In A Plot Hole
Join Samm and Mikayla as they have a conversation about your favorite books.
In A Plot Hole
Book Talk: Black Sheep
Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.
Come chat with us about Black Sheep by Rachel Harrison.
Follow us on TikTok and Instagram
@inaplothole
Welcome back to In a Plot Hole. It's the seventh episode. Seventh episode.
SPEAKER_00My name's Michaela.
SPEAKER_01I'm Sam. And it's thundering outside.
SPEAKER_00Perfect recording weather.
SPEAKER_01Perfect reading weather. Curl up on the couch with a blanket, a book, your Kindle.
SPEAKER_00Oh yeah.
SPEAKER_01Your puppy, your cat.
SPEAKER_00Speaking of bundling up, or sorry, kind of reading vibes, what you drinking?
SPEAKER_01Oh Dr. Pepper. From Canes, and it's Chuck Norris approved. He's the cart the face of Canes right now for National Chicken Tender Day. I think they're doing like a fundraiser actually for Yeah, there's yeah, it's a fundraiser for like to get kids and into like sports and stuff.
SPEAKER_00So yeah, that's what it says on the code. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01So if you want to donate to a good cause, Chuck Norris. Go get some kids.
SPEAKER_00We love Canes. It's just delicious.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. We have the same order. It's funny.
SPEAKER_00It's really funny. Um, you know the funny thing is I first went to Canes on my birthday, and we went today, and your birthday is tomorrow. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. That's funny.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Sorry, that was annoying.
SPEAKER_00Okay. Alright.
SPEAKER_01Alright, all right, all right. Well, hello, hello, hello.
SPEAKER_00Okay. So do we have a high and a low?
SPEAKER_01A high and a low? Mm-hmm. Mmm. Well, my hi today is from yesterday, where we did my big birthday like celebration yesterday, all day.
SPEAKER_00So it was a lot of fun.
SPEAKER_01So much fun. We went to a couple museums, Dave and Busters, a restaurant of Italian food, because everyone knows I am a pasta beach. It was so good. Oh, your lasagna looked really good.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01I had the shrimp like dish, which I thought was really good.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and like all of their ingredients are like handmade.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, they fry they make to order everything. It took so long. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00But it was well worth it. No. The portion sizes were decent too. Yeah. Honestly, when I got home to Isaac, I was like, they probably should be charging more for the food because like that was fantastic.
SPEAKER_01No, yeah. Well, they have like a family style where you can get like five different things for $39 in person. But like it's like you share it at the table. One of our friends was telling me about that. Yeah. We should do that one day. We should.
SPEAKER_00That would be really fun, actually. Okay. To do. Okay. What was your favorite part about yesterday?
SPEAKER_01My favorite part.
SPEAKER_00What's like a favorite thing we did last night or yesterday?
SPEAKER_01I just liked I liked the museums. I'm a museum nerd. The Titanic museum. We didn't come into Titanic. That was so cool. That was really cool. Kind of depressing. That was kind of sad.
SPEAKER_00Sorry, I was just thinking about your character.
SPEAKER_01Your personal so you get like a boarding pass of like a person that was actually on the ship. And I had some really high hopes for my girl Helen. She were both first class. She was first class, married, had $10,000 worth of jewelry on the boat, had a puppy named Fru Fru that she collected on her like five country honeymoon. And then she survived the Titanic. But she did not survive life.
SPEAKER_00Not for very long.
SPEAKER_01So R.I.P. to Helen.
SPEAKER_00She's a real one.
SPEAKER_01She was a real one. Yours was good though.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, mine ended good. I think I think my person got the better end of all four of us.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Because Isaac's Isaac's died. Isaac's person died.
SPEAKER_01So did Dylan's.
SPEAKER_00So did Dylan's because they were with Isaac was third class, Dylan was second. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Isaac's was really sad too because he it was a family of like eight or seven. Yeah. And they weren't even supposed to be on the ship.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_01They got transferred to the Titanic because the other because of the coal strike.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. It was it was really cool. There was a lot of things that they found on the excav excavitions to the bottom, which was really cool.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. They have a whole giant iceberg in there, which was super. I forgot to touch it. Here's my thing. Like, yes, it was really sad, but I think that says a lot about like how well they curated everything. Like if I don't like I was You were going to school for that kind of stuff. I go I yeah, I went to school for art history before I switched to art therapy. But my thing is like a good museum will make you feel something. And that definitely made you feel something. Because like some people just obviously there's the movie with Leonardo DiCaprio. Like people kind of romanticize the Titanic.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. But this at the end of the day it was a tragedy.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. So like for them to like for me to walk out of there being like, well, that was a little sad. It I it was a good experience for me.
SPEAKER_00It definitely was. So I think my favorite part of the that museum was one, all of the artifacts that they had, because it was so incredible to learn about like how they like went down there and did all that stuff. And then two, um, the grand staircase that they had recreated in there. It was gorgeous.
SPEAKER_01And they had actual pieces from the original staircase like on display there. I just thought it was like and you and there's a piece of the Titanic's hall that you can actually touch.
SPEAKER_00It was crazy. So we could say that we've touched the Titanic.
SPEAKER_01I've touched the Titanic, as is every other person.
SPEAKER_00We got to touch a rock. I at least with the second museum the museum we went to after that. We went to Ripley's believe it or not. Um, they had a piece of Mars. Yeah, they had a piece of Mars.
SPEAKER_01So I've been to space.
SPEAKER_00Bent to space. Got to touch a piece of Mars, which was cool.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, really fun. Um, I'll be honest. I don't really have a low. That's good. It's my birthday beard. It's your birthday being. The low is it's my last year in my 20s. Yeah. But that's not even a low. It just means I'm getting older and wiser, and eventually I'm gonna have a Gandalf beard and a staff.
SPEAKER_00I was gonna say we're gonna be Gandalf with Big Naturals. We can cut that up if we need to. No, that's funny. Please keep it. But Gandalf with Big Naturals. I love people who do that cosplay. It's hysterical.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. But what was your high low of the weekday?
SPEAKER_00My high of are we doing yesterday or today?
SPEAKER_01I just did today. I mean, if we're doing today, it's seeing you, but that's always my high.
SPEAKER_00Um, I would say my high, because we did a lot more stuff yesterday than we did today. Um, I would say my high yesterday was probably either the Titanic Museum or the Ripley's Museum. Ripley's was really cool. Um, it was a lot of fun because it was like Ripley's is so interactive, and that's what I like about museums. I like the science museums, those are my favorite.
SPEAKER_01I liked the art museum we went to, it just was a little small. It was a little bit more. I'm used to Boston, so like I was spoiled.
SPEAKER_00And plus, like they had more like the contemporary art, which was a little different than I don't mind like modern and contemporary art.
SPEAKER_01I just wish I like variety and I don't like looking at the same style of art through one museum.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and that's kind of what it was. It was like all very similar art pieces to itself. Um but it was fun. The only like downside to that in particular museum is that one of the security guards kept following us. It was a little weird.
SPEAKER_01Oh, they they uh so that's the thing they do is they um they sit in that seat. Um, because I learned about this in school, they sit in that seat, but if you're out of view of them, they have to watch you gotcha because they don't have access to cameras. So it's not it's don't take it personally. Because if you actually pay attention to them, like they'll walk and they'll like check, and then if they see someone else going somewhere that they haven't checked, they'll like walk over that way.
SPEAKER_00Like they have like an an area, so it's not because Isaac was saying that like one of them was just like dead ass just following him the entire time.
SPEAKER_01It's just because we're buyer, it's just because we were really the only ones in there.
SPEAKER_00It was a very small museum, it wasn't even that busy either.
SPEAKER_01No, yeah.
SPEAKER_00But it was fun, it was a really fun day. The like like we were talking about earlier, the food was fantastic. Um, I left after dinner, but you guys went and did some other stuff.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I went to a little bar at City Walk, which is fun. It was 80s themed, and that's my favorite decade because I don't know why. It was fun.
SPEAKER_00It's a fun, it's a fun decade. All the best music I would argue came from that.
SPEAKER_01No, literally. But I have a question for you.
SPEAKER_00Okay, what's the question?
SPEAKER_01A little sentimental. Oh.
SPEAKER_00Sentiment.
SPEAKER_01I had to. Um, what's the hardest thing you've done?
SPEAKER_00Like, period?
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00It's gonna be something that we've kind of already talked about before, but probably the hardest thing I've ever done was move across the country.
SPEAKER_01No. Have I asked this question before?
SPEAKER_00No, um we you asked what's been one of my biggest extra. Oh yes, yeah, which I would argue also is that also is that, yeah. Um yeah, what yeah, that's probably one of the harder things I had to do. That was a lot of um it was very emotional moving away from my hometown that I grew up in.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00I'm sure you can probably feel the same when you're gonna be able to do that.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I mean I do down here and um hardest thing I probably did.
SPEAKER_00He's awakened. He's he's awoken. He's awoken. I'm gonna make another I'm gonna make another Lord of the Rings reference. Smog is awoken. Small awoken.
SPEAKER_01Smoke is awoken. The hardest thing I've probably ever had to done I've ever ever had to done. The hardest thing I've probably ever done is like realizing that I need to focus on my health and not my dream in a specific moment.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Um, I was down here doing an internship at a company that I was really excited to be doing an internship for, and then I ended up getting really sick with like pancreatitis and it just wasn't getting the right time better. So I had to make that decision of like giving up my dream to focus on my health, which was the smarter thing because I ended up being very sick for like over almost two years after that. So, but that was probably the hardest thing I made a TikTok about.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, but especially with like the crew the specific careers that you were one doing at that time and two doing now, it can be hard to get into those. Yeah, like it's a very competitive company, so so yeah, that I can imagine that being incredibly hard to decide between.
SPEAKER_01But because I'm very much a person where I won't put myself first the same way.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, but I'm glad you did. Because who knows who would if you would have been here today if you didn't for real. And then I we wouldn't be having this conversation. I wouldn't have gotten to know you as well as I do.
SPEAKER_01Don't make me cry. Okay, I guess we'll sometimes I wish we were doing video, which I'm hoping we can do soon. We can, yeah. But which we've been talking about. Um, I wish they could see our facial expressions sometimes. Because sometimes like you react to something, but you're reacting to my reaction to like you say something else, and they can't, they don't want to yeah.
SPEAKER_00That'll be fun. That'll be really interesting, and I'm gonna actually have to start caring about how I look when we're recording.
SPEAKER_01Okay, beat that face.
SPEAKER_00Alright, do we wanna get into this book?
SPEAKER_01Woo!
SPEAKER_00Ow. Really excited for this episode, actually.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. So this episode, we're gonna be talking about Black Sheep by Rachel Harrison. Ow, that's a wolf.
SPEAKER_01I'm sorry. Ow. Ow. Okay.
SPEAKER_00Black sheep sheep's clothing.
SPEAKER_01Black sheep. Ooh.
SPEAKER_00Gotcha there. I mean BRN! I mean, that kind of makes sense for this book. Dab on the haters. It's too much for me.
SPEAKER_01Too much for me. She's dabbing in 2026, y'all.
SPEAKER_00I'll bring it. I know, poor PST.
SPEAKER_01My dog is outside the so my we're at my house today, and my animals are not allowed in the office because it's really small, and my cat's chew on wires. There's B bed. My bed. And and my dog sheds a lot because he's part husky and it gets into the fans of the computer. Yeah. And it breaks the computer, and we have to like take it apart and clean it.
SPEAKER_00Plus no beds in here.
SPEAKER_01And that's really annoying to wash as well.
SPEAKER_00When I say my bed, it's a it's like a seven-foot beanbag. It's a seven-foot comfortable beanbag that I will always sleep on.
SPEAKER_01It's what I sleep on. It's what I sit on when my husband's playing video games, and I'll sit in there and read. But my dog is standing outside the door whining because he wants to be part of the episode. But Beastie says hello.
SPEAKER_00Beastie and the other cats say hello.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Okay. Well, he's a dog, not an other cat.
SPEAKER_00He acts like a cat, but fair. Okay. Let's get into the recap of this book. Um, I'm gonna keep it nice and short. I know I'm not the best at that, so we're gonna try our best.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, we're trying new techniques.
SPEAKER_00We're trying new things, so just bear with us. But we're not jinxing ourselves, so this is not even wood, it's I don't know. I don't know if it's actually wood. Anyway, so Black Sheep by Rachel Harrison is about a I don't know how old she is, but I think she's 20-something.
SPEAKER_01It's literally what it describes as a 20-something.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so she's a 20-something girl. Her name's Vesper. Love her name. I love her name, but I need more female characters with unique names, please. Fair. Um, Vesper um had left her cultish family um in like uh New England somewhere, I believe. It's like in New York or something. I don't remember where exactly it is. Um New York.
SPEAKER_01It's in New Rural Rural, New York. Which by the way, is not part of New England.
SPEAKER_00My bad. I couldn't remember what state she was in. I'm sorry. Um so she leaves her cultish family um that she's been living with her entire life. Um, I think when she was 18, she um goes off to live with herself by herself in New York, and then randomly six years later, is called back for a wedding. But she's invited to a wedding. She's invited to a wedding. Um should I go more than that, or is that good? Because that's kind of like the synopsis of the book on the cover itself. Okay.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. So I want to know, like, what did what was your first like impression of this book? Like before reading it.
SPEAKER_00Like, how did you so I was a little nervous about this book. Okay.
SPEAKER_01Because um of some stuff that I've personally been through that I thought it would kind of I did warn, I did tell you, I was like, hey, this is about XYZ. I know you've dealt with ZYX.
SPEAKER_00So I thought it was gonna be a lot more serious than it ended up being.
SPEAKER_02Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. And um once I started like reading it and stuff, it was a lot goofier. And I don't want to say goofy, maybe, but it was a lot less serious than I thought it was gonna be, which ended up helping, and it went in a very different direction that I thought it was gonna go. So that I did enjoy. So it wasn't like super um it wasn't super like bad on my end.
SPEAKER_01It was more like a dark comedy.
SPEAKER_00It was like a dark comedy, that's a really good way to put it. Yeah, it was a dark comedy.
SPEAKER_01It gave Plume House. Yes.
SPEAKER_00Yes, like the best way I could describe it where it wouldn't surprise me if they made a movie about it. Yeah. Like Plumhouse made a movie about it.
SPEAKER_01Like, but please come up with new ideas.
SPEAKER_00Yes, please.
SPEAKER_01I like I love a book to movie adaptation, but like I need some I need some difference. I need like I need some. I need some book to movie adaptations.
SPEAKER_00We're gonna go see Okay, okay, we'll finish this. We'll finish this. Um I'm getting ahead of myself.
SPEAKER_01So I was really excited about it because the concept sounded really interesting because most of the time with like religious trauma books, it's like, oh, they're called back for like a funeral.
SPEAKER_00Uh-huh.
SPEAKER_01But it was for a wedding, and I was like, oh, that's so interesting. Because like that's a very happy thing. And this girl that's been away from this church for so long, yeah, is going back to a wedding and just gonna like drop in, like, okay.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and in the book, they even kind of say, like, it's real it was really odd for her to be invited back because they don't once you leave, you cannot come back.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, they're very like, oh, when you leave, you're not able, like you're you're shunned, like you're not allowed to be back in the church.
SPEAKER_00You can't contact anyone, you can't go back to the um to the ranch. That tickled. Um she keeps poking, she always pokes the holes in my pants. It's the same pair of pants. It's it's my recording pants.
SPEAKER_01Recording pants, recording pants. But that was like my like first impression of like just seeing the book, which I feel like having a first impression of a book versus when you your impression of when you're reading the book are very like always very different.
SPEAKER_00And now having read the book, the title of the book makes much more sense in multiple different levels, which which we'll get into later.
SPEAKER_01But um what did you end up reading the book? I think so. We started this new thing where we don't talk about the books to each other until now. So this is like this.
SPEAKER_00Fresh is fresh conversations.
SPEAKER_01I don't know what she thinks about this book at all. The only person that knows what I think about this book is one of our other friends who is kind of like our advisor in this situation.
SPEAKER_00So um she gives us feedback on what we need to fix and all that. Yes, we should we shout her out? Oh, we can shout her out and and her company.
SPEAKER_01Shout out to Callie. Go follow her, buy candy from her at Mystic Sugarworks on Etsy. You can message her on Instagram if you're in the Orlando area. She goes to markets a lot. Please, thank you.
SPEAKER_00She has some of the best candy. She did your wedding favors. She did my wedding favors. Um, she does DD Um dice as candy.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, they're like playable dice, which is her like main thing is like she does DD candy dice and they're playable, so they don't she makes them to where they don't get like sticky. Yeah, which is awesome. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Well, obviously, after you eat it, it's gonna be sticky, but while you're rolling them, it's not.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, but she's really cool. But she thinks, but that's that's her main Yeah, but she read she read this book, so I was she's the only one that knows how I like feel about this book. Yeah, so I want to know it to her. Yes, but I want to know what your your rating was on this.
SPEAKER_00So I think I rated this a three. Oh, okay. I I genuinely liked this book. Maybe not like as like it's not like one of my favorite books, but like I genuinely like enjoyed reading it.
SPEAKER_01Okay.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. It was a fun silly thing that I just like to read read.
SPEAKER_01I gave it a two and a half.
SPEAKER_00Okay.
SPEAKER_01I had things.
SPEAKER_00I know I from the very little that we've talked about this book, it I feel like you weren't the biggest fan of this.
SPEAKER_01I have things about this book. Um so to continue, like recap, the wedding that she gets invited to is with her c is her cousin and her ex-boyfriend. Correct. And the only reason she goes is because it's her ex-boyfriend.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01That pissed me off. Yeah. You haven't talked to this man in six years. Yeah. Like, he's gonna move on. Yes. Um it's not the religion you think it is, which I did which I did like. Yes. They are part of a satanic it is a say it is she did grow up in Satanism.
SPEAKER_00Yes, she was she grew up in a satanic cult.
SPEAKER_01Cult? No. So I okay. So it seems like satanic cult, but I don't think it is actually classified that. I think it's just she grew up in the Satanist religion, not a cult. Because that's they have a priest, they have yes, like they have a whole church, like all this.
SPEAKER_00Their church is underground, which is kind of sick.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Well, I I studied religion in my undergrad. Yes, you did. This is my main thing.
SPEAKER_00I've met I was very interested to see I've met many saints.
SPEAKER_01I've been to a Satanist church because I've had I did a whole paper on it in college. They are the nicest human beings you'll ever meet. They are very peaceful. They're very like it's not a dark It's not as dark as you think it is. Murderous religion. And from what I was reading about what the author wanted to do with this book and try to do something different, the way she paved Satanism. She did it mainstream. She made them these like violent people.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_01And more like mainstream what you would see in like a movie or like during satanic panic. Like that's what really annoyed me was like you you tried to go this one way and you ended up going the way you said you weren't gonna go.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and that's I completely understand that too.
SPEAKER_01And Vesper is annoying. Vesper is pisses me off. She pisses me off.
SPEAKER_00What about like what was she doing specific things that was pissing you off specifically?
SPEAKER_01She just was she was very whiny in like a way where she's like, oh, like boo-hoo. But one thing that really stuck out to me, she went back home to her apartment in New York, hung out with her friend, quotes around friend that she works with. She says, Oh, I like this guy that I now the man like the the friend was like, Oh, I like the new manager. I could maybe try to get your job back. And she's like, Okay. So she meets the guy, they go all out for drinks, she goes, and Vesper goes home with the guy that her friends likes and sleeps with him. Yeah. And then is like, why is she mad at me? What do you mean? Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Why do you mean what do you mean if she like because I kind of thought the same. I was like, she's kind of being a dick.
SPEAKER_01But then It honestly gave me more like ABC family freeform movie kind of vibe. Yeah, that's kind of what I think. I really wanted she did because she talks about like, oh, I had my parent trauma. My mom was never home because she's a movie star.
SPEAKER_00My dad wasn't around. I want to touch on that a little bit too. Her mom reminded me of like a worse, not I want or maybe worse.
SPEAKER_01Anytime I read her mom, I just saw more Tisha Adams.
SPEAKER_00I saw that's interesting because I saw um Oh my god. What is her name? Elvira. Oh yes. I saw Elvira. Yes. Because she was more of that like because I know Elvira's like a. Yeah. She's like a she's a horror icon, but like for if you think of it this way, it's like an Elvira if she was always Elvira and not just like there's the actress and just the character. Yeah. It's the same person. So like she has like her house is like fully decked out in like um like like horror movie m memorabilia that she's been in. Um Vesper talks about like her house being like constantly um like it's done up in like horror decor. At one point there's a lamp from a movie that her mom was in that she like is just made out of it's like fake skin, but it's like yeah, but it's like supposed to be made out of like human skin.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00So like like it's just stuff like that.
SPEAKER_01If you like but like it just like she talks about like she's like, oh my mom was never there because she was filming movies. Yeah. Oh my dad was never there, but I don't know his name. Okay, you have you have daddy issues, you have mommy issues, like but she never like it would be like she never like worked she went didn't went there was nothing about exactly in the past, like she would like there would be like snippets of the past, but it wasn't like fully like in delving into like why are you feeling this way? Yeah, like are you working through this? No, you're just being whiny about it. That is yeah, that's true. You just oh, like what did happen that made you at 18 want to leave? Oh, I just didn't believe it. Okay, you didn't believe the religion, that's fine. But like you're going you're talking around being like, oh, my parents were too religious, so I left.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Okay.
SPEAKER_00You just didn't- What are you doing about it?
SPEAKER_01She didn't go into any like full detail, and I really wanted more of that like toxic familial relationships, and I wanted more of that like religious indoctrination, which is what I thought I was gonna get. And I didn't, and it would be like it's one of those things where she'd be like, start talking. The only time she ever like opened up was when she told that one the guy, George, yeah, oh, um the manager that she slept with, yeah. Oh yeah, my family's in a satanic cult.
SPEAKER_00She's like, I've never told anyone else this.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. But you tell like a brand new person that you slept with, and then and then you're confused why he told everybody at work that you're from a satanic cult, and then everyone is like it just after that point, I would say it started to kind of tip into the more goofy side of it.
SPEAKER_00And maybe goofy is still not the right word. Less serious, as I keep going back to, because um, because I don't know, do we wanna spoil it?
SPEAKER_01I mean, there's a big twist, and if you don't want to know the twist, you can like skip ahead a bit all. But her dad comes up to her at the wedding. Yeah, just randomly shows up. Oh, you're here, so he must be coming. But no one's saying anything, which also really annoyed me, and I was like, who's coming? Like, but there was no like indication, like, oh, maybe it's her dad, maybe it's this per like, no, I just was like, who? Yeah, like it wasn't explained very much.
SPEAKER_00But then I guessed the twist in like chapter four.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, like you texted me and you were like, Yeah, it's her dad.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01So like he shows up and basically, so her dad is Satan, like he's actually the dad Lucifer. Yeah. And but when I first read that, I was like thinking, I was like, oh, we're gonna get like a Heaven's Gate thing where it's this crazy man who thinks he's all like prophecy and like he's running a cult and then they're all gonna like drink the Kool-Aid, but especially because it's called Hell's Gate.
SPEAKER_00It's literally called Hell's Gate, which I thought that was funny.
SPEAKER_01And I was like, But I was like, so it just didn't like fully explain like how are you Satan? Like, how are you Lucifer? Like they did this mean. I was and the ending was very like the ending was so But there's more, like, so then her dad shows up and starts torturing a bunch of people, like breaks the girl's teeth on the thing, which I was like, whoa! Like that's cool. Yeah. Like, oh, she tripped and fell and like smashed her teeth in a sink.
SPEAKER_00It's almost kind of like he almost kind of has powers kind of similar to he doesn't in dire like he doesn't directly cause what's going on, but he kind of like he kind of does like a final destination type feel with like something will happen to where like it'll like snowball into her dying or something, like her getting injured or something like that. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Or like like he had her like phone, like call George to come meet her somewhere, and it was just to break his hand so he could never play the guitar again. But he's like, Oh, don't worry, he won't remember you were here, he won't remember what happened.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, but she just stands there like okay. And she kind of just accepts the fact that like she's like she doesn't like she's like she's kind of in the middle of like, is this like bullshit or is this like she thinks it's just a joke, and that's what she's acting like, which like honestly, like yeah, If someone told if someone told me my dad was Satan, I'd be like, sure, like but like she's seeing all of it happen in front of her, and she's like And she's still kind of like I don't know and I'm like girl, you literally caused that to like in the beginning of the book, she's uh like she's a waitress and she's working at this restaurant, shorties, shorties, and like she this guy asked for like cheese, and this guy like kept harassing her or something.
SPEAKER_01Okay, oh no, he was harassing her because he's like, Oh, you look like Constance, which is her mom, and but like she it took her so long to be like there's my mom. Yeah, because like it was like, oh, are you because like at first it comes off like oh are you Constance Right? Like, are you related to Constance Wright? And I was like, it came off as I was like, who's that? Is that her? Is like that her like is she a famous actress? And like Yeah. Also, what really like kind of geared my twisted my gears and is like they made her like out to be like this which I will say there were parts where I appreciated about the the the depiction of Satanism, like the girls getting ready for the wedding, blasting Taylor Swift. I was like, they're real people, like yes, they would probably be doing that. But then there were other things where they're like they're like, oh let me like they cut like they so at the end basically you find out like oh she has to be sacrificed for the for the for the world to be destroyed.
SPEAKER_00Crazy too.
SPEAKER_01For the world to be like destroyed and then like replenished. Well the yeah, because she's Jesus, the the the devil's child. Yeah. But like so like they're like, oh, they go from like this gorgeous, lavish depiction of a wedding, yeah, and then eventually they're like, oh yeah, we just cut my child open, took her rib out, cooked it, and I ate it. He ate her rib. Yeah, he ate her rib and then slit her throat.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, to open like the gates of hell. Yeah. Um, but another thing too, like another thing kind of pulling back to the wedding, like it was kind of like a quote unquote regular wedding, but at the end, like when he announces them husband and wife, they like sacrifice a lamb. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01It was the parts of like, oh, let me try to make this like kind of accurate to actual like people that would be in in Satanism. But then oh, let me just have them sacrifice a lamb.
SPEAKER_00It was very like it kept like flopping from normal people to like heavy, like yeah, wrong ideals of Satanism.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, like like um the girl, the bride that was getting married, I forgot her name already, but um Rosemary. Rosemary. She was like, Oh my god, you're here! I'm in my pink flouncy dress. And then she was and then She was acting like nothing was happening. And then like people would go and be like, Oh, the nose piercing's a nice thing. Like they were like offended by her nose piercing. But then like then they would be like killing, then they would just like cut her open and like she's missing a rib. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00And then like they would like all of her family members are like they're all and they kept saying like there's a line in this book that I liked. It was um you keep act it was I'm gonna like, it's not like like a full-on quote. I'm just like paraphrasing, but it was like um that yep, that was the one I was gonna think. It was the one of um I can't remember who said it. I think it was her manager that after she got fired was like, Can I give you some advice? Oh, you're not that special, you're not that special, and then she goes, Well, everyone in my life has always told me that I am special because she's literally Satan's daughter.
SPEAKER_01And I I did like the parallel of like when you read the beginning, like all the waiters and like the cooking staff, it's like here you go, princess. Your highness. And then, but she's like literally actually the princess of hell. Like that, there are things I liked, which is why I gave it like right in the middle. But I was like, there are just too many things.
SPEAKER_00I was like, I liked the first half of the book when it started to get into like Satan's my dad, and I I'm like prophesied to open the gates of hell.
SPEAKER_01I was kind of like, So okay it was so it was funny because I was telling um I was telling Callie, I was like, oh, like when you told me when I had asked you once, I was like, oh, how are you liking the book? You're like, I really like it. And I was like, oh, where are you? And you're like, I'm at this part. And it's like, okay, that's where I really liked it up till two. So I was like, okay, like that's why I was like, because I don't remember what part it was, but it was right up to like middle of that part. You were like, oh, I really like it. I'm at this part. And I was like, okay, so that's where I really liked the book too. But then it just like you thought it was gonna go one way, but then it went complete 180. Not even, it went a different way, but then it started going the other way again and then back down. Like it was like weird, like it just it wasn't she kept leaving the ranch and then coming back to the ranch, and it was like a whole like the ending really pissed me off because she was like, So there's an epilogue. Was it like six more years later? Yeah, it was something like that. It was a couple years later, and they made a movie about it. Like her, the there was a there's a girl they talk about at the beginning, they only talk about her like once one or twice, once or twice about how oh, she's like the sister of somebody, and they're like they looked at her like oh, like like she she left, like she left the church, and she comes back, wrote this like biography, got it made into a movie. They have the house that Hell's Gate was over as like a bedding breakfast now.
SPEAKER_00So because so why they have it as kind of like a a BB and um kind of like as a oh yeah, one of those uh Oh yeah, everyone got sucked into the pit of hell.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, because died. Because she I don't remember exactly what I think her mom I will say, her mom had like slight redemption. I didn't like her mom at all. I didn't like her mom at all, but like she had that like slight redemption of like here, take this pin and draw blood, draw blood, and then she dies, and then she she used out.
SPEAKER_00I blacked out at that part.
SPEAKER_01Well, so she used the pin to like get unheld from her dad so she could so her mom like kind of saved her at the end, but like I was like, you weren't good enough to be redeem redeemed right now.
SPEAKER_00Like so her mom was an asshole, like completely just like anytime she was in the room, she was criticizing the main character. It was just not a good book. Like, like, like I said, I enjoyed the first part of the book, but I didn't necessarily enjoy the last part of the book. It like you like we were kind of talking about, it went in a completely different direction than we thought it was gonna go.
SPEAKER_01It had a good start, but it didn't end that way, and that was what really bumped me out because I was really excited for this book.
SPEAKER_00I was too, and I was a little nervous about this book, and once you kind of because you had finished it when I started it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Because I want I was honestly, I think I was um like not purposely putting it off, but like subconsciously putting it off because I was worried it would kind of um mess with me a little bit, but it didn't. It was it was it was an okay book. Yeah, I would say. It was okay.
SPEAKER_01I mean, I it wasn't bad enough to where maybe I won't read another one of her books again.
SPEAKER_00I I would say like I wouldn't I I didn't dislike it enough to where like I would never reread it. Like I would reread it if I was kind of in the mood for it.
SPEAKER_01I don't think I would reread it. I'm saying I wouldn't, I would read another one of Rachel Harrison's books again, is what I'm saying. Yeah. It has a 3.5 on Goodreads, though. Okay. Well some people like it. Yeah. I think because I wasn't expecting it to have like that tinge of like I just wanted a really good horror book, and I like to be scared.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and that like kind of what I was talking about earlier is like the the title made so much more sense because one, she's just a black sheep of the family. She left home. Um, she was always the odd one out. She's literally Satan's daughter. Two, um, they literally sacrificed her. The the entire purpose of her being born was to die, to sacrifice her life um at the end of the book to open the gates of hell and to unleash the apocalypse on earth.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. I'm looking at like the other like good read reviews, and a lot of them are like, oh, this book was I I liked this book until halfway. Um this was not a horror book. I wouldn't classify it as a horror book, maybe like a dark comedy. Yeah. But um, there's one that was like the most obvious twist, which kind of goes back to you guessing it before you even there was there was a few hints to where like her It started well, it was intriguing, and I was surprised by the first reveal. Heads up since finishing. Um I've noticed a lot of reviews give this away, which spoiler she was like, oh I'm gonna Oh, and then like halfway through she didn't. Yeah. So it's a lot of like the same. Yeah. Like I get it's like I don't know. I just didn't it wasn't it wasn't what we were expecting. Yeah. And I I don't know what I was expecting, but it really wasn't that.
SPEAKER_00It wasn't that.
SPEAKER_01But like when I hear horror, I'm like, I wanna be I wanna be scared, I wanna be shivering. Yeah. I want my bones to be goosied up.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. And maybe that's just because of the maybe miss classified genre of the book. Yeah. Because it says like even on Goodreads, it says horror, fiction, thriller, mystery. I would just say it's kind of more of like a mystery, maybe not even mystery, but like you said, it's kind of just like a dark comedy.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_01Because she has other books, and I'm gonna be honest, they're all roughly like the same rating, but like like between like a three and a four. Like they all have the same ratings. There's only one that's above a four. So and I it's funny because I we were at the bookstore and she there was um another book by her there.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And I was like, oh, maybe I'll wait and read Black Sheep and see how I like her writing. I don't think and like I said, there are books I like that people don't like. That's totally fine. And it's it's all subjective. Writing books is an art form, in my opinion. So, and to me, art is subjective.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01So someone's gonna like the book, otherwise it wouldn't if everyone hated the book, it would have like a one-star. Yeah. Obviously, people like the book. Yeah, it's just not my my style. Her writing's not my style. There's books that I've read where I'm like, oh, this is just not my style. There's books from multiple authors. Uh like for example, Rebecca Searle. I did not like that book by her that we read.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01There's another book of her I absolutely love.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Like it's it's like it's kind of like the story itself versus the writing, also kind of just like versus each book itself. It's kind of like you kind of have to base it off the book itself, maybe rather than the author.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00In some instances.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Unless the author is just trash human.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01So do you have any other comments you want to talk about?
SPEAKER_00Um, not that I can think of. I think we pretty much talked about it.
SPEAKER_01Oh, we didn't really talk about the ending in the epilogue. That she went back to the house.
SPEAKER_00Yes, she went back to the house.
SPEAKER_01And to like steal something from the house. But then which pissed me off because she was like, Oh, I'm never coming back to this shithole. But you went back.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I think it was like some odd years later though, to like at this point, all of her family's kind of dead.
SPEAKER_01Like, she no, they're all dead. Yeah, they're all dead. They're all dead, yeah. They're not kind of dead, they're all dead.
SPEAKER_00I mean her dad's dead too, right? I don't know.
SPEAKER_01He's back in hell. I mean, yeah, everyone got sucked into the pits of hell.
SPEAKER_00Like, in Well, because the other thing we didn't talk about is she has powers too.
unknownOh.
SPEAKER_00Kinda. Yeah. Because like at the I was trying to mention this earlier, like, when the guy was harassing her, they ordered like cheese. And like at the very beginning of the book, this guy, like, I don't know exactly what happens, but she like I have a comment about that. So continue. So he like gets hot cheese on his face and it starts boiling and she gets angry and it the cheese explodes.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. The thing that pissed me off about that is every time she's angry, something bad happens. And for me, as someone who has PTSD and bipolar, I have my anger outburst. But they're not like that.
SPEAKER_00No.
SPEAKER_01I'm not all I'm not violent. I'm not a violent human. So it really pissed me off for her to try to like depict like this person with anger problems because she has trauma as like a violent person. I understand she was like, oh, I don't know what's happening. But like you still are depicting a character who has an anger disorder because of tra past trauma as a violent person, and that really pissed me off because I have trauma. Yeah. I have an anger disorder, but my reaction is to do absolutely nothing. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00And I get people do some people, some people are like that.
SPEAKER_01But it was just like you're already like going for this really negative thing. Like, can you make something like be nothing? Not as negative. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00And like the other thing too is like in the epilogue, like after she kind of learns that she has power, she learns how to kind of control them. And she's like, Oh, I haven't had an incident. Cause like it hurts. Her powers are kind of like, like you said, if she gets mad or she gets angry, she causes something to happen. Someone gets hurt. It's giving It's not like inevit inevitably she didn't like fully consciously want that to happen, but like it still happens. So she's like, she has to kind of stop herself, which I found interesting, where she's like, Oh, I haven't had an incident. But they didn't really touch on her powers besides that.
SPEAKER_01So sorry, we were looking at the time. We're looking at the time. Um but no, yeah. But she went back. But I will say I thought it was a little cool that she could hear them underneath the earth. So it kind of indicated that they aren't dead. They're just in hell. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00But like also, why did you go back? Yeah, co- oh, so that's the other thing too. So she so the um the church was underground in a barn. Yeah, it was in a barn underneath the ground. And she, like, at the end of the book, I don't remember exactly what she was doing to cause this, but she kind of made the building crumble in on itself. How she got out, I have no idea. They don't really explain much.
SPEAKER_01Like I said, yeah. They all kind of get sucked into a black hole. Yeah, if she explains things, um it just wasn't explained well enough for me to like be like, oh, yeah, I totally remember that.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. But that's just not. Yeah, because all of her family got sucked in to the black the black hole, which is hell. Yeah. And um and then it's kind of just like a flat grass area now to where like it's there's like nothing there. Um at the at the end of the epilogue. Um so like yeah, when she goes back, she's like, oh, it's weird to see the barn not there. Um well, because yeah, the I think the minute I realized that she was Satan's daughter was when um she was talking about her pennant. Because they at the age of five, I think they all have to wear like a pentagram pennant.
SPEAKER_01Well, ever and hers had like diamonds in it.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, hers had diamonds. It was it was like so much more fancier than everyone else's. I was like, fuck, Satan's her dad. Like I kind of saw that from a mile away. It was just very, very obvious. Yeah. Okay. Was there anything else that you wanted to talk about? Hold on. Okay.
SPEAKER_01Little questions, but okay. Anything else about the book?
SPEAKER_00I think we kind of went over it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. She's on my shelf.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. I like the cover of the book. The cover's cool. I I like the red one cover. I like the red cover more though.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. I just like a pink horror book. So that's why I was intrigued. I bought the book for the cover and I didn't stay for the story.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, but that's okay.
SPEAKER_01There's gonna be books that we like and kind of like and like a lot, so I'm glad we kind of had the same thing on this because I feel like that would have Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Cause like, like yeah. Anyway, do we wanna announce what we're doing for August?
SPEAKER_01August, we have a fun theme for August.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so we're doing things a little differently.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, we're doing themes each month. So we're gonna have like a theme, we're gonna have a book with a theme, we're gonna have an episode of the theme, and then we're gonna have a different thing going on. But for August, I'm gonna post I'll post the the wheel because I did a wheel thing um of like different books, but for August, we're gonna read Trimroll.
SPEAKER_00Twilight! Twilight! Oh my god, I'm so excited.
SPEAKER_01Michaela's never read Twilight. Never. Have you watched the movies?
SPEAKER_00Yes. Okay, yes, I've watched the movies. Um I'm really interested to see how the movies are gonna. I'm I'm sure they're very different, and I know my my mom loves these books. They're her favorite books ever.
SPEAKER_01I love these books. These books really alter my brain chemistry. Yeah, like these are the books that got you into reading.
SPEAKER_00So I've been since you've reread them.
SPEAKER_01Um I probably read them when I was like last time I read them, I was like 21. Interesting. So it'll be interesting to years ago. But I've read them for the first time when I was in sixth grade. I talked about it before. I had to do it for a book report because the movie was coming out. Yeah. Last year they can do it. And it really just altered my brain chemistry.
SPEAKER_00Oh, I'm so excited. So it's like it's like the original like book talk, like book.
SPEAKER_01It's the book talk, it's the original fandom.
SPEAKER_00It is the book talk.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. But yeah, so our theme's gonna be like our theme for the month's like vampires.
SPEAKER_00I've been in a vampire mood, so I know because I know we had kind of mentioned that we might do Twilight for her birthday, and um Life Got Busy.
SPEAKER_01Life got we had to like Life Got Busy. We're revamping. Ha! Ramp.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so we're I know it's not her birthday month, but we're carrying it over into August. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01So it'll be fun. And I think we're just gonna do that one book first, and then we're gonna do the if another book pops in, another book pops in, but that one you can read with us. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00We will be doing kind of scattered, so they're not all gonna come out after back to back.
SPEAKER_01September's not gonna be new moon, so yeah. You'll have time, you don't have to read all five in month. But I will say, I don't have a copy of it, but eventually I do want to do like an episode on um the novella. That's part of it. So we'll fill that in.
SPEAKER_00That's on Edward's point of view, correct?
SPEAKER_01No. So there's a one called the short second life of Brie Tanner, which is about a it's in the point of view of um Brie Tanner, who's one of the vampires from the army in Eclipse.
SPEAKER_00Oh interesting.
SPEAKER_01Have you read that one? Oh, okay. I've read all of those. Oh, okay. I've even read Life and Death. And that's the That's the the gender bend.
SPEAKER_00Gender Bend, yeah.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_01Midnight Suns, Twilight, and Edward's point of view.
SPEAKER_00I knew there was a I knew there was that one comes in the box set.
SPEAKER_01That one and the Brie Tanner one will typically come in the box set. Okay, gotcha. Gotcha.
SPEAKER_00But okay. Well, that's so that's the theme. That's the book for next month. Very excited. I actually just bought my first copy of it. Oh, you bought it? Yeah, I bought it. I bought it at Bright Light.
unknownYay!
SPEAKER_01Was it paperback?
SPEAKER_00It is a paperback one, yeah. I have hardcover.
SPEAKER_01I've been trying to get my hand on a first edition of the first one in hardcover for so long.
unknownI want to get my grummy little pieces.
SPEAKER_00So if anyone, if anyone knows of a first edition that they can find, send it to us.
SPEAKER_01I'll buy it from you.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Please.
SPEAKER_00Alright, but I think that's gonna pretty much wrap wrap it up. Tell me what you thought about. If you read the book, tell us what you thought about it.
SPEAKER_01Give me your opinions.
SPEAKER_00Um if you haven't read the book, if you thought our kind of talk about it was interesting.
SPEAKER_01Did it make you want to read the book?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, let us know. Or if it made you not want to read the book, let us know too.
SPEAKER_01True. Because I would love for everyone to read the book. I want people to read the book even if I hate the book. Like, why did you hate it? I want you to be able to make your own opinion on the book. And give us other like monthly themes that you want to see and books that you want to see.
SPEAKER_00Or if there's a vampire style game or anything you want us to play. Yeah, give us some. Yeah. I have I have an idea though. Ooh. You need to do your meow. Meow.
SPEAKER_01Oh, here's my swear meow, even though I don't think I swore this episode. I did. Okay, so this is for Michaela's swears. Meow.
SPEAKER_00We'll have to let Isaac know that it's it later.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. He'll find it.
SPEAKER_00He's gonna like edit, be like, I didn't put a meow in here. He's gonna go now, he has to go back and redo all of it.
SPEAKER_01So, but follow us on TikTok. We're gonna do some fun things coming up on TikTok as well. Um, and then just give us your feedback. Yeah. Just be nice about it. Yeah, you can be mean, it's fine. Just don't be rude. Yeah. Be critical. But we'll see you in the next well, you'll he we'll hear you in the next well, you'll hear us in the next episode. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00So I'm very excited. I know me too. Yeah. You don't know what the next episode is, but mew! You're gonna you guys are gonna love it. Yeah, I'm very excited. Some fun stuff plans, so just stay tuned. Stay tuned. Alright, we're gonna go watch a movie. Yes. Bye.