A Conservative Voice for Insurance Commissioner

Bob Sullivan is running for Oklahoma Insurance Commissioner to bring conservative leadership, accountability, and transparency to an office that impacts every Oklahoma family and business.

With a commitment to protecting consumers, holding insurance companies accountable, and ensuring a fair and competitive insurance market, Bob believes Oklahoma deserves an Insurance Commissioner who will put people first.

Learn more about Bob's vision for Oklahoma and why he's asking for your support.

#BobSullivan #Oklahoma #InsuranceCommissioner #ConservativeLeadership #OKPolitics

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

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SPEAKER_01 0:36

Sure. So uh yeah, Bob Sullivan grew up, I was born here in Tulsa, actually. Uh grew up at Grand Lake, uh a little town called Cleora. Um graduating class in eighth grade of about 13 people, and we were the big class. So small town, Oklahoma. Um went to Venita for high school, and from there went to Oklahoma State University and uh graduated with a degree in finance and accounting. Ever since then, I've been in the insurance industry, uh, started off my career as an underwriter for Hanover Insurance, spent uh about two and a half years inside on the company side, um working in Oklahoma and Arkansas and some of the surrounding states, uh pricing risk, analyzing risk, doing what underwriters do uh for an insurance company. After about two years, I realized that this really wasn't where I wanted to spend my my career, spend my life. Uh you know, made the move in 2010 to the agency side, uh, joined uh Rich and Cartmill here in Tulsa and was there for about 12 years. And my my whole career since 2010 has been working with business owners, homeowners, farmers and ranchers around Oklahoma and all the other states as well. Um just trying to help people protect what they work so hard to acquire and protect your assets, protect from lawsuits and liability, and uh manage the risk of everyday life, which here in Oklahoma, there's there's a lot of risk.

SPEAKER_00 2:07

Yeah, absolutely. So, what got you into the insurance trial? Like what kind of paved your way into getting into that? Sure.

SPEAKER_01 2:13

So I I was dead set on being uh a banker and being in finance when I was in college at OSU. Um worked in banks, worked in you know my local community bank in Venita, then in college, worked at the local bank there in Stillwater, and and thought that I was going to graduate and go do you know high-level finance either on Wall Street or for some big Fortune 500 company. Um that was around 2006, 2007 when I graduated, and uh at that time the US economy was not doing so hot. And banking was not doing so hot.

SPEAKER_00 2:50

And uh bankers were kind of everybody's least favorite person. Oh, 100%.

SPEAKER_01 2:54

Yeah. Um, so just oddly enough, the higher OSU jobs, higher OSU grads job site, uh had a posting for commercial underwriter. Kind of interesting and interviewed for it and was obviously picked for the job, and uh kind of fell in love with the concept of insurance and helping people protect what what they've worked so hard for, as I said before, but um using that finance background and that accounting background to help you know help people quantify and understand what their risks really are and and put it in dollars and cents, not just some nebulous idea of there's risk out there. Yeah. Um so it was a lot of people in insurance say they fell into insurance or they stumbled into insurance, and I'm not much different in that sense. But uh you know, once you get into an industry like that and you just kind of fall in love with it, and I've spent my career learning as much as I possibly can about it. You know, so your business card and insurance has letters following your name, and I've got uh seemingly alphabet soup following mine at this point. Just keeping that mindset of continuous learning and continuous education. We have to do continuing it anyway as agents and brokers, but um taking that next step and you know, sitting for the test and really applying yourself to it is uh just always been important. I had a lot of mentors in my career that really instilled that value of learn something new every day.

SPEAKER_00 4:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 4:27

And and take that knowledge and use it to the benefit of your clients and policy holders.

SPEAKER_00 4:32

Yeah. Well, it seems it just to me personally, it just seems like the insurance uh is just such a vast like there's just so much to know and learn. Was that pretty intimidating for you when first getting into it? Or was it, I mean, was there a pretty steep learning curve, is basically what I'm getting at.

SPEAKER_01 4:47

Oh, absolutely. Um, I mean, picture being a you know 21-year-old fresh out of college. Yeah. Absolutely. And you know, everybody at 21 years old when they graduate college or 22, whatever you graduate at. You think you know everything. Then you get into the real world and you realize just how little you truly know.

SPEAKER_00 5:04

Right.

SPEAKER_01 5:04

Um and it was a steep learning curve. I mean, thinking back to my my early days as an underwriter at Hanover, the the list of mistakes I made in those early years is a mile long. And uh, you know, thinking that you know something about a particular type of coverage that has some some nuance to it or some difficulty to it, um, it was it was a sharp curve. But uh I think it benefited me the most when I got onto the agency side. It taught me how little I truly knew uh about the industry that I care to at this point. And um I think that really lit the fire under me. Education keep taking the next step.

SPEAKER_00 5:46

Yeah. You know, it yeah, after um like my family has a we have a cattle ranch down in southern Oklahoma, and just being there when we're going over insurance stuff, especially with the agents that they it to me is just mind-boggling. Like I'm sitting there like, uh, I don't understand half of this. So having a good, you know, agent sit there and basically spoon feed you, you know, what this policy, what's in this policy, how this protects you. It's uh you know super beneficial for you know folks like me and my family. Sure.

SPEAKER_01 6:25

So yeah, I mean it's you can you can chew up an afternoon just talking about the the basic risks that an average business owner faces every day that they're operating. And uh, you know, I think that's probably one of the biggest misconceptions that I've seen in my career is that oh, this one insurance policy will solve all of my problems. And uh the answer to that is no. One one policy covers really one thing. Even the broadest, you know, general liability policy has holes in it. And some of those are things that you want to buy insurance for. But I think in the concept of risk management, which has been more my focus in my throughout my career, is insurance isn't the answer to every problem. It isn't the answer to every risk that you face. You can make choices in how you structure your business or your personal life to to manage those risks of everyday life. And and honestly, if you do that properly, insurance is like the last thing that you do in that risk management process. It's for the things that you can't control, that you can't transfer, that you can't finance uh in in terms of monetary risk. So it's uh I think it's been very helpful to me throughout my career, and hopefully my clients will feel the same way. Uh, I'm not out there just pitching a policy for everything under the sun. It's having a deeper conversation about okay, you've got this risk of your employees getting injured on the job, and and for that, 99 times out of 100, workers' comp is the answer. But you know, in Oklahoma, we have some flexibility. For a period of time, we had the ability to even opt out of the workers' comp system. And using understanding products or understanding concepts like that were instrumental in, in a few cases, saving businesses from closing their doors. So having a pulse on what you can do and what you can't do is is vital. And having a good agent makes the difference in in navigating those fairly treacherous waters.

SPEAKER_00 8:27

Right. Yeah. And so in the coming up in the future with the you know, the innovation of AI and how advanced it's getting. What do you see as far as um AI in the insurance world? How how do you see that affecting it, whether the positives or negatives in it? Sure. Um what uh what are some things you'll be will you be implementing AI yourself in your line of work, or is that something that you're gonna kind of stay away from? Or you know, can you kind of explain what that looks like?

SPEAKER_01 8:58

Yeah, I mean, AI is a tremendous tool. It takes tasks that require tons of time, uh, just analyzing um you know or compiling large data sets. Let's say you've got a big business that owns a few hundred vehicles. Compiling that list of vehicles and spot checking that is is an arduous and time-consuming event. And uh, you know, account managers and customer service people in agencies spend hours pouring through these lengthy spreadsheets. AI is a major time saver on items like that, things that are just pure labor, uh, you know, very task-focused things. So I think we're seeing a lot of adaptation and a lot of adoption of AI for some of those type of processes. What I don't see AI as a a major case for yet is is the claims handling. I I think insurance claims don't come at convenient times and they don't come under convenient circumstances. You're you're either talking about a major health issue, like your wrist, for example, right, or uh a tornado or a fire. I mean, those those instances, those events are traumatic for many people. And um there's a lot of uncertainty there. And I think turning the people of Oklahoma over to an AI claims adjuster, so to speak, I think we're missing the force for the trees there. I think we're we we need to have that personal touch. You need to know as a person with a claim or a person who's suffered a a trauma of of any nature, to know that you've got somebody on your side, that you have a person with empathy, with emotions that can understand what you're going through on some level. And and having that in always in front of you is key to me.

SPEAKER_00 10:43

Yeah. Now, do you think there's a push to possibly have AI in those positions making claims, or do you think that's so far in the future?

SPEAKER_01 10:52

No, I think that's absolutely being targeted, it's being tested and being worked on, I think I would assume by many insurance companies. Um it's something that I'm very cautious about and and think that it's going to be a probably a key role of the insurance commissioner in the state of Oklahoma to have That was going to lead up to my next question.

SPEAKER_00 11:12

You as if if um Mr. Sullivan is commissioner in Oklahoma, what does that look like as far as implementing AI and what kind of process that would look like?

SPEAKER_01 11:21

Sure. I mean I I I think you always have to have you always have to have the human touch. Uh I think there's always there always has to be a case for human interaction with claims. I I just put it as bluntly as that. Um, particularly in areas where you're dealing with, you know, medical procedures and and things of that nature, I think you have to have the personal touch and the and the the professional touch as well with you know professional claims adjusters, and in the case of medical procedures, professionals in the in the medical field and doctors. Um I think if we take this cold and distant, you know, arm's length approach to things that affect a human body and a person and their personal lives and freedoms, we we can't outsource those sort of things.

SPEAKER_00 12:09

No, and I completely agree with that. Do you think there'll be like any kind of pushback from any outside entities that are wanting to really, really start pushing it? Like who would you see that be coming from? And uh what would what would be some things you could do to basically hold that at bay?

SPEAKER_01 12:24

You know, uh I don't know how contentious a topic it's going to be. Um obviously, if there are people out there or companies out there that are that are way ahead in terms of adoption of AI for things like that, I'm sure they're gonna be a little disenchanted if we step in as a as regulators in the state and and push back. Um obviously they've made investments in in those technologies and they want to see return on those investments and not see them go to waste. But ultimately, if if we're doing things that put the consumer at risk or put the consumer in a situation where they're not being treated fairly or justly, uh it's as simple as that. It it's right and wrong, it's balls and strikes. Um, if we find out that some companies have made AI adoptions and customer satisfaction is fine and high and people are being taken care of, you know, obviously we're open to taking a look and hearing them out. But um, you know, the the insurance commissioner's role is one of a watchdog for the consumer. Uh you know, we have an insurance department in the state of Oklahoma because insurance companies write insurance policies and they write them in language that is typically not translatable commonly. So you have to have insurance agents to help through that process, and uh you have to have an insurance commissioner and an insurance department to be that sounding board and be that you know disinterested third party, so to speak, to help navigate conflict because there's always going to be conflict anytime there's a contract. That's why attorneys exist, and that's why insurance agents exist, and why insurance departments exist.

SPEAKER_00 14:06

Absolutely. So, what uh what got you to want to throw your hat in the race? Um just what what are some things that led up to this?

SPEAKER_01 14:15

Sure. So uh we've had 13 insurance commissioners in state history, and by and large, the majority of them have come from the life insurance side of the industry or the health insurance side of the industry, and not a tremendous amount of depth from the property and casualty side where I spend 99% of my time. And, you know, in a in the year 2026, we have major issues statewide with property and casualty rates, homeowners insurance, commercial property insurance, auto insurance. Those are all PC issues. And so I always felt that it was the right time to have someone with good property and casualty expertise there, which again, that's been my life, that's been my career. Um then, you know, middle part of 2025, I got to looking at who had declared for the race and uh saw that uh we had gentlemen from uh shelter insurance and uh gentlemen from farmers insurance, and those are you know one company, you know, captive model uh companies. You know, your farmer's agent can give you farmers insurance, and sometimes they can go outside of that and shelters the same way. So being an independent agent like myself, I work with a few hundred insurance companies each and every day, day in and day out. And I think that breadth of exposure to insurance companies and how they behave and how they operate, having a better understanding of the overall ecosystem is is really vital to ensuring that we have a competitive and affordable marketplace in Oklahoma. Um, and just beyond that, I felt felt a calling, felt uh felt God telling me that it was time to do this. You know, a lot of a lot of events fell into place in a very short period of time. And at a certain point, if you're a believer, you have to listen to the to the God that created you. And if he's prompting you to do something, you better listen. And I I felt like this was absolutely that prompting, and and I'm here listening to it and following the path that he laid out for me. Yeah. I mean to get too too religious. No, I love it. No, I appreciate it. But uh it really was something that I felt very strongly about. And uh, you know, this industry has been absolutely fantastic to me uh on a personal level, it's been a very fulfilling industry to work in, and I want to see it continue and be sustainable and be successful for agents, for consumers, for the companies that are right in the state. Um I want to see everybody come out of this with a win-win-win solution, not a win-lose solution.

SPEAKER_00 16:56

So for as far as independent like yourself, as like insurance companies, um, is there quite a few in Oklahoma, or are you seeing more so of like you got state farm, or so they're only pushing a state farm product, or this is progressive, it's only progressive products, or is there a lot more of the independents that are able to source from different companies in Oklahoma that you know we just might not be privy to? There is a vast network of independent agents throughout the state of Oklahoma.

SPEAKER_01 17:26

The Independent Agents Association of Oklahoma is a great resource for finding a local independent agent near you. Um they're everywhere. I mean, uh underwriting at the beginning of my career, I exclusively worked with independent agents in multiple states. And uh there are some fantastic professionals all throughout the state of Oklahoma that can help Oklahomans navigate multiple carriers, get quotes and get options. And that's not to overlook the state farms or the farmers or the the all states of the world. I mean, they, you know, there's always this constantly evolving uh system of when companies file new rates, when they change coverage forms, and and there are companies that come into the marketplace with fantastic rates and coverage that I'm not shy to admit that I've encouraged some of my personal lines homeowners clients. You know, if if what I can do for you with Liberty Mutual isn't to your liking, here's here's a list of two or three captive agent companies that I think would be worth a second look. I do a lot of work with um, I've done a lot of work over the years with members of Tulsa Police and Tulsa Fire. My brother-in-law is a Tulsa Police officer here in town, and uh he's always referring some of his some of his squad mates over to me and you know, just have that conversation about okay, what what are we looking to cover? What are we looking to uh to do here? And if I'm not the right answer for him, I think it's ethically my job to tell him who is. And to have an understanding of who else is operating in that space with that size of home, that many autos, if you got teenage drivers, you know, whatever the criteria is, being that trusted advisor to them, even if it's not gonna benefit me in the least, even if it's gonna cost me money. Uh I I think that's part of the ethics of being an agent. Yeah. And if you're not operating in that ethical framework, then I would caution anyone to take a good hard look at themselves and ask what they're really in this business for.

SPEAKER_00 19:31

Yeah. What do um what are some things that you think would separate you from the other um the other uh insurers in this race? What are some things that would uh you believe set you apart, set you uh separate? I get to brag on myself now. What what what elevates you you think?

SPEAKER_01 19:47

Sure. Um so uh you know part of being an independent agent means you you know how to write just about every type of policy on at some level in the state of Oklahoma. Um I would just about guarantee I'm the only agent or the only candidate in this race who understands what it means to write a surety bond for a large commercial contracting risk or to write an environmental liability policy for uh somebody in the oil and gas business. Understanding the difference between uh you know property and transit and commercial cargo policies and all of the nuance that goes into that, um, that's not something you're gonna get with your your run-of-the-mill agent. Uh I think that's something that being an independent agent brings to the table. Um I've already talked about all the educational stuff and all the alphabet soup and the certifications. That's that's all well and good. Again, it's just pointing to the knowledge base. But another key differentiator is we talked about ethics a moment ago. I think it's ethically unsound to accept campaign contributions from insurance companies that it would be my job to regulate as insurance commissioner in the state of Oklahoma. There's a ton of precedent, and I'm not gonna throw stones at people in the past who've run campaigns. Has that happened in the past? Absolutely. Okay. Absolutely. But it's been a commitment from me and my campaign since day one to not accept campaign contributions from insurance carriers or their executives. Um I I like my sleep at night, and I like I like to protect my objectivity in that sense. And uh so we we made it clear very early on that we were going to be above that, above that question, be beyond reproach, so to speak. And uh I think that's a key differentiator. I I don't I don't closely monitor the campaign contributions for all of my fellow candidates, but um it's something that I feel very strongly about.

SPEAKER_00 21:43

Okay. What so getting started out that early, uh you said you were in your early 20s when you really started out, as far as your first really big claim that you might have had to work on. Can you kind of tell us about that? Like how intimidating would something like that be as a Brand new guy.

SPEAKER_01 22:01

Yeah. Um, I still remember my first big workers' comp claim as an underwriter. Um, we had just written this account over in Oklahoma City. It was a large uh produce distributor, and and and it helps to have some context. This is pre-Workers Comp reforms. This is before 2014. Um and we had a this business had an employee that showed up every day, and I think it was a Pontiac either sunfire, uh sunfire thunder, it was something like that. Something really cool. It's something really cool. And uh and the doors had had he'd had a couple of side swipes or vehicular incidents. The doors were inoperable, couldn't get in and out the doors, was climbing out through the sunroof every day, showing up to work, climbing up on the roof of this vehicle and hopping down to the to the pavement in the parking lot. And uh one day he jumped down from the sun from the sunroof and uh twisted his knee and goes into the building. I I believe objectively, and this is you know 14 years in the rear view now, uh staged a an incident inside the building when he was then on the clock after he clocked in, and we paid a very sizable workers' comp claim. I think it was close to $400,000 knee replacement, knee surgery, rehab, soup to nuts. It was not cheap.

SPEAKER_00 23:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 23:25

Um that same claim in you know, post-reform years would likely not be a not be a compensable claim. I I don't remember all the specifics of it, but the reforms that were passed in 2014 would have limited uh and it did limit a great number of fraudulent claims in the workers' comp system. So what for him like to do that, was there like an investigation or anything like that that would have so in in those days the your ability to investigate fraudulent workers' comp claims were very limited.

SPEAKER_00 23:56

Okay. Um so we really weren't able to deny the claim based on anything other than So this guy could have technically been hurt in his front yard, hopped in his car, drove to work, hopped out, and said, I got I smashed my foot here at work. Wow.

SPEAKER_01 24:13

That's that's the one from the underwriting days that sticks out the most. Um certainly had a a lot of a lot of sizable uh property claims over over the 16 years plus of being an under or being an agent. Um some that go well, some that drag on seemingly for eternity. Yeah um you know, we've had you know property claims, tornado claims that drug out for over a year. How is uh working with tornado claims in Oklahoma? You know, um it varies. It really does. Uh it's it's always heartbreaking, uh, especially when you're talking about total, total loss, you know, flattened homes, right, flattened commercial businesses. Um, you know, those those are gut-wrenching. Those are those are very traumatic, even as an agent. Um you know, the the tornado that hit Barnesdahl uh two years ago, uh we we had a we had a claim resulting from that. And what you look for, uh what I always look for is who got hurt and how badly did they get hurt. And in so many cases, it it's just seemingly miraculous that in the Barnesdahl example, not a single injury, not to staff, not to residents of the building, no one got hurt, and the staff did a great job of protecting lives and saving lives. And uh so there there's always uh you always seem to find some something that gives you hope. Yeah. Um but you know, and then we certainly had a fair number of of crazy liability claims, uh, a lot of a lot of lawsuit claims and various allegations that have happened to clients of mine over the years. And you know, some of them have merit and and you know, the claims paid out, and you're like, okay, this this is what we have the insurance for. And then there are some that are factually baseless, and somehow they still get settled for some six-figure amount, and you're just sort of left scratching your head. How in the world did we get to this? Um so it's you know, I I'm not never gonna say that we have a perfect system for anything. We have an imperfect legal system, we have an imperfect insurance system. Um the the point is to try and get better each and every time and and learn something from every claim. Um if you're not learning from your past, you're doomed to repeat it. So yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:34

Um I'm sure you remember, but in 2019 when all the floods happened, what was that? Uh can you kind of walk us through that? What was Sure.

SPEAKER_01 26:42

Um mercifully my my clients didn't have any major major issues from the 2019 floods. Um, I mean, I live in eastern Oklahoma and uh know a lot of people who did have issues with with rising water and flood damage, and um you know flood insurance is its own its own separate separate type of policy with its with its with a variety of different nuances. I mean, it's got federal implications, it's federally regulated in a lot of cases. Uh the National Flood Insurance Program writes the majority of it. Very little private flood is written. But um it's it that that's usually the hardest claim in terms of t duration to get people back to normal uh of any type of loss because they're usually very widespread. I mean, you're talking about tens, if not hundreds, of of properties damaged in a in a widespread flooding incident. And the level of cleanup and remediation and and damage that occurs that you know, you think about tornado damage, it's kind of cut and dry. You understand flood damage, it's there's a lot to contemplate there. Um I mean, and just from the mold mold aspect alone, you know, that that's a majorly dangerous and long-term effect that you know people don't really think about a lot.

SPEAKER_00 28:08

Yeah. No, I remember I was in uh Bixby at the time, and it was an absolute nightmare over in that area. Like there's a few neighborhoods that flooded and a few ranches down south, like in Leonard, that flooded, and it was an absolute nightmare.

SPEAKER_01 28:22

Absolutely. And uh, you know, gosh, and then you get into the vehicular incidents where people drive into that running water, rushing water, and you all are fire, you all are first responders. You see it more than anybody. Um, you know, the the crazy things that happen that you know the situations that people knowingly or unknowingly put themselves in, uh it's it's frightening. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, especially in talking about the Leonard area where you've got a lot of livestock down there and loss of livestock, loss of livelihoods. Uh it's it's very widespread, it's very catastrophic. And people don't think a lot about it. We don't think a lot about floods. Even in eastern Oklahoma, where we have so many bodies of water, and uh it's it's different. I mean, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 29:06

It seems like Oklahoma, the main thought is, you know, whether wildfire or tornadoes, sure, bad hailstorms, anything like that. I'm personally, we did you see the big hail storm that went through, you know, Collinsville Verdigris and all that. I've got my my house is in Enola.

SPEAKER_01 29:22

We have an open claim. Okay, so we had golf ball size hail in Enola that Friday night. And uh yeah, it's it's brutal. I mean, just people I go to church with who's who had all three vehicles in their household parked outside, and and the level of damage to those vehicles is just unbelievable. Yeah, and and the wind blew that hail, you know, sideways. There was a lot of lateral falling hail. Um it's it's dangerous stuff.

SPEAKER_00 29:51

Yeah, it looked like my the side of my truck got shot with a bunch of paintballs, you know, it was going in sideways. So yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:57

Oh yeah. You normally don't think about window damage with with a hail event, but there was a ton of window damage.

SPEAKER_00 30:03

Absolutely. On this campaign, have you how's it been? Has it been pretty exciting? A lot, a lot of learned, a lot of learned. Uh has there been a lot of lessons learned, or has it been pretty smooth?

SPEAKER_01 30:12

Oh, there's a major learning curve. This is this is my first uh first campaign of any type. Yeah. Uh you know, and jumping in statewide is uh an even steeper learning curve. I would say probably the most difficult thing to navigate. If I've got I'm blessed, I've got a great team, great people who who understand a lot of the ins and outs of what it means to run for office uh working with me. But probably the most difficult thing personally is just managing managing my time and where I need to be and when and how to best you know maximize impact of of where I'm gonna be any any given time. Um, there's hundreds of events going on throughout the state every month for for campaigns and candidates and political offices and a lot of invitations to come speak at events and uh trying to hit as many of those as humanly possible. But until I figure out cloning or teleportation, you can't hit them all.

SPEAKER_00 31:07

Right.

SPEAKER_01 31:08

Um, I'm not even sure you could if I figured that out.

SPEAKER_00 31:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 31:11

But um it's that's probably the most difficult part is you know, running statewide, you want to reach everybody in the entire state of Oklahoma. And uh doing that with uh with a truck and burning a lot of diesel, you're still not gonna hit it all. Right. So it's been a struggle from that perspective. Um but it's been fun. Yeah. I mean, I never thought I'd be running for office ever in my life. I ran away from politics and shied away from from getting involved like this uh forever. And uh as I said before, sometimes God just tells you it's time to get off the sidelines and get in the fight. Um and I'm in this fight because I care about the people in this state. Uh I've never lived anywhere else. Um fourth generation Oklahoma and raised in the fifth. And I want my kids to be able to grow up here and live here and be able to afford to live here and be able to afford to own a home. I want my mother to be able to stay in the home that I grew up in, be able to afford to live there. Um, you know, and it's a six-month conversation or annual conversation with her, you know, this is what the insurance renewal looks like. Can this still fit in the budget? And if not, what can we do to, you know, curb some of that expense and shift how she manages her risk and how she ensures her home? Um and it's it's getting to the point where we're we're not all the way out of options, out of levers to pull, but yeah, we're out of the good ones.

SPEAKER_00 32:38

Yeah, that's a that's a question I have uh I have for a lot of different people I've been talking to recently, with um, you know, the retirees who have fixed incomes, uh being able to afford the rising prices and the inflation that's going on right now across the country, just seems like it's I mean, it's a burden that uh they're having to bear with not not a whole whole lot of help, really. So right.

SPEAKER_01 33:02

And you know, and that inflation affects the cost of insurance. I mean, nails and lumber don't get cheaper either. No doubt. Uh labor for the people to put your roof back on hasn't gotten cheaper. Um, certainly in the post-COVID world, um, you know, things are more expensive. And while some costs, you know, building material costs have ebbed a little bit back down once or twice since 2020, but uh, you know, major global events happen, they pop right back up. You're when your cost of labor goes up, it doesn't go back down. Yeah. Uh that that toothpaste is out of the tube. Um so it's it's a struggle. Um, you know, I I think as insurance commissioner, we're gonna bring some ideas to the table that I think will put some more control and some more agency back into the hands of Oklahomans so that they're not just writing a check to an insurance company each and every year, maybe having some type of a shared risk or some type of a savings vehicle for that increased deductible risk. Right. Um that's something that I want to see come to fruition. We have we have the framework for those kind of things already in existence. Uh health savings accounts on the health side, um, you know, college 529 plans for kids' college funds. I think there's a major case to be made for having some type of a savings vehicle for Oklahomans to self-insure portions of their disaster risk, whether that's your deductible risk or your roof risk or or what have you. And I think if we can put a plan like that into place and get some good participation and get some good partnerships statewide, you know, people will feel like they've got an investment and they're not just, you know, throwing money at an insurance policy. What would the timeline for something like that be? Uh you know, it's gonna take a legislative lift uh to put something like that in place. Um I think as a state, we're in a position where there's some great people in the legislature that that I think will be behind ideas like this. There's some true professionals uh in our state government that I think will see the merit of this. And uh it's gonna be my job as insurance commissioner to have that collaboration between our legislature, with the insurance industry, with the consumers to make this plan work. Um I think it's just vital that we have everybody at the table. Yeah. Uh I think you know, the roofing industry needs to be involved in this, the construction industry for you know the other parts of the house, uh, the auto auto repair industry needs to have a seat at this table because you're taking tremendous risk with your auto-deductibles these days for you know physical damage. And uh you know, if we keep having these siloed conversations where it's just Bob the Insurance Commissioner talking with the legislature or Bob the Insurance Commissioner talking with the insurance industry, and then Bob the Insurance Commissioner with the roofing industry, i we're gonna miss things. You know, and uh if we have everybody at a table and can come to an agreement where chances are everybody's gonna walk away a little mad because they didn't get everything they want, well, that's probably the kind of compromise we need. Right. So I I I think that spirit of collaboration has to exist and that has to be part of the DNA of the insurance department.

SPEAKER_00 36:28

Absolutely. Well, I know that this is a state that uh requires a lot of lot of thought into insurance, of course. I know you know that. So I appreciate those uh helpful insights, especially for somebody like me, just to understand what's going on, because when it comes to insurance, like I said, I'm clueless. So I sat here talking to insurance agents uh with the claims I've got going on now, and it's like, well, this is what your policy states, and this is how you read it, and it's like I had no idea, you know. So have somebody to help guide you through it, it's or it's wonders, you know.

SPEAKER_01 37:04

Yeah, absolutely. It's you know, they're they're complex legal documents, yeah. And to just throw any any layperson into a room with that big stack of paper and say, all right, read this thing, that's not gonna go so well. Yeah, you you've got to have a guide. And you've got to, and again, I'm I'm a big believer in having a good professional agent, regardless of which agent you choose. Pick somebody who you have some trust and some faith in who's willing to sit down with you at a table like this and and discuss what it is you're trying to accomplish and how best to structure the coverage to do that and help you understand where the coverage begins and ends. Um I think a lot of people miss that ending part and uh they think they're just covered for everything. And you know, maybe you're covered for more than you think, but you're probably not everything.

SPEAKER_00 37:54

Insurance commissioner, what are some other things you want to tackle as far as uh things that you're seeing?

SPEAKER_01 38:00

Sure. You know, we've I'm gonna suck up a little bit. I think we need to partner better with the fire protection first responder community. Um a big component of your insurance rates is based upon what kind of fire protection exists near near your house or near your building. And so we're blessed to be in Tulsa, Oklahoma, where you all have a an ISO Varisk rating of of one protection class one. And you know, that that classification means that the citizens of Tulsa in in your protection area have a lower insurance rate than people in protection class two, three, four, all the way down to ten. Um so I think partnering with rural fire and um volunteer fire departments to enable them, give them the tools they need to get an upgrade to their ISO rating is going to be key for statewide. Um I really think the western side of the state needs this the most with their wildfire risk. Um and you know, in some cases that's that's a difficult problem to solve because it's a headcount problem. And recruiting people to do dangerous jobs is not the easiest task. I imagine you two felt a calling on your life to join the fire department and get into fire protection. Um whatever we can do as an insurance department to help help recruit and retain great people like yourselves to to take that calling and accept it and serve their communities in that capacity, I'm all for it. Um there's also you know a ton of just paperwork, I'm sure, that is probably the biggest hurdle in terms of getting that getting that upgraded ISO protection class rank. So whatever we can do as an insurance department to facilitate that, I'm all for it. Um ultimately the better quality of your first responders, the safer your communities. And in my mind, the less you should have to pay for insurance. Um I mean, there's things we can't control like the weather, but we can control the quality of buildings that we build, and we can control the quality of roofing materials that we use uh on our properties. The Oklahoma Insurance Department already started that process with uh something called the the fortified building program, okay ready. Um and that provides you know some grant assistance from the insurance department to help curb some of the cost and extra expense of putting those fortified roofing materials onto a house or onto a building. Uh, I want to see that program expand. It's it's currently capped quarter by quarter at a certain number of applicants. I believe it's 300 per quarter. I'd love to see that number double. Uh, furthermore, there's a cost up front associated with that. And I'd like to see us partner with uh hopefully some of our tribal friends in the state of Oklahoma uh to help incentivize and enable tribal citizens in rural parts of our state to participate in that program. Um, you know, $750 to pay a contractor to start this process for you doesn't seem like a lot to some people in our state, but for people living paycheck to paycheck or on a fixed income, that's that's an insurmountable number. It might as well be a million dollars. So if we can have partnerships to take those barriers away and help people access programs like this that are meaningful and positive, um, I think we need to be doing that. We need to be making those investments and cultivating those partnerships.

SPEAKER_00 41:33

Would that be something you'd be working on day one as commissioner? Oh, absolutely. Okay. Yeah, we're already having conversations about stuff like that. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 41:40

Uh you know, learn learn very early on that, you know, act like you already got the job. Start making moves like you already have the job. And that's what we're doing. Having conversations with legislature, with the legislators uh that are in positions to help influence things like that savings program I talked about. We've already had conversations with some tribal leaders about ways that we can partner to help some of their citizens access programs like this. And we're gonna have to have solutions for non-tribal citizens in rural America, rural Oklahoma. Um and so is the feedback usually really positive? Absolutely. Absolutely. I mean, ultimately, the great thing about Oklahoma, one of our biggest strengths is that we care about each other. And uh we're we're neighborly and we we have that belief that you know a a rising tide lifts all boats. So if if my neighbor can avoid a claim, you know, honestly, that helps me because you know, we're not gonna have to go respond to an emergency at our neighbor's house. And uh I think there's just a great sentiment of wanting to help one another in the state.

SPEAKER_00 42:46

Yeah. Um, with the ISO ratings across Oklahoma, is there like a do you know what the average ISO rating is?

SPEAKER_01 42:54

Oh, no, I don't. Uh I used to keep track of how many PC one protection class one fire departments there were in the state. And I think we're up to like four, four PC one departments in the state of Oklahoma. I think Tulsa was the first. Yeah. Um, so bravo. And uh and you kept it, which sometimes getting it is one thing, keeping it's another. Oh, yeah. Uh those those things are difficult accreditations to hold on to. Um, you know, I I don't know what the average is right now, but I think if we could set a meaningful goal of making 75% of the fire departments in the state increase by one point, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 43:34

You know, can your administration just bring the collective you know, down one at least?

SPEAKER_01 43:39

Absolutely. Yeah. I mean, I I think, you know, that's something that we can focus on a lot. I I really have, you know, rule uh volunteer fire departments are near and dear to my heart. I grew up, like I said, in Little Cleore, Oklahoma. We have a volunteer fire department. And I always knew where I could find those guys. They were always at the country sea store every morning having coffee. With their hats on. I mean, the you knew where they were, and I don't think they ever took days off from the at least from the coffee part.

SPEAKER_00 44:07

Well, I love being there too.

SPEAKER_01 44:09

Of course. Well, but you know, those to be a volunteer fire department means you really truly you really truly care about your community. You got the bug, it's in you. You may be a rancher, you know, the rest of the time, but when when it hits the fan, you're gonna be the person there responding to help your neighbor out. And and that's uh God, that means a lot. And so I really want to support groups like that as well. Um, so yeah, I think if I think if in uh in the first term we could have every every fire department in the state of Oklahoma move up one, obviously you all can't go up anymore, you know. So that's why I said 75, not 100%, you know, manage expectations here. But um I I think that would be meaningful in terms of helping our our property insurance, our fire insurance rates in the state. But uh, you know, things like the OK Ready program are fantastic. They focus on, you know, the wind and hail exposure. I think there's a lot more we could do with programs like that to expand to include um electrical monitoring devices, you know, the Ting devices that a lot of insurance companies rolled out. Uh that shouldn't be specific or proprietary to one insurance company. I think that could be something widespread that you know just monitors the electrical flow throughout your house. And if there's a problem or if there's surges occurring that are gonna, you know, potentially cause an electrical fire, you know, that's that's low-hanging fruit. That's easy. That's a device that plugs into one outlet and can be tremendously valuable. Um water flow monitoring devices, automatic shutoffs for water, because you know, let's face it, the best claim you have is the one you don't.

SPEAKER_00 45:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 45:47

Uh so if you have devices like those that can shut off a the water supply if a leak is detected, keep you from having to, you know, refloor the entire house or you know, major damage to flooring or things like that, why aren't we doing that?

SPEAKER_00 46:02

Right. Well, that would be my question. Why aren't we doing that?

SPEAKER_01 46:06

Well, you know, everything that the OID does is at the uh permission of the legislature. So that there is part of that, and and the insurance department has has a budget that is is set at the legislative level annually. And uh, you know, I think that's just something that we need to be more mindful of how we can take those premium tax dollars, which is the source of that revenue, and put it back in the hands of the people uh while also still continuing to support uh you know police and fire pensions, which is another use that that money goes to every year, which doesn't need to change. I imagine I'd be get positive feedback on that. Um but you know, ultimately, uh I'm a I'm a conservative Republican small government guy. Yeah, if a government agency is holding on to any kind of revenue or money that you know has the word tax associated with it, I think the best place for it is to go back to the people who paid it, which you know, premium tax dollars are sent in by the insurance companies, but they come from the premiums that you pay. So you've paid them. It's just another one of those hidden taxes that we all face as as people in in Oklahoma and in America. So let's put that back to work for the people and let people make decisions with their money.

SPEAKER_00 47:30

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Well, Mr. Sullivan, thank you so much for doing this. I've really appreciated having you here. Um, is there anything else you'd like to close?

SPEAKER_01 47:39

Sure.

SPEAKER_00 47:39

Uh episode with.

SPEAKER_01 47:41

By all means, yeah. Vote on June 16th. Uh, that is the Republican primary date, and I would very much appreciate it if you'd uh fill in the box for Bob Sullivan for Insurance Commissioner. Uh, you can find out more about my campaign at votebobsullivan.com. You can find me on Facebook as well. Um but but ultimately I would encourage everyone listening to this to think about how important down ballot races like insurance commissioner, labor commissioner, uh corporation commissioner are. Because those are those are roles that really have major impact on your day-to-day lives. Um and and I think those people in those roles that are trying to seek those roles really care about the state of Oklahoma and care about the people of Oklahoma. And I would encourage you to consider me as the person who cares the most about the people of Oklahoma and the race for insurance commissioner. Um, but I really appreciate it. Um I guess I'll close by saying uh vote Bob Sullivan on June 16th.