Little Stranger

Come discuss Little Stanger by Leigh Rivers with us! follow up by letting us know what you think!

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:29

Hello, and welcome everybody to uh the Sinful Shell first episode. Um, we are wearing the same outfits as our intro episode because we're recording the same day. Yay! Um, so if you don't remember, we are talking about little strangers. Uh, or little stranger. Oh my god. Um, we're talking about Little Stranger by Lay Rivers. And Heather is going to read the content warning one more time for everybody before we start the episode. And please note that there will be spoilers.

SPEAKER_01 1:03

A lot of spoilers. We are going to get very deep into this book.

SPEAKER_00 1:06

Yay.

SPEAKER_01 1:07

Just like something. Anyways.

SPEAKER_00 1:10

Um anyways, I actually I also just want to say before we start, uh, if you are under the age of 18, please leave. Turn back now. Turn back. Um back when you're 18. I do not support underage people reading these books.

SPEAKER_01 1:26

Um we get into a lot of heavy sexual topics and foul language and depravity. So if you're underage, which I hope you're not, don't listen, please.

SPEAKER_00 1:41

And please don't read these books until you're over the age of 18.

SPEAKER_01 1:44

Yes. Um But this is Dottie. She's gonna help us in this podcast. We also call her to tilde.

SPEAKER_00 1:53

She is giving main character energy throughout this entire thing.

SPEAKER_01 1:57

Snoozing. Um, but anyways, I'm gonna read the content and trigger warnings directly from the book itself. Um just so that you guys know from the author's mouth exactly what uh to look out for. If any of these points make you uncomfortable, please come back to an episode you might feel more comfortable in reading. Um anyways, this book contains characters that are foster siblings, not blood related. They put our race together. Um if you are comfortable with heavy somnophilia, C and C, dubious consent, drugging, branding, choking, sex over a dying body, with other kinks like brother-sister kinks, knife play, primal play, blood play, pain, screwdrivers, fear, light breeding, anal and spider play, Malachi Vise, my new favorite mute psychopath is waiting for you. Um again, this book is Little Stranger by Leigh Rivers. Let's get into it.

SPEAKER_00 3:11

So let's just preface this by saying you read the physical copy of the book. Yes, I did.

SPEAKER_01 3:17

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 3:18

I listened to the audiobook um because I could not get the physical copy in time for us to start this. So our opinions of this book may be a little bit different. We may have different things to talk about regarding it. Um, but I typically read physical copies before ever listening to the audiobooks, but that just didn't happen this time.

SPEAKER_01 3:41

I mean, I generally read the books first before listening to them. Um, but generally, if I like the book as a physical physical copy, I'll read it as an audiobook. I didn't quite have time this time. Um, and let's also just say this was our first time reading this book for both of us. Um, I have never read this book before now. She had never read the book before now.

SPEAKER_00 4:04

I had actually never even read anything by this author before now.

SPEAKER_01 4:07

So I have not read anything by about this author either. Um, this book is a duet. There is a sequel to this book. I have not read that yet. Um I don't believe you've read it either.

SPEAKER_00 4:19

I've never read that one either.

SPEAKER_01 4:21

Um we're not gonna get into that book today because neither one of us read it, so it's kind of kind of hard to be talk talk about something we haven't read. Um but you know, one thing I do want to ask, you know, I know we're cousins, but you're the only one here with a brother.

SPEAKER_00 4:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 4:39

Who is blood related, so it is very different than what happened in the book. But being a little sister to a bigger brother, how did this brother-sister trope feel to read?

SPEAKER_00 4:53

It's it's awkward. Um, because this isn't the first, like either step sibling or foster sibling book that I've read, as you know, because we've read the same other book that I'm referencing. Um, it's always super uncomfortable, especially when the topics heavily focus on the little brother or the big brother, little sister thing. Yeah, it's really uncomfortable. Um it's weird. Um not that it's like I'm saying it's weird, and I know some people are into it. I know judgment, but being a little sister, it's a little strange to listen to the the play like that. A little strange. Yeah, it's a little strange. Um, it definitely is a different way to listen to it because you don't have any brothers, you just have to do it. I yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:43

So that's why I'm like, for me, it's like not that awkward to read because I don't have any brothers. But at the same time, it's like they're not blood related, which is what makes it okay. But like I've read books that are big brother, little sister, where they're step siblings, but weren't raised together. But these kids, the these kids, these two were raised together. I think that makes it a little different for me.

SPEAKER_00 6:12

I every time they mention like big brother, little sister, I got even more uncomfortable every single time.

SPEAKER_01 6:19

It was like a big cringe moment for me.

SPEAKER_00 6:21

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:22

Not the biggest cringe moment, not the biggest.

SPEAKER_00 6:25

We'll get into that topic a little bit later um when we get further into the discussion, but no, being somebody's actual blood-related little sister, I was uncomfortable reading it. I'm not going to lie to you.

SPEAKER_01 6:40

Yeah, I mean, if I if I kind of like disassociated the little brother, big sister or big sister, little brother, sorry. If I disassociated that from the acts of this sexual scenes, it was perfectly fine to read those. I just kind of had to like disassociate that a little bit.

SPEAKER_00 7:01

Yeah, yeah, no, I I agree with you. Um but I didn't hate it. I didn't hate the book, no. I actually really enjoyed the book. Um it was very depraved. It was incredibly depraved. Um it overall, I think it was a good book. And I would really love to continue reading, but or like read it for the first time again.

SPEAKER_01 7:24

Yeah, it's it's one of those books that I'm like, I'd read it again for the first time if I had that magic ability in my life. And I also cannot wait to read the second one, the way the first one ended and um the description of the second book. I am extremely looking forward to the second book.

SPEAKER_00 7:42

Yeah. Um see, I haven't even read the description of the second book, so that's kind of like on me for not doing that research. But I, you know, I'm really excited to see where they go with the relationship and everything that happens.

SPEAKER_01 7:56

I am too, like, especially with the way the book ended, of like this is the end, or is it? It's like, all right, now I have to know more. Yes, absolutely. I have to know more. Like it ended on a good note with the two of their them and their relationship, but I need more.

SPEAKER_00 8:17

I agree with you.

SPEAKER_01 8:18

I need more.

SPEAKER_00 8:19

It was a it was a quick read. Um, I will say that. Um, so what we're gonna do is we should start getting into some of our like discussion topics that we have. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 8:31

Go first. Sure. So, what was your favorite part of the book?

SPEAKER_00 8:36

My favorite part of the book, and this is gonna sound so deranged. My favorite part of the book is probably when Olivia was in the gas station and she was speaking with Adam, and he came in, Malachi came in and beat the living shit out of Adam just for talking to her. Just for talking to her.

SPEAKER_01 9:04

Honestly, that's a good part of the book. I think, however, my favorite part of the book is the corn maze.

SPEAKER_00 9:11

That's my okay. I'm I'm with you. I'm with you because that is probably my second favorite part of the book.

SPEAKER_01 9:18

I mean, like, if we're if we're getting into like sex scenes, like that is my favorite sex scene by far, but also like just the chase.

SPEAKER_00 9:28

The chasing, the everything involved.

SPEAKER_01 9:31

Like, she doesn't know that it's her brother. Like, she thinks it's some strange man that she just approached and started talking to her bike and was already willing to be chased by him.

SPEAKER_00 9:46

Like, I feel like that shows some sort of depravity in itself that she just met this man and is willing to let him chase her through a corn maze.

SPEAKER_01 9:55

But like, hot, attractive man.

SPEAKER_00 9:57

She's never seen his face.

SPEAKER_01 9:59

Yeah, but the body was hot.

SPEAKER_00 10:01

That's a good point. Because she saw him with the motorcycle, everything like that. She didn't see his, but she didn't see his figure either because he was fully clothed, because she he didn't want her to see his tattoos. So she literally approached a stranger and is just like, this is on. Yeah. You know, meet me here, we're gonna run through a corn maze together.

SPEAKER_01 10:22

And you know what? The fact that she was smart enough to take off her heels before booking it, I am so proud of her for that one.

SPEAKER_00 10:30

I I would never be in this kind of situation. Neither would I, but if I was ever in that situation, I don't believe I'd be able to take off the heels first. I wouldn't even think twice.

SPEAKER_01 10:40

I mean, I don't think I'd be in heels in the first place. No, I'd be but if I was, I mean, I do know how to run in heels, but like I still think I would make it so that I get caught. But again, fictional, hypothetical situation would never happen in our stay out of my real life.

SPEAKER_00 11:02

No, but my my point on the gas station thing is the possessiveness. I absolutely just adore when a main character like a male main character is that possessive.

SPEAKER_01 11:17

Even a female main character being possessive like that.

SPEAKER_00 11:20

When the female main character is possessive, but a badass possessive.

SPEAKER_01 11:25

I I'm just I love an I love a possessive person.

SPEAKER_00 11:30

Like, if you're so deeply in love, but even if you can't express that you're deeply in love with that person, just the acts of it, yes, it just it shines a little bit of light into it, even though it's very depraved and very dark. Oh yeah, that you are willing to go this far to hurt somebody just for speaking to the person that you love.

SPEAKER_01 11:48

Oh yeah, but I'm like at the same time, that that was kind of hot. It was kind of hot, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 11:55

Yeah, 100%. And she was turned on by that too. Yes, she even said it, so it couldn't have been that bad.

SPEAKER_01 12:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 12:03

All right, I'm gonna get my first question. I'm sorry, guys, it's on my phone. Do you believe that this book would have given you a book hangover?

SPEAKER_01 12:13

No, I don't get book hangovers very often. I I think just like the fact that there's a sequel and that I want to read the sequel so badly is the reason I don't have a book hangover over this.

SPEAKER_00 12:32

I I agree with you 100% because I have had really bad book hangovers. Before this book, I have not read an actual like new book in probably six months because I had such a bad book hangover.

SPEAKER_01 12:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 12:47

And this is kind of jumping me back into the genre and jumping me back into wanting to read more.

SPEAKER_01 12:52

This isn't a jump, this is a deep dive back into the genre.

SPEAKER_00 12:57

I went right off a cliff, it's fine.

SPEAKER_01 12:59

Yeah, we went we went right over the deep end with this being our our first book. But you know, the wheel chose.

SPEAKER_00 13:06

The wheel chose and it chose right. It did, it really chose it really did.

SPEAKER_01 13:09

I think this was the best book to start off with because it was smaller, so we could really like get into it. Um, but anyways, um what was your least favorite part about the book? The brother-sister thing. See, for me, it was the fact that her mother sold her virginity when we're talking.

SPEAKER_00 13:31

Do you have a question about least favorite and favorite characters? Yeah, I'm gonna discuss that more then. But my least favorite part of the book is probably the brother-sister thing.

SPEAKER_01 13:43

I also really hate the spider scene where she puts the spider on her face. Like, I don't like spiders, I'm not afraid of them, but I don't put one on me.

SPEAKER_00 13:55

I just don't like tarantulas, yeah, those freak me out.

SPEAKER_01 13:59

I'm sorry, but I don't think I could want sex if you had a spider on my face and then were creepily singing the it'sy bitsy spider to me.

SPEAKER_00 14:08

Listening to that part on audiobook, I loved that part, but I feel like it's a little bit creepier because you're making it up in your head when you're reading the book.

SPEAKER_01 14:17

But oh my god, it was oh, it was traumatic.

SPEAKER_00 14:21

Do you remember an elementary school, or did you ever have an elementary school when like the touring zoos would come around to the elementary schools and bring the tarantulas? Yes. I'm sorry. That's all I could think of because I was terrified of those things when they brought them.

SPEAKER_01 14:36

Keep keep spiders at a distance from me, or even better yet, behind glass. But the minute you take it out and approach me with it or put it on my body, all bets are off. All bets are off. I fuck that shit. I am not here for spider play.

SPEAKER_00 14:54

Look, in my relationship, I'm the one who kills the spiders. But if it was a tarantula in my home, I would just torch it down. No if, ands, or buts about it. I mean, yeah. Because there's no way I can just trample one of those.

SPEAKER_01 15:14

Oh god, no. No, I'm sorry, but they're creepy.

SPEAKER_00 15:18

They're a hundred percent creepy, and I I'm not here for those. But it added to the darkness of the book, I guess.

SPEAKER_01 15:25

Yes, it did, and like the rest of that scene, if you ignored the spider, was perfect.

SPEAKER_00 15:32

I do want to say though, with the spider, I wish they came up with like she came up with a better name for the spider, other than Spiky.

SPEAKER_01 15:41

Well, spiky was the first one. I don't think we ever met got a name for the second one.

SPEAKER_00 15:45

I don't think so, but I do believe there should have been a better name than Spiky for a tarantula.

SPEAKER_01 15:50

Yeah. It's just it it's so mundane for a for a tarantula name.

SPEAKER_00 15:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 15:58

But I do like his like dynamic of like why he loves tarantula so much.

SPEAKER_00 16:03

Yeah, I truly thought when I was listening to this book they weren't going to deep dive into his past. But I mean they didn't, but the fact that you know he had a spider under his bed, and that's why he locked away his voice because the spider was didn't talk. Right. But was powerful to him. Powerful in a way where it didn't need to. Exactly. So he locked away his own voice so that people couldn't take that part of him away.

SPEAKER_01 16:29

And honestly, that was it was such an emotional piece of the story that really made you understand so it really explains why like he is the way that he is, and and his love for his spider. Honestly, I hated the fact for him that they killed his first spider, Spiky. Yes, like that's tragic. I I get why they did it, but at the end of the day, it's his pet. And if you did that to like my cat or my dog, I'd be pissed too.

SPEAKER_00 17:08

I would never ever forgive the person who did that to any one of my cats. Oh god. Or one of my dogs. I'm not a spider person, but for the exotic pet lovers out there, I could not imagine losing your pet because somebody doesn't like your pet.

SPEAKER_01 17:22

Yeah. I mean, I I don't know if it had more to do with the pet or just him and wanting revenge on him.

SPEAKER_00 17:28

On Malik, yeah, for what he did to the dev. Yeah. Yep. Yeah. Okay, I get that though. Also, um, okay. My next talking point. Um, did this book make you want to read other books from the same author? Not Little Liar, which is the sequel, but just generally, does her writing style and this book in general make you want to read another one?

SPEAKER_01 17:51

Yes. I want to see what other psychopaths she can come up with.

SPEAKER_00 17:55

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 17:56

Because like Malachi is so psychotic.

SPEAKER_02 18:02

Yep.

SPEAKER_01 18:03

And I love him. I I deeply love him. Um, but I I want to know what other psychopaths she has out there in in her her book world, but I'm also wondering if she has any softer characters too.

SPEAKER_00 18:19

Yeah, I know I thought about that too. Like, I because for me personally, after a super dark book, I want to read something a little bit lighter, um, or something not as dark as what we read. Yeah. That's just a personal preference for me. And I would love to see what other worlds she creates, what other characters she can create. Because I loved the way that she did all the psychological. There was a lot of psychological psychological stuff in here, and I just I love that aspect of it. And I want to know more of what she can just make.

SPEAKER_01 18:56

Yeah, I I I don't know what else she has out there for books. I don't know if these were her first two, but it doesn't sound like they are.

SPEAKER_00 19:03

They're the writing is way too good to be her first.

SPEAKER_01 19:07

Honestly, I'm really excited to see, you know, what what else she has, and you know, maybe that's a book we'll explore further down the line of like what else she has to share with us because I'd love to know. Absolutely, absolutely. Leigh Rivers, we're here for more.

SPEAKER_00 19:23

We are here for more.

SPEAKER_01 19:25

Um, what was your favorite character, and what was your least favorite character, and why?

SPEAKER_00 19:33

Okay, I'm gonna start with least favorite because I kind of already talked about this. The mother is my least favorite character. The fact that she sold her virginity, was selling her to different families for power moves. What a bitch! Horrendous, truly just horrendous, and all of those guys I would put those guys as well, except for Adam. That's only because he was that's only because he was gay, yes, and he wasn't an asshole. No, he was just terrified. The man that she was supposed to marry at the end of the book. What was his name? Uh was it Xander Xavier? I think it was Xander. I don't remember. It was something along those lines. I wanna say it was Xander. I think it was in the epilogue.

SPEAKER_01 20:21

Yeah, I think it I think it was Xander.

SPEAKER_00 20:24

Either way, I did not enjoy him either. No. Because a man who will make you dye your hair a specific color.

SPEAKER_01 20:32

Yeah. I'm sorry, but you don't get to tell me how to look or how to dress.

SPEAKER_00 20:37

No, how to look, how to dress, speak when you're spoken to. No, not puppetry.

SPEAKER_01 20:44

I am too much of a strong-willed person to ever be okay with that.

SPEAKER_00 20:49

Yeah, and then the man who was bla Parker, the one who was blackmailing her saying, I'm gonna tell the entire world your mom gave me $5,000 to fuck you.

SPEAKER_01 21:02

All because he wanted him to get he wanted her to blow him and his friends. I'm sorry, but she was right to get Malachi involved and 100%, just the simple act of sending the location and he was there with his friends too.

SPEAKER_00 21:19

Yes, I loved that was amazing on his part.

SPEAKER_01 21:23

And like I loved that the like when they got home, the dad stood up for them, yeah. And even against the mom.

SPEAKER_00 21:31

Yeah, and literally thanked Malachi for helping for helping her and taking the bat and saying, I'm gonna handle this. Yeah, I that was probably the one of the best dad moments, yes, it in the book.

SPEAKER_01 21:44

Honestly, yes, I liked the dad, I did not hate the dad, he's not my favorite character.

SPEAKER_00 21:50

I had a love hate relationship with him. Yes, I did not like how he treated Malachi throughout the entire book, besides that part, because in the beginning. They did talk about how Malachi would be pulled into a study and he'd come out with bruises.

SPEAKER_01 22:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:06

I don't like that part.

SPEAKER_01 22:07

I don't know. I don't like that part. I like him towards the end and that little bit in the middle. Um, but in the end, after he was thrown down the stairs after being badly beaten by Malachi, he became a better dad. He became a way better dad after that. And honestly, like him telling her to go to him at the very end.

SPEAKER_00 22:28

And being willing to try to forgive Malachi just because Olivia loved him.

SPEAKER_01 22:35

Yes. And he just wanted his angel happy. Like, I I loved that.

SPEAKER_00 22:39

I think that was a win for dad at that point.

SPEAKER_01 22:41

Yes. Um, my least favorite character is Ulsa Mom for the same points of like selling her daughter and trying to control her daughter. And I'm sorry, but what DCF community would ever hand those two children?

SPEAKER_00 22:58

Yeah, I just knowing that. And how is she a judge selling your children? Yeah. I'm assuming that like the judicial system and DCF didn't know about all of this.

SPEAKER_01 23:11

They couldn't have. Like, even the dad didn't know about her being sold.

SPEAKER_00 23:15

Right. So I think Olivia really just kept all of that to herself and just didn't want anybody to know. Because she wouldn't even tell Malachi about that.

SPEAKER_01 23:24

I know. But imagine having to like go through your life hiding being sold just so that you don't have to leave your family.

SPEAKER_00 23:33

And disappoint your mother. Like just having that high. I love my mother. I respect my mother. If she tried to sew me, I don't think I would take it as well as Olivia did, or in the way that Olivia did.

SPEAKER_01 23:45

I would revolt. I would like pack up my things and leave in the middle of the night just to get away.

SPEAKER_00 23:50

I think this also kind of tight like tacks onto the point of the psychological thing as well, though, because Olivia had a family. She was taken from that family because of how badly the conditions in her home were. Yes. And she's placed with people who claimed to love her, treated her well, other than selling her, but treated her really well and treated her like family and way better than her originally, like her birth family did. So I think that's kind of where the psychological thing would come in, where she's like, I don't want to disappo disappoint the person who came in here and essentially saved me. And she even says that they saved me from that house. So I I think that also kind of ties into the way that Olivia reacted to that point.

SPEAKER_01 24:35

I mean, I do wish that we got a little bit more of Olivia's background than we did.

SPEAKER_00 24:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 24:39

Because we didn't get much of it. Like we got we definitely got a lot more of Malachi's background than we ever did of hers. And we still didn't get much. And we still didn't get much. Like I would really love to know a little bit more about their background so we can understand a little bit more of why they are the way that they are.

SPEAKER_00 24:55

100%. In this respect, what is your favorite character in this book?

SPEAKER_01 24:59

Uh my favorite character is Malachi.

SPEAKER_00 25:02

Okay, I see it.

SPEAKER_01 25:04

Honestly, he's protective of the one person that he cares about. He's very misunderstood. Like he's labeled a psychopath, but I don't think that's true. Well, fully because he he is able to love. He loves Olivia. And it yes, it's very possessive in that psycho way, but I'm sorry. I I love that he's just absolutely willing to do anything for her and to get her. Like he learned to speak for her, specifically for her.

SPEAKER_00 25:42

And he was learning the first word he wanted to learn was her name. And I think that's absolutely adorable.

SPEAKER_01 25:48

Yeah, and and like even when she decided to leave him, instead of giving up and going back to being mute, he decided to go to therapy and speech therapy to try and better himself to get her back.

SPEAKER_00 26:04

Yeah, well, was it really to get her back though, or was it just uh I'm gonna go to go?

SPEAKER_01 26:11

Well, I mean, it could have been both.

SPEAKER_00 26:14

Because I I don't really know if he did it to get her back personally, but at the same time, I think he also did it for her.

SPEAKER_01 26:22

Yeah, I could see it. Which I mean, not a lot of men will do, even normal men get the help that you need to be better for not only yourself, but the person that you love.

SPEAKER_00 26:35

I'm a firm believer that you shouldn't go and get help specifically for the person you love. No, I think you should always do it for yourself. But if you're also doing it for someone else, it's a big plus in my opinion. Yeah. But you should always do it for yourself first, please, if you're gonna go and get help. Yes. Not specifically for someone else.

SPEAKER_01 26:56

Firm believer in if you need help, ask for help, get the help. Um, but at the same time, like he let her her go. Like he gave he didn't have to. He didn't have to. He if he was a true psycho, like truly hell-bended kept her keeping her, yeah, he would have kept her against her will, but he let her leave.

SPEAKER_00 27:17

Which I think is a big step for him.

SPEAKER_01 27:19

Yeah, he kept cameras on her, but he let her go.

SPEAKER_00 27:24

He did let her go, and I do, I do think that was a big step for him. And honestly, listening to that part in the audio was crazy, like literally crazy. Cause just the depravity in his voice in the psychosis, it's a whole different experience, yeah. Which we'll we'll talk a little bit more on a little bit later.

SPEAKER_01 27:51

Who is your favorite character?

SPEAKER_00 27:53

This is I was trying to avoid answering this. Well, too bad. So I don't technically have a favorite character in this book.

SPEAKER_01 28:04

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 28:04

Um the reason being is I do really like the book. I really like the characters. I don't think I can have a favorite character in this book. I think I love Malachi. I do, but there's just some really big red flags in here, and it's just, I don't think I could make him a favorite with some of the things that kind of happened in this book.

SPEAKER_01 28:31

What about Olivia?

SPEAKER_00 28:34

Yeah, and I I do really like Olivia's character, but I don't think I could make her a favorite. I think it's just kind of the psychological torture that she just puts herself through bugs me. Like I would never I've never been in that situation that they've been in. I would never want to be in that situation. I never want to be in that situation, and I never will be in that situation. It's just when characters know what they want, but they psych themselves out of it over and over and over again because of public image, because of what others think, it makes me so upset.

SPEAKER_01 29:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 29:12

As a personal thing, it makes me upset. I do not like when characters do that, and that's all she did to herself. Yeah. So she was essentially just hurting herself over and over and over again.

SPEAKER_01 29:24

I mean, I can relate, not with anything that she ever did in the book, but um, like certainly not the relationship that she had. But I can understand like that fear of what other people think about you. It took me a long time to stop giving a fuck about what people think about me. But same so like I can relate to that, but at the same time, like I'm here for a strong, independent woman who don't give no fucks.

SPEAKER_00 29:51

Right. So I think that was kind of my thing of why I can't make her a favorite character in this book is because she didn't turn into she wasn't a strong independent woman, she was always concerned about what her mom thought, she was concerned about what her dad thought, keeping everybody happy. And like I like you said, you can relate to that on a level, I can relate to that on a level, wanting to keep everybody around you happy at the sacrifice of your own happiness.

SPEAKER_01 30:18

I mean, I think my favorite moment with her was her leaving him at the altar. Yes, like um Xander, like she first strong woman thing she does. Yes, yeah, and but at the same time, not all her decision because her dad told her to go.

SPEAKER_00 30:36

And her mom said it was okay.

SPEAKER_01 30:38

Yeah, her mom gave that nod.

SPEAKER_00 30:40

She waited for her parents to say it was okay and that they wouldn't be mad about it.

SPEAKER_01 30:45

But the fact that her parents said okay, knowing the situation.

SPEAKER_00 30:50

Yeah. I mean it was a big step for them. It was kind of a wake up.

SPEAKER_01 30:55

It was a big character development moment for almost everybody.

SPEAKER_00 31:00

Yeah. So I this is why I'm saying, like, I don't until I read maybe the second book, my views might change in the second book. But in this book, I can't say that Malachi is my favorite. I can't say Olivia is my favorite. The dad will never be my favorite, the mom will never be my favorite, and none of the men will ever be my favorite either. So it it's just uh I I don't think I have one at this moment in time.

SPEAKER_01 31:27

Yeah, I think I mean where it falls in like my other favorite books, he does not rank in my top ten of book boy friends. I'm with you. But he is he's special. He he is special, you know, in more ways than one. But not my not my top ten for book boy friends, but is up there on the scale of of good men for choices.

SPEAKER_00 31:58

Good men is a little bit relative, but we're I'm not talking the things that he does, because those aren't necessarily good. But but but yeah, no, I see what you mean. I really do. But again, like I just I don't think I could list him as a favorite. Makes sense. Or any of them as a favorite, to be completely honest with you. I'm sorry, I can't do it. Keep Luffy up in the background. Look at this man. This man would be the dumbest book boyfriend in the whole ad world. Okay, hold on. Oh, this is the question I wanted to get to. Oh god, okay. Okay. Were there any moments that made you laugh, cry, or cringe in this book?

SPEAKER_01 32:48

The spider made me cringe, like completely. I ugh spiders. Um laugh probably his insistence on needing teaching. And like when she kept being like, I think you've learned enough, and he's like, Teach me more. And I'm it's laughable. It's a little laughable, yeah. Especially when they've you know, one lesson should be enough, but they kept going. It stopped being lessons, and that to me was just very, very pretty laughable.

SPEAKER_00 33:26

Were there any moments that made you cry?

SPEAKER_01 33:31

No, but then again, it takes a lot for me to cry. That's fair. But I think if there were anything that would m get me was going back to the point where he like talked about his love of spiders and where that comes from and his backstory and that I think that would be the only thing that would be like cry worthy for this book. Otherwise, like I again, I'm not a big crier.

SPEAKER_00 33:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 33:59

So it's it's really hard to get me to cry.

SPEAKER_00 34:01

I think I've only cried during one book, and this was not it. Um, cringe worthy, I need to bring this up because okay. In the book, the scene where they're at the top of the staircase. I knew this was going up. This is what I cringe so hard at, and I got such bad secondhand embarrassment. When they were at the stop top of the staircase, and he ripped her pants off and threw them over the balcony. The second the dad came in holding the pants and walked to the stop top of the stairs and caught them at the top of the stairs. I paused my audiobook. I was on my drive home and I paused this audiobook because I was getting such bad secondhand embarrassment from this. I had to collect myself and start over.

SPEAKER_01 34:57

I mean, I can say I have never been caught by my parents. Never. But it's just the fact that he was like a feral beast and refused to stop. Refused.

SPEAKER_00 35:09

That made me even more embarrassed. He was seeing red. I understand the concept. It was very cringe in my like not cringe as in like it should have been removed from the book and not in there. Cringe as in like such secondhand embarrassment for them or for her in more of that aspect, because he didn't give a fuck.

SPEAKER_01 35:32

I mean, at least we can say, like, neither one of them are blood related to the parents either. So it wasn't as so it's not it's still bad the worst, because it's not like he's seeing something he created, but he's raised her since she was like what six or seven? Something like that.

SPEAKER_00 35:52

And yeah, it is it is quite awkward for it's incredibly cringe worthy. Yeah. And that was horrible. I was I was like I said, I paused my audio on my way home and I had to take a minute before I started the audio again.

SPEAKER_01 36:10

I mean, another big cringe moment is fucking her while she's like head resting on dad's chest as he's bleeding to death.

SPEAKER_00 36:20

Yeah, as he's bleeding to death on the floor and unconscious. That was also super cringy. I I will give you that. Um crying for this book, I had none. I I really had no instances where I would have cried in this book. Um laugh. I also don't think I laughed very much during this book either. It is laughable that he needed lessons.

SPEAKER_01 36:45

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 36:46

But I don't think there was a point where I'm like, this is actually really funny.

SPEAKER_01 36:50

No, and like I wasn't like laughing about the lessons, it's just it was a laughable concept that he needed the lessons in the first place, yeah. But like nothing about this book screamed comedy.

SPEAKER_00 37:04

There are some other dark romance books that I have read and you have read as well, that are comedic.

SPEAKER_01 37:09

Yes, yes that just have that quick comedic timing. But I think the characters in this book are just so stoic that there's really no quick whip with any of them.

SPEAKER_00 37:21

No, no.

SPEAKER_01 37:22

Um, which is okay, because like not all books have to have a quick whip. But like they're very depraved in this book.

SPEAKER_00 37:32

Incredibly.

SPEAKER_01 37:33

It is it is one of the more depraved books that I have read.

SPEAKER_00 37:38

Not the most. I don't think so, in my opinion. It like for me personally, it is not the most depraved one, it's not even in the top five.

SPEAKER_01 37:47

Not top five, but top ten.

SPEAKER_00 37:49

Maybe top ten, yeah, I'll give it top ten.

SPEAKER_01 37:51

Yeah. Um actually I already asked you that one. Um, so what do we think of like the story in general?

SPEAKER_00 38:06

The story as a whole is I I I really liked how it came together. I like the background of both the characters. I really like the just general psychological aspect of the entire book, because I feel like it was a really heavy topic in this book, and I really liked how it ended.

SPEAKER_01 38:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 38:31

And I really like that they left it off on that, is it really the end type deal? I because with the duet, I I just love when they do something like that.

SPEAKER_01 38:40

I like books that end like that, but when you end like that and don't give me a sequel, that's when we riot. Yes. But most people, most authors that leave off like that do a sequel, so that is appreciated from us readers.

SPEAKER_00 38:55

Very appreciated.

SPEAKER_01 38:56

Um I mean, honestly, I I agree. I also did really like the story. I do wish we got a little bit more into their background a little bit more. I think that would have added even more depth to the story, and hopefully we see that in book two. You know, I can't say that she doesn't do anything. I'm just hoping we get a little bit more in book two. Um, I agree. I like how the story came together. I think it came along really well.

SPEAKER_00 39:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 39:25

I think um, you know, it had that right amount of smut to not smut moments. I agree, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 39:34

And the tension that she builds throughout the entire book is really because she didn't just outright go with it.

SPEAKER_01 39:40

No.

SPEAKER_00 39:41

And the just the building of the tension and everything just kind of brought it all together.

SPEAKER_01 39:46

And honestly, like you could see from the very first moment that Malachi met Olivia that he was fascinated by her and wanted something more. Ran away with her in the airport, but I love that he like slowly built her ability to love him back.

SPEAKER_00 40:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 40:05

Um, more than just a brother-sister bond, you know?

SPEAKER_00 40:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 40:09

Like he he definitely is the reason that they're together because he definitely did push for it in a respectful way.

SPEAKER_00 40:17

In some cases, like he he pushed her boundaries. He 100% pushed her boundaries, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 40:24

But I think in some believe that if she said stop, he would have.

SPEAKER_00 40:28

I believe that as well. But I will say, like, I feel like it was a little bit of a manipulation.

SPEAKER_01 40:35

Oh, absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 40:37

Because when they were kids, the only way that he got her to kiss him was by saying, I'm your brother, I can kiss you.

SPEAKER_01 40:47

It's allowed.

SPEAKER_00 40:47

It's allowed because I'm your brother. That part was a little bit, I will say, a little cringe for me. Cause I'm like, that no, that's not a thing.

SPEAKER_01 40:57

Having siblings, I know that's not it's not a thing. It's not a thing with cousins either. Just saying. Just saying. Um, but like, yeah, I mean, it was definitely very manipulative. And I also don't love the way like he shuts her off, shuts her out.

SPEAKER_00 41:17

Oh, when he gets mad at him. When he gets mad, he won't talk to her for weeks at a time. I don't like that.

SPEAKER_01 41:22

But at the same time, like her stopping him from using his hands or turning away so she can't see him. It is also cruel on her part, too.

SPEAKER_00 41:31

Incredibly cool.

SPEAKER_01 41:32

Because when you have a mute character and you're gonna just stop their only way of communicating, that is honestly one of the rudest things that you could ever do to somebody.

SPEAKER_00 41:47

Um and he it's not like he could communicate and he just chose not to.

SPEAKER_01 41:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 41:55

Like he didn't know how to talk. No, like he shut his voice off a long time ago and didn't know how to pronounce the words. Yeah, like so he couldn't talk to her or communicate with her.

SPEAKER_01 42:05

So sorry.

SPEAKER_00 42:07

I stopped for a reason. In a way where like he had to use sign language to communicate with her, and the fact that she just kind of ignored him and could turn around, I just don't believe is fair.

SPEAKER_01 42:21

No, I don't think it's fair either. And like the fact that she wouldn't like, I'm not saying that if you suspect suspect someone of cheating on you that you should give them the time of day to listen, but at the same time, where you've known each other for most of your lives, maybe you should have given him the benefit of the doubt and hearing his side of the story before just automatically assuming you knew the truth. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 42:45

Because he already told her the date with Anna was over before it even started.

SPEAKER_01 42:50

Exactly, and that's why he wanted the lessons to start again with another girl.

SPEAKER_00 42:55

Yeah. But like you when he tells you it was their first date to begin with, and it was over before it started, and he ran away from that date, you're gonna believe Anna over Malachi. Yeah. And you didn't even ask him, you just heard a portion of gossip that she admittedly couldn't hear all of.

SPEAKER_01 43:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 43:19

Because it it was far away.

SPEAKER_01 43:21

Yeah. But you know, girls are girls.

SPEAKER_00 43:24

Girls are girls.

SPEAKER_01 43:25

I mean, boys do the same thing too, though.

SPEAKER_00 43:27

So it's it's just a miscommunication thing.

SPEAKER_01 43:31

And that's where communication really is important um with any relationship, friendship or boyfriend, girlfriend, or marriage, or whatever it is. You know, anytime you have some form of a relationship with anybody, communication, communication, communication. 100%. Um, because you know what they say when you assume you make an ass out of you and me. Um but I also loved the cuddling.

SPEAKER_00 44:01

Which part? I'm sorry. All of it. Like they couldn't. Oh, like growing up and stuff like that. Yeah. Like she would go to him when she had nightmares. And during storms, because she didn't and he didn't like the dark. And it was just so cute.

SPEAKER_01 44:16

And then you get so used to sleeping beside someone else that you can't do it without each other. Like, I know how that feels.

SPEAKER_00 44:23

100%.

SPEAKER_01 44:24

Um, but it's just like that is that that was a really cute moment. I do.

SPEAKER_00 44:30

I love those moments as well. Um do you think your view, and you're not lean over like that. Do you think your view of the book would be different if you listen to the audiobook versus reading it first?

SPEAKER_01 44:44

Oh 100%. Any anytime I read an audiobook first, which I don't normally do, I and then I go back and read the physical copy, whether it be on my Kindle or the paperback or hardcover, whatever, if I listen to it first, it changes my whole view on how the book is, because the punctuation, the you know, paragraphs, the whole communication of the story in general is so different from one version to another. I can only imagine how it was with this book where he was mute. I can personally say I have not read a book with a mute or deaf character.

SPEAKER_00 45:28

Yeah, me neither.

SPEAKER_01 45:29

As an audiobook. Um, but yeah, no, I think I think it would have been very, very different.

SPEAKER_00 45:39

Um, it was because I did the audiobook first. I know it's a little bit controversial with this audiobook. We're not gonna get into that topic, but I will say this that you know hearing the tone of his voice when he had those brief moments of like psychological breaks is amazing. Like the tone in that voice, and just feeling all of the like you feel like you can feel all of those emotions. And when you're reading the physical copy of it, you're just imagining those emotions and the way that he would say it and everything like that. I think it brought an entirely different vibe to the book. I really wish I read the physical copy before listening to the audio, but I will say the audio definitely gave me a different view on it, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 46:33

And like, what was it like with like the signing as an audiobook? Because like I know in the physical copy it's in italicized, so it's easy to really see like where he's communicating because he's not dialoguing, but he's speaking with his hands.

SPEAKER_00 46:54

So one thing I'm gonna say that I really liked about this audiobook um versus other audiobooks I've listened to is when it's the male's part to speak, the female voice actor isn't reading the parts in what she imagines the male voice to be. It's actually the male voice actor saying it.

SPEAKER_01 47:15

I love audiobooks that do that. I think all audiobooks that should do that.

SPEAKER_00 47:19

I do that.

SPEAKER_01 47:20

My opinion. I do it.

SPEAKER_00 47:21

But because it sometimes changes when you're listening to the female voice actor try and voice a male's voice. It makes me slightly uncomfortable, especially in like spicy scenes. I hope it kind of makes me break my concentration when I'm listening to it.

SPEAKER_01 47:40

I mean, I agree with that because like there are some female audio book readers that cannot voice male voices.

SPEAKER_00 47:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 47:52

Especially if there's an accent involved.

SPEAKER_00 47:55

Yes. And vice versa for male voice actors trying to do the female voice.

SPEAKER_01 48:01

Because some of them are so deep that it's so hard to go high.

SPEAKER_00 48:05

Yeah. So with the like sign language parts of the book, I will say I read or I listen at the 1.5 speed, which I know people listen faster than that. That's just my preference, so that I can get all the details and not miss any.

SPEAKER_02 48:23

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 48:24

But there were pauses in between every single word he signed, and it made it just feel a little bit choppy. Um, yeah. Sometimes I would get confused and I thought he was actually speaking, but then I'm like, no, wait, he doesn't he doesn't talk. He doesn't talk, he signs. And at least until the time skip, anyway. Yeah. So I will just say, like, I understand why they made it choppy like that, and why they did it in between every single one. Um, I did learn some sign language in high school, and I know that every single word is a different sign. Yeah, and I mean there are phrases and stuff like that that you can sign, and I think that's why they did it, but it just made it feel a little bit choppy in the audio version.

SPEAKER_01 49:14

Yeah, and I I I can see how that would make sense of like it being choppy, because it definitely wasn't choppy reading it, but then again, you're just reading it.

SPEAKER_00 49:22

Yeah, it's italicized, so it's not like punctuation uh after every single word because he's forming a sentence when he's signing.

SPEAKER_01 49:29

But knowing a little bit of sign language, like I could really picture like him doing the hand movements with her. And I I do have to say I loved that he would only communicate with her. A kicker. Unless he was pissed.

SPEAKER_00 49:43

Yeah. No, I do like that as well. I thought it was like a cute gesture, honestly. It was a really cute gesture. Well, that wipes out my question and your question. Yeah. So we're back to one of mine. Um, what is my next one? Do you think the psychological turmoil on the uh in this book added to the plot?

SPEAKER_01 50:03

Yes. I really do. I mean, the psychological turmoil was practically the whole book. Without it, there would not be those characters, like Olivia or Malachi, because they had so much psychological trauma separately that together it was just a crazy amount of trauma.

SPEAKER_00 50:34

And every time she thought about Malachi in a way that is perceived wrong for actual siblings, even though they're not actual siblings, and her saying, I'm sick, I'm sick, this is sick, like it really just added to the tension that built between them. And in a way that, like, when they're finally together and they're over the fact that they were raised together and not actual siblings, like it it made it that much sweeter when they were actually able to get past it.

SPEAKER_01 51:07

And I mean, like, honestly, her being able to like get past that ideal, I think is only okay in the sense because they're not actually related. Yes. But like you said, like the her comments of like, I'm sick, I'm sick, I'm sick, and he never thought that way.

SPEAKER_00 51:26

I think there was a mention of it one time, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 51:29

Um, but it it just it really played into their dynamic of friends to lovers, if you think about it.

SPEAKER_00 51:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 51:38

Um, which isn't a bad trope, but like this took it to a whole nother whole nother level where they were raised together.

SPEAKER_00 51:45

Yeah. Yeah, because what she was she was six, he was eight. Or she was seven, he was eight. Yeah. When he came into the family.

unknown 51:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 51:56

No, it definitely, I think, played a big part in how this entire story came to be at the very end.

SPEAKER_01 52:04

There is no little stranger without the psychological torment and torture.

SPEAKER_00 52:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 52:10

It there really isn't.

SPEAKER_00 52:11

It's in their own heads.

SPEAKER_01 52:13

Yeah. And even played out by the mom, too, and the dad.

SPEAKER_00 52:19

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_01 52:21

Um, I do like the addition of the little sister, though.

SPEAKER_00 52:24

She was so she was great. The fact that she's just so sassy. And screw this wedding. Who wants ice cream? I say we go get ice cream. Like, I loved that part, I will say.

SPEAKER_01 52:38

That is peak little sister behavior.

SPEAKER_00 52:41

Little sister. I don't have a little sister, but if I had one, I would want her to be like her.

SPEAKER_01 52:44

I do not have a little sister either, but being the little sister, peak little sister behavior.

SPEAKER_00 52:49

And she was like, I never like this guy anyway. Like, you go, you know. You, you know, and no judgment that Olivia was in love with Malachi.

SPEAKER_01 52:59

No, and and I mean she didn't get to see their dynamic because she was not in the house when they were together. But like, just the stories that she heard and like the vanilla stories she heard. And she's like, go for it.

SPEAKER_00 53:14

Go get him. No judgment on my part. Go get him, go be with him. And I was like rooting for that little sister. I loved that.

SPEAKER_01 53:22

I hope nothing bad happens to her in the second book, and I might be very upset if something does.

SPEAKER_00 53:27

That would probably be cryworthy if anything happens to that little sister.

SPEAKER_01 53:30

Yeah. Little siblings and pets are my big big sad.

SPEAKER_00 53:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 53:37

Big sad.

SPEAKER_00 53:38

I won't, I will not watch movies if an animal dies.

SPEAKER_01 53:42

If I know that an animal's gonna die, I'm not gonna watch it. That's why I have a very hard time watching Marley and me.

SPEAKER_00 53:49

I've never watched it. There's a reason for that.

SPEAKER_01 53:52

I watched it before I knew that everything happened, anyways. Um I feel like we already answered that question. Which question? Is there anything we wish was touched on more?

SPEAKER_00 54:07

Yeah, because we we both really want them to touch more on their past. Yep. I think we did actually kind of go through that a little bit.

SPEAKER_01 54:14

Yeah. Um, so I'm gonna skip that one. Do we think he's too psycho or just the right amount of psycho? Um because there is such a thing as too psycho for me in a character.

SPEAKER_00 54:30

I I don't think he's too psycho, no.

SPEAKER_01 54:36

Neither do I. I think he's I think he's the right amount of psycho.

SPEAKER_00 54:40

I have read about more psychotic characters than Malachi. And I didn't even blink a fucking eye.

SPEAKER_01 54:47

Oh god, no.

SPEAKER_00 54:48

So, or bat and eye, is that the expression? Bat and I. I don't even bat an eye at those ones. Yeah. There, like I said, there has only been one one real book that has make made me like need to stop and take a break. This doesn't even come close to that.

SPEAKER_01 55:03

No, and I I don't know if it's because it's a shorter book that it doesn't get enough psycho moments, and it doesn't go into like the harsh detail. Yeah, I mean, it's very descriptive, yes, but honestly, I think he's the right amount of psycho, the right amount of protective, yeah, um, the right amount of possessive.

SPEAKER_00 55:31

I'm in a hundred percent agreement with you. Yeah. Yeah, like I I really don't think he was overly psycho in the book. Like, yeah, he had his moments, but I don't think they were super deep. I don't think they were like crossing a line.

SPEAKER_01 55:49

I think the most fucked up psychotic moment he had as a character was the going red and attacking his father while eating out his sister.

SPEAKER_00 56:02

So I think this gets into one of my conversation pieces as well. And it's at what exact moment, if any, did the relationship cross from dark but fictional into is this too far?

SPEAKER_01 56:17

I if there's one moment that might have been too far, and I'm not saying it was, because for me it wasn't, but for some people it might be, was the fact that like they were angry fucking, basically. I mean, like, not yet, but like orally, anyways, yeah, angry fucking at the top of the stairs when the dad comes home and he tries to pull them off, and then they just start going at each other and then fucking her over on top of his dying body, his dying body, yeah. I think if any, that would be the moment that it could go far.

SPEAKER_00 57:03

Yeah, it could have crossed a line again.

SPEAKER_01 57:06

In the fictional worlds that I read, that is not the farthest I've seen things go. Not the most fucked up thing I've seen. But I will say that if there were any moment for people that it would cross a line, it would be that one.

SPEAKER_00 57:24

Absolutely. Yeah, where it's like, this is dark, but it's fictional, but that could have definitely crossed the line for a lot of people.

SPEAKER_01 57:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 57:32

And I could I could see why it would.

SPEAKER_01 57:34

But like going like the eight years into the future when he's released from prison after that ordeal and hearing his side of that story, I think kind of helps break it down a little bit.

SPEAKER_00 57:47

Yeah, it helps kind of like mellow the situation.

SPEAKER_01 57:50

And the fact that he that dad didn't die also helps.

SPEAKER_00 57:54

He's in a wheelchair for life.

SPEAKER_01 57:56

But he's not dead. He's not dead, and he's willing to try and forgive Malachi, which I think is a really big step, because honestly, like I don't think I could.

SPEAKER_00 58:06

I don't think I could. I couldn't forgive somebody who did that to me.

SPEAKER_01 58:10

No. But just like that, that might be like the one scene that goes too far.

SPEAKER_00 58:16

For yeah, for definitely for some people, I could see why it would go too far. Yep.

SPEAKER_01 58:20

Not for me though. I have no I've read worse.

SPEAKER_00 58:26

How many more questions do you have? One. Oh, do you want me to do some of mine? Because I think I have three. Hold on.

SPEAKER_01 58:32

Yes, and I think I only have one left because we've kind of like gotten into the topics during other questions. Oh, the questions are no longer.

SPEAKER_00 58:42

Honestly, I think we've gone over a lot of my questions as well. Um because we went over that one. We went over that one. We did go over that. So I have one. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 58:58

So you're turned out. Okay. Was this a good read? Yes. I agree. I I wouldn't say it was my favorite read because I definitely have other favorites, which we will discuss in later episodes. But it it was a really good read. I mean, I sat down and read it in six hours.

SPEAKER_00 59:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 59:19

Which also came with distractions, so it's not like it was a straight six hours. Um, but I I sat down and I read it in a day, and that like I only do that with good books. If it's not a good book and it doesn't draw me in, like, I'm not gonna sit there and read it all day. But I do like how she set the book up if like the first half of the book was all Olivia's point of view and the different ages. Yeah, and like she her describing the different ages, and I liked that the second half of the book where Malachi actually starts to talk a little bit, was all in his point of view. And then you also got to see him like kind of backtrack and talk about his point of view from his earlier years without you know, kind of like fully flashbacking. Um, I think it was a really good way to set up the book and tie the story all together.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:18

Yeah. Yeah, I think it was a I really liked the read. Um, I would really love to just jump into the second book, um, but I'm gonna wait and buy it and read the paperback before I listen to it this time. Um I do the only like thing I have to say is I really wish it wasn't all about the brother-sister Diamond Amic the whole time because it did make me super uncomfortable. But you know, that's the book I signed up for, and I kind of knew that that's the relationship they had going into this book when we decided to read it. Um, but me personally, like it did make me super uncomfortable, yeah. And I kind of wish it didn't revolve uh solely uh around that dynamic.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:05

Which is why I'm looking forward to the next book because based on the description on the back of the book, it is not all about the brother-sister dynamic. Perfect. Um, so I'm super looking forward to that. Um I do really like this book. I I would love to know what else she has in other worlds and other other things. Because honestly, she's a good author just based on this one book alone. And I I would love to get some more from her.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:41

Absolutely. I'd love to explore her other books and her other series if she has them. I really don't know. I haven't looked at this author very much. Neither have I. Um, we kind of answered my last question as well with this. Your last question. That was all of our questions. Unless you have anything else to bring up from this book.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:57

Not that I can think of. Daddy, how about you?

SPEAKER_00 1:02:00

She's snoozing. Snoozing. Well, uh honestly, if you guys have any different opinions from anything we brought up, we would love to hear it. Please leave comments on our Instagram or on our Facebook page.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:13

But again, be respectful. We are not professional book reviewers. This is a hobby.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:19

Yep. A hobby because we love books.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:23

Um, please don't come at us for anything we said. Again, everybody is entitled to their own opinion. If you don't like it, you don't have to be involved in this community.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:34

Yeah, but we want to have a discussion with everybody. We want to know your opinions, your views on everything. You can go in and answer the questions that we talked about. Or if you have additional questions that you'd like to bring up as a topic, please put them in our comments. Absolutely. Let us know what you want to know or what you think our opinions are in different aspects of this book.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:54

And if you guys have any recommendations on other books, definitely, yeah, definitely let us know. Um, but yeah, no, we just want everybody to be happy reading books and be mentally comfortable reading books, which is why we do the trigger warnings. Um and yeah, like we we have our own opinions on this book. If you don't agree with these opinions, that's okay with you. Um, but we would love to know what your thoughts are on this book. We would love to know if you guys want to answer these questions. We can post our questions on our social medias as well so that you guys can answer them on your own.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:35

Um and let us know if you want to do a live as well. Oh, yeah. We are more than happy to do that with you guys so that we can answer your questions that you have regarding the books or anything that is on our TBRs and just talk about books and have a good time. We would love to do that with you guys.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:53

Absolutely. And next episode, we are going to be discussing Heartless Heathens by Santana Knox.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:03

I am so excited for this book. I have already personally read it. Heather hasn't been.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:07

I have not.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:08

Um, I read this over the summer while we were in Canada. So Oh, yeah, that's the one that you told me to read while we were up there. Yeah. We were up there for a funeral, and this is this is what I was reading the whole time we were in Canada. Um, so I am going to read off the trigger warnings. If you don't want to sit here and listen to this gigantic list, please just go look it up yourself before getting this book. Um, it does have heavy topics of religion, so if that's something that you're not interested in, just skip to the next book after that. So the content warnings, and this also has potential spoilers, and when we speak about this book, there will be spoilers. Um there's explicit language, death of parents, history of trauma, murder, gruesome deaths, suicidal thoughts, traumatic adoption, coerce, attempted suicide, feelings of panic from trauma, fictional occultism, Christianity, non-consensual drug use, anti-Christian rhetoric, uh horrific situations, political issues reminiscent of our current time, child abuse, neglect, fictional satanic worship, vomiting, disembowelment, dismembering, drowning, strangling, body mutilation, explosion, and bomb threat. Then into the sexual trigger warnings. There is group sex, sexual asphyxiation, non-consual, consensual sexual acts, dubious consent, physical assault, sexual assault, coercion, unprotected sex, light degradation, birth control, blood play, knife play, stretching, fisting, DVP DP, and incestuous situations. And the author also says, screw it, content warning for too many Tolkien references. So if you don't like Tolkien references, not the book for you.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:58

Just the Tolkien references, though. Just the Tolkien references. That is that is quite a list.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:04

It's a really big list. Like I said, if you did not make it through that whole list, because there is a lot, um, please look it up yourself before starting this book.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:13

Yes. Um, definitely don't want you guys to be a part of an episode that you're not comfortable with based on the contents of the discussion.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:25

Um please read what you're comfortable reading and skip the ones that you are not comfortable reading about or talking about after reading it. It's entirely up to you and your personal preference and what's going to make you feel safe.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:37

Yeah, we we've both definitely read books with very similar topics. And if you've if you notice um through as the episodes go on, most of the books that we read have very similar content and trigger warnings. Not always the same, but at least very similar. Very similar. Um, that is why we are a dark romance podcast. Yeah, we are here to discuss the dark romance side of things. Um but, anyways, that is the Sinful Shelf.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:13

Thank you so much for watching with us and listening.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:16

Yes. Thank you so much. Goodbye, duty. Goodbye. Goodbye, all, and we will see you next episode.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:23

Thank you all again for listening. Don't forget to follow us on our social medias for episode updates.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:29

You can find us on Instagram at the Sinful Shelf Podcast, Facebook, The Sinful Shelf, X at the Sinful Shelf, TikTok, The Sinful Shelf Podcast, and Threads, the Sinful Shelf Podcast.