EP 3: Should the Epstein Files be released?

This episode contains a trigger warning, topics such as self harm, human trafficking, abuse, will be addressed. 

Leslie and Cole sit down with Kelly Dore founder of Sierra Cares to talk about human trafficking, and the Epstein Files. 

Then Cole and Leslie share their thoughts on wars abroad and at home this Memorial Day Weekend.

Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:03

Well, welcome to Politics is Personal with Leslie and Cole. I'm Leslie Harrod.

SPEAKER_01 0:08

And I'm Cole West. This has been a really fun few weeks for us. Hopefully, it's been an interesting journey for you as well. Hopefully, we're getting you to talk with uh your friends, with your families. Um but uh I think we've got a fantastic show today. Uh former county commissioner and human trafficking advocate Kelly Doerr will be with us on the program today, which is sure to be a fascinating conversation. It's been an interesting week in Colorado politics, and when Colorado politics is making national politics, most of the time that's probably not a good thing. But uh can we talk about what's in our feed? And I'm sure what's in my feed is the same as what's in your feed. And that is a big WTF to Jared Polis. I mean, what in the world is Jared Polis thinking? What did he think this was going to accomplish for him? Um and can we just say the guy's political career is is dead?

SPEAKER_03 1:05

I am quite frankly, I shouldn't be surprised. I always say this, I shouldn't be surprised, but quite frankly I still am. Um and to back us up a little bit, we're talking about Jared Polis, um, I guess shortening the sentence, if you will, of Tina Peters. Tina Peters, who was this election denier who opened up the files basically to unrepentant, unrepentant, right? To allow f to allow uh what I would say is a step towards um election fraud, right? Right. And then we had JD Vance, uh our vice president, going on national TV at a press conference saying that all she did was trespassing, which was not true at all. I mean, she had federal or she had uh felony charges.

SPEAKER_01 1:45

Not only charges, but convictions, felony convictions, charged by um uh or prosecuted by a Republican district attorney in Mesa County. Um Mesa County is one of the more conservative counties in our state, so convicted by a jury clearly of her peers. So, you know, it's it's unbelievable to me that in the face of all of that, the fact that that I, you know, and you can quibble about was this a fair sentence, was nine years appropriate, but to grant her clemency was really sort of green lighting election deni uh election deniers across our state. And I really do feel for the county clerks and recorders around our state who are gonna have to administer elections.

SPEAKER_03 2:29

And Republicans and independents.

SPEAKER_01 2:31

More Republican county clerks in Colorado than Democrats. And what I've heard is almost universal condemnation from county clerks across our state, Republican and Democrat, that this was a horrendously bad decision by Gerald Polish.

SPEAKER_03 2:45

Why do you think he did it? Like who is he trying to placate? I mean it there's there's been all this talk in Colorado that he wants to run for president one day and that they're setting up. Well, that isn't gonna happen. And I'm just like, what and what is it? Not as a Democrat. And what calcul or anyone, what calculation did he think that this was gonna work? He just got actually censored by the Colorado Democratic Party, and that I mean that's the central committee. I mean, that's people from representing all counties across the state came and voted to censor him for this move.

SPEAKER_01 3:12

Did a polis staffer say, hey, you know, maybe we'll pick up some Republican support? It's sort of like, you know, newsflash. They don't like you, bud. I mean, they have never liked you. They've never been a fan. Right. So politically was a head scratcher. And maybe Jared Polis is trying to out Maverick who, you know, I don't know. I who knows.

SPEAKER_03 3:34

It's the only thing I can think of. Because quite frankly, I think he thinks he might be saving Colorado from something, especially saying he said history will look kindly on me for making this decision. I don't know who it depends on, I guess, who's writing history, because right now I'm I'm not seeing it. But I think he thinks he's saving Colorado, and I don't know how that's gonna play out. But what I am also annoyed about that's in my feed is the fact that now Tina Peters not only is going to be freed from uh and release from her jail sentence when many people are sitting in jail for a sentence for sentences that are way too long, way too harsh, and just quite frankly, um unjust. Um, she's also gonna be eligible for this $1.8 billion slush fund that Trump just got approved.

SPEAKER_01 4:13

You know, we talked about this in last week's show. Um, and I hate the fact that I was right about this, but you know, not only did we have the lawsuit just sort of mysteriously go away, but we have the creation of this fund where the the people that are gonna supervise how the funds are paid are appointed by Trump, not really overseen by Congress. Um so I it doesn't sit well with me that that folks that ransacked the Capitol on January 6th, that that personally assaulted police officers are now going to be eligible for federal money to compensate them for what they went through. What about the trauma that these folks put uh upon the Capitol police officers? Frankly, upon our country. A country, exactly.

SPEAKER_03 5:03

Yeah. So what i how is your feed playing this out though? Because I am sh I am philometics to think that anyone would support this slush fund that's being created, anyone would support, you know, releasing um these violent, quite frankly, criminals um and then giving them a nice large check upon their release from from from jail or prison. Um and then whoever else Trump thinks deserves money. Um how are people uh talking about that on your side? Because my side's pretty pissed off.

SPEAKER_01 5:32

Well, uh, you know, I mean what I'm seeing today is that Congress for the first time is showing that they have a spine and saying um we're not going to green light this fund. Uh but but like with so many of Trump's uh what I what's the word we should even use? Like the these these things that he comes up with, the ballroom, the arch, the fund, and that is it's just sort of act and then try to see if some anybody's gonna stop him.

SPEAKER_03 6:01

Trump's acts of corruption, that's what we should call it.

SPEAKER_01 6:04

Because no one seems to stop him.

SPEAKER_03 6:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:06

And the reason why he paints the reflecting pool blue and tears down the East Wing is that no one will stop him. Yeah. And no one in Congress has the spine that they need. Maybe this fund will finally be the wake-up call. Uh I'm not holding my breath, but I'm I'm I'm seeing in my feed that there may be some resistance in Republican ranks to this gross misappropriation of public money.

SPEAKER_03 6:29

Well, I certainly hope you're right. I certainly hope you're right, because I don't want to see this continue in my feed without people really speaking up and stepping out on all sides of the aisle.

SPEAKER_01 6:37

So um stay with us coming up next on Politics is Personal. Uh a fascinating visit with our friend Kelly Door. And just as uh a warning, uh that this discussion will include uh uh topics such as trafficking, sexual assault. So just wanted to uh make sure that you're aware of that before you watch the interview. But uh uh come back and join us for Kelly Door. Welcome back to Politics is Personal. We're joined today by my good friend and uh national superstar when it comes to the topic that I know we'll talk about today, but uh former elected county commissioner at the tender age of 35, which is something I didn't know about you before today. But uh Kelly Dore, welcome to the program. Thank you so much for joining us today. Um I have a very long bio for you. You've done a lot of great things, but um I always want to sort of throw it to the guest to have you introduce yourself to our audience and let them know what uh what you want people to know about who you are and and what you do. But welcome to politics personal.

SPEAKER_02 7:46

Thank you. Welcome, welcome, we're so glad to have you. So yeah, it's so it's an honor to be here. So I've I've actually followed both of your careers and love what you guys have done. Um but yeah, um so my name is Kelly Dore, and I am the executive director of the Sierra CARES Foundation, which we actually operate out of um West Africa, and um we um uh we basically since 2020 have um located and helped to um repatriate over 7,800 women and children um back to African countries that have been trapped in slavery situations in the Middle East. Um we have one of the um the Middle East has some of the the worst human rights issues when it comes to recruiting people and sending them abroad and recruiting them for jobs that are are truly um state-sanctioned type slavery. And so with that, I started recognizing that we have to not only just repatriate them, bring them back, but we have to set up programs to help them for long-term sustainability, but also to stop the really the entry point to being trafficked. We were finding most of our victims were coming back with multiple diseases, um, bone breaks, um being pregnant. And when they're coming back into a culture or uh a country that has no resources and no jobs, they're just basically living on the streets again. And so it wasn't really like you can't, you can't find people and say, oh yay, we saved you, like go go live a happy life. And so I actually wrote the first mental health program that is indicative to specific to um African survivors of trafficking. Um, and it can actually, it's being piloted and actually can be used for other countries and other organizations, but we have um mental health, which was something we actually had to introduce and talk about, um, how to understand mental health, how to basically come and care for the person and stabilize them through housing, stable housing and food sources, and then we have job training programs as well. So we actually have one of our big graduations at the end of this month. We have um, gosh, uh I think 45 migrant survivors that have gone through our training programs who are graduating. And so when they graduate, um, they get their graduation certificates, but they also get a care package that helps them for their sustainable futures. Um, so if they're in tailoring, they get sewing kits. If they are in the catering side, they get a bunch of baking materials and stuff. Um, we also have a sustainable farm program that we're working on, and we really are trying to target the really the prevention now of girls and even boys being sent to other countries. I don't believe in like the white savior American mentality of running nonprofits. And so when all of my staff is from West Africa, they're all trained there, um, they help us implement and run the programs. Um basically I I raise the money on the side. And so that's my that's my passion. Like that's what I love to do. Um, but that doesn't pay the bill. So I don't take a paycheck for running that. Um only my staff there gets paid. We um I consult for the, I've consulted for the Pass Four administrations for the U.S. Department of State when it comes to um conflict zones and war zones. So I will get sent in to conflict zones um to help them assess and understand um the victimology of what's going on, but also to train the frontline responders of what we're seeing because what we see when there's a natural disaster or when there's war, um, after the aid groups come in, some of the biggest groups of people that come in are the traffickers because they're exploiting.

SPEAKER_03 11:20

Yeah. Well, tell me about a little bit more about that. So you got into this work, not as a savior, right? Right. Um, but because of of personal experiences. So, you know, I I really enjoyed, and folks, you guys have to listen and watch your your TED talk. It's very powerful. Um and you talked about how people think human trafficking is so far away from us right here in Colorado or in the States, but you're doing work abroad and here. But what brought you to the work?

SPEAKER_02 11:49

So, you know, I I really think so part of it was I my own personal story is I am a survivor here in Colorado. Um, and really when I brought my case forward when I was um 14 and 15 when it actually went to court, um we this was 1993, so and I'm aging myself, but we didn't have laws. We didn't have the T VPA law, the trafficking in persons law. So we didn't even have the language to understand what was happening. And so a lot of what I was talking about, I was like, well, it was my biological father and his acquaintances, and I we'd go to parties and I would be allowed to go into rooms and have other men abuse me. Um and really a lot of my grooming started around the age of one with him. And then um, so my most of my abuse and trafficking stories starts from the ages of one until I was about 14. Um, and and really when you are kind of born into a situation like that and there's a lot of fear, there's some criminal elements going on, but also just a very abusive person who was not only abusing myself, but also my mother who had me very young, um, and then my and my brother, um, you know, you kind of think that this is normal. And that, and and I grew up thinking that every little girl was being abused by their father, and I didn't know it wasn't normal until I was about 13. I was sitting in health class and I actually um grew up in Jefferson County and was sitting in health class and they were talking about the power of saying no and like, you know, rape and incest, and I didn't really understand that, but I was like, oh my gosh, like that's what had happened to me. And I had said stuff before to my family, and I think really part of the issue is that like the people around me and my family and teachers, they didn't know what to look for and they didn't know where to what to do with it. And so it was very much like, well, you know, we don't know if what Kelly's saying is true or like, did this happen? Did it not? Because I think part of the grooming process that happens, especially when you're targeted and being abused, is um a lot of times they will focus on one person and it's not necessarily the entire family. And so um, this is why we see victims coming forth where like their siblings are like, hey, that didn't happen to me. But and so we have a hard time, I think, culturally recognizing it and believing it. But also we are a culture of where we don't want to talk about the bad things in our families and we don't want to shame them. And so it really, I really had to learn um like how to navigate this. And we didn't talk about mental health a lot, even in the early 90s. And so I think like my family just didn't know how to come around and support me on this or even ask or talk about it. So almost like when it happened, it was kind of like, okay, that was over, like that's a part of the past. Like we'll never speak of this again. Not realizing how it impacted me going into college. Um, and so I was the first from my biological father's side of the family to actually graduate, I graduated high school, but to actually go to college. So I went to college, um, I was the first female there. And really um within the first couple months that I was there, I went to a party. Um, I had had actually had surgery um about a couple weeks before that because I had actually had um cervical cancer cells, and and we realized now that that was probably from the abuse I'd had as a child. And so um, because at that point I was still a I I had not chosen a sexual partner. So like I I guess conceptually, like I was still a virgin, um, but of my own choice, not what was taken from me as a child. And so when I went when I went and had surgery, and so I was like still bloated. I went to a party in overalls, and I'll remember it was October 27th of 2000, and I um was at Rams Village at CSU and it was a football player party, and I came out of the bathroom. I just went into use the restroom, came out, and two football players came in and um held me inside the bathroom and took turns raping me. And so it really was this whole, you know, trying to figure out who I was, um, and also my family, again, didn't understand it. There was a lot of um shame around it for me, and then also the school, because they were two of the star football players at CSU.

SPEAKER_03 15:51

So you went forward.

SPEAKER_02 15:52

Yes, and so we I went forward. Um, but there was a lot of complications that came out of it. And um, and so charges were actually never brought forward. And on the top, on top of it, I was very, I'd been drinking a lot. I and I always felt that pressure of like, you can't come forward if you if you're not 100% clear. And so we just I I didn't follow through with it, um, but my mental health just tanked. And so, you know, the family joke was my blood alcohol level was higher than my GPA that semester. And and I look back and I'm like, gosh, like I would never like with my children now and what I know now, like that would have never been a joke, right? And we would have figured that out. But again, like my family didn't have the tools or really we didn't have the verbiage to understand it. Um, and so I went into social work because I think a lot of us when we've had trauma, we're like, hey, I want to figure out how to save everybody else. Um, not realizing that like if we don't get stay on top of our own mental health and do the work ourselves, we're just gonna mess a whole lot of people up because we end up pushing our trauma right onto them. And so, but through that process, started recognizing I wanted to do more and I really wanted to walk with vulnerable people and protect them. Um, I started doing in I did an internship where I actually was working with um juveniles up in the Larimer County and Wald County area who'd been sexually abused. And I really found that that actually was triggering for me because I I didn't have the mental health support. And so I kind of um, you know, I was kind of lost trying to figure out where I wanted to be. Um, and then throughout that time, I'd had a I had a boyfriend, ended up um finding myself pregnant at 21, came home from college with a baby and just kind of had was like forced to live my life and take care of a child. Um, and it's and my husband now, I met him when my son was five months old, but I didn't introduce him till later. Um, so he, I mean, he stepped up and became a father and like knew he wanted to marry me right away. And I was like, no, like I can do this on my own. I don't need a man to help me, you know, all of this stuff. Um, and and eventually, like my husband, it kind of like he broke me down enough where I was like, okay, this is actually a good man. And he he wants to do this as a partnership. He doesn't pity me. He doesn't like he he loves me for who I am. And that was something I wasn't used to. Like I think, you know, when you grow up in a cycle of where you're being abused, like there's always a value placed on you. And so I had, I started recognizing when I was younger a lot of the stuff, I didn't have the words to articulate at three and four and five, what was happening to me. But there was a lot of actions. And I think looking back now, family and friends are like, oh my gosh, like we missed so much, but we didn't know what to do. And so there's that weird dichotomy because people will either do one of two things. They will either run away from you because they're embarrassed and they feel ashamed, or they will come and support you and they're like, I want to learn more. Um, and so, you know, early on in early 2000, I was busy with children. My husband and I got married. We had four children. Um, and so I was at home raising them. And then my husband was elected in 20 uh 20, 2013 and became a legislator. And um I really started, you know, recognizing um that policy and laws are kind of like where things are, like even on local levels. This is where things happen, this is where things change. And and started looking at my own case. And so um, in gosh, so in 2014, I actually ran as a commissioner in Albert County. What I really recognized is so when I got elected, I started sharing my story about like what happened. And what I found is it was used against me a lot. Um, I had members of the sheriff department, they started calling me a whore, they were calling me loose. There were rumors, like, and I'll tell you, and you guys probably know this, like you want to know about yourself, like run for office. Right. You'll find out who you slept with, who you had affairs with, like who you did all this stuff with. And I'm like, whoa, I had no idea I was like this. Um, but I really started recognizing that like justice was being covered up, and there just was a lot of underlying stuff that we weren't addressing. And so um on 20 in 2014, um, this is right around the time when Colorado, um, so Paul Lundine actually um was Senator Paul Lundeen, but he was a representative at the time, worked with my husband and like um Bob Rankin, and they actually um did the inception of the Human Um Trafficking Council in Colorado, which came into 2015. Well, at that time, I didn't actually realize that that's what had happened to me. So, as a commissioner through NACO, the National Association of Counties, I got asked to, there was a new group forming, and it was about human trafficking, human rights. And so um one of my good friends, like Sally Clark, who was a longtime commissioner down in El Paso County, was like, hey, you should join NACO. Um, and I was on Health and Human Service, I served with a lot of Rappahoe County commissioners on that. And um, and they were like, hey, like you understand this background, you understand sexual trauma, you should sit on it. So I go to Washington, D.C., I'm sitting in a meeting. Um, and around this time is when President Obama decided they were gonna create the Human Trafficking Survivor Advisory Council and really started talking about it, even though in it the year 2000 in the United States is the first time we've ever had a law that addressed human trafficking. Um and so the TVPA Act was enacted in 2000. But it took another 15 years for like even a president's office to recognize it, or even states. I mean, we're still working on legislation, right? And so um so I remember going to the inaugural meeting. There was 12 of us as commissioners from around the country, and um, and I'm sitting there and they're explaining to us what human trafficking was. And I was like, oh my gosh, like I had this, I've had this, I had this. And so I remember going back to my hotel that night and I called my husband, and I was like, they were talking about things that were part of my case, which was a closed case here in Colorado. And I was like, they're talking about like multiple people coming in, like multiple offenders, and like led by one person. And if there was an exchange of drugs or money and stuff, which I knew had happened in certain cases, I never had to carry it. But when you have a child, that there doesn't actually need to be force or control, or there doesn't need to be actually an exchange of anything. The coercion, force, and control can be a part of it for a minor. And so realizing all of this was happening, so I actually we reached out to a good friend who was an FBI agent. And I um went, we came down to the courthouse in Denver and released, I got my case released to her, and she looked at it. They came back and said, okay, so of the 27 counts that were on here, so the state came and charged 27 counts to my biological father. Um he ended up pleading guilty to 19 of them and did not, and at the end of the day, had a judge here in Colorado, a female judge, and when my testimony was kind of read, um, like so he ended up taking a plea deal. Um he hired one of the best attorneys, um, uh is it Don Loslow in Denver, who is one of the best criminal defense attorneys in the state, um, hired him. And basically, it, I mean, I was 14, they didn't want to put me on the stand, they didn't know if I'd be a credible witness, but I'm recognizing now it's because some of the stuff I was talking about, I didn't have the words to articulate, but they didn't also either. And so um he ended up pleading guilty to 19 of them. He um, Judge Nancy Rice ended up sentencing him to two months in jail. He did not have to pay restitution, did not have to register as a sex offender. And so from that, I was like, there was just something in me that was like, how do we start changing this so that people like me can get their justice?

SPEAKER_01 23:39

So, what does it feel? And and thank you for sharing your story. It's such a powerful story, and the way you've taken that story and become an advocate for others. Um it's gotta be a particularly raw time for you now, as we see the Epstein case on the headlines, has been for many years. So what are your thoughts as you see this unfold? We're sitting here taping this today a couple of days after uh somebody that I admire greatly, Thomas Massey, who lost his primary in Kentucky, largely for uh let's just say it, for standing up for victims of this horrendous trafficking ring. So speak to us about how how you're experiencing this as a victim and and as an advocate. Right.

SPEAKER_02 24:31

Well, and and I think, you know, going back, I started recognizing so when I left office, like I realized that I did not have some of the tools and the mental health ability at 35 to navigate what was being slung at me in office, watching my husband go through things. Because it it's an ugly, I mean, you guys, it's it's ugly. And I at this point, like, I don't know why anybody would want to run except for the fact that we all want to make the world a better place. But I realized I wanted to stay in it and and figure out how to change the law. And so when I left being a commissioner, so I'm actually the right now, currently the only um survivor that has actually been elected to office anywhere in the US, which is kind of wild. And and maybe it's because I'm open and public about it. There might be others that don't that aren't articulating it or don't understand it. But I started realizing that like if people are making laws about us and for us, but without us at the table, then it's just a piece of paper, right? Because if we're not making laws that are actually that are that that people can actually take and actually and and actually adhere to, but also for victims and survivors that that are able to identify with, we're not doing any any justice for them. And so um, yeah, so in 2017, I um so I became um, I started doing consulting. Um so in when I left being a commissioner in 2016, I um got brought over to the Obama administration and was consulting um for the Department of State on just trafficking, but also just getting them to understand the language and and really how do we how do we understand the nuances of it? How do we talk about the difference between sex trafficking and like um and and like prostitution side and um the difference between children and adults, and then also sex work and how do we honor dignity for everybody in this space? Um, because I was seeing that that that's not what was happening. And and today it still doesn't. Like it's there's a lot of people just bucking heads.

SPEAKER_03 26:26

And that's why it's hard to get some of these laws passed because there are the survivors, um, then there are people who maybe are also survivors that also participated in the in the crime, and you want to respect or acknowledge their trauma in some ways in the laws, and thinking about people like your your mom or other folks who might have known things were going on, or things like you said, she was she she had trauma placed upon her as well. What's her role or the people around? And so it does become kind of a sticky issue when it comes to how the laws are written and enforced, but you helped pass 300 pieces of legislation across the country. How'd you get it right?

SPEAKER_02 27:05

So, you know, I think, and I do I want to start and say, like, you know, like I'm never gonna blame any of the people in my life that missed what was happening or don't have the ability to understand it. Like, I think that is their own journey, and like, and sometimes you have to just bless them from afar and love them and say, they everybody does the best they can with the tools they have. Um, it's when we start denying and deflecting. And I and so and I realized for me as a child, a lot of times I was told, like, well, that's not really what happened. Like, let us tell you what happened, or don't talk about what happened. And so I think one of the reasons I became so public is I was like, wait a minute, I've been, I felt like I've been shamed, and this isn't a dirty secret. Like, this is something that happened to me, not by me. And um, so in 2017, I was actually approached by the um Department of Justice Um and the FBI, and they were actually um starting to look at some of the Epstein files again. And mind you, um Maria and Annie Farmer came forward in 1996 and started talking about what was happening. That's when Bill Clinton was president. And so, so since 1996, when they first came forward, and the Department of Justice has had this stuff coming forward. We have not had a single president who has instructed the DOJ to prosecute and go forward on charges, Republican or Democrat. And so in 2017, they said, Can you help us? So they brought in three survivors and said, Can you help us understand the victimology, like what they're saying, who they are? And so from that, I've actually had the original files. I had to sign an NDA. Um the Epstein files. Yes, I've had the original. I've had there, and it's over 33 million piece files and pieces of evidence. Um, but I had an NDA and I had to go through all of them. And so, um, but last year in um 2025 in April, my NDA expired. So um, and and before that, like I started doing international work. Um, I um actually was part of the second cohort of ISTAC, the International Survivor Advisory Council for the OSCE, and um we officed out of Warsaw, Poland, and so started just doing international work. Um, and really because for me, human trafficking is not it's not a red or blue issue. This is a human rights issue. And we have to talk about our roles here in the United States, because it's not just sex trafficking, it's labor trafficking, um, it's the consumerism, all of the stuff that we're seeing and what what plays into that, um, and also how all of these countries, how we are we all work together. Um, and then I started you know going to conferences. Um, so I sit on the um UN women and started um you know hearing that, like listening to that. Um, and in 2025, in March, um, the UN women decided that, and it wasn't the women, it was actually all the member states, ended up on the human rights side, which was part of the human trafficking side. They all they voted in China and Saudi Arabia to be the two leads on that. And all of us were like, wait a minute, there's some of the most egregious human rights happening around the world. Um, and so got involved in that. And then um in July, I happened to be in Washington, D.C. doing a lot of policy stuff. And on it was, I believe it was July 14th, um, President Trump came out and said, um, there's nothing in the files. There, we're not gonna release them. After he had kind of campaigned on it, after he had talked about it. And I really started recognizing that How did that make you feel? Well, I was angry because I was helping them, but I was also like, what is happening? Like something had to happen here, right? And I started recognizing these files are not just about sex trafficking. So sex trafficking was secondary to what we're seeing. The biggest things that I that I've been seeing through the files are um, and there's horrific stuff in there, but it's the money laundering, it's the criminal enterprises. There are links. And when President Trump came out and said we cannot release them because um it's it will be a national security issue. What he was talking about is the fact that this is where um a lot of these files include the usage of USAID funds and how our CIA and Israel Massad, we created USAID years ago as a means to go into these other countries and thwart governments, thwart elections, take out dictators. So there's a lot of stuff that's going on, and there's a lot of financial stuff. And this goes all the way up to World Bank. Um, and I had said for years, I was like, you want to know all the predators that are in these files? Go to the World Economic Forum in Dava, Switzerland. They bring in 3,000 trafficking victims a year, and it's a giant party. And this is why, like, you know, Prince Andrew was there and all of these people, and I was like, like this, if you want to see what's going on, these are the parties, these are the secondary things.

SPEAKER_03 31:42

And you saw all this in the files, or you were also. These are all part of the files. Okay, these are all part of it.

SPEAKER_02 31:46

And so what, and so then in um, so in July on the 14th, when President Trump came out, and I'm in DC, and I was like, oh heck no. So I called um a couple of representatives. Like, I I mean, I have worked with like Chris Smith for a long time, um, Marsha Blackburn, um Thomas Massey, and um like there was a lot of other people that have done a lot of good trafficking um bills for us that we had run. And so, really, my policy side is I actually go in and help the congressional members if they want to pass a law or even write a law. I we tell them, hey, this is what's needed, we write it for them because you know, we know when you're elected, you don't know everything about everything. So you bring the experts in to help you. Um and that's what I'd been doing. And so I remember walking out of the Capitol and I went into Marsha Blackburn's office and I was like crying and I was like, I'm so frustrated. And she was like, Kelly, I know, but there's greater things at play, so a lot of us have to stay, have to stay quiet. Um, and so she said Is that what she said, point blank?

SPEAKER_01 32:42

A lot of us have to stay quiet.

SPEAKER_02 32:43

She's well, and because they were trying to figure out what's going on, I think, at that point. And I mean, this is like brand new, and they're frustrated and trying to figure out all of this stuff. Well, so I um ended up running into um two Thomas Massey walking down the hallway, and he's like, you know, he's like, Are you okay? Like, what's going on? And I I said, you know, you and he and he I said, I have the files. And he was like, you know what? Let's figure this out. And so with staffers from his office and Marsha Blackburn's office that night, we went and bought up 535 zip drives and went back to my hotel and downloaded the files onto every single zip drive. And then over the next two days, so the Wednesday and Thursday, walked almost 12 miles, but because you know the it's huge, all the offices are far apart, walked almost 12 miles and personally dropped off to every congressional member the files. And it wasn't, and that was July. So that was the last day was July 16th. So then on that Friday, I had to actually come, I was fly getting ready to fly home, and I got called to go have a meeting in the White House, and they were like, What are you doing? You can't do this. And I said, Well, my NDA expired, so yeah, I can, and I don't owe you guys anything. Is Trump in the files? Um, there's a lot of people in the files. Yeah, so Trump's name is mentioned. And I what I do want to say over and over is that one of the reasons we that the names just can't be released is because not everybody is guilty in there. And I think we have to always be very cautious because like I have friends who are um media people who were like, I'm in the files, but I had to go cover Trump's wedding to Marla Maples and and then also to Melania. And Epstein was there, Ghlaine Maxwell was there.

SPEAKER_03 34:18

I mean, Whoopi Goldberg is in the files. Yeah, it's a lot harder to talk about that.

SPEAKER_02 34:21

Well, and there's people that are, you know, that that have been included in the files. What we do know is we're able to separate the people who showed up at parties, right, or weddings, or or who um from the people who actually were emailing back and forth. Um, like, I mean, I'll tell you what's in the files. There's a lot in there about um about Bill Gates and Stephen Hawking and the the and what they did a lot at the um at the Zoro Ranch in New Mexico. They had an entire thing where they wanted to create an ultimate race and they were testing on people. I have survivors. There's over 12 testing what? Well, there's over 1,200 survivors in the files, and I have, gosh, probably there's at least 200 who've come forward and said we were forced to get pregnant. We were for we were held as minors, and we don't know what happened to our babies. We don't hear about that on the media at all. No, no, because they're not gonna talk about it. And so a lot of like it's much greater than just sex traffic. And this is what I've said. I'm like, there were parties where, yeah, there was drinking of blood. And what's crazy is you see in Hollywood, right? Like so the movies, like Eyes Wide Shut, some of that stuff is in there. But a lot of times when we see stuff coming out in the public that kind of makes its way out, it's based on something that somebody has seen. Um, and the same thing with um like what was happening at the islands or what was happening at these parties. And I'll tell you, Epstein's Island isn't just the only island out there. Um you said there's right. And so, like, and even a couple of years ago, so our our former Secretary of State, Anthony Blinken, um, his own f so he was actually um he's the godson of George Soros. And when and this is why Kamala gets put in to run as vice president with Joe Biden, because Soros was funding her 100%. When Biden comes out and wins, what we know is Soros says, this is what you're gonna do, you're gonna put Kamala here, and then they shift the funding over. And we this happens all the time, right? Like political packs do this, they shift stuff around. Well, we actually were able to tie, so Anthony Blinken grew up with Gislaine Maxwell, uh or Ghlaine Maxwell in um in Paris, France, but also were schooled in the UK. Their fathers were close friends and were some of the most prolific known pedophiles in all of France.

SPEAKER_03 36:28

I am a little bit shocked that you are so forthcoming with us right now. Well um about this issue.

SPEAKER_02 36:34

I mean, I got left in the Ukraine to be bombed and get my way out, and they think it was part of the. So are you I think I mean, really though, are you afraid? No, I mean I think it's one of the reasons I'm very public and I'm very I try to be very smart about it. I mean, I know like my husband sometimes, who's a former representative and a and a and a lawyer is like, ooh, like um, but I also believe that if we don't talk about the truth or what's happening, um, and and and I also watched for years like a lot of the QAnon stuff that came out where I think the problem is when people get a little bit of information and then they they run around with it, it can cause a lot of harm, especially in the trafficking movement too. And we were like, like there was we know for sure, like there were not underground pizza parlors in DC, like right. Like we know that. What we do know is, yeah, were there certain symbols being used to identify children? Absolutely. Were a lot of Hollywood people involved in it? And did were they there? Did they know were they at the parties? Absolutely. Do we know the extent of what they were involved in? Like we know what Bill Clinton was involved in. One of the reasons why the Clintons decide that they want to do their public um testimony public so that if you go into, if you're if you get brought into a closed congressional hearing, um, if it's closed, they are allowed to bring up um criminal elements of the case. The Clintons chose to do it publicly because when it's public, they're not allowed to. They're not allowed to. So everything released by the DOJ, so what Pam Bondi releases is everything, none of it is prosecutable. And this is why people, I think people are frustrated and they're like, well, wait a minute, the files have been released. No, they have not. What's been released are any are things that they the statute of limitations has gone out. They have no, they don't have the victims coming forward. Um, one of the women I'd been working with and knew for I talked to her two weeks before her death, Virginia Goyfe. Um, her brother lives actually here in Colorado and has been a huge advocate for her coming forward. Um, but we, I mean, do we are we 100% sure she didn't kill herself? Like internally. Right, I'm not sure. I know it. Yeah. Um You know what? I'm sorry. She yeah, but that she probably didn't commit suicide. We didn't. We don't feel like there's a lot of just complications, but also there's a lot greater things. And I've said to people, I'm like, look at this isn't just about the children there. What most of the people in the files are afraid of is what the systems it's gonna expose, the government corruption, the security stuff that's been going on, how our government has with Israel mostly and also the UK have gone into governments for decades and thwarted governments, like we've put dictators in and then we've had to take them out when they don't listen to us. Like it's all about world power and control. And a lot of it goes through the world our world banking systems. So Kelly, we're it's financial.

SPEAKER_01 39:17

So we're um uh we could sit here and talk to you for hours. Um but you know, I I uh but before we let you go this afternoon, I I just wanted to to pivot a little bit because you have a very long runway on this issue as a victim, as an advocate, as a person who's uh testified before Congress, who's worked with members of Congress. Sort of where do you where do you think this issue is going? And when some of these things retreat from the headlines as they almost inevitably will. Right. Um, where do you see the work going and where are you going to be focusing as an advocate?

SPEAKER_02 39:55

So, you know, really, so one of the things, and and actually Colorado is the first state, it took us three years, and we finally got it passed this year with bipartisan support, it was Senate Bill 15 or 26015, um, which basically we have never and we don't have a federal bill that that it that goes after buyers. And so the biggest issue with trafficking is demand. Wow. If we don't have demand, you don't have traffickers, right? We don't have victims. And this is where it's been really tricky, especially between children and adults. And what we've had to say is look, it we should be providing resources like there is a child cannot consent. A child cannot say, I want to sell my body for sex, even for survival sex. We have to do a better job as a society to say we're gonna put programs it forth so that our children in foster care, um, the majority of LGBTQ members are being trafficked and they're being forced into things because they've got no sustainable place to go and no safe place to go. And so, but the greatest issue is if we don't address the buyers, and predominantly in the United States, the number one buyers around the world of children are American men.

SPEAKER_03 41:04

Wow.

SPEAKER_02 41:05

They are, and they are white American men who identify as Christian, who make a disposable income of you know, $85,000 to $100,000 a year, who live in the suburbs, who are married with at least two or more children. And what we know is that a lot of them have been getting a slap on their wrist. And so traditionally, what we've seen is less, it's 0.76% of actual buyers of children in the United States have actually been prosecuted and held accountable for what they've done. Um, across the board, children and adults, it's less than 3%. The other misnomer that we've had too is especially when you talk about immigration and stuff, our traffickers are homegrown people. Like they're there are people here in the United States. It's it's not as many of the immigrants coming in, and a lot of the immigrant children coming in, most of the children in the United States who are trafficked are American children. Um and so I started again recognizing as an American citizen, what do we start doing to change the narrative and understanding? Because when the buyers are predominantly Western, European, American, Japanese, Australian, and from New Zealand, um, we've got to start rec because they've got disposable income. We have to recognize that. Um, and and how do if we want to talk about how do we put protections forward and change laws and protect the most vulnerable in our society, we have to address the demand. And so Colorado, we did finally we got that passed. I mean, like I said, it was a fight. And the hard part is you had on both sides, like it was killed in committee every time because they were like, well, we don't, our jails are such a mess. Like, yeah, we do we absolutely need reform? We do. Right. But they were like, we don't want to put men in jail who could potentially be raped. And we were like, but they just raped a child to this age.

SPEAKER_03 42:52

It it's fascinating to me. And um unfortunately we're we're we're at time, but I definitely want to have you back. You're so fascinating. And there's I'm sure our listeners are gonna want to hear a lot more. But before we go, um, before we started this segment, you and I were speaking a little bit about the unlikely, in my opinion, the unlikely co-conspirator in your work of Lauren Boebert and um her coming out against Trump um and really for survivors, right? And and really not even against Trump, but to end this to see the files to end trafficking. And she also has stepped up and said that women should not be harassed in the halls of Congress. Yeah, Nancy Lase's law law that they that they voted down. Yeah. Uh talk just just 30 seconds. Yeah. What do you think? How how does that play out for her? And and what do you think about the state of these women who are stepping forward and saying no more?

SPEAKER_02 43:43

So, you know, I'm gonna tell you, like, I I believe, like I I believe that Trump is trying to do some good things. And there are some good things that I've seen him do. There are some that are that I don't agree with. Um but I think when Trump ultimately had a a good idea, I think he wanted the files to be released because he didn't. Realize how in depth it was. After he gets elected and he starts pushing it, he gets called into a meeting with AIPAC. And I think they roll out this is what's going to happen. So he changes his tune. Whether or not we want to say it's political, it's funding, you know, there's a lot of different stuff, which we just saw with Thomas Massey, right? Like APAC put the most unprecedented amount of money into any congressional race. But yeah, so you had Lauren Boebert, you had um Thomas Massey, um Marjorie Taylor Green. Um, and and I was like, in what world do I live in that I'm ever gonna like agree with this? But I think the greatest issue is they are recognizing there's a lot of harm being done. And the problem with Trump is that if you don't agree with him or you that he thinks you're gonna make him look bad, he comes after you. I don't think he really cares like one side or the other, like how this plays out. Um, but I think that the rhetoric coming forth and the people attacking Lauren Boebert now, um, it's it's gonna be really hard, I think, for her to come back from. But I I mean, I will tell you, um, I haven't agreed with her 100% as a congresswoman. I do respect the congressional members who have the guts to come forward and say, no, we've got to start protecting our most vulnerable. And if we're not gonna do that, what do we stand for? Does she keep her seat? I don't know. So I mean, we we're hearing, I mean, I'm hearing a bunch of ramblings, like I get a bunch of stuff on the inside. I mean, I knew ahead of time that Pam Bondi a month before was gonna be let go and why. I think uh Representative Boebert, if she does, she does right now. I think she does, but I think at some point it's gonna get more difficult. And I definitely could see her stepping aside um and then letting someone else come in as well. Um, I don't know how you speak out against the Trump machine. Um, I mean, and even we've talked about Melania. Like we know Melania was brought over as a youngster recruited by Paulo Bertoli. And so are there elements of trafficking? Absolutely. But people, if they don't want to see it and don't want to understand it, it's really hard to get them on board. And so I think, you know, publicly, we actually have a federal version of our bill, the bill here in Colorado that's going to be introduced in the next couple of weeks. We have incredible bipartisan support. Um, rep Neals out of Texas, and then also Rep Jay Up Hill out of Washington. So two of extremes are able to come together and they're bringing people together, saying, you know what? Um, and we know by November, we if we don't get this bill passed federally, we won't have another shot.

SPEAKER_03 46:23

Okay. Well, so thank you so much for coming on today. Um, if our listeners want to reach out to you or find out more information about how they can help in this issue, where should they go?

SPEAKER_02 46:32

So my website is um www.cierra cares foundation.org. And it talks about what we do, um, but they can also sign up for our newsletter. Um, in our newsletter, I also talk about a lot of the policy stuff that we do here in the United States as well. Um so yeah, so thank you so much for having me on. And um, hopefully we continue these conversations and these topics. Absolutely. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 46:56

Well, um stay with us, we'll be right back and uh tell you what's bugging us this week.

SPEAKER_03 47:02

And we just want to say again, thank you so much uh to Kelly Dore for coming on and for sharing her experience. And wow, what an explosive conversation we had. I could have sat there for so much longer.

SPEAKER_01 47:14

Fascinating um and hopefully uh to be continued.

SPEAKER_03 47:19

To be continued. I've got a lot of questions. Well, now we will go into the segment what's bugging you. We know our listeners have a lot that's bugging them. We want to hear from you. Feel free to send us in your videos um about what's bugging you, and today we're gonna hear from Rob Duray.

SPEAKER_00 47:35

Here's what's bugging me is there aren't more politicians that are against war. Not against a specific war, like a Democrat coming out against the Iran war, but against war overall. Against the money that's spent, against its lives that's killed. How come there aren't more politicians on either side of the aisle that say, hey, war is bad for the common person, and we should be finding other solutions to it? I'd like to see more of that. It's bugging me that there aren't more people who are willing to come out against war generally.

SPEAKER_03 48:03

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 48:04

Great, great, great topic.

SPEAKER_03 48:06

That is a good, yeah, especially coming off of the last segment we had and really talked about, you know, uh the US involvement across the world. And, you know, I'm I'm a military brat.

SPEAKER_01 48:16

And so um I was born on an Air Force Base.

SPEAKER_03 48:19

I was born on an Army base. Which one were you?

SPEAKER_01 48:20

Carswell Air Force Base, Fort Worth, Texas.

SPEAKER_03 48:22

Fort Worth, Texas. We lived down there for a little while. I was born in Numburg in Germany. Okay. And uh my mom was an OBGYN and you know, really fed our families and got ourselves through college, through the military. And, you know, while I am a strong liberal Democrat, uh, I consider myself a Truman Democrat when it comes to war efforts because you know what? Sometimes there is a need for U.S. intervention, but I do feel like it should be as far to towards the last case scenario as possible. We shouldn't be rushing into wars or just deciding I don't like this guy, so I'm gonna I'm gonna s have a war. I mean, the instability that we know is going on right now because of kind of, I think, um uh I don't want to use uh inappropriate word, but you know, it just enhanced.

SPEAKER_01 49:07

Come on.

SPEAKER_03 49:13

Is is is not what I believe in. But I do believe sometimes we do need to engage in these international interventions.

SPEAKER_01 49:20

No, Leslie, I I compare and contrast what we saw with World War II. And I I had um the awesome privilege of being able to go to uh to Normandy and to see the beach where D-Day happened. It was such a powerful thing. And we were uh legitimately fighting against fascism and totalitarianism um when we fought World War II. Um and like you said, there are times when our country needs to exercise its military might. But there needs to be a there needs to be a thorough vetting of what the mission is. And so many times with the current situation in Iran, with what happened in Iraq, with some of so many of these quagmires that the United States continues to be sucked into, and that is is the objective, is the mission clear, or are we sending men and women um in uniform into harm's way without that being completely uh um f fleshed out? And and unfortunately in Iran, here we are again. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 50:25

And I think about Memorial Day weekend, right? Right. Um and so here we are thinking about and honoring those who have served and who have uh lost their lives in the line of war. And quite frankly, we don't want to see those numbers that we've seen in previous uh uh wars uh happen again, um quite frankly, and especially not in needless wars, where we're losing um our brothers, our sisters, our family members um uh in con in armed conflict. And so I think, you know, while I would say I do wish there was a w a a world in which there were no wars, um, I also believe that sometimes it's worth us stepping up uh and fighting to protect uh the democracy and the American values and also some of the things that we heard about in the previous segment to make sure that people can can live uh free from trafficking and harm uh and and and these egregious uh human rights violations.

SPEAKER_01 51:19

You know, one of the lessons learned in Vietnam was that we were going to include Congress in discussions about uh the exercise of war powers. Um that issue is is at the forefront again, and that is you know, and we've had Republican and Democratic presidents who have exercised military power without congressional consent. Um so I think it's time that we once again have a conversation as a country about what needs to happen before we send troops in. I'm glad you brought up Memorial Day. Um I'm coming up on the the one-year anniversary of my father's uh death last year, and uh my dad was a very proud Air Force veteran, served our country in in Vietnam. Um and I think, you know, for folks like my dad or for our veterans, and frankly, um as an aside, uh I think the way we treat our veterans in this country is appalling. And watching uh what our family went through just to try to uh obtain some benefits for my mom, you know, af after my father passed away. But you know, there are so many ways that we could be doing right by veterans in this country in terms of making sure the mission's clear when we send folks in, but after they complete service, making sure they have access to health care, making sure that we treat them with dignity, that we give them the support that they need, and mental health services are so vital for our uh for our veterans. So, you know, as we uh c are coming up on Memorial Day, you're coming you you come from a military family too. I mean, uh are are we aligned on that? What what do you think about that?

SPEAKER_03 53:02

100%. I was actually talking to uh my youngest brother Adam, who is currently serving and is at West Point now. I'm so proud of him, but he was the kind of young kid who would who who was a little bit of a fuck up, I'm not gonna lie. Yeah. And um love him, love him. Uh and he joined the military because he had a child early on and just thought that was the way to go. Um, and has worked his way up to now being at West Point and just just being an amazing father um and and and son and brother, and I love him to death. And I'm deaf definitely afraid for him. And when this war broke out, I said, you know, what are you gonna do, Adam? He's really close to his retirement. And um he's like, This is you know, um I would say that he probably doesn't want to go into war right now, doesn't think that's the right thing to do. But if we were to be in armed ground conflict, he said he would be there with with fighting with the soldiers because he needs to make sure that people are there that are trained, that know how to know how to respond and are responding appropriately and and and and have the skills that he has so he wouldn't let folks go in alone. And I just thought, wow, what honor, you know, what honor you have and and what a what an amazing human you have become and you are today to know that that if you are needed you will be out there. And I know that there are so many service members like that. And when he comes home and while he's there, he needs to have access to good mental health care, you know. He needs to have access and the and the families, right? Um, to trauma care because that is what it what what he sees. Um recently I went to Sundance and I'm uh I I watched this movie called Soul Patrol, and it was probably one of the best documentaries I've ever seen. It is going to be released uh to the public very soon. So everyone out there, uh shout out, watch Soul Patrol. It moved me in ways that I've I've not been moved around a mil a military war film, and it was about the returning soldiers from Vietnam. We've gotta do better uh with our soldiers. We've gotta make sure that when folks come home, they are welcomed back into society, that they have the tools that they need to succeed, and that they are not forgotten. And so as we think about this, this Memorial Day, I hope we all center in on that and Democrat, Republican, independent across every aisle that we can say we need to be doing more.

SPEAKER_01 55:12

Couldn't agree more, you know, and and this shouldn't be a partisan issue supporting uh our our men and women in in in uniform. So I I pr really appreciate your your comments on that.

SPEAKER_03 55:23

Well, it's always good sitting with you. I know that's all the time that we have here today, but uh another another episode. Under our belts. Under our belts. Uh and what what an episode it was. So I just want to thank all of our listeners. Thank you all so much for being here today. Uh thank you for the conversation. Thank you, Cole. Thank you to our guest. Wow. Um, and we will see you next time on Politics is Personal with Leslie and Cole.

SPEAKER_01 55:46

Yeah, uh Leslie, great to be with you. And remember, friends, politics is personal, so keep talking.

SPEAKER_03 55:52

Thank you so much for listening. This episode of Politics is Personal with Leslie and Cole was hosted by Leslie Harrod and Cole Wisp. This episode featured Kelly Dore and was directed and edited by Jamison Johnson and produced by Leslie Harrod, Cole Whips, Ian Silveri, and Julie Jackson. Special thanks to Hallie Wisp, keeping it in the family, and of course, Lily Bird, Bob Duray, and Mark Lyda. Music by JKK. And follow us on Instagram, TikTok, Facebook, Twitter, or any site where you get your podcast at Politics Personal with Leslie and Cole. Recorded at Denver Community Media, all rights reserved.