Relationships first: rethinking support coordination, with Anna Skora (Eps. 4)

What does good support coordination actually look like for people with complex needs?

In this episode, Matt speaks with Anna Skora, Founder and Director of Mindbridge. Anna shares how her own early experiences with mental health challenges, housing instability, and support services shaped her approach to working with people.

With more than 13 years of experience across mental health, counselling, community services, and the NDIS, Anna discusses the importance of relationship based practice, clear communication, face to face support, and proper handovers between providers.

The conversation also covers the reality of managing complex cases, responding when priorities change quickly, setting boundaries to prevent burnout, and building a team that stays aligned with its values as a business grows.

This episode will be useful for support coordinators, NDIS providers, and families looking to better understand what strong coordination looks like in practice.

You can find Anna and Mindbridge through their website at mindbridge.net.au, or connect with them on LinkedIn and Instagram.

Matt and his team at Steppr offer 'Weirdly Different' Positive Behaviour Support. Find his team at www.steppr.com.au

Thanks for watching!

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Let's get back to nature. Welcome to the NDIS in the Garden podcast with your host, Matt Sevier. All right, today I'm joined with Anna Sakora, the founder and director of MindBridge Therapy and Coordination. So Anna has more than 13 years of experience across mental health, counselling, community services, and the NDIS. She has worked extensively with people experiencing psychosocial disability, trauma, housing instability, safeguarding concerns, and other complex support needs. Through MindBridge, Anna provides specialist support coordination and counseling with a strong focus on relationship-based practice, advocacy, clear communication, and building systems that participants and families can rely on. So, Anna, thank you so much for being here. It's lovely to have you. Welcome.

SPEAKER_02 0:48

Thank you so much for having me.

SPEAKER_00 0:50

So, for people who do not know you yet, how did you end up working in mental health and support coordination?

SPEAKER_02 0:58

Well, um, as a teenager, I went through quite a tough time with my own mental health. Went through a little bit of trauma with um family. I left I left my family home very, very young. And I got involved. Well, I didn't get involved, I got linked in with the youth system in terms of housing. And I actually got the opportunity, well, I was very lucky to have some amazing social workers that kind of set me up for uh life, was man managed to get, you know, Department of Housing home at the age of 16. And, you know, a lot of that, you know, the the struct like they helped me basically start to develop my adulthood life at a very young age.

SPEAKER_01 1:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:43

And that part of the help that I got really wanted me to pursue that for my future as well and help other people because I saw how much amazing help there that they gave to well, I got that amazing help basically, and I was able to, I wanted to pass that on to other people. So I mean, obviously, when I was younger, my my idea was to be a pediatrician. And then my in terms of studies changed very quickly. And so by the time I hit year 11, year 12, I really wanted to study psychology. So went into my bachelor's degree, started my psychology. Was really lucky enough towards my final year of psychology to be offered a placement, a drug and alcohol placement for counseling as well through the AOD department back then. That's what they were called. The drug and alcohol department, I should say. And so I was lucky enough to venture into that counselling, the AOD counselling space. Initially, I actually it wasn't my thing that I wanted to do because it triggered a lot of stuff from my past.

SPEAKER_01 2:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 2:48

I actually learned a lot about myself during that time as well and managed to get a better understanding of what had, you know, my childhood experiences and how different I explain those that stuff to myself. So, yeah, so got finished my drug and alcohol certificate and then started work as a support worker because obviously coming out of uni in your fourth year, you're not a classified psychologist. You have to find work elsewhere before you go to your master's. So managed to do support work, and it was the best thing for me in terms of getting that experience and working with people. And then during that time, during that time, I managed to also start to get into my master's degree. Really wanted to do more counseling and psychotherapy side of things because I found like that really resonated a lot better with me than actual the psychology sector, I guess. I mean, with the vote both very similar, but it was more person-centered, I think, counseling and psychotherapy. Finished my master's, and I was very lucky to be part of a big company that offered me multiple jobs. Like obviously, we I was a support worker, then I moved into what used to be called Partners in Recovery, which was pre-NDIS. That was like case managing people with disability, mainly around mental health and case managing a lot of like mainstream services for them, which was the beginning parts of what coordination now is, I guess, prior to NDIS. And then obviously NDIS came into WA. So I quickly moved into that coordination role, moved over people from Partners in Recovery, and have been in that sector since.

SPEAKER_00 4:28

Cool. What a what a journey you've had. That's that's amazing. Yeah. So it's been a long road, it sounds. Yeah. So I mean, it's it that carries my question, my next question, because it's it's like you got into this because of how much it helped you, which is such an amazing thing. So you can directly see, you know, how how how good these things can be. Was there anything that made you think like I want to do like certain things differently?

SPEAKER_02 4:57

Not from what the help that I got. Over the years, what I have like my my values and my grounding in terms of the support that I want to provide to people has always remained the same. That's never changed since the day that I started support work, basically.

SPEAKER_01 5:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:12

But I have seen how other people provide support for p participants, and I get a lot of feedback, especially now having my own, you know, company. Um, and the people that come over that are referred over to me, I get a lot of feedback in terms of the supports that they have received up until now. And a big part of it is that the person-centeredness gets lost.

SPEAKER_01 5:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:38

I found that, I mean, I the work the company that I worked for previously were amazing. I had amazing co-workers, I had an amazing manager. But obviously, as we know, when a company grows, some of that stuff does get lost. And as much as you know, the values are there and they're printed on the system, and you know, people talk about the values, you know, I experienced a lot of the values getting lost amongst the one-on-one support that you know a lot of co-workers were giving. And I mean, you know, and that's just natural stuff that happens, I guess, when a company grows because caseloads increase, KPIs increase, you know, NDIS demands become bigger in terms of administration type scenarios. And so for me, what towards the end of me working with that particular company, I kind of felt like a lot of it was being lost in terms of into administration work and KPIs. And I really struggled to find time to go out and see my participants more regularly. And that's the feedback that I'm getting right now is the fact that, you know, people come over to Mind Bridge and they say, Look, I barely saw my coordinate my previous coordinator. You know, I was on the system, I saw them twice in the space of two years, and it just that just doesn't sit right with me. I get that there's tightness now in terms of the funding and all of that side of things. However, my bridge is that yeah, like face-to-face support. Yes, there is stuff that we have to do in the background, and yes, there is a you know, costs that I am absorbing as a as a you know company director that unfortunately, you know, NDIS don't pay for, but that is the core value of of why I do what I do is to be there for the people, to have that face-to-face support and to provide that, you know, that person-centeredness.

SPEAKER_00 7:28

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. And I saw on your LinkedIn for anyone wanting to reach out to Anna, LinkedIn, find her on there, she posts some amazing things. So you recently posted about taking over participant files where there was no proper handover, like minimal documentation, no sort of clear picture of what was actually happening. How common is that for what you see as a coordinator?

SPEAKER_02 7:50

Oh, look, I fail we face that 75% of the time. And I must say, I do I have come across excellent coordinators. I've got recent handovers where you know the attachments to the emails were like papers long, which has been amazing. Because you do know what's happened for the participant. You know, we get referrals from participants coming in, and they're, you know, you sit down with them and you go, Well, what's been done? And they're like, I don't know. I actually don't know what my coordinator did. And that that's when the handovers become really important because we can actually see, you know, what communication has happened, where some of where things may have fallen through the gaps. And like the handovers that we get is not to judge, you know, the other previous coordinate coordinator that was on board. It's to actually understand it of where do we pick up from? And yeah, a majority of the time the participants that have come over or the referrals that have come to us where the participants have seen said, I haven't seen my coordinator for so long. That is where the handovers aren't there. Like we're honestly still chasing some handovers from coordinators that had been, you know, two or three pe people prior for a participant, and we can't get we can't even get a copy of a plan. And you know, that that's so important for us. So I mean that's the main document that we need is coordinators, really. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:11

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Yes, yeah. So, like a lot of people you know, probably think support coordination is is mainly like referrals, phone calls, and emails. What would you say like good coordination actually looks like for someone with complex needs?

SPEAKER_02 9:27

Again, the first thing is having that relationship, having that rapport, because at the end of the day, we can't do our coordination work if we don't know the person, right? It's all well and good to have an intake process and write things on paper in terms of, you know, this is what a participant needs, this is, you know, the the particular support workers that they require. But until you actually meet the person and you get to know their history and you get to know what their needs are at this current stage, how are we to know who to refer over to, right?

SPEAKER_01 9:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:00

Literally had a conversation yesterday with a new participant that uh came over to us and she was saying that over the past few weeks, where you know, she's had recommendations to move over to coordination, she's engaged with two or three services where they didn't even bother to come out and meet her. The intake was on the phone. They, you know, 15 minutes, you don't really get to tell much of your story in 15 minutes at all.

SPEAKER_01 10:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:26

And they judged, well, I don't why do they judge? Because that's not the right word, but they they looked at the whole scenario and basically said, we can't help you without actually getting an understanding of what's actually going on for her.

SPEAKER_01 10:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:38

And she did mention it yesterday. So myself and my colleague went out to see her to do that meet and greet, which we don't charge for. Like my biggest thing, the the way that we operate here is we uh when we get a referral, we have a phone conversation to kind of introduce ourselves, and then the first port a call is a meet and greet. No paperwork, nothing. We just go out, we meet the person because we need to we need to understand their environment. We need to understand who they are and what they're going through. But they also need to meet us to see if there's gonna be a connection with us. Because if there isn't, what's the point of going through that intake process? What's the point of going through all that paperwork when you're not gonna take them on board? Now that's a waste of time. And that's you know, it's it's also delaying that referral process or that you're delaying getting anything on board for the participant because that you know, they've they've just wasted, you know, hours of trying to give out all of their information and then that you're not taking them on board.

SPEAKER_01 11:38

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 11:39

And yeah, like I mean, I've had multiple conversations with participant like participants or their families where they're like, you know, I want to come on board, send us your service agreement. I'm like, no, and and I do have to stop it down. Like, please, can we meet with you first? We can have a chat and see if if you get along with us. Like at the end of the day, that's that's what you want. You want to know your coordinate. Yeah, absolutely. And and yeah, that's that's the biggest role. Like referrals, you know, advocating for the people. Yes, that is part of our our role. That's the major part of our role of coordination. But it is being there and and and having that connection with someone for them to trust you to be able to advocate for them at the end of the day.

SPEAKER_00 12:21

Absolutely, and that's that's such an awesome thing about Mind Minebridge and what you've created. It sounds like you guys live in live in the real world, you know, which is amazing.

SPEAKER_02 12:30

So it's like I mean, we had like I said yesterday and oh yesterday or the day before, and the feedback that we got is it was very evident from the feedback that we got from our participants and you know in our paperwork is that that is the core, is that we actually build those connections and relationships first. And the auditor was I mean, the auditor was very impressed with that because they don't come across that very often with coordination companies.

SPEAKER_00 12:56

So yeah, yeah, absolutely. So, you know, I I run a PBS provider and like I see I hear about the inbox that coordinators have, you know, just the flooding of emails, the amount that you guys do is is like incredible. Not jealous of it. It is, it sounds like there's a lot of work that goes on, right? So you know, there there might be some coordinators listening to this episode. And uh what I really want to ask, so you like you you work with people dealing with mental health challenges, trauma, housing issues, like safeguarding concerns, and in general, like family, family burnout, right? So there's a lot going on for you. How do you decide what needs attention first when everything is urgent? Because it is a lot.

SPEAKER_02 13:42

Yeah, it is. And that's a good question. And that's I probably don't have a good answer for that because part of the coordination role is those moving parts, right? So today I will be, for instance, focusing because someone's come to me and I'll be focusing on looking for housing for them. And then suddenly tomorrow they're in hospital and I have to organize an MDT meeting with the hospital. And so their housing then gets pushed aside. That is, and look, you know, after doing this for so many years, that comes as a natural thing for me. I'm lucky for myself and I'm lucky that I have an amazing team that are very flexible in working like that, which I and I know I get that, you know, all of us have different characteristics and different working styles, and some coordinators do struggle with that sudden immediate change to be able to, you know, leave something and move on to something else really quickly. It is part like it's just par and par in terms of like the the role that we do. And realistically, you know, there isn't a quick answer into saying what do you prioritize first, because it is a lot of it is crisis management, especially with high complexities. And you just you just roll with what kind of comes to you at face first, you know. You just have to be flexible and amendable in terms of like being and being comfortable with the fact that you're working on something now, and that could potentially not be what you're gonna have to be working on tomorrow. And yeah, unfortunately, I don't have a a simple answer in terms of it's just I think and I think reality is is that a lot of coordinators come into this role thinking that it's gonna be easy for easy referral type scenario where and this is obviously these platforms are uh are necessary to be able to show people what the actual reality of the work that we do is. And yeah, you're at constant, you know, on the line of burnout half the time because you're constantly dealing with situations and yeah, it's it's it's hectic, but it is what it is. Part of power.

SPEAKER_00 15:50

Yeah, that's it. And I guess if you've done it for so long, you know, it's just it becomes one of those those natural flows, like you get your workflow, right? Do you think there's enough understanding? Sorry, yeah. Do you think there's enough like understanding across the section sector about how much work happens behind the scenes in the support corporation?

SPEAKER_02 16:11

Not really. I think, and again, I'd be part of what we do at our meet and greets or when we first get people on board is explaining exactly what our role is, because I have found that a lot of the time participants come in or families come in with certain expectations and a misunderstanding of what we actually can and can't do a lot of the time and what we actually do do behind the scenes. And that is also part of the process of when we discuss at meet and greets. You know, when participants say, I haven't seen my coordinator for two years, it is getting them to understand that there is potential that they have, the coordinator has been doing a lot of work, they just haven't been able to do that face to face because there has been a lot of admin and you know, the reach out to other and you know, other providers and stakeholders behind the scenes. But again, at the same time, there's got to be communication there to update, you know, in terms of telling the participant, like, this is what I'm doing, this is what where we're at, all of that. There's so, like I said, there's so many moving parts around this, but there is a misunderstanding and the expectations vary from people. Like I have people that think that I'm gonna be their personal secretary and doing a lot of their administrative scenario work. And for some people, that's necessary, don't get me wrong. Like, there is there is ability to step into that role to do that, but then there's sometimes the you gotta have those conversations sometimes where you know it's going across that line of you know, this is probably not where my role sits for you. Where can we find someone that will be able to commit to that and be able to give you that that support that you really need right now? It's communication a lot of the time, it's just communicating to people and from day one setting those boundaries of going, look, this is my capacity, this is what I'll be able to achieve for you. I don't want to make and I don't want to make promises because there's potential that I may not be able to fulfill that that those promises or that role later down the track. So being real, being honest, and having that communication with them in terms of expectations.

SPEAKER_00 18:20

Exactly, yeah. And you know, for any families or anything like listening to this, like that's something that is a really good sign for say myself as PBS or you know, your yourself as a support coordinator, it's like someone that knows their scope really well and communic communicates that from the start, I think that is such an important point that you make, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 18:40

Yeah. How do you and that's where that's that's where the work ends up? Sorry, that's where the work ends up really well in terms of like coordinating, because if you've got a team around you with various professionals that are open and honest, that are able to set the scene for the participant from day one, it's where everything flows and where you know everyone, you know, the the moving parts click together like a puzzle.

SPEAKER_00 19:08

Yeah, yeah, amazing. How do you so uh you know for me it's like uh my my weekends are very important, you know, you need that time off. How do you sort of uh you know balance life and business as well?

SPEAKER_02 19:25

Good question. If you asked me this day uh year one of Mind Bridge, I would have told you I'm working 48 hours, 20, 48 hours a day, 24, 7, 40, 7 days a week, all of that side.

SPEAKER_01 19:39

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 19:40

But that comes, that's you know, I was I started this alone. I didn't have a team. I had to call I was never a business person. That was like I had no idea in terms of how starting to run a business. Thankfully, I've got an amazing accountant that knows all that stuff, and she was she helps me through that. But yeah, coordinating or like coordinating, managing a business and you know, doing work as well. There was a lot of long hours put into it in terms of setting everything up. And then obviously, once getting staff on board, the training and staff and being there for the staff and you know, providing that that support to them constantly does does take a toll. Thankfully, when I did work for the previous company when I first started into coordination from Partners Recovery, into coordination, it's a blessing in disguise when you have hard participants that burn you out because at the time it doesn't feel right. It's very icky, you're going through hell. However, you learn so much from it. And I was, I'm looking at it as as a silver lining, is that I did have a fair few participants at the beginning of my coordination career that didn't massively burn me out, where I had to then reflect in terms of my own boundaries. You know, I was answering phone calls after hours because I was so worried about these people that didn't have, you know, the supports in place and didn't have informal supports. And so I felt like that was my role to be able to protect them and be able to be there for them 24-7. So I was answering phone calls, which then took a toll on my own personal relationships and my own personal friendships and my life. And it came to a point where I had to have a moment of realization to go, I can't do this. I can't save the world, I can't be here for people 24-7. My role is limited. I have to think of creative ways to make sure that these people are supported when I'm not available. And lucky enough, I've been able to build that boundary. Despite me opening a business that took a lot of hours out of outside of my work, my coordination clients and my counsellor clients have always been strict around maintaining inside business hours contact and being from day one, again, that communication when I meet with them to say. Look, I'm available 8:30 till 4:30, Monday to Friday. You can send me a text after hours. I won't respond to you until the next day. And they've got it. They've got it. The main part of it is I've been able to manage, I've been able to create a structure of other stakeholders that they can rely on to be able to contact them after hours if they need to, that are available, that are paid for the work to be able to do that, right? So where you can't, where as a coordinator, you can't be there 24-7. So the role is to go, if I can't be there, who can I put in place that can be? So that the participant feels supported 24-7 as they need to. Some don't. Some have families, some have informal supports, but a handful don't have anyone. And so we need to build that scaffolding around them. And that helps in terms of managing that life, work, work-life balance, you know, self-care, all of that stuff. We don't practice we don't practice what we preach a lot of the time. But if we can at least put you know the scaffolding for our participants, it does make our work life balance easier later.

SPEAKER_00 23:11

Yeah, that's it. Well, I guess like two years into Minebridge, what are you what are you most proud of?

SPEAKER_02 23:22

My team. I'm so proud and I'm so grateful and lucky of my team. I put up a LinkedIn post last night, actually, after our audit. The feedback that we got from the auditor, honestly, I cried. I cried in the interview because what I envisioned Mindbridge to be day one of when I opened is what we are now. And this whole time, people have been saying how, you know, we've had feedback from participants, I've had feedback from friends, I've had feedback from family and from other providers. And you know, people are like, you're amazing, all of that side of things. It hasn't sunk in, I think, because I've just been go, go, go all the time with this organization, trying to get things right. It wasn't until yesterday when we had the um feedback from the auditor where I just sat back and I'm like, wow, we are here. We are where I've wanted Mind Bridge to be. We're not diverting from those values. We say our values and we actually put them into practice. And that is what I'm proud of. I'm proud of a team that actually commits. I'm proud of a team that is here to really, really advocate for our participants and you know, within the mainstream sector and within NDIS, because that's part of our role as coordinators.

SPEAKER_01 24:35

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 24:36

That's what I'm most proud of. Like, you know, the business side of things, all of that side, I mean, that's great. It's added another level of you know, knowledge for me. But I'm proud of that, the fact that I'm actually actually doing what I intended when I first started Minebridge to do.

SPEAKER_00 24:54

Manifesting. We love it. Manifesting. Yeah, fantastic. Well, look, thank you so much for for joining us today. I feel like it's provided a lot of people that will be listening to this, you know, that's provided so much information on you know running running a business, running like working as a coordinator, and probably families looking for a good coordinator. So, in saying that, where can where can we find you?

SPEAKER_02 25:22

Well, you can find us on our website, mindbridge.net.au. You can give us a call. We've got our phone number on the website as well, all over LinkedIn. We've got Instagram as well, MindBridge Therapy and Coordination. Reach out to us, send us an email, you know. You'll yeah, we're across the board. You'll find us on most platforms.

SPEAKER_00 25:46

Awesome. Anna, it's been lovely to chat to you. Thank you so much.

SPEAKER_02 25:49

Thanks so much, Matt.