Josh Donaldson and Russ react to the Dodgers "ruining" baseball - GIDL Ep. 13

In this episode of GET IT DONE LEAGUE, Russell Martin and Josh Donaldson react to the MLB's trade deadline which saw Jeff Hoffman, Daulton Varsho and Kevin Gausman moved; they talk the potential of an upcoming lockout, and they give advice for developing young ball players.

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

Fight in the Mexican League. Man, my first thought, my first thought was, This is what could have happened between Donaldson and Machado when they had their little stuffle at third base. This is what could have happened. And then I then I look deeper, like I I didn't realize that the guy, the third baseman in the Mexican league who put on the tag kind of he kind of threw a little elbow at the guy, which in one angle you didn't really see.

SPEAKER_04 0:30

This isn't the trying league.

SPEAKER_03 0:37

Very appreciative.

SPEAKER_04 0:42

You know, this is the get it done league.

SPEAKER_03 0:45

Get it done league. It's early August. It's another episode of the Get It Done League. We thank all of you for making us one of North America's fastest growing baseball podcasts. Please like and subscribe or available on YouTube, Apple, Spotify, wherever you get your shows and podcasts. You already know who's here. There is Russell Martin. That's the MVP Josh Donaldson. I'm your host, Arash Madani. Guys, the trade deadlines in the rear view mirror. Uh, dudes have moved all over. We'll get to Gosman and Chicago and the rest in just a bit. But I want to start with the Dodgers. I want to start with Scooba. I want to start with this absurd narrative going out there that the Los Angeles Dodgers are ruining baseball. Because they care about winning, because they're investing in winning. Uh I have a lot of thoughts on it, but I want to get to you guys first, especially Russ. Let's go to you first. Because you've played there twice. You were there at the beginning of your career, you were there at the end of your career, you see how that place operates. When you hear this conversation of the Dodgers are ruining baseball, what's your reaction to that?

SPEAKER_02 2:02

Well, first of all, I just I don't think it makes any sense. Um you want to get angry at somebody that uh they're they're really good at developing players, they're they're obviously good at you know drafting. Um so they have the pool that's you know available to to other teams to to pick from when they want to make their trades, if if you know, when when that time is. Um I I just I just don't understand it. Um it all it's and at the big league level, the way they prepare for games and and they they they're just they're just doing things right on a lot of levels, and they're just they're spending the money to to build a winning team. And then they're they're willing to do that. So I don't know. It's it's kind of I don't know, it's it's coming from a perspective where like, oh, those the team's too good. It's like we're handing them the World Series before it's even it's even won. Um, you know, I I don't I don't get it.

SPEAKER_04 3:03

I'll say this. I I did hear like an interesting conspiracy theory uh uh the other day talking about how this trade that happened for Scoobyl. It's not I'm not blaming the Dodgers for doing it, but they're kind of saying how the MLB owners are in on it together to say, like, hey, we need a salary cap, we need all these things. Let's go ahead and give the Dodgers the best pitcher in the game so they win three in a row to further our case of like, oh, we have no chance against the almighty Dodgers. And to your point, Russ, yeah, I love the fact that the Dodgers are trying to win and they continue to do what they're doing, and they've been more creative than all the other teams and have been willing to spend more money than all the teams. So my hat's off to them. But the other side of the coin is like, let's play uh the victim here, all 29 other teams, while the mighty Dodgers get their third World Series in the in a row. And oh, we couldn't match this trade offer. From my understanding, the trade offer wasn't even that good. I don't know who the three guys are that are in this uh trade, but you know, none of them are major league caliber players at this moment, to my knowledge. Um, so yeah, I I can see both sides of it. I don't think that the Dodgers are trying to break baseball or ruin baseball. I think they've outsmarted uh most of these teams. Um and I also think that uh the other teams are kind of using the Dodgers as the scapegoat in this.

SPEAKER_03 4:53

Yeah, it's a great point on a couple of fronts. One, Tarek Scoobel's contract for the rest of this season is the same no matter where he went. It's a trade, right? So it's not like you're breaking the bank in free agency. Anybody who wanted him could have gone and gotten him, and then you have him for a couple of months, you have him around your environment, you see how he operates, he sees how you operate, etc. etc. That's one. But I think the other point that Russ made is really important that he said the Dodgers draft and develop so well. You know, I think lost in the big payroll and the Otani contract and what they paid Tucker and the rest is that this is a team from a grassroots level. Like you want to win in any pro sport, you gotta draft well, you gotta develop well. Doesn't matter. Doesn't matter if it's a 53-man roster in football, doesn't matter if it's five starters in basketball. And when you do that and have that prospect pool, that allows you to go do things. So what you do there is so vital. Russ, you were around there, man. What is it? What is their secret sauce on the that you saw on that development front that really stands out?

SPEAKER_02 6:08

Well, it's it's I mean, it's depending on if you're a pitcher or position player, obviously, if if you if you're a hitter, um it was the first team I'd been with where during spring training, you go into a cage and they're connecting, I don't even know what you call them, but like they're connecting all these pods, and then they're looking at your mechanics and what you're doing. So and they're looking at your deficiencies, where you might be losing a little bit of power, where you're losing your balance.

SPEAKER_04 6:37

Um, and then from there well it measures your forces, it messes it mess it measures your it measures your forces that you're using for then like how you synchronize.

SPEAKER_02 6:51

So so before they're they're gonna tell you, hey, we want you to try this drill to to try and you know maximize you know your your your power output or or just the efficiency of your swing, we're gonna put you through these through this machine, or we're gonna you know put these pods on you and we're gonna look at what we have. You take a few swings, then they kind of show you uh what it looks like, you know, on a on a video. And then from there, like, okay, now because we see that you know, this is what you're doing, uh, your back leg is collapsing a little bit as you're you know, as you're loading to go start your swing, we're gonna try and fix that pattern. And this is the drill that you can do, and we're gonna work on that and you know build it into muscle memory. And next, you know, next thing you know, you you've you have a more efficient, better swing. And that's just like one example of what they did they can do with the position player. So that that's that system is gonna make anybody better, right? So are they drafting better or are they developing better? It's it's you know, like when you're drafting guys, I think that you know, at the major league level, there's a lot of like, you know, it's hard to throw a ball harder than 96, you know, like there's not that many guys that throw 100, but there's a lot of guys that have similar abilities, but what you do, how you sharpen, how you sharpen them is by doing things the proper way. And I think that they do things right in on in a lot of ways and how they develop and what they teach. Um, you know, I think you could take a similar talent from another team and he's not developed the same way, you're gonna get more out of the guy who's going through the Dodger system because they're doing things so efficiently and so well. And I don't know, it's like sharpening a knife. Like both knives are made of this steel, one has a better sharpener than the other. Which one's gonna cut better? You know, the one that's been sharpened better. Like, you know, and it's they're they're both made out of the same material. Um, so I don't know. It's it's just it just doesn't make any sense. People have to try and play catch up and doing things the right way, and that's how they're gonna get better. And it and it that and I think it starts definitely, you know, in the minor leagues and how you develop guys. I mean, you take Jordan Alvarez, I think he was in the daughter system. He got plucked away, he was in a trade. You know, who won in that trade? Probably the the team that traded for, you know, it was the Houston Astros. They went and and and plucked him away. So um, you know, who knows? Time will tell down the road when they go and get, you know, these minor league players, what they develop into. And and um, but the trade, like the teams that are that are getting players, and and usually they're they're they're rebuilding, right? They're trading away their their major assets and they're trying to get minor league guys to to to potentially you know build their franchise back up. And that's that's how you build. You build guys when they're cheap. You know, the guys of minor leaguers don't cost a lot, but if you can get a couple of guys that are impactful at the big league level who don't cost you a lot of money, that saves you money to go get somebody in free agency. And and that's kind of that's kind of the way it's always been.

SPEAKER_03 10:10

Yeah, 10 years ago this week, the Dodgers traded a minor league prospect named Jordan Alvarez for a relief right-hander named Josh Fields. Um, wow. JD, you said you came close to signing with the Dodgers. Obviously, the term and the money wasn't, but like when you talked about that, your eyes also kind of lit up a little bit. Like, there's an aura of being a Dodger, there's a want-to that that dude seemed to have to want to play at Chavez Ravine.

SPEAKER_04 10:41

Yeah, I mean, I loved the stadium, uh, for sure. Playing there as a visiting player. I didn't get to play there a whole lot in my career, but the few times I did, I thought it was a great atmosphere. Uh, it's kind of out in the middle of nowhere. But um, you know, I from an outsider looking at the Dodgers, I look at it a couple of different ways. I look at it, um, are they developing? I think that I think it's kind of like the Yankees. The Dodgers and Yankees kind of have the same aura around it. If you're a prospect for one of them, people tend to think that you're better than what you are. And then you get one or two guys hit. I mean, I look at it, I say the Oakland A's are the best ever at developing guys. You know why? Because guys, young guys get opportunities to develop at the major league level.

SPEAKER_00 11:31

Right.

SPEAKER_04 11:31

Like the the difference between triple A baseball and major league baseball is huge, it's not even close. Um, so you have to have that time to be able to develop at the major league level. Uh, you know, I I remember we mentioned Dustin Pedroya, we talked about him not too long ago. If you look at Dustin Pedroya's start to his career, it was terrible. He was a 180 hitter for the first three, four months of the year, five months of the year, and then went absolutely berserk and ended up winning a rookie of the year. But if he was in a Yankees or Dodgers type setting of years past, I'm not saying that it always goes for like in this moment right now, but uh the fan base and teams don't give you that type of a leash to be able to do that. And you look around the league, like how many teams came up through an Oakland A's uh minor league development system, there's a lot more that are in other teams that are on other teams that are ever on the Dodgers. To me, I almost look at it when people get away from the Dodgers, they become worse. So I because I think they caught a little, I think they do such a good job of like making everything about them to where some organizations are gonna do that, and it's kind of you do it on your own, and then it looks to me like they kind of go by the wayside, and you know, that Dodger aura that they were having kind of seems like it's missing, but I think it is what it is. I mean, I think overall in baseball development it's getting slightly better, but I have my own mixed opinions on how it could be tremendously better. How so? And I well, I think I think from it starts from the beginning. I think A, like you have a lot of lower level, or not as many, but you have lower level leagues now to where they're playing pretty much games all the time, and kids that are 16 to let's just call it 19 years old, right? To me, like minor leagues, and especially at that age, it's all about developing. Now, playing games is important, but I don't think they should be playing games every day. Like it should be something to where like they play you know two or three games a week, and the rest of it is really trying to develop, get stronger, get faster, um, learn how to become a professional and in a lot of different ways, except for you know, not playing every day. Because I think that amount of wear and tear that you're putting on early on, especially for young kids that are throwing and pitching, is not necessarily always the best thing because they haven't fully developed yet and they don't even have the strength. These kids are throwing 95 years old, and they don't have the shoulder stability, the shoulder strength, the elbow strength, the the tendons aren't strong enough to be able to with uh stand a lot of these 95 mile an hour pitches that they're throwing. So that's why by the time they get to the big leagues, they get here, they start building up, and then it snaps because they've already put themselves in a compromised position. But another thing that I've always preached to a lot of organizations that I've been in is that I think that you should have like specialty groups inside smaller groups and more coaches in an organization. What do you mean by that? So, like most of the time, just to give you like an idea, you have your position players and your pitchers, and then you have catchers that are kind of their own groups, right? Bless you, bless you, Russ. Sorry, guys. It's okay. Um, and so like you'll have your position players, they kind of they do their own strength program on their own, they have batting practice, infield, outfield practice, all but then you can even split infielders and outfielders into like a subset, right? For the most part. The groups are still big, and you'll have one coach to all of them, right? My theory of if I was GM tomorrow of a team, I'm coming in and I'm hiring way more coaches, and I'm gonna make the groups three to four max. Oh wow, and this is your group that you're gonna be with the entirety of spring training, and so what's gonna what is that's gonna uh have inside of it would be a veteran player. Like let's just say, like, let's say like you have like a Troy Tulowitzki. Let's just say, like, I'm gonna put these names together, right?

SPEAKER_03 16:32

Sure.

SPEAKER_04 16:32

You'll have a Troy Tulowitzki, then in that group, if we was with the Yankees, he would have had like a George Lombard who's now there, that he's in his group, because I want George Lombard to look at what excellence looks like every day. And I want him to be able to see that. And then I'm gonna put like another like guy that's um, you know, maybe like your 25th, 26th man type of roster. Like, there's gonna be 10 or 15 of those guys in in your camp. That could be like the 26th possible, and then I'm gonna put some 17, 18-year-old kid in that group that we think is a guy. And so now every single day you're gonna go through the games, and whether this kid got in, whether Troy Tulowitzki was in the game, whether George Lombard was in the game, we're gonna go over every single one of his plays every day, and I would make it more specialized. This is a base running day. We're gonna go look at video, we're gonna see how that's played out. Let's go over certain situations. Teams don't go over situations in spring training anymore. It's just like, hey, go run the bases and um you know, go get a couple reads. No, we're gonna go over as a group and we're gonna do these together, and we're gonna make sure that we're doing it at not say full game speed, but we're gonna do it with some intent. Then you got defense, and then now George Lombard's gonna be able to talk to Troy Tulowitzki, and this young kid's gonna be able to talk to Tula, the coach is gonna be able to go there. You know, it's gonna be so individualized. BP. We're gonna be able to break that down so you can have small groups and get way more accomplished by paying attention to detail and having guys that are around and um that can really influence your in type of organization that you have. And the more coaches you have, the more work that the guys are able to get done in a specific day.

SPEAKER_02 18:37

Yeah, a little bit of development thought. Go ahead, Russ. It's just it's the it's the little things that'll help you differentiate yourself. You take two teams at same same talent level, but one of the teams has a little more attention to detail when it comes to base running. It could be like dirt ball reads, um, a little bit more aggressive, getting first to third with less than two outs, you know, just all those little things. Or, you know, an extra run here, you know, uh it's those those are are are what makes teams championship caliber team, playoff type teams.

SPEAKER_04 19:14

And that's where you get the word baseball IQ from, like to learn that. Like uh, you know, a 17, 18-year-old kid might not have ever heard what a dirt ball read is supposed to look like.

SPEAKER_03 19:25

Yeah, you know what I'm saying? True. So, Russ, a lot of parents, a lot of people, a lot of coaches probably come up to you and say, what kind of advice would you give for somebody who wants to become a catcher, wants to become a pro catcher, a college catcher? Just get better as a catcher. Using using Josh's kind of 16 to 19 age range, if you're coming up, what what were some of the key things that you learned? What were some of the things you wish you'd known that you think could really help in the development of a prospect, of a soon-to-be prospect, of a draft eligible prospect, to really take that next step in their development and their career? Well, there's a there's a lot of ways to learn.

SPEAKER_02 20:08

Uh the first thing I would say is pay look at the guys on TV, the best guys who are doing it at the moment, the best receivers, the the best guys that are uh, you know, uh catch and catch and throw guys, and look at what they're doing and and study them. Right? Like so visually, most most guys are gonna learn visually. Um, so if you like, if you like a certain hitter, right, just pay attention to his at-bats, you know, focus in on a guy who who has you know a similar body type or looks like he's the like same type type of athlete, and and look at how you know that guy's doing it. And just for me, for example, like watching a guy like Yachty Molina, I was in the big leagues and I'm still learning from a guy like him. And I'm trying, I'm picking something from from his arsenal. I'm like, okay, I like the way he does that on this certain pitch, the way he catches it. And then I'd look at another guy, I'm like, oh, this guy's good at catching the high ball. Like, what is he doing? So I'm I'm just kind of picking what I like from each guy and incorporating it into into what I like to do. Um, so I I I would that's the one thing I would say is I don't have one magic word for for, you know, I can't I can't just like say this is what works for everybody. You gotta you gotta do what works for you, right? Everybody's got different body type.

SPEAKER_03 21:31

Um and then But what I do think what you're saying, Russ, is the main takeaway is the learning never stops.

SPEAKER_02 21:39

The learning never stops. We're always working. And probably the best, my best learning experience, it was John Debas. I was in instructional league, and we would sit behind the catcher and a hitter, and they'd have they'd put one of those nets you put behind or in front of second base during batting practice, and we'd sit there and we were talking about game calling. And that for me, it wasn't even, it wasn't a physical thing. We just sit there and and it was pitch by pitch, like what would you throw here? How would you start this guy? You know, and and there wasn't a right or a wrong answer. What he told me is like, when you call a pitch, you just need to have a reason for it. And then we can we can discuss the reasoning behind it. But there isn't there, there, there rarely is like a right or a wrong. It's subjective, right? What's your purpose behind it? Why are you doing this? As long as you have a reason, then it's it makes sense. As long as you know your reasoning isn't a stupid thing, you know.

SPEAKER_04 22:37

It's it's only wrong whenever it's a three-two slider to get set out and your team loses the world series. I know Rash would love that. Yeah, I knew he was gonna get a kick out of that.

SPEAKER_02 22:49

But you totally, but even in that real peace. Even in that situation, even in that situation, the catcher's probably thinking, throw me your best slider. And maybe, maybe at that time, Hoffman's thinking, I gotta throw a strike here because I don't want to walk him. But the catcher in his mind, he's like, This is like, this is your best slider right here. Or maybe in that situation, what he needed is a catcher to to kind of like pound his glove and like, you know, like give me your best one. And that kind of okay, the the pitcher's like, okay, I'm locked I'm locking in right here. This is gonna be my my strikeout slider, instead of just you know, throwing that. You know, but maybe maybe the intent was to throw a nasty one and you kind of just spun it, then you know, like the history of the case.

SPEAKER_04 23:32

It's just high the whole the whole thing is hindsight's 2020. It's very easy for second-guess anything, whenever something negative happens. And I'm glad Russ stuck to his guns there because it's an important lesson for kids. It's like don't get so attached to the success or failure to whatever it happens, especially when you're young and you're developing. You need to have reasoning for whatever it is that you're doing. There's no there's no right or wrong what he's trying to say. When you're young, it's all about learning. You need to learn and you need to push yourself, and you need to push yourself to fail. That's the most important part. Push yourself and see where it is, because the Russell attests to this too. We learn the most from ourselves and from our careers and from other people. Whenever stuff doesn't always go our way. Whenever you lose, you know, I love Connor McGregor's quote that he had back in the day. He goes, I don't lose, I learn. You know, that's what it is. Like, and that's what professionals, the guys that are at the best, it's not that we don't take it to heart. We definitely take the losses to heart, um, some more than others. But for me, it's like whenever you can take that lesson that's being taught to you in that moment of losing, like that's when you can take the next step. Whenever you allow losing or that result to hinder you, that's when the failure starts to compound, right?

SPEAKER_03 25:08

It's the get it done league, Josh Donaldson, Russell Martin. I'm your host, Arash Madani. Please like, subscribe. Thanks again to all of you for making us one of baseball's fastest growing podcasts. All right, JD, open the door. Uh Jeff Hoffman is a Minnesota twin. Yeah. And rightly or wrongly, fairly or unfairly, in Buffalo and across football, nobody remembers Scott Norwood for the terrific career he had. They remember him for the missed field goal in the Super Bowl. In Philadelphia, they don't remember. I don't remember him at all. Philadelphia, they don't remember Mitch Williams for being an outstanding closer. They remember him for one pitch. You know, University of Michigan, C. Webb for the timeout, Nick Anderson, Orlando for missing the free throws. And as solid as Jeff Hoffman was, he likely will be remembered for that one pitch, rightly or wrongly, fairly or unfairly. What how how do you guys, as as dudes who've been in the arena, who've suited up, how how do you guys process what Jeff Hoffman as a blue jay was?

SPEAKER_02 26:31

Go ahead, Russ. That's a good question. Uh I mean, it's history, history was made, right? Like for the Blue Jays, it's it's it's gonna be kind of that that nightmare scenario. Like the guy who gave up the home run and then we ended up losing the World Series. So I think it was, I mean, it's better for the Jays, it's better for him to go to another city, put on a new uniform, right? Like every time you're going to the stadium, it's you you you remember, you know, it's it's never gonna be forgotten. It's just one of those moments, right? So I think it's it's a trade that had to happen. He's gonna be better. Like the people in Minnesota don't care about what happened in Toronto, right? So he he gets to kind of he gets a new slate, gets to start fresh again. And um yeah, so it's it's just for me, it's something that had to happen. And you know, good for him, good for the Jays to you know, to find him a new home and and and he gets to start fresh, because you he's as long as he had that blue jays uniform on, he he's he was never gonna forget what happened. And he'll probably never forget, but at least you know in Minnesota, they're not gonna, you know, they're not gonna talk about that, which is great for him.

SPEAKER_03 27:54

Josh?

SPEAKER_04 27:56

Yeah, I mean, a couple things. I mean, I think it would have taken a real special individual to kind of come back and push through that. I mean, to make it work out. I felt like he was kind of fine starting to find a little home in the seventh inning where that pressure probably wasn't as much. Um, yeah, he's gonna get to go to Minnesota, um where it's Minnesota nice, right? Like it's like like that's the phrase. Like people in Minnesota, I don't even think they care about baseball that much. Um, you know, playing there for two years, it wasn't, you know. I thought it was uh mediocre at best, right? And that can be good. Like I that could be good for him. Like when I I know Derek Shelton, he's the manager and stuff there, and which I'm sure he's changed it up in the clubhouse some or whatnot, but when I was in Minnesota, it just didn't seem like they had a culture to win or care to win. Um so everything was analytics, this everything was analytics that, and there was no reasoning. I was like, hey, show me some reasoning. Sorry, I'm going on a rant right now about Minnesota. Um, but yeah, I think Hoffman, I think his career, like he's gonna be known as obviously giving up the homer. The only way for that to be like take it away is if they would have won if he had that opportunity to get in and won and pitched in that situation again and got the win. But the chances of that happening are so slim, even before the season starts. Like, so yeah, it's tough. Like now he still has a career left, like he can still go have good moments that people can remember, and he needs to go and have another big, if not bigger, moment than that. I don't know if there is, but yeah, it's that's that's the life of a reliever, though. Like, you know what I mean? Like, that's what made Mariano so special. It's like he was able to lock that door so many times and uh pitch multiple innings, and but there's also the Mitch Williams. There's for every one of Mariano, there's a hundred offense, yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_03 30:20

Right. Um, so it's interesting what the Jays are doing. Obviously, Gosman's in Chicago, but then they make the trade with the ancient. Did you hear what he said? I did.

SPEAKER_04 30:31

I thought that was I thought that was what'd he say? I didn't hear it. I kind of, you know, I I have no Gosman. I don't think he minted out of any like it was not shade in a bat. That's not I don't think it was, I don't think he was being shade, but I was like, whoa, I was kind of thrown off by that because he was like having this love fest with Toronto right before he was leaving, and then the first time a mic gets put in front of him in Chicago, he's like, Oh, it's only about baseball here. I'm like, what? Yeah, it w what are you saying? Like, was it not about baseball in Toronto? Like, you guys just won the World Series. What do you thought? What'd you think about that?

SPEAKER_03 31:16

Yeah, I I didn't, you know, we talked about Wrigley having the grass, etc. My only thought, because my only thought was that Gosman was trying to say it's only about baseball here is we're not talking about trades, we're not talking about dismantling the team, we're not talking about whatever. It's about okay, we got two months left till October, let's go for it. That's the only thing I can think of because that had been so out of character based on everything he had talked about, yeah. Exactly. Even saying, I can't wait to get back in Toronto. This is not goodbye. Um you know, Wrigley's special, Wrigley's historic, etc. etc. But it just the way you the way he said it and the way it came off was just yeah, it caught me by surprise too. Yeah. Yeah, Russ, you should go check it out.

SPEAKER_04 32:09

Check it out.

SPEAKER_03 32:10

Where where I was going with this is sorry, can you continue? No, it's all good. Can you continue to like not rebuild, retool on the fly, move some pieces around, like the blue jays are doing here? Like, obviously, there's 40,000 plus in the stadium every night. You guys remember what it was like when it was rocking. You remember what it was like when the team wasn't winning and how quickly things changed. I just wonder, look, the lockout's looming. We'll get to that next. I just wonder what the blue jays are trying to do and how how and if this thing can work.

SPEAKER_04 32:46

I think they're actually better right now. You do, huh? I think from the trades they got better. And I think like where they were at and what they've shown thus far. And look, I was in a I was in Canada for a month, the last month, and obviously a lot of people want to uh come up to me and ask me what's what do I what are my takes? And I just said I didn't think the team was very good. I didn't think their team was very good. Like whether it was from injuries, whether it was from guys not performing the way that they should, I think this is gonna give them a shake up. Like, this is the the only thing that's closer than what just happened right now is firing the manager, right? Because once the manager gets fired, like everybody's like, oh shit, like we better start playing, right? Like it kind of wakes them up a little bit. This right here is they shook up some guys, shipped them out, and it kind of made sense for them to do that, but at the same time, like I gotta give credit to Ross and and Mark that you know, this Soriano guy that they just got from Anaheim. You put, you know, one of the things that I do think Toronto does a pretty good job at is play defense.

SPEAKER_00 34:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 34:03

Like you put that defense, but behind him, who's a ground ball pitcher. Like, I think that they got he reminds me of like Aaron Sanchez of like when Aaron Sanchez was first coming up, like that bowling ball sinker power stuff. And you know, Sanchez won 20 games almost 20 games for us one year. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 34:23

I mean, top three in the Cy Young that year.

SPEAKER_04 34:26

You you get rid of Varsho, who has been kind of fringy at best. I think I've seen some stuff about uh defensive numbers sliding, and you know, Miles Straw is like a defensive center fielder, like let him go do his thing. He can be your little guy that can bunt and move a couple guys over. He kind of fits into the scheme a little bit of what they need to do as an offense. Um but ultimately uh from an offensive standpoint, I just think that they're pretty that they're they're pretty stale. And they the one thing that Ross, and even when I was there, what Ross and Mark told me is like we kind of know how to do the pitching side of it, the hitting side's tough. And it looked to me like they went and doubled down on what their strength is gonna be in the future as the starting pitching, like they went and got some arms because you can't ever have enough what in the big league, you can't ever have enough arms, and that's what he went and did, and I think it made it better for him.

SPEAKER_03 35:27

Yeah, yeah, because look, what they've what they've shown to do with pitching is go get it and go pay for it. You know, they paid Gosman, they paid Cease, they traded for Barrios and paid him. You know, Cody Ponce will see what ends up happening with him. This is this is kind of their philosophy. Now let's see what Soriano becomes. And now I now you just wonder as you kind of look ahead, everybody is saying there's not going to be baseball starting on time next year. There may not even be baseball next year. That has become the narrative. We kind of started with that conspiracy theory that Josh talked about that the owners are saying we don't want to pay, we don't want to win, we want to show the Dodgers to be the bad guys and that nobody can kind of compete with them. Russ, you've seen a lot of this over the years. What where is where is this thing headed?

SPEAKER_02 36:20

I it's that's they're gonna try and put the blame on the players for not wanting a salary cap. That's the story that's gonna be told. And it's it's just that's just not the like the it's everything's still working. It's not something that's necessary, and that's and that's the ultimatum right now, the or the feeling that I get. It's they want a salary cap. And I would just kind of I would flip it. I'd be like, okay, if there's a salary cap, then there should be a sal there should be a cap on the profit that the owners can make. You cap the profit they can make, and that goes into a pool, and that gets distributed around amongst the players. Like it just the they would never accept that either. Right.

SPEAKER_04 37:07

So what they're gonna do is open their books or just open their books to where everybody can look at every dollar they're making. Because guess what? Sure, when Russ, when Russ Martin signs a five-year deal with the Blue Jays, everybody knows exactly how much he's making. So it's like Russ is the bad guy in the end. He's making 70, because nobody wants to hear, you know, normal people don't want to hear about millionaires bitching about billionaires, or vice versa. They don't give a crap about that, right? But at the end of the day, like from the sport that we've played, this is reality of like what he's saying.

SPEAKER_02 37:48

Yeah, it's just you know, and and what happens in the lockout, it's the impact. Like, you know, all the young players, the the the league is kind of young. And I don't know if it's by design or it's just there's there's more young players that are good. But what happens is, you know, how long will they wait out before the young guys feel like they're losing they're losing a year here? And and for me, the the biggest mistake and what could completely ruin the game is if there's a lockout and it ends up being for more than a year. And I think the owners think that if we are willing to wait more more than a year, well, but that with that mindset is you're you're you're completely ruining the game, right? Yeah, and who's that fault? And that's and that's and the paint, the the picture that's going to be painted is oh, well, it's because the players don't want a salary cap. But it's that's I think that's the fight that they're willing. Like you have as a player, you have to be willing to to hold your ground and being like it's we're not accepting it. We're not accepting it.

SPEAKER_04 38:58

You know, I think I think I think with it too, Rosa. Sorry to the as the owners are looking at it, the MLB union hasn't been weaker right now than ever before, ever probably since Wiener first, like when he passed away, it was pretty vulnerable at that time, but we weren't going straight into a lockout to losing Tony Clark to whatever the scandal was, and then now that's all kind of happening in the same year of this going on. This is really gonna put a lot of onus of what Russ was saying of they need to show solidarity. I think at the end of the day, to try to not make it too lengthy, both sides are making hand over fist right now. Contracts are bigger than it's ever been, the owners are making more money than it's ever been. They would be it would be idiotic for either side not to keep playing because of the amount of money that's being turned over.

SPEAKER_03 40:04

Um but you know the idiocy, we saw it five years ago when no league was playing during COVID, these guys were nickel and diming, the owners were nickel and diming with the players over like nothing. Then you come out of you could have had you'd have been the only pro league going with no competition. Then there's another work stoppage the following year, and honestly, guys, I don't know the last time that baseball has had so much momentum. A couple of years ago, Dodgers Yankees World Series, then comes the Jays Dodgers World Series. Baseball's hot again. The WBC just had everybody going, but it feels like the owners right now are so hell-bent on just putting the screws at every level on the players, they're willing to do that at the expense of this kind of momentum ride that the game is on right now.

SPEAKER_04 41:03

Yeah, I mean, look, I've not I've never been in the room with the these guys, so I don't know what they're what they're thinking. Uh, I mean, obviously it comes down to money, right? Right. Uh they've already they've already cut two, you know, the the minor league players. Uh when they I don't know if they do they have a union, official union now, I'm not sure. But they started giving them guidelines of what was acceptable and not acceptable. They went and cut two levels of minor league baseball. Um, so yeah, they're the draft, they've shortened the draft. At the end of the day, this is all about money for these guys.

SPEAKER_02 41:44

Just to touch on what you just said, they're cutting teams. So every organization has two less teams in every organization. That means there's cities in the United States that no longer have baseball. So the communities are completely changed. And to me, how how how are you winning? Like if you're just looking at baseball as a whole and you're taking away, you know, two communities per organization, a lot of cities just where the families used to bring their kids to go watch minor league baseball, gone. Like, how how are you winning right there? The connection to the game disappears. Just I I just I don't know. I and you're you're saving a few bucks, but you might be, you know, maybe those kids are going to watch soccer now. You know, they're gonna go watch a different sport.

SPEAKER_04 42:36

And they talk about like we want we need to make the game grow. It's this, it's you know, the game's not growing. Well, guess what, guys? Baseball just passed basketball this year, as far as the most popular sport right behind football in the United States. And like you're saying, the owners have a habit of stepping on their own toe whenever baseball gets momentum. I don't think that um, in my personal opinion, every year that I've been into these lockouts, there's always the threat of a oh, there we're gonna lock out, we're gonna lock out. Even the last time when they did lock us out for whatever it was, like it was like two weeks of spring training, right, until that happened. Um I just don't see it happening. But at the same time, and this is why I don't see it happening, is even what Russ was saying, if they go for a year, right? The MLB union has money that they've been putting away for six years now that can sustain these guys for a full year to where they won't ever have to jump back across and become a scab, you know? And there's all these protection policies that they have and And I just don't think hey, if the game of baseball doesn't play for a year, I don't think it is the same after that. Personally, I don't I don't think I don't I think all these contracts that they're I think they lose the TV sponsorships because TV is the biggest thing that pays these teams. And to give you a little education in 2019, so that's seven years ago now, right? Wow, that's crazy. Uh 2019, there were only two teams in the major leagues that were evaluated to be less than a billion dollars, and that was the Rays, and that was uh Oakland. Now, all every since then, now all the teams are billion dollar teams, and they the more the Dodgers keep getting valued and teams keep getting sold, it brings up all of these other slacker teams that don't want to upgrade stadium, blah blah blah. Like just for being a part of this MLB is making them money.

SPEAKER_03 45:09

Yeah, the Dodgers ownership, Mark Walter and company just bought the Lakers for $10 billion. I mean, that's what we're talking about here.

SPEAKER_04 45:16

Yeah, I mean, just $10 billion. I mean, uh, who's got you got $10 billion lane round?

SPEAKER_03 45:19

Yeah, that's it. Uh, we gotta run, but before we do, real quick, producer Stu threw the fight in the Mexican league at us in our group chat. That was a good one. Like, uh boys, over to you. Wow. Because that was I I watched it and I'm like, suddenly my head kind of snapped forward looking at that.

SPEAKER_02 45:40

Man, my first thought, my first thought was this is what could have happened between Donaldson and Machado when they had their little scuffle at their base. This is what could have happened. And then I then I looked deeper, like I I didn't realize that the guy, the third baseman in the Mexican league who put on the tag, kind of he kind of threw a little elbow at the guy, which in one angle you didn't really see because it looked kind of weird. I'm like, why is this guy like why is the base runner attacking the third baseman after a simple tag? But then I saw another angle, and the third baseman kind of like shoved and almost threw a little elbow, and I was like, oh, okay. Now I get it.

SPEAKER_04 46:22

That was quick, though. It was like a to me, it almost looked like it was like playing, like he like he got tagged and it was instantaneous. Wham with an overhand right to the joint. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But he went down. I was like, damn. Quick. Like that looked quick. It looked like some it looked like some Tim Anderson Jose Ramirez fight right there. And then he got caught.

SPEAKER_01 46:45

They both went down. He got sucker punched after. Oh, yeah. He went, yeah, yeah, yeah. He paid the price.

SPEAKER_03 46:50

He did for sure. He did. So uh, if there's a lockout, now I know what we're doing on the show.

SPEAKER_04 46:56

We're getting Manny Machado on the program because then we're really gonna go back in time and I gotta give you one story though of a brawl that nobody knows ever happened. All right. I'll make this quick. This is before the phones and everything were popular. This this is my very first year of Pro Bowl. I was in Low A Peoria freezing my balls off. And apparently Ryan Sandberg was my manager. Rest in peace, Rhino. Yeah, um, but there was some type of animosity between Sandberg and the other team's manager. I think it was for the Rangers. And I was catching literally, it's like it's 30 degrees out, and I'm like, nobody wants to be on the field. It's like sleeting at times, you know. Anyway, I catch strike three, out was over, and I guess it stemmed from the year before the team was up by seven runs and they were still stealing bases and stuff like that. And in this game, they try to do like some, I don't know, it was like they were doing something that Ryan didn't like. I catch strike three, I'm running off the field. Sandberg comes running behind me. And this at this time in minor league baseball, the managers are on the third base coach. Okay, so Sandberg's running behind me. He goes straight after the coach. Freaking Kyle Farms were spear tackle on the ground. The bullpits are in the in the outfield there. Some Latin guys, and Latin guys do not fight fair when it comes to brawl. They will go spikes, they will go, they throw gloves at you. Like, I mean, you saw Johnny Quato when he got pinned up in the thing, he was trying to cleat people in the face. You know, they don't fight fair. This isn't there's no rules. There's no rules. And this guy, like, who probably threw a hundred in the bull pit, he freaking crow hops hit Sandberg in the chest with like a crow hop throw with his glove, and then it's just a Donny Brook fight, fight, fight everywhere. But I'm just sitting there thinking after the fight, I'm like, Ryan Sandberg is a Hall of Famer.

SPEAKER_03 49:20

Yeah, he sure is.

SPEAKER_04 49:22

If we're in Loway in the Midwest League, and he's tackling a coach on the field, and some Latin guy who probably doesn't even know that Sandberg's a Hall of Famer, just chunked his glove and spiked it right into his chest from like three feet away, and then tried to fly and kick him at the same time. I'm like, what are we doing? This is insane. I'm like, I wish this was off video because if it was, it'd be special.

SPEAKER_03 49:54

Maybe that's one of the franchises that doesn't exist anymore.

unknown 49:58

Right?

SPEAKER_03 50:00

Oh man, that's crazy. Great story. Great story, great story. Sorry. On that note, rest in peace, Ryan Sandberg. Fellas, thanks so much. Another episode of Get It Done League for the MVP Josh Donaldson and Russell Martin. I'm your host, Arash Madani. Please like, subscribe, and follow. We'll see you next time.

SPEAKER_00 50:21

Get it done, League.