Winning Isn't Everything. Wanting to Win Is. A Former Pro Athlete Explains the Difference

His name is a mountain in Armenia.
When his family moved from Iran to Los Angeles, there was no English equivalent for the letter. So his parents invented one. Aragad. It became his identity — which is exactly how he has approached everything since.
Aragad Abramian grew up in Los Angeles as an Armenian-American kid born in Iran who was not the tallest player on any court he ever played on. He was the point guard. The coach on the floor. The one responsible for making every person around him better.
He played professionally in Kazakhstan. He travelled twelve times a month. His coaches did not speak English. His teammates did not speak English. When he stepped on the court none of that mattered. There is only one language on the court — and he spoke it fluently.
When COVID shut down professional basketball he did not wait. He pivoted in days — completely, fully, without one foot still in the door — into financial services and real estate investing. The same discipline that built his basketball career built his investment firm.
He also coaches youth basketball in the Armenian-American community because there were not enough coaches and somebody had to show up.
In this episode of INSIGHT, Emma Sargsyan sits down with Aragad Abramian for a wide-ranging conversation about hunger, discipline, losing, leadership, motivation and what it actually takes to rebuild yourself when the first plan does not work out.
─────────────────────────────────────
ABOUT ARAGAD ABRAMIAN
Aragad Abramian is a former professional basketball player who competed in leagues across the United States, Armenia and Kazakhstan. He is the founder of a real estate investment firm and runs Mini Ballers Academy USA — a skills development programme for youth basketball players in the Armenian-American community of Los Angeles. He is based in Los Angeles.
─────────────────────────────────────
ABOUT INSIGHT
INSIGHT is the first Armenian-English language power and culture podcast in the United States, hosted by Emma Sargsyan. Each episode is a long-form conversation with an extraordinary guest at the intersection of business, identity, leadership and culture. Distributed across all major podcast platforms. 
Subscribe for new episodes every week.
─────────────────────────────────────
TIMESTAMPS
00:00 Cold open 
00:38 The name — a mountain in Armenia 
03:00 Where the hunger came from 
08:00 The Armenian household and education 
13:00 Kazakhstan — grinding where nobody is watching 
20:00 Motivation is a match — discipline is the candle 
26:00 Losing, scars and learning from wins 
32:00 Coachability and the two types of coaching 
38:00 When the game is on — personal problems do not belong on the court 
43:00 Blaming and taking responsibility 
47:00 Leadership as action — leading from the front 
51:00 No plan B — transition 100% or not at all
─────────────────────────────────────
FOLLOW EMMA SARGSYAN
Instagram: @emmasargsyan 
─────────────────────────────────────
This episode is for everyone who is grinding somewhere nobody is watching — and wondering if it is worth it.
It is.
#Basketball #Entrepreneur #INSIGHT #EmmaInsight #Motivation #Discipline #Leadership #ArmenianAmerican #Kazakhstan #RealEstate #AragadAbramian #PersonalDevelopment #GrowthMindset #ProfessionalAthlete #SportsToBusiness

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:11

Everything I did I wanted to win. I was more intrigued. When it comes down to actions, they like to victimize themselves or point fingers. Their dad died on game day. So it's like a match. If you when you light up a match, it is there for a long time.

SPEAKER_02 0:27

You want to go play in the somewhere.

SPEAKER_00 0:29

This is a good question.

SPEAKER_02 0:35

Thank you very much for being here today.

SPEAKER_00 0:38

My pleasure.

SPEAKER_02 0:39

And as I asked about the pronunciation of your name, let's start with that. How do you want me to pronounce it and what is the story behind it?

SPEAKER_00 0:45

Yeah, so my name is Argod. Um God is what my parents call me, and it's a mountain in Armenia. And uh when we were moving to America, um my parents were like, hey, there's no tza letter in English, so they put a D, so that's kind of how it went. Yeah, so you know, no one was there for it for that for them to help uh pronounce it and and write it out, so that's kind of how it came about. So they made a whole new name and it was it has become my identity, so I we we've just kept it.

SPEAKER_02 1:23

Before we go any deeper about your career, the courts, the basketball, the games, I want to understand where that hunger came from. Uh you grew up in Los Angeles. Uh you were born in Los Angeles? No.

SPEAKER_00 1:36

No, I was born in Iran.

SPEAKER_02 1:37

You were born in Iran. You grew up in Los Angeles as an Armenian American. You were not the tallest player, but you were the point guard, which means that you had more mental work to do, so you were the center of everything. That does not really come from physical gifts. Yeah, you you you you have to have the the mindset. It comes from somewhere inside. Where did it come from you? Where does this hunger come? And what what was that specific moment? The specific moment when you understood that basketball was not just something you played, but something you were.

SPEAKER_00 2:13

Yeah, so I mean it all starts from wanting to win. And uh ever since like I was a child, I could remember as far as like five, six years old, like all everything I did I wanted to win, no matter what it was. Um, some came easy, some came hard, and then the the things that came hard for me, I was more intrigued. So, for example, like basketball, it was a little bit harder for me because of the obstacles that were in front of me. But that's what kind of you know gave me my hunger, is is that it was a little difficult, challenging, and and it it kind of gave me my drive. So um yeah, that's kind of like how how it grew is just wanting to win.

SPEAKER_02 3:03

You said you didn't like things that came easy. What did come easy at that time?

SPEAKER_00 3:08

Um just like other sports, for example, like soccer, football, um, like volleyball, like because my like running, I was usually the fastest player uh in every sport. I was really fast and it wasn't like I wasn't athletic. I was very athletic growing up, but um the thing was you know, some sports came easier to me, and I wasn't really intrigued by it anymore because of that. Almost like you become bored. You become bored with the sport or bored with something that's super easy for you, so you find something challenging.

SPEAKER_02 3:46

You grew up in an Armenian American family uh in Los Angeles, which means that you grew up inside a community where the sacrifice, hard work, overachieving, overdoing everything came by as a default. Would you say that part of you that is wanted to excel in everything came pre-installed with that being being raised in that household, or is it something different?

SPEAKER_00 4:15

I think it's something different, honestly. It's like um, because my parents would never they were never like oh like you gotta achieve this, you gotta be this person. You know, my parents just always wanted me to be happy. It was like that within my family too, just not just my parents either. But it was always like do what you love, are you happy? Continue doing that. It was never like, hey, you have to be a lawyer, doctor, or this is what you have to be. You know, um, they always were focused on education, and that's something it didn't come to me uh naturally either. Uh I was never like an ACE student in school or anything like that, but I did strive for it. I did think like reading, writing is cool, math is cool, and then me being an athlete, it kind of uh pushed me towards that because I you do need to have good grades to play sports.

SPEAKER_02 5:13

Oh, it's required?

SPEAKER_00 5:15

Yeah, it's required to, yeah, it's I think it's still required for you to have really good grades or above average grades for you to play sports. So that's kind of what drove me to stay in school and get my education. And then once I got older, it was I was really more focused in on education even more outside of the classroom. And I do it still today, you know.

SPEAKER_02 5:42

Up up until now.

SPEAKER_00 5:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:45

You played in Kazakhstan, you played in Armenia, yeah. Um in leagues that most people in Los Angeles don't know about.

SPEAKER_00 5:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:55

And I was to be honest with you, because in sports it's actually either you you you make it, you just become the goats, or or you you just don't. You were in between of this for many years, and uh you're from far from home, competing in environments where nothing was comfortable, nothing was familiar, you didn't know them, nobody was watching. What was it actually like? And what does grinding in these uh conditions tell you, or how does it shape you as a person that you have become now?

SPEAKER_00 6:28

Well, first of all, like uh when when you said like you know, these like some people try to be the star and some people want to be the go or whatever, like that. Yeah, of course you want to be the best. But uh when I was younger, I had a coach that really uh pushed me towards playing a role. Um and he made me realize, and I realized this on my own as well, but it was good reassurance that if you once you become really good at that role, you you'll be put on good positions and you'll have better opportunities because majority of players are trying to be the best, they're trying to be the score, every there's it's saturated of those type of players. So, and it especially my height, you know, uh or and my physique and everything like that, it's very saturated, meaning there's a lot of players just like me. So, what separates me from those players is that I actually play my role. You know, the coach wants me to do a certain thing, I'm gonna just do that certain thing. So I really focused in on that, becoming really good at my role, and then from there on, it's it's about persistence, right? You gotta be persistent, never quit. And then that's kind of what the test was in those environments, you know, especially going out to uh Kazakhstan. Uh, and a lot of people didn't, I'm sure a lot of people don't know about Kazakhstan, they just know a few things they see in the media, but it's a beautiful country, and and I took that chance and I went over there, and you know, the weather is diff definitely more challenging over there than growing up in LA, but you know, you get used to it, and it comes from your passion to keep uh striving forward, and yeah, everything is much more difficult. You have a translator, you know, your coach is not speaking English, majority of your teammates don't know English, you know, so it it becomes very difficult. But once you're on the court, it's it's a one language, and you know, you just go off of energy at at that point.

SPEAKER_02 8:33

Do you think motivation is a myth?

SPEAKER_00 8:34

No, motivation is really real, it's real, it's definitely real. Um, but motivation it's it's it doesn't give you the longevity. Okay. Meaning motivation will only take you so far, you know, uh, and that's where discipline comes in. If you if you're able to connect the two, that's when you're you're able to persist, you know, the challenges.

SPEAKER_02 9:00

We hear a lot about consistency, about showing up, about doing it, no matter what. You feel like that or you don't. It's like a whole trend movement right now on social media about like consistency. And as an athlete, no one else than you know better how does it feel to show up when you don't feel like to get out of the bed when you don't want it, and you did each and every single day. I'm sure you had bad days, I'm sure you had days you didn't want, like hate everything, but you you were there, you showed up, you played, and no matter you won or you lost, this is who you were. And give me the mechanism, the specific thing of how it works, how not to burn out in being this constant process of showing up, being motivated, being consistent. How does that even work? Many businesses want to do that, they they say they want to do it, but they never actually end up in that.

SPEAKER_00 10:02

So I think so. And it c it starts from uh younger, but definitely you could you could achieve it as you grow older. Uh but it it comes from small wins. It it's a lot of people fail because they they want the instant gratification. So, meaning you want to lose 25 pounds and you try it for two weeks, three weeks, you know, you go as far as six weeks and you're still seeing barely any results. Uh a lot of people start quitting or they burn out, as they say, you know, um, and that's not really reality. Uh it you gotta just continue doing it, and it's the small wins. It comes from, okay, today did I wake up, did I snooze, right? So giving that, keeping that promise to yourself. It you say you're gonna wake up at 6 a.m. and you do wake up at 6 a.m. You don't hit that snooze button, boom, you just won the day. You know, you start off the day with a win. You know, you say you're gonna, you know, take out the trash, you're gonna fold your clothes, you do that. It's the small wins. Those small wins become you going into the gym. You go into the gym, become you eating right. You eating right becomes, you know, a hundred days of that, then you lose a couple pounds. And then, you know, five five years down the line, everyone's like, oh my god, how'd you do it? You know, and it's the same with business. I always tell my guys, it's it's what you do that that no one realizes. You know, keeping your desk clean, you know, small stuff. You you see uh, you know, you're in the hallway in the lobby of the building, and you see trash on the floor, you pick up that trash, you throw it away, you keep your standards high, those little disciplines are gonna take you very far, you know. So it's it's always the little stuff, I think, and they become bigger. So that's what it is. A lot of people just always want instant gratification and they want to do something and they want to achieve it right away, and it's like it doesn't work that way, and honestly, and it's not fun that way either. Like, life is all about enjoying the journey and the process, you know. So as long as you understand the process and you start enjoying the process, and you you it just continues going and it doesn't become a drag and all this stuff.

SPEAKER_02 12:39

Actually, there's a whole business based on this need for instant gratification. Lose 20 pounds in five days, or I don't know, become a marketing manager in two weeks. There is a need for this. Do you think it's a mindset problem? People have to shift their mindset, and in that case, those businesses will go bankrupt, but still, is there a mindset problem?

SPEAKER_00 13:02

Um, I'm sure like 90% of those businesses or whoever's marketing stuff like that is scam. They're scamming, and honestly, if you're gonna gain something in an instant, uh, it's it's definitely not worth it, I would say. Uh, you look at look at any like I always like to uh compare stuff to sports. If you look at any sports team, how long does it take for them to get to the championship? Yeah, just think about that. You know, it takes it takes uh, for example, like basketball, since I'm a basketball player, uh in the NBA it takes 82 games, you know, just just for the season, and then you have playoffs, and then playoffs you have like multiple layers into it. So it takes many levels and a long period of time just to get there. You know, uh as we're speaking right now, the New York Knicks are in the uh in the NBA finals right now. The last time they were in the NBA finals, it was like you know, 25 years ago. So uh or more. I'm not like specific on that number, but you know, imagine 25, 20 years, you don't you're you every year you keep not making your you're you're short on your goal, but next year you still go, you still go, you know, and that's the whole point of life. Now, if you look at the city and everyone involved since they were there from the beginning, look look how happy they are, how how uh joyful it is from taking that those steps, you know.

SPEAKER_02 14:34

Tell me the moment when the basketball chapter as a professional player was closed for you, not the announcement part, but the the decision. What led to that decision and what was going on inside your mind? And were you envisioning your next steps, where it is going to lead you, how are you going to lead? Because obviously you've tied most part of your life to basketball, and then you decided, okay, so it's done and I'm moving on. What was going on inside your mind at that time?

SPEAKER_00 14:59

Yeah, so for me, it was thankfully, it was like it was it was very quick, and I'm pretty pretty quick on my decisions. I'm I'm a really like sharp decision maker when it comes down to it, and I knew from previous uh people I've talked to and like friends that were professional basketball players that when they retired or they pivoted to another career, how they did it and what works best. And for me, it was a time of like COVID was getting really uh really bad to the point where you know I was contacting my teammates overseas and they were stuck, they weren't getting paid anymore, they weren't able to fly back home, you know, and and no one knew what was going on. So it was it came to a point for me, uh, and I just saw it getting worse and worse and worse. And for me, it was like at a point where like, hey, look, I can't just I can't uh you know focus on on basketball anymore right now because that opportunity is really not there and it's like pretty bad, you know. Uh so I'm gonna lose a couple months if I try to continue doing that. So I went full-time into uh financial services, and that's what I had my licenses prior to that. Uh prior to playing basketball, I was I was also a property manager uh at different with different investors, different companies, and I was also in financial services. So during college I was able to get my licenses and get my degree in that. So I really liked investing and working with investors and and helping people out with investing. So I was in financial services and I went full time into that and it became very successful because of the time and need. Uh so it was like a it was like a time period where it was like really needed for those services, and I was able to capitalize on it. And then at the same time, uh I was having meetings with the with the Federation of Armenia's Basketball Federation, and they were we were having meetings about helping and supporting and starting foundations and all this stuff, and uh they kind of started pushing me towards you know coaching, you know, the youth, because there wasn't enough coaches uh in our community, and so I started coaching, especially at that time. There was no gyms open and everything like that, so I was able to put together, you know, private lessons and everything like that. So uh that's I've went fully I shifted it.

SPEAKER_02 17:42

Do you do it up until now, the coaching?

SPEAKER_00 17:45

Uh yeah, so right now I still do coaching and uh I have a program, it's called Mini Ballers in Academy USA, which is uh just strictly skills development and work on beginner level kids.

SPEAKER_02 18:00

Basketball and finance sports and financial services, they seem to be worlds apart. Uh tell me about like you I assume you equally belong to both, right? How is that even possible?

SPEAKER_00 18:14

Um not really. Uh basketball is kind of right now it's like my almost like my charity work when I I could get out get out of the office, you know. So the energy, most of the energy I spent is towards investing and running an investment firm.

SPEAKER_02 18:32

Back to the basketball and not the financial services, because athletes, sportsmen, usually have very different and very uh practical point of view. I want you to give me five practical things that basketball has taught you that you are using up until now in your life.

SPEAKER_00 18:50

Uh well, number one is is discipline for sure. Uh athletes, I believe athletes, uh military individuals, um, what else? Mainly those people in business, they're very disciplined and they become successful because of the discipline they learn in their sport. Ummunication is another thing. A lot of people lack communication in the in this industries business. A lot of people lack uh communication, fast communication, uh and also leadership. Like it's it sports gave me the the route to become a leader. You know, you're I I don't believe someone is born a leader, I believe it's a skill. You you gain those skills, and uh being in sports, it it helps you become that leader, and uh you know, a few other things, you know, uh meant mindset, you know, persistence, never giving up, like having a mindset of uh uh rejection, losses, and being able to move forward quick, you know, uh decision-making sports is really fast paced, um, especially being a point guard, you have to make decisions, uh sometimes decisions on your own, you know, because you are the coach on the floor, you know, uh, especially when there's 5,000 fans yelling and screaming and you can't hear the coach, you become the coach on the court, so you have to become really good at decision making. You know, uh as a basketball team, you have multiple plays. You're you know, you want to be able to know what play to call, at what times, you know. So decision making is very big, and that's like one of the main things. I think I I gave five right there.

SPEAKER_02 20:46

I want to speak about losing because winning is cool. Everybody loves the winners. But before you will, like you mentioned about the Knicks uh team, before you would win a game, you go through so many losses. I want you to take me to the first time you lost a game that was very significant to you, what you felt at that time, what was inside your mind, and how you coped with that, and how did it affect your next wins and losses?

SPEAKER_00 21:16

So uh for me growing up, I was never used to losing. So growing up, I wanna say I wanna say almost my whole life until college, I was never used to losing. Um, and I don't mean that in the ignorant, like that's just where what environment I was in. I was always in a good team, I was always good with good teammates, I was always on a good with a good coach, and we always won games. And uh when it came down to it, whenever there was a loss, and it would be very rare, and when we did lose, it was very heartbreaking, like uh like to the point where I would cry. You know, it was very heartbreaking. Like it was a very deep scar. Um, and there was only a handful of those losses in my life, and it's it's very like I could I could remember it till today, like when I was like 10 years old and we lost, and I was just like, you know, that's never happening again. You know, for me, winning was uh you know how they say don't make win winning's not everything. Well, for me, I always say this and I mean it to the kids too. It's not uh winning isn't everything, but wanting to win is everything. So it's it's about the will and how bad you want to win. And that's how I was growing up in everything and everything we did. Um but one one example I could give you is in high school we lost uh a game that was gonna kind of make us champions of our league. Uh this was my 11th grade year, and uh it was like with the last game we played against Van Nuys High School, and uh we lost by like a couple points, and we still made it to the playoffs, but we didn't win the win the league. We went further than them in playoffs, but we didn't win the league, so that get like it was like a very deep scar, like it was very deep scar where the next year there was no way I was gonna lose to that team or or the to the league. So uh we ended up winning the next year, and uh it was the first time in 52 years that we won uh in that league, yeah. So it was a big history.

SPEAKER_02 23:46

Had you not lost that previous year, would you win?

SPEAKER_00 23:50

Um so that's a really good question, and uh I always uh tell people like your losses, you have to take it as a lesson, right? You have to learn from it. Um, it builds character. Um, you know, you learn from your losses, but good players learn from their wins too. You know, good businessmen always look at okay, look, how do we how do we how do we make this certain amount of money? How do we get this deal? What it what did it take? What are the KPIs? Okay, this month we got five deals uh closed. What are what did our numbers look like? And then you know, you look at it. You look at okay, how many calls did I make, how many offers did I take, how many meetings did I take, we what were the meetings outcomes. So you look at all those details, and it's the same thing in sports. You you win the game, the next day we're looking at film and we're we're studying the film. You know, of the game. Of the game that you just won. You know, and that's what and this is what good players do, this is what championship teams do. You study yourself even though you won. Not just you learn the lessons even if you when you win, you know, not just when you lose. So it's it's the same thing, it's the process. You know, win or lose, it's it's still a process of progressing, just getting continuously getting better every single day, no matter what the outcome is. Your goal is to become better, you know, is to win the championship, and guess what? After that championship, we're winning another championship. It just it's just the it's there's the no end to the journey.

SPEAKER_02 25:31

You either said or implied something, uh, and I want to reflect on this because I think I'm trying to link sports to business all the time, and this is the conversation is going to look like. Uh, you mentioned about coachability. It's the ability of the person to be told what to do, to be coached, and to actually get the advice and implement it. Maybe it's linked to your role as a point guard because you are the coach on the ground. But I want your opinion uh about what a coachable person looks like in business, what is the quality and what difference it makes uh versus the non-coachable person.

SPEAKER_00 26:08

Yeah, uh I mean being coachable is very important. Every successful person is coachable, you know. They they like to learn, take advice, critical advice, and and take it from there. The what I would say is it it all it has to do a lot with the coach. So when you're a coach, you have to understand what it takes to get to the to the individual, you know, because every single person is different. Some people need compassion, some people need to be compressed. Okay, so there's two different ways to coach someone, and then if you're not able to understand that person and uh and follow follow through with with the way they're able to be uh coached, you're not gonna get to them, you know. So it's for example, like someone that's uh uh needs to be compassionately coached, meaning like you have to tell them, like, hey, good job, you did this correctly, continue doing this correctly, and then they'll do it. But if you're if you're very critical and compressing that individual, they're gonna be rejecting you and they're not gonna be listening. So uh, for example, like someone that needs compassion, and you're like uh you go at them, you know, very strong and be like, Oh, you suck, and you did this and did that wrong, you did this wrong, like how can you do this? You need to work harder. That person's gonna be very rejecting, and it's not and they're not gonna listen to you, you know. So uh it it comes from the coach, understanding how to communicate to the to the individual, and uh yeah, it just it just comes from that, and being everyone is coachable, you just have to be understand how to persuade that person and how to talk to that person, how to motivate them, how to make sure they're aligned with their actions, you know what's going on with them. Some people you need to be there for them outside of business, you know. You want to you want to show that you actually care, you what's going on in your life, like why aren't you you know, reaching your goals? Is something happening in your family life? Do you need some time off? You know, you need some space, or the person that you're dealing with, you need to cuss them out, you know. So there's there's people it that work differently, like their mind it connects differently, you know. So uh as long as the coach understands how to communicate that to the individual, uh anyone could be coachable.

SPEAKER_02 28:41

Is it communication or psychology?

SPEAKER_00 28:43

Because it sounds like well, communication is psychology. So the a good psychologist knows how to communicate, and and what is a good communicator is is the person that controls the conversation, you know, the person that asks the right questions. You know, so most of the time a lot of people don't listen. You know, a good psychologist is able to listen, they ask the right question, they listen in, you know, and then the person's talking answers their own problems.

SPEAKER_02 29:13

In business, and I I hear this approach a lot, whatever is going on in my life, it's my problem. I'm not bringing it into my workspace. Uh and now you are mentioning that you need to hear, maybe they are encountering some problems. In some cases, yes, you hear, you help them, support them, but in uh other cases, the person that you always hear takes it for granted, and they think that bringing their personal problems or their their private life into the business, into the office, and they are expecting you to understand it, to understand and go forward and uh I don't know, talk with them or give them certain benefits or so this is real, this is what happens, and I'm sure you have encountered these kinds of situations. It's not about communication, it's about you being good, being the compassionate one, and the other person not understanding or abusing whatever you are doing. How do you deal in these situations?

SPEAKER_00 30:10

That's a great question. So, a lot of people what they do is uh sports, business, everything involved uh in between. A lot of people, uh, when it comes down to actions, they like to victimize themselves or point fingers, right? Um, yeah, it's it's it's okay to talk and figure out what's what's keeping you behind, what's bothering you, but when the ball's on the court and the game is on, it doesn't matter what's happening outside of that. It really doesn't matter. So I uh for for my associates and my office and my business, uh, when it comes down to it, like hey, when you're on your calls, you're when you're in your meetings, when you're in the field, it doesn't matter if your girlfriend just broke up with you, you know, uh you it doesn't matter if your mom passed away, it doesn't matter if your dog is sick, you know, it's gonna happen no matter what. There's gonna be there's gonna be a a dra dramatic thing that's gonna happen to you in your life, uh, and you're not gonna be prepared for it. It's not it doesn't matter what it's gonna be, but when the game is on, you gotta play the game. There's no way around it, you know, and when you finish the game and you win the game, then you could uh deal with it, you know. So uh it comes down to it, and and I've experienced that personally in the in basketball and in uh in business, you know. So I can give you really good examples. Like I've had teammates where their dad died on game day, you know, and they had to show up. And you have to show up. There's no way around it. There's there's you can't call out. You you have to play, like your numbers called, you have to play, you play your heart out, and then after the game, you mourn, and you know, you talk about it, we all talk about it, and we sit down, and you know, we're a family, and we're gonna take it as as is. But when the game is on, it's on. The uh your opponent doesn't care that something bad happened to you that day. That's the end of the story.

SPEAKER_02 32:25

Like they might even take advantage of that.

SPEAKER_00 32:27

Exactly, exactly. Your leg hurts, your back hurts, you're tired, you didn't sleep well, even better for the opponent. You know, the opponent is waiting for that, he's he's licking his fingertips for that, waiting for that opportunity. Yeah, because so you can't show any weakness. So it's the same thing in business, it's a doggy dog world. When you're in the field, when you're in those negotiations, those meetings, you know, you can't show weakness, and you gotta go hard. And then uh that's kind of like what I what I say always, and obviously when it comes down to someone not performing, you look at their you know, KPIs and their numbers, like hey, look, you're not playing well in these in these games, or you're not playing, you're not doing well in the office, you know, figure it out. You know.

SPEAKER_02 33:17

I want to speak a little bit about blaming because in sport, especially in team sports, this is something very big. Um, we lost because the referee was not good, or because the I don't know, the teammate didn't play well. Uming is is a for form of self-defense, not fully uh recognizing that maybe there is something that you have done. And in business as well, it's the same. I didn't close the deal because my sales manager didn't do the work, I didn't do this. What is your take on blaming and how do you prevent in your environment, in your team, uh these practices of blaming?

SPEAKER_00 34:01

So I learned from the from the best coaches, you know, and when there's a loss, you blame yourself. When there's a win, you you blame the players, you know, or or not blame, but you you give you praise the players, yeah, exactly. So you give it to the players. Um and it's the same thing, you know, uh a lot of people want to point fingers because it's easy, that's the easy thing to do. The easy thing to do is point fingers and say it's his fault, her fault, uh, it was, you know, it was my environment's fault. It was this, everyone wants to be the victim, you know, it's the government, it's the taxes, you know, it's my it's the the street I grew up in, it's the country I grew up in. Everyone wants to blame everything except themselves. And once you start blaming yourself and improving yourself and taking responsibility of yourself, then that's where real true self-development comes in, that's where true, real progression comes in, and that's when you move forward.

SPEAKER_02 35:05

Can that blaming go way like blaming yourself? I have this philosophy as well. When something goes wrong, it's me, but when everything is okay, it's the team. Because in my opinion, it's the right thing to do. You are leading, so you have to take care of the consequences as well. But can that go way too far, blaming yourself in places where you shouldn't be blaming?

SPEAKER_00 35:28

Yeah, so I mean, if you're really hard on yourself, it could it could become devastating. And you need to have a, you know, you gotta understand yourself, you have to be aware of yourself. You know, sometimes you gotta praise yourself, you gotta pat yourself on the back, you know. You got the wins, you stayed disciplined, and that's what I talk about the small wins, you know. No matter what goes wrong in your life, you know, take responsibility for it, but also see the small wins that you did throughout the day, throughout the week, throughout the month. Those small wins stack up and they become big. So it's just about taking responsibility. I wouldn't say blaming yourself and being really hard on yourself. It's taking responsibility of like, okay, I want to be responsible of these mistakes. You know, what are the lessons learned in these in these mistakes? Or, you know, vice versa, in these wins. Take responsibility of the wins too.

SPEAKER_02 36:23

Um I want to speak about leadership, but not the motivational real-type leadership that we see everybody speaking about the true leader, who he is, and what he is doing. I want to speak the practical version of it. You are the point guard, that is the leader in the court. You were you your entire job was to make people around you better. You are managing personalities, uh, egos, momentum. Uh, what is leading from the point guard point of view teach you in business? Please link it to that.

SPEAKER_00 36:55

So I think leadership is really important of uh leading by action. So uh leading by doing the work. It's always about doing the work, you know, uh being really well with communicating, being vocal. Uh being a leader, you gotta be vocal, you gotta communicate, but also you got to do the work as well. It's the same thing in business, you know. You want to tell your guys, hey, make the calls, uh, you know, close the deals, negotiate this way, negotiate that way. Uh this is what we're looking for. And then, but you're not doing it, you're just sitting back and or you're doing certain things, certain other things. Uh it doesn't translate really well. Um, the best way to do it is lead by action. So uh leading by doing the work actually, and then they see you doing the work, and then they they follow along. You know, so for example, like in in sports and basketball, um, I was always, you know, doing the extra work, being in the weight room early in the mornings, which became a thing where the whole team started doing it, you know, no one misses out. You you whenever we do training, we go 100%. You know, I'm not the last one uh finishing my runs, I'm the first one, you know, I'm pushing it my hardest, and everyone else follows along. You know, once the leader stops doing stuff like that, that's when uh everyone else steps back as well. Um it's the same thing as a manager, as as a as a you know, any type of principal, a director, executive. If you're not doing the work, if you're not in the trenches with the guys, they will they won't go too far for you because they don't see you doing that, you know. So I always like to do extra. For example, like I'll be in the office longer, I'll be all in the office earlier, you know, you know, doing more walks, more like the numbers show for itself. You know, end of the month, I'm looking at numbers and I'm showing them, hey, look, the reason why I did this is because of this. Now, if you want to become that, you gotta, you know, follow along. So I think leadership is the main thing is to lead by by action.

SPEAKER_02 39:19

And by example.

SPEAKER_00 39:20

Yeah, by example.

SPEAKER_02 39:22

Would you say that it is a mistake that many leaders often make, claiming them themselves a leader, but not leading with action? Or if it's not, what is a single big mistake you would say that many leaders make in real estate uh and in financial services where you are now?

SPEAKER_00 39:41

I think uh a lot of a lot of leaders and like just uh business owners in in general, uh, once they have a system in place, they just leave it alone and they don't they don't check up on it sometimes or they they just you know they leave it idle. So it it comes it becomes uh kind of a nine to five to someone, you know, like they're just clocking in, clocking out, and they don't they don't want to go the extra mile. So it it just lead by example, that's what it is. So it leading by example is get to get to the spot and do extra.

SPEAKER_02 40:25

Doing the hard part.

SPEAKER_00 40:26

Yeah, just or just doing extra, you know. Sometimes hard things aren't aren't hard for some people, you know.

SPEAKER_02 40:32

So yeah.

SPEAKER_00 40:35

It's it could be something hard for you, but not hard for me.

SPEAKER_02 40:39

Yeah, but if it's hard for me enough and I'm doing it, then that means that I'm doing something, I'm going the extra mile.

SPEAKER_00 40:46

Exactly, yeah. Yeah, you're earning it.

SPEAKER_02 40:49

Yeah. We we touched upon motivation briefly, but I want to go back to that. Everybody talks about it. And motivational content is mostly consumed on the internet, again, just like the leadership, because we think that we if we watch a couple of reels and videos about motivation, we're going to be motivated. And as I I could say that most of this content is useless because the people who are saying these kind of quotes or urging you, they have never been in your shoes, right? They don't know what you're going. And you cannot do the one size fits all approach of motivation and then consider okay, so this guy told me I have to go and do this. I did, and nothing happened. Um, I want uh to tell me what is motivation actually, apart from the real the bad, the harsh, the raw truth about motivation.

SPEAKER_00 41:40

So um I could I could only speak positive about motivation because it it it it is a good thing. Uh it's just how you use it. It's all about how you use motivation. And it's a it's a it's a light, you know, it's a it's like a lighter. So it's like a match. Uh if you when you light up a match, it finishes, right? So once it finishes, it's out. The light is out. So what do you do? You put it on a candle, right? And then that light is is there for a long time. So it's it's I'm just using it as a you know, where motivation is just something that's gonna spark you up to do something. So it's because it's it's motive, you know, it's a motive. It's making you move, you know. So it's very it's it's just that's what it is. Motivation is gonna be something that's gonna make you get out of your chair. So what do you do? Yeah, exactly. So what do you do once you're out of the chair for you to stay off the chair or off the couch or whatever, you know? And that's where discipline comes in. You know, so if you're able to become motivated and whatever you need to do to get motivated, it's positive, it's good, but you can't stay motivated. That's the thing. You have to stay disciplined.

SPEAKER_02 43:06

So motivation is like the the spark, yes, and then you you do the right thing.

SPEAKER_00 43:10

So motivation is really good for you to go to uh motivational speeches or looking at those reels, you know. Uh, you know, I'm sure if you look at enough motivational uh reels, you're gonna try to get off the couch. I promise you, you probably will. You know, if you listen to enough David Goggins, you're gonna wanna do something.

SPEAKER_02 43:34

Feel guilty for not doing.

SPEAKER_00 43:36

Yeah, so that's what I mean. Like you're gonna if you once you get motivated enough to get off the couch, but figure out what to do to stay disciplined and continuously uh stay disciplined, you know, and then that motivation is gonna come and go, come and go, come and go throughout your cycle. So it's always like that. There's gonna be times, you know, throughout the year. Year where you're just like, oh my god, like you know, another 5 a.m. workout, you know, you're gonna be like, you know, and that's where discipline kicks in. Everyone is motivated beginning of the year. They want new year, it's gonna be new me, I'm gonna be better, this, that. And then within February, everyone is their motivation is gone, the light is gone, the match is gone. Now they're back to sitting on the couch.

SPEAKER_02 44:29

And the ones with the who are more disciplined, they stay.

SPEAKER_00 44:31

Exactly, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 44:32

Jay Shetty talks about uh the difference between a fixed mindset and a growth mindset. The person who believes their abilities are fixed versus the person who believes every experience is information about how to get better. In my opinion, basketball is a very good um explanation, masterclass, let's say, in growth mindset. Um, because the game immediately and brutally tells you that you did this wrong at this certain point, and there is no way back, you cannot revert to uh back time. How was that specific training, years of immediate, honest, unavailable feedback? How has it shaped the way that you receive and process feedback now?

SPEAKER_00 45:19

Uh well the thing is with basketball, it's a little bit different sport. You know, you have to kind of turn turn over uh really quick because you have you have malt a lot more games. So it's not like football or any other sport where you have one game a week, you know, and uh you can't really make too many mistakes. So I mean what it's taught me is is to get over it quick, learn from it quick, move on quick, you know. So exactly like what you're saying is the growth mindset is like you have to do it fast. I think that's what that's what it's important. And nowadays in business, everything is very fast, we're all fast-paced, you know, something that didn't work out for you. And for us as an investment firm, this happens a lot. We get rejected a lot. Um, deals fall out, deals don't go through. You there's might have been a deal that you've been working on for weeks, and it doesn't go through for you, it doesn't go your way. Uh something happens in escrow. Um, you have to figure out, get over it fast, move on to the next deal. And it's the same thing in basketball, like we as as kids growing up right now, a lot of the kids have like four or five games a day, you know, uh throughout the weekend in these AAU tournaments, and that's how it was for me too growing up. We would we would go to tournaments for a weekend, and we would have like you know, eight games in in two days.

SPEAKER_02 46:56

What does it do to s psychology of the child? Like they basically have no life. If you play eight games or five games a day, yeah, if you're a kid, you want to go play in somewhere, like yeah.

SPEAKER_00 47:08

This is why I tell parents, like, if you're gonna if you want your kids to really uh exceed in sports, like it's gonna be uh it's gonna be a full-time thing. It's it's a full-time job for you and the kid. Um, I always suggest parents to put uh kids in multiple sports by the age of 13. And then from 13 pick one or two uh really uh like the the love of your you know the love of your life uh sport and you're gonna that's gonna you're gonna live and dive with that sport, you know.

SPEAKER_02 47:47

So I mean I've I've I've always thought about that because if a kid leaves like eight year or ten year old, they are not made for this kind of pressure. Um I don't know, does it affect their psychology, psyche in the long run?

SPEAKER_00 48:05

Um honestly uh I I see it in a positive aspect because for me it was positive. You know, it could be for some kids very negative, like they're it could be a very bad childhood for them, but for me it was really positive. Like that was my uh group of friends I grew up with and still friends with, you know. And when we were 10 years old and we went to our basketball tournaments, and you know, that was the funnest thing, you know, for me and everyone else.

SPEAKER_02 48:36

Were you thinking that it was fun for you back when you were there? Or it was like a torture for you?

SPEAKER_00 48:42

No, it was fun, yeah, it was fun, it was a blast. Um, I wouldn't change it for the world, yeah. Okay, yeah, it was super fun, and I I it was for me it was fun and serious, you know. I took it very serious.

SPEAKER_02 48:59

If you could could go back to Kazakhstan at the time you were playing, and you meet your younger self there, what would you tell him? Not an advice, just what would you say to him? Like you are meeting our guard that is playing in Kazakhstan away from home, in uncertainty, not knowing what's coming next. One thing you would tell him.

SPEAKER_00 49:20

Um I would I would say, you know, uh, let me show this is a good question. I would I would say, you know, research a little bit more. Research a little bit more, like study a little bit more, whatever free time you have, study. And which I was doing, but not to an extent. I feel like I wasn't doing uh researching the correct material. Maybe I'll tell tell my younger self to be like, okay, this is the material you need to study, give some insider information.

SPEAKER_02 49:58

Oh look, this is what's going to happen.

SPEAKER_00 50:02

Yeah, but other than that, I mean I enjoyed the process, I enjoyed the journey, like every second of it, and uh yeah, I enjoyed, I enjoyed the process, like it was fun for me, like it was uh it was unique, you know. I was able to we traveled a lot. Uh we traveled about 12 times a month, so it was 12 times.

SPEAKER_02 50:29

Would you do it again if you had the chance to knowing what's going to happen?

SPEAKER_00 50:33

Yeah, for sure. For sure. Yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_02 50:35

Uh and my last question, and I usually have this for the audience because a lot of people watch this. Um, young, old, it doesn't matter the age and the location. Uh, a lot of people, and there are people who who are watching this that are in the middle of a transition, a personal, a business transition. You have been there, you have done that, and you're speaking about it as an easy thing, but I can feel that it was not that easy to build your life on something and then say, Okay, this doesn't work, I have a plan B. What would you say to the boy, a girl, a man, a woman who is watching it right now and thinks, okay, what am I going to do right now? My plan A doesn't work, and I don't know what my plan B is. Tell them something as someone who has been there.

SPEAKER_00 51:26

Uh, someone that's I mean, the person that's uh I mean, like lost that doesn't know their next step, it's uh you just have to put yourself out there, like it's really difficult to say because I've always known my next steps, like I'm always like five steps ahead of so now you have a plan C, right?

SPEAKER_02 51:47

In case something like that.

SPEAKER_00 51:49

You have to be, I mean, no, actually, don't get me wrong. If you have a plan A, like you shouldn't have a plan B or C or D or whatever, you should go all in on that plan A. And you should go all forces in, you know, and that's how I was like basketball was my plan A, there's no plan B, nothing else. Like it was all that or nothing, you know. And if something happens where you do need to pivot, you have to do it really fast and and not one foot in, one foot out. So a lot of people that are like lost or they don't know their next step, is because they have one foot in this door, and then they're trying to put their foot in other doors, and they splitting themselves, they're splitting their energy into multiple things, and that's why a lot of things aren't working out. So I would say if you're gonna transition, you have to transition 100%. You can't be one foot in, one foot out, you know, and and and everyone and anyone that I've dealt with that has came into my business, that has done other businesses, the only time I see success is that that when they do fully go into it with 100% commitment. And there's nothing else. If you're not gonna commit 100%, then don't do it at all. So for me, it was a very quick transition. Like a lot of players, basketball players, uh athletes, the reason why they have such uh unsuccessful retirements, you know, is because they don't they're one foot in, one foot out. You know, they're they're still playing basketball here and there, they're still trying, you know, uh to get on a team or whatever, but but they're still like doing other stuff too, and then it's just like you're scattered everywhere. So you want to be fully immersed and committed into whatever your your thoughts are going towards. And I would say uh for those that don't know what what to do next is to figure out an industry where it has subcategories, and you want to try the subcategories out. So, for example, if you want to be in e-commerce, for example, right? E-commerce, there's a bunch of subcategories. You know, you could have physical inventory, you could have uh, you know, a shipping company that does the shipping and all you do is market, and there's so many subcategories that you could go into and you could try and see which one you like more. So I would say pick a pick a uh industry that you really like and you're passionate about, or you you don't need to be passionate about. It it depends on what you like. You know, if you like beauty, beauty industry. How many subcategories can go under beauty industry, right? There's so many different hair products, there's uh you know skincare, nails, whatever. Yeah, nails, exactly. So a lot of the industries have a bunch of subcategories. So as long as you know what industry you like, or maybe you don't like, maybe you want to make money. Yeah, you know, uh, that's your goal, and you think money is gonna solve your happiness, and you try that out. Um it all comes down to that, you know, uh picking a subcategor uh category and going through the subcategories, seeing what you what works for you. You know, for example, for me, uh for me it was investing, right? It was investing, and what is in investing? There's so many layers in investing subcategories. You could go into startups, venture capital, private equity, real estate. There is uh, you know, a bunch of stuff. Tech companies, retail, industry, industrial, you know, and then what fell into my lap was like real estate, fix and flips. Okay, let's specialize in this, let's specialize in this, and then now it's like going vertical, you know, going into this route, that route, you know, raising funds for development now, doing commercial, industrial. So it all has to do with understanding what you like and what you want to get into, specializing, commit committing 100% into it, you know, and if if it means spending your last dollar going negative, but you're committed, it's you're still gonna come up top. So that's kind of where I see it going.

SPEAKER_02 56:12

Thank you very much.