Human Connection Always Wins with Pink Noise

In this episode, we cover:

• Why internet hype is secondary to the "long grind."
• The legacy Pink Noise wants to leave behind.
• Under-the-radar band recommendations you need to check out (featuring Silly Goose and Code Words).

Special thanks to the Adobe community and DistroKid for supporting independent music. Don’t forget to sign up for our newsletter at loyaltothecraft.com!

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

What's up Adobe Radio? This is Mike Jafar here coming at you from the loyal lounge in the Crystal Coast of North Carolina. When I was 15 years old, I started building drums in my grandma's basement, and shortly after, I realized the power of networking. I've worked with my musical heroes growing up, and I navigated my way through a career in music. And I want you to know that you can too. Let's learn from my friends that I've met along the way. Tonight's guest is Pink Noise. We met at NAM, a trade show many years ago after I saw videos popping off on social media with Pink Noise's music and music videos. Tonight we're talking about the grind behind the art, identity, creativity, navigating the music industry, staying authentic, and what it really takes to chase your dreams. Pink Noise, welcome to Loath of the Craft. Thanks so much for being here.

SPEAKER_01 0:47

What's up, Mike? Thank you so much for having me. I appreciate it.

SPEAKER_00 0:50

So tell me, you just got off the road with Magnolia Park. Tell me all about it. What was it like? Was anything crazier than you thought was going to happen? How do you feel now? And just what was the whole experience like for you?

SPEAKER_01 1:03

Oh man, it was an incredible experience. I mean, Magnolia Park, not only are they the best guys, but they sound incredible live. So of course it was nerve-wracking getting on a stage and sharing stage with them. Um, but it was the most fun I've probably ever had in my life. Um, it was my first tour, so selling out almost all 17 dates and playing to these people that want to hear my music was just incredible. And it was a dream come true, man. Um, lots of lots of really exciting stuff happening this year. So I'm really stoked about it.

SPEAKER_00 1:37

Awesome. So you're home now and are you getting ready for another tour? Are you writing? Like what's your what's the uh creative energy like right now for you?

SPEAKER_01 1:46

So for the first time ever, I am actually in album mode. So I'm super stoked about that. And I leave for tour on the 30th of this month, which is about a week and a half away. So I'm I'm very excited. And uh I have most of my year booked already. So I mean it's just it's amazing. I'm so grateful.

SPEAKER_00 2:07

Heck yeah. And who who is that tour with? Is it is it you solo? Are you going on an or are you supporting another artist? What's that look like? What's the bill?

SPEAKER_01 2:15

So for this next tour in June, I will be supporting a band called True North. And um, they're awesome, they're great friends of mine. And um, after that, I will be going on tour with a band called Until I Wake.

SPEAKER_00 2:29

Cool.

SPEAKER_01 2:29

And in between those, I'll have like some headliner dates.

SPEAKER_00 2:32

Awesome. All great bands, and I'm sure the fans are gonna love your music and your show as well. What is what is the setup like for you? Are you independent? Do you have a label, management? Like what's what's your what's you know, what's the uh pink noise kind of you know setup looking like?

SPEAKER_01 2:48

Yeah, so I started out independent and then um I signed to a label called Network Music Group, and they have bands like The Haunt, Arrows in Action, Rose Colored World, um, just a really, really cool roster for rock. They're starting in the rock space now. So um, I'm very grateful to be a part of the team on Network, and I do have management. Um, I actually share management with Brian Birkheiser, um, former iPorvail and Scatterbrain.

SPEAKER_00 3:19

I love that.

SPEAKER_01 3:19

So he is uh he's been like a mentor to me. So um we just linked up and uh I got to know his team and they were like, we would really love to help you. So um now it's just you know, we're like family. So it's it's been amazing.

SPEAKER_00 3:35

That's so cool. You know, loyal to the craft's whole mission is to share experiences, the ups and the downs, and the dreams, and the you know, the big dreams and the the things that potentially can get in the way of the creative process of making that happen. And I know your your music impacts a lot of people in different ways, but talk to me about belonging. You know, we you just got off this tour, you had fans seeing you for the first time that you may have engaged with online or maybe just saw you that night. What is your take on that in in the community and the belonging factor and how does that play a part into your music, especially when you're writing?

SPEAKER_01 4:13

Oh man, um, you know, I my whole life I've pretty much felt like an outcast. I've always been different, and uh for better or for worse, you know, that's just who I am. Um and I think there is a sense of feeling like I belong in music because I have my freedom of artistic expression. Um, and I think the younger me would really appreciate, you know, just being my most authentic self and and people really resonating with that. Um I think that is just like it still blows my mind to kind of see people connect the way that they do with my music. Um, because you know, way back in the day, like a not so confident kid was like, Man, I really want to do music, like if only I could, and now I'm literally doing that for my job. So um it's pretty amazing. Um when writing the music, I just try to be as authentic as I can. Like I every single song is an experience that I am personally going through, um, and uh how I can shed light like from maybe either a bad situation or just you know, making sure that other people don't feel like they have to feel alone.

SPEAKER_00 5:24

Yeah, yeah, and and especially getting off the road with Magnolia Park pretty recently. Did you have any experiences where fans were telling you stories about how your music impacted them?

SPEAKER_01 5:34

Absolutely. I mean, it it's pretty surreal to hear people say that your song plays a big part in the soundtrack of their life and what they're going through. And it really moves me a lot to hear people say, like, your song has been getting me through the day, like I've been having a really hard time, and you know, it just makes me want to give them a hug. I'm like, I'm so sorry that you're feeling that way, but I'm so honored that my song is helping you heal.

SPEAKER_00 6:06

That's huge. That's huge. Is there a particular time in your life when you remember being inspired by art or music or a band and you felt the confidence to just go for it and put music out? I mean, talk to me about the beginning stages of you putting your art out online because it is scary. And there are there are a lot of kids that we talk to in the low to the craft ecosystem that are sitting on whether it's music or a piece of art and they're afraid to show their parents or their friends or their you know teachers even because they don't want to be judged. What is what is that like, you know, what was that like for you? And now that you've shared such a big stage and you're doing all of these amazing things and writing an album and you've got management, what were some of the things that allowed you to go for it from the beginning that you think a kid listening to this in their room right now needs to hear?

SPEAKER_01 6:58

I think the most important thing when wanting to pursue any sort of art or even like just you know, put something out in the world to be seen, I think it's really important that you do it for yourself. I think a lot of people care too much about other people's perception, but you're not responsible for how other people perceive you. But what you are responsible for is um making sure that you feel fulfilled, your you know, yourself, and making sure that you feel happy. And what inspires you and sets your heart on fire is nobody else has a say in that. And I think I realized that really young, and I'm really like fortunate to have really supportive parents who wanted to see me do music and you know, wanted to see me do what made me happy, but also surrounding yourself with really positive people, people that want to see you succeed, is is also really helpful in that way to you know have the confidence to start putting things out and and to just kind of dip your toes into you know what are people you know what are people going to perceive my art as and and not be afraid of how they perceive it, but really just be proud that you were able to release something to the world completely unafraid.

SPEAKER_00 8:22

Yeah, that's huge. And and I feel like can't be said enough, honestly, having a supportive, you know, I don't even want to say team. Obviously, when you're making a band and and it becomes a little bit like a business, you need that team around you, but just the people in your life, whether it's your parents or your teachers or guidance counselors at school, friends that have your back and can support you through the tough times, because life happens and as fun and creative and energetic as the music industry is, there are hurdles and there are things to overcome. What have some of those hurdles been for you from a from a building your brand standpoint that you've that you're proud of overcoming?

SPEAKER_01 9:04

Yeah, I mean, I think uh there have been some challenges that I've had to overcome and even still like have to overcome. Um, I mean, me being a giant exclamation point in a very male-dominated music space is it's hard, especially when I feel like I also don't fit in with like you know, being on the female fronted hour, you know, on a radio station because I am non-binary presenting, and that is very hard for some people to wrap their head around, like, oh, where do we put you? And I just want to make music music again. I want it to be inclusive and you know, acceptable for every person, like you know, whatever shape, size, or color they come in to be accepted and not have to, you know, fit into this little box. I think that's my entire brand is like destroying fitting in the box. Because my whole life I've been told, oh, you don't belong with the girls, you don't belong with the boys, and you know, if I don't belong anywhere, I'm gonna pave my own path. And I think that is something that I will kind of always have to swim against the current on. So, but I'm I'm totally okay with doing that because I think it's really important for every single person to feel like they belong in the space, um, because talent should overcome every single other physical attribute.

SPEAKER_00 10:32

Yeah, 100%. And so when you were on the road, what was it like? I mean, you I obviously you you play your show, you're doing your sound check, you're loading in and out, getting help from from your bandmates and people that are on the road. Are you hanging out at merch and talking with the fans and building that community? And what does that feel like? And what was kind of a day in the life for you while you were on the road?

SPEAKER_01 10:52

Absolutely. Every single night I'm at the merch table. Um, I think that's really important to me to like build that connection and and make those new fans because I I want to hear their stories and I want to hear, you know, if this is the first time they're hearing me, like what inspired them to come say hi, you know. Like I want to hear the kind of impact that my music is making, good or bad, you know. Um, and luckily most of the time it's good, but um, I think it's just it's important um to build that connection. I think my favorite part aside from like playing the shows and singing like as loud as I can, as hard as I can, hopefully most of the time as good as I can. Um I love just meeting people and hearing their stories because I've yes, I do this like for my own almost like personal like therapy, right? Like getting on the stage and spilling out emotions and hearing people sing words that I, you know, once had in a journal is pretty surreal, but it's like meeting the fans make it so much more worth it and it's so much more gratifying.

SPEAKER_00 12:01

Amazing. Well, we're gonna take a quick break, and when we come back, I want to dive into the creative process and really how you structure your songs and what you're typically writing about and how a song evolves to get to the point to launch it online to launch it online, and uh we'll be right back. All right, welcome back to Lil to the Craft here. We're talking with Pink Noise and we're gonna dive into the creative writing process. How does it work for you and how has it evolved over the years of you putting out music? And has anything external really made you think differently about your creative process? And just talk to me about the evolution.

SPEAKER_01 12:38

Yeah, so when I had started making music, it was uh I mean, going from making music in high school, I mean, I was just rocking out in a garage, but eventually that evolved in my last band that I was in. Um, I started self-producing and writing and kind of just like being behind the computer learning all of the ins and outs of you know how to record my own stuff. And uh for about six years I had total control. This is before Pink Noise, and I was used to doing all the DIY stuff. So um I kind of got in the mindset of like I control everything. And then I met my um my producer Hiram and uh everything changed. I felt this shift um kind of happen where I was like, you know, this is somebody that's been in the industry and worked with a lot of bands that I, you know, used to look up to. Um maybe I should just kind of roll back on the uh, you know, control side of things and just kind of go with the flow and and let him cook, you know. Yeah. Um, so I started kind of taking more of a backseat approach to the whole idea, um, and not starting it like, you know, hey, I have this thing. Just kind of more like we would go into a session and talk about what I was going through in that very moment or in that day, or you know, what's something that's been bothering you. We would start basically with like a therapy session. And as soon as I would start talking, um Harm would just kind of help me build a you know, sonically sound space for what I was feeling right then and there. And um, I think it's really unique to be able to do that. But um then we would just start throwing ideas out, and uh, you know, sometimes I would come to the studio ready with like a hey, I have this like catchy melody in my head. So every song is a little bit different, but it all kind of starts the same way with a little bit of a hey, this is how I'm feeling, we should write something like this. Um, and then it just kind of evolved. We we write really fast. So um on this next record, I'm I'm definitely like venturing out with some more like producers and production and just like trying to you know find how I'm going to navigate this space um and trying to to be experimental and be different um and continue to push the boundaries.

SPEAKER_00 15:16

Who is a uh producer that you dream of working with? Like what's your bucket list look like?

SPEAKER_01 15:21

Oh man. Um, I would love to work with uh Zach Cervini's a big one, um, but I would love to uh work with uh Eric Ron would be really awesome to work with. Um I mean there's so many. There's so many, but I would love to get something maybe mastered by Ted Jensen.

SPEAKER_00 15:41

Oh, cool. Yeah, all of those are all of those are great for sure, and I could definitely see that working with your style for sure. It's it's it's awesome hearing you talk like this. You know, it's it's the therapy session, the I mean it is. You're you're writing music from your soul and your passion, and I feel like there are artists out there, you know, I don't even I'm not even thinking of any thinking of any in particular, but I feel like it's either you're writing from a source of inspiration or you're feeling obligated to write. And I feel like when you when you attack it that way as a therapy section, you can get to the to the heart of the matter where that's where the best stuff's gonna come. Your lyrics and the the emotion is gonna come out, and it's great for the song, but it's also great for you, the artist. And I think that's what's so amazing about music is there's no black or white. Like you said earlier, no matter your shape, size, color, whatever, we're all human beings, and no matter what it is, your emotions are your emotions, and it's a very practical way to deal with your emotions. Literally writing a song about it and being able to to to whether you're a drummer, guitarist, singer, writing it and playing it is a powerful, you know, uh vetting of your emotions. How does that make you feel?

SPEAKER_01 17:01

I mean, music is uh catharsis for me, you know. Like I feel like I wouldn't know who I was if I didn't, you know, have music in my corner. Whether that's listening to music, you know, there are like definitely records that have impacted me so much so that like I listen to those to get through the day, you know, but like those inspire me to to write my own feelings and and put them on a page and and make them accessible for other people to listen to. Um and I think music is kind of what makes the world go around, you know. Um music is love. I think the reason that humans create music is to feel love and self-expression um through sound waves. I think it's extremely unique, and I think music as a whole, no matter what genre, is beautiful, and the fact that we get to listen to it on our little pocket, you know, cellular devices is just incredible.

SPEAKER_00 18:02

It is crazy, for sure. What do you typically write about? Like what are some of the some of the topics? I mean, you you know, you we talked about belonging. What are some of your kind of go-to topics to to talk about? I know it probably depends on you know the emotions and things that you're feeling, state of the world possibly, but like what are what are some of the typical topics that a pink noise song, you know, has baked within it?

SPEAKER_01 18:24

Um, you know, a common theme that I'm finding out is like um I just put out my last EP um called Flesh and Bone, and that is definitely a little more in the heavier space for me for the most part on that um on that EP. Um and it's I really just talk about what it's like to live in my shoes. You know, I I go through the motions of like this is what it's like to be in the music industry, and um this is how it affects me, this is how music affects me, um, and this is how the internet per like you know affects me and perceives me. Um and I kind of really just talking about my whole relationship with music the entire time, actually, on this record. So I think it's um I think it's more of like a self-reflective process. Um uh but most of the time I feel like I'm talking about just the state uh that the world is in and how to make it better. And I also just like to I love to sing about love.

SPEAKER_00 19:39

That's awesome.

SPEAKER_01 19:40

So I think that is kind of a culmination of every part of me, you know. Um but I'm just like everybody else. I I definitely get imposter syndrome and think about things too much, and you know, I'm like, oh man, are are people gonna like this? And at the end of the day, like I don't really care if people like it. I'm doing it for me, and people like liking it is a huge bonus.

SPEAKER_00 20:04

Yeah, totally. I mean you'd be doing it regardless. I mean, you just went on your first tour, but you've been putting out music for years to get you to that point already. So I feel like that's you know, uh very genuine of you to say.

SPEAKER_01 20:17

Absolutely, yeah. I mean it's you we don't get to decide if we, you know, like go viral or not, but you do get to decide whether you put out that piece of content to go viral. True. And I think I think that is really important, especially like today. Everybody's afraid of being judged on the internet, and like that is a real fear for everyone, you know. Like nobody is exempt from being ridiculed on the internet, you know. Um, so you might as well just do it, you know, might as well just put it out there because that could be your success stories. Oh, I was I wasn't gonna put out this TikTok, I was like, you know, I wasn't feeling it that much, but I did it anyway, and it blew up. And that's kind of exactly what happened for me. So I was doing it for me and nobody else. And when you start to do things for yourself and just do it because you love it, I think that's when people start to flock and they go, Man, this person's really talented. Like you just they would never know if you didn't put it out there.

SPEAKER_00 21:22

Totally. How do you feel right before you release a song? What what what are some of the emotions that you're feeling?

SPEAKER_01 21:29

Um, I feel really excited a lot of the time. And sometimes I'm like, man, I really hope that this goes well. And then I start to dissect like, you know, do I really care like if it goes well? Like, I'm doing it because it's self release. Um, and that's the most important thing, and uh and then I get really excited about it again. And I'm like, man, I'm just excited to put this out there. I've been working on this for a year or you know, several months or sometimes even two years and It's just a great feeling, like once you're able to listen to that song on Spotify and be like, man, I did my best to put it out there. And then people decide if they like it or not. And I've been very fortunate to have people like it more often than not.

SPEAKER_00 22:16

That's great. And you talked we talked a little bit earlier about finding your people, you know, whether it's again your parents, friends, whoever that may be, but also in your position, finding the right producer and the team that's in the studio going through those motions with you. Talk to me about that process a little bit. How did you find your producer and get to that really deep creative process where you trust each other? And do you feel any pressure to stay consistent with a certain sound or any sort of pressure that you need to evolve in any certain way? Like, what does that look like for you behind closed doors with your producer?

SPEAKER_01 22:53

So I definitely I I definitely feel pressure to like, you know, up my sound or like, you know, is are people gonna like the next thing that I do? Because what what my mission is is to be different and be experimental um on purpose. You know, I think that's how you reach full self-discovery, and I don't want to keep myself closed off from that. But when I met my um producer who produced my last two EPs, um it was he met me in a karaoke bar and heard me sing and was like, Hey, you gotta come, you gotta come record with me tomorrow. And I was like, Okay, for sure. And he was a friend of a friend, you know, so like I was like, Alright, this is this is cool. Um and after our first song together, which ended up being my song Landmine, um, on my first EP, um, I just felt like he understood me as an artist, and we kind of just went pedal to the middle after that. I think having that kind of like trust with someone to bring your art to life in the studio is like one of the deepest levels of trust you can have with someone in the music industry. So there are so many amazing producers, but every single producer that you interact with is going to give you a different end result. Um, whether that's like through the writing process, mixing process, or just you know, the the whole vibe all together and like what you're trying to put out. And I feel like thus far I've had the absolute best time with Hiram. Um, and we've made some really awesome stuff.

SPEAKER_00 24:36

That's great. And it's so important for artists to find your tribe, you know, whether it again is at school, I mean, there's so many opportunities for you to find your people, and just because you live in a town that doesn't have you know a venue or a music school or whatever, the internet is a great place to be. I mean, literally the fact that you found your producer at a karaoke bar, you're out there putting yourself out there, it works. And so are you originally from LA or did you move there? What what tell me tell me about that, like how you how you ended up where you're at now?

SPEAKER_01 25:08

So I recently moved to LA about eight months ago. And um, I am originally from Tucson, Arizona. So I lived in a you know smaller town. Um, it was always hot, and the local band scene was tough. You know, there were so many bands trying to make it out of Tucson, and uh I think me being so different, I definitely struggled with, you know, the the community there because I think a lot of people don't like what's different from them. And uh I felt pressure to act a certain way. And um, you know, I think having camaraderie is so much better than like trying to compete with people. So um I'm glad eventually, you know, like I started putting myself out online and it kind of separated me from some of the local acts and stuff, and I was very blessed to be able to like have an audience online and feel like I can move across the country to you know pursue music in the music capital of the world, you know. So um I think it's been it's been a crazy ride, but LA's been very kind to me. So I'm just stoked to be here and be around so many creative people.

SPEAKER_00 26:28

Awesome. All right, we're gonna take one more quick break, and when we come back, I want to deep dive into the business side of the music industry. You're moving to LA and meeting people and getting on tours like with Magnolia Park, finding the management. We'll be right back. All right, Adobe, we're back here with Lil to the Craft, and we've got Pink Noise talking all about music, inspiration, creativity, moving to LA, finding your people. I really want to go deep on the business side of it. It's something that not many people talk about openly. And the, you know, the the tough realities of making it in music. Talk to me about, you know, we just before the break talked about moving from Arizona to LA. What's that been like for you, both on the positive opportunity side, but also on the potential realities of what the music industry is like on the back end and the fact that it is a business, and how do you make something sustainable as far as a career in it?

SPEAKER_01 27:26

Yeah, I mean, um, it's definitely had its pros and cons to move to LA. Obviously, the cost of living is pretty ridiculous and in LA, everything is jacked up like 20, 25 percent, sometimes even 50%, like you know, anywhere else in the country. So that has been a huge adjustment for me. Um, just trying to make ends meet with the uh you know, the music side of things, really hustle and and try to make up that difference. Um, so that being said, you know, like it's really great to be out here and and network with the right people and like-minded people. I feel like I definitely feel more understood out here than I ever did in Arizona. Um, but there are definitely things that come with that where you're like, man, the music industry is hard. Um specifically, like I think this whole industry is just a bunch of imposters, you know, walking around and and trying to feel like they're cooler than they are. And uh I think we all feel that way. Um I think that kind of mentality of like I'm cooler than you is honestly really lame. Um, I think that if everybody was just focused on I want to make the best art possible, um, around the best people possible, and less about you know, the the numbers and and oh I want my uh I want my my split to be this much or you know, a rising tide uh carries all ships, right? So I think uh some people are definitely too um too in it for the other things like the monetary gains and stuff. I think if you just focus on building your your brand and connecting with people, I think all of that will come in time.

SPEAKER_00 29:24

Yeah. Talk to me about networking and and you know, obviously you heard the story about meeting your producer. How did you get on a tour with Magnolia Park? Was that via management, an agent, and how did you meet that person that helped you kind of open that door with the band?

SPEAKER_01 29:39

Yeah, so um Hiram, my uh producer, was working with Magnolia Park um for their record, and um he had mentioned it to me, he was like, Hey, I have Magnolia Park in the studio. And I was like, Oh, that's sick, they're like crushing it right now. And he had mentioned to them, he was like, Hey, like, do you guys like pink noise? And they were like, Yeah, we love pink noise. And he was like, Well, I might be able to like get them to do a feature if you guys need like a feature track. And they were like, Yo, that would actually be really sick. So, um, I was sent the demo for Crave, and I was at home actually, um, at the time in Arizona, and um Har was like, Hey, if you want to do this feature, um the band said that they would love to hear what you got. And uh he said, But you have like twenty-four hours to do it, so if you could do it really quick and send it back, that would be awesome. And I was like, Oh, okay, uh, I'm gonna have to get to work on this pretty fast. And um I worked on that and sent it back, I think within like two or three hours, and the band happened to love it. And uh from then we kind of just bonded uh over social media till we were able to meet in person and on their um Vamp tour, I actually was able to go perform it with them live in Phoenix for the first time ever. Um, so that was really cool. Um, kind of giving me a small intro to their fans, but um when I uh when I got word that they were looking for somebody to open for them, um my uh my producer was like, hey, I can send them a message and see like if uh if they'd be interested in having you on there. So at the time I didn't even have a booking agent or anything. And uh Management Lake Park was like, Of course, that makes total sense. Let's do it. So I got my first tour without a booking agent.

SPEAKER_00 31:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 31:40

So um that was pretty amazing.

SPEAKER_00 31:44

Great story. That that is, you know, of all the things we've talked about, I feel like that's the biggest takeaway for the loyal to the craft mission, is exactly what you just said. Is again talking about finding your people, trusting them, your producer is obviously a very special and important part, an integral part of the pink noise, you know, music. But that's how it happens. I feel like there's a lot of young musicians out there that have the excuses of, well, I can't do this because of that. And it's all of these conditions that don't really at the end of the day add up. And the fact that you got on such a large tour, you obviously hustled. You know, you put the song together in three hours. If you took 48 hours or longer than the band gave you, you probably wouldn't have had that opportunity. But you buckled down, you did the work, you got it done, they liked it, and just kept the relationship going, and it worked itself into you literally just got off tour with them. And I think that literally encapsulates the entire message of loyal to the craft of chase your dreams and make it happen. That's incredible.

SPEAKER_01 32:49

Absolutely, and finding your friends along the way, too, is like such a big part of like how to get further in the industry is like you make connections with people and they like you, you know. If they like you, they want to help you, and I think that's just a testament to people loving music and loving people that love music as much as they do. Um, I think that it that kind of love, especially in this space, makes the world go around.

SPEAKER_00 33:16

A hundred percent. What's something in the industry that surprised you once you were in it? Good, bad, you know, and and any of those things that was just like a real, oh wow, I didn't anticipate this being a part of you know me making music.

SPEAKER_01 33:34

Um let's see. I think one of the biggest surprises is that um a lot of people um a lot of people like to co-write with uh smaller artists. Um I thought that was really cool. I've had the pleasure of co-writing with uh a couple of different artists, um Blessed Fall being one of them. Um Magnolia Park and um you know now I'm like starting to work with other bands too for co-writing and um you know I am definitely still what I would consider like a smaller artist. I uh definitely have a good following on social media, but I still have a lot of learning to do and a lot of uh a lot of tours to be had, and um I think that people taking a chance on a small artist, like but like seeing like, oh hey, I think you're really talented, um, is a little shocking to me. It's for them, I think it's less about the the numbers and more about the who's gonna write a really epic song with me. Um, so I think that actually did surprise me a little bit because I thought from afar, like, oh, everything is so numbers based, but there are a lot of people that are co-writing and like writing songs with really big artists who are not like very big artists themselves. So I thought that was really cool and definitely a curveball.

SPEAKER_00 34:58

Well, and what do you see the benefit of? Is it is it is it you know more repetition and you get in the reps and like you're able to be inspired and also kind of like see how it works for that band behind the scenes, or is it more we get to cross-pollinate fan bases, or is it all of the above? Like, what are some of the benefits you see with the co-writing aspect?

SPEAKER_01 35:18

It's definitely all of the above. Um, I think that being able to be a part of somebody else's like creative process and help them with their own self-discovery is like the most gratifying part for me at least. Um, something that like was sitting in my brain also sounded good to this artist, and um just kind of like refining that and working that and building something that they're ultimately really proud of, um, and being able to help with that is just super cool to me. Um, but also like you know, if if I can put my name on something and people be like, oh yeah, like this this makes sense. It sounds like something Pink Noise would do, or you know, yeah, I can definitely hear the influence. I think that is a great way to, you know, if you're not already in front of that person's fan base, you get in front of them that way, and also um like your fan base being able to see, like, oh yeah, like this is really cool, like this sounds like they would do this, you know. Um, and deepening that connection on both sides, um, both fan bases.

SPEAKER_00 36:27

Very cool, and hopefully cross-pollinating on online and then eventually on tour together, right? Absolutely. What does a bad creative day look like for you when you're in a funk and you've got writer's block or something? Walk me through that process. What does it feel like and how do you get yourself out of it?

SPEAKER_01 36:43

Oh man, I uh I do get writer's block, I think more often than not. Um, and I think the best way to get over that is to just finish an idea. It doesn't have to be the way that the song is gonna be. It doesn't have to be you don't have to be married to anything, but just finishing an idea, listening to it and hearing it, being open to it is really important. I think the best way to succeed is to fail first. And I I think that a lot of the time like I'm really hard on myself and I'm like, oh man, first try I didn't like I didn't get this, you know, this song completely right or this doesn't sound right to me. Um a lot of the time when songs start out that way, they end up being my favorite songs. So um, you know, just being able to listen and refine whatever it is that you think could be better um is the best way to start and listening to it like you're a fan, um, and listening for like what would I want to hear here? Um so yeah, I think that's really important um to have those bad days though, because it's the challenge that gets you to the final goal, right? Love that if everything was easy, if everything was easy, then it wouldn't be so much fun to do it.

SPEAKER_00 38:09

And everybody would do it, and it would probably wouldn't stand out as much. It's it you gotta go through the hurdles to get to the other end where it's it's the good stuff.

unknown 38:17

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 38:18

What that's amazing advice. And what advice would you give artists on top of that who think just going viral is the goal? What would you say to them?

SPEAKER_01 38:29

Um, you know, one day uh we're not gonna have the internet um in the capacity that we do, I'm sure. Um I'm sure everything is gonna change, and things are changing all the time around you. So virality is not as important, you know. Um using AI tools is not as important as it is to be a human and connect with other humans. Um so I don't think that the internet is the end all be all. I think you know, some people still get their start going out there and and playing shows and doing the you know the long grind, and that's how you build those really deep, you know, like cold fan bases, like like Bad Omens, you know, they they definitely had some help from the internet, but they they laid the foundation themselves, you know. Um there are so many bands like that. Look at Bringing the Horizon, they were way ahead of the internet and they're the biggest band in the scene, debatably. So um building that human connection with people, whether it's at shows or you know, you uh show up to other shows and support artists and like hey, I'm an artist, you know, like talking to people, networking. Um, like you said, networking is just really important. It doesn't necessarily have to be, oh, you you know, you had a viral video, like that's really cool that people have seen your face, but um, you know, it's how do they feel when they when they listen to you? Uh whether it's listen to you talk or listen to your music. Um human connection wins every single time.

SPEAKER_00 40:08

I love that. Well, let you know, that was very well said, and I think it's a great kind of wrap-up there. But if there was uh a few last words that you wanted to leave the Adobe community, what's the legacy that you're hoping you leave behind with your your your your music under Pink Noise?

SPEAKER_01 40:26

Um man, you know, there's so many things that are going on in the world around us right now where people don't feel safe and people feel, you know, like the political climate is so polarizing, and what I want is for my music to bring people together, no matter what that looks like, no matter who it is, I want people to feel safe when they come to a show of mine, and I want people to understand that like inside of those four walls when we're singing those songs, like the outside world, you know, like when you go back, like everything is gonna be the way that it was when you walk through those doors. But when you come to a pink noise show, I want you to just love and and be respectful to people and just forget about all the noise on the outside and just have a good time and feel safe.

SPEAKER_00 41:21

Awesome. Well, great advice. Thank you so much for sharing Pink Noise. This is so awesome having you on here. Everybody go follow Pink Noise on socials, support the new music. That sounds like it's gonna be coming out soon. Also, lots of shows and tours coming up. Support independent artists, support artists that are out there doing it for the right reasons. Go follow Pink Noise, drop a comment, send a DM, let her know that your friends over here at Loyal to the Craft sent you. And hey, let's drop some some uh some new bands to check out. Are there any smaller local bands in the scene that you're paying attention to right now that people listening should be checking out?

SPEAKER_01 41:58

Absolutely. Um, one of my favorite artists, I actually just had the pleasure of touring with them, is Silly Goose. Oh, yeah. I feel like they are so underrated, it's not even funny. They're like so amazing, man. They've they put on a great live show and they're really good dudes, and I think they're doing it for the right reasons. Um Silly Goose is really great, and um I have uh my homies in Code Words um who are out here in LA. Um, they're an incredible band, and they just they hit every time in. Um, and way, way underrated as well. So definitely give those a listen.

SPEAKER_00 42:38

Cool, awesome. Well, thank you again for being here. We really appreciate it. Again, shout out to all the amazing listeners in the Adobe community. Thank you, Adobe. Shout out to our friends at DistroKid who support independent artists and music just like this. And feel the habit. Go follow Loyal to the Craft, sign up for our email newsletter on loyaltycraft.com. And Pink Noise will see you out there. Thanks so much.