How to Scale Your Personal Trainer Business Online (with Miles)

In this video, Callum is joined by Miles, a seasoned fitness business mentor with 30+ years in the industry, and the owner of the rapidly growing 6FitGyms group.

With deep experience in both coaching and business development, Miles shares what it really takes to scale a personal training career in 2025. From systems and mindset to branding and retention, this episode is full of practical advice for PTs looking to grow their business and master their craft.

―――――――――――――――

🎯 Thinking about becoming a personal trainer?

Take the free PT career quiz: https://ptlaunchlab.co.uk/quiz

📞 Ready to start?

Book a call: https://ptlaunchlab.co.uk/book-call

🎓 NCFE Level 3 Personal Trainer Course:

https://ptlaunchlab.co.uk/courses

―――――――――――――――

Follow PT Launch Lab:

Instagram: @ptlaunchlab | TikTok: @pt.launch.lab | YouTube: @ptlaunchlab

Watch the full episode on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8477A4T4HBQ

🎯 Thinking about becoming a personal trainer?

Take the free PT career quiz: https://ptlaunchlab.co.uk/quiz

📞 Ready to start?

Book a call: https://ptlaunchlab.co.uk/book-call

🎓 NCFE Level 3 Personal Trainer Course:

https://ptlaunchlab.co.uk/courses

Follow PT Launch Lab:

Instagram: https://instagram.com/ptlaunchlab

TikTok: https://tiktok.com/@pt.launch.lab  

YouTube: https://youtube.com/@ptlaunchlab

#PTLaunchLab #PersonalTrainer #BoxingCoach #AddictionRecovery #FitnessUK

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Hello everybody, hope we're all doing well. Welcome back to PT Launch Lab. So today I'm in with Miles and we're going to be going over his journey in the fitness business, how he built up all of his chain gyms, his advice and experience in the PT game. So this is going to be a good one. This is going to be a good listen. So make sure you like and subscribe.

SPEAKER_00 0:31

So hello my house, nice to meet you. Welcome. And you too. Uh good to be here. Excited to uh channel things fitness and uh old time and and future stuff.

SPEAKER_01 0:40

I know absolutely. I mean we reached out to you because obviously your big chain of gyms is obviously really impressive. So I'd love to know specifically your history, like how did you get into it? What's your background in all this? What's your what's your what's your calibre?

SPEAKER_00 0:56

Um well typic, typical, I think most lads store, it's sporty, love the gym, and then just wanted to always had a dream to run a gym and you know pie in the sky, own a gym one day, and you know, went to gyms as a teenager, then decided to go do my fitness qualls with focused training in Bolton. They're still around as well, Bolton Health Studios, which I think's been demolished now. So that was I think 1996. So I just come up to I think 30 years almost in business. Started with a small independent, just used to work for free because I wanted free membership because as a 16-year-old, that's all I wanted. Yeah, yeah. Um, and then did my A levels, you know, PE biology, went to uni, did my degree, kept working for gyms throughout that time. And when I left uni, I gave up some time to be a floor walker at Fitness First. Right, okay. That shows takes you back a bit. Yeah, fitness first. And then um I ended up being a sales manager for them, and that went pretty well. Did won a regional award, best salesperson while I was there, and then ended up working for JJB Sports, if you remember. JJB, yeah, wow. JJB Gyms. So that's going back to the early 2000s. Progressed through assistant manager, general manager, cluster manager, ended up running the Scotland estate for them. Wow, yeah. Um, lived in Glasgow, and then worked for Greens, David Lloyd. So I went through pretty much most of the industry, and then thought it's now or never. You know, I'd done like a 15-year apprenticeship running clubs, setting up clubs, and thought I've got to do it. And sort of I went all in, sold my house. Wow.

SPEAKER_02 2:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 2:43

Um, yeah, just went all in, and that's when MP Fit was born, which was I think 2010, 2011. Started off, and we went up against the most popular DW at the time in the country, which was Burstall, and was told I was crazy to open a gym down the road from them. And I thought, well, about myself at the time I was heavily into you know strength training, um, west side methods, DeFranco's training. Yeah, yeah. What I classed as real-world functional athletic development training. And I thought there's no one doing it. So opened up and it took off. You know, it took off. There were a lot of mistakes on the way, bought some of the wrong equipment, you know, tried to please everyone, and I realized being a people pleaser, sometimes you please no one.

SPEAKER_01 3:35

Yeah, there's no there's no game for that anymore.

SPEAKER_00 3:38

No, you you've got to say who you are and who you're not because sometimes otherwise you're just vanilla and you're in the middle. Yeah. And MP fit was unashamedly, this is what we do. People were saying at the time in that club, why don't you put TVs up? No. Are you gonna put this here? Are you gonna put a jacuzzi in?

SPEAKER_02 3:55

No. No.

SPEAKER_00 3:56

We're here to get your results, that's what we do. And people traveled. Yeah, you know, you all back in the day, your membership travelled three to five miles. Yeah, we had members traveling seven, nine, twelve miles to train there. Okay, yeah. We extended the site, got the downstairs, which it has now, and then eventually opened up a second site, and um, it did really well. And I I exited and sold in 2017.

SPEAKER_01 4:22

Wow. So obviously, when you started that, I like that you went back to the functional strength aspects because it's like you say now, a lot of these leisure type gyms, let's call them leisure, they've all turned into a spa of some sort. You know, they've got more saunas than they have gym equipment, they've got the higher price memberships that includes a massage as well. Yeah, and you'll find a lot of the members, no matter what age category they're in, like, oh, I'm gonna go and do a bit of sauna today, I'm gonna do a bit of this, rather than the old method of I'm gonna go to the gym, I'm gonna work hard, and I'm gonna go home. Because I think the nature of a gym's really changed now. I think with the commercial side that's come into it, a lot of you don't have to be associated, like you can be a disassociated person, you can walk in, you don't have to know people's names, you can do whatever you need to do, whether that's you know, just going in the shotner, going in the pool, whatever, and then go home. There's no real commute community aspect about it.

SPEAKER_00 5:20

I think that's been my major criticism of the fitness industry over the last 30 years, which is you know, I've always thought the gym should be the third place. Yeah, you've got home, you've got work in the gym. You know, we have a mental health crisis because people feel alone, they feel isolated. And I've always had a massive passion in, and some of the mentors I had at the start were big on this. Know your members' names, eye contact, chat to people. You know, they should be said hello to when they walk in the facility. Yeah, goodbye when they leave, ask them how the training's going. These are the basics, yeah. And every facility should be doing that. And I know that some of the budget models have got a different model, and I know it's profitable, and I and that suits a certain niche in the marketplace, does it? But what I do think as well, as much as people criticize the budget gyms, what I think it does, it's a bit of a gateway into fitness for some people because it's low cost, but you also realise with low cost you get low service, yeah, no help, no support.

SPEAKER_01 6:23

And I think people forget one of the biggest things it's always been in sales, just in general, is people buy from people. Yeah, you know, the product the product could be naf, it could be a really basic product, but people work with people who they like, and yeah, I think that matters for PTs as well, because it doesn't matter because everyone's pretty much promoting the same thing, and it doesn't matter. You might have a little bit more knowledge in one area than some others, but essentially we're all promote promoting health and fitness, and there's thousands upon thousands of different gyms, independent gyms, different types of gyms, and you tend to drift towards the one that speaks to you the most, and it's usually the people inside it.

SPEAKER_00 7:02

100%. I think people want to think that's me, that's a bit of me. Either that PT, that coach, that gym, that solves the problem, the unique problem I have. And a lot of the time people are just vanilla. Yeah, they're trying to appeal to everybody, but then appeal to no. And I think as we know, well, when when somebody's looking to solve a problem, be it get fitter, relieve stress, get stronger, drop body fat, whatever their goal is. You, whether it's a coach, a gym, you want to be the logical, ethical, and emotional solution to that problem.

SPEAKER_01 7:40

Yeah, yeah. And I do you think that's why like high rocks gyms and CrossFit gyms have got so popular? Because they're very community-based now.

SPEAKER_00 7:49

I think I think CrossFit, you know, people talk a lot about what they've done wrong over the years and all the the PR catastrophes and stuff. But I think CrossFit did something very, very well, which was the community sample. They got people together, a common goal, and people fought for that community. And they did that exceptionally well. And that then has been taken on the good parts of it, I think, by HIROX. Yeah, and HIROX has obviously took off and gone to a different stratosphere.

SPEAKER_01 8:19

Yeah, because I think they've made high rocks for everybody, haven't they? Because, like, we we talk about functional fitness. I love everything about functional fitness, it's a skill. You learn these skills and they adapt to real-world applications, and it's tough. And I think with HIROX, there's something for everybody, it's not a particularly skillful aspect, it's accessible, yeah, and it opens up the doors to other people. And I think that's why it's important, and I think that's why it's welcomed as well. And I think that's sometimes where commercial gyms really miss out on that fact because you could put a thousand different machines that work a thousand different body parts in there, but they don't take anything home with them that they can practically use outside of that.

SPEAKER_00 8:58

I think I think where where gyms go wrong largely is they only think about what happens in the four walls. So, do they do community hikes? Do they get out with their members? Do they communicate to the members and give them value? Do you give them programs outside? Is the support how do you be accessible to your member when they're not in the gym? And I think that's the big challenge for gyms now because you've got to think beyond the four walls. Libraries, education, nutrition, coaching, social events, there's so many things that gyms could and maybe should be doing to separate themselves from the big box budget gym down the road that has loads of equipment.

SPEAKER_03 9:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:49

How can you differentiate yourself and provide a level of service and support which your budget gyms won't do and can't do because they haven't the manpower?

SPEAKER_01 9:59

So what mistakes did you make in the early days, especially bringing it up?

SPEAKER_00 10:05

Oh, there's been a few. There's been a few. So I think I think I had a very clear vision of what I wanted to be, but I sometimes let outside influences say that won't work. And I I'd kind of done my research. You listened to the noise a bit. Yeah, I listened to the noise, and sometimes I could have been bolder. I could have been, no, this is what we're doing, and it'll work, and I'm prepared to fall on my sword if it doesn't. I should have backed myself. So certain times I went a bit mainstream when I should have just gone kind of all in on this is what we're doing.

SPEAKER_01 10:40

Do you think that's where some people struggle now because they just sort of join the pack a bit and they try and do what everyone else is doing? It's fear. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 10:48

Everything comes back to fear. So PTs, coaches, gyms, I dare put that social media post out because what if somebody comments negatively?

SPEAKER_04 10:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 10:57

What if somebody says a negative comment? But they're probably never going to be your ideal client. They're never going to be your customer. So if you speak unapologetically and authentically, you and what you stand for, the people who resonate with that will be your potential clients. So the ones that don't like it, well, they were never going to be a good fit anyway. So sometimes I think being from the start, doing your research, getting very clear, having a mastermind of people who know more than you, pick their brains, pay for knowledge to accelerate your journey, and then back yourself and be bold. Do you think that's why mentors are important? 100%. I still have them now. I mentor gyms now as well as owning gyms. And people who come to me who are starting out, who have hit roadblocks, who have hit a stumbling block. You know, I can give them my 30 years of knowledge and maybe you should do this, try this. Let's look at your model, let's look at what you're doing. And we we tweak and refine things because they could spend five years potentially go out of business or just pay for somebody who's been there before. That's the power of mentors.

SPEAKER_01 12:09

And I know you work with obviously you work on scaling fitness businesses. Yep. Um do you find that sometimes there's some people out there it's difficult to work with because they're not willing to accept the advice? Like sometimes they don't accept when their thing's not working.

SPEAKER_00 12:26

100%. That's the most common problem is people get a little bit blinkered and that their ego gets in the way. You know, it's a case of-I imagine Jim. I said shocking, shocking because everything you look at the PL, you look at the financial statements, you look at the membership, you look at the retention, you point out every single metric that their business is in trouble and heading one way, which is into financial obscurity, and it's going to close. But sometimes you can say, right, okay, what do you think to this? What do you think? And that you they'll go, oh yeah, that would work. But they're still hanging on to the broken model or the system that isn't just clearly isn't working. And you look at the bank statements and you can see they're losing money every month, but they still sometimes hang on to ego.

SPEAKER_01 13:16

Yeah, we did that. I think I think everybody does that though, because you get stuck because when you first start something, naturally the beginning part is the most successful in it, and all those little factors and variables do work for a time, and then you've got to sort of figure out well, how can we modify this to constantly change with the times? Because every year something changes, every year there's a new type of mythology, there's a new type of approach, there's a new type of system that you want to use, but you get used to it. Well, this worked, so why can't we just keep doing this?

SPEAKER_00 13:49

I think new levels, new devils. And what you apply that, yeah. And what you find is what got you to your first 20 clients won't get you to 50 or 100. And in gyms, the methods you've used to get to 200 members won't get you to 2000. So a saying a mentor said to me recently was, you know, sometimes you've got to leave good behind to be great.

SPEAKER_03 14:13

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 14:14

Because good methods won't get you great, they'll keep you good. So sometimes you get in that zone of being comfortable or taking over, but you know you've got to change and pivot your mindset, your actions, your beliefs, your systems to go to another financial level or member level or what whatever it may be, whether it's you know, a coaching client's level, you know, your systems won't sustain the next level and your mindset won't. Because often your mindset and your beliefs are the bottleneck in your own business.

SPEAKER_01 14:48

Yeah. Yeah, yeah. How do you manage the expectation then? Because I think we all have an expectation in our brain of what we're supposed to earn from doing a specific thing. And then the reality kicks in. How do you match the expectation of what you think you should be doing to where you're actually at? Because I think you can get lost in the cataclysm. I think social media did it as well. You see people out there, you they might be in the same business, you know, people who get into PTs. You see people driving Lambos and Bugattis in Dubai, and they're thinking, how did they do that?

SPEAKER_00 15:19

Often rented for a day.

SPEAKER_01 15:20

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 15:21

Often. And I know some of these people, so I know that it's smoke and mirrors. So that that does sway people's mindset. I think everything it's based on what I should be here or I should be there. Based on what? What are you what actions are you doing to achieve that?

SPEAKER_03 15:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:38

You know, so I I I've got a big thing which is data over emotions. So you should always be looking at the data because when I speak to people, be it somebody who's in a gym or a coach, and they say, Oh, everyone's joining. And I went, Everyone?

SPEAKER_04 15:54

That's a bright one.

SPEAKER_00 15:54

How many? Yeah. What was your target versus you know, are you on are you on track? The goals you set, you should always weekly reflect and daily sometimes reflect on are you on the the right trajectory or not? Because people say, and and then everyone goes to saying it halo or pitchfork. Yeah, everyone's joining, everything's rosy, everything's miserable. Everyone's leaving, and you say to them, Well, you're saying everyone's leaving. Show me the data. You've got a 3% churn, 4%, 8%, 10% churn. What is it? And is that seasonal? Look at last year, in October last year, did you have a bad month? Yeah, but we had a great September, we had a great August. Sometimes people look at things without context.

SPEAKER_01 16:41

Yeah. It's like panic mode, isn't it?

SPEAKER_00 16:43

Yeah, you know, they have this zigzag approach. Oh my god, I'll go run there, then I'll run back and I'll run back and have a plan. Look at your plan every week, look at your daily actions, and am I moving and doing the work towards? So, people, I can give them a social media 90-day plan and a strategy based on the type of member they're after, the type of client they're after. And I can say, here's what you need to do every day. And it's one day's a testimonial, one day might be some education. Have you done the work? Uh, well, uh, I don't have time. And I say, Well, not having time is the adult excuse of the dog getting my homework.

SPEAKER_03 17:23

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 17:24

You know, and I say, Show me your Google calendar. And it's the funny thing is, is everybody that has no time doesn't have a calendar schedule.

SPEAKER_01 17:32

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, it's like when you speak to your clients, in it, and you know, say, Did you hit these points in your programme? Like, well, no, because the kids got up early and all of this. I was like, and you end up just building this facade where the world's constantly against you. Whereas you've you've got a choice.

SPEAKER_00 17:50

Cosh, we we all have choices, and it's you either choose to do sometimes the hard thing, which is the thing you need to do, or you choose the comfortable option. Yeah. And we know that in in fitness, we know that that often people choose the comfortable side.

SPEAKER_01 18:03

Yeah. And I suppose so it in your area as well, you can really figure out the pros and cons of the fitness business these days. So obviously there's a lot of pros. I think people miss on the cons. Um, what would you say are some pros and cons today of being in the fitness industry, whether you're a coach, a gym owner, what aspects are the pros and the cons?

SPEAKER_00 18:26

I think the pros are massive. Just, I mean, looking at data on and gym memberships, there's still only 16% of the UK population have a gym membership. So it's 84% of people potentially can be converted to doing regular exercise in a gym, which will make them fitter, stronger. Even if they don't follow the best programme, they'll still see some results.

SPEAKER_02 18:46

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:47

So it will reduce obesity and a plethora of other problems. So there's massive upside potential for PTs and coaches. I think again, you know, with people being in front of the screens longer than ever, being less active than ever, I think there's a massive opportunity to get people fitter, stronger, healthier, and as a result, affect their mindset and make them feel more connected. So the personal touch as a coach, I think is massive. And I controversially on another conversation I had last week, I said this. I think there'll be a massive swing back to actual in-person personal training.

SPEAKER_01 19:26

Yeah, well, you see, Ryan keeps saying this exact same thing. And I think the idea of being an online coach is so intoxicating. Because I think when people think of freedom, yeah, people think of freedom, you can work from anywhere in the world, you can do this, you can do that. That sounds like a dream. But what we always teach is if you haven't been on a gym floor talking to people and knowing how to build a connection, you're going to struggle very much online because you know by facing somebody and talking to someone and working through the problems, a lot of the time it's got nothing to do with the mechanics of exercise and the complications of diet. It's mainly about emotional connection. They need to know that they're in the same boat as everybody else starting. Yeah. And you transfer that online, it's a transaction of money, and you give them a program, you give them a diet protocol, and then they don't follow it, and then you just consider that person just not be capable.

SPEAKER_00 20:21

Well, I'll quickly go to the negatives of the fitness industry. And what I see is if you can't do it, coach it. So people who've never done master it and the 10,000 hours on the gym floor. Yeah, they've never done the legwork. If you've not worked with clients over a long enough period, watching everything, knowing how people react to coaching, knowing how to actually physically coach and exercise tempos, postures, looking at people's body language when they walk on the gym floor to see are they ready for this workout today? Do they look beat up? You'll look at the body language and you think, have this let well. They're working away. And an online coach, if they've never done all that 10,000 hours in the gym, you can't effectively on like it's like being a virgin sex therapist. If you have not done the hard yards, yeah, and I see coaches, and I don't, I don't, I don't like throwing people under the bus. I've seen coaches who've failed on the gym floor because they wouldn't go and speak to people, build relationships, they've had and you think that's like the most like that's the most important thing. The clue is in the title person training. And you then see these people who are an online coach, and you think you've never even been an in person coach.

SPEAKER_02 21:51

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:52

So now you're copying and pasting spreadsheets and sending it to people, charging them 200 quid a month.

SPEAKER_02 21:56

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:57

And that is the bit of the fitness industry, and that's Why I almost hope personal training comes back in again.

SPEAKER_03 22:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:04

Because you can't hide.

SPEAKER_03 22:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:06

Whereas behind a laptop, you can nick other people's work, copy and paste it. And I do know that goes on because I know people who are doing it and selling other people's work to clients. I find it appalling.

SPEAKER_01 22:18

Yeah. And do you know what? Even to a degree, if the workouts aren't your own, it's still negative in a way. But if you were a good coach with someone else's workout, you realise, like you just said, it's not about the workout. It's about building the capacity in a human being to be able to mix training, family life, and realizing that can be a catalyst to improve all the other aspects outside. And health and wellness, I mean, you can take whatever form of training you want. You could functional strengths, you can do running, you can do swimming, boxing, whatever form of training you take on, you gotta know that it has a knock-on effect to the rest of your life, and it usually in a positive manner. And it's like you say with these online coaches, like we always hit this home because there's nothing I hate more than somebody who's never had any personal connection with people and knowing how someone's gonna feel about it because you get that nerve-wracking feeling, you get that you know, that confidence, that imposter syndrome, but you don't think you're gonna be able to do it. How is how are you gonna let someone know that that's okay and that you're gonna help them? Because essentially that's what personal training is, you're just there to help. You're gonna spend half your time being a therapist, you're gonna spend time is more than half the time. Yeah, and you're gonna spend half your time making sure that they're you can help them build emotionally as well as physically, because if you can get your mind right, your body's just a byproduct, and uh it's it's a weird one because when we started doing the personal training courses, initially we just started with the courses and we thought that was important, but then we know as personal trainers, the certificate is just a gateway, and it's it's like getting your driver's license. You spend all that time with your instructor, you get your license, doesn't mean you can drive, it means that you have the legal qualification to say that you're allowed to be on the road, doesn't mean that you can do it. Yes, and then when you get your certificate, it's about going out on the gym floor and meeting people and understanding people. And usually I always find the best personal trainers have had a personal training themselves and been through a journey.

SPEAKER_00 24:25

100%. I mean, I've always invested in mentors and coaches. I've travelled to Charles Polloquin seminars, Paul Check seminars, John Berardian. I've spent 30 years going to seminars learning from people smarter than me. Because if you which I think again in the personal training industry, it's quite sad. People don't go and they get qualifications and they're not always upskilling.

SPEAKER_03 24:50

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 24:51

You know, who's better than me in that field? Are they doing a course in London this year? Right, I'll go and I'll do it three days there, I'll go and do that in Manchester. And people and trainers who won't invest in their own education are surprised that they can't put the prices up every year because they're not levelling up their skill set. If you can get better results and deliver more, you can charge more. But if you always stay on the same skill set level, don't expect your income level to keep rising. Yeah. I see that, and I've seen that for years.

SPEAKER_01 25:24

100%. Yeah, and yeah, this is why the the industry can be difficult sometimes because I think people can't correct the dots with what's important in terms of yes, it's important getting transformations. It looks great when you put that post on and someone's gone from 30% body fat down to you know below 15. It looks fantastic, but do they are they mentally better? Are they going to sustain that? Because you can get someone from A to B very fast in a short amount of time. It's what they do after their time with you. You know, it's it is like working with someone again with a drive instructor. You want to get someone to a place where they're confident, and then are they going to maintain that and be better? Because as a PT, you could have a client for years, but a lot of clients will work with you maybe up to a year. And when they go away, are they going to maintain what you've taught them? Have they got sustainable knowledge to be able to go away and go, I know what I'm doing now, and I can crack on? Or have they left with nothing and you've just put them through workouts and they've got no mental stability to carry that on?

SPEAKER_00 26:29

Yeah, I think one, you're building confidence in them that the gym is a place for them to train. So without you, they can then carry that habit on. Two, it's it's the why. If you're telling somebody to do certain exercises, certain volume, eat a certain way, some of the grams of protein, why is that? You know, if you if if you educate them on why they're doing things, often adherence goes up. And if they if they understand the why and they keep understanding the why as you're coaching them on a journey, they hopefully leave with enough. Like you said, to it's like the whole the old analogy, isn't it? You know, teach a man how to fish versus giving him a fish.

SPEAKER_03 27:08

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 27:09

I don't want to butcher the analogy, but it's that kind of thing.

SPEAKER_03 27:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 27:12

You teach them how to train and the and the rationale and the logic behind it when you've built their confidence up and they're at a level. Sometimes you can go, right? You you're kind of good on your own now. You can maybe do a distance. That's when the online stuff comes in. You know they know how to train because you've coached them, then you can go on and do their programming and their nutrition for them. So I think I think the industry that's we're at this point of you know, online's best or in-person's best. I think there is it's using knowing when to use a hammer and knowing when to use a screwdriver.

SPEAKER_01 27:45

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 27:46

Not will not one thing works for everything.

SPEAKER_01 27:48

Yeah, yeah, no, 100%. How do you profile? So obviously, you employ personal trainers in the gym. Yeah. How do you profile it? Because I'm sure it's more than a CV. What do you look for? So representing your brand in your gym.

SPEAKER_00 28:02

I like people, believe it or not, I like people to be already members at the gym because you know they they're training your gym, they like the product, they're into fitness. So when they get their qualifications, they aren't somebody who's hopefully or just fancy being a PT. I've been a I've worked in a warehouse yesterday and I fancy being a PT. I like somebody who's into fitness, usually had a PT themselves, yeah, yeah, yeah. And then does a course and wants to be a PT because they they've been helped and they want to help others. So they they want to help. I like that, and as well, a skill set I don't worry about so much because that can be taught.

SPEAKER_03 28:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 28:43

The dying art of being able to speak to people.

SPEAKER_03 28:46

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 28:47

And you know, when I when I started in the industry, it was like, okay, go and speak to 10 people, find out the names, find out why they're here, and what's the one payment point they struggle with? 20, 30 years ago, that's how we were taught. And that has been lost, yeah. I think in the industry. Whereas, you know, people now rely on social media, I think it's too much rather than walking up to people on a gym floor. How's it going? How's your training? Exactly. Is there anything you're struggling with? Or what's the one thing if I could solve for you? What would that be? Yeah, solving problems, yeah. You know, I yeah, because usually when people, there's people, there's a one lever that usually is a big lever that unlocks a lot of things. It can be snacking, it can be the nutrition, meal prep, it can be anything. Yeah, but as a coach, if you can solve that one thing, the ripple effect is massive.

SPEAKER_01 29:36

Yeah, and and I always lay it back because I I was a mechanic many moons ago, and people always ring you. So as a specialist in that area, people are gonna ring you with a problem they need to fix.

SPEAKER_00 29:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:48

And you're gonna help them to fix that problem. And I think PT coaching works the exact same way. The audience that you're gonna build, the clientele you're gonna build, they're gonna have a problem. Okay, it could be your niche area could be helping busy mums and dads over 30, optimize and you know, find a little bit of balance. Okay, that's your problem that you're saying is fixed. It doesn't have to be just that problem, but these problems that you've got to fix, it might be a few, it might be a lot, but you're in the job of getting to know people and getting to know what the actual problems are. And it's like the three Y's, isn't it? So when you're doing a consultation with a client, you're like, What do you want to achieve? I want to lose weight. Why do you want to lose weight? Well, I had a dress that I tried to fit in that I had from many moons ago, and it didn't fit anymore. Why do you want to fit in that dress? Oh, because at that point I felt really confident and I was in a new relationship, I felt good. Okay, so you're wanting to get that spark back going, you're looking to revitalize, you're looking to feel good. Okay, that's a good goal to go. And then you can build that accountability when they get into the depths of the training, and they'll always hit a point where they plummet a little bit, maybe the scale weight's not moving as much, maybe the performance in the gym slowed down a little bit. Like, remember your goal, it's all part of the process, everyone goes through it, and then I think you can transfer that over to building a business as well, because it will hit a stalemate at some point, and then you're like, oh, it's not working, you know. I want to go back into employment, I'm gonna, you know, I'm gonna find a way out. Well, remember why you're doing it in the first place, yeah. And remember the why, and remember the real reason you want to do it because I think everybody that comes into this the one thing that people we've had conversations with potential learners, and they always ask for guarantees. So we put you can earn up to five grand a month if you want to. And more. Yeah, and more. And they'll go, how can I guarantee that you earn five five grand? I'm not making guarantees. That's not the point. You know, you can buy a Tony Robinson book that tells you how to be a millionaire, and each page has all that information on there. Every person that buys that book is not going to be a millionaire.

SPEAKER_00 31:51

Yeah, because they don't often do the work and apply it consistently, as you know with clients. Yes, you know, and I call it the valley of despair. So everybody who's starting a business, starting a weight loss journey, starting a gym journey, motivation lights the touch paper, the rocket ship sets off. And as we know, when motivation like a muscle tires and fades, yeah, you go down into the valley of despair. How is it worth it? Oh, it's hard work. But if you can just get the discipline and the rocket ship going again and get them back on track, yeah, they usually stay the course and see the benefits. Yeah. But you've got to get them doing the work long enough to see the benefits.

SPEAKER_01 32:34

I'm sure with the amount of people that you worked with, sometimes you just want to give them a bash on the head and say, look, get over yourself. This is part of it.

SPEAKER_00 32:42

Having tough conversations with people and being a blunt Yorkshireman, like we both are, you know, you sometimes have to just have a an affectionately themed, difficult conversation. Yeah. Where you say, right, okay, I'm gonna give you it straight now. You want to get to there, we've agreed a course of action of these things, and you're not doing it. Do you want to get there? And that can be with a client to weight loss, strength, anything. We've agreed. Can you do this? Yes. Have you got the time for this? Yes. Have you got the motivation for it? Yes. Have you got the this? You can get all the yeses in the world to the agreed plan of action, but still, when they're not in your present company, they have to do the work. And that's where you have, you know, the valley of despair. Yeah. Self. Motivation fades. Oh, should I carry on? But you've got to, like you said, bring them back to the North Star. What do we want? Where do we want to go? What does it look like? What does it feel? How is it going to make a difference in my life when I get there?

SPEAKER_04 33:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 33:50

Reconnect them to that and hopefully we get them back onto the track and we get them moving forward again.

SPEAKER_01 33:57

I think the same people that want guarantees, it always drives me nuts. These are the same people that probably buys a lot of ticket every week. You know, they're buying it like they've already won it. And they're buying it every week with the notion that they might get it. And it's that transfers to look, you start in something, unless you see it through, you don't know if it's going to work. And I think those initial steps that you take where you get those small successes to the start, it can build that false sense of right, I'm on the right track, I'm doing good. I'm beating 99% of my competition, 99% of my potential. And then, like I say, when it gets hard, they usually revert back to their old mindset of the world's against me. It's the victim mindset I sometimes find that people want to feel like they can't achieve something because this world order is telling them that they can't. And you've got to push past that because no one's ever been successful, has got to that first roadblock and give up at the first one.

SPEAKER_00 34:55

Yeah, you know, business, being a coach, business owner, fitness business owner, gym owner, it you are going to you're going to have massive hurdles. You're going to have things come out of the blue that hit you, blind side you. You're going to have all these things happen, but you have to just dust yourself off, pick yourself up. Again, where am I heading? What am I doing? What do I need to do to get there? You know, and do the work. You know, the amount of times that I've seen people with potential as a coach who've not achieved it and dropped out of the industry because the daily basics they're they're not willing to do.

SPEAKER_01 35:39

Yeah, just run through the run through the rituals and hit those marks every day.

SPEAKER_00 35:43

Yeah, and sometimes a little bit of success and then stop doing the basics as well.

SPEAKER_01 35:47

Yeah, they forget.

SPEAKER_00 35:48

That's a key thing. Or, you know, I've got to 20 clients now, and suddenly all the social media they were doing every day, the reaching out to people, speaking to 10 people a day, you know, how can I help? Just how can I help? Tell me how I can help you. If you don't, if that got you to 20 clients, you get to 20 and you stop doing all that, well, everyone, as you know, gets a churn. Yeah. People move away, people for illness and all sorts of reasons will stop. So you're suddenly back at 15, then you're back at 10, and you're back at square one because you've stopped doing the work that got you the clients.

SPEAKER_03 36:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 36:23

So in the background, you have to have systems or yourself, one or the other, that gets you the lead flow, which gets you future clients, and you can build up a waiting list if you need to. But people stop doing the stuff that got them the clients.

SPEAKER_01 36:38

So that's like the 80-20 rule, innit? So you're 80% is all your admin, keeping stuff running, keeping stuff alive, and that 20% is the bit that scales, in it. That's the outreach, that's the iceberg. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 36:51

You know, you've got all this under under the water that people don't see, which is and again, you can systematize a lot of this. You know, there's lots of ways of doing it so you can leverage time, but you've got 80% of systems that make sure that stays above the water and looks glossy and shiny and successful and all the rest of it. But there's a lot of work that goes on behind the scenes.

SPEAKER_01 37:12

So if you could go back to you know the prime self before you started all this, with your advice for now, you can go back and have a conversation. Is there anything that you could probably drop as a hint of noise to them? This is probably translates to those watching now who might want to aspire to go into the fitness industry. What would be some really key points to understand before taking on this sort of endeavour?

SPEAKER_00 37:39

One, be coachable. So, again, like we said, be a sponge. At the start, you've got to look at everybody who's smarter than you and try and absorb, pay for. You know, I've took people out for meals before to pick the brain. I used to call it a brain picking fee. You know, if that I'd I'd reach out to people who I knew were doing far better than I were, and I'd say, you know, oh, do you want to go out for a meal? Your choice, I'm paying. And I'd just sit and just ask them questions. I'd go on weekend courses, mentorships. I would do everything I could to try and get the facts in your head, but then you've got to have the courage and be bold to then put it into place.

SPEAKER_03 38:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 38:21

And all the naysayers and people like us don't do that. People in this town don't make money.

SPEAKER_02 38:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 38:27

People in our family are not self-employed. You're always going to have that weight of people and dragging you down.

SPEAKER_03 38:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 38:34

So you've got to, it's all right acquiring the knowledge, but then you've got to be able to put it into action. So I would say having somebody who mentors and holds your hand until you have a business. Because setting up a business is full of minefields, and you don't know them until you step on one. And somebody who's been there and stepped on all those minefields and made the mistakes can stop you making those mistakes, save you time, save you a lot of money, yeah, and a lot of hard take.

SPEAKER_03 39:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 39:04

So I would say, you know, get the knowledge and just be a sponge and then get somebody who can hold your hand and walk you through the journey.

SPEAKER_01 39:12

Yeah, it's yeah, I love that. I do. Because I think people get really tied up in the now as well. Um, I've had to learn over ever since having my first child of allowing to be present as well, because we can live in the future way too much. And even if that's in the success mindset of I'm going to be here, I can't wait to get there. This is the only time I can be happy. And I think having that mentor and having those people and having all that information around you lets you know that these are stages to hit, these are milestones to hit, these are things to go through, even the the tough ones, because you can get all the advice in the world, you can't avoid certain pitfalls, and you've got to just build an armour to be able to push through it, right? And there's no there is no book out there, there is no information out there that tells you when it's time to knuckle down. I think that just comes down to instinct as well. It's got to be who you are.

SPEAKER_00 40:13

You've got to enjoy the journey because you've got to go through all the stages. And I look back and some some of my I rem I remember setting up my first gym. And when you're starting, you're hemorrhaging money. Yeah, yeah. You you pour every penny that comes in, you're putting back in, you're buying more equipment, you're buying it with money sometimes you don't have. And I remember at one point in in year one, I remember going to Leeds, the McDonald's in the Merion Centre in Leeds, top end of Leeds. And I remember my card failed in McDonald's.

SPEAKER_03 40:49

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 40:50

But I look back on that year one as the business was growing, and it was like, I look back now and laugh because I remember I was selling clothes on eBay, but I had a vision, and by year two and year three, the revenue just did that. But I had to go through the hard times. You know, and and I weren't unhappy, I had no money, everything was going into the business, but I was so passionate about the project and I knew it would come good. And I wasn't scared to ask for advice when I had in trouble.

SPEAKER_03 41:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 41:20

So it was a case of, you know, like I said, I look back now and I look back with fond memories at year one when I had nothing. I sold my house. I bought I sold a lovely big house to buy a two-bed bungalow without a kitchen. I was living in absolute sort of squalor for that first year or two. Yeah. And, you know, but it's just you go through those phases of building painful ones, you know, struggling, struggling, struggling. And sometimes you just get out the other side of it. So now you're almost paying that forward now, though. I want to stop people making mistakes because I see a lot of people who could do really well. And because of obvious, glaring things that you can fix pretty quickly, they could have a really great business or a really great coaching business. You know, and it some of some of the things that I've implemented for people is just sometimes you've got the wrong equipment for your type of member.

SPEAKER_03 42:20

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 42:21

Your name, your logo, your branding, your message doesn't talk to your ideal client.

SPEAKER_03 42:27

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 42:28

You try you're trying to get John Smith in, who's a 40-year-old male, but you've got branding marketing that appeals to 18-year-olds.

SPEAKER_02 42:37

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 42:38

So you're wondering why you're struggling, and you you literally, you might be pouring all the effort in, but if you're rowing the boat in the wrong direction, so sometimes it's turning the boat around and thinking, right, where are we headed? Who's the ideal client? What language do they talk? Where do they go? What do they read? You know, what doing a deep dive into your ideal client, a real deep dive into it? It all starts from there. And then you kind of build the solution problem that solves their problem.

SPEAKER_03 43:06

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 43:07

So it's reverse engineering sometimes that the gym or the coaching business because people go in, and sometimes I've had people who try really hard and it's not laziness, but they've just got the message wrong. You know, they don't know who they're trying to appeal to. Well, I'm well, I just am trying to appeal to everyone.

SPEAKER_01 43:26

When does the idea start, though? So what we always try to hit home for everybody is when you first start, especially in fitness, you might not have a clear vision straight away.

SPEAKER_00 43:38

PTs, they shouldn't niche down too early. Yeah. PTs, you should learn your craft. Because people come in and they say, Oh, I want to train young lads, I want to train young young women, I want to do this. But what you sometimes find is after six months of training that type of client, they're like, I've realized I don't enjoy it. I actually Actually, enjoy the 40-year-old to 50-year-old professional people who execute what you say are very diligent, and you get better results with them. So I just say to PTs who are starting, have an open mind.

SPEAKER_03 44:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 44:15

Go on the gym floor and actually start training all types of clients. And then over time you'll realize what is your North Star. I want to train women over 40, men under 25 to do contest prep. Whatever your market is, you'll figure it out as you go. I don't think at the start you haven't got enough experience to know what you're going to be good at and what you are going to coach.

SPEAKER_03 44:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 44:43

So I think when it comes to building a business, physical bricks and mortar, you need to have a very clear. Otherwise, you've got to like tear it all down and rebuild it.

SPEAKER_01 44:52

Yeah, you have to you have to change your aspects again and again and again. I mean, I even when I did it, I I went through that route, I was training anybody and everybody. And then my sort of niches come round now, mainly training women for strength training. Yeah. And someone actually asked me the other day, like, why do you like why most of your clientele all women? And I came down to very simple fact is they listen and they do they do exactly what you say. Because blokes, you tell them something, they'll go, Yeah, I can do it, I do know what I mean.

SPEAKER_00 45:23

And obviously, your your style and your method and your and your coaching, obviously, women get great value from that. So as a result of that, they'll probably tell more women who go, Good, I've got the guy for you. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it it builds from there. So it's a case of you sometimes by accident as a PT, as a coach, you think, well, I never set out to coach that kind of person, but that's that's my market, and I love it. It works.

SPEAKER_01 45:51

Have you uh so I know you probably got a lot of these goals, but have you got any goals for the next few years? What what's your approach now? What are you trying to do?

SPEAKER_00 46:01

Well, currently in the middle of a big refurb at um at six fit in the moment, we're doing spending a lot of money on that place, just trying to trying to get it to a place where I feel I've got it as good as it can possibly be. So that's you know, it's been a project, transforming it from an older club to uh rebranding it, complete new look, new feel, new equipment, and obviously on a bigger site, 20,000 square foot, it's it's quite a costly operation. Yeah, quite a costly operation. Yeah, so we're we're sort of 70, 80 percent through that project. So I still I'd like to spend more time because I I love mentoring and helping gym owners, small box owners, and and and coaches. So I want to dedicate over the next couple of years, get back to doing one two days a week, dedicated mentoring and coaching. So once this project starts demanding less of my time, yeah, I can then start helping more people, which I just enjoy. You know, people said years ago, what would you do for free if you didn't get paid for it and you'd enjoy it? And the coaching and mentoring, because it's it's like I love going into a business and quickly spotting stuff.

SPEAKER_03 47:18

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 47:19

Because I'm like, oh, there's some quick wins here from walking to the car park looking at everything from is the front door clean? What's it like first impression? And you straight away you've got this mental bang, bang, bang, that needs to change, that needs to change. I've walked in, oh, you've got you've got free weights as soon as I've walked in the door. If I'm trying to appeal to women who might be nervous, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, sometimes, like I said, the the product doesn't match who you're trying to attract.

SPEAKER_01 47:49

Yeah, you it's those little aha moments, in it, where you can walk in and go, ah, that makes sense. And usually, like obviously, y'all coming from that perspective, the gym owners, the PTs, they're not going to see that because you can't you can't read the label when you're inside the bottle. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 48:06

And everyone's inside the bottle.

SPEAKER_03 48:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 48:07

So you need somebody to come and look at look at you with a 30,000-foot view and go, right, here's your blind spots. And sometimes you can achieve great things quickly.

SPEAKER_03 48:20

Yeah.

unknown 48:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 48:20

Because sometimes if you've been in the industry long enough, you get to spot blind spots quickly. Because you can just walk in a gym and go, right, change that, change that, change that, change that. That needs moving, that needs moving. You can have an action plan within a day. So one day consort in a gym, you can give them sometimes overwhelm.

SPEAKER_03 48:41

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 48:42

But it's like, here's the big levers, let's change that first and that first. Then we'll move on to that, that, that, that, and that. So I love that going into a site or going into somebody's culture business and go, tell me about your business. They'll tell you about it, and you go, okay. And you can quickly go, right, let me give you some insight. And you can say, Well, you're trying to appeal to a 30-year-old mum who's nervous and anxious, and you're called, you know, Barry's Barry's bodybuilding. Do you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_03 49:12

You yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 49:13

You're kind of like that nervous person who you're trying to attract, you're not talking to them. You're the gym rat who shredded eating chicken and broccoli seven times a day, and they're thinking I could never be like that. Yeah. And you there's a disconnect.

SPEAKER_01 49:28

Yeah. It's the same thing when uh Ryan goes on about us all the time when bodybuilders turn into coaches, and then the first thing they do is they put a photo of them in little underpants, you know, doing art flexors. So I want to help women do this and do that.

SPEAKER_00 49:41

I want to help nervous women with confidence.

SPEAKER_01 49:43

Yeah. You're not, you're not ideally specifying, and you're not looking like you want to help these people.

SPEAKER_00 49:49

Yeah, it is, and sometimes as fitness professionals, we're not talking in their language. Yeah. We're talking in fitness jargon. A treadmill to a 70-year-old is a walking machine.

SPEAKER_03 50:04

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 50:04

And we still use the word treadmill.

SPEAKER_03 50:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 50:06

We're not talking to them in their world.

SPEAKER_03 50:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 50:10

And I think, and this comes back to whether your coach, gym owner, SGPT, box owner, know who you're talking to. You know, is it a walking machine or is it a treadmill?

SPEAKER_01 50:22

Yeah, yeah, 100%.

SPEAKER_00 50:23

You know, this thing you do 10 times, Barbara, it's going to strengthen those arms you've mentioned to me. She doesn't want to know it's called a bicep curl with a three-second eccentric. Barbara doesn't care. She's 65 and she wants to get a bit stronger. Yeah. Talk to Barbara in Barbara's language.

SPEAKER_01 50:40

Yep. Yep. And uh I saw a one the other day as a gym somewhere down south, and they built a BBL room. So this is where women specifically go to build their ass. And they've just named it the BBL room, and it's just full of equivalents. That's where you're going to do that. And it's going to drive people in there because it's very people who want to train the glutes, it talks to them. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 51:01

Talks to them. Because what you're saying is, if you want to get better glutes in that area, you're going to get it.

SPEAKER_01 51:08

You're fixing a problem.

SPEAKER_00 51:10

Fixing a problem that people want to solve. And that's it, you know. And whatever your fitness business is, whatever you coach, if it's confidence, if it's contest prep, whatever it is, just talk to those people in a language they understand.

SPEAKER_01 51:25

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 51:26

So that's a big thing we do. We're talking jargon.

SPEAKER_01 51:29

Yep, we do. I've really enjoyed that. Thank you so much. Yeah, no, no, great. I appreciate it.

SPEAKER_00 51:34

Always happy to sort of you know impart whatever whatever things I've learned over the years. And you know, it's I always enjoy talking all things fitness.

SPEAKER_01 51:42

Well, we'll love to have you on again as well. And uh I'd love to part two anytime come down, visit the gym because uh I've I've been looking at it, I'd be really interested to see it as well, see the project.

SPEAKER_00 51:51

Come on over, yeah. I think if you come over this December, some of this next phase of works will be complete. So I can show you this phase before we start on the next phase. So never ends.

SPEAKER_01 52:01

So just for everybody, where are you based? What what where do people find the gym?

SPEAKER_00 52:06

Yeah, Miles Holstead uh on Instagram, Facebook, and our gym page is Sixfit Gyms, if you can see that. Sixfit Gyms. Get the badging audience on Instagram, Facebook, and you know, you can have a look at what we do, the kind of messaging we put out. You know, some of it's educational, some of it's what we're doing, trying to keep members informed. So yeah, it's just you know, being authentic and trying to be who you are.

SPEAKER_01 52:32

Absolutely. Well, thank you so much. No problem, enjoyed it. Make sure you like, subscribe, turn that notification button on, and we'll see you on the next episode.