#03: She Works 30 Hours a Week and Affords 3 Months in Europe

Nicole Giordano spends three months a year living in Europe, owns her home, and works thirty hours a week in a career she loves. She's the founder of Midlife Creative Studio and a long-time online entrepreneur who has spent the last decade designing a life around what actually matters to her, thoughtfully and strategically. In this episode, she sits down with me to break down how she actually affords the lifestyle.

Nicole and I walk through exactly what she spent on her recent three-month stay in Spain, how she and her partner built a life where either of them could afford it on their own, and her best travel hacks for stretching the budget. Plus, she shares the mindset shift that turned three months in Europe from a vacation fantasy into an annual ritual.

Nicole reveals her "enough" philosophy that lets her spend $12,000 on a kitchen renovation instead of $50,000, the mantra she uses to stay the course even when she’s tempted, and the one question she wants us all to ask ourselves to craft and afford our dream lives.

Get Ashley’s travel budget template where you can estimate trip costs, compare options and plan in advance so that all you have left to do is enjoy your trip, financially stress free. 

Learn more about The Studio, Nicole’s community for midlifers who want more creative practice in their lives.

Check out Ashley’s Money Club to join a community of women unabashedly going after their money goals. 

Take this quiz to get a personalized Wealth Building Blueprint.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

The idea of like that's not my life is something that is just built in, right?

SPEAKER_00 0:06

And so sometimes I say it out loud to myself, like, that's not my life. And sometimes I just know it. My guest today spends three months a year living in Europe, owns her home, works 30 hours a week at a career she loves, and has built a life that is genuinely beautiful. Thoughtfully, strategically, and without spending more than she needs to. And we're getting into exactly how she does it, the mindset, and the actual numbers. Nicole breaks down exactly what a three-month stay in Spain actually costs: flights, rent, food, and all. She shares how she and her partner built a life where either one of them could afford everything on their own, and why that decision changes everything. I don't want to buy a house that if something happened and it was just me, that I would have to leave. Plus, her enough philosophy, the mindset that lets her spend $12,000 on a kitchen renovation instead of $50,000 and feel better about it. And why she says the real secret to affording your dream life is simpler than you think. But I think most people don't take a pause and ask themselves that question and then answer it honestly. I'm Ashley, certified financial planner, founder of the Fiscal Fun, and I'm asking the question everyone is already wondering. How do people actually afford their lives? This is how do you afford this. Welcome to the show, Nicole. We were talking about this last week at lunch, that it's going to be so much fun to record a podcast with a bestie because we can just chat. So I'm so excited to have you here. I'm excited to be here. So I want to get right into it. You live in Europe for three months of the year, you take two other trips, you own your home, you work 30 hours per week in a career you're passionate about. How do you afford this? Yes.

SPEAKER_01 1:53

Tell us a big question. Yeah, that does sound pretty great. And it is great. I would say that I prioritize what is important to me and also have learned to ignore what other people or society think I should be prioritizing. And I would say that's at the heart of it.

SPEAKER_00 2:19

Yes. Oh my gosh. I want to talk all about that. Before we get into that and dive into the numbers, you've crafted this beautiful life where it's clear travel is a top priority for you. What drives your love of travel?

SPEAKER_01 2:34

Yeah. So well, so there's two things. One thing I will say I think is important for me to say for transparency, and it actually is probably a big part of what you're asking me now, is that I don't have children. And I'm not saying that if you do, that this life isn't possible, but it changes things and it makes things you have to approach it differently. But as you know, my child-free status was not by choice. And so when you asked me about what drives my passion for travel, a big part of it was understanding, or when I learned, or when we learned that that path of parenthood wasn't an option for us, taking something that we love, which was travel and going like full force with it and figuring out like really leaning into our consolation prize of location independence and how we can live that life fully really drove us to to the whole like three months abroad and that kind of thing. So that combined with I've always loved traveling, right? As a kid, I was a big reader. So stories about other places, other people, other cultures, just this opening up of a world. Like there's some so much outside of just where I am that I've always known I wanted to travel. But then I would say life circumstances in my adult life made it like, oh, this is going to be my life now. Like if I can't have A, then this is B, and I'm going to, you know, just lean really hard into it.

SPEAKER_00 4:11

And you when you stay somewhere for three months, like you really, you're talking about being in a new place with the people, like you really get a feel of the culture, the people. You are a local essentially.

SPEAKER_01 4:22

Yeah, we we try to be. We try to to to do it in that way. I mean, we don't own a place abroad, so and we do go different places each year. So, you know, there's that it's not like it's a second home, but we do try to make decisions about how we how we travel and how we bring ourselves into the community in a very thoughtful way, so that we're not just like tourists taking over.

SPEAKER_00 4:51

Right. It's a win and it's a win for you. And you mentioned this kind of in the intro question, but as your besties, something I've always admired about you is how clear you are about what you want your life to look like, even just in your answers, you can hear the thoughtfulness and the way you think through it. You're clear, and then you strategically built it, right? And that is so inspiring. How have you gotten so clear on what you wanted? Like, what is do you have a process for it or a way you think through it? Honestly, this is gonna sound trite, but I ask myself, right?

SPEAKER_01 5:24

Most people don't do that. Like most people, it's like it goes back to this beginning thing where it's like about other people's expectations and societal expectations and what defines success and you know, what makes a good life. And everybody's answer to that is different, but I think most people don't take a pause and ask themselves that question and then answer it honestly and not think about what they're supposed to, you know, want for their life, or the steps they think they're supposed to take, or the path they think they're supposed to take. So I appreciate that compliment, and it means a lot to me to hear that from you. And you've said it to me before, and I just think there's no real secret other than asking myself that question and answering it honestly without worrying about anybody else other than my partner in life. Right. Because, you know, it's us together. It matters.

SPEAKER_00 6:21

Opinion matters, I guess. Yeah, and I guess it's for like thinking about it. Maybe it for a lot of us, it's hard to take the layer off where you're like, how much of what I want is because of what other people think. And then I think too, maybe there's like an iterative part of it. Like you, I'm just thinking back one day. I didn't like listen to a podcast in the car. I just was thinking and I thought of you and I was texting you after. I'm like, oh, this is what you mean about like giving yourself self space to actually think about things and not have things like always inundating you. But maybe it's like, okay, let's I think this might be what I want. Let me test it. Let's then live it a little bit. And then is that working? Do I let you know maybe because sometimes it feels so big to figure out what you want in one sitting, you know, or one absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 7:13

And when I say I ask myself that question, it's not as if I had the exact answer, like the exact plan in my answer. It was more just this idea of like, what do I want for my life? And I'm talking about like, you know, a long time ago I'm asking myself that question. And it's like, I know that I want location independence, I know that I want freedom of time, I know that to me, success has more to do with how I get to spend my days and less to do with like the number that's in my bank account. Those kinds of general things. And then once you have that sort of overarching picture and some bigger, bigger ideas, then you kind of work backwards into making it happen, right? So it's like, well, if I want this, then back up, back up, back up, what do I need to start doing now to get me to that point in personal life, in career, like whatever you're talking about? So, and you know, we didn't start by going away for three months to a single place. We went, you know, years ago, we did a month. We went for one month and we were like, oh, this was great. And it wasn't enough time and we wanted to do more, that kind of thing. And then one year we jumped around to a few different places within those three months, and that actually felt like a little bit too much. Like we couldn't like relax into it. So then we're like, let's go to one place a month, and then we're like, hmm, maybe we want a sweet spot of two. So we haven't like figured out the exact formula for us either yet. For a long time, we were 100% sure that we wanted to buy a place somewhere in Europe and we just had to find that place. And we haven't uh ruled that out, but we also have started to like loosen up how we think about that and what it has to look like. And it doesn't necessarily have to be spending on buying and that kind of thing. So to your point, it's it's it wasn't fully formed when I answered that question, but it was more just like honestly asking myself that question and honestly answering it, I guess I should say.

SPEAKER_00 9:06

And it's guiding, it sounds like guiding principles. So then if you get a work project that it's like, oh, this will take up my time freedom, it guides what you say yes to, what you lean into, what you say no to. Absolutely. It's incredible. And it leads me to another observation I've had as a lucky insider in your life is that once you know what you want, and this is again like with the societal expectations and what other like you mentioned, the number in your bank account isn't reflective of success in and of itself. So once you know what you want and you go after it, it becomes enough. And there's like this satisfaction that you have in a world where it can feel like it's never enough. I think that's a huge life on lock.

SPEAKER_01 9:51

Yeah. I mean, I remember the first time you said that to me, which was maybe a while back. I I realized it was like I've never actually used that word. Like, I don't think I ever defined it in that way. But it was like, oh yeah, I understand exactly what you're saying. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 10:07

And like social media, I think, makes it really hard not to compare. So does seeing what your friends are doing and some of the things that you're doing, right? Location freedom, time freedom, they're not what everyone's doing. And so if something is less conventional or there's pressures and comparison, how do you overcome that? How do you handle that? How do you stay with the course of what you know you actually want?

SPEAKER_01 10:30

Yeah, I mean, I will say it's it's not always easy. So, you know, we made some big decisions based on the idea of enough. So, you know, we bought a house that was significantly cheaper than the mortgage we were approved for because what we found, we were like, oh, this works for us. Like, this is enough, right? And we love our house, and it's, you know, a quarter of the size of some of my friends' homes, but it doesn't matter to me, right? So that same thing with the car, right? We bought a Honda Accord hybrid, right? We were buying a new car and we could have bought something that was cool or fun. And we're like, we live in cities, we drive our car whenever we leave the city, which is not often, right? Like, and it, you know, and we paid it off quickly, and now all we have is to pay insurance. So we did make some big enough like uh decisions. And I understand the feeling like that you're mentioning with the whole idea of like with social media or with friends, and that still happens to me, you know. Like I can find myself scrolling on Instagram, which I tried not to do too often, but and be like, oh, that place is so gorgeous, and like how much I would have loved that. But I don't know if I would call it a mantra or if I would just say it's like a knowing in me, but the idea of like that's not my life is something that is just built in, right? And so sometimes I say it out loud to myself, like, that's not my life. And sometimes I just know it. Like when I see something, it doesn't matter, like, oh, that's beautiful. And then I keep scrolling because that's not my life. Yeah. And I think it comes like it's it's something, it's almost like you practice, right? So I said we like bought this house. It's an older home, it's over a hundred years old. It needed some work. We waited five years to like make the kitchen something that we loved. And even then, we could have spent $50,000 gutting the entire kitchen, new cabinets, like done it all up. But we decided we cared more about creating a feeling. And I think so we we we did a our kitchen, we just like did some updates so that it felt a certain way. And we spent $12,000 instead of $50,000, right? And I think that that is part of that mindset, this idea of like, whether you're talking about a kitchen or anything else, it's like, how do I want to feel in my life? How do I want to feel day to day, month to month, year to year? And of course, not every day you feel this way, but it's building a structure around yourself that supports not just what you want, but how you like what you want your like your days to look like and everything, but how you want your days to feel. Like, what is it you're so when I walk into my kitchen, I love it and we cook a lot. So I I use the kitchen as an example because we spend a lot of time in there. And it's not the architectural digest chicken uh chicken kitchen, but it or the chicken. There's a lot of chicken being made. But it is something that makes me smile and makes my partner smile, and we we love it. And so just kind of thinking that way too, right? So when you see something beautiful on Instagram or you walk into your friend's house who they did spend the full 1.5 million, right? Like, and that's great because that's their goal and that's what makes them happy. When you see those things, you can start to flip that into more like, oh, what do I love about this so much? Like, how does this place make me feel? Oh, I love that they did XYZ. Maybe I can do something similar in my home and have that same feeling. Like you can be, I don't know, creative in how you think. None of that is to say that it's easy. I do understand it, but come up with a phrase, something that you can say to yourself to just kind of pull yourself out of it because it's that's the hardest part. And once you get good at that, then you are just making the decisions that are right for you based on your life.

SPEAKER_00 14:20

That's not my life. I love that mantra. And I can't tell like most, I don't know if I can say most, if someone's fact-checking me, but I feel like a lot of people get the most mortgage they can get. Oh, yeah. Or do the biggest kitchen reno they can, right? And you consciously have created so much space for the travel, for even for the kitchen reno, right? And curious, just because you were talking about the feeling, which your kitchen is gorgeous, and and you do get that feeling, and maybe like taught like if you're open to sharing what that feeling is and how you think that would have been different, would it be different if you spent the 50k? Like how much in feeling cost are we having?

SPEAKER_01 15:10

Oh, yeah, that's so interesting. I've not thought about it like that. Like feeling cost.

SPEAKER_00 15:15

So amazing.

SPEAKER_01 15:19

Okay, so essentially what we were what we were what we decided was like, okay, what what do we what is our goal with this kid? What do we do? Why are we doing this, right? Like, why are we updating it? We're like, well, we want it to feel like uh exciting to be in there. We want to like enjoy ourselves when we're cooking, we want a like light, more light in there. We want the same feeling we have when we travel, which is like we sp most of our travel, a large portion of our travel is in Europe. Like, we want to feel that like touching Europe when we're not there. And so we took this approach of just like choosing elements to change that made us feel like we were in this little awesome kitchen in an old home somewhere like in the countryside of like Italy or something with like terracotta tiles and you know, like that kind of thing. And and we like we we put a skylight in. So that was something that was an extra cost, but was important to how we feel when we're in there to walk into that. Because you know, I live in a city, I live in the historical part of a city. It's a little row home on an adorable little tree-lined street, but it can be dark, right? Because it's like this little historical tiny thing. And so putting that in was a choice to spend extra money, but it was because it felt really good to us, and that was important. So, like when I say things about how I make these decisions on what to spend on and whatnot, and all that, I don't live in or navigate in like this feeling of like longing, right? I spend money. I just spend money on things that I'm important to me, and I think about how they make me feel in my life.

SPEAKER_00 17:03

So I don't know if that answered your question, but Yes. And do you think that you would have enjoyed it more if you spent more or not necessarily?

SPEAKER_01 17:10

No, I don't think I would have enjoyed it. Absolutely not. Would I enjoy it more if I had spent more? I think there's probably from like a utility standpoint, I might have gotten a little more out of it, like some added counter space. Like that would have been nice because we cook a lot, right? But the cost of that wasn't like I just didn't want to, like, I didn't care that much, right? And so yeah, I certainly wouldn't have. Um, and there's almost a joy in the creative way we made it be what we wanted it to be, without just gutting it and like having someone come in and tell us exactly what to do, right? Like we researched the tiles. We went and got all these little paint chips and just painted our cabinets the exact color that we wanted. And, you know, we did that. And I think that's another thing, this idea overall of like being able to think about, you know, a DIY mindset without it being like a scary thing. I don't think everybody needs to go into everything, whether you're talking about a kitchen reno or just like, you know, any other service in your life. But if you're talking about ways of like thinking about money, and it's just I think people think they can't do stuff, but with without taking a moment to to to to reflect on whether they could try it themselves. And so for us with the kitchen, it was like, let's sit down and like make this fun, right? Like, what could we do ourselves? And even just the using of Pinterest, you know, those things. So I wouldn't have enjoyed it, right? I would have enjoyed it less, I think, if I spent more because I would have been just sort of like, you know, like, oh, just do it, whatever, make it all happen.

SPEAKER_00 18:46

Yeah, of course. Right. There's something in the relishing and in the dreaming, kind of the same with travel. And I also love what you shared about going into a friend's house, like using whether it's like the hit tinge of comparison or the tinge of jealousy as like a, oh, let me get creative with this. What can you do? Yeah. All right. So to the numbers of your travel, just because, and also to your point on encouraging people to see what they could actually do. That's something that you nudge me to do in my business all the time when you're like, maybe you should try this. Like, I bet you could do this, right? So you really do live this. And it, I it, like you said, it's a mindset. It touches your travel, it touches your kitchen, it touches how you think of everyday expenses. And so that's why I was so excited to have this conversation because you're just how you think of money is brilliant, I think, because you don't, you're like you said, you're not longing, you're not wanting, you're very strategic. So curious, can you walk us through what your expenses look like for a typical three-month stint in Europe? And because I've had a couple episodes with people who are travel influencers, content creators, like I just want to say for everyone listening that you are not a travel influencer right now, getting comp trips. So this is something that you're paying for like the rest of us.

SPEAKER_01 20:04

100%. Yes. I have, and I'm, I won't ever like I have no plans to be a travel influencer. There's nothing in, yeah, that's not a thing for me. So, no, this all is paid for by us. So yeah, okay. So walking you through it. So, first of all, twice a month, $350 is put aside. So $700 a month is put aside now into its own account. Now, the thing to keep in mind with that is that doesn't cover everything, like the like you know, when we do that, but it's such a big chunk that it makes it feel less like oof, when you start booking the tickets and you know, the reserving your apartment and all that stuff. And so I think that that it doesn't have to be that you're putting aside, I mean, if you can or if you or if you want to go for it. But for us, it just feels good to have like a nice chunk that we are like, okay, this is our our pool of money, our little pot, right? So that's the first thing that I should say. Then the expenses would be the major one being the apartment. So we own our house here in Philly. We do not rent it out. That's something we've talked about, but I we haven't moved in that direction. I think I don't know, we love our home a lot, and we it it I don't I don't know. I'm not there yet with this idea of just like having someone come in for three months and live there. I I don't know that that will always be the case, but for now, we carry both our mortgage and our Europe rent over the three-month period. But we we left New York seven years ago, and there were a few reasons, but one of them was to lower monthly expenses because we wanted to be able to do things like this. And so our mortgage is under $2,000 a month, which is wonderful. Especially for living in the heart of a like the historic area of a of a city. But so we we made that decision from having, I think it was, I think we were paying like $3,600 a month in rent in New York before we left. And that was a big jump. Or, you know, like a big drop, I should say.

SPEAKER_00 22:18

And that was seven years ago. That was seven years ago. Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:21

Right. Okay. I don't know what you all are doing now. The double. Yeah, I don't know. I don't want to know. So there's that. And then we try to keep our apartments around $2,500 US dollars a month, which we found is depending on where you're going, you know, you have to pick your cities this way too. You think about that when you're making your decision where you're going. Um, it's pretty doable. So that's that. I mean, other okay, our flights. So our flights, we try we look for flights into like direct flights that are easy and from Philly that there are a lot of flights, so they tend to be lower. So places like Lisbon, Madrid, like easy. And then we often, even if we're going to another city from there, we will often just fly into the main city that is, you know, a cheaper flight, and then we'll take a train if we're so this past winter we flew into Madrid and then we took a much less expensive two-hour train into Valencia, and Valencia, Spain is where we were spending our three months. So that was just, you know, it we got uh compared prices and we didn't want to keep flight like do a second flight because it was more. So there's that, and the flights, I would say all in, it's usually like I think it's about maybe six or seven hundred round trip each into the city. So let's say 1400 in flights. Um, we usually don't use miles for that because we like to take other trips and we try to apply miles to more expensive further flights. Um what else? So I mean, food and groceries, it's just a it's you know, instead of here, it's happening there. I will say it's cheaper. That has been we always have sticker shock when we come back to Philly after being in Europe when it comes to groceries. One thing that happens is you tend to go out a bit more when you are in a new place. So our our going out budget, we would increase. We are thoughtful about it and a bit strategic, but we do spend more. So I would say could easily spend in it's probably maybe about 500 a month in just enjoying ourselves at like restaurants and stuff. We would go out to dinner more than we would here in Philly, but not like nutty, like, you know, as if it were vacation. Because that's the other thing. If you're gonna do something like this, something like three months, and you want to talk about like, you know, the money, how we do this. One important thing is this mindset shift around reminding yourself that this isn't vacation, right? So you're not like booking tons of excursions. You're not going to every hot new restaurant that this city has to offer. Like you're you're strategic. You're picking and choosing a few things to do because it's not a vacation.

SPEAKER_00 25:19

And I notice too, when you're picking where you're staying, like in a neighborhood, you're not staying in like the tourist hub. You're usually, and it honestly is a win-win. You're often staying in a cool residential neighborhood or something where someone would want to live, and that changes the rentals you're able to find. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 25:37

So uh what a big part of it is doing your neighborhood research. So I I kind of look at it like if this is like if the center is like the the place where all the tourists are and where all of the like, you know, the museums that you're probably going to visit and stuff are there, you start looking at the out like the rings. How many rings out would you are you willing to be? And we try to pick something like a little bit, you know, one or two rings out because want to be able to keep walk, like still walk. We're walkers and so keep walking, but being open to that walk might be 20 or 30 minutes instead of, you know, five or ten or fifteen. But yeah, and it feels better doing that too. You're it you don't the the mayhem of the tourist hub, you just feel much more a part of the community. And you get to, I mean, we in three months we would we there was this little place in Valencia where we would go and have wine and tap us, and they were the loveliest people who owned it, and they would recognize us, and we, you know, in that three months we had that grocers recognize you. You like create those bonds and stuff, which is really nice.

SPEAKER_00 26:46

I love it. And I just, you know, I'm still not, I was like, can I do this math in my head? And I pulled up a spreadsheet because I'm not listening and doing math. So I really, yeah, but curious. So you mentioned that you're putting 350 aside twice a month. So that, oh, I actually did once a month. Okay, so right there you have $8,400 a year that's set aside for this. Then you have $2,500 a month for the rental, $1,400 flights. We're at $8,900. So you're really and curious, like you mentioned groceries are cheaper, you're dining out more. Does that cancel out? Or do you find you're still spending like maybe probably still spending a little bit more, right?

SPEAKER_01 27:26

Because this is the thing with like not making sure you're not living in that place of like longing ever either, right? And so you're going to a place, you're spending three months there. You want to enjoy the place. If you spend your whole time in the apartment, like what's the point of being there? And so and the thing to remember is that this is you don't have a community there. So like at home, you can have social time by inviting your friends over. Everybody BYOs, and maybe you order a pizza and hang out, right? And you can do that on the the cheap. There, you don't have that. So if you want to feel any social connection, you're going out. You have to go out and be amongst people. That will cost more money. So I would say I think we still we still spent a bit more in our monthly output, but we're okay with that because we want to enjoy the place. And it's just a nice, it's an it's a little bonus that the groceries are lower. So it helps to offset it a little bit, but it's still, we're still spending more.

SPEAKER_00 28:24

So we're talking if it's like 8,900 flights in place, maybe like 9,500 or 10,000 for the for your trip.

SPEAKER_01 28:33

Yeah, I would say that I'm trying to think of, I can't think of anything else additional that I wouldn't be spending when I just to be alive like here, you know, like in Philly. So I don't think I'm forgetting anything that would skew that any in any way uh too big, other than if there's like, you know, one of the things, cool things about Europe in particular is just you can like be somewhere and then take a train to another town for the weekend, right? And that might not happen as often in your home city, like you might not do that as much, although you could, I guess, but people don't tend to. So we had a few of those too, like little weekends in like a little a small town in Spain, that kind of thing. So that's you know, those are weekend trips and that adds too, but it's it's not right outrageous.

SPEAKER_00 29:23

So right. And you already shared a lot of these, but any like as an avid traveler, experienced travel, like any other hacks for those who want to afford to travel more. You mentioned transferring money year-round, which you know I love. I'm obsessed with that. And then being like in a not uh like a two rings out town, treating it like you're living there, not doing all the hot restaurants, all the excursions, excursions, etc. Yeah. But anything else?

SPEAKER_01 29:51

Yeah, I would say so. One thing that I I like to do is I I have a bunch of recipes. So we we cook a lot, right? So I have a bunch of recipes and I I tend to write recipes so they're on recipe cards. But this year, what I did was I went through them before we left for Europe and I took photos of several of them that are nothing like fancy but with ingredients and you know, nothing, no fancy equipment. So that, and I put them on my phone in this folder so that when we were there, I had this like little, you know, booklet on my phone of easy things to cook that I already know that we love, like we enjoy. That's why they made it to the recipe card to begin with. And it doesn't matter if it there's not like some fancy blender situation that I need, you know, in the kit, like that's not there. And that really helps because when you're in a new place and you walk into a grocery store, everything's different, especially when you're an American going into a grocery store in another country. You can expect about a tenth of what you're used to finding in this other, which I think, you know, that that could be a whole other podcast. But the point just being like, you have you can't go into this grocery store thinking, like, well, I'm just gonna make this XYZ thing that I make all the time at home, because I bet you a whole bunch of that stuff is not gonna be there, right? So just this idea of like preparing yourself in that way so that when you do walk into grocery stores, being like, well, this is mostly veggie, and I think I can find most of these veggies, you know, like that kind of thing. So I would say that's another one. That's a good one. Also, in terms of booking your flights, so the second week in January is for for the actual travel, is a sweet spot. I'm I think a lot of people know that, but it's just like it can be 30, 40%. Oh, okay. All right, so it could be 30 to 40% cheaper because that second week of January is they call it's like a quiet zone because this holiday season has just sort of come to a close and everybody's exhausted. But and work travel isn't gonna happen the week after that, you know. So like there's this week. So we always fly out then. Obviously, we're staying for a while, but that, you know, that's something that brings down costs if you if you can. But this is an example where like if you have kids, you probably can't fly. You can't probably can't leave for three months at that, at that point. But maybe you can, I don't know, situation.

SPEAKER_00 32:10

And it's also when it's really cold where we are, so it's like a really nice and the holidays are over, it's like a nice night. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:16

Yeah, but I'm so glad you said that because something else with this tapping into this mindset and this idea that this is not a vacation. So we're going to southern Spain. I'm leaving from Philadelphia, which is in the northeastern region of the United States. So yes, it's cold here and it's warmer there at that time, but it's still winter. And so, like, I if I wanted to go and be on like some tropical beach for those three months, this would cost me five times that, right? Like, this is, and you have to, you have to be okay with that. So I remember like telling people, be like, oh, you're going to Spain, like, oh my gosh, what's the weather gonna be like? And I'd be like, well, it's going to be about 60 degrees to tick to 63 degrees during the day. And it'll get into the high 40s at night. And they sort of look at me like, what the hell, who cares? Why would you do that? And it's an improvement. It's not 20 degrees. Huge improvement.

SPEAKER_00 33:10

Or seven, exactly.

SPEAKER_01 33:11

Oh yeah, you you all got it this year. But yes, but it's not what societal expectations, other people's expectations. Like, well, if I'm gonna leave in January and February, I want to be laying on a beach and you know, on a tropical island. I'm like, that's great. Do you have $25,000 to spend the next three months doing that? If you do, fantastic. But this is how we so I still had a coat with me. It wasn't my like to my ankles coat. I didn't have my ear muffs, I didn't have all that, but I wore a coat at night. So that kind of shift is important too. Right. Not going when everyone wants to. Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. And being okay with that feeling like, no, you're not leaving the winter for the the beach. You're leaving the winter for something a little bit warmer, but it makes it possible to live in Europe for three months, right?

SPEAKER_00 34:00

So Right. Yes, I love it. The mindset just follows us through the conversation. Also to the, I feel like it's fun if you're cooking, like you repeat a lot of amazing recipes. To cook them with different ingredients in a different country is probably fun. And I'm just when you were like, be prepared. I just my last trip to Europe in the Netherlands, I thought I was getting peanut butter and I was getting peanut sauce. So I made like a peanut sauce and jelly sandwich. Like had more of a Thai player. Kids are like, thanks, Mom. Interesting. Um, so yes, let's be prepared can be really helpful. All right. So I would love to, if you're up for it, shift to income, the money coming in that makes the lifestyle possible. What are the ways you earn money? And can you share, like, what can you share as far as how much you earn and different income streams? Sure.

SPEAKER_01 34:55

So you're catching me, as you know, at a time where I'm wrapping up one business and starting to launch another. So my right now things are different than what they have been. I would say that up until this point, I was bringing so I I run a I run online businesses. So that's I should say that first of all, like that's a big part of this too. Like that I work remotely. My partner also works remotely. And so there is that flexibility. And we do work while we are over there. Um, it's not as if it's three months of like vacation, like I said. So prior to this shift in what's the changes that I've been making with my career, it was about 140 of income from the business for me. And then now though, as I'm wrapping that up and I'm transitioning, my my income has pummeted. I make under $100,000 right now. But what is important to like remember here is that we built this life in a way that either one of us could afford the lifestyle, the house, the car, whatever, on our own. That was important to me from the beginning. Like, separate from this idea of being able to travel anywhere, it was like, I don't want to buy a house that if something happened and it was just me, that I would have to leave. Right. Like that was so not I'm building my home and I I so we make, we, we, we make and have made decisions for so many years that have set us up in a way that we don't live we can live on one income, I guess is ultimately what I'm trying to say. And so not a lot has to change, but we have those conversations. Like if something does have to change, which I don't want to get off track, we can talk about that later, like the conversations that I have with my partner about that stuff. But so you were asking about income. So about 140, I'm below 100,000 now. That w will not stop us if we we have every intention of leaving again for three months next winter, unless something else is the reason why we don't. And so I don't know what else can I answer about that? Was that the only question?

SPEAKER_00 37:07

No, that yes, and I think it's so inspiring because it allowed you to shift into a new business that you are passionate about without having to uproot everything that you've crafted as far as your lifestyle. Absolutely, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 37:20

And can you tell us about the new business? Thank you. It's the Midlife Creative Studio. And it is an online space for midlifers like myself who want to use creativity to have more fun in life, to support emotional health and well-being, to just, you know, play again in a way that we haven't since we were kids. And so it's very new, but we do little like live gatherings and we have an app, and people come in and you know, you're part of the community and share what you're doing, doodling, drawing, creative journaling, that kind of thing. Just having fun again. So it's very new, but they're so fun.

SPEAKER_00 37:59

Yeah, we're it's exciting. Classes are so fun. Yes. Yes. Highly recommend checking it out. And as so the focus of the business is women in midlife. Has your philosophy around money, spending, career changed as you've gotten older?

SPEAKER_01 38:14

Yes. I would say that I was always like kind of thoughtful and slow. Like I never liked the word hustle. But as I've gotten older, it's like even more so. Like I'm shifting my business because I ran that online business or continue to run it, but it I started that in 2009. And I am not the same person I was then, right? Like a lot I've changed, I've evolved, and my interest has changed and evolved. And I don't care if the the business that I launch now doesn't make me the same amount of money that that business was making. I I'm okay with it. And I do the math around, well, what do I what do I need? Like what like what what should be coming in? And then if there's more made, great. But I I I don't money is not a driver in that way. Um, I also I'm just like just sort of like I said, slow about things. And I don't mean that that doesn't mean that I don't have ambition, which I think a lot of people think is what I mean when I say that. And that's not true. Those are two, it's very different. It's just how I go about what I want my business to look like, what you know, what I want my work to be. It's just I I take some real time to again think about how I want to feel, what I want this to be like. And the first business answered that, but it answered that when I was 29, 35, 40. I'm now going to, I'll be 46 this year. And so my answer to that question is different. And so shifting that business was important. So yeah, and I think also I I don't know. I think I've always I've never been a big uh like my spending, yes, if my age changed how I spend. I I don't know that that has changed so much, but I've never been a like, you know, stock my closet full of stuff spender to begin with. So I don't know that I I can't think of an example of my money philosophy changing with age.

SPEAKER_00 40:24

I love the separating of ambition from the enoughness. I think that so I could talk to you about the everything for a very long time. So, but I still have a few questions. So you have a wonderful partner, Jim. We love Jim. He has also been your business partner. How do you two handle money? Joint accounts, separate, hybrid, like yeah. And then I I'm curious too, just those any conversations that that you wished you had or that you had as you two got more serious, like in Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 40:57

So yeah, I think people will be a little surprised. So we are only a joint accounts. And I know that most people, I shouldn't say that, again, the most fact checkers, but a lot of people, a lot of people are we don't have them.

SPEAKER_00 41:12

So we can say whatever we want. It's great we're fact-checking ourselves, though, you know, like that's pretty responsible.

unknown 41:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 41:20

So I was just saying that a lot, most of the conversations I have with friends or people like who are around my age, they either have completely separate accounts or they have like a single household joint account and then they each keep their own accounts and that kind of thing. We did not do that for whatever reason. I think I think I there are a few reasons why that, you know, we have always been in partnership, and I and that I mean like, you know, we're we've we're very entrepreneurial. So like at one point he had a job and I was trying to get the business going, and then the business was going well, and then he wanted to start something, and so then he, you know, he did this, and then I did so there was for so many years, especially in the early part of our relationship, and I should say we were very good friends before we became like life partners, so there was that too. But there was always like this give and take, like, okay, you go and work on that, and I'll make sure things are covered here, and then flip, you know, okay, you go and and and so it just never occurred to us to do things separately. I I don't know. I mean, we have one credit card and it's both of our credit cards. So I uh yeah, we don't we don't do that. And I know that all of the, you know, money savvies, all the financial femmes out there you've been teaching, it's like, you know, prenup and you know, having these discussions and doing that thing, and we did not do that.

SPEAKER_00 42:45

But I don't know, maybe uh just luck that it it hasn't been an issue and con- And it's beautiful the stepping in for each other with the very because that's something I always wonder about too, with entrepreneurs together. You know, now he's in more of a full-time role, but like just the give and take and the letting each other experiment and grow. And yeah, it it's that it makes sense a lot of times to think about it in a combined way.

SPEAKER_01 43:12

Right. Right. And for a long time, I mean we built our the last business, start imagine, we built that together. So it was kind of like one of those things where it was like, okay, one of us needs some income while the other one puts all their attention in here, right? And then it was like, okay, now that my side has gotten of this business, I've really laid a foundation. Now let me go find some income and you do your part, right? Like, and that was really how we start, we built that business in the beginning. But we do, you know, we have this conversation. So like I'm in this space now where I'm transitioning, and while we're fine financially, we had the conversation like, okay, well, we put about $40,000 a year into continue to for retirement. We're probably doing more at this point than we need to. And it was like, okay, well, if at any point it things get a little bit like, oh, we sh okay, well, we'll just drop that. We'll take a little bit more income until your new business is off the ground. So we we had that conversation. Like, we'll be fine if that's what we have to do. Right. Right. And yeah, so we do that. And then we're complete transparency. We both have every login, every account we both are on, so we can both see things. Nobody's in the dark about anything. And then we each have our roles on like how we like who manages the stuff. So like he tends to manage the bigger things like retirement stuff, and he'll like look if our HSA percentage goes down, he'll be the one to do the research and be like, oh, is there another high yield savings that's offering a promo and we can move our money there? Whereas I, I mean, and all in conversation, we're both involved, but he's his he does that. And then I'm the everyday person. I look at the credit card and our our expenses. Did we spend more this month? Did we not? Like what had why do we need to be eating a lot of bean salads for in a couple of weeks because we like overdid it last month? You know, he's fully aware, but I tend to make sure all of that's done. So it's very partnership.

SPEAKER_00 45:13

Did that happen naturally, the roles, or did you say, hey, I want to do this, I want to do this.

SPEAKER_01 45:20

Yeah, I think he's like the best researcher, right? Like he's just we talk about this because I think our your husband, my own. And so I don't have that kind of patience, right? And he does and he's good at it. And so it just sort of naturally like you do that part, like you find us the new account we should be in. I'm happy to make sure that our grocery bill wasn't super outrageous this year for no reason or this month for no reason, right? That kind of thing.

SPEAKER_00 45:51

All right, and then because I don't want to keep us so long, even though I do, but I would love to talk about gym more. Um, but we talked about your home. Like you're not only the reno, but like you have incredible style. Like your home is beautifully decorated. You eat fabulous food. I know you are budget conscious, you're choosing, you're cooking a lot, but it's like what you're eating is amazing. So just curious about this lifestyle you've crafted, how much you're spending, how you make it work. I'm happy to go one by one, like clothes, food, yeah, decor. But I think it's something that's very inspiring because I know it's done very cost consciously and strategically, but it's also fabulous.

SPEAKER_01 46:35

Thank you. Yeah, sure. My first, my whole work for decades, this business I had been talking about that I'm transitioning out of is in the fashion industry. So my background is in textile design. I just design fabric and that kind of thing. So I'm in the world of fashion. And so I've always loved the craftsmanship of fashion. So I for a very long time have taken the approach with my personal style where the vast majority of what I spend is on a few pieces that are special. And I mean, I, you know, the the Everlanes and the packs and places like that, I'll have, I'll get basic T's and that kind of thing. But I don't do a lot of it. I have navy, white, black, tan t-shirt. Like I'm very much like that. It's not a capsule by any means, but it's more like, okay, what do I need in my closet? I do that. And then where I spend more is on those special pieces, the ones that are made of hand woven fabric or, you know, embroidered or just something special. I buy things on my travels. I love that. So yeah, I don't spend a lot. I don't shop often. I actually don't love shopping. I it's not, you know, because I think when I see something that I'm in love with, like, wow, that's so beautiful. That's me, isn't shopping. It's like discovering a piece of art. And it's like, okay, I want that and I want to buy it. And I feel okay with it because I don't buy 40 different styles of jeans and have them all in my closet. I don't, you know, have 27 different V-neck black sweaters. Like I just, I just don't. So so that's how I approach style. Not afraid, though, to spend on the really beautiful quality things. I mean, within reason, there are like $600 blouses that I look at and I'm like, that's stunning, but I'm not spending that, right? So I do, you know, keep myself reined in, but I do love really beautifully made things.

SPEAKER_00 48:32

And how about is it a similar philosophy with how you decorate your home?

SPEAKER_01 48:38

So I mean, I think that part of it just is what my style is, which is I love old things. I love old things that were that have a story. So we take our time with filling the house. Most of the pieces of art or decoration are from our travels, either our individual travels before we were together or our travels, you know, since we've been together. I mean, I have a wall in my house that has nothing on it. I've been in my house, it'll be seven years in July, and the wall just doesn't have anything on it. And it's because I haven't found the thing that's going to go on that yet. I don't just go to the store and buy things to put in the house. And then even within like the furniture, like we will spend on what's important to us. So we love to cook, we love to have people over to eat and gather. So we had a really beautiful dining room table made from reclaimed what it cost was $4,000 for the table and the chairs. It's perfect and we love it. We have two mismatch couches that are smushy and I love them. And I just got some fun throw pillows that match, so they tie in, and the two couches are not the same couch, and I don't care, right? So, like, you know, like again, it's like having that balance of stuff. We have this beautiful hand woven piece of fabric that we we bought when we were in Indonesia hanging on our wall. We also have this little non-functioning, funky little teapot that we found at a flea market in Paris for a quarter. And that's on a shelf in our kitchen, right? So it's the same mix and match of things, and it all is just about how it makes me feel, what you know, what's important to us and what's not. And the exactly matching couches doesn't matter to me. They're cozy and they're comfy, and I think about how they face each other. And I can have my friends over and we hug pillows and we talk for hours, right? Like you've been one of those people, right? And it just feels good. So it does.

SPEAKER_00 50:29

It feels so cozy and good. And then last thing, just food food. You're always eating the best things. Like, and you mentioned you spend less when you're home, but you're always trying, you're and maybe always is the wrong word. How often are you going to the fun restaurant? I know you're cooking so much, but you're finding really incredible recipes. Like, what is that philosophy?

SPEAKER_01 50:49

Yeah, so I would say we probably go out one or two times a month. So it's not that much. The philosophy around that, though, and this is interesting because it's shifted recently, where we started to realize that we no longer care about going to a place that isn't special. And so by that I mean like I live in an area where all kinds of new places are popping up. And, you know, there's a cool new place, the vibes look cool. It's a pretty basic menu. Everybody's like, oh, they have a good burger. It's like a $28 burger, doesn't come with fries, and it's like, okay, I could go do that, whatever. I hate that. Or there's this Filipino place that opened up around the corner, and like I will spend more there. It's the food is beautiful. That's where I'm gonna book a place and go. And I don't care anymore about checking out this new place that opened up where you know people are liking to hang out. And it it's it's interesting how that has shifted recently. It's like I I canceled a this last year, my birthday's in September. So it was last September. I canceled a reservation that we had made for a birthday dinner because I was just like, we've never been to the place, but I was like, the menu looks nice. Like, oh yeah, that would be nice. I don't want to go. And instead, we like walked deeper into South Philly, and we went to this amazing hole in the wall Indian place and had incredible food. We still spent money, it's it's amazingly crafted food. But it was just like much more interesting to me. So we've really shifted like how we think about where we want to go. And then in terms of our groceries, this is a place where we we do embrace the little luxuries, right? Like I think about what we're gonna have, like what we want to cook, and I think about the ingredients accordingly. So, as an example, I have an amazing cheese shop near me. Their feta is like $18 a pound, but it's the most incredible, punchy, amazing feta. I could get it at the grocery store for probably six or seven dollars a pound. Depending on the recipe, is depending on where I'm going. So if feta does not play a big role in this recipe, I'm just gonna get the grocery store one and it's gonna be fine. If feta is like, you know, it's fatouche salad and it's just feta everywhere, I'm getting the good stuff, right? So really exactly. So finding the balance there. And also like looking for recipes. I love New York Times recipes. I think that they are just so well vetted. And then the more you cook, the more fun you can have with changing out ingredients, you know, like and I've gotten to the point where I understand flavor profiles, I understand how different ingredients work. And so it's like, oh, this sounds really good, but they want this, like, they want me to get this thing that's maybe super expensive or whatever. I'm like, I bet I can make it with this instead. But that takes practice. You know, we have a friend who loves to switch out things and recipes, but she's not there yet. So she's always saying, This isn't very good, and we know why.

SPEAKER_00 53:51

Different to leave out six things than swap watch strategies. She's gonna love this. But we know also just uh just calling out when you said our philosophy about choosing restaurants has changed to even have a philosophy, right? Like that is just like that's a whole different level of how you think. Like, this is how we're thinking about it strategically. So many people will just go to the burger place because it's every week because that's what you do. Right. And that and they don't we don't think it's just like this thoughtfulness and reflection of how we want to be choosing, and you're choosing restaurants that you enjoy more, so it's such a win-win. But I just wanted to call that out because to even have the shift, you have to have a philosophy around it, and that's pretty incredible. Curious, what are you working toward affording next?

SPEAKER_01 54:44

I think we want to take the same approach that we had did with our kitchen to our our back patio. So, as I mentioned, it's a tiny house in an old neighborhood. So we just have like a little concrete, like 15 by 15 patio. It's not very inspiring to be in. I put some potted plants out there, but it's like lacking the oomph. So we're gonna do that same DIY. What do we want it to feel like? What elements are we work are we willing to spend more on? Which are we gonna not spend as much on, like all that. And we want to do that for the the patio.

SPEAKER_00 55:14

Yeah, this was so much fun, Nicole, and so, so valuable. Thank you for giving us an inside look into how your beautiful brain works and things, so that we can apply these wealthy mindset shifts to our own lives. Where can everyone find you and support your work? Thanks.

SPEAKER_01 55:30

The midlife creativestudio.com.

SPEAKER_00 55:33

Thank you. Amazing. Check it out, sign up for classes, and thank you so much again. Bye. Thank you so much for listening to How Do You Afford This? If you loved this inside look into how people are actually affording their lives, follow and subscribe wherever you get your podcast. We have new episodes dropping every week, and trust me, you do not want to miss them. And please share this with a friend. You'll get credit for introducing them to their favorite new podcast. Yes, I said it. And you'll be helping me on my mission to make crafting a wealthy life more accessible, more transparent, and a whole lot more fun. See you next week.