What No One Tells You About Postpartum Nutrition & Starting Solids | Courtney Garfoot, Juni Pediatrics.

In this episode, Rashelle sits down with Courtney Garfoot, clinical nutritionist and feeding therapist from Juni Pediatrics, for an honest and informative conversation about nourishing yourself and your baby through the postpartum period and beyond.

Courtney breaks down postpartum depletion — what it is, why it affects up to 50% of mothers, and how to spot the signs. She shares practical advice on blood tests to request, key nutrients to watch, and realistic food and supplement strategies for time-poor, exhausted mums.

They also dive deep into starting solids — from when to begin, baby-led weaning vs purées, allergen introduction, and how to create calm, stress-free family mealtimes from the very start.

In this episode:

• What is postpartum depletion and how long can it last?
• Key blood tests every new mum should ask for
• How to stock your freezer to support postpartum recovery
• Breastfeeding nutrition, hydration, and common food myths debunked
• When and how to start solids (and why iron-rich foods come first)
• Introducing allergens safely and confidently
• The one thing Courtney wants every new mum to do right now

If this episode resonated with you, please leave a review and share it with a mum who needs it. We're so glad you're part of our inner circle. 💛

Want to learn more or need feeding support? Find Courtney Garfoot over on her socials or head to Juni Pediatrics to get in touch and book a consultation.

💛 If this episode helped you, please follow the podcast, leave a review, and share it with a mum who needs it. You're so welcome inside the circle.

Connect with Mummas Circle:
🌸 Website: mummascircle.com
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Connect with Mummas Circle:
🌸 Website: www.mummascircle.com
📘 Facebook Community: Mummas Circle
Instagram: @mummascircle_
📺 YouTube: @MummasCircle

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Hi everyone, I'm Rochelle and welcome to another episode of Inside Mumma's Circle. Today we have Court Garfoot from Juni Pediatrics, who is a clinical nutritionist chatting about all things nutrition. So grab a cup of coffee, uh, get comfy and let's dive right in. Welcome Courtney. Thank you so much for joining us today for this episode of Mumma's Circle. It is my pleasure to be here. Thank you for inviting me in today. So we would love to hear a little bit more about you as a clinical nutritionist and uh a little bit about your journey into what you're what you do and why.

SPEAKER_01 0:28

Yeah, so I'm a clinical nutritionist and feeding therapist. A lot of what I do these days is focused on that pediatric kind of area, but before that, I did do a lot of women's health, that side of things as well. I have been practicing for close to five years now. So I did come to nutrition later on with my own experiences, as a lot of people do. So it was my own experiences with chronic illness that kind of led me down this path, and then land in women's health because that's what I had experienced and what was happening to me. Had a baby and then fully lent into the pediatric space, which was an area that I was always in a little bit, but yeah, fully went into that more recently. A lot of my work in women's health, though, did obviously centre around fertility, pregnancy hormones, postpartum, that kind of picture. And also the work in pediatrics has then flowed through into how that impacts the experience of motherhood, matrescence, how we show up for our kids, particularly if we have been depleted during pregnancy and all that kind of thing, how we can then support that mother to support the child.

SPEAKER_00 1:35

And I think that's really I think I love the journey that you've had yourself because that's how we sort of connected, right? You came and did some chats with our mums uh in our mums groups for Mumma's Circle, which was really amazing. I learnt a lot as well. And even being a mum of my oldest is nearly 18, I still learnt a lot around nutrition and postpartum nutrition and what's important. And I think that I'd love to hear basically what you talked about back then was around that postpartum depletion. And I'd love for you to share your a bit of knowledge around postpartum depletion for anyone who's listening today.

SPEAKER_01 2:08

Yeah, absolutely. So postpartum depletion is one of those kind of newer terms, I guess, that's coming around now. It's not so much defined medically, so there's no real this is what you need to be diagnosed with postpartum depletion. It's more a cluster of symptoms that we're realizing can make up this condition syndrome that we're now calling postpartum depletion. Os Dr. Oscar Serelax has done a lot of research, written books in this area, and is really insightful to look at. And his work has found that it on average affects about 50% of mothers, and if it's not addressed, it can last up to 10 years. Wow, that's a long time when you're thinking about that postpartum period. Yeah, well, it we know it takes two years for those hormones to reset postpartum. So, but by then most parents are like many are having a second child. And if you're already going into that one depleted, it just keeps flowing on.

SPEAKER_00 3:11

And it snowballs and snowballs, right? Yeah, absolutely. I think one of the really key things that you would also bring up in in our Mama's Circles chats was around making sure that you're getting your checked. So, in terms of your blood test postpartum, what are some of the things that you would typically look for which would bring together those symptoms or around that postpartum depletion?

SPEAKER_01 3:34

Yeah, so we'd be definitely looking at things like an iron studies, vitamin D, vitamin B12, zinc, and anything else following on from pregnancy that we might want to follow up with again. So if there's been gestational diabetes in pregnancy, then we want to check on how those insulin levels are doing as well. Maybe do a HBA1C to check how responsive those insulin levels have been, things like that. Really important that we should be getting postpartum bloods done at six weeks postpartum, and then you want to be getting bloods done every 12 months. But if symptoms change, you can have more bloods done. So they might have been fine at six months, like six weeks postpartum, and then at six months postpartum, iron levels have fallen off a cliff, and that's when the postpartum depletion is hitting. It might be things changing. So where we're at with breastfeeding, like whether we've stopped breastfeeding or cycle has come back, and that can impact our nutrient levels as well. Returning to work can impact a whole lot of things from whether you're pumping, so that can impact from a breastfeeding perspective what nutrient supply we need, because if we're pumping, we need to supply more milk than we would if we were direct feeding. But also, if we're then juggling work and children, we're eating less, and that can also contribute to the nutrient deficiencies as well. And the tricky thing with that postpartum depletion picture is a lot of the symptoms of postpartum depletion are typically that of a normal motherhood experience.

SPEAKER_00 5:06

Right, okay, so I would love for you to expand on that.

SPEAKER_01 5:09

So things like fatigue, brain fog, irritability. It's like you're talking to me. It's the thing that we go, oh yeah, but you're a new mum. Yeah. But it's really important that we do get those things checked because the amount of times I've seen women who might have been told that you're a new mum, it's to be expected, or mums are fatigued, kind of thing. We push and push and finally get a blood test done, and they need an iron transfusion because the iron is so low. It's not enough to just accept that this is what it's supposed to be. And that this is how I'm gonna feel forever and ever. Yeah, absolutely. It's definitely worth getting some blood tests done to one see if there is something going on there, and if there is, we can fix it, but also to if it's not something there, work out what is going on because it's important that you are enjoying your motherhood experience, not feeling completely trash the whole time, and then looking back, going, what the hell happened that first year? I've got no idea because you're in such a sleep-deprived, fatigued state, whether that is looking at it from a biochemical perspective, and is it something in those blood tests that is contributing to that fatigue and everything else, or is it a support picture where things like your mumma's circles and mumma's groups are really important for providing that support in that postpartum period all around?

SPEAKER_00 6:34

Yeah, I remember like when I had my second and just hearing you say about that it's snowballs from one project, because there was literally like two years and four months between my first and second, and then two years between my second and third. And so I can definitely see how it was such a snowball effect, actually, now that you've said that all these years later. Yeah, and how and how long was it before you were feeling good again? Oh I would say years actually, I would say years because you then just go, that's just because I've got three kids and I'm busy and all of that. I remember sitting there after I'd had my second, like probably six months after I had her, and just like just falling asleep. Just I'm like, come on, come on, it's okay, just get onto it, you'll be fine. But yeah, that's uh that's really interesting. Looking at that from a nutrient perspective is interesting, it's fascinating.

SPEAKER_01 7:20

Absolutely, and even me myself, like my iron levels dropped at six months. I was like, what the heck is going on? Yeah, and yeah, it can happen to all of us. It can happen to all of us that you just don't realize when you're caught up in that bubble of everything that's happening. That it should be a reasonable. Yeah, as well. Do you check in with yourself too? And I think when we're also looking at picture of postpartum depression, postpandom anxiety, like a lot of that can be nutrient-related as well, particularly that depression picture. Like, if your iron levels are low, you're already getting interrupted sleep, it's very normal for your body to feel flat and down, and it can all just once again snowball together.

SPEAKER_00 8:07

Yeah, wow. Okay, so what are some on this on postpartum depletion? What are some of the key nutrients that gets uh most depleted after birth? And obviously, we've talked a little bit more about the symptoms, but I'd love to hear more what are the main ones and what are some of the signs for mums to look out for in particular?

SPEAKER_01 8:23

Yeah, so nutrients that we're looking at are particularly that iron, vitamin D, B12. There's a few more like your minerals like zinc and magnesium that can also be quite depleted following pregnancy and into that postpartum period. And in terms of those symptoms we're looking for, it is that fatigue, brain fog, irritability, hair loss, sense of overwhelm. Like it really is that what we commonly see as a postpartum picture. But I think part of that also is that just because it's common doesn't mean that it is normal. So the hair loss, absolutely, there is going to be some hair loss in that what we call the fourth trimester, like that first 12 weeks. But it's when it gets past that 12 weeks and it's getting excessive that we're like something might be going on here. It's worth a bit of investigation there.

SPEAKER_00 9:15

Yeah, let's check that out because hold on, I should not be losing clumps of my hair sort of sort of situation. We get that a lot in our mums groups, actually. Yes. Yes, okay.

SPEAKER_01 9:24

Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. So it's those kind of things that we're looking at in terms of what does this whole picture look like? Also, what do we like before birth? So, in terms of that third trimester where baby is sucking up so many nutrients, like if we look at once again iron, baby is really stoppiling that iron in the third trimester because they don't get a lot from breast milk. So they need enough iron to last them four to six months until they're starting solids. There is a little bit in formula, but baby in tummy doesn't know that's coming. So, what we then see is that it's very common to drop a bit in third trimester. Many women will have iron infusions in the third trimester, things like that. But if those levels haven't come up enough and then we have a bleed during birth and things like that, it can drop again quite quickly.

SPEAKER_00 10:14

Oh, interesting. We one thing just on that six-month mark is just something I didn't know about until I had you at one of our sessions was around, we're just gonna jump over into the solids just quickly. Because what I found really fascinating is when you're starting solids with your little one around the six-month mark, it's highly recommended now to start with iron-enriched foods like your meat and your leafy greens, because the iron stores get depleted at six months from for the child. Is that correct?

SPEAKER_01 10:41

Yeah, so they start depleting around that four to six month mark, and it's not a fall off the cliff like they have iron one day and it's all gone. It is gradual, which means that you want to start introducing those foods first because when they start solids, we're not expecting them to actually consume a lot. So once they are consuming, those foods are already familiar, and they will be eating those rather than trying to introduce them once their iron stores are really dropping around that seven to eight month mark where we would expect them to be actually eating a bit more solids at that point. Well, I found that really fascinating. That was something that I learned in the models group when you came along. And it's interesting that the shift away from your cereals and things like that were so enriched with vitamins and things where we can just do meats and things like that.

SPEAKER_00 11:27

Yeah, I could think because even for me with my girls, that was something that you wouldn't really start with. Right. The meats was not something that you would really start with. But now I think I love that's that perception or that myth is changing. Yeah. And there's a really there's a reason why. So that's that's great. So I wanted to talk about obviously new mums are exhausted, sleep-deprived time poor. And they're often eating whatever's quick and what's easy to grab, one-handed, all of those things. What's a realistic approach to replenishing their food, like their nutrients and things? Are we talking supplements, food, both? What is something, if someone came to you, what would you be recommending off the bat?

SPEAKER_01 12:06

Yeah, sure. So I guess the first point that's often missed is that it's actually recommended to take your prenatal until you finish breastfeeding. Huh. So I've learnt something new right now. Interesting. So a lot of people have the baby and are just like, oh yeah, prenatal, done. But no, you actually need to keep taking those until you finish breastfeeding. So that can help. That can help. And then from a food perspective as well, like we do need to make sure that we are getting lots of food in, particularly if we're breastfeeding. Even if we're not breastfeeding, recovery from pregnancy and childbirth is a lot. So making sure that we are getting a lot of regular food in. Stockpiling the freezer with food portioned out. Don't just put a it can be easy, put a whole massive casserole dish in the freezer. It is not useful when you need something for lunch.

SPEAKER_00 12:59

Oh, and that's so true, right? Because then you look at it, you're like, oh, that's a big meal. I don't want to defrost it, then I don't want to throw some of it out. Actually, that is super practical. Okay, thank you for that.

SPEAKER_01 13:07

Yes, so putting it into containers, uh, one or two portions can be super helpful. It's also quicker to defrost when you just need something. Utilise anyone around you who is willing to help to cook food. Just that the neighbour, the aunt, the uncle, the sister, yeah. What can I do? Load up that freezer with food, particularly if you don't necessarily have people on the ground. And that was our situation in terms of all extended families interstate. So we staggered everyone's visits, and essentially was like, while you're here, you fill out the freezer, we will use it all before the next person comes, and then you fill up the freezer. That is perfect. I love that. That's really sound advice. That's great. Fill it up. Warm foods are really great, very nourishing in that early post-partner period. They can be a little bit tricky to eat one hand by juggling a baby. So once baby starts moving around or wriggling around a little bit more, they do get a bit trickier to have, but it is a good base as well. The other thing with freezing foods is freezing components of foods can be helpful. So you might find that freezing a spaghetti bolognese sauce, and then you can do it with different types of pasta, you can do it as a shepherd's pie, you can do it in in pies, gives you variety rather than oh my god, it's another lasagna.

SPEAKER_00 14:23

Yeah, that's very true, actually, because you kind of get sick of the same thing after a while, right? So that's actually really good. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 14:29

You can also freeze breakfast options. That's like some people have freeze like breakfast burritos or like taco bowls and things like that. You can warm up for breakfast, is another way of doing that. One of my favourite postpartum stories, and it was a mum that I worked with quite early on in my career. Her mother-in-law, bless her, had nine children herself, so knew what she was doing. And when this lady had her baby, her in-laws were like, By the way, we bought a deep freezer three months ago, and we have been stocking it with food. Oh, and they didn't cook for the first three months. That's amazing. That is how you support that is how you support a new mother, that is what you do, and like it brings tears to my eyes now because that is just incredible support.

SPEAKER_00 15:16

That would have given like such a great head start for that woman, right? Like that, just to feel that.

SPEAKER_01 15:21

Yeah, and exactly, it's not just the practical aspect of having food sorted, like the emotional attachment to that of someone caring so much to have done that is phenomenal. So, yeah, there is so many options in terms of freezing foods. You can also freeze anzag biscuits, which I found out when I was past postpartum. That's good. That's good to know. Okay. Anzite biscuits are actually a really great snack for, once again, one-handed eating, but also great for the breastfeeding mother because they've got oats and everything like that in there as well that are really great to support supply. Yeah, and you can freeze so many foods. So many of our, you know, your curries, your stir fries, your pastas, casseroles, cheese, so many of those foods can be frozen perfectly fine. Just don't even think of it.

SPEAKER_00 16:09

Yeah, and is there things that we can put in it to help make them more nutritionally dense bone broth and things like that? Would you sort of encourage more vegetable-driven as well?

SPEAKER_01 16:18

Yeah, absolutely. So your bone broths are great. Loading up on vegetables for sure, you can often add an extra vegetable or two to a recipe. If I'm doing anything that's blended, so if I do a curry sauce that gets blended at the end, I'll throw a tin of beans in as well. You don't notice it once it's all blended in together, and it does help up that fibre and nutritional intake. Nuts and seeds are another good one that you can throw into things like hemp seeds, sunflower seeds, pumpkin seeds. They can all be thrown into stir fries and things like that quite easily as well.

SPEAKER_00 16:52

Yeah, nice. And in terms of supplements, I don't know everybody is different, and I know every every person is a different a different space in their journey and their in postpartum. Is there any supplements that you would be like your go-to? Like you should definitely have some of these handy after you finish your antenatal vitamins.

SPEAKER_01 17:12

Yeah, so definitely the prenatal until you finish breastfeeding. Other than that, it is really up to the person at the end of the day and what their diet looks like, what blood work looks like, where we're sitting in terms of your dietary preferences as well, things like that, very individual from that basis. You can go too high with something, so like I wouldn't, for example, recommend just doing an iron supplement because you can go too high in iron and it'd be problematic. So it is worth testing before going down specific supplement path there.

SPEAKER_00 17:46

Oh, that's really good to know. So, in terms of the breastfeeding mother versus the pregnant mother, would you say that their nutritional needs are similar or very different?

SPEAKER_01 17:58

It is a little bit different because we do have nutrients in terms of breast milk that are maternal dependent and maternal independent. So something like B12 is maternal dependent. So the amount mum has impacts the amount that's in the breast milk. So mum has more B12, breast milk has more B12. We know that mothers who have more B12 in the third trimester of pregnancy have children who sleep better. Oh, so just say that again, please. So mothers who have high levels of B12 in the third trimester of pregnancy have babies who sleep better. So, and you know, there is a little bit of transfer through breast milk as well of that B12, too. Calcium, for example, is maternal independent. Does not matter how much mum has, breast milk will stay the same, which means that the body will find it. So if mum isn't having enough through diet, it will take it from bones and teeth. So there are certain nutrients that are very important to have while breastfeeding compared to in pregnancy and in different stages of pregnancy as well. Nutritional needs do change. From an overall intake perspective, it is very dependent on person to person. Some people will find that their supply changes drastically depending on how much they have eaten. Other people will find that it doesn't vary as much. It depends on person. Hydration is also very important for that breastfeeding mother and making sure we are very hydrated to support that milk supply.

SPEAKER_00 19:34

Yeah, okay. So just like normal water, like filtered water is ideal, right? For just keeping up that that hydration constantly for mums. And I do notice that in our mums' groups as well. If anyone's feeding, I'm like, do you need water? Yeah, do you need water? Because I just remember feeding and I'm like, I'm so thirsty. Like all of a sudden, it just would come on. And in and around breastfeeding as well, making sure that I was always hydrated, I felt like I would have a better feed, like my child would have a better feed.

SPEAKER_01 19:56

So absolutely. The recommendation is three litres a day of water while breastfeeding.

SPEAKER_00 20:00

Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_01 20:01

Which is a lot, which also, when you're looking after a baby, can be one of the things that you forget to do. And it you might have that water bottle at the start of the day, and then by lunchtime it's empty and you just don't get back to it again. We can look at hydration powders like your hydrolytes and sodium are quite popular. Hydra mama, things like Mama and Me, there's quite a few that are quite popular. Um, but I would not drop that water intake as well. So still try and keep up that three litres. Don't be like, oh, I've had a hydration once I only need one liter today. You still need your three litres.

SPEAKER_00 20:34

So that's actually a really good point. So I was gonna say, do those sort of supplements, those sort of drinks, those hydration drinks, are they helpful for new mums from your perspective?

SPEAKER_01 20:45

Yeah, absolutely they can be helpful, particularly for supporting that hydration side of things. I struggled a lot with breastfeeding. I had a child that just didn't feed well. I breastfed directly for five and a half months, and he never did a feed under 90 minutes. Wow. So we had a lot of issues with weight from about the four-month mark because I was like, I need to, I can't just sit here and feed you all day. I actually need to go do things.

SPEAKER_00 21:10

I need to live and connect and be a human being. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:13

Yeah, and like up to that point, like I could feed all day, and then I I couldn't, and his weight started dropping. So that was when we started pumping and things like that. And once I was pumping, I really did notice the hydration made a big difference. So yeah, it definitely and yeah, sorry, step that back. Hydration did make a big difference, and I would use a rotation of them depending on what flavour and what was on sale and things like that. But yeah, it does definitely help with that hydration side of things. It's not a tick fixer supply issue because you do need to make sure you're eating enough as well, but it is a tool in the toolbox, I guess, to support that breastfeeding mum as well.

SPEAKER_00 21:53

Awesome. That's really good to know, actually, because I often see these now, and obviously I'm not breastfeeding anymore, but I often see them and go, are they actually helpful or is it Something that is just uh something to do or something to have. So that's really good to know.

SPEAKER_01 22:04

It can also sorry it can also be a taste thing as well because three litres of water can get boring real fast. So correct. Correct. So anything that can make it a little bit more exciting can help as well. And I know the mum and me ones for Andrew's kitchen has the motherhood hydration powder. They have a few different flavours, so having a bit of a rotation can also keep it interesting too.

SPEAKER_00 22:28

Good to know. There are a lot of myths around what mums should and shouldn't eat while breastfeeding. So, such as like spicy foods, dairy, caffeine. What actually evidence-based and what can what is actually evidence-based and what can mums stop worrying about when they're feeding?

SPEAKER_01 22:45

Yeah, so a lot of it is myth. Unless your child has an intolerance or an allergy, you can enjoy a wide range of diet. The spicy one I find quite interesting because I can guarantee you there is no mother in India avoiding spicy foods. Correct.

SPEAKER_00 23:01

Ever has.

unknown 23:02

Correct.

SPEAKER_00 23:03

And then kids start on spicy foods. I literally had this conversation the other day with my kids. So yes, sorry, continue. Continue.

SPEAKER_01 23:09

No, absolutely. So it's yeah, one of those things that I think in a Western society we have, for whatever reason, decided that children need really bland foods, uh, but they actually don't. So even when we're breastfeeding, you can have a wide range of diet. So in terms of the spicy food, like I had someone recently who was like, Don't need to avoid broccoli while breastfeeding. I was like, no, broccoli is completely fine.

SPEAKER_00 23:33

Where did they get that from? That's wild. Like where? It's just wild, right? How they how people yeah, anyway, sorry, continue.

SPEAKER_01 23:41

Yeah, and I think as well it can be, you know, that person at a party who has some really meaning advice that helped them while breastfeeding. Yeah, the storage that just perpetuates and keeps going. And I think we can also be very guilty of something working one time. And we're like, oh, I had a really good feed and I didn't eat broccoli yesterday. So I'm gonna hold on to that. So yeah, in terms of dietary-wise, that's perfectly fine. Caffeine can impact sleep in babies. So, in terms of actual baby health, not too much of a concern, but it's more the impact of it on sleep that is a concern. So, once again, though, if your baby is tolerating it, fine. If you have a child who's up all night, maybe look at how many coffees we're having and reassess the picture.

SPEAKER_00 24:33

Is there a timing thing on that, even? Is it if you having a coffee maybe while they're feeding, is that a better option so that it's not transferring, or you just it's just really look at it from your baby's perspective and how they're handling it.

SPEAKER_01 24:45

Yeah, potentially I mean, potentially in terms of metabolism, is then gonna take longer to metabolise into the milk, that kind of thing. But I would just monitor your baby and see how they're going with it. Yeah. It's also alcohol is an interesting side of things. The I don't think the rules in Australia have officially changed, but the research is changing that area around how much alcohol is actually transferred into breast milk. So, yeah, there is some change happening there, but nothing I don't think has officially changed in terms of the recommendations yet. But it is one to keep an eye out on what is changing there.

SPEAKER_00 25:23

Yeah, interesting. So we've already touched now on starting solids, so we want to deep dive into that because I know that we it's such an important topic in our mums groups because solids can elicit such a stressful response for a lot of our mums out there and dads. So when it comes to starting solids, there is a conflicting guidance around what you should do, what you shouldn't do. So, currently, what would be the advice that you would give to a new parent just about to start their solids journey?

SPEAKER_01 25:50

Okay, so with solids, we want to start from six months. We really want to avoid starting before six months where possible. Sometimes it is indicated to start before four months, before six months, definitely not before four months. So, in that four to six month mark, there's a little bit of leeway in there, but really hold off as close to that six-month mark as we can because it's better for gut health. So, the more established that gut is before we start bringing food into it, the better that gut health is gonna be lifelong. We're just getting that foundation right there from the start. In terms of baby lead weaning versus purees, it really depends on what works best for your family. The relationship with food later on is very similar, and as mothers who are further down the track will tell you by the time they get to 9, 10, 12 months, everything's going in the mouth anyway. So, yes. It really is a case of yeah, whatever works best for your family and for you. Some people find puree's a whole lot less stressful, some people find baby-led weaning less stressful. It really is what works for you. We want to look for signs of readiness before starting solids, so being able to sit in a high chair. We don't need to be able to sit independently. Most children won't be able to do that until close to that eight, nine-month mark to wait for a child to sit on their own before starting solids is a long time to wait. They need to be interested in food, so watching you eat, reaching out for things, that kind of behavior, and putting things in their mouth. So the more they're putting things in their mouth, the more they're desensitizing that gag reflex, which we need for them to be able to eat solids as well. It's really important that we do introduce solids, and even if we are doing purees, like progress through that baby lead weaning, because the muscles that they're using in eating and strengthening those oral motor muscles are the muscles that they use for speech. So if we stay on pureees for a long, long, long time, they can then struggle with speech because they haven't moved their tongue around as much and use those muscles in the way that we need them to.

SPEAKER_00 28:03

Yeah, okay, no, that that makes complete sense because you've seen that natural progression, right? From the puree's and whatever kind of works with your family. So, in terms of family meal times, what's some advice? I mean, obviously, you work with a lot of families, and so what is some advice that you would give to new parents in terms of having a happy, calm family meal time? Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:23

So we want to introduce family mealtimes as soon as possible. So, right from when they're just starting solids, even before if they're happy sitting in the high chair playing with some toys, getting them used to that routine and that family environment is really important. We want to introduce family foods as early as possible, and once again, that goes back to the, as we said, the babies in India are having curries. You can introduce all of your family flavours as soon as possible, and we really want to introduce them as soon as possible to get them used of those flavours and those foods. You don't want to be cooking multiple meals.

SPEAKER_00 28:59

You don't want to cook. Guilty, guilty. I did that for years. So quickly learning to have us all have the same meal at the same time, and whatever that looked like was actually so much better. So yes.

SPEAKER_01 29:10

It's exhausting, and so yes, and particularly once you if you then have subsequent children come along and they don't like the other things, and it just gets a whole lot more chaotic very quickly.

SPEAKER_00 29:22

And it caused a lot of stress in the family home around mealtimes. So being able to have that calm food, what is it, um food dependent, not dependence, but you know, that sort of that food association. Yes, that's really important, right?

SPEAKER_01 29:35

Absolutely. So we also know, which is one this is one of my favorite pieces of research, is that so children are tasting flavors through the amnionic fluid from about 16 weeks gestation.

SPEAKER_00 29:50

Wow, I did not know that.

SPEAKER_01 29:52

Yeah, so when I first heard about this, I was like, oh, it's gonna be like flavour profiles, like your salty, your sweet, spicy, that kind of profiles. No, they tested with specific foods. And pregnant women are really hard to do studies on, but this they could. So what they did was they got the first one they did was they got a group of women to eat carrots in pregnancy, and another group of women didn't eat carrots in pregnancy. When the children got to solid's age, brought them back into the lab, gave them carrots. What they measured was how much they ate, and my favorite metric ever, how favorable the facial reactions were. Well, I can just imagine what he's going. Yeah. If you have seen facial reactions of a child trying food, brilliant. So the ones who had been exposed during pregnancy ate more.

SPEAKER_00 30:42

I'm just I love that. That is so cool. Science is awesome.

SPEAKER_01 30:45

Yeah, and retested with garlic, pepper, all different kinds of foods, same response. So they've been tasting these foods already. Yes, for six months they might not have been, depending on if we've been breastfeeding or formula feeding or what that's looked like. But once we're introducing foods again, give them family foods in an appropriate way. So if you're pureeing, you can just puree whatever you're having for dinner. If you look at the blends of baby puree foods, they do not sound nice. Yeah, look, they're not ideal. But they eat them. So it might not sound great to you to puree up whatever you're having. Oh, but yes. And then obviously, if you're doing baby-led weaning, just preparing it in an appropriate way. The Solid Starts app is great in terms of appropriate ways to prepare foods, mate, like for choking risks on that. But yeah, it's just introduce your family foods as soon as possible. Focus on tastes for that first probably three months. We really just want to introduce as many different tastes of things as possible. In that nine to 12 month kind of mark, we want to introduce textures as much as possible. So even if, for example, they might not have liked scrambled eggs, trying them poached or in it like fried eggs and in different ways to see if it's a taste or texture thing. Trying foods multiple times because often children won't like something the first time they try it. Very normal, very natural to be like, what is this? And then after a few times they like it.

SPEAKER_00 32:17

How many times? It's like something like 20 times, isn't it? Or that they have to be offered a food before they might accept it. Is that kind of a good idea? Yeah, it is.

SPEAKER_01 32:25

Yeah, so 15 to 20 times is where the research is sitting at the moment in terms of before, yeah, it becomes a preferred food and something they like to eat. But that also includes seeing it, touching it, smelling it, because it's all sensory information for the body about what that food is. The example I often use is that not many people like coffee or red wine the first time they try it. We are all with all of us, it can take a while of trying things before we like it. Yep. Yeah, we're all the same in that.

SPEAKER_00 32:56

Yeah. I wanted to just deep dive or uh just jump into the allergen introduction, something that is super anxious for a lot of parents and what that looks like. So, what how would you recommend people start with the allergen sort of discussion or introduction?

SPEAKER_01 33:11

Yeah, absolutely. So we want to introduce the likely allergens early on because the more frequently they're in the diet, the less likely it is they're gonna have a reaction to it. So we want to make sure we introduce peanuts early and eggs early as well. So the recommendation is that we introduce those ones first and that they have them once a week once we've introduced solids, is the recommendation. With all of them, yeah, we want to make sure that we introduce it in a nature-appropriate way and that keep them in the diet while they're having solids. So, in terms of nuts, when you're first introducing them, the pick and mix section at the supermarket be really helpful because you're not then buying a whole bag of sorts that you used. And your mixed butters, so then arm and Brazil nut cashew butter can be a really great way to keep it in the diet because then you're getting a three-for-one kind of like exposure. Don't give those kind of ones in the first time you give it because if you give I guess that goes back to the allergy introduction, you want to introduce foods one at a time because if you introduce something with a whole lot of foods, you don't know what they're reacting to. Uh, we want to introduce foods in the morning, don't give an allergen at night because you want to be able to monitor what happens. If they get a rash on their face, we call that a contact rash. That's not actually an allergy. So monitor that, give it again, see what happens. My little one had a contact rash to soy, and first time red, splotchy face, but by the second time, less of a reaction, didn't last as long. Third time less of a reaction, and by the fourth exposure, didn't happen. So it can be a case of the immune system just working out what it is in those situations.

SPEAKER_00 34:59

Yeah, nice. I think that's a really solid plan, I think, and I think because it is scary, and we have some of the mums go, oh, we go and park under the emergency, yeah, with their baby and give them. I think if you're obviously if there's history of it, it's a different conversation. Absolutely. But yeah, it's it's uh definitely a question that gets often brought up, so that's a very sound way to approach it.

SPEAKER_01 35:19

For sure. If you have allergies yourself as a parent, definitely consider getting someone else to give it to your child, uh, because you obviously don't want to get it on your skin and things like that. And if you are doing the trip to the hospital or the doctor's clinic to do it, don't give it to them in their car scene. Yes. Don't do it in the car scene because you don't want it to get on the car and then then get back in the car and have another reaction.

SPEAKER_00 35:43

Yeah, that's really I would never have thought of that. So that's very handy. Thank you. So if a new mum listening right now could only change one thing about the way she is eating, what would you tell her to do first?

SPEAKER_01 35:56

Make sure we're eating enough. That's often we're just not eating the day. It can get to the end of the day and you realize you haven't eaten since breakfast. Make sure we're eating enough. Eat when your child eats can be a really great way to make sure that we're eating regularly during the day. Don't sit down to feed without a snack. Yeah. And a full drink bottle. Yeah. Because you'll feed, they'll fall asleep, you're nap trapped, it's three hours later, you haven't eaten, you haven't had anything to drink. It can happen quite quickly. So getting those kind of things down before you feed can be really important.

SPEAKER_00 36:29

Yeah, no, I love that. I think that's really important. And when we do our mama's circle, we have our morning tea. And one thing that I notice a lot is we I bring around the morning tea and oh, they're like, Oh, we'll grab one or two. I'm like, We have plenty. Please help yourself to as much as you need because I'm sure most of you have not had breakfast. Yes. And nine times out of ten, they're like, No, we haven't. So I'm like, please eat because it's really important. Because then the next thing they're in the car and they're driving, or their baby falls asleep, so they get half an hour to doom scroll in the car in the driveway while their little one sleeps, which is so important too. So they get that little mental break too. So yeah, sure.

SPEAKER_01 37:04

And just prep as well. If you're making enough for dinner, make enough for lunch tomorrow. If you're like overnight oats can be a great breakfast, make five lots at once. It doesn't take much more effort to create an extra couple of portions when you're already making something, and it can pay off in the days after when you've got that food there.

SPEAKER_00 37:26

Beautiful. Well, thank you so much for all of your insight. I really appreciate it. Thanks for coming on today. Thank you.

unknown 37:32

Yay.

SPEAKER_00 37:33

Thank you so much for spending time with us today. If this podcast resonated with you, please feel free to leave a review, share with a mum that might need it, and we're so glad to have you part of our inner circle.