Episode 5 - Jenn Power Fitzgerald Power

Jennifer is a Partner at Fitzgerald Power in our SME department. Since qualifying as a Chartered Accountant, Jennifer has advised business owners on financial and taxation matters.

 Jennifer has a passion for working with SMEs in a cross-section of sectors. Through her commitment to excellent customer service and extensive knowledge of the sectors in which she works, Jennifer has built long-standing and committed relationships with her clients. She specialises in providing outsourced, online financial services and enjoys working with companies continuously to empower business owners and management through the provision of accurate, real-time financial information.

 Jennifer qualified as an Accountant and was admitted as a member to Chartered Accountants Ireland in 2010. She graduated with a Master’s in Strategic Management and Planning from the UCD Michael Smurfit Graduate Business School and a Bachelor of Business Studies from Waterford Institute of Technology.

 Outside of Fitzgerald Power, Jennifer loves spending time with her family and enjoys nothing better than hitting the beach with her husband and three daughters. She is a keen runner and is currently trying her best to swim in the Irish Sea a little more (although wouldn’t mind if the temperature rose a little!!).

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:02

Okay, I'd like to welcome Jen Power from Fisher Power to our latest interview in the podcast series. Jen, thanks very much for joining us today. Thanks very much for having me, Neil. And uh as I've followed Fisher Power very closely online for the last couple of years, and you are a very progressive firm. I love watching the posts uh that pop up from the likes of Stuart and Noel and others just about the things you're doing with clients. Um I was down in your office a couple of times, so I met some of the team down there, and you certainly strike me as being a very progressive firm who are giving a very good level of service to clients, you know, advisory advisory services and so on. So um it's nice to get to meet you because I have been following you online for uh for a few years.

SPEAKER_00 0:47

Oh, it's good to hear, and it's good to hear that our message uh reaches uh everybody through the likes of LinkedIn. Um and I think that progression piece is something that we really value uh that we are trying to constantly change and and be progressive, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:03

Yeah, very good, Jen. So maybe we'll kick off if you'd like to tell me a bit about your own background and your journey to your current role, which I think is your head of the SME team. Is our partner, sorry, partner of the SME team? Is that correct?

SPEAKER_00 1:16

Partner in our SME team here in Fitzgerald Parro. Uh so uh I've been here a while. I've uh did my grad program here 18 years ago. So been through the ranks, um, very traditional training, um, moved through a senior accountant uh up to to assistance assistant manager and manager, uh, had some kids in the interim and I'm partner of the SME team uh for the last four years.

SPEAKER_02 1:44

Excellent, yeah. And um so maybe I'd be curious to hear about some of the clients you have. Obviously, with the SME team, I'm guessing you have a mix of different types of sectors and so on. Are there any particular sectors that you concentrate on, or is it a a mixed bag?

SPEAKER_00 2:00

Um it probably is quite mixed. Um the clients, my clients, my team's clients, um would really vary in both size and in sector that they operate in. Um we probably have two key cohorts within that, being um clients in the in the hospitality and food and beverage sector, and then also uh what we would refer to as scaling companies. So companies on some form of growth journey. Um and we just feel that we've gone through a growth journey ourselves. We've gone from a course a half year of 45 years ago to 95 today, and that has come with its rewards and its challenges. Um and so we we feel that we can add that additional layer of advice to those clients and that scaling group as well.

SPEAKER_02 2:52

Yeah, brilliant. Uh, I like that the fact that you're scaling, you're scaling yourselves and your clients are scaling. So I'd be curious to know a bit more. Can you tell me a little bit more about that scaling, maybe some of the clients you're working with, how you help them, the kind of things you do with these companies who are scaling?

SPEAKER_00 3:07

Yeah, like I think that um the need that we are that we are meeting for our clients currently in that in that kind of space of of scaling is that we do offer um a cross range of of services. So we can offer like services from payroll to bookkeeping to management accounts, obviously audit and and uh advisory in with that. We would also have quite uh comprehensive and well-built-out corporate finance teams and a tax team. And so that allows us to offer that scaling company a full suite of services where we find that the companies may be too small to have a full-time finance team or too small to have a full-time CFO, but they are big enough to have all the requirements that a company needs in terms of CFO services. Um they could have Enterprise Ireland on their cap table, they could have external investors, private equity or venture capital. And so that all comes with a requirement to have quite a robust finance system. Um, and we've built departments and teams with infrastructure power that can provide that, but um in an outsourced manner. So a lot of our clients would use us for monthly bookkeeping, monthly management accounts, monthly payroll services, and through the provision of those services, you tend to get to know your clients quite well because you're providing timely, real-time management accounts to them on a monthly, uh, on a monthly basis. Um, and so we get to know their challenges. We talk to them on a monthly basis, there would be a lot of contact with with us and our client base. Um and we're almost on that journey with them. Um so we're not sitting in their offices, but we do feel like we're part of their team. And I think that's something that both I and my team really pride ourselves on.

SPEAKER_02 5:06

Yeah, and it sounds like it's almost the the full, you know, uh what's it called a one-stop shop service, you know, the bookkeeping and the managing accounts, and you're you're very much part of, like you're saying, you're almost part of the team, even though you're not officially.

SPEAKER_01 5:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:20

Um, and what kind of challenges are you seeing? And you must get to know these businesses really well. What kind of challenges are you seeing when they're on this growth journey?

SPEAKER_00 5:30

Um I think that uh irrespective of the sector at present, it would be remiss of me not to not to mention the increased cost to doing business. Um you know, all SMEs, I think, in Ireland are are struggling with it at present, um, and the increased cost of labour and how a business can pass that on to their client base. Um, and that does come down to sector. Um, so whether they're they're scaling on a growth journey or they're an established SME, I think the number one challenge currently is that increased cost to doing business, and it really probably comes down to labour. Um the the increase in the minimum wage um from 12 odd euro in Jan 24 to just over 14 euro now, um it's increased by 12% in two years. Um and for certain SMEs that is hard to pass on to your customer, and it requires I think it requires a more experienced and sophisticated finance system to maybe the SMEs in Ireland 10 years ago. So real-time management information, real-time cash flows are more prevalent and more important now than ever because if they don't know their margins and they don't know if their both their gross profit margin and their EBITA are on track, um, it could be too late for those businesses because things are tight currently. Um and I'm sure you've you've spoken to to many accountancy practices and businesses that are saying the same. So it's not unique, but it is a real it is a real challenge. Um other than that, um it it comes down to team and people, um, I think a lot of the time. Um maybe in certain areas, businesses are struggling a little bit with with AI currently and just keeping up with the rate of change and and how they should be using AI in their business. Um and so for smaller teams that can be a challenge. Um and then, you know, linked with the increased cost of labor, it's just keeping your your team hiring the right people um and making sure that the right people are in doing the right jobs. I think that they would be the key challenges.

SPEAKER_02 7:56

Yeah. And like just hearing what you're saying there, that information, like you know, the mark knowing their gross margins, the net profit, obviously, cash flow forecasting, and so on. Um, and you know, that's so important for business owners. And I suppose you know, you're obviously providing that, and your clients, I suppose I would say, are fortunate, okay? And actually, some of the people I was put into in this series would be, you know, they'd be quite progressive as well. But like I've worked with a lot of other accountants, I come across a lot of other business owners, and their accountants don't provide that level of service, um, which makes it very difficult. I often say it's like you know, playing a match without the scoreboard, you know, or or driving driving the car without the rearview, you know, looking in the rearview mirror. Um, that is so important. I think it's great to hear you say all that, Jen, that many of your clients are getting these monthly reports and so on. So they have good information to help them make make the decisions they need to make for the business. Because unfortunately, I would say the vast majority of business owners in Ireland don't actually have that kind of information.

SPEAKER_00 9:01

Yeah, we've definitely seen that. And I think, as I mentioned, the landscape has changed and it is harder to do business now than it was 10 years ago. So for businesses that may have been able to operate without monthly KPIs or monthly management information, I have seen cases where that now causes difficulty for the business owner. And sometimes it doesn't have to be too complicated, you don't have to overcomplicate a KPI dashboard or management information, but it is crucial that you do have that real-time information and you know the three or four critical levers for your business. A lot of the time they are very similar, irrespective of sector.

SPEAKER_01 9:49

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:51

If you have your gross profit, if you have your your net profit or your U beta, and you have good cash flows, you know, they would be the three key key things for me.

SPEAKER_02 10:01

Yeah, absolutely. Um, the cash flows. So, I mean, um it's fabulous to hear that. So these clients are on a uh they're on a scaling journey, and you mentioned AI uh just uh short while ago, and it's amazing, you know. We're all looking at Chat GBT. I've been looking at Claude recently, and um they seem to be announcing new features almost weekly in terms of which is going to you know, I think help accountants with bookkeeping, but also the reporting side, you know, it's very exciting. How do you how do you see AI impacting your own profession, the accounting profession?

SPEAKER_00 10:37

Yeah, I think like there's been a lot of talk um about how it will impact professional services, accounting and legal services in particular. Our experience to date is that I think it will be great for some of the administrative tasks, some of the lower level tasks, um, where we struggle um, you know, to keep up to date and it will streamline those tasks for us uh and for the sector as a whole. I don't think it will replace the advisory bit, and I don't think it will it will replace the technical know-how, you know, that that that myself and and my colleagues can provide. Um but I think even for our clients, what I'm seeing on the ground is that it is a great tool for the administrative side of things, for the jobs that maybe you've been putting on the back burner, or for the jobs that take up hours in in business owners' evenings, times that you know it can really streamline that type of administrative uh piece and the and the recurring pieces of work that we do.

SPEAKER_02 11:45

Yeah. Yeah. So um yeah, I think you're right saying it'll it'll certainly help with the repetitive task, but it's not going to replace the the human element and being able to look at the figures and give advice to your clients, which is like the numbers on their own.

SPEAKER_00 11:59

Like I was I was at a conference last week and somebody said people buy from people. And I really do believe that um at the end of the day, either for our clients or for ourselves, it is really important to be able to have a trusted advisor that you can bounce questions off and that can come back to you with a very comprehensive answer that you know is correct. And I don't think AI will replace that.

SPEAKER_02 12:26

Yeah, no, I don't think so. Um and you know, I'm just thinking you were saying earlier on about the you know, the the service you provide to many of your clients, the scaly ones and the the the hospitality ones as well, and obviously not betraying any client confidences, but it you know, I love a good story, right? So is there any particular clients that you can maybe tell us a bit about in terms of how you've helped them on their journey and so on?

SPEAKER_00 12:54

Um, yeah, like I think, as I said, we have a total varied, like I have a total varied range of clients, and I get real reward from helping them um move through challenges. And obviously, when there's a good outcome, it's brilliant. We have a particular client um who would have a number of um restaurant outlets, um, and we have helped them in set we use uh zero in a number of cases, so we have helped them um set up their their bookkeeping and management accounts function. They wouldn't have had any visibility on a store by store or a restaurant, restaurant by restaurant um uh PN monthly PL. Um and we have over the last year set that up. We now deliver monthly management accounts by working day 10 um post-month end. Um and they would have, and by working day four, they would have a very clear what we call pace report. So that's profit after controllable expenditure report from us, where they know their sales, they know their gross profit, and they know their their wage KPIs. So we give them a KPI dashboard working day four and then full management accounts, working day 10, um on a restaurant by restaurant basis. And so they they know in very real time what's working and what's not. Um we helped them set uh a budget for FY26 and FY27. So now we report a budget every month, and they can drill down into their restaurants to see what ones are working, what ones are not. Uh, you know, where are there uh crucially is their labour um at the right percentage? And if it's not really understand with each of the restaurant managers why. Um so it's quite rewarding to be at that stage to have gone through that journey with that business owner. Um and I can see that both the business owner and the management team are getting real value now from this. Uh so that's that's one example.

SPEAKER_02 15:07

No, brilliant, yeah. I mean, I'm thinking of a client uh of mine who'd uh love that they've a range, uh a range of uh fast food uh shops, and um yeah, it's just a challenge with their their management accounts are behind, and you know, it's like um it's a challenge, let's just say, and but you know, the the one thing I I can certainly pick up on there is the labor percentage because the benchmarking, I think I love when you have a number of similar businesses that you can you can benchmark say the labor percentage, and that's one thing we have done with this other business because you know, if one is at 32% and another one is at 28% or whatever, you can and they're similar businesses, you can you can start getting them comparing notes on their rostering on how they manage the people and so on. You know, it's uh there's opportunities, I suppose, when you have a number of similar uh businesses under one roof, isn't there?

SPEAKER_00 15:59

Yeah, and like even to the point where last month, um, the way each KPI for one of the one of the restaurants was super, it was way ahead of target. But the management team took the opportunity to actually understand are we understaffed in that restaurant and is you know, is the quality where it should be, and it do we have a problem, could we be facing a problem there in three months' time? So it's good to know that you're taking the the hassle uh from the business owner, the management team, and actually being able to provide the information and then they can get on with that with doing their job of reading the information and bringing it back to an operations perspective. Um, and you're right when when you're chasing your tail with late management accounts, um it's hard, it's very difficult to make quick decisions.

SPEAKER_02 16:57

Yeah, the information is much later. I'm not gonna even say how long, but uh anyway. Um but the you know, the um the having the restaurants like that under one roof, all right. And when you mention KBIs, like I'm a huge fan of KBIs, and it's interesting when you're saying about the labor percentage because that might look great, but then if that means their the dessert sales are down or the gross margin slips, you obviously have to look at all these key metrics, don't you? Because it's one on its own, as I said, a lower wage and wage percentage might sound great, but if it means that actually the staff are too uh too rushed to do the upselling and the cross-selling, right? So um, yeah, you have to look at it the full picture, don't you?

SPEAKER_00 17:39

It is all linked. Or again, like you know, with rising costs at the moment, that gross profit and your your cogs percentage, your purchases percentage to your sales, it's very difficult to constantly pass on that cost to the customer um and find the sweet spot of what the customer is willing to pay. Um, so we do believe that that information itself down to gross profit does have to be delivered quite quickly. Um to ensure that nobody are, you know, uh busy fools and all of that. So um it it is really important.

SPEAKER_02 18:20

Yeah, it's great to hear you're providing those reports because that's one sector in particular, the you know, the bars and restaurants and cafes that are so labor intensive. It's a sector really that you know you you would certainly would I I'd certainly be very conscious of them and almost sympathize a bit with the owners because it's a certainly they've been hit with so many price increases with labour and everything else over the years that it's it's it's a challenging sector, isn't it?

SPEAKER_00 18:47

It is, um, especially like they've I think it's the one sector minimum wage and auto enrollment has really impacted them. They have the 9% in uh VAT cut now coming up, which will be great, um, but they do need additional supports, um, and they need to get their business model right so that they know they're achieving the right you know, the right profit margins.

SPEAKER_02 19:14

Yeah. And I think I think it might have been Stuart or somebody in in Fisher Power did a brilliant report there a couple of years ago, and it was like it was showing the impact of those increases, like we're talking about the minimum wage and whatever, how it could impact on like the before and after of a of a pro of a restaurant. But then what I liked about it is that it came back and said, okay, if you say if you help them with their the employer's PRSI or whatever, very specific targeted measures could bring the profitability back to where it was before. And like I thought it was a brilliant, I think it was Jordan, I might have been sure who did it. It was a brilliant report because that's Jordan. Yeah, was it? And like you could see it was you could see how uh he was doing here's the impact, and here's a specific thing you can do with the PRSI to bring it back. And it had the example in the numbers, you know. But um, unfortunately, or the powers that be it, I think didn't um take it on board as you as you'd like to think they might, you know.

SPEAKER_00 20:11

Yeah, like as I mentioned, it uh the the VAT reduction will be well needed and welcomed in July, but it probably is a little bit late coming to the table um and targeted supports for individual SME sectors are needed.

SPEAKER_02 20:30

Yeah, absolutely. Um so Jen, the um it sounds like everything's hunky-dory with Fitzgerald Power. You've you've no challenges at all, have you? Um are there, you know, look are there any particular challenges that you're dealing with with this growth phase that you're going to do?

SPEAKER_00 20:48

Yeah, like I I think that we have uh we have definitely come across numerous challenges as we've grown. Um, as I said, we've gone from you know with core staff of of say 40 to 95 today. So that has come with with its challenges. Um a lot of the senior people have grown with the business, and so that comes with with great advantages as well. Uh we're we're a people business, so we are lucky that we have such a great team um in our head office in Waterbrood, uh, where the majority of our team are located. Um and I think it really comes back to our people. Um, if we um are hiring the right people, uh they can provide the services to our clients. Um and any of the challenges that we've come up come up against in the past, if we bring it back to our people, we've managed to overcome it, to be honest. Um so it really is just having the right people doing the right jobs um and leaving them get get on and do that.

SPEAKER_02 21:54

Yeah. Um so the I suppose if you had, let's say um advice if you're giving advice to a business owner uh if you to pick one or two little nuggets of advice to give to uh I'm gonna say a business owner now who maybe a non-charel power business owner will say because um in fairness many of your clients are you know getting good reporting and so on so other we'll say other business owners what advice would you give them one or two little uh nuggets what would you say to them um I think uh I'll I'll probably I put on my accountant's hat now which might be a bit boring um but what gets measured gets done and yeah like I I've seen that I've worked with clients and ourselves previously um where if you're not measuring it it is very hard to move the dial on it uh so um I bring it back to your monthly management information don't overcomplicate it first of all I think I've seen cases where people want these huge big management reporting packs from day one and if you're starting off with nothing bring it back to basics decide on what the crucial levers are for your business whether it's cash flow whether it be your margins or your labor KPIs and understand get into the weeds of it and understand with your with your accountant how you get to the point of being able to report on that on a monthly basis.

SPEAKER_00 23:20

Cash is king can't get away from it so understand the variance between if you're looking at a at a profit and loss account and a net profit if that doesn't tie in with your bank account which it may not dependent on your on the sector that you operate in understand why and what your working capital um you know position is to bring you back to that that cash in in the bank um yeah they would be two big things and I think from an SME's perspective I think sometimes an SME's ability to make decisions quickly can be their superpower so sometimes their competitor may be a larger company that could take months to make decisions because of various different uh systems and protocol within the big company so you know we are seeing it with our clients at the moment even with AI you may not need a three year AI strategy to adopt certain simple elements of AI um so make sure that you lean into the fact that you can change and pivot quickly um and you know use use AI to your full full advantage.

SPEAKER_02 24:32

Yeah absolutely and look their great advice with the monthly reporting and the cash flow forecasting are just so important. Unfortunately like I've worked with hundreds of business owners of all shapes and sizes and the vast majority of them unfortunately don't have monthly reporting and don't have cash flow forecasting um so uh yeah but they're so important aren't they it's like like we were saying earlier on it's like the the coach on the sideline with the hurling or soccer match or whatever and they're trying to manage the trying to make decisions if they have no scoreboard like how can they actually make the right decisions for their team and their business you know and and probably the next step on from that is you know a a 12 month forecast what what are you actually looking to achieve in the next 12 months it could be just to stay stable it could be to achieve growth um but have your forecast so that month on month you can report to that forecast and understand the variances quite quickly yeah um and there was one other thing I wanted to come back to you know the monthly reporting you do for many of your clients um with some of my own clients I I meet them on a monthly basis to go through the reports you know because um there can be a lot of value in that I'm just wondering if is that part of the service is it the reporting or is it the report and a kind of what do we say review meeting monthly bi-monthly or quarterly it it depends on the service that the client wants.

SPEAKER_00 26:03

So there would be a number of clients who would just like the monthly reporting pack from us um and some variance analysis within that pack and then there would be other clients who do require um a meeting monthly or a meeting quarterly sometimes the meeting quarterly can actually add more value because you can look back on the quarter gone and look at the at the forecast for the quarter coming and we would do that in a number of cases and yeah more so than not now I don't know if you're the same but clients want to meet remotely so we use teams and we would have that teams meeting and it can be quite efficient. An hour's meeting once a quarter you can you can cover a lot.

SPEAKER_02 26:47

Absolutely because sometimes they can go on I know I had an engineering client before and no we covered a lot but the meetings just go on for a few hours and then we pair it back to an hour and you know what it's just it can you can get through they can be just as effective if you stay on track and maybe drill into there's nobody obviously one there's not one main adverse variance to drill into is there it could be the sales the cost the margins the cash there's not really one to drill into and find out what's happening so they can be efficient an hour is if you have your clear agenda and you've released your management information a couple of days beforehand so everybody can come prepared then yes you can you discover a lot. Yeah especially people actually look at the information beforehand it helps doesn't it that does help it helps I've had i've had no I've had numerous yeah it does help yeah where where where people don't in fairness they do like I've started doing this with people and uh you'd know at the start the first few meetings they haven't but you know what after a while when they release you're asking them what this information this to start it's a bit like doing their homework they know uh better you know and they do and it definitely helps um and and also what I would also encourage um sometimes when we start this process it is just the business owner that we meet but the more people that they can bring into that team from you know their senior team it really helps because everybody can contribute to the meeting and and that information is power to to senior managers and a senior team as well.

SPEAKER_00 28:18

So that's something that we've definitely seen and when the business owner expands um or the CEO expands the team to to review that management information it it it definitely adds value.

SPEAKER_02 28:31

Yeah I I've seen the same thing with um some engineers and architects I worked with and they evolved a team you know five or six team the next thing they're starting to actually look at the reports they're starting to understand margins you give them sales targets and I said to one one guy like it was like uh on an official MBA for his team because I could see in six 12 months into this I could see a big change in them so I think you're spot on it's a it's it's it's almost a form of training for some of the team isn't it to get them involved and and most people I think although they may be hesitant at the start um information is power and they may think that it may be overwhelming for for some of their management team but actually six months in it is really helping um them see that that information and those KPIs.

SPEAKER_00 29:23

Yeah it's brilliant yeah um so Jen that's brilliant look I've gone through all the questions uh I kind of had most of them anyway I think I had prepared so is there anything else that I haven't asked you that you'd like to talk into uh I don't think so we've covered uh we've covered a lot there um yeah like I I I think from my perspective uh you know even though the even though I would say that the Irish SME that we are speaking to at the moment is is uh does have ongoing challenges especially in terms of those rise rising cost bases um and and labour increases um I think there's so many good news stories out there um and you know we do need to mention that um yeah Ireland is in uh you know a great space at the moment uh there's so much opportunity um especially if if you are exporting off the island um you know the world is your oyster um and uh things like Enterprise Ireland um are brilliant at uh you know at providing investment and also resources to do that so that was that would be my other uh key piece of advice is to lean into any of those additional resources that are there for Irish SMEs um especially in terms of of local bicks or or local enterprise offices and and enterprise Ireland can be an amazing forum um for investment also.

SPEAKER_02 30:55

Yeah and even on AI I know even the local enterprise offices are giving great support to people who want to uh who want to actually use AI to you know to implement some workflow changes and all this so it's it's brilliant the support yeah so I would really encourage business owners and their teams to make sure that they're utilizing all of those those resources. Yeah brilliant okay Jen uh listen thanks very much for your time it was brilliant chatting to you I really enjoyed it and um thanks for your time.

SPEAKER_00 31:25

Th thank you very much it was lovely to meet you and uh I'm sure we'll meet again soon.

SPEAKER_02 31:29

Absolutely thank you.

SPEAKER_00 31:30

Thanks Neil Okay