Ep 10: "I Thought She Was Mean Because She Was Pretty" | Robyn Lietchti

Every friendship has a story — and Robyn's started at a locker in ninth grade with a snap judgment she almost let cost her everything. 

In this episode of The Best Friend Project, host Rachel sits down with journal creator and author Robyn Liechti to talk about the girl she assumed was mean because she was pretty, and the 26-year best friendship that followed once she got out of her own head. 

Together, Rachel and Robyn dig into the loneliness epidemic and the $500 billion industry built around it, why society hands us language for romantic love but not platonic love, the Harvard happiness study linking long-term friendships to living longer, inconsistent effort and mismatched values as the top friendship pain points, being used as an alibi by a friend, why walking away quietly can be healthier than a blowout, and how Robyn turned grief over her grandmothers into 15,000+ self-published journals. 

If you have ever misjudged someone on sight, struggled with adult friendship, or wondered how to find, make, and keep friends as a woman over 30, this conversation is for you.

In This Episode

• The worst first impression that became a 26-year best friendship
• The friendship question almost no one asks
• Is ghosting easier than telling the truth?
• The secret to lifelong friendship? It might be adult sleepovers.

Connect With Robyn

Website

 Instagram @robyn.liechti

To learn more, visit The Best Friend Project.co . While you're there, discover your Friendship Archetype by taking the  Friendship Survey We'd also love to stay in touch—come say hello on Instagram  and Facebook (we will follow you back!)  If you need to reach us, you can always email us at Hello@TheBFProject.com.

Chapters: 

00:00 "I Assumed She Was Mean Because She Was Pretty"

01:00 Welcome to The Best Friend Project

02:00 How We Met: Trader Joe's Muffins in the Trash

03:00 The Harvard Study on Friendship, Health & Longevity

04:00 Loneliness Is Now a $500 Billion Industry

05:00 Connected on Social Media, Still Disconnected

06:00 What Taking the Friendship Survey Revealed

07:00 Why We Never Ask New Friends About Their Friendship History

08:00 The Locker Story: Grade Nine and a Snap Judgment

09:00 Insecurities, Assumptions, and What We Almost Miss

10:00 Different Lives, Same Best Friend: Toronto to the Country

11:00 Adult Sleepovers and Why People Stop Having Them

12:00 Friendship in Departments: Soccer Moms and One-on-Ones

13:00 What It Means to Have "Enough" Friends

14:00 Postcards in Bathrooms: 7,000 Miles of Survey Data

15:00 The Five Friendship Archetypes and the Keystone

16:00 The Skill You're So Good At You Don't Notice It

17:00 From Losing Her Grandmothers to Her First Journal

18:00 Seven Journals, a Kids' Book, and a Part-Time Job

19:00 Picturing the Woman on the Other Side

21:00 Stealth Mode: The Art of the Bathroom Postcard

22:00 Why We Ghost Best Friends Instead of Talking

23:00 Inconsistency: The #1 Friendship Pain Point

24:00 Effort, Values, and Actions That Don't Match

25:00 When a Friend Uses You as an Alibi

26:00 Time Will Either Expose or Promote

27:00 Not Being the Fixer — Walking Away Quietly

28:00 What Robyn Would Say to Her Best Friend

29:00 Look Past the Pretty: Read Their Energy

30:00 Rachel Reflects: Judgments That Stick With Us

31:00 15,000 Journals and "On the Phone With"

32:00 Next Week: Mary McGreevy and Tips from Dead People

#TheBestFriendProject #FemaleFriendship #AdultFriendship #FriendshipPodcast #WomenSupportingWomen #BestFriends #LonelinessEpidemic #FriendshipBreakup #HowToMakeFriends #MakingFriendsAsAnAdult #FriendshipGoals #PlatonicLove #WomenOver40 #JournalingCommunity #SelfPublished #GuidedJournals #KeystoneFriend #FriendshipAdvice #PodcastForWomen #MeaningfulConnection

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

In grade nine, my first year of high school, I had a homeroom and then the lock was right outside. And there was this girl and she was so pretty, and I just kind of assumed that because she was pretty, she was mean. So I think it was it took yeah. So I think it took a few months, not the whole semester or anything, but a few months to kind of warm up and realize like, okay, she's actually a human being and she's so kind and has like the biggest heart ever.

SPEAKER_00 0:30

Look around and you'll see them. Women out walking, in restaurants, at the airport, stores, driving in their cars. Women are everywhere. And every time you see a woman, you're seeing someone who has, at some point, struggled with a friendship. Because it's one of the most complicated, meaningful, and rewarding relationships of our lives. But how to do friendship well isn't talked about enough. So let's start. I'm Rachel Schwartzen, former private investigator and TV journalist, and now host of the Best Friend Project, where we use original data and real stories to better understand how women find, make, and keep their friends. Thank you for listening. So joining me today on the podcast is Robin. And I'm so excited to have met you, although completely randomly on Instagram when I had posted about having to throw away Trader Joe's blueberry muffins by putting soap on them so that I didn't literally fish them out of the trash because they were that delicious. And I was like, I just don't know if anyone else does this because I'm on a quest right now to just kind of see what all people are doing in terms of, you know, being honest about what they do and how they feel about things. And then you responded, and I think that's where we met, right?

SPEAKER_01 1:56

Well, I thought it was a little extreme, but I loved that you were being honest because I remember I commented thinking, and I was being nice and funny, but I'm like, I think I just put mine in the freezer. And you were like, Yeah, no, that wouldn't work.

SPEAKER_00 2:10

No, and these gluten-free muffins from Trader Joe's are that good. Um, because I think I did try the freezer first, but I was like, I'm gonna eat all four of them if I don't do something drastic right now to stop myself. Um, but anyway, so then we met and corresponded, and then you went to, I believe, the best friendproject.co and filled out the survey with the project. I did, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:34

I thought it was really neat.

SPEAKER_00 2:36

You know, even the Harvard study that's one of the larger largest, longest running happiness studies, concluded that women with, you know, actually men and women with long-term friendships are happier, healthier, have less depression, and live longer than people without friends. And when I stumbled across that after my friendship breakup, I was like, well, yay for you. You know, what's what's the rest of that story? Because what do we do if we don't? And the ultimate uh question I kept asking myself is like, okay, well, now what? You know, how do we find, make, and keep friends? And one of the other things that was super interesting that um, and as a former private investigator and journalist, I recognize that I find comfort in data. It makes me feel less alone and less weird, even though it feels a little bit clinical sometimes. And I feel like it's something I do to remove myself from having to feel. I'll just go, okay, well, what do the numbers say? And then I can go, well, back into my emotion that way, or something like that. Um but in in 2023, I mean, just so just a few years ago, um the loneliness was deemed an epidemic in our country. And around loneliness has grown a $500 billion industry. And the things that are cited for causing loneliness are social media, you know, which isolates us, and lack of intimate friendships and relationships, and then absence of true romantic connection. But I feel like as a society, we go, oh, social media is bad, and now we must fall in love. And what we mean by love is with a romantic partner. You know, and the tools and the support and the language for cultivating those strong platonic love relationships, I just felt like is missing, and we've been throwing money at the wrong problem. And I think we just need to talk more.

SPEAKER_01 4:41

Yeah, have those communities again. I think you touched on a neat point too about having social media but still feeling disconnected. And it's true, like even if I see what my friends are doing, that doesn't make me feel connected with them until I speak with them and actually hear about it and hear, you know, their emotions and their range of feelings and thoughts that they had, not a picture.

SPEAKER_00 5:05

Yeah, that is. I mean, because then you get into all that FOMO and things like that. But ironically, we're connected because of Instagram, you know, and social media. So I think there's sort of what what we think, you know, what we see, what we perceive, and then how we internalize it versus I don't know if externalizes a word, but you know, reaching out to each other and connecting and then, you know, having a conversation and kind of getting to know each other a little bit. Um, and then going back to the survey, it was really interesting to not know you and to read your survey inputs. I'm curious to what was your kind of thought as you were taking this survey? Did you feel like it was, I don't know, I guess what like how did you feel when you were.

SPEAKER_01 5:57

I think it made me realize that I mean, I already knew I had a really good one at least really good friendship and some other ones, but I hadn't really stepped back and put two and two together of how important it is for like health and lifestyle and just overall well be well-being until I was actually reading it. I'm like, yeah, this actually has a really big impact on my life and something that most of us take for granted, but it was nice to step back and have that awareness about it. Makes you just appreciate it even more.

SPEAKER_00 6:29

Yeah, I love that. And when you say it, you mean friendships or like your friendship history?

SPEAKER_01 6:36

Probably both. I mean, I've learned a lot from even the friendships that didn't make it to this point in my life. Um, but definitely grateful for the ones that have stuck around too.

SPEAKER_00 6:46

I love that. And I think that that's something I've recognized that's been missing in the find part of my mission to find, make, and keep friends. You know, when, let's say when I was dating, you know, you sort of are on a first or second date, and it's sort of natural to say, Oh, have you ever been married before? Or have you ever had a long-term relationship before? How did your last relationship end? And when I've met new friends, I've never asked them, like, what kind of a friend are you? You know, and it's weird because it's supposed to be the most important relationship in our lives, but what like I don't know that that's like would be even a normal conversation, and I hope it will become part of normal friendship vernacular because we are drawn to certain people for certain reasons and we have preconceived perceptions of people, which kind of brings me to your locker story, yeah. You know, and your survey, and that really stood out for those preconceived sort of thoughts about people. So, do you want to share a little bit about the locker story?

SPEAKER_01 7:56

So, in grade nine, my first year of high school, I had a homeroom and then the lockers right outside, and there was this girl, and she was so pretty, and I just kind of assumed that because she was pretty, she was mean. So I think it was it took, yeah. So I think it took a few months, not the whole semester or anything, but a few months to kind of warm up and realize like, okay, she's actually a human being and she's so kind and has like the biggest heart ever. And so finally started talking with her. Our lockers were side by side, and um, we're still best friends. So that was when we were 14 and we are 40 right now. So and if I hadn't even just like, you know, shaken myself a little and just kind of stuck with my own insecurities and didn't give her the time of day, then I would have missed out on a lot, a big part of my life, actually. Yeah, I know. Wow. We get we just get in our heads and those insecurities can pop up, but there's so much to people when we can look past, you know, what's holding us back.

SPEAKER_00 9:06

Yeah. That's so interesting that you uh perceived her to be mean because she was pretty.

SPEAKER_01 9:11

And now when I think back and like she's still gorgeous, I was like, I can't believe I actually thought that maybe you were mean, and nothing she had ever done or said, you know, made me actually think she was mean. I was just an assumption.

unknown 9:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:27

Yeah. And so you've told her that I thought you were mean deserving.

SPEAKER_01 9:31

Yeah, we laugh about it now. Yes. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:34

I'd be like, is that a compliment? Or oh wow. And you're still friends today. That's incredible. Do you live by each other or we're about an hour and a half away.

SPEAKER_01 9:48

So she is basically downtown Toronto, and I'm an hour and a half north in the country. So we have totally different lives. Um, I'm not married, but I have a partner of, I guess, 11 years with two kids, and she's single, living on her own, this beautiful condo. And so our lives have taken definitely different paths and turns, but we didn't let that, you know, interfere with anything. We still talk a few times a week. FaceTime is important for that connection, I find the messages are great, but the FaceTime is really nice. And I think we see each other at least like every other month. We kind of take turns. Um, her parents live close by, so even if she's up, sometimes she'll just stop in on her way home, or I'll go there for sleepover with or without my kids. Yeah, they call her, they call her auntie, so it's really nice.

SPEAKER_00 10:48

Oh, I love that you do adult sleepovers.

SPEAKER_01 10:50

I don't know why people stop. They are like the best nights ever. Yeah. And I mean, sometimes, sometimes we just like watch a movie, go to bed early. Other times we eat a lot of snacks, stay up late and talk, or have a one glass of wine. But I don't know. I just love those. I look forward to them.

SPEAKER_00 11:09

Oh, that is fantastic. I love that. And you know, because part of I feel like what I want to cancel plans, I'm gonna be better about not doing that. But it's the the going there and everything is fine, but then it's like, okay, I leave, and how late am I gonna be there? And then I have to come home, and then I have to walk the dog, and it's dark out, and you know, you sort of but if I just stayed over and brought the dog, then I would be fine. Yeah. Yes. Um, that's no excuses. Um, and so you FaceTime her, you see her frequently. Do you have like other friends within your community that you're also socially with?

SPEAKER_01 11:46

I do, yeah. So I would say she definitely has way more. She's way more extroverted and social than me, but I have about two or three that, you know, every two or three months we'll have a dinner, catch up on everything, and then same thing. Just put something on the calendar for another few months. And then also my kids are in a lot of sports. So I sit with a lot of soccer moms and flag football moms, and I find it's like kind of in little departments of friendships, and they're all offering something unique and still special. Um, just not the not the same as my best friend, but I still love other people. It's just not the same.

SPEAKER_00 12:27

Yeah. I love that. So you have that your special friend, which I can't get over 14 that you met when you're 14. Um, it's something that stood out in your survey too, when you said that you had enough friends. And what that indicates is that you know you're not chasing more friendships. Like you don't feel an emptiness that you need to surround yourself with more people or more of anything because you have a feeling of contentment with your current social group. Is that just sort of how you've always been, or did you kind of arrive to that?

SPEAKER_01 13:06

I think it's always been like that, even through some changes. Like, I can't remember a time where I've ever felt lonely friendship-wise. In fact, like I think I get a lot more invitations that than I say yes to. Um, I have a couple friends who just know if it's a big group outing, I probably won't go. But if it's like a one-on-one with a girlfriend and we're going for a hike or a tea or breakfast, I will be there. But those big group settings, I just I don't know. I find as I get older and my kids are so busy with their sports, and there's only so many days of the week and hours, I'm just really particular, and I'd rather just spend my time with family or a one-on-one where I can like really connect than the group settings.

SPEAKER_00 13:52

I love that your community of friends understands that you're not gonna go and they're not offended by it, or like, well, we're gonna stop inviting you, or things like that. I think that's really beautiful. And within your uh survey too, and so also I want to back up too because I launched the survey in October of 25 and then gathered all of the data. And I think I had shared with you, and people probably know this by now, but I'd been putting up these postcards in women's bathrooms across the country. Um, like I live in Dallas and in Minneapolis and travel, you know, in between. So every restaurant, coffee shop, gas station, airport, salon, dressing room, sorry, free people in anthropology. Um because there's I didn't want to launch it on social media because of I didn't want my friend to see that I was doing this. I also had no real understanding of what I was going to do with the data. I just, like I said before, really find comfort in data and wanted to know that I wasn't alone or confirmed that I was, and that no one has ever had a friendship fight except me. Um and what emerged from it's now traveled over 7,000 miles. Like thousands of people have engaged with the survey, whether scanning it or signing up. And from the data, these five very distinct friendship archetypes have emerged. And I feel like we have that language in romantic world, like the five love languages, or you know, that kind of a thing. But I haven't seen this play out like this in friendship. And the profile that you fall under is what we're calling the keystone. And so it's very much like the keystone in in an arch is the top piece and it holds everything together, but not under duress or pressure. It just is. And it sounds like when I'm talking to you, I'm getting like a little of a clump because it it does seem like you are that to your you know, extroverted community, you've you're that for your best friend, you're and you're content.

SPEAKER_01 16:05

Like I think I think I didn't really realize until recently when I've been kind of looking at personality and skills, because I'm like, I don't have like a skill skill. And then I realized that my skill skill, when I think of like skill, I mean like doctors and lawyers. Oh, okay, okay. Because I was like, and I mean I think I'm fairly good at writing, but I for some reason I just that's just so natural, maybe that I don't think of it as a skill. But then I was like, no, I think I'm just really good at grounding everybody together and just bringing us in and just holding space.

SPEAKER_00 16:41

Yes. Well, and two things. Steve Jobs says that when we're good at something, we don't even know it because it just comes naturally to us. So we just think like, oh, no big deal. But we don't recognize, like, no, it is an absolute gift to the world to be able to write. And all of what you're saying leads me directly to your journals because you wouldn't have been able to do all of that incredible work and bring those to the world if you didn't have this gift. I mean, you say skill, I'm calling it a gift. And, you know, your journals are incredible.

SPEAKER_01 17:14

I've had a lot of fun writing them and making them, and it was funny because it kind of started with just one for grandparents, and it was when I had lost my two grandmothers, and I was like just really upset because I had all of these things of theirs, but they were both like quite old. But as I was young, I didn't know to ask them these questions. So I started with a grandparent journal to pass down to grandkids, and then it went on to journals for women and teachers and entrepreneurs and just a place where you can actually celebrate yourself because I find I at least myself, I did a lot of comparing growing up, probably until I was 20, 25. So I just wanted to make a home for people to share their stories in.

SPEAKER_00 18:00

And that was like 10 years ago, right?

SPEAKER_01 18:02

Yeah, I think it was uh at least eight, maybe nine, 20, 2017, maybe it started, 2018.

SPEAKER_00 18:10

And how many journals have you published since then?

SPEAKER_01 18:13

Oh, I think I have seven. Seven journals, a kid's storybook, and then a new book for adults.

SPEAKER_00 18:20

And do you do that full-time or do you also have a job?

SPEAKER_01 18:23

Yeah. So I when I first did them, I had a full-time job. Then I went, didn't work at all for a few years, and now I'm part-time doing accounting. So it's like, I don't know, it's kind of a good balance, and it's good for my nervous system to just have something that's there all the time, then it puts a little less pressure on being creative all the time. But yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:46

Yeah, definitely. That is interesting that you do the accounting side, and then that. Um, but you know, I I think it does give the other side of the brain a little bit of a break. I feel like that sometimes when I'm doing all the data analysis, I'm like, okay, now my creative brain can take a minute. Um one of the things too that I find really beautiful in reading all of the surveys, I read every single one, is I feel like I know people, and a lot of people have said uh very kind things after they've taken the survey that they feel like they've they know themselves a little themselves a little bit better, having a you know, answered questions about their childhood friends or their relationship with their mother or things like that. Um when you're creating your journals, do you feel like you can visualize like the woman or the person on the other side participating in this?

SPEAKER_01 19:47

I know it's funny because I was just thinking of that the other day. I was trying to, you know, come up with some post ideas, and then it kind of dawned on me like it's so much. You post so much about what you've created and um selling it or the features, and then you have to remember who's on the other end and what you hope they get out of it or what they're going through, and you know, hopefully it can brighten their day a little bit. Yeah, it's really neat to think of the other side. And it's so weird because I didn't even think of it till I saw how many like journals altogether I had sold, and then because on a daily basis, you know, it's just like a box here, a couple of orders here, and then when I saw the grand total, I was like, that's a lot of people when you think of it, even if it's over so many years. It just it was kind of nice.

SPEAKER_00 20:36

Yeah, no, that is beautiful. And I feel very similar to the I'm gonna just call it adrenaline rush when I'm going into a bathroom and I've got my I've advanced from you know direct just tape to these sticky dots because they're faster and more stealth. But I'll do like a quick analysis of the bathroom, make sure there's not a bathroom attendant in there because that's usually like a red flag because they're just gonna take it down right away. Yeah. And then, you know, but I'll get my sticky tabs up and I put them on the door, but I picture her because I read it so many times in the survey. Women saying, like, I couldn't believe, you know, I left this luncheon, my friend did this, I go into the bathroom, and there's this conversation starter. Because the postcards just say every friendship has a story, what's yours? And then there's a QR code that goes to the survey. But in a world also where we've lost the ability to really discover anything because the algorithm serves us everything. You know, so we just are being fed what someone somewhere thinks that we want to know about versus us really naturally or discovering something on our own. And so I have these like different intersections of her journey where she's going into the bathroom. For whatever reason, this post postcard is resonating with her. And then taking the survey and then, you know, just that experience of being able to kind of audit what like how also what we've done wrong. I mean, I hate to say wrong, but like no one's perfect. And I can look back and be like, wow, I I ran from that or I didn't address that, or I avoided, you know, that's my big thing. Like I avoided that conversation, which is so funny because like we drag our partners to therapy and force them to talk about stuff. But the best friend that knows us that we've laughed, we've cried, we've shared our secrets with, we've loved, like we're just gonna ghost her and not put that difficult conversation on the forefront. You know, it's just the weirdest thing. But so reading the surveys and and seeing the arc of women and and the the way the survey flows too, you know, it'll ask different questions and then kind of meander and then it goes back to some similar things. Um it took me like four or five months to even write the survey, and I worked with different survey experts and things to make sure it made sense from a user standpoint. But there's that arc where all of a sudden they'll look back and be like, wait, I think that I I snapped or I should have done this or I could have done that kind of a thing. And one of the things that you referenced in your survey um was a pain point with your friendships, which was inconsistency. Um, which, you know, is you're certainly not alone in that. And we want to have that consistent presence or just know that someone's going to be there. But is that what you meant like when you referenced inconsistency?

SPEAKER_01 23:42

Yeah, I think I mean inconsistent um effort definitely is what is one side of it because it can't always be one-sided. Like, like it's okay to be busy, totally understand that. Um, at the end of the day or week, it you still need to check in, I think, with those closest to you and who are really meaningful. And I think actions speak a lot of a lot too. Like you can say they mean a lot to you, but if you're not putting that effort in, then maybe not. And then also like with values, that's a big one. If you are starting off, you know, in one direction and we're pretty similar with our values, and then that's showing up differently and really inconsistent. That's that's a big one for me. Like nobody has to be perfect, yeah, but um, the values are important.

SPEAKER_00 24:35

Have you had an experience where someone kind of put you in an compromising position because of a value switch around?

SPEAKER_01 24:42

That happened a few times. Uh, once when I was in high school, which I was proud that I even was aware of it in high school. I remember uh my mom saying one of the girls had been waiting outside and she asked, like, what are you doing on the front lawn? And she didn't live in town, but she had been using me um with her mom to say, Oh, I'm hanging out with Robin, but she was going out with some really like the not good crowd, like the the drugs and alcohol kind of crowd in high school. So I didn't really like that because that meant she knew I was different, but and using me to stay in her mom's good books. And I also had that in my 20s uh with a friend who was um had left her marriage. I guess she was cheating, and she was saying that she was with me when she was not. So those things like I try not to be judgmental because I don't know everybody's full story, but I don't like being dragged into it, I guess. And then just kind of trusting the colors that you do see, I guess. Like everyone eventually will show you who they are. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 25:51

Yep, yep. I always say time will either expose or promote, you know. It's really interesting though that two different sets of people recognize like your like goodness, you know, just true nature.

SPEAKER_01 26:04

Oh, it's a goodie good, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:07

Well, but it sounds like you were actually like a good, you know, you weren't pretending to be good. But then also it's interesting that and maybe this is just a boundary that again you it's a strength of yours that you don't even know, but that you it wasn't in your like social ecosystem to be like, hey, I want to find out why is she lying, why is she doing this, why is she hiding behind me? What can I do to help her or change her life, or you know, because that kind of rescue friend position is also difficult because we're not here to save each other, so to speak, you know what I mean? And um but I love the absence of being the fixer, I think that you just let them do that. I'm not I'm certainly not quoting Tressmiana. You allowed them to just be who they were, and then you went on your merry way and lived your own.

SPEAKER_01 27:05

I don't find that there's a lot of point in arguing with somebody or causing a big ordeal. It's just like thank you for showing me and I'm gonna go this way. Yeah. So I've never had a huge blowout with a friend. It's always those quiet little things, and it's just like, okay, and then you just move on.

SPEAKER_00 27:25

I mean, there's a lot of value in that too, you know. If you were talking to your best friend right now, what how would you like what would you want to say to her about your friendship?

SPEAKER_01 27:38

Oh, she means the world to me. Um, I would just want to tell her that she's basically my other sister, and she holds a really special place in my heart. I can't imagine living a life without her uh to lean on, to laugh with, to do fun little trips with, but and just to thank her for being such a good person. Yeah, such a good, good person and friend.

SPEAKER_00 28:03

I love that. It's lucky that you have that. What advice would you have for someone who sees a really pretty person and thinks that they won't be friends?

SPEAKER_01 28:15

I would say definitely take a moment or two to get past the physical and just also not just their personality, but you can also tell by their energy. So you don't need their beauty to tell you, it's also their energy. Like I find their energy is not gonna lie. If they have kind eyes and they're just happy or smiling, like that's a pretty good sign. But yeah, definitely give them a chance, get to know them, and then you can decide.

SPEAKER_00 28:48

Yes. And then you can decide. That is so true. And where could we find your journals for everyone listening that is eager to explore the catalog now that you have internal opportunities?

SPEAKER_01 29:01

Uh they can be found on my website, which is RobinLichi.com, and they're also on Etsy.

SPEAKER_00 29:08

Okay, on Etsy. And you'll also find them in the show notes when you go to the best roomproject.com on wherever you get your podcast, you'll see a link to Robin's information in the show notes. Um, thank you so much for spending some time with me today and sharing your experience with friendship. And it's always, you know, I think some people gravitate to the survey because they've had a blow up or something bad happen, but I would say probably 40% of people are so excited to talk about their amazing best friend and share, you know, just an incredible story of friendship. And I I need to hear from both sides, obviously. We all do, um, because it is out there and I think it doesn't have to elude those of us that struggle with friendship, and it's just incumbent upon us to just keep showing up and being, you know, pretty on the inside too. And all that. So thank you so much. Yeah, thank you for having me. That's what's fun. Awesome. If you're interested in taking the Best Friend Project survey, go to the best friendproject.co and find the link to the survey and click it, and I'd love to hear from you. Robin has such a calming presence about her. It was really interesting to listen back to that interview and reflect on just how sweet she is, but strong and confident. And I will never forget her almost missing out on one of the most important friendships of her life because her friend was pretty. You know, the judgments we make, right, stick with us. Um, but she's adorable. And if you want to see more uh or hear more about her, find her journals, just see her in her daily life with her kids and her dog. Her Instagram is Robin, R-O-B-Y-N dot L I E C H T I. And her journals are incredible. She's just done all of this on her own and self-published over 15,000 journals. So there is bound to be one for you or someone you love or a great gift idea as well. Coming up on Saturday, too, we do a little mini episode called On the Phone With, where I call Robin and I get her impression of the podcast episode and see what her friends thought about it when they heard it and more. So it's a fun kind of reflection for both of us and you to tune into. Next week on the show, you will meet Mary McGreevy. Mary McGreevy has an all-star following on Instagram because she reads people's obituaries, and it just kind of came up completely out of the blue, and uh it was something that she was passionate about, so she just decided to start reading obituaries because you can't get them in the newspaper anymore because not a lot of people get the newspaper, and she knows how much, especially older people like hearing the obituaries. But when I was listening to her talk about Big Sue, which was an obituary that was written by a friend after the friend died, it occurred to me that, you know, I mean, I'm here because my friendship died. We're both still alive, but this very living, breathing, to me, thing between us is is dead, presumably, right? If I ever heard about something happening to my former best friend, like I would be devastated. Um, she is the keeper of so many of my secrets and hopes and dreams, and even though we're not together anymore, she still carries them with her. And it really hit me that, you know, death is so final, but our words linger and our memories linger as long as somebody is still here to tell them. So when I heard Mary reading this Big Sioux obituary about a friend who had passed away, I was wondering what wisdom has Mary picked up on from dead people about friendship? It's a fascinating conversation. So please tune in next week for that episode of the Best Friend Project podcast with Mary McGreevy and tips from dead people.