Kalpana Pot: Science, Stardust & the Courage to Dream Differently

In this expansive episode of A Lighthouse in the Dark, Michael Fishman sits down with Kalpana Pot, actor, author, science influencer, and astronomy expert. What unfolds is a fascinating conversation about curiosity, creativity, space, truth, and the courage to follow a path others may not understand.

Kalpana opens up about growing up in an academic family, feeling like the “black sheep” for choosing creativity, and learning to honor both sides of herself: the scientist who wants evidence and the artist who dares to dream.

Together, Michael and Kalpana explore what it means to challenge expectations, pursue acting, write books, teach science, and build a life that refuses to fit neatly into one box.

Their conversation moves from the deeply personal to the cosmic, while touching on astronomy, conspiracy theories, aliens, climate change, the dangers facing our planet, and the importance of scientific literacy in a world filled with misinformation.

Insightful, funny, thoughtful, and full of wonder, this episode is a reminder that curiosity can be an act of courage, imagination can be a form of intelligence, and sometimes the people who think differently are the ones who help us see the universe more clearly.

Because following your light may lead you all the way to the stars.

Kalpana Pots Links:

https://www.instagram.com/kalpanapot/?hl=en

https://www.imdb.com/name/nm5305151/

https://www.linkedin.com/in/kalpana-pot-1700b3271

https://www.tiktok.com/@toknerdytome

https://podcasts.apple.com/ga/podcast/128-kalpana-pot-actor-writer-host-and-space-communicator/id1517307796?i=1000661782112

https://stan.store/KalpanaP

Full episodes can be watched as well on YouTube @alighthouseinthedark channel.

For more connection and exclusive content please subscribe to the official @alighgthouseinthedark Substack.

Additional content is available across social media @alighthouseinthedark

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

She's an actor and author and a renowned science influencer. She is currently working on her astronomical planetary science degree. I would like to welcome Kalpin up to Lighthouse in the Dark. How are you today?

SPEAKER_00 0:14

I'm doing well. Thank you for having me.

SPEAKER_02 0:15

Yeah, I'm so excited. I am fascinated and somewhat like amazed both by your science knowledge but also just like your wit and your humor and the way you go about things. Thank you. I think the way people interact on the internet is fascinating.

SPEAKER_00 0:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 0:29

And and yours is so feels genuinely authentic.

SPEAKER_00 0:32

Thank you. It really is. So when I, like everybody else, hopped on social media during the pandemic, it was never really for the intention of like, oh, I hope I become an influencer one day. It was kind of something to do. So I still to this day work part-time here at Griffith Observatory, like once or twice a week. And when everything, the world shut down in 2020, I hopped on TikTok just to talk about what I was already doing at my part-time job. And then it started to take off here and there. And then inexplicably so in late 2023 into four, Instagram gave everybody a boost. So that started taking off. But I really like that these platforms, TikTok was always that way, but even Instagram shifted to short form. I have no interest in long form content. I don't enjoy editing anything at all. So the short form is where I'm at. And since it shifted from pictures to people's personalities, getting to talk, uh, that's where I really found my interest in it. And so I curse in my videos most of the time. People have a problem with it, but also that was never like a gimmick. It's just how I genuinely feel about pondering the universe, is that it's fucking amazing. And then I put that into the talks and it rubs some people the wrong way, which I don't give a shit about. Um, but for other people, they kind of like it. I'm trying to take the stuffiness out of academia because I think that's where the disconnect comes from for people.

SPEAKER_02 1:50

Yeah, I mean, I would say, like, with the theme of the show, like you are a lighthouse for science information. Like I think you have opened the door for a lot of people. Thank you. And you make it not stuffy. And I I think this is brilliant. So this is your book spaced out, right?

SPEAKER_00 2:05

Yes. Spaced out a casual approach to the cosmos.

SPEAKER_02 2:08

And you you do that is you make science accessible and warm for people. Yeah. And simple.

SPEAKER_00 2:14

Thank you. Which I'm gonna need simple.

SPEAKER_02 2:16

I'm gonna need simple today.

SPEAKER_00 2:17

So it poses its own challenge because like I try to confine everything to less than 90 seconds, but you're talking about things that are very complex. So, how do you talk about, I don't know, time dilation or relativity easily in such a short amount of time? So it it has its own challenges, and every episode is a episode, every um post is a learning experience, but I genuinely enjoy it. And the best comments I ever get are uh, you know, I wish that you were my teacher growing up. I mean, I know some people say that for various reasons, but um I'm aware of the sex appeal in the in the uh branding as well. But there are other people who are like, my kids love your videos, and just just things like that really make make it worthwhile doing what I do. That and brand deals, because it's nice getting paid also.

SPEAKER_02 3:00

Listen, there's nothing wrong with getting paid for what you do.

SPEAKER_00 3:03

Exactly. It's free content like every other day, so at least gotta make some money out of it.

SPEAKER_02 3:07

Well, and you're sharing good stuff.

SPEAKER_00 3:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 3:09

Right? Like at least you're sharing something and putting something into the world that matters for people.

SPEAKER_00 3:13

Yes. Thank you. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 3:15

Yeah. Now what lights you up about science? What was the the spark for you?

SPEAKER_00 3:19

Let's see. So I'm Indian. Uh I was born in Southern Africa, but ethnically we're Indian. So academia is, you know, you we have no choice in the house. Like there's just that was a given. And I have two older sisters, both became doctors, because some stereotypes are true. Dad's a psychiatrist, mom's a dentist, and here's me, actor, or whatever even I do now. I can't even define it anymore. But um, so because of that, science education was always very important in our house, and that's probably the like thing I'm most appreciative of were uh the way we grew up, among other things, but the fact that they pushed education onto us so strongly. It was a requirement. But for me, I can't explain why I love pondering the universe. It was something inherent in me since I was a kid. And I'm currently working on a new book, and I don't have much to say about it yet because it's such a new thing. Um, but I was thinking of like maybe making it a bit more personal, like my journey into this stuff. Thinking about it, I don't have a single moment that got me interested. I just remember being a kid. Maybe it's because it was like around the time the Hubble Space images were coming out, giving away my age, and um and I just the pictures, I don't know. There's just there has to be something greater than ourselves. And that's the philosophy behind it, I think, is what in the heart hits me the most. Carl Sagan always represented that the best. Uh, and I've always felt like astronomy is as much of a philosophy as it is a science. And I think so, marrying those two worlds together, like you ponder bigger things in a scientific way, but the effect that it has on you, I think that's what stays.

SPEAKER_02 4:56

Okay, I have to ask you about this. Okay, because that's like music to my ears. The idea of it being kind of the beauty in it.

SPEAKER_03 5:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:05

Not just the functional aspects of it, right? Because people look at it so much for like the functional part or like what does this mean? But the bigger picture, the deeper thinking part of it. Like, what does that do and how does that bring you to life?

SPEAKER_00 5:18

When I am overwhelmed and stressed, which is every day this year so far, I've already burnt out. Also because I am I sorry, I just started my d second degree for the astronomical degree, and that plus a potential new book, everything that I do. And then I'm like, you know what? In the grand scheme of the universe, nothing matters. It's a very nihilistic point of view, but to me it's very freeing. And some people don't like hearing that, but I I think it's what you make of it. And it to know that we are just a speck of dust in this great enveloping dark, like Carl Sagan said, to me is awesome because I'm like, oh yeah, nothing actually matters. And or or everything matters. Either way you take it. I think it's just very freeing in a society that puts a lot of expectations and constraints on us. And I enjoy that part of it the most. To be like, okay, one day we'll die, it's fine.

SPEAKER_02 6:09

Okay, so this is interesting because I saw you talking and somebody asked you if you could live forever. And you had a fascinating response to this.

SPEAKER_01 6:16

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 6:17

Which which was like, I there's a part of you that was very interested, but then immediately you were like, I don't want to live through the death of the star and kind of be floating out in space, right?

SPEAKER_00 6:28

Yeah, totally. So it was uh a podcast with fellow STEM creators, and so we obviously overthink the shit out of it because it's not just like, oh, do you want to live forever, yes or no? But it's like, okay, but what are the what are the parameters? Like, am I gonna survive the end of the universe? Like what we theoretically, the most belief theories call heat death, where everything just fizzles out over like an unimaginable time from now. There's no, it doesn't mean that it leads to another big bang. So you're just floating in the abyss of space for eternity. Like, do you but do you and do you have to eat? Like, do you have to keep yourself sustaining? And so we went through all these questions. So initially I was like, yeah, that sounds great. And I think I stuck to it, but that's only because I was too embarrassed to take my answer back. Because that actually also sounds awful. I feel like I would love to, and then I get to decide when I leave because I would like to see technological advancements if we ever achieve interstellar travel, um, maybe see the last black hole fizzle out, which is what they theorize would be the last objects to die in space, our black holes evaporating. And then I get to pull the plug. So it's like, yes, but also as long as at some point I die, because after everything is gone, just if there's nothing, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 7:34

Like I don't really want to be the observer of nothing.

SPEAKER_00 7:36

Of nothing, right?

SPEAKER_02 7:38

Yeah and like you talked about vastness. So it's something that uh my writing partner Michael and I talk about all the time. We've started having this conversation, and this morning when we were prepping for this, and he started asking about like the vastness of the universe. Yes, and yet the infinite of like inside atoms and and the subatomic particles of life, right? Because there is an element of that that goes on forever too.

SPEAKER_00 8:04

Yeah, it's there's so little known about quantum mechanics, and it's a subject I even touch on in my book to the best of my ability because I forgot, I think it was Nobel Prize winner Richard Feynman, who's like, if you think you know quantum mechanics, you don't. Like even someone like him is admitting that it's just a batshit world that nobody fully understands. So definitely it's like, you know, we found the atom, we found the nucleus, we found the subatomic particles, there's string theory that even takes it farther. Like, how far does this shit go? It's a universe within itself and abides by different rules. So in either direction you go, we're in the middle of it. It just it's overwhelming in every dimension possible.

SPEAKER_02 8:44

Okay, I'm gonna ask you more personally. Sure. Okay, because you talked about being in the middle essentially as the youngest child, right?

SPEAKER_03 8:50

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 8:51

I'm an actor. You're an actor. Are you the black sheep in a way in your family? Because I'm in a family of all education people. Uh-huh. And then they're like, when are you gonna get a real job? Like, yeah, after all these decades, they still ask, yeah. Yeah, like are you gonna do something normal at some point? And I'm like, why would I want to do that?

SPEAKER_00 9:11

Yeah, totally, absolute black sheep. Um, and I in some way blame my mom because she pushed pushed me into singing and dance when I was younger. So God forbid I took a liking to it and I wanted to pursue entertainment, and she like just didn't see that coming. I don't know. I like attention also, you know, I like public speaking. Like last week I did an event we did an event. Well, Amazon did an event at Griffith Observatory and they asked me to present. And public speaking, I just I just love it. It's just such a thing that comes from the heart, and for some reason I enjoy it. So like I like the spotlight, and it was kind of her fault. So, but even to this day, and despite like the TV shows and commercials, I think they don't quite understand the people who d don't necessarily care as much for structure. Like they do their jobs and their nine to fives, guaranteed income, but we're willing to risk that in order to sometimes be kind of happy. So otherwise it's insane. It's insane what we do. But it's just like if you can imagine doing something else that you would love as much, then do it.

SPEAKER_02 10:13

You should probably should.

SPEAKER_00 10:13

You should 100%, right?

SPEAKER_02 10:15

It's crazy.

SPEAKER_00 10:15

It's crazy, but like you would really have to know that about yourself. And it seems like both you and I knew that nothing else would. And as much as I love space, I never wanted to make a career out of it. I had no interest in working for NASA or JPL or anything. It somehow made its way into my career as being a communicator, but you know, like I don't care to conduct research or win a Nobel Prize one day. I would love to just communicate what other people are doing who are way smarter than me. So I like to be the bridge between the public and the experts, which we need more of in this day and age, especially with the rise in anti-science in all aspects. You know, I can deal with the flat earthers and moonlanding people who come at me.

SPEAKER_02 10:54

I want to get into this. I want to tell you, I totally want to get into this. But I actually do want to touch something first because I actually your desire and I think your interest in science and like space made perfect sense to me. And I and it's funny because I think people are like, oh, actor and like communicator, and then space. That's such a weird combination. But to me, there's an uncertainty about space.

SPEAKER_03 11:18

Right.

SPEAKER_02 11:18

There is accepting the beauty of the unknown and yet at the same time looking for the discovery. There is the magic that you never knew was going to be there until you find it.

unknown 11:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 11:29

Like so much of that to me is crossover to what we do as a performer. Totally. Because the moment is the moment, right? And the moment is as vast or as deep as the moment becomes. And then you have to move on, right? And like and I don't know when the next one is coming. I'm not really sure what the heck's going on in the solar system, and I have no idea what's going on in this business. So I think they're kind of they're kind of interrelated to me.

SPEAKER_00 11:51

Holy crap, it's no wonder you're an artist because I have never thought of it that way, and it makes complete sense. This was like a profound therapy moment for me just now, as to paralleling the two together. I've never heard it put like that, and that's it's blowing my mind right now, Michael.

SPEAKER_02 12:05

So see, good, because that was might be my last moment of feeling smart in this conversation. So I'm gonna take what I can get.

SPEAKER_00 12:12

See, artistry, and I always say too, I think it's that like people got interested in deep space because of interstellar or things like that. So it's the artists that really open the world to science, is what I see, is what I see is happening more and more.

SPEAKER_02 12:27

Okay, so I have to ask you this question is related to that. Do you have a film that sparked something in you from a scientific or from an astronomy standpoint?

SPEAKER_00 12:38

Probably contact. So we can know Carl Sagan. And I read the book years ago, like many years ago, but the movie always stuck with me, and I can't remember specifically what part, just the idea of traveling to another planet, an exoplanet. Vega is an actual star, I think is four light years away. Um I don't know, there was something about that. Just that moment of her going through a wormhole, uh, the impact that it had on her as a human being, from someone being so rigidly about science to being like, what did she say? Like uh it should no word should have sent a poet. And that's so important because it's the artists that are going to help explain science to the world.

SPEAKER_03 13:16

Right.

SPEAKER_00 13:16

Um but I think it was it was that movie in 1997 or 98 when it came out. I had never seen anything like it up until that point. So also because I'm biased towards Carl Sagan, I'll always have to put that as number one.

SPEAKER_02 13:28

I think it's really fascinating because here you are the artist translating for people.

SPEAKER_00 13:33

There you go. See paralleling things again for me. Thank you.

SPEAKER_02 13:38

Okay, so talk about the people who go crazy when you respond. Like, like because as people who are public people and do a lot of stuff and put a lot of stuff, there is pushback.

SPEAKER_01 13:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 13:50

And it's usually the thing that I think is gonna not be controversial in any way, shape, or form that I'm like, this is the most benign, non-aggressive, non-important. And then somebody's like, no, but this point, and you're like, Yeah, I I did not realize this was a thing.

SPEAKER_00 14:05

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 14:06

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 14:06

It's been an fascinating journey to encounter these people, whether or not it's once in a while at Griffith, uh, very rarely, because people are braver behind their screens than they are in person. Like you have to be off the rails completely if you're coming to Griffith as a flat earther, which happens. Wait, hold on.

SPEAKER_02 14:23

Take me through this. So for people who don't know, like Griffith Observatory, first of all, yes, is like a sacred place for me.

SPEAKER_00 14:28

It's amazing.

SPEAKER_02 14:28

It's a like one of the most amazing places. I could just sit up there for hours. I'm always like, do we have to close at 10 o'clock? Like, because like I just want to stay for the night. Like, can you just let me? I'll just lay on the grass. Just leave me alone, don't turn the sprinklers on.

SPEAKER_01 14:42

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 14:43

But tell me about flat earthers who come to the I'm gonna come to a planetarium at a place where where we talk about the stars and tell you it's flat.

SPEAKER_00 14:52

Yes. The craziest encounter I ever had was uh I forgot what year 2018 or something, an actual group of flat earth anti-NASA protesters showed up. I have so much to say about this because it was just batshit. And that might have been like one of the first big encounters of that anti-science movement that I saw. This is pre-pandemic, so still lesser known at the time. My first thought is uh okay, well I'll take it back a step. I did kind of go out and talk to them. They're not allowed to come in the building. Okay. They can be on the front lawn because they are on megaphones and things like that.

SPEAKER_02 15:24

And then like protesting.

SPEAKER_00 15:25

Full-on protesting. There's like a group of 10.

SPEAKER_02 15:28

Protest people looking through telescopes.

SPEAKER_00 15:31

I this is the kind of mentality that they have. It's just it, they're not all there, is what I have to think. There's some insane paranoia that they have that.

SPEAKER_02 15:40

I know I'm gonna about to get a whole bunch of these people in my inbox. I can just tell right now.

SPEAKER_00 15:48

Like getting rejected audition after audition, this is nothing compared to that. So they can come at me all they want for all I give a shit. But I actually talked to one of the women and she's I swear to God, she said something like, I don't, I forgot what I asked her, but she said, I don't believe in math. Like literally, two plus two is four. Like there's no dispute about behind that. So whether that's nonsense or not, it goes to show you their mentality. And I was like, all right, I'm done. There's I I can talk to people if you're questioning. I'm so happy to do that. That's what science is about. Be like, hey, tell me why the earth is or isn't flat. Awesome. Let's talk about that. That's been happening more and more at Griffith for sure. But when you're coming there and your mind is made up and you're just there to fight, it's not worth my energy. So I learned the lesson the hard way. But then the irony being like, these are everybody in the world is benefiting from the same technology that science andor NASA has developed. For instance, GPS satellites. How the fuck did these people get up to Griffith? Likely they use GPS, right? So if you really want to hate on science and technology, abandon all the technology that you benefit from. But no, they're gonna pick and choose for whatever cognitive dissonance reason that they have. So so here we are. That was insane. But you know, from that comes art, and there's a pilot I've been trying to pitch around town for like a couple years now. It's finally hopefully getting somewhere to some degree. But it was supposed to be a workplace comedy based on a space museum. I wonder where that comes from. But the climax of the pilot was a group of flat earthers who show up. So I was like, you can't write this stuff because the reality is stranger than fiction. So I put it in art at least. It it makes for a great story.

SPEAKER_02 17:21

That happens a lot in my world, is I have such a weird, varied background and so many different parts. And then it's my favorite is people are like, that's a crazy idea. Where did you guys come up with that? I'm like, I lived that moment. I'm like, like, I'm creative, I made all this stuff where that fits, but that's a real thing. Like I'm like, I'm like, and people ask those questions, and it's a very bizarre, it's a bizarre world.

SPEAKER_00 17:45

It really is. It's um just things that you can't ever dream of actually end up happening. It's very strange. But you know, since the pandemic and being online where people are way braver, I get shit said to me all the time of and just anti-science stuff. But it doesn't, it does bother me, but I think it's because I've encountered it enough. Uh just built a thicker skin around it, knowing that we are inclined to pay attention to the negativity. While most of the comments are awesome, the one that's shitty stands out, and I'm like, uh, I don't want to, I don't want to give that attention.

SPEAKER_02 18:14

So tell me about the people who come to you who are anti-science. Is it their belief system? Is it frustration? Is it they just don't love that you're doing it and they don't know what else to say?

SPEAKER_00 18:28

I I've still yet to figure out the psychology. I'm wanting to think there has to be some aspect of this is their way to feel a bit special, maybe science or math or whatever was hard growing up, which it is for most people, but it doesn't mean you go like off the deep end, you know? And so to be like, oh, I actually know the truth now and I'm here to save you sheep, there has to be some savior complex, something psychological in them that's a bit broken. They find a community. I think that's a big thing too. That there's a meme. I don't even know if it's true, and I hope it is because it's hilarious, but it was like from it was a tweet from Flat Earth Society, and it was like flat earthers have members all around the globe. And like JPL or somebody, Planetary Society chimed in and was like, read that a say that again, but slowly, because like around the globe from the Flat Earth Society. But I think like the point is they're finding a community with people who also felt the same way that they were maybe it's just they don't understand it, and that makes them angry. So then they go to the other side where they are like, Oh, actually, I didn't need to understand it because it wasn't true. They were trying to trick us, but I'm special and I know the truth, and I'm here to save you, is kind of what I've gotten from it so far. But yeah, in the comments though, disproportionately it is men.

SPEAKER_02 19:43

I was gonna that's my next question. Being an attractive female who's talking about science, I know you get people who are triggered who just show up. And you actually made a recent post about a P.

SPEAKER_00 19:59

Oh my god. We'll leave that for people to find. Okay, yes, absolutely. It is definitely one of my I think maybe the very last one I did, but it is disproportionately men. And I never like to put stereotypes and things like that out there, but this is literally based on data from my lived experience where they are the ones who most likely come at me for varying reasons. And it's um when do I get it the most? Maybe moon landing stuff, moon stuff in general. Once in a while, flat earth things, but you know, all of that aside, the anti-science stuff that triggers me the most isn't even my field, it's anti-vax stuff because that is that's life and death. And and maybe it's because I have family in the medical field. Uh and my sister, middle sister was during COVID was in residency in Long Island, so she saw like almost the worst of it, not as much as Manhattan. But like that blows my mind because brilliant people figured out how to combat these microorganisms, and somehow you think you know better all of a sudden, even though they have literally eradicated diseases. So flat Earth I'll deal with moon landing triggers me too because people died in pursuit of getting us to the moon. Um, but then for some reason nothing triggers me as much as anti-medicine, uh, vaccines or anything. And then like with the way the current I know I said I'd steer away from politics, but it's so hard to have to do that.

SPEAKER_02 21:22

Give me your truth. Give me the truth.

SPEAKER_00 21:23

Okay, yes. And I, you know, I'm very honest about it too on social media, but like I can't fucking stand RFK Jr. I think he's done so much damage to this country with the bullshit that he spews, and it's nothing, no, no single person of medicine with any credibility supports what he says. I don't at all disagree with like getting better quality food and taking the shit out of it. There's not a single study that says autism uh vaccines cause autism.

SPEAKER_02 21:47

No, and I'm okay with even like investigating vaccines, right?

SPEAKER_00 21:52

Right.

SPEAKER_02 21:53

But the first step is to actually do the science and investigate it, not just start tell people. Not to get their measles shot and then watch measles skyrocket and watch people like for me it's I don't need to see someone die before I'm upset with that, right? And I don't have to know somebody personally for it to be a personal thing for me.

SPEAKER_00 22:14

Yeah, absolutely. That's the thing. And I okay, I haven't I don't remember the history of the story, but when soon after we moved to this country, I somehow got the measles, even though I maybe just wasn't inoculated yet before I started school or something. But and that was absolutely hell. I just remember two weeks being like six years old, going through absolute hell. So I don't wish that upon anybody. But you're absolutely right. If there was do legitimate science. When people are like, I did my research, YouTube is not research. You don't have access to a lab, uh rigorous testing, peer review, and then you finally get to qualify as um evidence or a theory. Like scientific theory has more meaning than just us using the word theory in everyday life. So nobody, unless you're doing that, actually doing research, you're not really doing research. We gotta come up with a better word, I think.

SPEAKER_02 23:00

But like we need a new word because it's been it's been like taken and co-op. Yes, it really has for like a negative purpose.

SPEAKER_00 23:07

Yeah, like, oh, I did my research. And I'm like, I'm like you didn't.

SPEAKER_02 23:11

Turning on your phone is not count as doing research, right?

SPEAKER_03 23:14

Like exactly.

SPEAKER_02 23:16

Because the other part is anybody could post the counterpoint, right? And there's no way for me to know for sure I can't check everybody's credentials. I can't check every one of these things.

SPEAKER_00 23:27

Totally. That's the thing. And I've was trying to figure out recently too. So I said something on a uh story a while ago that was like being the outlier doesn't make you right. Um, and I think it was there was some meme of, and it was so funny, but it was like a picture of Joe Rogan, and above him was just like a stock photo of like dentists, and then they were like, nine out of ten dentists recommend flossing. And then the caption for Joe Rogan was, let's get that tenth one in here. So, like, just because you go against the norm doesn't mean you're right. In fact, that actually means you're wrong because 90% say yes and you're saying no, being an outlier doesn't make you special. And the same level of scrutiny we give to traditional media or doctors or whoever, why all of a sudden are we not giving that to the ones who go on uh other media? You know, like if you're going on a podcast, like we are now, why do we not get questioned the same way as actual experts who've done these things? Like just because you could be a doctor who goes on Joe Rogan and you're saying shit that was different than most other doctors, why is that person not questioned? Why why don't you see this person as also being a grifter trying to sell their book? Just because they're saying something different doesn't mean they're right. In fact, generally it means that they're wrong. We gotta go with the what the numbers are saying, and if nine out of ten dentists say you should floss, you should probably f floss. Like I just I don't get it.

SPEAKER_02 24:48

Well, and if you have an alternative point, right?

SPEAKER_00 24:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 24:51

So prove it. Because science should be pretty easy to prove. That's the part, that's one of the reasons why I wanted to have you on. Yeah. Because you do have such a unique perspective and you share such valuable information, but it's not like it's not your conjecture, it's not like a theory.

SPEAKER_01 25:06

Right.

SPEAKER_02 25:06

Even when you do every once in a while talk about something that people have talked about from a theory, there's a science support to it.

SPEAKER_01 25:13

Right.

SPEAKER_02 25:13

And you acknowledge this is the latest theory on this.

SPEAKER_01 25:16

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 25:17

Right? Which is a totally different thing than saying, oh, I know, or I I believe or I want there to be a causation between these two things. I also think it's really hard when the case of like the autism with with vaccinations. We're telling people a blame essentially for autism. And first of all, I guess I look at autism different, which is there's so many beautiful autistic people that they basically have a superpower. It's almost like their brain is wired for very specific aspects, right? And they're very narrowly focused, and there are other things that they're not great at. And the truth is, in history, especially in science, there were probably a lot of people who were autistic who turned out to be amazing scientists.

SPEAKER_00 26:02

Absolutely, right? That's so true. Half the people I work with at Griffith are autistic as fuck. So, like, I know exactly what they're like, and there's nothing wrong with that. Sometimes I envy their ability to just be so good at this one thing. Um, you know, that takes me back to this idea. It's well, actually, I don't know, I don't know the history behind it, but it's so true. The Dunning Krueger effect, where it's like um you're introduced to a subject and you think you know a lot. The more you study it, the more you realize you don't know shit. And then you like get a PhD, and then so the graph kind of goes like this. And so most people who know very little about a subject think they know as much as somebody with a PhD. And we're seeing that uh present itself more and more these days. And I see that all the time on social media. There was something recently, um, a good friend of mine, he has a PhD uh in exoplanet atmosphere. So this dude knows about alien worlds better than most people. And the if you remember from Interstellar, they land on a water planet. Was it the water world? Or no, it was the ice one, sorry. This one where Matthew um Matt Damon goes batshit. And apparently Nolan specifically designed that planet to be nonsense. Like no planet physically would exist like that, like it wasn't even a sphere or anything. He just wanted a really crazy world. And my friend touched on that in something that he posted, or if it was when we were recording our podcast, and people came at him and I'm like, bro, this is his expertise. Just because you're like, oh, but anything can exist in the universe, which isn't true, just because you think that when you this is not your field, like your point, um, your study, doesn't mean you know as much as this person. So, anyway, that's the Dunning Kruger effect. It's like, I know a little bit, so I think I know as much as somebody with an expertise. But, you know, again, I'd not want to discourage anybody, have your imagination, but also realize when there are people who know better than you, and that's okay, right? That should be okay.

SPEAKER_02 27:52

There's lots of people who know better than you in something. Yeah, right. We can't be all experts at everything.

SPEAKER_01 27:57

Right.

SPEAKER_02 27:57

And I do think on the internet there's a desire to be that, to be the all and everything in everything.

SPEAKER_01 28:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 28:03

And I'm like, no, I just don't, there's things I don't know about.

SPEAKER_00 28:06

Yeah, which is what's isn't that the fun, I would think, right? To be like, damn, I don't know about this. Teach me, or let me try to learn it. But I don't know if that's a confidence thing or it just something that comes with education, like the curiosity or willing to learn because curiosity is innate in us. But a lot of people are lacking that ability to be like, I don't know, and that's okay. Let me trust the person who does.

SPEAKER_02 28:29

Okay, in this moment, then I'm gonna say, then teach me.

SPEAKER_00 28:33

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 28:33

Okay, I'm gonna throw some topics at you try to make them as simple as you can.

SPEAKER_00 28:38

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 28:38

Um and teach me.

SPEAKER_00 28:40

Sure.

SPEAKER_02 28:40

Okay, so I just want to start with what is your favorite celestial entity? What is what is the thing for you personally, celestially, that like you're like, I can't believe that exists, or that that's amazing.

SPEAKER_00 28:54

Uh I'll have to say, um two off the top of my head. Black holes, typical answer, are amazing. It's just their existence is insane. But if I have to pick like a favorite, I always go with the Pleiades because that's maybe my all-time favorite space image is of the Pleiades star cluster. Um, it's actually a group of like a thousand stars, but six or seven or so really stand out to you, and you can even see it with the naked eye. But if you look at this image, it's so simple and hauntingly beautiful. It's about 400 plus light years away. These stars are about a hundred million years old, and they're super uh they're super young, but they won't live very long. Like our sun lives for about 10 billion years, halfway through its life. These stars will only live for hundreds of millions of years. But there's something with that picture. It's just like most space images you see of nebulas or things like that, they're beautiful and like complex with the colors. This is just like six blue bright stars against the backdrop of space, and I just I love it. It's just so pretty. It's it's there's beauty and it's simplicity. So I'm gonna have to go with those two.

SPEAKER_02 29:54

Hold on. Beauty and the simplicity. Is that part of something that is something bigger for you? Are you a simplicity and like is it about uh inherent value of like validity and and a way something is more than the aesthetics of it for you?

SPEAKER_00 30:15

Maybe. Maybe there's even like a slight envy to it where it's like uh we live our lives, or I do having to do a million things and be a certain way, and these stars are just chilling and they're stunning, just existing the way they are without any of the extra fluff around them. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 30:35

Give me your your thoughts on time.

SPEAKER_00 30:38

Okay. Time is fascinating. We can actually time travel backwards with our eyes. It's probably my favorite feature of the universe is that the farther away we look, the farther back in time we're looking. And I think that's just so cool.

SPEAKER_02 30:51

Hold on. The farther away we look, the farther back in time. So you're talking about like across the galaxy, for example, like if you see like uh a black hole or something, right? You're seeing that from a from a distant time period, right?

SPEAKER_00 31:06

Yes, exactly. Because the photons from that object have to travel across space to hit your eyes. So, for instance, it takes like two seconds for us to see the moon because of the light having to bounce off of it to hit us. Um, light travels from the sun for like eight and a half minutes. So we're always seeing it as it was eight and a half minutes ago. So the farther away you look, the farther back in time you're looking. And I think that's just it's just so cool because there's no way in hell we're ever going to physically reach these places. So at least the universe gives us something. It's like, all right, well, we'll just show you how it would have looked, you know, billions of years ago or hundreds of millions of years ago. So, and to so there's that part of time. The other part of time that I love, speaking again of interstellar, is that it's rel it really is relative and it's been measured to be so. It's just, I know they call it um, well, it's Einstein's relativity theories. The faster you move, the slower time moves for you.

SPEAKER_03 32:00

Right.

SPEAKER_00 32:00

And then the deeper the gravitational field, the slower time is. So what I wrote in my book is like if you really want to try to elongate your life, be a mermaid and move as fast as you can. Okay, so I say that because Okay, hold on.

SPEAKER_02 32:12

Okay, okay, yes. Be a mermaid.

SPEAKER_00 32:14

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 32:14

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 32:15

And move as fast as you can. Okay. So because time moves more slowly towards the center of our Earth than it does on the surface or above.

SPEAKER_02 32:23

Which is why the core is younger, right? Okay.

SPEAKER_00 32:26

So if you're a mermaid and you're moving just super fast, you can live a little bit longer, not by much. It'd be like minutes maybe.

SPEAKER_02 32:32

Um is that also applied to the astronauts? Because it's just a slight difference, but but they are technically a little younger than the time difference, right?

SPEAKER_00 32:41

Exactly. They're like micro milliseconds younger. Okay. So uh a couple weeks ago I did an um a Zoom interview collab thing with Senator Mark Kelly from Arizona. And he was a former astronaut and has a twin brother who was also an astronaut. So it was a really also great experiment for NASA to see the effects on twin bodies, not just of like the damage of space travel, but that his brother Scott Kelly also got younger by 13 milliseconds or something like that. So, and that's just that's so cool. So if you look at contact, um, 18 hours for her, what was it gonna be? Eight I'm forgetting the time thing now. I just remember that when she was, if she actually made it to Vega in the time that they had determined, four years or so plus four plus years. I'm gonna get all this wrong. I'm forgetting the numbers. Time would have slowed down for her more than people on Earth. And that actually also happened, I want to say, in the movie. I am forgetting that. So let's skip ahead to Interstellar where they I can actually remember it better. The water planet um was seven years for them. Sorry, uh, one hour for them was seven years for people back on Earth. So that is actually relativity. It was just the way the speed of the planet orbiting the black hole plus the planet's effect uh the black hole's effect on the planet made its gravity and its time experience very different than for people on Earth. So when Matthew McConaughey's character was there, an hour for them was seven years back on Earth. And that's that's a crazy feature of the universe that wasn't discovered until a hundred plus years ago by Einstein. Up until that point, they thought that time was constant, no matter where you are. And we know today that it's not, and that's just why? I don't know. Why is our universe designed that way? Who knows?

SPEAKER_02 34:22

And you did this thing on are they tachrons? Oh, the tachyons. Yeah, tachyons. Okay, so talk to me. This they move at like 186,000 like miles per second or something like that.

SPEAKER_00 34:36

That's right. So that's actually that's the speed of light right there. 186,000 miles per second. That's a hard number to remember, so good for you. Okay. So that's I was paying attention. Yeah, totally. So that's how fast the speed of light moves. With tachyons, they're a hypothetical particle that are proven mathematically, but their existence also, if ever found, might not ever be found because it violates just the way our universe functions. And I want to say uh certain comic book characters talk about it. I think the Flash. I don't remember. Some nerds told me some stuff. And like I like certain comics, but I'm not I don't know that much about it.

SPEAKER_03 35:12

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 35:12

But um, yeah, so with the tachyon particle, it allows you to move backwards in time. So, like, let's say I think I said in the video, uh, if someone sent me a tachyon signal, I would receive the signal before they even sent the message in the first place. So there's a weird paradox there. And so in that case, like you go with the grandfather paradox, like if I sent a signal that prevented my grandparents from meeting, therefore I wouldn't have been born. So then would I have sent a signal? Right. So it violates this principle called causality, which is cause and effect. So, but it's still cool though. Like this is the sci-fi shit that we love. And it's not even fully sci-fi because there's a lot of math to support it. But um, this is the stuff about space that I think people find the most fascinating. It's the possibilities of what seems like magic.

SPEAKER_02 35:58

Is this the thing that makes you come back to it over and over and over again?

SPEAKER_00 36:01

I think so. Absolutely. Yeah. And then when I find that videos like this, like tachyons or random sci-fi-y sounding stuff, is what gets people into it, then even better. I actually, when I first wrote my book, the sci-fi section was at the back. And then also now, being a more experienced screenwriter, I know the first 10 pages are what matters. So I move that section to the front of my book because I think that's what gets people the most interested, is like the stuff that seems like magic that we haven't proven yet or anything, is where people find this stuff to be fascinating. So let's open the window to them with that kind of talk, right? And then we can get into more boring things.

SPEAKER_02 36:37

Okay, give me a Dyson sphere.

SPEAKER_00 36:39

Okay, Dyson sphere.

SPEAKER_02 36:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 36:41

Hypothetical spheres that a type two civilization harnesses uses to harness all of the energy from its star.

SPEAKER_02 36:47

Type two?

SPEAKER_00 36:48

Yes. Uh and more fascinating stuff. Okay. The Kardashev scale, Nikolai Kardashev, scientists in the 1950s, came up with like a not an arbitrary, um, but let's say arbitrary kind of criteria for um classifying advanced civilizations. So Earth, the way we stand, still harnessing energy from our planet, like fossil fuels and things like that. We're a 0.7.

SPEAKER_03 37:10

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 37:10

If we were to ever be able to fully get to maybe using solar energy, maybe we'd be a type 1. A type 2 harnesses all their energy directly from their star. So you hear of these hypothetical structures called a Dyson sphere. They're supposed to surround the star.

SPEAKER_02 37:29

And absorb.

SPEAKER_00 37:29

And absorb the energy. I did a video because someone was like, is it possible? And I don't think so, because my thing is, where the fuck do you get all the material? Like you're building a structure around a star, let alone the Earth. I don't think we have enough material, but around a star. So where where where do we get the material from?

SPEAKER_02 37:51

So I had a counter, because I was like, okay, so here's the problem with that for me. So say we do this and we put it all the way around. How do we get light now if we've blocked everything to take in all the like I'm like, I'm like, I I need like there's a logical flaw for me.

SPEAKER_00 38:06

There you go.

SPEAKER_02 38:07

Because I'm like, so we harness the energy, but we're all dead and we can't grow anything. This sounds like a terrible idea. Like infinite power, and I guess we're growing everything. We're gonna grow everything in little like warehouses. I know, right? Like, we're gonna all grow like this. This is not what I planned.

SPEAKER_00 38:25

So I think the best solution to a Dyson sphere is a swarm. So you don't encompass the entire star, it's just maybe a swarm of material that surrounds it, and maybe just the equator or something like that. I always just come down to where is the material coming from? There's a movie, a disaster movie I saw over the pandemic. I like the concept, but it's so dumb. Geostorm, you guys ever saw it? They build a structure around the earth to control its weather. There's not even enough material for that. Like, where is we're gonna destroy Mercury? Just sacrifice Mercury, extract all the metals, build these materials. So, like, so I always like pick out um pinpoint shit like that. I love, I mean, I'm not shitting on artistry though, like run with it, you know. But I'm just like, but where does that material come from? So, yeah, anyway, hypothetical Dyson sphere for a type 2 civilization, a type 3 gets even crazier because now they've essentially colonized the whole galaxy. So they can that's just another level of technological advancement when it just gets fun though. And you can even come up with uh um civilizations that are increasingly more advanced, and that's just pure imagination, and I think that's that's what's fun.

SPEAKER_02 39:30

Okay, I'm going to aliens.

SPEAKER_00 39:31

Okay, let's do it.

SPEAKER_02 39:32

Okay, talk to me about aliens for a moment.

SPEAKER_00 39:34

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 39:35

All right, talk to me from a standpoint of aliens, right? What is your thought process on aliens and what do you think they would be like?

SPEAKER_00 39:43

I think um, based on statistics alone, they have to exist out there. Okay. I would all I mean, I would 100% be more shocked if we somehow ever came to know that we are alone. And that was the concept spoilers of Ad Astra, which I thought was really cool. And when Brad Pitt found his dad by Neptune or whatever, and they scanned millions of exoplanets to look for signatures of life, and he was just so like messed up in the head because he's like, I haven't found shit. And like that impacted him more than had they actually found signs of life out there. And I agree, that would just be even more mind-blowing. But um, I think statistically they have to exist. I don't think any of the UFO UAPs are actual evidence of extraterrestrials. Um, but I think they have to exist. And in terms of what they would look like, likely when we'd find one, it would be more simple celled. Statistically, that would just make more sense.

SPEAKER_03 40:36

Right.

SPEAKER_00 40:37

They would just be simple organisms. If we were to find something intelligent and complex, honestly, I think your imagination can just soar. I don't necessarily think they'd be bipedal. I think it's again statistically more that they'd be on like all fours or all six or whatever. And yeah, I think they would just be completely their evolution would just depend on their planet's environment. And that was fun when with Project Hail Mary was that Rocky, the alien, was like literally a rock. And that was really cool. So yeah, so let your imagination run at that point.

SPEAKER_02 41:10

Okay, now I think I heard you say at one point on and somebody asked you, and you said that's why we look for water.

SPEAKER_01 41:16

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 41:17

Right? Because I forgive me if I'm misquoting you, but it's the transmission of across cell walls and things like that.

SPEAKER_01 41:25

Yeah, totally.

SPEAKER_02 41:26

That you thought would be one of the predominant things.

SPEAKER_00 41:29

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 41:30

From an energy or from a life force standpoint, is that right?

SPEAKER_00 41:33

Yeah, I think so. Water is important to all life on earth because of the polarity of the molecule. So it pushes and pulls nutrients throughout the body. And and that's specifically because of the H2O molecule. So that's why I think it's important to look for uh water out there. I did take a I did have to take an advanced biology class for this degree that I'm doing. Actually, I didn't have to, I chose to, but I had like sections of chunks of classes to choose from, like, oh, bio regret.

SPEAKER_02 42:00

But uh Wait, you don't like bio?

SPEAKER_00 42:02

Actually, no, I love it. This is just not what I expect. Yeah, that's a good idea. Yeah, this ended up being a bit more molecular biology, and like the workload was insane. But I look back on it and I'm like, wow, this shit was fascinating. So I can't quite define the process of like osmosis and all that stuff with the cell, even though I just took the glass. But um, but I'm aware of it. I just am not my expertise to put it into words now. But specifically comes down to the molecule of H2O and how important that is for life.

unknown 42:31

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 42:31

And we look for water also, because if life was really that adaptable to everything, then there'd be life everywhere in our solar system. We have an abundance of it on this planet, and they all depend on water. Minus the extremophiles, like tardigrades. I mean, they use water too, but like chemosynthesis or something.

SPEAKER_02 42:47

Yeah, exactly, right?

SPEAKER_00 42:48

So, but literally 99.9% of life depends on water. We have an excess amount of life on this planet. If life could be anywhere, then Mercury, Venus, Mars, we they would have it too. So why not look for what we have here to look for life out there? And then that's where liquid water comes in, situations that are similar to Earth, need a magnetic uh field to deter radiation away from your star.

SPEAKER_03 43:12

Right.

SPEAKER_00 43:13

Uh, atmosphere, of course, water, a solid planet that's also not erratic in its orbit or like spin. I think those things are the most important, and then time being the last factor. Or maybe the most important factor. Yeah, probably.

SPEAKER_02 43:27

And so it's interesting because like we talk about this planet, it has a very distinct tilt to it.

SPEAKER_01 43:33

Right.

SPEAKER_02 43:33

Right? But it's consistent, right? Right. It doesn't wobble when it makes a turn. Because if it wobbled, everything would be different, and a large portion of what's on this planet would cease to exist.

SPEAKER_01 43:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 43:42

And it's so amazing how finite and how delicate life is.

SPEAKER_01 43:46

Right.

SPEAKER_02 43:47

Like I think there's something so precious about that. I think that's the scientific part that I dn I've never felt like science and faith are in opposition.

SPEAKER_01 43:56

Same.

SPEAKER_02 43:57

I've always felt like the two walk hand in hand, and I'm always Somewhat uh uh astounded because, for example, religious people believe that everything started from a singular place, right? And there was creation. And a lot of scientists, not all, which I think is an important point, believe that everything started from one initial place. Now, whether it's an energetic place or an evolutionary place, that that's a whole different debate. Sure. But every single group essentially believes the same thing, which is everything started from one. So we're all interconnected. So I'm not really sure why you guys hate each other and why you're talking about it. Like I'm really confused by like all of you have very similar core values or core components.

SPEAKER_01 44:38

Right.

SPEAKER_02 44:39

Like we're really fighting over some minutiae to hate someone else.

SPEAKER_00 44:43

That's I think where it comes from, down to the details, it seems like. Um, I grew up Hindu. I don't know too much of the details of the Bible. I don't even know if it actually says the earth is 6,000 years old or not. That's just like the stereotypical thing you hear about it. So if if it does say that and it contradicts what science knows the age of the earth to be, I think it comes down to those details. When you look back from it, like you were just saying, the crux of everything is about the same. So why why do why do humans, why are we so inclined to fighting all the time? Well, also conflict.

SPEAKER_02 45:17

Why why are we choosing to hate or destroy like regardless of your belief system? There's something inherently sacred about life. And yet we're destroying it at an astronomical level.

SPEAKER_01 45:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 45:31

And so I'm always somewhat astounded by that.

SPEAKER_00 45:34

Right. I know. Last month or the month or two ago, I read Sapiens, which was popular like 10 years ago. Um it's such a good book. And he said something to me that, or he said something in the book, that uh helped me kind of cope with the destructive nature of humans, is that everything we do, even if it seems batshit, or people are like, oh, you shouldn't be gay because it's unnatural. No, if a human is doing it or capable, it is natural. So I have to justify in my head that our destructive behavior is just part of nature too. And that's how I have to just deal with it.

SPEAKER_02 46:10

I can see that. I it's a very interesting thing. The hatred portion I've always almost feels a little bit like mental health oriented, right? Like I that there are always an element where the blind hatred is always somewhat like it's just a mind meld that you've decided to accept a certain part of the darkest aspect of humanity.

SPEAKER_01 46:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 46:30

I used to volunteer in the NICU all the time, right? I was a NICU and small baby unit person. There's a lot of babies who are born that are non-binary, right? We didn't invent this, right? Like science didn't suddenly decide, hey, we're gonna invent non-binary because, you know, because the media said we should, and because it, you know, it it's a political statement.

SPEAKER_01 46:48

Right.

SPEAKER_02 46:49

But no, non-binary happens all the time. Yeah, it happens like and I watch parents who, in the first few hours of a child's life, have to make a decision that's going to define this child legally for the rest of its life. Wow. Which is like such a heavy like, can we give them two years so they can at least see what the kid is interested or what they're drawn to or what their features are, even right? Like because they all look a little alien when they first come out, right? Like in the most loving way. Because I love babies, but like I look at it and I'm like, you're gonna make a life decision for this child. Or, you know, there's all kinds of dysmorphia, and there's all kinds of like, you know, whether it be partial genitalia, both genitalia, like there's literally a spectrum. There's such a spectrum in humanity, right? And we act as if, well, you know, it's all one or it's all other. It's like, no, no, you can be religious and still realize like if a higher power in your mind exists, then a higher power created this. Because it's not just in human beings, it's in every species.

SPEAKER_03 47:54

Totally.

SPEAKER_02 47:54

Ask a farmer. They've seen a lot of variety in all the animals they've raised over the course of their lives.

SPEAKER_00 48:00

Yeah, I absolutely. What made you want to volunteer in a NICU? That's that's a that's a lot. Holy crap, glutton for punishment, maybe.

SPEAKER_02 48:08

Well, it's a combination of things. I have a unique gift, which is I put babies to sleep.

SPEAKER_01 48:12

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 48:13

Um so it and I'm kind of there saying, Yeah. So I I do. I'm literally like, if if somebody can't, or if it's somebody, especially if I see um a woman who's by herself and she's outnumbered, and I'm like, I there's nowhere for me to run. I can't go anywhere. I promise I will walk right here in the aisle where you can see me. Yeah. But I'm like, would you like me to walk your baby or like give you a break for just a moment? Like, I'm not going anywhere. Right. There's nowhere for me to go. We're locked in this tube. Like, I like there's no there's no out.

SPEAKER_03 48:43

That's right.

SPEAKER_02 48:44

And I just love babies.

SPEAKER_01 48:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 48:45

And so I think because I accept the chaos that comes with them, I don't get a whole lot of chaos. I get just the opposite. It's kind of order in the chaos.

SPEAKER_01 48:57

Sure.

SPEAKER_02 48:58

Um, so that's really sweet. Yeah, when my house became when it when the house got quiet and it was just me in the house, I was like, okay, I'm gonna go back to doing this because I love that. And there's also I was a grief counselor for a little while. And so I I meet people on their worst possible days. You know, they had this beautiful vision of what family or having a baby was gonna look like.

SPEAKER_01 49:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 49:21

And it didn't go exactly the way they planned. There was an emergency or there was a problem or whatever it is.

SPEAKER_01 49:27

Right.

SPEAKER_02 49:28

But the baby's still beautiful in its own way, right? And I I I tell people all the time, because I've been on the palliative care team, which means I'm there at the end. Even sometimes when parents can't be, when they've they or they've given up and they've gone home. And what I would tell you in that is I think every creature deserves to be loved all the way to the end. And so there's a part of that. But also I've watched so many miracles. I've watched babies born at twenty one, twenty weeks that even 10, 15 years ago, 25, but probably 27 was viability, and now we're talking about babies born in the twenties or sometimes you know, 19 that are surviving.

SPEAKER_01 50:10

Wow.

SPEAKER_02 50:10

And you know, lungs aren't supposed to be done to like 26 weeks, 27 weeks. So you're talking about a baby who comes into the world partially right, like partially formed, yeah. And then somehow finds the will to form itself and to continue forming, and if you give it love, they all grow better. And so I think it's kind of like there's just this very simple thing of like just love them.

SPEAKER_03 50:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 50:37

Like, and I they don't have to be mine for me to love them. I think that's also part of it. Um, it is a little strange for people when a male walks in and is like, oh yeah, give me your baby, like I like, or I I'll love this child like blindly, because um that's not what people anticipate.

SPEAKER_01 50:52

Yeah, gotcha.

SPEAKER_02 50:53

But also I think sometimes that's my advantage. Yeah. Is like in the NICU in particular, there's a lot of dads who don't want to talk about what's going on or their experience or won't talk to anybody else. Um, even the male nurses they won't talk to because I think it's like they can't. And for whatever reason, I I tend to be the place where they can just kind of let it all out. And sometimes I'm just like, hey, we need to go take a walk. Or like I can see them getting agitated with people. I'm like, let's go take a walk. You find the space in between, right?

SPEAKER_00 51:21

Absolutely. That's so admirable. That's so cool that you do that.

SPEAKER_02 51:26

Well, you're guiding people to science. I'm helping people kind of bridge the gap in the world that they thought they were gonna have.

SPEAKER_01 51:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 51:35

Right? And totally part of the storyteller thing too, right? Right. Is listening to people's stories and then sharing part of like I I'll be here for a very I'll I I actually like the fact that a lot of times I'm at the hardest part of somebody's story. And it's great a couple years later when a little kid comes back to visit, or my favorite probably case is uh I was working in the NICU. I'm always right where I'm supposed to be. It just works out that way. I went to go take a short break because there was a shift change and everybody was like kind of just just a little antsy. I was like, okay, give everybody space, there's nothing for me to do at this time, everybody's kind of accounted for. And I went downstairs and ran into a little boy from oncology. And I used to volunteer in a in an oncology ward when I was younger. Um it's the most beautiful part about what we do is actors when we work a lot, we get access to people and people see us, and for a moment we'll feel better or we'll connect with a character and want to tell us their story.

SPEAKER_01 52:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 52:39

So my little boyfriend, I can't use his name for HIPAA reasons. Yeah, sure. I was like catching myself. So he stopped me and was like talking to me, and they needed directions, and I walked them, and next thing I know I'm talking to him, and he's like, Are you gonna come visit me? I I don't know how to say no, right? Like I can't imagine saying no. So then I'm like, Oh yeah, I'm volunteering to go visit him. And then I kept visiting him, and one day he's having he left and then he comes back and he's having a terrible day. And this is, you know, when we talk about the cosmos to me, there's also something about the sacred element of like what is all this and what does it all mean? To me, it's the beauty of the universe is everything is out there, and yet we are everything and we are stars, right? Everything that makes all of that is part of us.

SPEAKER_01 53:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 53:27

This little boy walks in and he's wearing a shark costume. And he I'm like, what's going on? He's like, it's shark week.

SPEAKER_01 53:35

Amazing.

SPEAKER_02 53:35

And I'm like, fantastic. He goes, Can you come here? I was like, Yeah. So I get down on my knees, and he throws the hood over me, which is the head of the shark, and starts chomping me.

SPEAKER_01 53:43

And he's like, I'm eating you, and I'm like screaming.

SPEAKER_02 53:46

For five minutes the kid feels better.

SPEAKER_01 53:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 53:49

Right? For a moment somebody didn't see him as sick.

SPEAKER_01 53:52

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 53:53

You know, so I'm the fool who will dress up. You know, I went and bought a six-foot inflatable shark costume and like came visited him because it's shark week. You're gonna have to like, so then I got to attack back. So you know you have to have some fun, right?

SPEAKER_00 54:06

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 54:06

But you find the beauty in life, I think.

SPEAKER_00 54:09

And it's in moments like that, for sure. As they say, you know, like your your actions of kindness might not change the world, but they'll change the world, at least even momentarily, for that being. And what more can we do as humans than that? That's really amazing.

SPEAKER_02 54:25

So, what's the dream for you at this point?

SPEAKER_00 54:29

In terms of career, doesn't have to be more. I have no idea.

SPEAKER_02 54:34

Everybody in this town always asks about everybody's career, right? Everybody asks what you do. Yeah. I'm more interested in about what lights you up and what inspires you to do the things you do. Like, what inspires you to keep going back with everything we talked about and the opposition, right?

SPEAKER_00 54:47

Right. I think the opposition itself fuels me. Like, there wouldn't be a need for science communicators if anti-science people didn't exist, so like go for it, I suppose. Yeah, help, right? Yeah, exactly. Comment away, rage bait, whatever. Um, but you know, this is the issue I've been having this year with being a little burnt out already. Some sense of existential crisis because I don't fully know what I want to do anymore. And so much of my identity was always tied to career. And I suppose coming from a South Asian family, that's just kind of how it is.

SPEAKER_02 55:17

Listen, my dad's an immigrant and career's everything, right? Um, and education. Yes. To get to career. To get to career.

SPEAKER_00 55:24

It's it just defines so much of you as a person. And coming into Hollywood 10 years ago, it was a very different world. And I didn't I still do enjoy acting, but not as much as I am actually enjoying doing content creation. But I still love storytelling, and so I would love to get one of my stories developed, however tough that is or not, I don't know. But I even lost a bit of interest in doing that. Like I mentioned earlier, my pilot. It was it's been my baby for a few years now, but now I'm also like, uh, I don't know anymore. So I genuinely feel a little lost this year as to what I'm doing, but I'm not mad at it. It could just be like a transition period of what I needed. And I'm also someone who likes to try a lot in life, like grew up singing and dancing 10, no, a little less than 10 years ago, I got a black belt in Taekwondo, doing all of this shit now, getting my second degree. It's like unending things I want to do in life, and that's probably just what this phase is for me. It's just shifting into possibly trying something else or something new. Hey, if Netflix came to me and wanted to develop my pilot, absolutely, please do. But I'm not oh, like suffocating that dream as much as I used to. And that's probably a good thing, but I just I don't have an ultimate goal anymore. I think as long as I can have a roof over my head and money in my Roth IRA, I'll be okay, I suppose.

SPEAKER_02 56:42

Is it a bit of a like photon element to it? Is the thing about a photon, is it it essentially is light and it's traveling, but we don't always know where it's going. But in order for us to see things, such as like what we make in movies and pictures, is we need the light to expose the darkness and it's the contrast that lights things up.

SPEAKER_01 57:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 57:03

It's okay that you don't fully know what your picture is yet.

SPEAKER_01 57:08

Right.

SPEAKER_02 57:08

But you know you're the photon that wants to keep shining and keep doing. Totally. Is is it somewhere along that?

SPEAKER_00 57:14

You're so good at drawing artistic metaphors. It could be, yeah. It's just um I'm being such a control freak, which is weird that I chose this fucking industry.

SPEAKER_02 57:25

But um, I don't know anything about this. This is gonna turn to a therapy session here.

SPEAKER_00 57:30

But it's like uh also like these life lessons that I experience are always ones that try to remind me that ultimately you don't really have control. And that could just be what this is. Like wanting to pursue Hollywood, it'll be a part of me that will always want that. It's changed so much now, and I'm glad at least I have my foot in the door in the content side. You know, when you're younger, you visualize a specific way you'd hope your life turns out. And as I say, it never really does, but it ends up being better. And being a little lost right now is actually good for me because it allows me to relinquish this non-existent control that I think I have. And so I'm just kind of going with the flow and seeing where life takes me. So continue with what I'm doing. Absolutely. I'm still gonna pitch my projects and all of that. I just, it's not the burning desire that I once had, even up until like last year. So I don't know why. I don't know why I'm changing or what's happening, but I'm just gonna go with life and see where it takes me.

SPEAKER_02 58:27

I think some of that's growing though.

SPEAKER_00 58:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 58:29

I think early on you have a very rigid view of things. It's kind of like every time we discover a planet, right? They kind of have a concept of what it looks like, and then they're like, okay, let's really take a look at this thing. It's the part that I love about it, which is when they start diving into it, it's like, oh, it does have a lot of the same pieces we have. It's not as foreign or weird, it's just constituted a little different.

SPEAKER_01 58:51

Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_02 58:52

Right? Like the pieces are still the same. The form is slightly different, but if I look at it, it breaks down to things that I actually can understand and relate to. And it's beautiful in its own way.

unknown 59:04

Totally.

SPEAKER_02 59:04

Because I think like every planet, every time we find a celestial body, they are uniquely beautiful in their own way. And we don't always understand them at first because sometimes we don't have the measurement tools or the complex like understanding of that part. And then which is amazing about humanity, which is somehow we figure out the science or the math, and all of a sudden it's like, it's like, okay, like that's a theoretical, and now it's no longer theoretical. Yeah, now it's real, and now and now we can measure that, and now we go back to all the things we did before and say, okay, I'm gonna apply this in other places.

SPEAKER_01 59:37

Yeah, totally.

SPEAKER_02 59:38

If only we could do that in government and science and like medicine. I know, I know, no, for sure. Instead of like withholding it.

SPEAKER_00 59:44

Yeah, yeah, totally. I think that is always the thing that gives me hope about humanity, is um what we are truly capable of in like cool ways like that. Um, whether it's through storytelling, like imagine a hundred years ago making a film like Interstellar, like that concept wouldn't even exist, and now we're able to. That, and then also, you know, our ancestors would look at like the Pleiades and come up with stories. Like in Greek mythology, it was the seven sisters, and Zeus put them in the sky, and Orion's always chasing it. But now we actually know that it's like a star cluster filled with a thousand stars, and it's at this distance away, and these stars are this old, and that's amazing. So the existence of humans has always been such an interesting paradox to me, because we're capable of such cool shit and also such insane shit, but maybe one wouldn't have existed without the other. I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:31

Okay, so what do you wish to see from humanity? If you could like push us or nudge us in a direction, what would that look like for you?

SPEAKER_00 1:00:40

I hope that because I you know, my experience is just so far, apart from my childhood, when I was in Botswana, is in America, and I'm really frightened and discouraged by the push towards anti-expertise in science. I think that's insanely frightening. So I'd hope that humanity somehow gets back on track in the Western world, in all parts of the world, I suppose. I just don't know if it's really happening in developing countries at this point. And I hope that um we figure out climate change before it's a bit too late. And at the same time, if that's just the course of our existence, because we've been here for like a blip. Dinosaurs existed exponentially longer than we did. And if we take ourselves out, then that's fine too.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:28

So talk to me real briefly about climate change.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:30

Sure.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:31

What is the part of that that you wish people would pay attention to more? And as someone who studies science, what is the part where you're like, this is pretty obvious? We could just do this.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:39

It's weird to know that an appending doom is happening, is going to happen. And that at this point, like a hundred percent of climate scientists believe that anthropogenic climate changes, as in humans are causing the acceleration of it, is real. Like it's not a debate. And but it's the weird thing of like the frog in a boiling pot analogy. Like you put one in a pot that's already boiling, it jumps out, but you put it in a pot of normal water and it starts to slowly get hotter. So that's what climate change is, is because although we are seeing some effects, extreme weather, but it's not to the point where, like, you know, Florida's completely flooded over yet. It's like we're we're gonna have to wait until that happens for people to do things. And I wish that we would just stop fighting about it so we can start doing things now. And I don't actually know if it's necessarily too late yet. I mean, you kind of measure climate change based on the ocean temperature, and it has heated up quite a bit. Um, there's also like a prevalence of viruses these days because of a hotter planet. So I know for sure in Earth's history, it has uh gone through periods of cold and heat from natural causes, but we're aware that we are directly creating this one and we have the ability to change it. And because we don't, that's very frustrating.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:57

Okay, I'm gonna talk to you about something in related to this. Because I heard you say one time that misinformation goes viral while education goes out the door.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:07

Right, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:07

And I think you were referring to this concept that August 12th, right? Like the whole plan is supposed to lose all gravity.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:15

Okay. Talk to me about why that's BS. Okay. Right? Because you see it all over, like, and it's gonna happen more and more over the next couple of months. Talk to me about that, and then why you think that that is the pattern.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:28

There was a video somebody tagged me in, or I came across it, and it was like some AI voiceover creepy sounding like on August 12th. NASA's aware, but they're not telling us that Earth is gonna lose gravity for seven seconds. And everything's gonna flow and then everything's gonna crash. And NASA calls it project anchor. They know it's gonna happen, but they're just like there's nothing they're doing about it. And that is so insane, but it goes to show you what lack of education kind of does because, and I get okay, fine, you're talking about gravity. That is a concept that, unless you're studying astronomy or physics, you're not super familiar with the dynamics of how it works. But gravity isn't like a thing, it's an aspect of the universe. Like Einstein's the one who said that gravity is created by the mass of an object. So we revolve around the sun because it's I mean, you imagine like a trampoline fabric, and like the heavier the object is, the more its dip will be. And that's essentially what gravity is. And so that's why the moon revolves around us. We kind of revolve around each other, but that's getting too many, too much into detail. But anyway, um, so there's nothing to turn off. This is like a feature of the structure of our universe. So, how the fuck would we just automatically lose it for seven seconds? Also, like everybody would die because I just I just I don't understand. Like, what you would just somehow come down? Like it's it's on the.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:49

Are we all supposed to stay indoors on August 12th? Like, I'm not and then do you do you like just pad all of your furniture and like and like like lay in bed? Or like I'm not really sure. Do I tie myself? Like, how unless the I guess SM people probably will be the only ones okay because then they're already in nature.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:05

Like, anyway. But like if Earth lost gravity, nothing I just there's there's no there's nothing that can explain this. Like it just doesn't, Earth would have to disappear, and how would that happen? And therefore everything that's on it also disappears. There's no way to lose gravity. That's just not literally physically possible. Right. But you know, the videos like that, they go viral, and I didn't, I don't fully remember the comments. I'd like to think most people are like, uh, yeah, okay, bro. And I think they are, but then why does a video like that go viral? And that's the problem with social media and the shit that it pushes. It's just it's really the algorithm is really based on, I don't know, rage bait, misinformation bait, whatever it is. And then there's like quality stuff that doesn't get seen as well. And I don't know why the algorithm is designed that way, but it's specifically for maybe they realize videos like that retain more attention.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:59

Right.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:00

And like you watch the whole thing because you need to know, like, oh my God, am I gonna die? What can I do? And that just generates more money for these platforms. So they're 100% directly complicit in the problem that's happening in the country today with misinformation. Oh, without doubt, they're like the catalyst of it. But yeah, we're not gonna lose gravity on August 12th. And it's a coincidence they picked that day too, because that's when the solar eclipse is gonna be happening. But like I couldn't even begin to explain how that is so insanely wrong. Like it's just not physically possible. We can't manipulate gravity like that. It's literally a the part of the fabric of the universe.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:33

So as we wrap up, I want to ask you a couple questions, but they're more aimed at you.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:37

It's time already. Okay, I can keep going. This is really fun. So I could go all day.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:41

Okay. We may have to you may have to come back. We may have to do it that way.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:44

Down, down.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:45

Specifically for you. What are three words to describe you? If you were gonna describe you, what are your three words?

SPEAKER_00 1:06:53

Imaginative.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:54

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:55

Curious, spicy.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:59

Imaginative, curious, and spicy. Okay, fantastic.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:03

How about you?

SPEAKER_02 1:07:03

I would say authentic. Love or loving is always one of them. Um relentless.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:09

Love that.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:10

Yeah. Great combo.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:11

I try to be kind, but but there's a relentlessness to it.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:14

Yeah, totally.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:15

Um, so I'm always gonna be that way. What are the things that you want your loved ones to take from your life? You share so much with the world. What is it that you want the people close to you to take from you in your life?

SPEAKER_00 1:07:28

I've never thought about this before. Hmm. I ultimately hope, especially when it comes to family, that they're just proud of me. And I think they are. We just have never been, we don't share emotions too much in our house. I'm sure you understand.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:41

I grew up in a house where I'm not supposed to have emotions. Like I'm supposed to be stoic and there aren't supposed to be emotions. And every time I like want to talk about them, they're like, no, no, no, there's that there's something wrong with you.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:51

Right, yeah, right.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:52

Like and we don't tell you we're proud of you. We just tell you what you need to work on.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:57

Right, exactly. Like, and they're like, Oh, well, you shouldn't, you know, you're what's good. Yeah, you we don't gotta tell you. You're you you figured it out already. But um, so I just I hope for that, which I know is true, and I and I don't want them to worry about me. Like, I know what I'm doing and I love what I do, but and even if they don't understand it, please just let me be.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:18

The thing about being an artist is people are always worried about us.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:20

Yeah, like I don't want that. I know, and maybe it's just how I grew up, also being the youngest, but you kind of bear that burden of like, please don't ever worry about me. Like, I'm fine. Yeah. So I think I think that. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:32

So as you put all these things out into the world, what do you want to guide the world to? What is it that you're lighting up in the world that you want to guide people to safe harbor for?

SPEAKER_00 1:08:42

As much as I shit on humanity, I guess I truly deep down hope that because I know we're capable of saving this planet and ourselves. I suppose that's a big reason why I do what I do online is like trying to subconsciously remind humans that look at like all the shit that we've been able to do in such amazing ways with science and whatever, medicine, all of it, STEM in general, don't forget that. And let's utilize these essential superpowers that we have of our brains towards good because we're capable. I'm such an animal lover, um, because they're just purely based on instinct. And the difference with humans is that we can make choices, like we choose to do shitty things, but we at the same time can choose to do good things. So I hope to I really hope for the world that we lean more towards the good because that's our choice.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:38

I think it's beautiful.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:39

Thank you.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:40

I think that's exactly what you're doing daily with all of your science content.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:45

Thank you.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:46

And I like that you're spicy about it. Yes, because I because I kind of to me that's like it adds to the element of it. And I almost like when people don't get it.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:56

Right.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:57

Because I think that's a really good kind of test. If you choose not to get it or you choose to be turned off by something so minor, you probably weren't gonna get the bigger, deeper concept anyway.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:08

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:09

Well said. The smartest people I know have deep conversations, but they're not afraid of being wrong.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:15

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:16

Right? Like, thank you for the gift of getting to learn from you and watch your mind work because it was fascinating, and we'll have to do it again.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:23

Oh my god, anytime thank you for having me. I just I can't believe time has flown by. Yeah. Because I really, really enjoyed this, and thank you for the insights you've given me as well.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:31

I want to say, as a fellow creative, there's a very clear beauty of your vision of the world, and the uncertainty is acceptable, right? And I know people get worried about us, um, but it is my experience I'll say four decades in, because I'm the youngest dinosaur. Um is the reality of all of this is why is this any more illogical than anything else in the universe? We are tiny little specks spiraling on a planet that is hurtling through space at light speed in comparison to everything else. We pretty much should just be yelling we the whole time, like just celebrating it like it's a roller coaster because it's really special. And we haven't found anything else that's even close to us. So it's kind of impressed upon us to be the best versions of us.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:26

Well said. Perspective. Thank you. No, thank you.