_02I call them the laterals, but they are their own group, and yeah, this group is now huge.
SPEAKER_01Absolutely huge. 25 of us, uh, we're all doing like different things, um, in specialties like implants. Some of us are cosmodentists. Some of us have gone into max facts. So whenever there's an issue or a problem, you know, we're sharing ideas, sharing problems, and helping each other to solve them. So I think yeah, it's good, it's really important.
SPEAKER_02There's zero judgment in groups like that, as well, isn't it? You can put any kind of case up and you're not thinking out what they're gonna think because they're your friends, which is um quite unique. It's that collaboration.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Have you had any specific mentors? I know you mentioned Phil in sixth form, Patrick Martin in finals. Any specific mentors or people that you've have kind of helped along the way, apart from friends.
SPEAKER_01Um well, I have a me I have a mentor who helped me to um my foundation year. My foundation year is interesting because Were you in Doncaster? I was in Doncaster, yeah. Um so when I first started my my uh foundation year, um something happened with my registration. So when you go to foundation year, you have to hand in certain documents and things.
SPEAKER_02Which I'm a really weird system, actually. You get your degree and then you have to go and ask for permission to work, even though you've got your VT place. It's very odd.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. So I ha so I handed in these documents and and I think we had to post them. And um we started working whilst they were still processing these things. And then it got to a point where there was a cutoff where if certain documents hadn't been handed in, then you couldn't work. So suddenly um I got a call from I don't know if it was the deanery or something. They called me and they said, look, you can't you can't work from Tuesday. They called me on like a Friday and said on Tuesday you have to stop working because you're not registered, you haven't sent us the documents. And I'd sent them a few months before, but I couldn't remember for the life of me if I'd actually sent them. So it was like a bit of a blur. So, me being honest, I went to my trainer and I said, um, yeah, I have to stop working on Tuesday, and um, I'm really sorry, but I thought I'd handed them in and I didn't get the support that I thought I should get. Instead, all I got was, I can't believe you did that. You know, this is really bad. You need to sort it out. This, that, and the other. So then I scrambled to try and get my references and get these documents again. And then Monday night came, and I was thinking, oh, this isn't gonna happen. I'd sent emails to you the weekend, and luckily people had started replying to me. And then Monday night came and I got a call from the deaner, and they were like, I there was a problem with the post. The post was delivered to the wrong room, so no one could find it. But we've actually got your documents so you can continue working from tomorrow because it's all been sorted. So I put the phone down. Then they called my trainer and they said the same thing to my trainer. So I was in the change room thinking, oh my goodness for that. And then the trainer opened the door, and then they said, um, oh, it's Nashley, I've sorted out that situation. Um, so it's all good. Um, so you know, you you can come to work tomorrow. And I was like, hold on, wait a minute. So I so they were about to leave because I was changing, and I said, I said, wait a minute. I said, they've just called me before they called you, and they've told me that there was a problem with the mail and they're found. They said, and the trainer said, Oh yeah, yeah, that that's it, that's it. And I said, um, so don't take the credit for that. Um and then I said, I told you that I had handled this stuff in, but instead of supporting me, you started, you know, attacking me and saying all this and all that. Um and I said you shouldn't you shouldn't make any associate feel that way. And I said, I don't think you should have any foundation students after I'm done. And I'm going to let you know the deanery know this.
SPEAKER_02That's very brave of you.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Um I was filming. And then that trainer said, really apologetic. I'm really sorry. Please don't do that. Blah blah blah. And I'll support you. So then the next day came and it was a totally different trainer. Didn't used to say morning to me or anything. That morning came in, holding a copy. I got you a Costa coffee. Uh how's everything? Do you need anything? Um, I'm going to this training session. Do you want to come as well? So that year was turned out to be really amazing because I had all this support. I didn't have to pay for anything. All my petrol and everything got paid for.
SPEAKER_02Really?
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_02You learned a good lesson there. Like you stood up for yourself and it worked out.
SPEAKER_01I did, yeah. But I feel like I've always done that. Like with the bullies at school, the same thing. You gotta stand up for yourself.
SPEAKER_02You gotta where does that come from though? Because I I definitely didn't have that at school. All uni. I nowadays it's easy, but when you're that young.
SPEAKER_01I think I think I got all those ideas from watching movies.
SPEAKER_02Really?
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Avid movie watcher at that age. What kind of movies?
SPEAKER_01I love watching movies. Like my favorite is like comedies and action. Like I'll sit, I'll sit and watch any comedy because it's uh White Chicks is my favorite movie. I've watched that a bunch of times, like maybe 27 times now. Really? And I tell people that they don't believe me. I can recite it word for word. Um so I so I watch films and I see things happen in films, and a lot of the time I remember things, and then I think, huh, maybe if I did that it might work. Maybe if I did this, it might work. So everything I've done in the past where I've like, right, I'm gonna beat this bully, not through fit physical punches, but mentally, is because I've seen it somewhere. But I feel like we all learn from seeing things somewhere. If we learn to be scared of something, we've seen someone.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, an example.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. If we learn to be courageous or strong, it's because we've maybe seen our parents be courageous and strong. So watching movies has always been something that I enjoy. Um I really get immersed in movies and then learn from I I get a learning point from anything I watch.
SPEAKER_02A lot of them are based on real life, aren't they? They are maybe not white chicks.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_02I mean white chicks is thinking of other ones. Um yeah, I mean, your life's like a movie Tash.
SPEAKER_00It feels like it, certainly.
SPEAKER_02You I was before I was due to beauty today, I was trying to think of someone I know that works harder than you, and I struggled. And now listening to your story and your dad and moving countries, it kind of I can see where it comes from more. But at one point you were working in five cities, you flew up to Newcastle from London every week or twice a week, and even now I have a notes app in my phone to I have to update on the regular way you're working, just so I don't pester them too much to go for a beer after work. But where well it's obvious where it comes from to me, but why do you think it's you flying up and down the country? Because no one else I know has ever done that for a dental job.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so a bottle of flying um was during COVID. So during COVID, obviously, the world went on a standstill, and um people were spent about what's having social media, Instagram. I got a message on Instagram from a practice, and they said, How's this up in Newcastle? And they said, Look, we're we're like really busy, we really love your work, um, and we'd like you to come and work with us. And I thought just off Instagram, just off Instagram, just random message that came to, and I thought, oh, this is one of my friends playing a trick on me.
SPEAKER_02Did you?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I thought I didn't know who it was, but I was like, someone's playing a trick on me.
SPEAKER_02We've got everyone but a joy.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and I thought, and they're trying to make me like, you know, I'll turn up one day to meet the boys and they'll be like, Did you really think that I'll practice messaging and said come and work with her? kind of thing. But I thought, okay, let me think of it from both sides. If it's if this is real, I need to approach it in the right way. So I started replying, and then eventually they said, come up and have a look. And mind you, I was living in Bristol at the time. So went over, there were no planes flying at this time because you know it was just after COVID, there were no flights. So I got the train, went there, had a look, and they said, you know, we're really busy, and they told me how busy they were, and I was like, okay, this is ideal. Um, and it was a time when I hadn't actually started doing any composite bonding, and they said, we need you for composite bonding. I'd only did well, I've just I've done a few cases that I posted. Um but from those cases they said, you know, we think you'd be a good fit. Um so I went up there, and then um we agreed on the contract, and then I started working there. Then they opened up flying. So I'll I'll fly from Bristol to Newcastle. Um, and in that first year that I was working, I took 64 flights. I was a regular in the airport. Madness. It got to a point where I knew, okay, if I get the bus from this point at this time, I'll get to the airport just in time for when it's like 20 more minutes to board.
SPEAKER_02Pass-minute security.
SPEAKER_01Pass-minute security, I'd go through the fast track, and then I just I'd literally just be walking all the way through, and then I'd just get on the plane when everyone was getting on.
SPEAKER_02The thing is, with you, I don't think you see that as hard work. I think that's the difference.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I don't.
SPEAKER_02I think you see it as adventure. I do.
SPEAKER_01I do, I do.
SPEAKER_02Is that correct?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, you're correct. I um I always think to myself, um, why not? All the time, I'm like, why not? Someone will say to me, Can you do this? Will you do that? I'm like, why not?
SPEAKER_02I never, I've never heard you moan about working hard.
SPEAKER_01Never.
SPEAKER_02Um but you don't burn yourself out either. I think you are interesting.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_02What do you do to stop working too hard? Like, what are your limits? What do you do to look after yourself?
SPEAKER_01So One of the things is watching movies, obviously, as I've mentioned.
SPEAKER_02What's your favorite movie of all time apart from White Chicks?
SPEAKER_01Um, recently, my favorite movie is um Avengers um Infinity War, and and I have a good reason for that.
SPEAKER_02I've never seen any of them.
SPEAKER_01Well, you've never seen The Avengers. So the The Avengers with Thanos is not like my favorite movie. And the reason I say that is when you watch movies that have this kind of storyline where there is a hero and there's a villain, usually those storylines are all the same. There's a hero, there's a villain who comes up against him, the hero beats the villain, and then it's a happy story at the end. And usually the reason why the villain is a villain isn't like a good reason. They're just being evil to be evil. So, like when you look at it, in your mind you feel like this is a bad person, so you know, the person the hero has to win and you're happy with that. But when you look at the Avengers with Thanos, the reason Thanos was doing what he's doing and you know, collecting all the Finding Stones to snap is actually for a good reason that we're currently living in now, where the world is getting overpopulated and resources are, you know, eventually will run out and all those kind of things, and we see and we see it with all the pollution and all this. And his reason for wanting to go on this quest is because in the planet that he was on, that planet ended up dying off because it ran out of resources and everyone died. And his whole thing was if I if we had wiped the innovative, well, if we'd wiped the cut the planet of half of the people, then the resources would have been still available and and the planet where he came from.
SPEAKER_02A place of fear.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, a place of fear and a place of like make things continue. That's interesting because I look at it, I can see it from his point of view that if we want to fix the world, you could like snap everyone away. People won't really feel any pain because they just kind of disappear, and that's and that kind of solves a lot of the problems that we have. So it's different. That movie is different in that sense.
SPEAKER_02So it's got you thinking.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it gets you thinking from the point of view of the villain, and you kind of see the villain as a good guy in a sense.
SPEAKER_02Any other ones apart from Avengers?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, there's um like of all time. Oh god. There's a lot of movies, like um, I don't know, a lot of movies are based on actual real life, uh how people lived, like you know, ones that depict Nars and Mandela, and you know, it's it's difficult. I've seen so many movies, like there's no standout pre-bills. I can only think of White Chicks and and the Marvel movies.
SPEAKER_02What's your favorite quote from White Chicks? Come on. We've already gone over, so this is gonna be a part two.
SPEAKER_01It's the it's well, it's the oh my gosh, you want to talk about Marvel? It's mother time, and then yeah, it just continues like that. There's a bunch of lines in there.
SPEAKER_02There's a lot of quotes, yeah. Apart from movies, what other passions do you have outside of dentistry?
SPEAKER_01Um, so I'm a very creative person. Um, so I like to write poetry.
SPEAKER_02Do you?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, in my spare time, I write poetry. I also in my spare time write um children's books. I have a book that I've written. It's called The Mischievous Max.
SPEAKER_02Is that the one that's available on Amazon? I'm not saying that to plug it. I'm sure I've heard you sent that now.
SPEAKER_01It might it might be.
SPEAKER_02Mischievous Max.
SPEAKER_01Mischievous Max, yeah. And it's basically about a boy called Max, um, who is totally made up. I don't know anyone called Max or Maxwell. And it's 10 different adventures that he goes on. Um one of the adventures um is called Sweet Smuggler. Um, and I wrote I wrote Mischievous Max when I was in Australia, so I went to Australia in 2015.
SPEAKER_02After VT?
SPEAKER_01After VT, after my foundation training. Um and while I was there, I thought, you know what, I'm gonna write this book because I just had I think I was in my creative era during the time. And the Sweet Smuggler I wrote because there was the whole thing about Jamie Oliver and Trigger. And um in the Sweet Smuggler, Max has his best friend called Gavin. And um at school, suddenly the the canteen or the sweets they no longer sell sweets because of this whole Jamie Oliver thing. So the sweets get locked up so that no one has access to them. And even when you buy them, there's only so many that you can buy because it's all about reduced to your shit consumption. So then Max and Gathering decide they're gonna take the sweets for themselves, they're gonna steal them and smuggle them. So they hash out this pan, they put together all sorts of equipment, like you know, you create your helmet and you put a torch on it with elastic bands and all that kind of stuff. And then, and ropes and all this thing, and then they have to get into the canteen past the school security guards, and and then eventually they get the sweets, but it's quite difficult to smuggle them out because then you've got the school's security dog coming after them, and there's all sorts of happening, all the chaos that happens um up until they eventually get the sweets into their dormitory.
SPEAKER_02You might have to download it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it's quite a good story, it's quite creative.
SPEAKER_02Poetry.
SPEAKER_01Sorry?
SPEAKER_02Poetry about about anything in particular or some of the poems are to do with um um myself and things I've gone through.
SPEAKER_01So they're not sad poems.
SPEAKER_02Do you read do you read other people's poems, like famous poets, or is it more?
SPEAKER_01I can't stand reading other people's poems.
SPEAKER_02Because it means nothing to you.
SPEAKER_01It means nothing to me, yeah. So I do it for myself, and I don't know how I got into the habit. I just started doing it and I just kept on doing it. I think it was what I think it was because we must do poetry and um studying English, literature.
SPEAKER_02I've never known that about you, but I do that. And I don't read other people's poems either. But I I don't know. I think there's if you're trying to make something rhyme in my head and you're trying to get something down on paper, it's much more fun to do it as like a something that's rhyming or something that follows a pattern to get it out of your mind than just writing paragraphs to me.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_02It's more enjoyable. And then you sometimes shock yourself and think, oh, I didn't know it was feeling that way.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I didn't know.
SPEAKER_02But it rhymes. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01So that so I've got that poetry, I've got the books, um I love Lego sets, so started collecting them. I've got currently, I think I've got over 300 Lego sets.
SPEAKER_02Have you?
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Never know never. All boxed up all in a warehouse. Ready. Ready, yeah.
SPEAKER_02For when the children are older?
SPEAKER_01No, for when I'm gonna sell them one day.
SPEAKER_02Oh, to sell oh, okay. Yeah. So like rare pieces.
SPEAKER_01Very rare pieces. They're like they don't even make these anymore. And so I collect loads of Lego sets. Um, some of them I have with me. Um just waiting to open them because they're my favourites, but I haven't quite been pushed to open them yet.
SPEAKER_02Anything else?
SPEAKER_01Um I love uh flying, love travelling. Really into flying. Love going to loads of places, love going on holiday.
SPEAKER_02Where's your favourite places recently?
SPEAKER_01My favorite place that I usually go is uh Croatia. And I've been there plenty of times with my um with all my best friends. Um but obviously there's loads of other places to go. I've really love to go to Africa this year. The Serengeti, um, a bit of safari. I think that's pretty cool. I did safari when I was about nine years old back in Zimbabwe.
SPEAKER_02Have you have you been back since she moved?
SPEAKER_01I went to Zimbabwe in 2017, quite a while back.
SPEAKER_02Um be nice to take a family.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I think I'll go back again maybe end of this year. I want to do Zimbabwe and then maybe uh South Africa and then maybe go somewhere up to Tanzania or something like that.
SPEAKER_02What do you love about traveling?
SPEAKER_01I love planes, I just love aviation. Um I know this sounds weird, but I love knowing how an aeroplane works. I love knowing why planes crash. So I sit there and I watch these videos, crash investigations, just trying to find out why it's like the red box or whatever they call it.
SPEAKER_02What is it called?
SPEAKER_01The black box. The black box, yeah. So I try and find out everything about planes. So initially, when I didn't watch it, I think I started watching it when I did the 64 flights. Because I was like, if I'm if I'm gonna do these flights every week.
SPEAKER_02Practically driving.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. If I do these flights every week, there's a chance that one of them could go down. So I wanted to know what what the risk was. So I sat there watching these videos, and then eventually I realized that obviously it's very safe. People say it's safer than driving, but I didn't really I couldn't really quantify what that actually meant.
SPEAKER_02I heard you're more likely to This is a bit more of it, isn't it? You're more likely to die in a car accident in the Uber on the way to the airport than you are in the plane. Exactly. Which puts things into perspective.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. So I love planes, I love sitting in the airport, I love people watching. Um yeah.
SPEAKER_02What do you like about watching the people in the airport?
SPEAKER_01I just like think like you know, um makes me feel like an ant.
SPEAKER_02You know, like in a good way. Like you're so tiny. Everyone's got their own everyone's got their own story and they're going here, there, and everywhere in the world. You're insignificant in a good way.
SPEAKER_01I think I think the word is is it called sonda? Maybe. I think it's the word I think the word is called sonda. It's like the realization that everyone's living their own lives.
SPEAKER_02Um and they're the main character in their own.
SPEAKER_01And then the main character in their own lives, and you're just watching and you're thinking, I wonder what that person does. I wonder where they're going. And you know, they're hugging people and saying goodbye and crying.
SPEAKER_02I always think that when you're walking the streets and you're looking into people's living rooms.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_02And the lights on, or it's Christmas, everyone's got a little tree, and you're like. We're only as big as our own little world.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_02It's a it's a comforting thing somehow.
SPEAKER_01It's pretty awesome.
SPEAKER_02I think everyone has a story and do you do any sports?
SPEAKER_01Um I play football. I'm really good as a striker, but I'm not very balanced in terms of my feet. So I get injured every time. Um but it's probably because I've never actually trained to play football properly. Um apart from that, when I was in school I did all the sports. Uh when we were at the boarding school, we had we played rugby, hockey, uh football, um, horse riding.
unknownReally?
SPEAKER_01We game it, we did it. Really? Yeah, we went to it all. It was like that kind of school. Swimming track? Track, yeah, 800 meters. I was really good at cross-country.
SPEAKER_02Really?
SPEAKER_01I was one of the top I had really good endurance. So cross-country makes it.
SPEAKER_02I don't mean this in a bad way, but you're not built like a cross-country runner. I know, but that's interesting.
SPEAKER_01I could I could I could I think that's mental. I could run my top song.
SPEAKER_02Mental endurance.
SPEAKER_01What what's really crazy is um when I was at school, I was I was always in the finals of the high jump.
SPEAKER_02Sorry, defash. Really?
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Um did you go to school with?
SPEAKER_01Um, but I was It's amazing. I I hadn't the ability to prepare. I jumped for one with the with the bar, isn't it? Yeah. Jumping, huh? Yeah. I had the ability to jump over that. And I was competing with people like almost like twice my height.
SPEAKER_02Maybe you are just bouncing, agile.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I could just I could just leap into the air and go over it. Obviously, I never got the goals or anything. But I was always like, you know, so you do like athletics then? Right?
SPEAKER_02You do like athletics then.
SPEAKER_01I do love athletics. I do love um watching athletics 100 meters every every year when it's on TV, I'm there. You know, got my popcorn out, got my drink out. I know it's 10 seconds, but you know, it's a good 10 seconds. It's a good 10 seconds, and you and you and you get to watch it all through the prelim preliminaries and the heats.
SPEAKER_02I just love the discipline behind it.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_02It's a what's the it's an individual sport, it's not a team sport.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_02I've never liked team sports, I don't know what that says about me. But it's the self-discipline that it's you and just you, and you go for it.
SPEAKER_00It's it's literally all about you.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00When it comes to that.
SPEAKER_02Competitiveness and drive and pushing pushing the body to its limit, like mentally and physically.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, to its absolute limit.
SPEAKER_02Who's your favorite?
SPEAKER_01My favorite male sprinter. My favorite sprinter is right right now Noah Lyles.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I knew you were gonna say that.
SPEAKER_01And I have a good reason for it. So no, Noah Lyles. The thing is, um I think with Noah, people don't believe in him. They look at him and they think, he's he's he's not gonna do this. Last time I was a fluke, last time I was a fluke, he's not gonna do it this time. And like to put it bluntly, no, Noah's belief in himself overrides the crowd's disbelief. So every time he will say something, he'll say the most outrageously, he'll say, I'm gonna win.
SPEAKER_02He's an entertainer.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, he's an entertainer, he's a showman. He says, I'm gonna do this, I'm gonna do that, and he goes and he does it. And I think that says a lot about a person. When you say you're gonna do something, you should really go and do it.
SPEAKER_02And I think probably that's the kind That's gotta be part of his game plan though, as well. That he's he's telling himself he's doing it, you know, visualization. He you see his post before months before, and he's like, I am winning that. Yeah, he's it's already won. Yeah, it's it's just he's not daft, it's psychology.
SPEAKER_01It's psychology, and yeah.
SPEAKER_02Definitely cocky as well, but I I quite like it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I love I love it when he's like, I'm gonna go.
SPEAKER_02If you can back it in sport, I'm all for being a bit cocky. Just winding people up a little bit.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, just a little bit. Just turn the screens a little bit, see what happens. I I do I do really love that.
SPEAKER_02I love the start line when they the camera goes to each face individually and you're waiting for the reaction. And the ones that don't do anything, you're like, ah, just give us something.
SPEAKER_01Give us something, yeah.
SPEAKER_02You're gonna be in the back.
SPEAKER_01And he and you well, he loves anime, so he's does he? Yeah, he loves anime, so he's always doing something anime-based. Like, I don't watch much anime, but when you see it, you like it kind of gives you an idea of the kind of mental state that he's in. And like it makes you watching him makes me believe in myself, makes me believe that whatever I'm trying to puse, I can do it. But at times, I'm the only one who believes I can do it, and other people can't see it for me.
SPEAKER_02It doesn't matter, it's the only thing that mentors are you believe it. Best thing to invest in.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Going a little bit sideways almost at the end now. It's definitely too proud, so I'd never have to make this. Since becoming a dad, now you've got two little ones. How do you think that's changed you as a clinician? And a person, but as a clinician.
SPEAKER_01I think for everyone initially you do start um living like for yourself and put yourself first. Everything's just about you, and then once you have a child, two children, more children, people that you who are dependent on you, the you know, it's another pivot. So it's all about how can I make their lives better? What can I do now that I wish had been done for me in the past. Obviously, in the past there were opportunities that were present for me when I was born, and some of those opportunities then disappeared, and you know, life did change. So in the same in the same way, in the same way that my dad was building things, you know, for me, I'm doing the same thing for my children, so that um they can have all the things I didn't have. So you you're living, you're no longer living for yourself, you're living for someone else. And it's it's a joy, like I enjoy it. I you know, the decisions that I make about, you know, do I go out anymore? Do I um how much time do I spend away from home? And everything is just like kind of centered around them, but I wouldn't change it for the world.
SPEAKER_02I think it's great. I think we can see the difference, right? It's nice, it's a it's a softness that happens when when the when the guys have the kids.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_02When you were talking just then, I wanted to ask you, and it's a tricky question. Knowing I mean you won't hindsight's a funny thing, isn't it? But going from everything to nothing and then having to work again hard to get back up to where you are today. Do you think you'd be different? Has it changed you as a person? It must have. But then do you think your life trajectory would have been much different if that hadn't have happened? Where do you think you'd be?
SPEAKER_01So when I look at all the points that all the pivoting points in my life, I think the most intruding pivotal point was when my dad lost everything and I had to come to England. So, like growing up, my whole thing, my whole belief, my whole motivation was I knew I was gonna pass my exams and all that kind of stuff. Like that was a given for me because I'd I no one could stop me in that sense. But my whole thing was I was gonna get a scholarship and then I was gonna be in America, and then things were gonna happen for me in America.
SPEAKER_02A sports scholarship or an academic school? Going over for the hijab.
SPEAKER_01Nah, I don't think I could have ever done it for the sports, but academic scholarship. Um, because when I was at St. Ignatius, they there were a lot of scholarships that would be.
SPEAKER_02Where you've come from.
SPEAKER_01A lot of scholarships were provided by um certain universities from America, and so there was a number of students who would always go to America. And for me, like without a doubt, that was my trajectory. I was gonna I was supposed to end up in America, and I probably would have been a medic and probably may have gone on to become a neurosurgeon.
SPEAKER_02Do you know which states they go went to, or cities, or unis?
SPEAKER_01No idea. No idea.
SPEAKER_02Just add it to your list and go and travel it anyway.
SPEAKER_03But yeah.
SPEAKER_02When you can. Going back to when we started, or when you when you got planted in Sheffield out of nowhere before all of that, what advice would you give to someone in that position or one's just starting out at dental school, knowing what you do now?
SPEAKER_01I would probably say that when you uh go through this whole journey, it's not always gonna be, you know, it's it's it's not all gonna be roses. Like you're gonna have ups and downs. You'll have ups and downs that have to do with your personal life, ups and downs that have to do with the actual dentistry itself, ups and downs with maybe finances. There's all sorts of things that will try to um knock you down. But the important thing is. That you get back up and you carry on. And you need people that will help you along the way. You can't do stuff on your own. So you always need supportive environments, supportive friends, and that will take you through anything. I think that's I think that's the take on, yeah.
SPEAKER_02It's a good message. Don't be scared to look for other people. You can't do it alone.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, can't do it alone.
SPEAKER_02Okay, thank you, Tash. I'll leave it there.
SPEAKER_01Thank you.