Noele Gordon

Join us as we take on lesser known camp icon Noele Gordon, the proclaimed ‘Queen of the Midlands’ throughout the 50’s right through to the early 80’s! Watch along with her famous Crossroads wedding, a bombastic fourth wall breaking Christmas Experience and a camptastic response to getting sacked!

Watch along with with our video section at the link below!

Noele Gordon sings ‘Friendship’ on Lunchbox - https://youtu.be/jwPSuEeUh_M 

Noele as Meg Richardson gets married in style! - https://youtu.be/JrLPoUr8dnE 

Noele hosts the Royal Variety Performance - https://youtu.be/ntt10_qY5bE?si=ZwXBpjuI8tHMdNHF 

Christmas At Crossroads - https://youtu.be/WLv-ffzW_Co?si=i3WjS98DzYvU_31s 

Noele responds to getting the sacked at the Christmas Party…! - https://youtu.be/qkwFcEJ8c50?si=ycxDufaowzuQQroo 

We are indebted to those who have originally uploaded these videos, this podcast wouldn't be possible without them!

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Transcript

SPEAKER_04 0:01

Hello and welcome to Camp Icons. How are you doing, Liz Liz?

SPEAKER_01 0:07

I'm doing very well, thank you, Nick.

SPEAKER_04 0:08

You're doing good. Just that was quite formal, wasn't it? We're not normally that formal.

SPEAKER_01 0:11

Shall we shake hands?

SPEAKER_04 0:13

No, you're too far away. I'm not stretching.

SPEAKER_01 0:19

No exercise on the podcast, please.

SPEAKER_04 0:21

No, this is a sitting down activity.

SPEAKER_01 0:23

Yes.

SPEAKER_04 0:24

Um every week on the podcast, we look at a camp icon and take a look at their life and their work, and then we watch some of their campist moments.

SPEAKER_01 0:40

My favourite bit.

SPEAKER_04 0:41

And this week, uh we're doing something a little bit different. Episode three, we're straying from format quite early.

SPEAKER_02 0:48

Yeah, already.

SPEAKER_04 0:49

Yeah, um, we are looking at someone that I consider to sort of be a forgotten camp icon.

SPEAKER_01 0:55

Well, definitely forgotten by me because she told me the name and I don't know this person.

SPEAKER_04 1:01

Brilliant.

SPEAKER_01 1:02

Excellent.

SPEAKER_04 1:03

This week we are looking at Noel Gordon.

SPEAKER_01 1:08

Yeah, it's I I'm excited because I think I'm going to be discovering something new.

SPEAKER_04 1:13

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 1:14

So there we go.

SPEAKER_04 1:15

I I hope so.

SPEAKER_01 1:16

And maybe the listeners are as well.

SPEAKER_04 1:18

Maybe. Noel Gordon really was a pioneer.

SPEAKER_02 1:40

Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_04 1:42

Er she was the first woman ever to be seen on colour television.

SPEAKER_02 1:47

Right.

SPEAKER_04 1:47

She was involved with it wasn't like broadcast, but she was involved with John Logie Bed's colour television trials.

SPEAKER_01 1:56

Oh, wow.

SPEAKER_04 1:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:57

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 1:57

She was the first woman to ever be seen on that.

SPEAKER_01 2:01

That's amazing.

SPEAKER_04 2:03

She was the first female television executive.

SPEAKER_02 2:08

Ooh.

SPEAKER_04 2:09

In 1955.

SPEAKER_02 2:12

Right.

SPEAKER_04 2:13

Yes. She um she was born in 1919. So we are going back a back a little bit further. Back a little bit, yeah. Um and her mother wanted her to go into performing arts. She said of her mother she desperately wanted me to be in the theatre from the moment I was born.

SPEAKER_01 2:31

We love a showbiz mum.

SPEAKER_04 2:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:33

We love a pushy, pushy showbiz mum. Yeah. Get 'em get 'em performing.

SPEAKER_04 2:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:38

I never I never could get 'out there.' Well, I think that's the vibe.

SPEAKER_04 2:43

I think mum wanted to do it. Yeah. She was too shy. Um and so she went off and trained at Rada.

SPEAKER_03 2:50

Oh.

SPEAKER_04 2:51

Yes, she went and trained at Rada. Um, and was making a steady living in theatre and TV, and then came to the attention of Lou Grade, who was setting up ITV.

SPEAKER_02 3:04

I see.

SPEAKER_04 3:05

And he sent her to America for a year to study their television production methods.

SPEAKER_01 3:11

I mean, this is amazing. This is quite a, you know, a huge opportunity for someone to go and do that.

SPEAKER_04 3:16

Yeah, I mean, where this is sort of 1954.

SPEAKER_01 3:19

Wow.

SPEAKER_04 3:20

When you don't the sort of the view is not really that women are holding these positions and having these opportunities at all. So she came back and she started a show called Lunchbox.

SPEAKER_01 3:33

Okay. Which I've never heard of it.

SPEAKER_04 3:35

Well, no. The the thing about Noel is that she is working in a time where they weren't really recording TV shows.

SPEAKER_01 3:44

Right, of course. Yes. Yeah, so it just happened and then that was it.

SPEAKER_04 3:48

Lunchbox was broadcast live, so it was broadcast. It wasn't there was no tape in that camera, it just went out and that was it.

SPEAKER_01 3:56

Oh, you just forget, don't you? Yeah. Because it feels like everything now is saved and you can find it somehow. And okay, yeah, wow.

SPEAKER_04 4:03

Yeah. There is one episode of Lunchbox that was recorded. Right. And we will be watching part of that later.

SPEAKER_01 4:09

I'm genuinely excited.

SPEAKER_04 4:11

Yeah, so I mean we're really going back to a different era of camp.

SPEAKER_01 4:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 4:15

This week. Other TV endeavours. She was the first female to interview a Prime Minister.

SPEAKER_01 4:23

So you said it rather, so she obviously is an actor.

SPEAKER_04 4:26

She was an actress. She went and had a career in the theatre, and then in her 30s kind of transitioned.

SPEAKER_01 4:32

To she's she's doing it all, really.

SPEAKER_04 4:34

She was in the original London cast of Brigadoon.

SPEAKER_01 4:38

Oh wow, okay.

SPEAKER_04 4:40

Lunchbox round for ten years.

SPEAKER_00 4:42

Oh, it's a big deal.

SPEAKER_04 4:44

And then they cancelled it and decided that they wanted to replace it with the first UK daily soap opera.

SPEAKER_02 4:54

Right.

SPEAKER_04 4:55

So uh the kind of the idea of the soap opera up until that point, they'd been sort of like twice weekly. This was the first time that it was going to be on sort of four or five nights a week. And that soap was Crossroads.

SPEAKER_01 5:11

I see, I see. So is this the thing that I would mo if I did know it, I would most associate her with.

SPEAKER_04 5:18

I would assume so.

SPEAKER_01 5:20

Right, okay.

SPEAKER_04 5:21

You've heard of Crossroads, surely.

SPEAKER_01 5:23

Now I know of Crossroads, and in my lifetime they tried to bring it back.

SPEAKER_04 5:28

They did.

SPEAKER_01 5:29

And I think I don't think it was a huge hit. I might have tried an episode, but I don't think it really it really, you know, stuck with me.

SPEAKER_04 5:39

Fair. Um But yeah, so she became she's the original crossroads. She's the original crossroads, and I mean when I say she was the original crossroads, yeah, like it was hers.

SPEAKER_01 5:54

She right, okay.

SPEAKER_04 5:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:57

So soap operas now, and the we mostly have them in the evenings, yes, but they were like a daytime thing.

SPEAKER_04 6:06

Yes, I th I think Crossroads was like sort of tea time, that kind of half five, six o'clock slot. Yeah. Um Crossroads, if you're unfamiliar, was um set in a motel. Um Meg was the owner of the motel, um, which had I believe 20 chalets that were available, and it was about kind of the the staff and the guests at the motel.

SPEAKER_01 6:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 6:35

It had a bit of a reputation, did Crossroads?

SPEAKER_01 6:38

Yes.

SPEAKER_04 6:39

Are you familiar with its reputation?

SPEAKER_01 6:41

Am I right in thinking um that it inspired Acorn Antiques?

SPEAKER_04 6:47

You are bang on the money.

SPEAKER_01 6:49

Yes.

SPEAKER_04 6:49

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 6:50

So when I hear Crossroads, I sort of think of shaky sets and dodgy acting and possibly camera work and just overall a level of like naff.

SPEAKER_04 7:05

Yeah, that that is the reputation that um kind of it has become known for. Right. What I discovered in the research for this is that the reason that was the case is because they filmed all the episodes were filmed for broadcast, but they filmed them as live.

SPEAKER_03 7:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 7:25

If there was an error, there were no retakes, it went in.

SPEAKER_01 7:31

Which is an amazing thing.

SPEAKER_04 7:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:34

Because they've done live episodes of you know EastEnders and Coronation Street in sort of recent-ish years. Yeah. And there is always an error, however, much you practice, that is a huge thing to pull off. So many actors and so many cameras, and it's a complex thing.

SPEAKER_04 7:53

Absolutely. Um there was uh an anecdote that I enjoyed that was basically because they were filming it live, if they said their lines too fast and the scene was running under, they had to do something.

SPEAKER_01 8:10

And what they would do I just I'm just taking that in. Right. The scene is running under, we're panicking.

SPEAKER_04 8:19

What they would do is give Meg a phone call.

SPEAKER_01 8:22

Right, okay.

SPEAKER_04 8:23

So Meg is the character that Noel Gordon plays.

SPEAKER_01 8:25

Yes.

SPEAKER_04 8:26

Um So the phone would just randomly ring.

SPEAKER_01 8:30

And I've understanding a little of why it got the reputation.

SPEAKER_04 8:34

And I've seen footage of her picking up the phone, going, Hello. Hello, yes. Oh yes, we are in Birmingham. Oh yes, just a short distance from the NEC. Because she she would ad lib until the like the floor manager said, Okay, you can put the phone down.

SPEAKER_01 8:56

Oh my goodness. Yeah, what an amazing responsibility to have. She's got to be there.

SPEAKER_04 9:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 9:03

Wow, oh that is incredible.

SPEAKER_04 9:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 9:06

Oh, I d I love that. I think in like today's like, you know, Netflix streaming era when everything's so like overly, you know, produced and like manufactured and it's so slick, there's kind of no like heart to it. Do you know what I mean? Yes. I think there's something really beautiful about the fact that all the actors there are working their hardest to make this thing happen live, and then they've got her there like on standby to like pull them out the shit.

SPEAKER_04 9:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 9:39

I love that.

SPEAKER_04 9:40

She like she was the queen of the show. She she had her own chair in the green room, and you sat in it, and I quote, on pain of death.

SPEAKER_01 9:49

I wow, I respect that.

SPEAKER_04 9:52

But equally, that I've watched a couple of documentaries about her, and everyone that worked with her said how lovely she was. Like she would take the time out to go through scenes with people, she would she really wanted it to be like a family environment, and as much as she was definitely running that ship, like she wanted it to be a nice, a nice atmosphere.

SPEAKER_01 10:18

That is really interesting because I think when we had the like well when we had other episodes, I was sort of like about Scylla, we were talking about like the kind of divinous yeah, and it's maybe like there are more than what more than one way to be the matriarch, you know? Yes. She's so she's got this real like caring side where she's you know making sure it's her family and she's looking after them.

SPEAKER_04 10:44

Yeah, there's there's another story about um how one of the crew was getting married and both her parents had passed away, so she um drove her to the church.

SPEAKER_01 10:56

That's lovely, isn't it? Yeah. Oh, I love that.

SPEAKER_04 10:59

I mean she drove her to the church in her own Rolls-Royce that she had purchased. Um Rolls-Royce. Was she? Yes. It had the number play NG10.

SPEAKER_01 11:11

Imagine. Imagine her just knocking about in her Rolls-Royce. She's rolled up in the Royals. Oh, of course.

SPEAKER_04 11:17

There was another anecdote, one of the actresses says she turned up one day and she said, I think Pamela's going to be very late today because I just drove past her at the bus stop. Which, I mean, is diva behaviour and I'm here for it.

SPEAKER_01 11:30

Yes, I love it. Just, you know, make Pamela work harder and get her own Rolls Royce, you know. She's got to learn.

SPEAKER_04 11:38

You get that bus, Pamela. Um again, now I think it's easy to underestimate how popular Crossroads was.

SPEAKER_01 11:59

That's that's amazing, isn't it?

SPEAKER_04 12:01

Yeah. I mean it's numbers that You just can't get that.

SPEAKER_01 12:04

No. No, even like Christmas specials now are struggling to get like higher than a few million. That it's it's just a a different world. And there's something really different about like that shared cultural experience. Yeah. Because everybody watched it, everybody talked about it for years. And I know my parents talked about crossroads, and I think yeah, it was one of those shows that kind of seeped into everybody's knowledge.

SPEAKER_04 12:33

They all had some kind of knowledge, even if they weren't watching it every single day, they have Yeah, and and I mean this is the thing, like now we you know, you miss an episode of EastEnders, you can watch it on catch-up, but if you missed that wedding episode, yeah, you weren't seeing it again.

SPEAKER_01 12:49

No. And everybody'd be talking about it and you'd have missed out.

SPEAKER_04 12:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:52

You had to be there, you had to make sure, you know, you made your tea uh beforehand, so you didn't have to go out and miss any.

SPEAKER_04 12:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:59

Oh, it's a different life.

SPEAKER_04 13:01

Speaking of the wedding episode.

SPEAKER_01 13:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 13:04

So bearing in mind that her character Meg was a motel owner in Birmingham. Right. Um, she got married in a registry office. Okay. Because she was divorced, so she wasn't allowed to get married in the church.

SPEAKER_01 13:19

Oh god, speaking of a different time.

SPEAKER_04 13:21

Yeah. Um and then she had the marriage blessed in Birmingham Cathedral.

unknown 13:27

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 13:30

And because of the popularity of the programme, the streets of Birmingham were lined. They were lined with people that wanted to see them film it. Oh, I imagine. And so you can see in the episode, and will see in the episode, like this small-time motel owner just having thousands of people lining up. So the royal wedding. Yeah, basically. Like it sort of was like a royal wedding because it it people absolutely turned out for it.

SPEAKER_01 14:01

Oh fantastic. I know. It's great. I'd be quite happy to replace the royals with just um soap opera actors. I'd be quite for that. Imagine Phil Mitchell just sat in Westminster Abbey holding an orb.

SPEAKER_04 14:19

I'd I would take I'd take Sharon as the Queen. Sharon as the Queen. Queen Sharon. Would that make Angie Watts the Queen Mother? It should. One of my favourite, I I I don't know if you remember this, we were in a pub, you and I playing um it was Shag Mary Kill. Right. And one of the options was Angie Watts, and I said I would marry Angie Watts, and you were I don't know if you'd had a drink, but you were outraged and said to me, Stick stick lipstick and big hair on a fish, and you'd be interested. So don't you sit there and say that Angie Watts should be the Queen Mother after you've slurred her like that?

SPEAKER_01 15:12

I don't have any memory of that.

SPEAKER_04 15:14

I do, I can I can tell you I won't because we're on a podcast, but I can tell you which pub it was and which table we were sat at.

SPEAKER_01 15:22

I could probably guess what pub it was. Okay. Do you remember the other two options?

SPEAKER_04 15:29

I don't know. So in 1981, we get to the thing that kind of is her legacy and is the thing that she's most remembered for.

SPEAKER_02 15:46

Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_04 15:48

Which I think is a shame. Oh but in 1981 she was sacked from Crossroads.

SPEAKER_01 15:57

No.

SPEAKER_04 15:58

Yeah, she had been there for 17 years. She was like undoubtedly the queen of the show.

SPEAKER_01 16:07

Yeah, she's like a fixture.

SPEAKER_04 16:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 16:10

So So what happened?

SPEAKER_04 16:12

Well, she was told all good things must come to an end.

SPEAKER_01 16:17

Outrageous.

SPEAKER_04 16:18

Yeah. On the night that her final episode aired, she appeared on a chat show on the BBC, not on ITV.

SPEAKER_02 16:28

Of course.

SPEAKER_04 16:29

And he said, why? He's you know, why have they let you go? And she said, I don't know. I haven't been able to find out. I mean I'm sober and clean and quiet living, and I learned my lines, and suddenly they said all good things must come to an end. Like they absolutely shafted her.

SPEAKER_01 16:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 16:49

Really.

SPEAKER_01 16:50

It's I think I I don't know, but it's it's just ageism, isn't it? It's like and she's a woman, and it's like we can just get rid of her and get new blood in without realising what value she is to people who've been watching her for 17 years and feeling like you know, people get really attached to soap opera characters because they see them every day. They're really attached.

SPEAKER_04 17:14

Well, the public protested. There were not surprised protests outside the studio.

SPEAKER_01 17:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 17:19

And um a man named Bill Buckley released a single called Meg is Magic.

SPEAKER_01 17:26

Oh, that's wonderful.

SPEAKER_04 17:27

To try and get the producers to change their mind. Um but for a for to kind of put into context the scale of it, that is what inspired the ending of Acorn Antiques when Mrs. Overall is sacked.

SPEAKER_01 17:45

Oh, right. Yeah. Yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_04 17:48

Um And there's that scene where the Julie Walters, as the actress who plays Mrs. Overall, comes out with her dark glasses on and a cigarette holder and goes, That show was my life. Yeah. Um and that was based on uh an event where Noel spoke to the press outside.

SPEAKER_01 18:07

Um my goodness.

SPEAKER_04 18:10

So these kind of I think now we're probably more familiar with Acorn Antiques than we are with Crossroads.

SPEAKER_01 18:18

I think so. Because obviously, uh like a comedy show like Victoria Woods gets rewatched. Yes. Whereas people m probably aren't going back and re-watching all of Crossroads. It's those that remembered it from the time.

SPEAKER_04 18:31

Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Um and so yeah, she was she was sacked, she was kicked out.

SPEAKER_01 18:38

I I do think that is genuinely terrible. And it's um you notice nowadays, like I don't really watch EastEnders, but I did when I was younger. Yeah. And then you switch it on, and you're like, all the characters that left have come back. And you think, like, actually people love that, you know, consistency of knowing those characters really well. Yeah. That's why you always end up bringing them back. So don't keep don't keep sacking them in the first place.

SPEAKER_04 19:03

Well, she um she then went on to star in a production of Gypsy as Mama Rose. Yes. It's another quote from her. Noel described herself as the UK's Ethel Merman and referred to this is her own words. Um I'm more of a hollerer than a pop singer.

SPEAKER_01 19:27

Oh, I love that. Yes, I love that. I just do you know what? There should be more styles of singing. I think we used to be more diverse. Now it's like, oh, we can only sing one way. I love a hollerer. Like you you know that I love Ethel.

SPEAKER_04 19:41

I also love Ethel Norman, and I'm just trying to stop her from coming up on this podcast at some point.

SPEAKER_01 19:46

I was gonna say she's got to, yeah, but um yes, oh I think I think that's wonderful. I'm more of a hollerer. I love it.

SPEAKER_04 19:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 19:54

Um I I almost expected that, even though I've I have no image of her in my mind and didn't know anything about her until five minutes ago. That just makes sense to me.

SPEAKER_04 20:06

Yeah, she um so obviously I said she was in the original cast of Brigadoon and another of her quotes uh there was Frederick Lowe, the American composer. I had just auditioned for him for Brigadoon singing a couple of songs on stage. When I'd finished, Mr. Lowe stood up in the stalls and said, Will you marry me?

SPEAKER_00 20:26

Did he?

SPEAKER_04 20:27

I asked if he was married. Yes, but I'm not working at it. I asked why he wanted to marry me, and he said, So that you will always be there to sing my songs. And she said, in that case, I told him, You'd better see my agent.

SPEAKER_01 20:43

Yes. Yes, oh yeah, oh I love her. Go on.

SPEAKER_04 20:47

Yeah. Um she made a brief return to Crossroads in 1983 and was due to go back full-time in 1985. She had signed the contracts, but before she could start filming, she died of stomach cancer.

SPEAKER_01 21:03

Oh, yeah. See, I knew they would want her back.

SPEAKER_04 21:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:07

Yeah, that's very sad that she didn't get to do that, but it doesn't surprise me that the the will and the you know desire to have her back was there because it just it you know there's no reason to get rid of a character just because they've been there a long time. It's like I I could just imagine after 17 years of like phoning Meg if the scene is running short, somebody going, We've done everything we want to with this character. Actually, we we just we we get attached to people that we like watch really often. We don't need them always to be, you know, reinvented as a character or them to have the most dramatic storyline ever. Sometimes it's nice just to have them there, you know?

SPEAKER_04 21:51

Yeah, the for sort of consistency.

SPEAKER_01 21:53

And they're just they're like part of your family, aren't they? When you really love a show. Like I'm sure people did. I I I can tell by the way that people talk about Crossroads that they really loved it and took it into their hearts, despite whatever flaws people pointed out.

SPEAKER_04 22:09

Yeah. Yeah. In lieu of a memoir, there's no memoir for Noel Gordon, she didn't write one. Um, I have got a TV Times Extra from 1975.

SPEAKER_01 22:24

I'm I'm so excited by this.

SPEAKER_04 22:26

It's called My Life at the Crossroads by Meg Mortimer.

SPEAKER_01 22:30

So that's her character.

SPEAKER_04 22:31

That's her character, yes.

SPEAKER_01 22:33

Right.

SPEAKER_04 22:34

Um, and I'm going to take you through some of the things that she says.

SPEAKER_01 22:40

Right. So she's written this in character.

SPEAKER_04 22:44

Well, I don't know if she's actually written it. I hope that she has.

SPEAKER_01 22:47

Oh yeah, we believe.

SPEAKER_04 22:50

Um so Meg had two children, Jill and Sandy. Um, of Jill, she says, my eldest daughter has had a lot of problems over the years. She used to be a stubborn, rebellious teenager, but now the mother of two children and with two unhappy marriages behind her, I feel she has matured a lot. She's a supergirl. If only we were closer.

SPEAKER_01 23:12

I love how um soap opera characters, because they've got to have all these storylines, end up with the most checkered pass. Yeah. It's like she's only been married 18 times.

SPEAKER_04 23:24

Um one of the other like big, big storylines in Crossroads was Meg's son, Sandy, was confined to a wheelchair.

SPEAKER_02 23:33

Right.

SPEAKER_04 23:34

Um and was they were kind of providing like representation in an era where it it didn't sort of happen. Yeah. It was um so they were doing the sort of realism stuff, and then they were doing some other things. So this is an article entitled Tragic Magic Moments. A disaster that was probably a blessing in disguise was when a bomb went off at crossroads. We were not victims of a terrorist attack or anything like that. Workmen were excavating for a new wing near the motel, and a dumper truck went over a wartime bomb. There was an ear-splitting blast, and our kitchen seemed to cave in. I was terribly upset, but once I'd got over the shock, I realised that I needed a bigger and better kitchen anyway. And here was a golden opportunity to have one. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 24:31

That's the silver lining to a bomb explosion. Yes. Yeah. Good. I like that.

SPEAKER_04 24:36

As a result of this storyline, they took Meg abroad for a little for a storyline abroad.

SPEAKER_01 24:42

Right.

SPEAKER_04 24:43

Where do you think they might have sent Meg?

SPEAKER_01 24:47

Um Majorca.

SPEAKER_04 24:49

Mallorca. It was thanks to the bomb too that we had a wonderful three months in Tunisia.

SPEAKER_00 24:56

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 24:57

It took so long to clear up the damage and rebuild the kitchen that when I was asked to go to Tunisia to help open a new hotel called the Coral Reef, I jumped at the chance.

SPEAKER_01 25:08

Yeah. So they took her to Sorry, the the hotel in Tunisia is called the Coral Reef.

SPEAKER_04 25:14

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 25:14

Right. Yes. Is there a coral reef near Tunisia?

SPEAKER_04 25:17

Not to my knowledge.

SPEAKER_01 25:18

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 25:20

There are other storylines in here mentioned about when one of her husbands tried to poison her, when she went to prison, when she went on holiday to Spain. Um so yeah, she lived quite a colourful life. Wonderful. Did our Meg. Another thing in this magazine that again I just I I can't imagine it ever happening today.

SPEAKER_01 25:48

Is the entire magazine about this character?

SPEAKER_04 25:51

It's not all about Meg. No, there are is there are some bits about other characters as well.

SPEAKER_01 25:56

Right.

SPEAKER_04 25:56

I can see that you're looking at just how many pages under.

SPEAKER_01 25:59

Yes, there's a lot of page turning going on.

SPEAKER_04 26:01

It's worth the 35p. Um there's an article entitled Girls Who Get the Men Switched On.

SPEAKER_01 26:09

Oh, okay. Yes. Not in the current climate.

SPEAKER_04 26:13

No, absolutely not. Um sorry, this is a little bit. I will read that later though, just my own. Oh, we are going through this with a tooth comb. Um here we go. What people don't realise is that the costumes aren't the work of a clever wardrobe mistress. For, like the rest of the cast, Noel Gordon is responsible for her own costumes. Admittedly, she receives a dress allowance to help cover the cost, but it's up to her to choose the right things, find the time to buy them, and make sure they look fresh and neat.

SPEAKER_01 26:48

No way.

SPEAKER_04 26:49

Yeah. So for Crossroads, they were supplying almost everything.

SPEAKER_01 26:56

That's that's wild. Like I I don't think I've ever heard of that as a practice, but um maybe on a student film, but that's absolutely that's mad. I really I am interested what these costumes look like now.

SPEAKER_04 27:13

You are gonna see some.

SPEAKER_01 27:15

Because in the other episodes I've been able to comment on style, yeah. Uh which always fascinates me about our camp icons, and I I haven't really said much this time, so I can't wait to see uh what she actually uh looks like.

SPEAKER_04 27:29

Yeah. I've got a couple of um Noel's style tips. Oh good.

SPEAKER_01 27:38

I m I need them.

SPEAKER_04 27:41

Soft feminine chiffon and satting is flattering to all ages.

SPEAKER_01 27:46

Okay. Do you agree with that? Oh, it might be to all ages. Um not to all body types. Okay. I don't I don't do well in chiffon.

SPEAKER_04 28:00

You don't get a lot of chiffon these days, do you?

SPEAKER_01 28:02

No, everything's sort of polyester from China, unfortunately.

SPEAKER_04 28:07

Bring back chiffon.

SPEAKER_01 28:08

I wish we were all decked out in chiffon all the time. Uh as I say though, I need a lot more structure than that.

SPEAKER_04 28:15

Okay, here's another one for you. You can never go wrong with a neutral coloured classic suit which you can team with various blouses and accessories.

SPEAKER_01 28:24

Hmm. I j I had a feeling she'd be a blouse wearer.

SPEAKER_04 28:30

She is a blouse wearer. Broad vertical stripes can give a slimming line to a chunky cardigan.

SPEAKER_01 28:38

Uh can they? Broad vertical stripes, okay. Yes.

SPEAKER_04 28:42

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 28:43

I've heard people say that. I think it's a lie. Okay. But um, okay. I'll try it out.

SPEAKER_04 28:48

Try it out.

SPEAKER_01 28:49

I'll report back.

SPEAKER_04 28:50

Try it out. Right. I think we should dive into watching a bit of Noel Gordon. Um the first clip that we're gonna watch today is from Lunchbox. Excellent. It's it's our first black and white clip. Um now what I what I will say is they are doing a bit in this. They say that they're doing a bit.

SPEAKER_01 29:19

Okay. So this is this is lunchbooks. This is from the like mid-50s.

SPEAKER_04 29:31

So it started in 55. Right. And ended in the mid-60s, I think.

SPEAKER_01 29:38

Yeah, because this is a black and white clip, but it it feels very old.

SPEAKER_04 29:42

Like Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:43

It's yeah, there's like a when they have to switch camera, there's like a weird like dark bit, and it's it it's really cool that there is actually some surviving.

SPEAKER_04 29:53

Yeah, I've I so I've watched I I haven't watched the whole thing.

SPEAKER_01 29:58

No.

SPEAKER_04 29:59

It's it's of its time. Yes. And it's quite it's quite slow moving.

SPEAKER_01 30:05

So what we've just watched is a musical number.

SPEAKER_04 30:08

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 30:08

But what is the whole show then? Is it what what else happens?

SPEAKER_04 30:15

So it begins with the can can. Right.

SPEAKER_01 30:19

And then Is it on at lunchtime? I presume so from the name, I you know, I assume. Because I really don't know why I haven't looked that up. But it's quite a lot of production for a lunchtime show, is what I'm thinking.

SPEAKER_04 30:34

It's um for about the first 20 minutes, yeah. They're wishing people birthdays, uh happy birthday and happy anniversary. Right. But like they'll do a few and then they'll sing a number to those people.

SPEAKER_01 30:46

Yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_04 30:47

And then they'll do a few more and sing another few to those people. Um they have the in-house band.

SPEAKER_02 30:55

Right.

SPEAKER_04 30:56

Um And it was something that Noel wanted to bring in. She wanted to bring in those elements of cabaret.

SPEAKER_01 31:01

Right. Um I I I really enjoyed the little number they did.

SPEAKER_04 31:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 31:07

So she introduces it by saying uh it's her and another um man. Yeah. Um that she says that we both got idiot boards.

SPEAKER_04 31:18

So she introduces she's sort of telling the audience that sometimes when they're singing they ha cheat and have the words in front of them. Yeah. Essentially.

SPEAKER_01 31:27

Um But I think they're trying to do that as a funny thing.

SPEAKER_04 31:32

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 31:33

Because clearly they could have had the So what they keep doing is running to the back of stage to look round the corner at their like, you know, crib sheet of their lines.

SPEAKER_03 31:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 31:44

But clearly they could have put those in a better position. They've tried to make a feature of it or something.

SPEAKER_04 31:49

I think they've tried to make a thing of it, but she does say, like, don't think we don't need these words, because we absolutely do need these words.

SPEAKER_01 31:58

I believe her.

SPEAKER_04 31:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:00

Um funnily enough, it's the second time I've heard this song in one of these clips.

SPEAKER_04 32:05

It's a bit different to Sue and Rosemary, isn't it?

SPEAKER_01 32:08

It is different to Sue and Rosemary. I enjoyed both on their own merits.

SPEAKER_04 32:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:13

Um I but a yeah, I haven't heard this song in years, so then it's come up twice. Is this the campist song?

SPEAKER_04 32:21

Uh maybe it is.

SPEAKER_01 32:22

You can find is friendship. Um yeah, so they do quite a like a nice, like standard sort of version of it, but just with this odd run into the back of stage thing. Yeah. Which I think was supposed to be funny.

SPEAKER_04 32:33

I think so.

SPEAKER_01 32:35

It's because you could just hold the words in your hand, but then maybe that looks like amateur hour. So they've made it they ha they have made it a little feature that they have to run to the back to look at them.

SPEAKER_04 32:47

Yeah, and I think that's for me. I think that's sort of what makes it a bit camp is that they're sort of doing this bit that they don't really need to be doing.

SPEAKER_01 33:00

So yeah, some sort of silliness and like yeah, something extra added to it for no reason.

SPEAKER_04 33:08

Yeah, basically. They could have just sung a lovely song.

SPEAKER_01 33:11

Yeah. And she looks amazing. Oh, she yeah. She it reminds me of my grandma's like generation where the hair was always done, yeah, the jewellery was always chosen, makeup perfect, your whole outfit would match. Not like me, throwing on random outfits and whatever's clean will work. And if the shoes are comfy, I'll wear them. This is like the whole thing is thought through, top to tail. Yeah. Every bit of it has got to work. So she's got a beautiful, like fitted dress, and you know, like a shiny brooch, her earrings. She looks fantastic.

SPEAKER_04 33:54

And she's got that very um sort of plummy RP.

SPEAKER_01 34:00

Yes, a plummy accent. Yeah, it's like you could probably if you just heard the clip, just heard her speak, you would know what era that was that clip was from.

SPEAKER_04 34:10

She never loses that accent. Interesting, yes. Um But yeah, that was that's some proper old school camp there.

SPEAKER_01 34:20

It is really old school. It's um it's kind of really nice to see. Actually, I know it's weird, it's weird that that song's come up again, but it's nice to see it in different eras. Because they're having a lot of fun with it. Yeah. Back then, and Sue and Rosemary have fun with it in a totally different way. Yeah. But both of them sort of feel like they're maybe slightly pushing the boundaries for like the time that it's made in. Yeah. Because back in the 50s, when they were making stuff, you know, there was a right way to do things. There was a very like, you know, um, wanting to project a very professional atmosphere because this new thing that they had was called TV, and they didn't always get it right, yeah. Because they were still figuring things out, but they wanted, you know, everybody with the proper accents and everybody to do their jobs properly and everything. Yeah. And so having this kind of silliness, that's why she has to explain it.

SPEAKER_04 35:16

It's like Yeah, and also to a degree as well, to be a woman being having silliness on screen in the fifties.

SPEAKER_01 35:26

Yeah, she's allowed yeah, she's allowed to be a bit comic and a bit fun. She's not just there as an accessory to someone else. Yeah. It's really nice.

SPEAKER_04 35:37

We are gonna move forward now. Right. Um to your favourite decades. Yes. The 70s.

SPEAKER_01 35:43

Good.

SPEAKER_04 35:44

And we are going to watch some clips from the wedding episode that drew 18 million viewers.

SPEAKER_01 35:51

Perfect. Oh it's actually just acorn antiques. Now that I see it, I'm like, oh, I didn't realise how bang on Acorn Antiques is.

SPEAKER_04 36:11

Yes, it uh is the credits with the the moving in and out.

SPEAKER_00 36:14

Yes, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 36:15

So that was another thing that they did for time. If they needed to make up time, they would run the credits slower. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 36:24

Oh wow, but also just the like random collection of people seeing her off to her wedding. They're just shouting things out. The dialogue is absolute nonsense.

SPEAKER_00 36:36

They're just shouting.

SPEAKER_04 36:39

So it so what I will say, uh what I should point out at this point, is that I've taken the full episode and I have edited this down into a more digestible uh clip to watch.

SPEAKER_01 36:51

Which you've just made a small smaller version of it, but I I do believe if I saw the whole thing in context, it would still feel like they were shouting random things.

SPEAKER_04 37:01

If you if you saw the whole thing in context, you would wonder what on earth you were watching.

SPEAKER_02 37:08

Would I really?

SPEAKER_04 37:09

Because about 20 minutes of the episode is the blessing of the marriage in the cathedral.

SPEAKER_01 37:16

Oh, like you were just at a real wedding.

SPEAKER_04 37:18

Yes. The choir sings two hymns. Two hymns. And it's none of the main characters have a line beyond I do and I will. It's just the vicar in the cathedral talking, like doing 20 minutes. So the clip begins with Meg getting ready in her sitting room and her daughter Jill is helping her get ready. Yes. She looks immaculate.

SPEAKER_01 37:48

Yeah, again, just incredible.

SPEAKER_04 37:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 37:52

Um, she's got this sort of bluish uh I think you you that I think that might be Siffon.

SPEAKER_04 37:59

And it is very flattering on her.

SPEAKER_01 38:01

It's she looks great. Yes. She looks wonderful. And she's also quite clearly, the second you see her in total command of every single scene.

SPEAKER_04 38:10

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 38:10

She has so much presence and authority. Um so even though she's playing a character who's nervous about her wedding, she's still kind of just in charge of every aspect of that.

SPEAKER_04 38:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 38:25

Oh, she's wonderful.

SPEAKER_04 38:26

One of my favourite bits in that scene is when I'm not sure what the character is called that comes in with the glasses on. No. And she just very um emphatically declares My shoes! Like she's not mentioned these shoes before, we didn't know that she was looking for shoes, we didn't know that she didn't have shoes on. No. Someone brings in shoes and it's like they're made of gold.

SPEAKER_01 39:01

And the the character that comes in is so scattery. I swear she almost throws the shoes. She seems so timid next to this woman.

SPEAKER_04 39:13

And then uh one of my other um one of the other classic lines in there, Oh, I just keep remembering things that I've forgotten.

SPEAKER_01 39:22

I love that so much. I yeah, it's one of those great lines of dialogue that is either total nonsense or quite profound.

SPEAKER_04 39:33

Yes. I think I know which. Yes, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 39:38

I I do wonder what she thought of the scripts, because uh like people who have play a character for a very long time have a great deal of ownership. So I wonder if she just crossed everything out when she got it. Or if she was a very professional, you know, I will do as written.

SPEAKER_04 39:57

So there one of the things that I watched, there is a drama on ITVX called Nolly. So she was known amongst the cast as Nolly. Noel Gordon, Nolly.

SPEAKER_02 40:07

I do think I've heard of that.

SPEAKER_04 40:09

Yeah, you probably have. It's written by Russell T. Davis. Oh yes. It stars Helena Bonham Carter as Noel Gordon. It's prime it primarily deals with the sacking.

SPEAKER_01 40:21

Oh, I see, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 40:22

But you build this they build this picture of her um as being quite in control. Yeah and you know, if she didn't agree with a bit of direction, she would change it and move it around. Russell T. Davis says that he almost everything in the document uh not documentary, almost everything in the drama is based on stories he was told by ex-cast members. So I would imagine there was a certain amount of control that she did have.

SPEAKER_01 40:55

I I can believe that because she's so commanding her presence in that. Um yes, it's almost harder to believe that she wouldn't fight back. Yeah because that character, you know, after an amount of time, is so much a part of her that I can believe that she would Well that brings me on to when she takes the shoes, sits down, and makes the two other characters put those shoes on her. Yes.

SPEAKER_04 41:22

Because the um her daughter uh the the person getting her ready is her daughter Jill. Yeah. And she says, Oh, I don't want you to get your dress creased. But I can imagine a world where she's turning around and goes, I'm not being on camera bending over, putting my shoes on. No.

SPEAKER_01 41:42

Um absolutely.

SPEAKER_04 41:44

Yeah, because there there is sort of an attendant nature to what How are we going to do this scene?

SPEAKER_01 41:50

I can't be bending over doing those finickety little straps on those tiny little shoes. Absolutely ridiculous. The girls will do it, the girls will have to do it.

SPEAKER_04 42:02

We then move into the reception where she makes her entrance and presents herself. Which is really the only way I can think to describe that.

SPEAKER_01 42:13

What a dramatic way to do. It's accurate. It is accurate, yes, yes.

SPEAKER_04 42:19

She walks out of the door.

SPEAKER_01 42:21

Anyone else you would say she enters the room or what she does, she doesn't.

SPEAKER_04 42:26

She walks in, arms outstretched, compliment me.

SPEAKER_01 42:29

Yes. It's I mean it is her wedding day, just to remember. But it's wonderful. It is like, here I am. Yes.

SPEAKER_04 42:39

And then a man just starts chanting the wedding march to her.

SPEAKER_01 42:44

Yes, yes.

SPEAKER_04 42:45

Dumb, dumb, bad.

SPEAKER_01 42:47

This is what I mean by just a random collection of people, which is what Acorn Antiques always has that feeling of like just characters that have nothing to do with each other, just stood there trying to deliver lines that don't connect with anybody else in the scene. And it just, yeah, oh, it's very fun.

SPEAKER_04 43:07

Then we cut to the exterior of the registry office.

SPEAKER_01 43:12

Yes.

SPEAKER_04 43:13

Which where we get our first glimpse of the crowds.

SPEAKER_01 43:16

It was immediately obvious. It was not like um they'd managed to get a shot where you can just about see it in the background. They clearly there was no shot they could get. And so it just looks like the biggest group of people you've ever seen outside a registry office.

SPEAKER_04 43:34

Yeah. We cut to inside the registry office, no word is spoken. A ring is slid onto Meg's finger.

SPEAKER_01 43:42

Quite a big ring. I noticed.

SPEAKER_04 43:46

Fair. I don't know if you uh I wasn't looking at the size of her ring.

SPEAKER_01 43:49

I don't know, yeah, I don't know if you took that in, but it was large.

SPEAKER_04 43:55

And after which the groom attaches himself to her face.

SPEAKER_01 44:00

Yes, yes, so she was going on quite she was worrying quite a lot about Hugh, is it?

SPEAKER_04 44:04

Hugh is the the groom.

SPEAKER_01 44:06

Yes. Um he doesn't have quite such a commanding presence, you know.

SPEAKER_04 44:10

No.

SPEAKER_01 44:11

It doesn't have much at all. I'm sure he's great.

SPEAKER_04 44:14

I'm sure he's great, but and then I believe that's the end of part one of the the full episode. Is them in the registry office.

SPEAKER_01 44:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 44:24

I cut out the cathedral service.

SPEAKER_01 44:27

Yes, yeah. Thank you for that. It's bad enough when you're at a real one and you know the people and you can't get away. Um not that you know I don't uh enjoy people's uh weddings, but they can tend to drag. Doesn't sound like you enjoy them. I do. I I love a wedding. I often cry. Um but the ceremony has got to be quick sharp for me.

SPEAKER_04 44:58

And then we end with the the final shot was them leaving the cathedral.

SPEAKER_01 45:03

Yes.

SPEAKER_04 45:03

Down a pathway where the police are making sure that the crowds can't get to holding back the crowds.

SPEAKER_01 45:11

Yes. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 45:12

Which is would be unusual for For a for a motel owner in Birmingham.

SPEAKER_01 45:18

Yes. Um I I guess you just I don't know, you suspend disbelief, do you? You just go with it.

SPEAKER_04 45:24

I yeah, I think that's pretty much what Noel said at the time.

SPEAKER_01 45:28

It's quite clear she's a legend. Like you just have to get on with it. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 45:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 45:33

Uh he um the groom is all done up in you know, top hat and tails. So even though it's a registry office, it's not like um and she's wearing blue instead of white because that was what they would have done then. Nowadays I think you can do whatever you like, can't you? You could have a big white dress, however many times you've been married, who cares? Um but you know, she's got a you know, demure uh blue dress. Or don't I No, I don't mean demure, do I? I mean, you know, tasteful. Do I do I mean tasteful?

SPEAKER_04 46:04

The hat has an has a a whiff of an Easter bonnet about it, I think.

SPEAKER_01 46:08

I know that there was a period where hats like that were very popular for weddings. So I've got quite a few family photos where the hat comes uh and makes an appearance and they can be quite ornately decorated. This one has quite a lot of flowers. Um yes. Well, I d it reminds me of one of um one of Elizabeth Taylor's outfits. One of, yeah. That she ha she does a a sort of uh green um with a cowl thrown over her. I don't know if was that Eddie.

SPEAKER_04 46:40

You did say cowl cow.

SPEAKER_01 46:44

No, she hasn't got a cowl. No, she's not that cowl. Can't remember which one it is, but um yes, it's that's that same sort of uh a flowy, um very very nice dress, but yeah, they wouldn't have had a you know a big old white meringue.

SPEAKER_04 47:03

We're we're sticking with the 70s good a bit longer. Um in the mid-70s, she was the first woman to ever host the Royal Variety performance.

SPEAKER_01 47:14

I love a Royal Variety performance.

SPEAKER_04 47:16

Then you're gonna love this. So that's Nolly at the Royal Variety Show.

SPEAKER_01 47:26

Oh my goodness! When I said I love the Royal Variety show, I was thinking of older ones because I have to say, you know, Michael McIntyre and a couple of acts off Britain's Got Talent have nothing on what we just saw. She's got she's opening up the show with oh it's it's incredible. She's got Josephine Baker coming on, yeah. And then she's got a tribute to like vaudeville, she's got every kind of like circus act going on at once. It's it's incredible.

SPEAKER_04 48:02

Yeah, I I what I I got too excited. Um I want to see the whole show.

SPEAKER_01 48:11

I was gonna say I want to sit and watch the whole thing.

SPEAKER_04 48:13

Yeah. Oh but to focus on her. To focus on her.

SPEAKER_01 48:18

I one one thing we haven't spoken enough about in this episode is camp. Because that's what it's meant to be about.

SPEAKER_04 48:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 48:27

And this is the campest I'm seeing her so far. So far. She has two outfits. Yes. Outfit change. She is very sparkly in both.

SPEAKER_04 48:40

I mean, yes.

SPEAKER_01 48:41

Sparkles from head to toe. And just and she's coming out and she's yelling.

SPEAKER_04 48:49

It's that well, it's the that commanding presence. Yeah. Like you are not looking at anyone else, you are looking at her.

SPEAKER_01 48:57

Absolutely, absolutely. I mean, she's really, she's in charge of this moment.

SPEAKER_04 49:02

Yes. Um It's sort of like a it's like a little blue kind of it puts me in mind of like a sort of sailor, sailor adjacent with the collar.

SPEAKER_01 49:15

Yes. Um Yes, there's a there's a definite sailor inspired uh style to the first one. Yes. Which I think Barbara Streisand always has an outfit like that as well.

SPEAKER_04 49:27

Yes, yeah, I know the one you mean.

SPEAKER_01 49:29

Yes. Um and then the second one is the um the classic tightcuff uh flappy arm. I don't know what you call it.

SPEAKER_04 49:38

Okay, no idea. And in both, she's got a little flower in her hair.

SPEAKER_01 49:42

She has, doesn't she?

SPEAKER_04 49:43

Which um she changed the outfit but not the flower.

SPEAKER_01 49:46

I was disappointed by the same thing. I'd like we've had an outfit change. I need a flower change, please. Flower change for Miss Gordon.

SPEAKER_04 49:56

I imagine she forgot to take it out.

SPEAKER_01 49:59

Yes, yeah, yeah, probably. Because it didn't really go with the second one.

SPEAKER_04 50:02

Didn't go with the second one, and I don't think like that's all the first one.

SPEAKER_01 50:05

Well um Oh yes, no, you're right. Yeah, absolutely. She wouldn't want anything to be, you know, out of place. You can tell that. No, I just I love the way she's speaking because I think it is this is obviously being broadcast on TV, but it is more of a a style that you would use in a live show. It's very big. She's very big into a big crowd.

SPEAKER_04 50:26

And I feel like a I feel like part of the reason it feels camp is because it's almost from another era. I mean, obviously, as she demonstrates, this style was still around in the 70s, yeah. But it was definitely changing and evolving and um and yeah, like you say, everything is um it's big, it's clipped, the arms are gesticulating for days. She squeezes uh the thing I like about the way she talks is she squeezes every syllable out of a word.

SPEAKER_01 51:10

She does, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 51:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 51:11

She's getting the most out of it.

SPEAKER_04 51:13

Mm-hmm. And I it is in that clip. It's I couldn't find a really good clip of her doing it, but that woman can add an H to a W Like No one I know. Where? Where? What? What are you saying? Um which actually now I think about it is very Miss Babs from Acorn Antiques. She does that, doesn't she? Yeah. We're moving to the very late 70s now. Right. We're moving to 1979, and in a first for this podcast, we're moving to Christmas.

SPEAKER_00 51:49

Oh campus Christmas.

SPEAKER_04 51:52

This may be where that saying originated. I need to need to preface this video by saying that this aired during a real episode of Crossroads.

SPEAKER_01 52:13

Absolutely incredible! Is it still going? Oh, that was so good. Yeah, wasn't it? It's so good.

SPEAKER_04 52:26

There was a quote on one of the documentaries that I watched from one of the actresses that was in that.

SPEAKER_02 52:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 52:33

And she simply said, none of us could quite believe it was happening.

SPEAKER_01 52:42

It's it's wonderful. It's just, oh, so this is this is from the Christmas episode. Yes. And she's singing Need a Little Christmas.

SPEAKER_04 52:51

She's singing We Need a Little Christmas. Um to give it some context, one of the other characters in the show, they're having a little Christmas party, and he says, How about a song from you, Meg?

SPEAKER_01 53:04

And she doesn't take much persuading.

SPEAKER_04 53:06

She doesn't take breath. Okay, John, key of D.

SPEAKER_01 53:12

She does take key of D. She's a total pro. She's supposed to be a motel owner.

SPEAKER_04 53:18

Well, yes, she's supposed to be a motel owner, and then we have a full, full breaking of the fourth wall.

SPEAKER_00 53:24

Yes, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 53:26

She says directly down that camera and starts singing.

SPEAKER_01 53:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 53:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 53:34

She she's singing at us.

SPEAKER_04 53:36

She sing yes, she very much is singing at us.

SPEAKER_01 53:38

She keeps we keep like she keeps turning to find a new camera so that she can sing at us again.

SPEAKER_04 53:44

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 53:46

The opening where it's just her and the piano. The piano is awful. It's like it's like her and the pianist are at war. And then at a certain point comes in the trap, which is so um of its time. Yeah. It's got all this like extra kind of on the top of it. It's so funny. It's so funny. Her voice, I think, is great.

SPEAKER_04 54:15

I actually really enjoy her voice. Oh, yeah, she sings well, you know.

SPEAKER_01 54:20

And then maybe too well for a motel owner.

SPEAKER_04 54:23

But possibly. Um and then we start panning round.

SPEAKER_01 54:28

This is my favourite part. This is my favourite part, is the pan to the reactions. Because there's supposed to be people at a Christmas party enjoying this song by the motel owner or reacting to the song of the motel owner. The first one is a a child who quite obviously just waited to escape.

SPEAKER_04 54:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 54:47

Just please let me off this set. I don't want to be here.

SPEAKER_04 54:50

Yes. Agreed.

SPEAKER_01 54:52

The next woman I assume has wandered onto the wrong set from some kind of Victorian period piece.

SPEAKER_04 55:04

How dare you, that is Miss Tatum, and she deserves respect.

SPEAKER_01 55:13

She must have been born in about 1840. She's so old. I do love her style though. She's got a choker with a cameo on, which was very popular in the reign of Queen Victoria.

SPEAKER_04 55:31

And once again, I'm just gonna go back to they supplied their own costumes.

SPEAKER_01 55:35

Oh wow. She's a legend. Yeah. And then well, in comedy you always do a rule of three with the funniest one last. And they knew to do this one last.

SPEAKER_04 55:49

Yes, it's Kathy Staff.

SPEAKER_01 55:51

Yes, Nora Batty.

SPEAKER_04 55:52

Nora Batty for Last of the Summer Wine, uh playing Doris Luke Crossroads. And I don't I was about to say they linger on her.

SPEAKER_01 56:04

They do linger.

SPEAKER_04 56:05

No, it's more than a linger.

SPEAKER_01 56:07

It's an extended linger, yeah. And she doesn't know what to do. No, she doesn't know what to do with her face. No, I don't blame her, but it's very funny to watch.

SPEAKER_04 56:18

She sort of fixes into a look. Yes. And then you just sort of slowly see the life drain from her eyes. When she's like, cat, cat, cat. Then move on to someone else. Cat. And they just don't come up.

SPEAKER_01 56:40

They just don't move on. Oh, it's so good. It's so good. Oh my goodness. Yeah. Just oh so funny.

SPEAKER_04 56:54

Yeah. Yeah, and it just is camp personified. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 57:02

Because um you've already got the like the excess of it being Christmas and all these people around, and it's like she's gonna get up and do a song for everybody.

SPEAKER_04 57:13

Dressed immaculately in white.

SPEAKER_01 57:15

Yes, again, immaculate. Yeah. Um might have been chiffon, might have been a Georgette. Um don't know. Uh couldn't see the weave. Um and yeah, the reactions from this crowd of oddballs, it's just so good.

SPEAKER_04 57:33

Like they're all having the worst time ever.

SPEAKER_01 57:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 57:37

Pretending not to. No, no. Wells. There was a bit where two of them are pretending not to.

SPEAKER_01 57:43

Right, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 57:44

And the rest of them are sat stony face. Oh we need.

SPEAKER_01 57:50

Yes, so there's bits where they join in with the song, and it's not enthusiastic.

SPEAKER_04 57:55

It's not, but I wonder if they daren't sing over her.

SPEAKER_01 57:59

Oh possible. That's very possible, yeah. Oh, it's so good.

SPEAKER_04 58:05

Yes. It's it's ridonculous. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 58:10

I've really enjoyed that. If if people aren't watching all the clips but they want to watch just one, do that one.

SPEAKER_04 58:15

That's the one.

SPEAKER_01 58:17

So good.

SPEAKER_04 58:17

Well, that's the one, and this next one is the one, I think, because we're gonna think that about all of them, aren't we? Well, this is camp icon behaviour.

SPEAKER_01 58:26

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 58:27

So, as we've said, in 1981 she got sacked. She still went to the Christmas party.

SPEAKER_00 58:35

Of course. To sing.

SPEAKER_04 58:37

And she did a number.

SPEAKER_01 58:50

The icon, the legend, the diva that she is. This it I scratch what I said about the last one. If you only watch one of them, watch this. This is incredible.

SPEAKER_04 59:04

I I love the fact that we've gone from you knowing nothing to going the icon, the legend.

SPEAKER_01 59:09

Oh my god, I want to know everything about her. I want to be her when I grow up.

SPEAKER_04 59:15

So she goes to the office Christmas party.

SPEAKER_01 59:18

Yeah. There's so many people.

SPEAKER_04 59:21

There are so many people.

SPEAKER_01 59:22

Obviously, it's a big production, but everybody's at the Christmas party. Oh god.

SPEAKER_04 59:25

Oh, this isn't a party just for crossroads. This is like a channel party.

SPEAKER_01 59:30

Oh my goodness. Oh, how incredible.

SPEAKER_04 59:33

So she turns up, she walks on stage in a full funeral veil.

SPEAKER_01 59:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 59:39

Which we don't really see anymore, but uh people used to dress.

SPEAKER_01 59:44

She's in satin and chiffon.

SPEAKER_04 59:45

Yes, she is. But it's black this time.

SPEAKER_01 59:47

And yeah, the veil is all the way down. It's yeah, fully committed. Oh, imagine. Imagine her just putting that on, like knowing what she's gonna do. Just getting ready for the moment when she walks out there in front of everyone to do this. Oh, she's incredible.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:06

I as I said to you when I press play, if I ever get fired from a job, this is how I'm going.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:13

We could all learn from this.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:14

We could.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:15

So she steps out on stage, the music has started, and she draws back the veil to a massive round of applause.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:23

They love it.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:24

They do.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:24

She's doing some like little fake tears that she's wiping away. She's she's she's fully committing.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:30

And she launches into a song. Basically, a song that is saying um it's about a romance that's gone sour.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:40

I don't know this song, by the way.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:41

I I don't really know.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:44

But yes, it's kind of it's about trying to like somebody being like trying to murder their spouse.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:50

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:51

Or, you know, partner, whatever, but it's in a sort of comic book way.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:55

Yeah, we we wouldn't really do it now, I don't think.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:58

No, possibly not.

SPEAKER_04 1:01:00

But yeah, it's a very sort of oh, I didn't know there was any problem until you whack me around the head, sort of thing. Yeah, yeah. Um And it's obvious from the beginning that she's singing it about her sacking.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:14

Every every word of it she's fully using to to yeah, be about this situation. Mm-hmm. It's wonderful.

SPEAKER_04 1:01:23

So she's singing about She's singing about it. We know what she's singing about, but she's not being overt about it necessarily.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:32

No, well she's she's overt in that everybody there understands. Yes, but this is a song that's written for a different purpose, so it's it you know, they but they get it. And that to me was enough. That is diva behaviour enough because that's a big deal to go out and do that. And then she just ups the ups the ante.

SPEAKER_04 1:01:52

Oh boy, does she up the ante. She goes, she walks to the side of the stage and is handed a picture in a frame, which we can't see. We can't see at first, and then she walks back to the microphone and she says, I'll never forget that night at the crossroads, and you suddenly go, Oh, she's Oh, she's really doing it. I'll never forget that night at the crossroads when you said all good things must come to an end. You had a strange sort of look in your eye, and then you smiled and I knew you meant it. I mean the fact I have this committed to me.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:30

Yes, you do, yeah. But it is an amazing moment.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:34

And she she shows us the the photo of the person that Or she takes it even further. Yeah. Yeah. She so uh uh I can't rem I can't remember his name, but she shows this the photo of this guy and parades him. She does she's just showing everybody this photo.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:52

This man sacked me.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:53

This man sacked me. This is who we're talking about just in case anyone was left in any doubt, which they weren't. Here he is.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:00

And if you need me for anything, you can contact me via the news of the world.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:05

Which is so like oh she's just she's just iconic.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:12

It's absolutely like taking control of this moment. Like I this is why I say we could all learn from this, because this this moment has of the this sacking has obviously really hurt her.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:26

And she's like, what am I gonna do about it? I'm going to do the most iconic diva performance I could possibly do in front of all the people that you know, like some of them will have been on her side, but others will have been like part of it, and there's all different people there.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:43

The vibe that I get is that the majority of people were on her side. I'm sure they were. The majority of people because although it was I think it was the producer that sacked her, but it the order came from higher up, basically. Um, and I think the person that she's showing in that photo is the higher up person. But we don't know if he's in the room no, I'm assuming he's not, but I would love it if he was.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:12

I the thing is, I feel like she would do that either way.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:16

Oh, yes, she absolutely would.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:18

Yeah, and there will definitely have been people that work with him.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:22

Oh, a hundred percent.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:24

That are part of that decision, and or and you know, uh what we know from you know, big organisations is that some will have not supported her because they will have sided with it for their own reasons. So she's she's just going out there, whoever is in the audience, she's like, I'm going to do this. It's it's an incredible it's really bl brave actually, and uh she does not do it in a way that suggests she's second guessing herself at all.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:52

She is so committed, and also she manages to do it without any kind of bitterness.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:01

Yeah, it doesn't seem it's it's it's literally like okay, that happened. This is how I'm going to deal with it.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:08

Yeah, yeah, completely.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:09

And I I I love it. I think it's it obviously it does show her kind of hurt from it. But yeah, like you say, it's not it's not a bitterness, it's not that. It's like it's more of a just this is me. I'm gonna show you who I am because you didn't care when you got rid of me, basically. And the and putting your voice back into that when you felt like just shunned. Um yeah, what an amazing thing to do. I love that. I absolutely love it.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:43

So that is all of our clips for this week. Um, what do you think I well, I guess first of all, actually, you didn't know anything about her. So um what are your thoughts?

SPEAKER_01 1:05:56

I didn't know anything about her, and um Now well, now clearly I'm a fan and I want to know everything about her. Um but yeah, she she I was just thinking she represents kind of uh a really strong woman who's strong, like she's very feminine in the way she dresses and well turned out and you know, not to like gender things, but like, you know, she's got these very like um flouncy chiffon outfits out on all the time, and like I I think there's something really that is camp about that. Like um camp has always been associated with like drag, and drag queens often have like really strong women who are strong in their looks that they look up to, and she feels like she fits in that kind of genre of woman, like a matriarch who's got a really you know um a well-turned out look and a a kind of a real sense of herself, and it's interesting the power that she has, you know. You she projects it in the clips that we saw, but you were talking about real examples where like she's doing things um uh not acting them, but she's going and doing projects that where she is uh in a powerful role. So she has this kind of like um yeah, real uh strength to her, but in in her own way that isn't you know determined by like the maleness of the worlds that she's operating within. She she manages to be a woman and be herself within those. And there's something I think that like that that kind of is iconic, you know, it is like icon behaviour. I think she seems like that sort of person. Um there's a you know, there's others like I can think of sort of um I don't know, I don't know. I I I don't liken her to anything anyone else, but I just I really think there's something beautifully strong about her, um, and she's very, very cool. So I didn't know anything before going in, but I totally see why she she would and should be a Camp Icon, but I'm I'm just surprised that I'm not like I wasn't already familiar, we're not already talking about her.

SPEAKER_04 1:08:22

So I think normally at this point we kind of talk about legacy and stuff, and I think for me in this instance, I think it's a real shame that her legacy was her sacking. Yeah. That is kind of the the big thing that people tend to remember, but actually before that moment in her life, she'd had this amazing career, like she'd studied TV production in the States, she'd been on the West End, she was the first female TV executive, she was interviewing prime ministers. I think she did a show where she got a pilot's licence, and um she had this reputation when she was doing her sort of lifestyle shows of like she'd do anything, she'd throw herself into anything. Yeah, she was sort of like a a precursor to Annika Rice, I guess. Really up-to-the-minute reference, there, isn't it, for the listeners.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:33

I do see what you mean.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:35

But yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:36

The mention of Annika Rice makes me laugh.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:39

Um So I think like what her legacy is and what her legacy should be are two very different things.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:47

Yeah, that is I d I definitely agree, and that's something we haven't had so much before. Yeah. It feels like um Scylla and Sue were cemented where they should be.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:57

Yeah, yeah, I think so. Um I I do want to take this opportunity actually to direct everybody to nolgordon.co.uk. That's it's spelt N-O-E-L-E. Um it's uh it's a Nol Gordon Bible, like they have archived so much stuff over there, and it's been really useful in prepping for this. Um so if you would like to know more about her, that is where I recommend that you start.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:29

If you're not really a reader, um I'd say go and watch Nolly on ITVX because that gives you a real kind of sense of I think I remember that coming out and I must have missed it, and now I think, yeah, I want to check both of those things out because it just feels like um like you say, just doing a down to the sacking or just you know, this person who was in a soap opera that's now not on the air, is really a shame when she's such a a powerful figure and such an interesting and just the last clip we watched where she takes control of her moment just makes me think what an what a a cool powerful woman that um we could all you know use role models like that who just absolutely know how to how to deal with anything in life, you know?

SPEAKER_04 1:11:24

Yeah, absolutely love that.

unknown 1:11:27

Woo!

SPEAKER_04 1:11:29

Well, that was the Noel Gordon episode of Camp Icons. Um you can follow us on social media at Camp Icons Podcast. That's at Camp Icons Podcast. And are we on Facebook? We we do have a Facebook page. It's Camp Icons Podcast. Please follow it because I set it up. And don't really know if people use it anymore, but we would very much appreciate it. You can find in the episode description links to all of the videos that we have reviewed today, um, some of them in slightly more extended forms than we did because I uh was just conscious that we probably didn't want to watch eight minutes of stuff. Um but yeah, it's all out there. And as I said during the main show, please go and check out nollgordon.co.uk. They are doing lots of wonderful work over there. Did you enjoy that one?

SPEAKER_01 1:12:29

I enjoyed it very much, really did.

SPEAKER_04 1:12:31

Yes, bit of a different one, finding out about someone that we maybe didn't know so much about. But um thank you for listening, and we'll be back next week. Thank you.