Reading Between the Years
This is a space for the conversations that don’t fit neatly into headlines, talking points, or inspirational slogans about aging.
We’re two friends in our sixties, living this season in real time — the physical changes, the relational shifts, the unexpected griefs, and the freedoms no one prepared us for. We’re not here to offer advice or tidy conclusions. We’re here to talk about how it actually feels.
Each episode, we read between the years — the years behind us and the ones still unfolding — and name the emotions that often go unspoken. The doubts, the humor, the tenderness, the anger, the gratitude. All of it belongs.
If you’re tired of the rhetoric and ready for the real story, you’re in the right place.
Pull up a chair. This is Reading Between the Years.
Reading Between the Years
Chapter 9: Because I said so is a complete sentence!
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(Is it truly humor...?)
Hey guys. Hello, hello. Welcome back. And Dana.
SPEAKER_00Welcome back to our little chat, uh, reading between the years, continuing our conversations of aging in this crazy climate that we're in and what that means to our relationships, our bodies, our minds, all of the above. So today I thought we'd tackle, and Judy and I talked about tackling the positive sides of aging, whether it's with families or relational or societal or you know, our place in all of the above. So I thought we'd have that conversation today. So yeah. Yeah. And it's Friday. And it's Sunday until later this afternoon. Um, so because there are. I feel like there are many positives with becoming older. And I I was thinking about this today. Um, that while oftentimes it are, it it are, it is the negative that we go through in life or things that would be considered negative for some people, um, that brings about these positive, you know, the sense of wisdom, the sense of contentment that you get as you age. If you're lucky, I feel like if you're lucky enough to have the wherewithal and the ability to learn and change and evolve. Um so there is negative kind of wrapped into this, but I think the positive that comes out the other side is amazing. Absolutely amazing.
SPEAKER_01I agree. I agree.
SPEAKER_00I think things that I've I've found with myself are um, I'm able to walk away from conversations, especially we have these daily huddles at in the ER with all the nurses, kind of what's going on today? What do we need to know? And the nurses, you know, 20s and 30s are still like, well, I did this and I planted my garden last night, and I did this, and we did this. And I used to feel the need to engage in that. Yeah. And and now, and I'm not gonna say it's that I just I don't care. It's just that my sense of self is not so intertwined with these conversations and where I feel like I fit in these conversations anymore. And it's so wonderful. It's like I can stand in this conversation talking about, oh, we have 20 chickens. Well, we have 50 chickens and the and all the things that are trendy right now. It's so nice to be able to say, all right, have a nice day, because I know what I do and I know what I'm doing for my garden and my life at home. And it doesn't be a part of that conversation isn't necessary. It used to be so necessary, right? You used to feel like you had to be a part, and you know, the people that we all know that have to be the ones to share the news because that gives them more value or whatever. It's so nice to be able to just say, okay, that's great, good for you, and walk away. That's so important to me.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it is walking away is so important, whether it's positive or negative. But like what you said just brings up a huge metaphor. Um, you know, people with their gardens and what they planted, because the people who are engaging in those particular conversations are still molding their garden, they're still planting their garden, um, meaning their life, because they're sitting back thinking, well, maybe I shouldn't get 10 chickens. I should only get five because Nancy has five. Yeah, 10. And maybe I should do this, maybe I should do that. Because as a young woman or as a young um, you know, man or woman, you're you're still reaching out and discovering things. By the time that we're our age, we've discovered those things and we want to walk away from the stuff because we know what works for us and what doesn't work for us.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01It's the difference between a a garden that's only two years old and a massive yard that has mature trees because we know they've been there for a while. We know that this is gonna come up and it's gonna act the, you know, this hydrangea is gonna come up and it's gonna act the same way it does. And you could say that's a child, or um, you know, my flowers are gonna do this. Yeah, am I gonna plant new stuff every year? Yeah, I am, but I know what works for me and what doesn't. Yeah, and these kinds of conversations, I don't need that anymore. Did did we? Like you said, yeah, of course, because we were one of them. Yeah. And I'm not dissing them at all. It's just a learning process. It's all a learning and especially a discovery process of what works for you, what doesn't. I have to get ideas from so and so, and or even, oh, why did I do that? I should have known better. Thanks for pointing that out, kind of thing. You know, it's positive and negatives, and we're not talking about life-threatening things, we're just talking about lifestyles, you know, growing as an adult, like said.
SPEAKER_00So I mean, and I think those conversations are so important when you're when you're in the finding out phases of your life because it's how you build, you have your instinct, you check with somebody that's already doing it. It helps you trust, helps you build that relationship, do things that are correct, but also trust your instincts. It helps you build your sense of self because it's like, well, I was thinking about doing this, and the other person says, Oh, I did that two years ago and it didn't work out. What we ended up doing was this. It's such an important part of growing and becoming and expanding and trying new things, but it's so nice to not have to, like I said, my world used to be totally wrapped in those conversations and feeling like they heard me and they saw me and and I was a part of the conversation and I was good enough to be in the conversation. It's like I it's we go for walks every day at lunch, and they're it usually they're all younger than me, which isn't shocking, um, because I should be retired by now. Um, but there's one person that we walk with who just isn't really interested in what I have to say, who just isn't really, you know, they're all young kids or kids that are at least in middle school. And it probably didn't help that when she was fighting to get her son's autistic diagnosis, I was kind of like, you know, our previous conversations of what does difference does a diagnosis make? And now I understand that it opens up services, so it does make a difference for some people. But I feel like she just doesn't care or doesn't, you know, I could talk and I could walk in silence and it wouldn't be any different than what she already interprets from my interaction, which is fine, because that's and that's the beauty of it. It's fine. I don't care. I'm not gonna worry. And because it used to be then I would work my way around to her side of the office just to say, hey, how you doing, to get some positive feedback to make sure that I hadn't done anything. Did I do something? Is this something that I did I say something wrong? Did I did I look at her? Did she say something to me and I didn't respond? Is this a reaction to something that I did? It has to be a reaction to something I did, and now it's kind of like you're wrong. Yeah, whatever. It doesn't matter. It's so nice. And I do it is important to me to be able to, like I said, to say it's not that I don't care. It's just like I I don't have time for this, blah, blah, blah. It's just it's I don't need it anymore. And it's so wonderful.
SPEAKER_01It's such a um oh, what's the word I'm looking for? It it's such a um release, it's such a it just it's relaxing to think, yeah, did I actually do that? Did I act that way when I was 30 or 25 or 28 and why? Yeah. You look back at it. I mean, truly hindsight's 2020. Yeah, that kind of stuff, but we just don't need it because we're comfortable in our own skin, finally. Um, I mean, it doesn't mean that there's other things going on in our lives or our kids' lives or our family's lives that we have to deal with, but we deal with those kinds of things so differently now.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Like, like you said, you're more confident and you're gonna walk away from something that is not related to you. It just doesn't relate anymore. We don't relate to it. I've seen a lot of social media lately about I'm in the phase of my life. Sorry, I do that too much, you guys. Um, I'm in the phase of my life that the the one that I saw that really struck me was when I see something that I want to try, or when I see something that I want to buy or purchase, I just I say to myself, now I'm gonna do it myself. You know, because I have the knowledge and I have the skills. And sometimes I have a little extra money to spend on it. So I'm not gonna go buy that, I'm just gonna make it myself. You know, why should I make it my why shouldn't I make it myself? I can do that now, you know. And when your kids are younger, you don't have time for that kind of stuff. You just don't have time. I find myself lately not having any time whatsoever because there's a lot of stuff on my plate. But that brings in what we were just talking about. At least my plate is more organized now than it used to be, and I can prioritize my plate instead of feeling completely overwhelmed, like you've got a set of triplets sitting on the living room floor and they all need changing at the same time.
SPEAKER_00No, absolutely. Absolutely. It's so wonderful to be able to have that freedom once again, if you're lucky enough to have it, to be able to design your fill your plate with what you want to fill it with. Because I know I'm so sick and tired. I'm still in a in an industry where you still have to be tested, you still have to get certifications. You still I am so tired of having to prove my worthiness to this thing that is quickly dissipating in importance in my life. My job is quickly changing in its importance in my life. It used to be, yeah, I can go to get as many certifications as possible. Now it's kind of like, why do I have to keep proving to you? I mean, I can do ACLS with my eyes closed, let's be honest. It's uh cardiac life support. I can do it, you know, it's the same rhythms, it's the same, everybody lives, it's it's pretty easy. It's an open book test. Everybody passes ACLS, every it used to be scary. Remember when it used to be scary? And they would they would flunk you, they wouldn't hesitate to. And um, yeah, you get to this point where it's like, no, I don't need a test to prove my worthiness. And I used to be one of those that did. I would go and try new things, and heck, I did um what's the military trauma TNs? No, what was the one? It's one where it's like an EMS uh design, it's something, but it's like I was sitting there in uh T E C C emergency, anyway. Um like 45 years old with all these young bucks, and we had to carry people and move people, and I'm kind of like, okay, here we go. But it was like I was still in this urge and this need to say that I did this. I need to be able to say that I did this. And it's like, no, I'm good. I'm really behind your name. Yeah, it's like I don't I am hypothetically the initials behind your name. And now we carry our name is our credentials now, you know. It's like and our age is our credentials. It's so funny when I think back on how I used to treat old people, you know. As you age, of course, that changes. I had a horrible instance with my grandmother where I where I made fun of her because she said she was on the have I sold this story? My grandmother was on in a swim team at her school. So this would have been she went to high school in the 20s. Um, she was on a swim team in her school, and I was a swimmer all the way high school through college, right? And I was with her at my at her house. My cousin Kara came from Atlanta and I came from wherever we were living, and we stayed with her for a week and we went to the swim to a pool because that's what kids like to do. And I was a swimmer, and she said something, hey, you know, I was in a swim team when I was your age, and I go, I said something smart, like, well, how many hundreds of years ago was that, or how long ago was that? And I thought, and I still obviously carry the guilt of this because now I understand the need and what we do to try to connect with our grandchildren and and have that sense of importance, not only as a grandparent, but also, yeah, I lived a life before I was your grandmother. And I think that's one thing that's very aware to me now. It's like if you see an old couple, we have this couple that walk, I'm just gonna ramble, shall I? Um we have this couple that one time I saw him pushing her in a wheelchair, and then a couple months later I saw um her pushing him in the wheelchair, and it was just like, yeah, that's what we do. We've been together for 60 years. This is what we do. And it's just the glory of these people that have managed to live to this long and what they've been through, and and honoring the fact that these were kids at one point in time, they had all their struggles, they had everything, you know. It just always amazes me that um you don't know that when you're little. Yeah, you don't know that when you're older, and that there should be, you know, I almost remember saying, well, because I was a cocky 20-year-old, and people would look down to me because I was young. It's like, yeah, but you need to look up to older people because they've lived. They have this sense of contentment, like you and I were talking about. They have this sense of wisdom from all that they've been through. You know, we learned you learn so much. You learn so much as you get older, and and it's it it just enriches your life so much. It enriches it.
SPEAKER_01It's it's funny that you mentioned that because I I would have the same experience, you know, as a as a younger like EMT that the way we treat elderly people, you know, they're they're um it's not a focused type of treatment. It's more we lump them all in the same. We don't consider anything except the age they are today and moving on. Like what am I why do I care about you because you're not gonna be here for another 10 or 15 years, or you might or or I might be the last person you see, or you know, you're in hospice and it doesn't matter, excuse me, the connection. Yeah, but why not take the time to do that? Um, and a good example of that is my dad is 94 years old. He he stays with my sister and her husband, and um they take excellent care of him. You know, we all try, all our um siblings try to rotate through and spend a day or two with him. I'm the one that's across the state, and so I don't get to see him as much as possible. But um she and her husband do the majority of the care, take him to his um doctor's appointments and things like that. Every once in a while, when I don't have a si when I have a sibling or I don't have a sibling, they don't me back up. They don't have a sibling who can sit with dad. Um and he's pretty self-sufficient. He, you know, just walker takes care of himself. He doesn't cook for himself anymore. He's 94 years old. He deserves to be cooked for, you know, can eat whatever he wants. Um, but he's not bedridden whatsoever. He gets around, he goes to his appointments and things like that. But every once in a while we'll have somebody come in because my sister needs to go, you know, get out, have a break, go to a meeting, do do church things, stuff like that. And so most of the time that we have a care cover cover, the caregiver come in um for you know a half a day, maybe six, seven hours. Um, they don't know him from Adam.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And it's always funny because my sister will text us, hey, Amber was here with dad today, and this is what happened, or we'll get nothing. So someone will just be with him and not really speak to him or care for, I mean, don't care for them, but they just don't get to know him. But let's just call her Amber. Amber was there last week on a day that none of us could show up, and Amber got to know him. Um, got to talking about him being a retired fire chief, how much he taught, how much you know, work he did. I mean, he was he was a fire chief for 44 years, he was a firefighter for 48 years. And um, it turns out that she's in EMT school and oh cool, he had excuse me, tons of things to talk about. You know, she quizzed him for hours. Well, what should I do here? What should I do here? And my dad's memory is pretty good, but it's not excellent. And so sometimes, you know, she would get, I don't remember that, or um, oh yes, and then he if she would touch on something that really um you know pulled the strings or something, you know, he'd go on and on. Oh, what are you gonna do this, this, and don't do this, and don't do that, and then you know, give her advice and things like that. So that was a great, it was a good day for him. It was a good day. I mean, we try to do that kind of stuff too, because some of us are in the in the business and some of us aren't. But um, yeah, it just makes a difference. I mean, why not? Why not delve into that? And as young people, even young healthcare providers, sometimes they just don't care. They just they don't bother, it's their job. And yeah, you know, they're not personable. But at our age, now it's like, hey, tell me about this. You know, you ask those open-ended personal questions about people if you really want to get to know them. Because there's a big difference between an impersonal closed question, like, hey, how was your day?
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Um, as opposed to a personal open question, like, tell me like what are you working on right now? Yeah, or what's taking up all your time. Those are personal questions, and we need to learn the difference, even if it's only gonna take up an extra minute and a half of your day, you know. I actually said something on purpose to someone a couple weeks ago that you know, because I knew I was gonna get, I hadn't seen him in a while, I knew I was gonna get um the hey, how you doing thing? Yeah, in fact, it was at our EMSIC conference. And I purposely said with a smile on my face, hey, I'm terrible, how are you? And I could have been serious, but I you know, of course it looked like I was joking, but what if I was serious? Yep, they didn't really hear me, you know. They you know, and I got a comment like, oh, that's cool, I'm fine.
SPEAKER_00Okay, yeah. That's a commentary on the world. That's crazy. Yeah, I after taking care of dad, so my father died five years ago, uh, but he was lucky enough to be home on hospice, and I was around, which was one of the reasons, one of the reasons we moved back to Michigan to be around for him. But I was around and and helped quite a bit, at least I feel like I did. And after going through that, the senior citizens were my favorite patients. I was still working in the ER. And so the young folks would go to the, you know, the dramas and the the stuff that we've all done for years. And I would love to do the grannies that fell or the grannies that are the weaknesses and stuff like that, because it's just it's hard to, it's hard to not appreciate, at least now, the just the life they've led. I don't know anything about it, but they've been here for 80 years. Garandam Tia, they've been through the death of family, they've been through who knows how many financial crises, the things that they've seen in their lifetime. You know, my grandmother, I used to love to talk to her because she saw, you know, TV, telephones, you know, then color T, you know, just the technologies that we took for granted to be through, to live through that period of just extensive change and and we bitch about the next iPhone coming out because it's got a different, it doesn't have a charge port or it doesn't have a mic and you know, inlet or whatever. Or it has a different hookup, you know. Yeah, my favorite, just my favorite people in the world. And I and I don't feel like I mean, we're obviously not there yet where we need to be honored for being senior citizens, but I think that just that sense of I feel like I have a better idea of what's important. I have a better idea of what um what matters to me. Who who knows if it matters to anybody else? But I've been able to define things in my life so much more. Because, like you said, when you're in your 20s, you're talking to everybody about how to raise your chickens. When you're in your 60s, you know how to do it. And the things, and maybe that's not important anymore, but you've tried it and you've weeded it out. And this is the definition of my life and my circle and what I choose to revolve around and have revolve around me, is very specific.
SPEAKER_02Yep.
SPEAKER_00And once again, that came through just life, the you know, the death of parents, the like we're burying my husband's brother this week, and he just came home with the ashes in a box. If that doesn't snap you out of the stupid things that you think are important in your head, that my brother-in-law is sitting right there on the counter, you know, I don't know, you know, that's that's where it comes from. That's that's where it comes from. And you have unfortunately you've got to go through that stuff to really get to, I think, the good stuff.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I completely agree. It's your choices.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_01And to be able to be blessed with determining where your choices are and where your actions are and where your words go as a as a um opposed to like um the way we spoke when we were in our 20s, 30s, 40s, you know, with no patience. Um, it's just it's it's worth it. Why do we have to be old to be able to be this mature is always the question.
SPEAKER_00I know there's a quote about that that I haven't mentioned in the past, and I don't know who hoot is, but yeah, it's it's very strange for me to but it's so wonderful. It I feel like just in the last couple of years, I've really been able to flip this switch and it's been so great. And I know that I should be grateful, even though this happened in my 60s, that some people never get there. Some people never have the ability to be able to sit by themselves and quiet and be okay and not be looking for a stimulus. I need something. Why isn't my earbud in? You know, I'm not being totally inundated. I'm willing to just sit in silence, and I'm very grateful for that. Background very grateful to be able, like you said, when somebody asks you how you are, you can honestly answer, as opposed to what I always hear, live in the dream. And I get so pissed at that. It's like, if you're that upset, make a choice. Make it make a move, man. As many moves as you and I have done in our lives, and every person that's reached any, you know, any age of any significance. We've all made choices. We've all, you know, moved on. We've all been either forced to or have had the luxury of making our own intentional choices. But man, life's too short.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, definitely. It's shorter even for us now.
SPEAKER_00It's shorter. Shorter every day. Every day, but it beats the alternative. I'd rather get old than not get old. That's true. That's true. Yeah. I'd rather get old, but anyway, just some thoughts.
SPEAKER_01Just some thoughts, good positive thoughts about maturity and and aging and us and how we can take all those things and put them together for good because we're a little better than we used to be.
SPEAKER_00What's the line? I'm I'm not as I'm as good as I once was, or something, the Toby Keith one. I might not be as physically good, but I feel like mentally I'm I'm good.
SPEAKER_01Right. You know, in our head, it's funny. I had a friend um post on Facebook that she was filling in for a gym class. Um, she's a teacher in like middle school, and um, this girl was doing a cartwheel. And if if Tressa ever sees this, she's gonna laugh. And one of the girls said, Well, you can't do one because you're old. And this, I think, I I think Tressa's in her 40s, and she had to prove to herself that she that she could do a cartwheel. And it worked. And she said, I was afraid I was not gonna land that thing. And I and I sort of commented on her Facebook post, great, now I'm gonna have to go out in the yard and try a cartwheel. Yeah. For my own sake, because in our head, we can do it. Yeah, totally do it. I'm totally capable of doing that. And then you walk outside and you go, uh Yeah.
SPEAKER_00If I fall on the ground, am I gonna be able to get up? Is somebody around to lift me off the ground if I get there? Yeah, like lift assist. Yeah. Oh man. Oh my goodness.
SPEAKER_01Oh well, we hope we made you guys laugh today, at least a little bit, and a little bit of reflection on the positives of being more mature. There you go.
SPEAKER_00We'll talk to you soon. Bye. Bye.