The Quiet Epidemic

On this episode of See Through, hosts Dev and Roger unpack the male loneliness epidemic — and why the real problem isn't feeling alone, it's being unknown, even to the people closest to you. Using the lifeguard analogy and lawn chair conversations, they break down why men suppress instead of share, what it actually takes to show up for the people you love, and why one honest conversation can change everything.

Real talk. No filters.

In this episode: male loneliness • emotional suppression • men's mental health • vulnerability • friendship and connection • why men don't open up

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Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:07

Welcome, welcome back. Welcome back to See Through. Hope you are having a great week. Welcome back to another episode. It's great to have you. Thanks for joining us. How's it going?

SPEAKER_01 0:17

Thanks for coming along on the journey as always. Welcome back to another week of fresh topics and hopefully some clear thinking for the two of us.

SPEAKER_00 0:26

Yeah, honestly, this is kind of like therapy, I guess, in a way. I guess being able to talk things out loud is always a very healthy way to get things off of your mind and allow yourself to digest it a little bit easier. So yeah, this is a lot of fun. Hope you're enjoying the show and hope you're enjoying the episodes. Any comments, feedback, likes, subscriptions go a really long way. So thanks for tuning in. We really appreciate it. For sure. Appreciate it.

SPEAKER_01 0:52

And of course, like, you know, any feedback, any maybe hints on topics that you would want to hear, keep them coming in. I think in the next, you know, couple weeks, we've got some really fresh content coming in that I'm pretty excited about talking through because some of it's going to be eye-opening for the two of us as we start to dissect, listen to our own perspectives, but also do research to find out what things actually are that are out there in the world trending.

SPEAKER_00 1:18

Yeah. And we're also excited. I think our goal is hopefully, you know, in the very near future, um, to make this a video podcast.

SPEAKER_01 1:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:27

And I think one of the easiest ways to hold yourself accountable is by telling somebody or someone that you care about what you're gonna do so that they also have an expectation. And we care that you're listening right now, so we've kind of set that expectation so you can look forward to us actually meeting that outcome.

SPEAKER_01 1:45

Hold us accountable.

SPEAKER_00 1:46

But um, no, it's been really amazing. And yeah, we're excited to jump into today's topic. But before we jump into it, you know, we thought we'd just sidebar, kind of chat a bit about things that are happening in our lives and just things that are on our mind. I'll maybe get us started this week in sharing. I've been noticing a really interesting trend that I thought I wasn't a part of, but I actually think I'm the core kind of audience for this trend, which is a lot of people of all age groups, no, so there's no like, you know, you know, boomers or millennials or just everyone I'm seeing take part, which is wanting to enjoy a more nostalgic period of time and enjoy more nostalgic technology. And I'll start with I've seen more wired headphones in the wild for sure. Than honestly ever in my lifetime. And we have the most advanced wireless Bluetooth headphone technology on planet Earth, and I see more wired headphones in the wild as a throwback, as a acknowledgement, as a, you know, kind of like an odd that you know things were cooler back then, things were simpler back then. And I would even take that a step further. I haven't watched this yet, and so there's no spoilers. I don't think you've watched this either, but the movie The Odyssey just came out.

SPEAKER_01 3:07

I have not watched it yet.

SPEAKER_00 3:08

Perfect. So we can't even spoil it. We know nothing about the movie. Nothing. But what I do know about the movie is it was fully hand cut. Did you know that? I did not know that. So it was shot in IMAX in a very particular format, a 70 millimeter film. Yep. And the way that it was edited is there, and you can look this up on the internet. I'm sure there's a Gavaral video on some social media. That's where I consume this. Literally, somebody physically hand cut every part of that movie and stitched it together into one like film role.

SPEAKER_01 3:39

Like how it used to be done.

SPEAKER_00 3:40

Yes, like physically in 2026 when AI exists and all these technologies exist, somebody physically did that. And I think part of what is making this movie so hype is the idea that somebody did something in a more old school and in a more retro way. Anyways, I say all of that to say that recently I found myself um in a thrift store. Uh, I didn't, I don't, I'm not a thrifter. I I think thrifting is actually really cool. I just am not cool enough to thrift. Um, but I found myself in a thrift store unexpectedly, and I was just walking around the thrift store with my son, and I happened to stumble across the VCR section of the thrift store. That's hilarious. And did you buy? So I'm now the proud owner of 35 of my favorite and my soon-to-be son's favorite, Disney and Pixar movies.

SPEAKER_01 4:33

Awesome.

SPEAKER_00 4:34

You can't see this, but we're sitting in my office right now. They're in kind of this dining room right next door. I'm now on the hunt for a VCR, which I tested at the value village that I was in, but it didn't work, as well as the TV. Because there's something I find really amazing about him being introduced to these characters the same way that I was introduced to these characters. And that's not to say there's anything wrong with like streaming services or anything like that. We all use them. I mean, I use them, so I'm not hating on them. But again, back to that wired headphones. There's something cool about hey, this is a cassette, you gotta put it in, you gotta rewind it. It's a little blurry. Like, I kind of I love that kind of aura, that kind of feeling. And I never thought I would care about that kind of stuff.

SPEAKER_01 5:18

You know, let me look in storage. I actually might have an extra VC for all of them. And it was crazy, it was only like a dollar, they were like one dollar each. Well, no, not movies. Movies have got DVDs, but I may actually have a VC. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:31

If you have a VCR, I yeah, I would take that off of you. And I felt like this was kind of emerging kind of in like the early 2010s because record players really took off again. Like everybody, all of my friends were all buying records, and everyone that was cool had their own records. But then that kind of like kind of teetered off. And then Polaroids really started to come back.

SPEAKER_01 5:51

My daughter has a Polaroid.

SPEAKER_00 5:52

Everyone was into the Polaroids because they wanted to put it on their, you know, the room or whatever. Great. That kind of died down, and now we're in this like, I find I don't know what to call it. Like, people just like old school tech, like retro tech. I even know of certain companies that are making like dumber phones, like not smartphones, but like dumb phones that don't do anything, like Nokia flip phones because people want their phones to do less.

SPEAKER_01 6:16

Simplicity.

SPEAKER_00 6:16

Simplicity. Yeah. I honestly think like in like five years, the number one selling phone will be a phone that does nothing except calls people and can send text messages, and not even through like an app, like just straight up text messages.

SPEAKER_01 6:29

Yeah, you may not be wrong, right? It's like walking away from technology because it's so immersed in our lives that taking a break is actually refreshing. Yeah. On the headphone topic thing, and you know, if you called them the boomers, and I'll say even the Gen Xers, even I've believe it or not, I've moved into using my wired headphones more than my Bluetooth headphones, not from a nostalgia perspective, but more from a uh health and sort of health conscious perspective of not having anything that's emitting any sort of electronics in my head, and I've gone to a wired headset. So just there is that component out there as well for a lot of people.

SPEAKER_00 7:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:09

Us older, us older people.

SPEAKER_00 7:11

Yeah, I know I was gonna say the most old thing I've ever heard. Anyways, what is it like what is it? People used to be like, oh, like printers cause like cancer or whatever, like the radiation, all this, anyways. But uh yeah, so I am very into I think giving my child a little retro throwback experience, and we're gonna start with VCRs, and we'll see if I I'll mention it in a future episode, or you can comment and maybe if you all care, I can give you a little VCR, a little VCR review. I can show you all of the ones that we've got.

SPEAKER_01 7:42

Um Hey, listen, I have a retro car, and to my understanding, I think you have a retro car new. I do.

SPEAKER_00 7:49

We both own retro cars. What well, what car do you own?

SPEAKER_01 7:52

1991 Ford Mustang LX.

SPEAKER_00 7:55

Yes, and I own a 1991 Honda Prelude. Yeah, yeah. Beautiful cars, beautiful cars. Um, all right, so that's our little banter. I think uh I'm excited to talk about today's topic. I will just put out that today's topic is a little heavier. Yeah, it is a bit heavier, but I think it's something that honestly, I guess the best way I can put it is it I think it's an important topic. It's one that people will have polarizing opinions on, which, as you know, is kind of what we love about this show. Yeah. And I think we're excited to kind of share our perspective on it and see through it kind of from our lens, and we'd love to hear from you as well. So I'll let Roger tee tee it up and kind of share. He was he was kind of the the thought leader behind this one this week.

SPEAKER_01 8:40

Yeah, it's um I'll read the title of it, and we are calling it Why Are Men So Bad at Being Known? And it's referring to is the male loneliness epidemic real? And I came into the episode genuinely skeptical of the term, you know, the male loneliness epidemic. Sounds like a headliner designed for clicks. So I actually looked into it, and here's what I found. The numbers on who's lonelier, men or women, are actually pretty close. And so this is not the story, right? The story is that men are five times less likely to admit it, less likely to seek help, and far more likely to let it quietly destroy their health, their relationships, and their sense of purpose without either even or ever naming what's actually happening. I'll give you some more numbers. In 1990, 3% of men said that they had no close friends. Today that number is 15%. So that's not an epidemic of feeling lonely. That is an epidemic of being unknown. And those are two very different things. You know, the male loneliness epidemic, if you want to call it that, shows up as irritability, overworking, maybe it's drinking in substance uh use and abuse, screen immersion, or cynicism. But rarely does it show up as the word lonely. So reframing this is super important for us so we can understand it and potentially identify it. So it's not men sitting alone in a room crying, it's men being angry, distracted, checked out, and then not knowing why. Dev. I would love to hear your thoughts after I share sort of those stats.

SPEAKER_00 10:34

Yeah, listen. It's interesting because I am an only child. So I'll start by prefacing. I've spent a lot of time physically alone in my own thoughts, in my own world, especially growing up, you know, um, as a kid. And so when I hear those statistics and I hear those numbers, the first thing that comes to mind is for me, and the way I define loneliness and how I've interpreted it growing up, and is kind of how I view it today, is I don't believe loneliness is necessarily the absence of people. I find it's the absence of being known by the people who are around you. And when I hear that, honestly, in especially in the world that we live in where people are so connected and everyone's, you know, always chatting with everyone on a variety of apps, texts, WhatsApp, Snapchat, Instagram, TikTok, all that stuff. You can be, you know, in conversation, you could be physically in a room with a bunch of people at a restaurant, at a party, at a function, at a, you know, at an event, um, and still feel completely alone. And the reason is not because you aren't near someone, but it's because being near someone isn't the same as feeling safe with them.

SPEAKER_01 11:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 11:58

And I know a lot of dudes that are really insecure about being themselves around their family, their, you know, so-called best friends, their siblings, their partners. And in a way, and it's unfortunate, they use that as, I don't know, let's say, um, a justification, like you're referring to, to then be a, you know, be a be a negative version of themselves, or, and in my opinion, if you're between the ages of like 21 and 38, these are the most dramatic men I've ever seen in my entire life. Men are way more dramatic than women, purely based on the fact that they don't know how to be vulnerable and they don't know how to be themselves and they don't know how to feel safe. Now, we can put that on everyone around them, but I'm saying as somebody that's learned how to feel self-sufficient, being, you know, there for myself, it is possible to do without, you know, having to create so much negativity around you through the process and making it all about you.

SPEAKER_01 13:04

Yeah. I think for you, when you're speaking around your sort of self-discovery and learning journey, I think spending time alone is super important in a healthy way. Um, because especially at a young age, because then it allows you to figure out how to process things, especially your emotions, and show up in the environments or in the relationships the way you need to from a communication perspective, right? I think growing up for myself, you know, especially as I've aged and the more successful I became in my career, I believe fewer people truly knew me, right? Not fewer friends, but fewer people who actually got to know what's going on inside and in my head. So then, you know, were they able to support me or understand how they could um offer me leverage or assistance in something? You know, I reflect back on my dad's generation, which had a completely different model. I shared their lawn chair sort of analogy and story from the past of they showed up with no agenda, men sitting together in a circle and actually just talking, not about sports scores, but about life and sort of trials and turbulations, their immigration to a new country and finding a job and being the primary bread, you know, earners and stuff like that. And it didn't feel like they needed to share with each other that that was vulnerability. It just was. They were just being open and communicative, right? Yeah. And I think today we've sort of put this word of being vulnerable. And then men will shy away from being vulnerable because that's not who our true nature is. Yeah. And I think that's where I think some of this, I won't say it's damage, but I think some of this stigma of opening up and not opening up, men have sort of put up a wall now to say, you know what, I'm not going to be vulnerable because I don't need other men to judge me that I'm weak. And because of that, then the natural dialogue of just being yourself and sharing openly in a community environment or at least in a trusted group environment, has fallen to the wayside, right? I, you know, you you and I talked about in a previous episode around profound friendships. And there were three elements you there was time, distance, and silence. Yep. Right. And for me, I think of some of my closest friends that exist. We've talked openly and honestly around the things in our lives at moments in our life when we needed to without judgment. But I don't know that that exists to your point, like it did in the past when I grew up and my dad's generation for sure, especially in today's world of social media and you know, curated contents and and sort of buzzwords, if you will, because uh that's what they are, in my opinion. They're buzzwords versus just the reality and the actual behaviors of being able to be authentic.

SPEAKER_00 15:53

Yeah, listen, I think a lot of it also comes down to a lot of men, and I and I I would imagine women can experience this as well, but I I guess from a guy's perspective, don't know really how to hold space for one another. In that, you know, if somebody comes up to you and, you know, they're feeling some type of way negative or they're not feeling great about a certain situation. I find a lot of dudes either go straight to trying to fix the problem or make it lighter, try to joke around, try to make it feel like not that serious.

SPEAKER_01 16:27

Yeah, deflect.

SPEAKER_00 16:28

And ultimately, I think both of those outputs usually cause most people to not want to then, you know, re-engage and they don't feel better. They may act like it in the moment, but I think over the long term, I think most people, even subconsciously, are like, hey, that didn't really give me the impact that I was looking for. I'm gonna maybe not do that again. But I think there's also another component to this, as you were talking about that lawn chair analogy that I was thinking about, which is there used to be this really amazing kind of I think concept where the people that were the closest to you, the people that you felt you could be vulnerable around and maybe talk about, you know, things that were on your mind so you didn't feel as lonely about your feelings or lonely about your thoughts, usually are also people that you're really comfortable not saying anything to, and you can just be with that person in complete silence and you feel good. And it doesn't feel like you have to always force a conversation and force a dialogue. I actually really equate the people that I feel the best about in my life are actually the people that I can be quiet around. Because I don't I don't have to like constantly be putting on a face or constantly be, you know, sharing something, or constantly feel like I have to like, you know, keep up a conversation. It usually means that like that's more of like a formal relationship or it feels like more performative. But the other side of that coin too is gone are the days where you can just meet up with someone without even like needing to plan it like five weeks in advance and like have like multiple text exchanges to really coordinate, and there has to be some event or something tied to it. Like, I think a lot of this also comes down to is people don't just chill. They don't just go and sit in a park or sit on a couch and just just have no predetermined agenda, or nobody, nobody makes time for that. And I think that's also part of the reason why most people feel lonely is because even when they're with other people, it's always within a like an agenda. There are there's a task, there's a movie that needs to be watched, there's a dinner that needs to be had, there's a drink that needs to be drunk because they're at a birthday party, there's money that needs to be exchanged because they're at a wedding. There's never like a moment to just catch your breath and like I'm just talking to you just because I got nothing else to do and I want to talk to you.

SPEAKER_01 18:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:46

And I find that in a lot of a lot of people. Like, I don't know that a lot of people have that. And if you do, it's really rare and you should protect that at all costs.

SPEAKER_01 18:54

Yeah, I think a lot of men have learned how to be present without ever being known. Yep. Right within their inner circles. And I listen, I even see it in myself at times, the instinct to just say everything is just fine or redirect the conversation just because I feel like I don't want to burden somebody else with what maybe I'm going through in my life. And I think that's sort of the issue in itself as well. As men, we were taught from a young age that we don't burden others with what's going on. We silently just keep hustling and keep grinding and keep doing the work. And eventually that feeling or that thought you're having will just dissipate into the abyss until it resurfaces again, over and over again. And I think, you know, for a lot of us, maybe that sort of hits a nail square on the head of the cycles of repeat behaviors that come up. You suppress a feeling or an emotion so far and so often that it disappears for a time because then you get busy or caught up with something else. And then it resurfaces, and all of a sudden, that cycle of whatever it is, maybe it was anger, maybe it was overworking, maybe it was irritability, right? Maybe it was doom scrolling or substance abuse. That cycle starts again because you didn't actually deal with what was wrong. You just kind of buried it and put it away, hoping it would dissipate and it never does. It always comes back, right? And so, like my point there is it doesn't necessarily have to be therapy, um, although that probably could help some people, um, or a men's retreat or listening to a podcast around vulnerability. I think what actually changes things is one conversation with one person where you get to say something true and that other person doesn't flinch or judge. Right. And they just allow you to be yourself authentically. And for me, when I think of that actually playing out, when you can allow space for others to just do that, then they'll create an opportunity for themselves to do it again. And I think that for me is the beginning of unpacking and and helping and being healthy for one another in a relationship.

SPEAKER_00 21:01

Yeah, listen, I completely agree. And I also just want to acknowledge that can also be a hard relationship to find. Um, it's really hard to, especially when you're needing to put yourself out there to trust someone that deeply to feel psychologically safe to maybe share what's on your mind. I think the other really complex thing that you may have to deal with if you're feeling lonely, or if you're feeling like there's nobody in your corner, or you know, you don't have anyone that you can turn to is if you even know, you know, some of the negative feelings that you're having, or if you're feeling that way, what it is you're even looking for. Because I've seen a lot of people that have shared with me that feel lonely or feel like helpless or abandoned, uh, or things are not going in their direction, or you know, the word that I hear the most is they feel forgotten or they feel left behind. And when I ask them, well, what are you looking for? Like what would, what would, what would make you feel better in this moment? A lot of the times they're not even clear on what it is that they're seeking. So it's hard to feel like you can progress towards, you know, finding, you know, your people, finding your tribe, finding the people that you want to surround yourself with if you don't even know what it is you're really looking to fill, what void you're looking to fill. And I think that's the sad part is because people aren't willing to do that inner work of asking themselves, well, what is it that I need to feel that, you know, safety, to feel that psychological safety, they instead just do what's easy, which is to just go with the flow, to just say yes, to just say everything's okay, to pretend like they're good. And then what happens is something boils them over, they become the worst version of themselves, they damage things around themselves, they break things around themselves, they continue to perpetuate negative stereotypes about men and you know, further, you know, provide more examples of you know our emotional instability and how we, you know, aren't able to, you know, really control our own emotions and how we're overly, overly theatrical. And and it all comes down to the fact that those emotions aren't being dealt with consistently and they show up in these these really dramatic and these really over-the-top, you know, ways, uh, which I think is really the tough part because I I hate when I see that. I just hate, hate to see a dude just basically be the worst version of himself, all because he didn't have the foresight to just deal with his own, you know, for lack of a better word, you know, drama himself.

SPEAKER_01 23:37

You brought up two interesting thoughts for me in that moment. One is, you know, we've shared, we're both Southeast Asian males, right? South Asian males. And I think it's a learned behavior, specifically in our culture, where men, you know, they didn't teach us how to be open and communicative and sharing thoughts and you know what's troubling us. I don't know about you, Dev. Nobody ever sat me down when I was a kid. My dad did once in a while, right? But I often didn't have a sit-down talk with, hey, what's on your mind? What are you thinking? What's troubling you? You know, are you okay? Simple question. Now, in the backyard, if I was helping my dad in the garden and stuff, sure, we would have some idle conversations and we got time to connect and sort of, you know, he would share his best practices with me. But I know in my in our community, it's not a it's not a taught behavior within the group of men. Um, I think, you know, you know my sister and my the females in the family, they talked a lot more openly than the men did for sure. The second component is the question is not whether you have friends. Most men do. The question is whether any of them are actually getting to know you on the depth, right? On a deeper level, not the version you perform at the dinner parties or at the you know the pubs or sitting around watching a sports game, the actual you, you know, the one that doesn't hide behind the mask. And is anyone actually paying attention and observing you when you actually need the support and being able to offer you what that, you know, the age-old saying of the olive branch? When's the last time anyone's offered you an olive branch? Yeah, right. And and for me, I think those are the two thoughts I had was one, a learned behavior where we're not taught to communicate clearly, concisely, and um openly. And the other is within our male groups, do we even get to know each other on a fundamental level? And in some cases you do, but in the majority of cases, we don't.

SPEAKER_00 25:48

Yeah, listen. On the you know, the topic of that olive branch, the thing that I would say is if you if you really have the right people around you, and and if you are also showing up, in my opinion, the way you should for the people that you care about and the people that you love, the way I think about it is you're always kind of a lifeguard. And what I mean by that is that lifeguard mode is a lifeguard is constantly surveying and constantly looking at who looks like they're struggling and who looks like they're drowning. And I think a lot of people, you know, when they hear about a friend that's going through a tough time, or, you know, worse, you know, somebody that's maybe caused themselves harm towards himself, they're really shocked because they're like, wow, I had no idea. I had no clue that that person was feeling that way, or I had no person that that person was going through that. But if more people had a lifeguard mentality, and the lifeguard mentality, the way I define it, is this is a lifeguard does not wait for the person that's drowning to ask to be saved.

SPEAKER_01 26:53

Right.

SPEAKER_00 26:54

Somebody that's drowning does not have the capacity to ask for help and to ask to be saved. And so what the lifeguard needs to do is to watch for signals. They need to observe nonverbal signals, they need to observe the water, they need to observe a multitude of things, and then make a decision as to whether or not to jump into the pool or jump to the ocean. Now, the other thing that I think is also important is if a lifeguard is not sure, you know what they do? They jump in anyways. Yeah. Because they're not sure. So what do they do? They air on the side of caution. Hey, you know what? You seem like you're okay, but that one little move there looked like maybe you were struggling. I'm just gonna jump in. You good? Okay, well, I'll just jump right right out. It's just I can jump right out. That's I think the real powerful part of that loneliness is if you're not doing that for others. Well, I mean, spoiler alert, you cannot expect that to be done for yourself. So I'll just start by saying that you should not be expecting from others what you're not doing for everyone else. But you know, the way I think of that olive branch is really powerful is be a lifeguard. Look around at the people that you care about. Now, be selective because, like any lifeguard, you can't keep your eye on a thousand people. Yeah, it's just not possible. Like it's physically impossible.

SPEAKER_01 28:06

And trying to save everyone, you'd be exhausted.

SPEAKER_00 28:08

You'd be exhausted. You probably drown yourself, to be honest. Yeah. So metaphorically speaking. Yeah, metaphorically speaking. And so I think that's for me, really, when I think of all of this, is if you if you just really focused on watching for signals, if you really, and this is why it's so important for people to really know who you actually are, because if you let them in and you actually show them who you are, they then are afforded the opportunity to be your lifeguard.

SPEAKER_01 28:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 28:38

But if they don't, and if everything's all good all the time, always everything's great, well then you can't blame them for not jumping in to save you. Yeah. Because you're not giving them any signals that allow them the opportunity. So it's a two-way street. You've got to show them, and then you, if you're the person on the other side, you cannot be wait to be asked. You just got to jump in.

SPEAKER_01 28:59

Yeah, it's a trained behavior, right? So that's what I'm picking up here. In order to be the lifeguard, you have to have the training to be the lifeguard. And what I mean by that training is great, you can have formal training, but actually train yourself to be a conversationalist, right? To be able to identify when somebody just needs to have a dialogue versus asking pointed questions or making somebody feel like they're in the hot seat. That's not what we're saying. It's to be able to recognize that, hey, I've got a friend over here who's, you know, metaphorically drowning. What can I have in a dialogue or just show up for them and just be with them? Yeah. Just have a conversation around a real conversation. Yeah. So they felt seen, they feel heard, and they feel like, you know, oh my God, I can do more here in this situation than just sit quiet or idle. The other thing I'm sort of picking up on is what we learn when we board an aircraft in the safety demonstration about putting your mask on before you put somebody else's mask on. And in order to show up in the right frame of mind, in the right sort of way of helping, you have to do some of the work yourself first, right? And being able to share openly and communicate yourself, I think sets the groundwork in how others choose to approach you in these dialogues. And men, for those that are listening, this is not easy. And we're not saying it is, but you need to practice it. You need to find your circle of people, pull up a lawn chair, um, and just allow people to be in your space. And Dev, I loved it. Can you sit idle with people? And sitting idle with people that might be going through or who have gone through similar life events or journeys, you don't necessarily have to speak the words out loud, but just sitting idle with somebody else that's already gone through what you're going through is enough from a support and reassurance perspective that allows you to persevere through, right? Because it starts building a bond that you may not have thought you needed and may not have thought was actually right there beside you in the first place.

SPEAKER_00 31:08

Perfectly said. I couldn't agree more. I think that's a great way uh to wrap our episode. And as we're looking to wrap, um, I wanted to take us through our motivational minute to uh round us out. Now, you'll know um I'm a big fan of stories, anecdotes, um, things of that nature. And uh before today's episode, I was looking for one that I felt, you know, could maybe summarize what we talked about. So here it goes. A young sailor once asked an old lighthouse keeper why he still bothered lighting the lamp every night. Half the ships have passed never even you use see the light, the sailor said. How do you know it's making a difference? The keeper thought for a moment, then said, I don't light it for the ships that don't see it. I light it for the one ship on the one night in the worst storm that does. He explained that for years he'd wondered the same thing: whether the work mattered, whether anyone noticed, whether it was worth the climb up those stairs every single evening. But he'd learned that you don't get to see the most of the difference you make. You just have to trust that showing up consistently in the dark is the thing that occasionally saves someone. Years later, a ship's captain came looking for him. During a storm, off course and nearly out of options, his crew had spotted a single point of light through the rain. It was enough to reorient them. It got them home. The captain never even knew the lightkeeper's name. He just knew the light was there when it mattered. Most of what we do, showing up, doing the work, being reliable, feels invisible most of the time, but it's rarely wasted. Somebody somewhere is navigating by a light they never think to thank you for. So keep spreading your light this week, and we'll see you next time.