Disappointment- Episode 6

My first ketamine-assisted therapy session didn’t go as planned. Instead of a profound journey, I faced disappointment and frustration that I was doing it wrong. A raw, real-time account of an unexpected beginning.

#Katabasis #PurposefulDescent #KetamineTherapy #KetamineAssistedTherapy #CPTSD #TraumaRecovery #MentalHealth #HealingJourney #PersonalGrowth #Transformation #Hope #Clarity #Surrender #Grief #Estrangement #DivorceRecovery #Neuroplasticity #SelfDiscovery #EmotionalHealing #Resilience #TherapyJourney #Podcast #MentalHealthPodcast #HealingInRealTime #RecoveryJourney #LifeTransition #PurposefulHealing #InnerWork #PersonalDevelopment #StoriesOfTransformation

Transcript

SPEAKER_04 0:16

Okay, so I'm in the yurt. I think this is called the Barcelona yurt. And there's one across from us. And in this room well, it's a yurt. And in the center, it looks like this really pretty, like, Indian colorful lamp hanging down. I took a picture, I can maybe put it in the podcast notes. And then there's it looks to be like six beds on one side and six on the other. They're on the floor with big cushy pillows and fabric all along the walls. And yeah, it's cool. There's carpet in here. Um I went into another one and it wasn't carpeted, so I didn't like that one as much. Um what is that plant over there? There's some kind of weird decorative plant over there. There's a big happy smiling Buddha that you would see in a Mexico. I mean, a Chinese restaurant. Um, and Christy Christina Joy is my facilitator, if you will, my guide. What are your what's your title? Facilitator. We walked into this room about 30 minutes ago and it was freezing. There's an air conditioning over there, and I was like, I do not want to be cold. And she used to live in Mexico, so she doesn't want to be cold either. And we were both like, just shut it off. And we're waiting for the nurse who has calculated my height and my weight so she can give me the right dosage. I'm hoping she's not gonna take it too low because my thing is I want to go balls to the walls and get the experience. And um, I guess while we're waiting for her to come in, or I'll tell you what else just happened. Um I met the is he the CEO or the owner? I'm not sure. He's the founder and a CEO, I think. His name is um William David and Naylor. And he um met me out front when I went down to go get my hoodie because I wanted to be warm. It was freezing in here. And he that's the first time I've met him. He asked if I had done my my treatment, and I said I was about to do it. He was very excited for me. He gave me a hug, very friendly guy. And um, then he said, I'm gonna give you something that's gonna change your life. And I was like, All right, dude, what do you what are you gonna give me that's really gonna change my life? But then he gave me what I guess was like a well, he asked me some questions. He asked me my birth date, where I was born, what time I was born. I think that's pretty much it. And then there's this thing called the human design body graph chart. And he you know, put in all that information and up came this key chart with specifications of who I am, my energy, my body. I don't know what it what else would you call it, Christina.

SPEAKER_11 3:14

Your energy is how you operate.

SPEAKER_04 3:17

Yeah, how I operate. And so so I I took the picture that he gave me, he sent it to me. Uh he's got my text message. We've been messaging throughout uh my planning coming here and all that. Anyways, it has um keychart specifications. It says my energy type is a manifesting generator. And I'm like, that's just somebody who is a proactive self-starter, accomplisher, you know, blah, blah, blah. I knew that about myself. It's not like I was, you know, the world was open to me. And then the profile is a four or six, which means um opportunist role, which is honestly in this world it sounds like a horrible title, but I think they and Christine Yeah, that's it. Just says opportunist. What are you?

SPEAKER_11 4:05

Opportunist role model.

SPEAKER_04 4:06

Oh yeah, no, it does it does say that. Opportunist role model. So how how weird is that that Christina Joy and I are the exact same thing. When are you born? And Leo. You are not born the same freaking day I am. Oh my gosh. I'm born August 15th. What the hell? That's so cool. Wow, small world. I was like, she was like, I've got the same one. And uh, because I was just telling her this before I started the podcast, and we were like, that's interesting. I did not realize this exact same day. Wow, that is very cool. How old are you? How old are you? She's 31. I'm 55. Okay. So I'm gonna keep reading real quick and we're waiting for who to come.

SPEAKER_11 4:52

I know, but we do need to do kind of like a meditation process.

SPEAKER_04 4:56

We gotta do a guided meditation thing. So let me run through this real quick. I'm gonna just tell you this because I I think I'll forget otherwise. Give me a couple seconds. Okay, so number one, it has this map. If you guys go want to go look up human design body graph, it has like this map and they're geometric shapes with like a diagram map of your body and how it flows, right? Like if the top is like, I guess, your head and the bottom is your feet or something. I don't know. Anyways, it has three colored in defined centers for me. Number one is the green triangle, which means your mental processing. Number two is your throat, which is obvious connection to your communication and identifying you know, yourself and vocalization and all of that. And then the third one is the red square, which uh is sacral, and it means it's um your powerhouse of life force and stamina giving you the signature endurance of a generator. So then it has all these ones that are not colored for me because of where I was born, supposedly. And it's um they absorb the the grays that are gray, um, and they absorb and amplify energies of people around you serving as areas for deep wisdom or potential conditioning. It includes the head, uh, the G center, the heart, the ego, the root, the spleen, and the solar plexus. Okay, so that's what I found out. And I think that's pretty much it. So I did, well, I didn't want to say this part. So then I said, Okay, I they're she's taking my blood pressure. And I said, It said, Do you want to know more about this? Because I put this into a, you know, uh Google. And I said, actually, I'm about to do my first ever ketamine treatment. So what do you suggest? And then it said, you should always go into these with intention. And so um it's not it's not a goal to achieve something, it's just you know, a a nice uh outline, I guess, to have. Um and so it says it gave me three options, and I just told Christina Joy all of these, but I'm gonna say it to you guys. Number one option was surrender. It says, because your heart lean and emotional centers are gray, which means open, you naturally spend a lot of time absorbing other people's stresses, anxieties, expectations, wants, and needs. No kidding. Uh that is definitely an area and Christina Joy totally gets that too. So it said, Your intention, option number one, could be I am safe to let go of what is not mine to carry. And I thought, yeah, that's a good one. But I came here to do that. So I don't think I need to make that it. Option two was your energy type is built to move fast and do a million things at once. And the medicine is going to force your body to stay completely still while your mind travels. So you could make your intention. I give my body permission to reset and my mind permission to just float. I decided not to do that either because I've done Reiki in the lat twice in the last week. That's a whole nother story. Option three is observing without fixing. For your six-line profile loves to sit on the roof and observe the big picture and always gain wisdom. I could make my intention. I am a curious observer in my own mind. So I thought that was pretty cool that you could get, you know, type in this thing, get this body thing, look it up, you know, figure out who you are, what your energy is, um, how you are, and then think about your intentions. After talking with her, I decided not to go with any of those intentions. After all, I am a generator. Um, and what's my blood pressure? You are because I forgot to un I my legs were crossing. Yeah, that's really good. 117 over 81 is my blood pressure.

SPEAKER_01 8:59

You are gonna get injected in five minutes.

SPEAKER_04 9:00

I'm getting injected in five minutes, and I'm gonna record the whole thing. And I can either put the I talked to Christina Joy on the couch earlier this morning, and she said I could either put the headphones on and the blindfold, or I could not choose them. We could have music, not have them. I did bring in my Palo Santo and my cranberry incense, which are two things I love, and she's got I borrowed her lighter, so she's got those for me. Um what else? Um, I'm gonna let how long do you talk for?

SPEAKER_11 9:36

Um, we would do about 15 or 20 minutes. Oh, so we're doing four minutes.

SPEAKER_04 9:42

Okay, we have instead of 15 or 20 minutes, we're spending four minutes doing something because I didn't realize this and I started doing the podcast. So live and learn. Okay, so I'm gonna let Christina take it now. Christina Joy, and um, I'm turning up the volume and I don't know what's gonna happen here, guys. It's it's uh it's up in the air. But she just turned on the music, so sit in and listen. Should I put this somewhere else? You want to put this on recording right?

SPEAKER_11 10:15

Or just let leave this right here.

SPEAKER_04 10:17

I'm gonna take my glasses off.

SPEAKER_11 10:18

Okay, and then go ahead and try the headphones for me.

SPEAKER_04 10:23

Oh yeah, that's nice.

SPEAKER_11 10:24

Okay, how's the volume? What what kind of music is this? This is journey music. What? Journey music.

SPEAKER_04 10:32

Journey music.

SPEAKER_11 10:32

Okay, can I get my journey out there? Yeah. Is the volume good or are you?

SPEAKER_04 10:37

Yeah, no, it's good. Pretty cool. I think I should put my phone up here a second so they can hear it real quick. So they have an idea. Oh, this is what it is? Is this something you can get on Spotify? Really? Okay, you'll have to share that with me. Okay, so that's the music. It's different than the ears because it's going from one side to the other a little bit more.

SPEAKER_09 11:14

It's a little more important and not totally sitting down on top, but I'll get upset down on time once I start.

SPEAKER_11 11:21

So I'll just invite you now. Would you like a blanket or anything?

unknown 11:27

Okay.

SPEAKER_11 11:29

So we're just gonna take a moment to just drop in, so just take a second to get super comfy.

unknown 11:35

Okay.

SPEAKER_11 11:36

So then go ahead and close your eyes. And we're just gonna start to unlock some nervous system. Starting to take some deep breaths in through the nose and out through the nose.

unknown 11:56

And in through the nose.

SPEAKER_11 12:16

Absolutely.

unknown 12:18

Okay.

SPEAKER_11 12:20

We're just gonna do a short visualization, staying with the breath, long deep breaths in, breaths out. Just start to visualize a soft golden light that's entering through the soles of your feet, and about through the lights, into the lips. Everywhere that the soft golden light touches your body just completely softens and surrenders, just lets go.

SPEAKER_09 13:07

Coming up into your low belly, relaxing your low belly, throwing up the center of your chest.

SPEAKER_11 13:21

There's so much light in the center of your chest that it starts overflowing, trickling down into your shoulders, down through your elbows, all the way into your fingers.

SPEAKER_09 13:41

Your leg getting warm and soft way in the high inhaling blindly and exhaling one way. Some strain to the tips of your fingers, the tips of your toes.

SPEAKER_05 19:38

I worry as I'm gonna do it.

SPEAKER_04 20:36

I mean, I take a single water and fly.

SPEAKER_03 20:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:59

I was gonna say we forgot to mention that because we got sidetracked. What did I say was going to be hope, clarity, and sweetness.

SPEAKER_12 21:40

That's pretty nice. I know it's a good one.

SPEAKER_04 21:48

Now you're just trying to do it.

SPEAKER_12 21:55

That's how you go eat. It's not you haven't actually do it yet for the experience. Because if you're two like it's like it looks for your eyes, okay. Okay.

SPEAKER_11 24:49

Warmth. Warmth, yeah, like kind of spreading throughout your body. You don't have to do you feel like spreading throughout your body? Just up in my head right now. Okay. It should take about like five to ten minutes to fully kick in.

SPEAKER_02 25:03

Okay. This is just a warm feeling over my body. No, you shouldn't go fully into an experience. Okay. Okay.

SPEAKER_04 25:12

Is it okay if I just did this in this? Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 25:15

Okay. So now I have the headphone on just one ear and not the other. But they still get to hear the music, right?

SPEAKER_09 25:23

They will still hear the music. Yes, I'm just making sure that it's not a good one.

SPEAKER_11 26:00

That is normal, like kind of maybe like a fuzzy feeling one point in the morning. We're very lucid from most people just.

SPEAKER_00 26:15

Maybe I should have had a higher dose, huh? All text to her from 10 minutes to not feeling like you're in.

SPEAKER_02 26:22

I once was awake in anesthesia. The doctor was like, hey, she's still awake. Like it happens a rare thing, but that happened to be the true story.

SPEAKER_01 26:33

Oh.

SPEAKER_02 26:34

Like I was awake in the surgery, and I was not supposed to be awake. I didn't tell them that, but I never thought of it until just now.

SPEAKER_01 26:44

Were you feeling things? No, I mean then.

SPEAKER_04 26:50

Was I feeling things in surgery?

SPEAKER_01 26:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 26:54

Oh, yeah. I felt pain and everything. Like I came out. They had to call the anesthesia uh anesthesiologist back in and open. Because they were like, oh what the hell? So I guess he did dosage me enough.

SPEAKER_11 27:08

So I don't know if there's something in your brain or is there um yeah, there are different receptors that are more uh sensitive to manifestation. We'll do a little bit more breath work right now to see if that can actually activate it. Take a deep breath. Okay, but now psychological. Yeah. Okay, let's take a deep breath into the mouth. Take in as much as you can, tip in a little more. Hold for a little longer this time. Hold your breath. Turn into what you're feeling in your body. Hold on, hold your energy. Am I not supposed to be into that? Okay, just two more breaths. Big red hands. And big exhale. Last one, inhale. And then maybe put the eye mask on. That'll help a little bit. And exhale. We'll give it like five more minutes to see if you really drop in. Just come back to the normal breath.

SPEAKER_02 28:58

I guess I feel like I'm supposed to feel something or see something or have some kind of something. And I don't now, so I feel like I did something wrong.

SPEAKER_03 29:17

You know, it's frustrating.

SPEAKER_11 29:21

You're not doing anything wrong. It's just really focused on the surrender piece and just allowing yourself to feel what you feel right now. Just taking clarity. Surrender. Hope, clarity, surrender.

SPEAKER_00 29:40

Hope, clarity, surrender.

SPEAKER_11 29:43

Let's just approach the sensations that you're having right now with curiosity. Dropping all expectations of what they should or shouldn't feel like. What do you feel? Nothing. Nothing.

SPEAKER_02 30:30

So I'm like, I felt warm for a little bit, but now I'm like, okay, now what? So I feel like I'm doing something wrong.

SPEAKER_11 30:42

No, there's nothing wrong. Um, it could just be the way they can brain interact. But there I just text in a shame. You're not feeling anything.

SPEAKER_03 30:50

So I mean I wish. I see nothing because I got the lights off, but I feel like I'm doing something wrong.

SPEAKER_01 31:02

No, you're definitely not doing anything wrong.

SPEAKER_04 31:06

What am I supposed to be doing?

SPEAKER_01 31:12

It's different for everyone.

SPEAKER_11 31:16

Um everyone, but it shouldn't feel very introspective.

SPEAKER_03 31:22

Should feel introspective.

SPEAKER_11 31:25

Yeah, it's meant to take you kind of into your subconscious mind, into your emotional body. Every single person is different. Alright, so you are gonna get another shot. So just try to relax and do whatever you're feeling right now. Is there any kind of body sensation or any kind of sensation at all? Okay. Sorry. No, there's nothing like I was absolutely no. This experience is for you, and this is something that you invested in for yourself. Right.

SPEAKER_03 33:06

And so I just I feel like I'm not doing what I'm supposed to be doing. And that's I don't like that either.

SPEAKER_11 33:15

There is absolutely nothing for you to do or not do, or be or not be. There's no way to do it wrongly. Well, you are doing right. Yeah, there's no right and wrong, there's no word and wrong. It's absolutely see that's hard, that's all hard for me.

SPEAKER_03 33:37

I I I um say that uh what is it writing experience? Experience, um I have been um saying that's something.

SPEAKER_11 34:30

One of my favorite quotes is out beyond our ideas brain. It's kind of this letting go of what our brain is programmed to think is good or bad, which is a lot based around what what is pleasant or unpleasant are control dynamics. And so kind of just like letting yourself be in this space where our there is literally no way to listen. Life, this experience.

SPEAKER_09 35:00

There's no way to do what you want.

SPEAKER_11 35:21

So she's on the choosing it while the other nurses. Since they first injected you? Uh, about fifteen minutes.

SPEAKER_04 36:32

So, how long can we wait?

SPEAKER_11 36:34

That's what I'm asking now.

SPEAKER_07 36:57

I oh, you feeling really normal? Yeah. Okay. No, that's okay. I feel like I'm supposed to feel a different way, but I don't. Uh-huh. Interesting. I got you a pretty small booster. I almost feel like maybe I should get you a bigger one. You really don't yeah, you really don't feel anything. I I mean, I thought it was gonna be like the experience.

SPEAKER_06 37:22

Yeah, maybe I'll go get you just a little bit different. Okay.

SPEAKER_11 37:25

She did mention, I don't know if this is relevant, like a couple times she's been put under for surgery that she's like immune to anesthesia. She's awake during the surgery, so you can't.

SPEAKER_04 37:35

I wake up during the surgery. Like I was awake and they were like freaking out, and all the doctors are like, oh get her. It has something to do with where your head and your spine.

SPEAKER_06 37:48

Yeah, people have different anesthesia. Well, I'm gonna get you a bigger one. So I'll be I'll be back.

SPEAKER_00 37:54

Okay, she's great.

SPEAKER_06 37:57

She is pretty good.

SPEAKER_11 38:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 38:04

Anyways, okay.

SPEAKER_11 38:10

Has this happened to me before? No. I'm your brother. But there's yeah, but there's nothing wrong with you. It's just the way that your brain interacts with it, and I'm glad that they are you know honoring your desire to.

SPEAKER_04 38:24

I am so happy that you're born on my birthday.

SPEAKER_11 38:27

That is wild. That is really wild.

SPEAKER_04 38:29

Out of all the I mean, think about it. All the days of the year. All the days of the year. How many people are on this campus right now? Maybe 20? I mean, that's wild. There's 365 days in the year. What is the chance that the both of us would be born on the same day?

SPEAKER_02 38:48

Well, exactly, born around my I called my mom. He actually had me call my mom. Yeah, earlier.

SPEAKER_04 38:56

And it was around um, she said, I think we got to the hospital around three. And I'm like, well, okay, mom, how long are we gonna labor? She goes, Well, labor started at three. Uh, you were born sometime soon after we got to the hospital. So he put in three o'clock.

SPEAKER_11 39:12

Three in the afternoon or three in the morning? Okay. Yeah, I was born around like 1 a.m. Yeah. It's the interesting stuff. Do you mind if we turn the AC on on the room? Yes, yes, yes. It's gonna heat heat up in here a lot if we don't.

SPEAKER_04 39:26

How do you decide which yurt to use?

SPEAKER_11 39:30

Um we just talk about it, HV. Have you been in the other one?

SPEAKER_04 39:37

I went to the other one. I like the other one.

SPEAKER_11 39:39

You like the other one? We can see if we can do tomorrow's session in the other.

SPEAKER_04 39:49

Okay. So I volunteered at this place in Houston, and this friend of mine say her name. She said, um, if you're going on this experience and you're doing this, you should take a joint.

SPEAKER_02 40:04

And she gave me a joint to bring with me, and it's in my heart.

SPEAKER_04 40:10

I kind of feel like I would maybe get more out of that than I am with this.

SPEAKER_11 40:17

Um you've done both. What do you think? Super different experiences, but yeah, the idea is for this to be deeper, you know, a lot more, you know, pro profound and introspective. And why is it not? It could be just that there are receptors in your brain that are, you know, kind of like not blocking it. That are blocking it, yeah. Or it could be a mental thing where like this happens a lot with psychedelics as well. Like, even with really powerful psychedelics where there's always one person in the group that doesn't really feel like they went into it fully, and it can sometimes be a mental thing of like really just letting go and allowing yourself to have the experience. But I'm glad that she went to that a bill booster. I agree with you that especially because you're not scared. So that's the biggest thing is like people have fear around.

SPEAKER_04 41:14

Yeah, there's no fear whatsoever. You would just like to have the experience. Like I would just like, yeah. Come on, yeah. Alright. Well, I felt warm for a while there for a second. Was it just a second?

SPEAKER_11 41:32

Three and five minutes, maybe. Yeah. And I thought maybe that was when you were gonna drop into the experience.

SPEAKER_04 41:36

I felt warm and now I feel nothing. So where did all the drugs go then?

SPEAKER_11 41:42

I mean, they went to the city.

SPEAKER_04 41:46

But it's not affecting my brain. I mean, I'm having a conversation with you, I'm not seeing anything.

SPEAKER_11 41:51

Well, it's not like they're in there floating around not doing anything. It's like, you know, some people eat chocolate and get wired. Really? For other people it just tastes good. Yeah, like my mom. It's like super sensitive to chocolate. Yeah, it has something called bail bromine that activates your lymphatic system, and some people are just extremely sensitive to that. So it's the same as like, I mean, yeah, but for other people it can be in their system, but not interacting with their system in the same way.

SPEAKER_04 42:18

We're sitting here talking about how chocolate interacts with people's systems.

SPEAKER_09 42:23

Chocolate? Is that another weird one? That's another weird one.

SPEAKER_07 42:28

Well, I was gonna, we were gonna just give you 10 more. I doubled it to 20. Um, you had that arm the first time.

SPEAKER_06 42:35

Um I mean, I probably will still be mild.

SPEAKER_04 42:39

Um I was asking her just curiosity. We're recording this on podcast, by the way. Oh, okay. Um, why did this happen to me?

SPEAKER_07 42:50

Like, why don't I feel it? Why am I? So um it could be that you do metabolize and it's usually different and that it just met a metabolism thing. It could be a metabolism thing. I also think that people can stop themselves from dropping in. And some people and I've experienced people have like like vastly different experiences with the same dose depending on like the music. Um, or sometimes I've found from my experience people who have um like OCD or really need to like control the situation sometimes will stop themselves. So not to say that you're doing that, but it could, I don't know, maybe if you feel like you're like being watched and on the spot with the recording of it, or I I don't know, I'm very open.

SPEAKER_04 43:34

Yeah, I'm just I was I was like, I'm I'm okay with whatever I see, whatever I do, whatever transpires, but it's just really nothing. There's nothing.

SPEAKER_07 43:48

Yeah. It might just be a metabolism thing, which is it's unusual.

SPEAKER_04 43:52

It's unusual to have like the doctor said I was unusual when I woke up in surgery, too. So yeah, surgery that's unusual thing.

SPEAKER_07 44:01

Yeah, well that's very good to know. It will definitely go up by more than we would for the next one. Okay, good. I'm I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_02 44:11

Well I was disappointed. I'm worried about Christine Joyce.

SPEAKER_11 44:15

Um just before the time.

SPEAKER_13 44:29

I have plenty of I have plenty of time.

SPEAKER_04 44:32

I think you can there's no other place you can go.

SPEAKER_11 44:38

There's another point that's a little property, but you can talk about afterwards.

SPEAKER_04 44:45

Afterwards, okay, that's it's it's I feel like first things that have to do.

SPEAKER_11 44:53

Well I mean the first inject and I'll get to the inject.

SPEAKER_04 45:07

And I told her earlier, I'm like, how much I have friends needed three hours.

SPEAKER_07 45:13

Yeah, but that would be that would be definitely typical. Yeah, most people like most clinics will reserve a room for like two hours for like the introduction or the check-in with the experience and the recovery. Yeah, yeah. And there are people that happens too, but that's like an outlier. Okay. Well, obviously, and I'm an outlier. I'm an outlier in the opposite direction, unfortunately.

SPEAKER_04 45:35

Malcolm Globell. I know I I know the name. He he wrote a book called Outlier.

SPEAKER_07 45:40

Oh, really? Yeah, come on. I'll check it out. Okay.

SPEAKER_04 45:45

Okay, you ready? Yes, should I do something beforehand? You're about to inject me.

SPEAKER_07 45:50

Oh, you should get your music ready.

SPEAKER_04 45:52

Okay.

SPEAKER_11 45:53

I wouldn't not be seeing boys, but um being able to get the headphones and the iMasbag on and just use it. That helps you drop in.

SPEAKER_04 46:00

Okay, here we go.

SPEAKER_03 46:06

Okay.

SPEAKER_07 46:11

All right, here we go. You got the music going? Hope, clarity, and surrender, right?

SPEAKER_04 46:20

Wonderful. Is that right?

SPEAKER_11 46:22

Hope, clarity, surrender. Okay. One, two, three. Let's just really lean into the surrender piece and let go.

SPEAKER_13 47:56

Hold on, I can't hear you.

SPEAKER_11 47:57

What let's just lean into the surrender piece and let go of keeping track of time and just allow yourself to be curious about the experience and just see what you feel.

SPEAKER_02 48:38

I'm worried about time.

SPEAKER_08 48:40

Don't think about time. The sensation or the sensation itself, or then not having the sensation?

SPEAKER_02 50:23

Like all this.

SPEAKER_08 50:25

Like sorry. Super valid.

SPEAKER_02 50:30

I don't know what I'm supposed to be feeling or what I'm supposed to be thinking or how I feel like I'm screwing this up. Like I'm not doing it right.

SPEAKER_11 50:44

Well then maybe let's just surrender to that feeling and not make that feeling wrong.

SPEAKER_10 50:50

What does that mean?

SPEAKER_11 50:52

I just dropped the idea of like missing it up. Because it could be that that is also what's keeping you from going holding to the experience is this really strong expectation that you place on yourself of that there being a right and wrong way to do this. And I understand your frustration 100%, and it could be a physical thing that's just not metabolizing it, in which case, you know, a lot of conversation after this about increasing your dosage and making sure that you get the experience that you signed up for.

SPEAKER_04 51:38

Yeah, I feel like I'm doing everything wrong.

SPEAKER_11 51:43

Let me text Katie again.

SPEAKER_02 51:45

I don't know what to do. It's really frustrating. It's not what I wanted.

SPEAKER_01 52:08

Remember the surrender and what this hope surrender and surrender.

SPEAKER_13 52:13

What? Hope clarity and surrender.

SPEAKER_02 52:16

Hope clarity and surrender.

SPEAKER_11 52:17

That's what I don't know what else. So hope, clarity, and surrender are things that only you can access within yourself. There is no magic drawing, there is no magic cure that will give you those things if you don't have them. What psychedelics can do is give you a key or an opening or a window, but it is a process, and that's why it is multiple sessions as well. A lot of times what comes up during the first session is not necessarily just you know bliss and euphoria, right? It's really facing the things that are standing in the way of whole clarity and surrender.

SPEAKER_04 52:57

So how do I know what's standing in the way?

SPEAKER_11 53:01

So again, like that's an answer that you have within yourself. But it could be, for example, things that are coming up right now are like ideas around should or shouldn't, right? Which is our brain's way of wanting to control our external environment. So it could be that control is getting in the way of surrender, it could be that despair is getting in the way of hope or negativity bias, right? It could be that you know there's always the for your surrender, there's always the opposite, which is control, right? For hope, there's the opposite, which is despair. For clarity, there's the opposite, which is confusion. So a lot of times with the sessions, the reason that there are multiple sessions is because the first few sessions, they actually bring up and help you see what's standing in the way. So that by the final session, you can actually access these things. And it's not that the ketamine does it for you, it's that the ketamine opens a window into your own psychology where you're able to find the answers within yourself.

SPEAKER_01 54:06

Sucks. I know, I know.

SPEAKER_04 54:11

I thought this was gonna be great and awesome and wonderful and terrific and amazing.

SPEAKER_11 54:18

So, what what I will say is that there's two pieces. I think one is like whatever expectation you have of what you would really like to get out of this experience, this is an opportunity to really advocate for yourself and for that, and whether we're able to get that through the higher dose or whatever, you know, there is a whole stack here that is here for you. And then the second is you know, there's two pieces to this is you know the the substance, and then there's your physiological way that you interact with it, and there's your psychological way that you interact with it. So there's also the piece where like so if I if I just you don't suck, you don't suck, and let's get that kind of like negative language out of your head.

SPEAKER_04 55:18

I don't want to know how to do drugs right.

unknown 55:23

Oh my god.

SPEAKER_11 55:27

Seriously, they give me a- Okay, so the nurse said that they're gonna find a solution for this. So whether that's like they'll give me an exercise in the higher dose. I mean, I can't promise anything because I'm not them. This is so I I'm I'm embarrassed, honestly. There's nothing to be embarrassed about. This is not a a failure with mutants. I feel like it is.

SPEAKER_04 55:56

I feel like I failed.

SPEAKER_11 55:58

And so maybe dealing with that feeling of failure is part of the process. Maybe this is all part of what you came here to unravel. Maybe it wouldn't have helped you in the long term if the ketamine just gave you a rainbows and butterflies experience on day one, because that would then again reinforce this idea that it's something outside of you, or that you have to outsource or look for something outside of your substance or something that's going to give you what you don't have inside. So it could be that this frustration that's coming at the sense of failure, this is all brewing to the surface, things that need to be brought to the surface, so that this process can actually be a truly healing process, which is like helping you find the keys inside of yourself that will be sustainable throughout the rest of your life. And then I also fully understand the piece where you're like, I came here because I need help, you know, I really wanted to let go and surrender into an experience that would take me and feel bigger than me and make me feel, you know, take me into a place that I can't really access on my own. That's why I came here. So I understand that piece 100% too. And if you'd like to talk to William right now, we still have some time before the next session. If you want to talk to him and just let him know how they're feeling, um, and see what kind of solutions he can give you because he'll be the one that can tell you, like, okay, we can do this, we can do this, we can do this.

SPEAKER_03 57:22

I didn't do what most people do.

SPEAKER_11 57:26

But let's drop that for now because no two people are the same. It doesn't matter. The point is, you have an expectation, a desire for your experience here, and you get to advocate for that right now. What what would you be desiring right now? Would it be another dose? Would it be, let's say, another time where you actually get like a really big dose?

SPEAKER_13 57:56

I want to feel what my friend told me about. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 58:01

And I want it to be a change, and I want to have hope and clarity and surrender. I want to have all that.

SPEAKER_13 58:09

And instead just being on a matter of you.

SPEAKER_11 58:15

Yeah, I'm feeling from certain stuff. How would you feel if I went and got William or Justin so that we could talk through this? And it's not just me kind of talking out my ass, but we can actually come up with a plan to make sure that you feel like you're getting what you came here for. Does that feel good to you? Yeah. Okay, cool. Right back. Try not to be hard on yourself. There is a solution, but what in the clarities there are.

SPEAKER_02 58:50

I'm disappointed right now. I know.

SPEAKER_10 58:52

And that's a totally valid feeling. Just let yourself feel that way without what you're doing.

SPEAKER_11 59:02

I know. I'll be right back.

SPEAKER_04 59:24

Okay, so I'm sitting here by myself. And this whole thing is recording, and I'm just the only one.

SPEAKER_13 59:37

I don't know. I don't know what I expected. Maybe I expected too much. Maybe the drug isn't metabolizing.

SPEAKER_02 59:47

Like it's supposed to.

SPEAKER_13 59:50

Maybe I'm supposed to feel and see and be and I hate the fact that I'm frustrated.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:04

I just want it to be super easy and not a big problem and not an issue. But I mean, I do love Christina Joy. She seems to really be willing to get help and try to figure out what to do.

SPEAKER_13 1:00:25

She's a very kind and sweet person, so I I'm happy that she's gone to do that, but yeah, sitting in here. Or I don't know.

SPEAKER_04 1:01:47

I don't know what to think right now. I hear birds, and then I'm like, are those birds on recording or are they outside of the earth?

SPEAKER_02 1:02:05

I think it must be a recording somewhere. I hate to be the problem child. I hate to be the person who, you know, oh, they gotta go get somebody. It just bothers me.

SPEAKER_13 1:02:39

I'm grabbing my glasses. I got this thing on my finger.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:47

Eighty-nine? Ninety-eight. Ninety-eight over eighty-one is what it says. It's uh, yeah, I got my glasses on now. Ninety-eight over eighty-four. And I'm looking at the phone now, and it says it's been an hour. I'm like, oh my gosh, it's it's already eleven fifteen.

SPEAKER_13 1:03:08

What have we done in this amount of time? Okay.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:17

Well, I know I did the first dose, and they gave me the second dose. Still not feeling anything. She went to get William. And somebody else, I think she said. I think. Well, I don't actually know what time it was she came in here, but I heard it wasn't very deep. I don't think I had anything. I think I metabolized it wrong or something.

SPEAKER_12 1:04:02

Well, so so there are two things. Sometimes people do metabolize it kind of rapidly, uh-huh. But you're still getting the effect in your brain that we want, even if you're not having a psychedelic experience, right? I'm disappointed though. Yeah, it's okay to be disappointed. Like, you know, sometimes people are excited for what can be. Um, but we still have to be careful. Like, I've even in the past given someone who was like, I, you know, like metabolizing with da-da-da-da-da and this whole thing, and it was awful. You dropped into a khole on point second. What's a khole? It's like like you take too much.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:38

Oh, I I don't know anything about it.

SPEAKER_12 1:04:40

Yeah, it's basically like you like you're like, I don't know who I am, and I don't know where I am, and nothing is real, and it's like all scrambled. And so we have to be careful that we're not gonna do that to someone. So once it was like you really weren't getting anywhere, so we gave you another like a dose. But you know, when I think so, I work in the space of parts. Do you know what parts? IFS parts work is internal family systems. Okay, so it's a type of psychotherapeutic modality, and that's the one that I use the most. And so in parts work, you have a self and then you have parts, right? And a self is just sort of this authentic self who we are, no agenda, no like you know, grasping or attempting, and self is compassionate, clear, creative, kind, curious, I know kind of stuff that's the I mean, um, and playful, powerful. And when we're in that space, which is hard to get to, it's something that I teach people to do in a very good process, then that's how we feel. Outside of those, over our lives, we have parts of ourselves that break off. And so we have protectors who are managers and firefighters, and then we have wounded parts who are um the wounded parts are usually wounded exiles. So something traumatic happens, even if it's small, um, and then that part kind of gets exiled off the system. And so when I hear what you're saying, I hear you have a part that is frustrated and disappointed. And that's okay. The part is allowed to feel it. Okay, you know, like, and so when we work in parts, we have a lot of Because of the place of self, we have compassion, gratitude, understanding for the heart. And so that part of you that's disappointing. To me, for that part, you know, we'd say, I hear you, I get it. This it's okay to feel bad. And then we let that part tell us how it feels, right? So that it feels witnessed at heart instead of getting mad at it or pushing it away or any of those things. And so, you know what we can do next time, because Yeah, I'm all about solutions.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:48

I'm like, okay, well, if this didn't work, should I even do it again?

SPEAKER_12 1:06:53

And so that's another part, right? Or it might be the same part, right? But it's a part that is like, what's the point? But we can start you higher next time, because we know, right? And we're converting into a cable. And then we can do the booster again if we need to. So just like we boosted you and we realized that it wasn't weren't getting anywhere, we can do a boost again. So like next time, you got today all together, you got about um 60 milligrams. 60 milligrams academy. Yes, which is 0.75 per kig, which is higher than we start people. Um, unless they've done a bunch of ketamine that we've got research. What's wrong with me that makes me like this? Do you have red hair?

SPEAKER_02 1:07:37

No.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:39

More so, yes.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:40

I hide it, yes. But you do have red hair.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:43

More so, yes.

SPEAKER_12 1:07:44

So red-headed people, but again, one of the people that I dropped into a cale had red hair, so this is why I were careful. Red-headed people will often it's auburn. Um anesthetics faster, meaning higher doses. Which is why we were okay giving you an extra 20 today. Because then Christina said that you said that you had you were.

SPEAKER_04 1:08:08

I remember so badly what the doctors told me because I've had um I've had a lot, I've almost died six times. I've had um epidural headache where they push the thing or whatever, and they said um I want to say it's like low or shallow or something.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:31

Does that have any fairy? No.

SPEAKER_12 1:08:34

Shallow. So it means like you don't go very deep or something, like you stay pretty that's what you would think it's the opposite. I I just it has something to do with the anesthesia. She was saying that you said you wake up easy. I right? And you don't use THC, do you? I don't even know what that is. That's cannabis.

SPEAKER_13 1:08:57

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_12 1:08:57

I I have some in my cards somebody gave me, but I have not used it.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:01

Okay, so you don't use collar. Yes.

SPEAKER_12 1:09:04

People who use THC regularly also really push the tolerance for anesthesia. So that's not it. It's probably just genetically you're gonna have a higher tolerance. Yeah, which is why we did the other thing I will say, and this is like just something that I'm aware of. I'm not saying that this is you, but um people also, if they're if they're anxious, if they need control, if they struggle to let go, if it's really hard to not be on and like the one who is in charge.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:34

I'm always the one who's in charge, but I was totally, I had no anxiety, no stress, like no worries, no, not scared of needles, no nothing. Like I was like totally willing to receive whatever came with this.

SPEAKER_12 1:09:48

And that may have been you, like self, right? When I'm talking about parts. But if you have a if you have a part, I'm not saying, but if you have a part that is a protector that's that manager that is like, I am going to stay in control, then it can make it, it can like basically stop you from having an experience. But if we think that that's what it is, then make sure that we like talk to that manager, right? So I didn't get what everybody else got today. You still got the neuroplasticity, so I want you to know that. And it's important for your system to know that because it's still, it's even if you don't have a psychedelic or altered state experience, you still get the neuroplasticity. Okay. So you've started the process of and in NMDA receptor antagonism, you've started the process of neuroplasticity in your brain. Okay. So I don't want you to feel like that isn't happening. And then when you come, if you come again, what Monday? Are you coming Monday? Thursday. Yeah, it's weights on Monday. So typically we do the Mondays and Thursdays, and that's on purpose because you do have BDNF. So your BDNF level in your system is going to be pretty high for the next four or five days. What is BDNF is brain-derived neurotrophical factor? So what ketamine does on that NMDA receptor antagonist, it um basically it antagonizes it, which means absolutely when it does that, it shunts basically it sends the glutamate to this other receptor that makes a lot of BDNF. And BDNF is like miracle growth of the brain. So it's basically like you just took a bunch of you know fertilizer and dumped it on your brain. And so this is the the process of starting the neuroplasticity. Okay, that's cool. And that stays high for about four or so days after you do ketamine, which is why our schedule is set up the way it is, because we don't want to cannibalize right the BDNF that's already big. We want to like maximize when you're getting the next dose to push the BDNF up again so that you're like, because if you do it too soon, then you're you're basically just like wasting your experience. Does that make sense? Because you already have a high BDF and it can only go so much.

SPEAKER_04 1:12:05

So there's no way I can get anything today and experience this so that for the next four days I have something to go, wow, I had this experience.

SPEAKER_12 1:12:16

So we we can't really do another one because you still have ketamine in your system too, and it's like how much is still there and how much has been metabolized, and we don't know. But it's also so there's that part that's frustrating. So you let that hope frustrating. I to I what I'm hopeful for is that that part doesn't then front so much that you don't have hope for the next one.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:39

Um you know it's kind of hard to have hope when this is the first experience.

unknown 1:12:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:12:45

But it it's also just like this happens sometimes, and it's okay.

SPEAKER_12 1:12:59

And now we know, right? So the next time we can start you higher and then boost you again. And so you know, and sometimes people and there are other people I have I know other people who don't have like psych delicate things that they still get benefit, and so they don't have like this experience visual something just they don't have, but you're still getting the benefit for your system. Okay, yeah. And we'll keep working on trying to get you to that experience. Um, but the experience is almost like a a bonus in terms of your uh healing and like treating the anxiety. Okay, yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:45

Okay, so I get this thing off and get ready to go.

SPEAKER_12 1:13:49

Yeah, be careful getting up because you may be a little less safe on the feet. Let me get all the things I'm back to.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:55

Okay. Thank you.

SPEAKER_12 1:13:57

Yep.

SPEAKER_04 1:14:06

All right, so it's been an hour and 13 minutes that this has been on record. And yeah, I feel like I kind of got a non-experience. I know that there was the warmth and I talked. I'm gonna want to go back and listen to this myself, but I feel like I'm not coming out of this going, woo, I had this great experience. I feel like I had a non-experience, even once they boosted me. And then I feel guilt about that, like I did something wrong, like I was supposed to breathe different, or I was supposed to put my earphones on at a different time. I don't know. I I'm like, what did I do wrong? How how did I do this? How did I mess this up? So there's guilt and shame, I guess, involved, frustration. And I'm trying to understand it all, honestly. I just feel like this is what I came here for. This is supposed to be the aha moment. This was supposed to be my figuring things out. And I mean, maybe I will, maybe, maybe it will be better the next time. I don't want to be mad, but I am. I'm kind of frustrated and mad. Mad that this didn't work out the way I wanted it to, frustrated that it seems like this shit happens to me all the time, whether it's, you know, having epidural headaches and you know, all the trauma that went with that, or waking up in surgery that one time, or you know, having the blood pour out of me at my heart rate was 40 over 20, and I was still lucid. And they were like, she's still lucid, and you know, having all these weird experiences. And I'm just like, what the hell? Why does it have to happen to me? So feeling a little frustrated by the whole circumstance and I don't know, scenario. I guess Christina Joy is gonna come back in here in a little bit. I think I'll leave it on um instead of stopping it because I think she's got a lot of wisdom. I know she it's what time is it? It's 11:30 now, and um, she's got somebody coming in here at 1230. So, I mean, I guess it should be happy that I've got the ketamine and it's like like she said, miracle grow for my neuroplasticity, and that's cool. Um I do feel a little off, a little off, not sure exactly how to describe that or what that looks like. It's not a good feeling though. I don't feel good. Yeah, no, it's almost like I have a dull headache. Not good. Frustrated. And now I don't know what to do either. Do I take a nap? Do I walk around? Do I eat? Like I feel like there's not a lot of direction. You can kind of go and be and do whatever, and that's cool on one hand, but on the other hand, it's like I feel like I need some guidance, I need somebody to tell me what I should do. Um, I I think I just feel like I messed up and I did things wrong. Even my own body metabolizing it, not metabolizing things the way that I should have. I mean, I'm not even in control of my frickin' body metabolizing. I'm just really frustrated. Hopefully, Christina Joy comes back in here soon.

SPEAKER_13 1:18:24

I hear people talking, I don't know where they're at.

SPEAKER_04 1:18:46

When I shut my eyes, I don't see anything, you know. Like I thought if I shut my eyes, I would see big something, but I don't know. It's been a while. Um, let me get my glasses on so I can see what time it is. Yeah, it's been at least six minutes since she left. But I mean, oh wait, somebody's coming, maybe. Yep. I was like, did they forget about me? I just literally said that, and then she walked in.

SPEAKER_11 1:20:24

Oh, I know it.

SPEAKER_04 1:20:26

Well, I feel like a failure.

SPEAKER_11 1:20:28

Okay. You're not a failure. I didn't what did you guys agree on?

SPEAKER_04 1:20:35

I don't know.

SPEAKER_11 1:20:37

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 1:20:44

So it kind of sucks.

SPEAKER_11 1:20:47

Yeah, I understand. Did you talk about dosation the next one?

SPEAKER_04 1:20:52

I guess they're gonna, but then it's like, well, if it didn't work the first time and I screwed that up or it's not metabolizing or whatever, then how is the second time gonna be better? Am I gonna be doing and then she said something like it was like miracle growth for your brain? So even if I don't feel the effects, even if I didn't see, you know, whatever, rainbows and sunshine, lollipops, whatever, um, that it was still gonna be good for me for the next four days until I do the next treatment.

SPEAKER_01 1:21:23

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 1:21:24

So that's it.

SPEAKER_11 1:21:28

So what do I what are you feeling like you want to do?

SPEAKER_04 1:21:30

That's why I just said that to the podcast. I was like, I don't know what to do. I don't know, do I eat, do I take a nap, do I go somewhere? Do I I just I feel I don't know what to do?

SPEAKER_11 1:21:42

Well, how would you feel if we got you set up in the room with some soup? Does that sound good?

SPEAKER_04 1:21:47

Soup?

SPEAKER_11 1:21:48

Yeah, we're gonna have soup for lunch.

SPEAKER_04 1:21:51

No.

SPEAKER_11 1:21:52

No, what sounds good?

SPEAKER_04 1:21:53

I thought we were having brunch. Brunch is soup.

SPEAKER_11 1:21:59

Yes, that's okay.

SPEAKER_04 1:22:01

Oh, okay. In my mind, brunch was like pancakes, waffles, something, you know, fruit, brunch. I don't need that. I don't no, no, no, don't don't text anybody. Don't no. I'll just yeah. I'm really reconsidering all of this at this point.

SPEAKER_11 1:22:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:22:23

I mean, I just spent a ton of money. I I I don't know what to think. This has never happened with anybody with you before.

SPEAKER_11 1:22:39

With me, no, but like I said, I just got here a couple weeks ago. I have signed in onto plant medicine ceremonies, but it's been tomorrow, so sorry, my thought of me.

unknown 1:22:55

I don't know what to do.

SPEAKER_04 1:22:57

See, I was hoping for hope, clarity, and surrender. Those are the three things, right? Hope, clarity, surrender. I don't have hope right now. I don't have any clarity right now, and I don't know what I'm surrendering, whatever. You know, it was just kind of trying to get me into the space, but I was hoping for answers and solutions and clear, you know, all that. And I feel like I don't have it. So now I I'm back at point one. So what do I do now? Just sit around for the next four days. Answer that question. Like, seriously, answer.

SPEAKER_11 1:23:37

That is an answer that only you have. I don't I can't answer that for you. I don't know what would be best for you. I don't know if this is the place where you are to find answers. Are the things that you're looking for answers for?

SPEAKER_04 1:23:59

You know, I came here because I'm disappointed with life. And now I was hoping that this would work out, and I feel disappointed with this. It's just like really kinda sucks.

SPEAKER_11 1:24:16

It does. All right, yeah. That's a really valid thing to have. I understand. I wish that I could give you like an answer. I don't, I really don't have one.

SPEAKER_04 1:24:26

No, I I mean I appreciate that. It's just like, come on. I kind of have a headache.

SPEAKER_11 1:24:35

Do you have a headache? Do you have some coffee?

SPEAKER_02 1:24:39

I don't know. I don't know what I want right now because I feel weird.

SPEAKER_11 1:24:48

Do you feel weird because you feel like the ketamine didn't work, or do you feel like there is some ketamine in your system?

SPEAKER_04 1:24:53

I feel like there's some ketamine somewhere in my system, but I don't know what it's doing. You know what I mean? Like it's like I got the bad part of it, maybe.

SPEAKER_11 1:25:06

Well, there is no good or bad part of it. It's just how it interacts with your brain.

SPEAKER_04 1:25:13

Okay, well, I didn't get the best results, and she says it's like fertilizer and it'll grow over the next four days. I guess maybe I just need to give it a little time. I get anxious and I'm like, results now, baby, please give it to me now. Yeah, I want results quick. Right. So maybe what I need to do is just shut off the podcast, take some time, come back, go from there. I mean, who knows? I mean, maybe by the third time, I'm like, this is the best thing since sliced bread. This is awesome, amazing, and wonderful.

SPEAKER_11 1:25:53

And it's just given up on it.

SPEAKER_04 1:25:55

Yeah. So I you know, I but then at the same time, what if I do three of these and they all end up like this? Am I is there something weird with my brain?

SPEAKER_11 1:26:07

I'm like that's a conversation that I would really seriously have with the nurses. Like be like, is there a possibility that because of my metabolism and my neuroreceptors, that academy actually won't work on me and that I will be wasting my time and money?

SPEAKER_04 1:26:22

Yeah, it makes you wonder.

SPEAKER_11 1:26:24

Like, just you know, ask them even if there's a possibility that there's like a yes or no answer to that question. Because that's important. Yeah. Because if it there really is no like, if there really is no way that your brain can actually fully block the experience, or if they give you a high enough dose, then you will have an experience. If you're not having experience, the only thing blocking you actually is psychological, like you're not allowing yourself to have an experience, then it's worth working through that. But if it's a physical thing to where you have something in the way that you metabolize, it's kind of like a chemistry, uh chemical and yeah to where potentially you are running the risk of spending more money and getting more doses of a substance that actually can't interact with your neuroreceptors the way it would with other people's. Then that to have a yes or no answer to that question would be really important in deciding if you want to move forward.

SPEAKER_04 1:27:19

Yeah, I agree. I I definitely think. Yeah. Okay, I'm gonna shut this off and then I'll talk to you with this off. Okay, hold on. Let me hold on. All right, okay, and there's that episode. So we'll see if I publish this or what that looks like. But um, I guess that would be episode six. And yeah, so we'll see. Bye.