I had everything I dreamt of. And felt completely empty | Joly Tematio

She built the career everyone wanted. And collapsed on a client call at 5pm.

Joly Tematio had the title, the income, the life that looked perfect from the outside. She was a Black immigrant woman in Germany, working in finance, climbing the ladder, proving herself every single day.
And then her body said enough.

In this episode of Legacy Talks, Joly takes us somewhere most interviews never go. Before the business. Before Germany. To a 12-year-old girl in Cameroon who was told her dreams did not pay well enough.
We talk about:

The moment she knew success was empty
What it actually feels like to build alone in a foreign country with no safety net
Why she collapsed on a Zoom call and what changed after
How she rebuilt her business and her life at the same time
What she wants the next generation of women to know
This is not a business story. This is a story about what it costs to become yourself.

I am Katarzyna Krawiecka, founder of Legacy Architect. I help entrepreneurs and leaders turn their life story into a book before it disappears.

If this conversation made you think about your own story, or someone you love, I can help.

Start here: https://legacyarchitect.net/

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Ladies and gents, there is a version of success that looks perfect from the outside. The title, the clients, the income, the life people point to and say, She made it. My guest today had that and she was built more from it every single day alone in a country that wasn't hers, in an industry that wasn't built for her, carrying everything on her back because she had too much to prove, to tell, to let everything fall. And then one day, on a call with a client, her body said, enough, not loudly, just quietly and completely. That moment didn't break her. It built her into who she is today. I created legacy talks because I believe that the most important stories are the ones nobody asks about. The ones that live underneath the success, underneath the titles, underneath the highlights of newspapers and reels. I read everything Jolly shared with me before this conversation. And I sat with it. Because this is not a business story. This is a story about what it costs to become yourself when the world around you is not sure if you'll make it. Jolly Tematio. Welcome to Legacy Talks.

SPEAKER_01 1:27

Thank you so much for having me, Kasha. I'm honored to be in your podcast. Thank you for inviting me.

SPEAKER_00 1:33

Thank you. Thank you very much for trusting me with this. I I truly, truly appreciate it. Um Jolly, you have done a lot of interviews. I'm not going to ask you the same questions. I want to go somewhere most people have not taken you. Before the business, before Germany, before everything. Who were you in Cameroon? And what did you carry with when you left?

SPEAKER_01 2:00

That's a beautiful question. Who I was in Cameroon, I grew up in a very traditional household. My mom was a stay-at-home mom and my dad was the main the main provider of the house. And I grew up with that understanding that, you know, studying, being the best at school was the only way for me to succeed. I come from a family of four girls, so my parents were really particular about really allowing us to understand that, okay, if you want to succeed in life, we need to be the best at school and get in in a corporate world. Um so I grew up with that instilling me very, very young. I remember when I was probably 12 years old. Um I was talking with my dad about what I wanted to do when I grew up. And I said, you know, I want to be on TV, I want to, because I was really fascinated by people that I was saw on TV, like journalists and interviewers. And I was I want to be in on TV. And he was like, you know what, darling? That's not, that's that doesn't really pay well as a career. I would really advise you to go into finance because that's more secure. Those are what the richest people are coming. That's the way the most successful people are coming from. So go into finance and accounting. I was like, okay, yeah. He said, absolutely. So I said, okay, I'm gonna be the best accountant, the best financial analyst in the world. And it really carried me that that instilled in me at 12 years old. And I realized later on that I was like, that's where my definition of success came from. I wanted to make my parents so proud because I saw my my mom sacrificing her dream to be a stay-at-home mom and you know raise us. And I saw my dad really working really hard to provide for our household. And for the longest time, I was like, I want to be the best at school, I want to achieve because that's where I felt like I was seen, I was applauded, I was I felt like I was contributing by being the best I could be. So that's what kind of my childhood growing up in Cameroon before before traveling abroad, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 3:53

That's amazing because your parents gave you the confidence to to be the best you can be. And yeah, so that that's incredible. Jolly, you described the moment you decide to leave your career as quiet and terrifying. Not loud, not dramatic, just quiet and terrifying. I want to stay with that because most people imagine that the biggest decisions of their life feel like lightning, like certainty, like a sign. Was there any certainty? Or was it just a voice you had been turning the volume down for a long time?

SPEAKER_01 4:31

That's that's a good question. I I would say there was no certainty at the at that moment, but there was definitely a voice that I had tried to ignore. I remember when I started my first corporate job, like full-time in 2018. It was my dream, you know, from 12 years old to being like 20, mid in my mid-20s and starting my work. I was like, yes, I've made it. This is what I my parents are so proud of me. I'm so proud of myself. I made it literally. And even with that first job, I remember thinking, oh my gosh, this is like just going, like the routine, going to work every day, doing the same things. I remember after six months, I was already falling out of love and feeling out of place. And I just thought myself, you know, you just push through. That's just because I'm new to the corporate life. And I spoke with my friends and my family members, and they were all like, you're gonna get used to it. It's just you go through it and you get you get fine. And after one year and a half in that company, I was like, the feeling is still there. I don't feel quite at ease. I my soul is earning for so much more. And at the time, it felt like I just want to make more money. I just feel I need to make more money. If I had a job that was paying me more, I'll be more fulfilled. So I said, okay, let me skill up, let me change career, uh, let me get more degrees and all the things. And I moved into a different city a couple of years later. I had a way bigger paycheck, I had all of the benefits, nice office, nice, all, nice old things. But after a couple of months, the feeling came back. And I thought to myself, you know what, this is not about money, it's about something deeper. And it really forced me to stop and ask myself, okay, Jolie, if nothing changes, because at that point I started really considering personal development, you know, going through mastermind online courses and things, things like that to really increase my income. And it really allowed me to work on my mindset. So I had to stop and ask myself, okay, if nothing changes, will you be happy with the life that you've designed, that you've created? Because if you just keep on doing the same things over and over again with this feeling within you. And the answer was no, absolutely not. I need to change something. And I remember specifically one night I was in the office with my boss. We were working on a project, it was like 10 p.m. And it was just a normal day at the office for us. It was a Tuesday night, half past 10 p.m. We're working, and there was some night where I would leave the office at 11 p.m. at midnight because you know I was like a junior manager on a run to be a senior, so a lot of responsibility, a lot of proving that I deserve to be there. So I was working really hard. And I was just sitting there with him, and he was, you know, a married man in his late 40s with a wife and two kids at home. And my goal was to become like him, you know, grow up in a, you know, climb the corporate ladder, become a manager, a senior, a VP. And for him, it was just like what you do. And I just asked myself, okay, if that's the price I have to pay, um, if my ambition has to cost me my family life, I don't want it. I don't want to be 40 and having to be at work at 10 p.m. because I'm chasing the next thing that I don't want my life to be like that. And it was really hard for me. I felt like I lost my identity in that moment. And that was kind of the frightening part because I was like, who am I? For the for the past 15 years, I thought this is what I was supposed to be doing. And now I'm I have whatever I dreamed of, and I feel so empty on the inside. What's next? So I had no certainty about what the next chapter would look like, but I had that inner knowing that I didn't want to keep on living the same life, that I had to take a different decision and different actions if I really wanted to create a life that was really aligned with my deepest joy and my deepest fulfillment. And you know, that's what it looks like at the moment. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 8:16

And what was the thing that you were most afraid of? Not in general, specifically, what was the thing that kept you at night before you made that decision?

SPEAKER_01 8:26

I think my big I don't think actually my biggest failure my entire life was to disappoint my parents. And because, you know, they've given so much for me and my siblings, and I always wanted to make them proud. And when I considered changing career, I felt like I would just be a biggest disappointment to the entire family because they had invested in me to go to the best schools and get the best trainings, and they had sacrificed so much for me to have the life I had built at the time. And I felt like just going vogue and doing something different would be like they've had done all of those things for nothing, and everything that I had worked so hard for was had become useless. So it was for me was like, I'm gonna be the black sheep of the family, I'm gonna lose the love that I had worked so hard to earn. Um, and that terrified me for a long, long time, to be honest. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:15

Yeah, just fear of feeling of being rejected by the people who gave you the most.

SPEAKER_01 9:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:21

Is something I can I I totally understand. I really do. Johnny, when you took the leap, what did the closest people say to you?

SPEAKER_01 9:34

They thought I was crazy. They all said you shouldn't do this, it's just it doesn't make sense. Why would you sacrifice certainty, a beautiful life that looks perfect from the outside, to go into the void? It it like no one really understood, um, which made it really hard because I wasn't really able to articulate what I was wanting to create because it was a feeling and a deeper knowing. And it's hard to paint a picture when you don't quite know what you are building. So it made it even harder for me because those are people that I would really seek approval in the past. And so feeling like they understood was important to me, and I didn't get that from them. They were more like, you shouldn't do this, it doesn't make sense. Do you even realize what you are risking, what you're leaving on the table. My my dad was like completely shocked. My mom didn't get it, and so they were not understanding. And I believe that looking back now, it's not because they didn't want to support me, it's just because they were so scared about, you know, I'm an immigrant, I'm in a foreign country, I'm I was single at the time, so it's like you are leaving all of that safety net to go into the void and no one is there to back you up if something happens. Like uh, why are you doing this to yourself? So that's also where the the I think this the fear came up and they kind of projected along to me, and yeah, that's what they said basically.

SPEAKER_00 10:58

I sense that the hard hardest part wasn't the work of fear of failing. It was the loneliness. You mentioned that building in a country far from home, far from anyone who really understood what you were attempting, not network, not safety net, culture shock every single day.

SPEAKER_01 11:20

Yeah, yeah, loneliness. I would say definitely that's that you literally hit it on the nail because that's huge. I'm not even going to going to downplay that. I'm a natural infovert person, and I've initially going in. I thought, you know what, I'm going to be my own boss. I'm gonna have my own hours to work on my own time, it's gonna be so much fun. Which he was it was until it wasn't, but yeah, there's a deep loneliness, especially because the work that I do, I work with clients internationally, so I don't really get to meet my client face to face, it's more like we are mostly in a visual environment. So it's quite lonely, and I had to grapple with that loneliness for a long time. And you know what the thing for me that had made the journey easier that I wish I had known looking back, and I only came to realize that like one year ago, five years into entrepreneurship, is that when you become an entrepreneur, you have to become your biggest cheerleader. You have to become your biggest best friend, your biggest supporter, because you are building something and no one is gonna be there to cheer you on. No one understands what you are building, and there are gonna be so many days and nights and months where you are building in silence. Uh, and so if you are not your best friend, if you are if that voice inside of you is not the most supportive, the most encouraging ever, it's gonna be even more lonely. And for the longest time, for me, it felt even lonely because you know, when you are when you have a corporate job, you have colleagues, you have a boss that tells you, good job, that's amazing. I love what you created there. You have colleagues that say, Oh my god, I'm impressed by what you've done. Um but you when you are an entrepreneur and you're starting from scratch, there's no one clapping batting you on the back, saying, Oh, you've gonna you've done a good job today. And so if you are like myself, like type A person, very perfectionist, wanting everything to be really good, you tend to kind of beat yourself up a lot. And you feel like, oh, this I could have done that better, and this could have been better, or that I made a mistake there, or am I why am I doing this? So it's like so much negative self-talk that makes the journey even more lonely because now there's no one supporting you on the outside, there's no one confratulating you, but also on the inside, it's like that negative self-talk that so you it doesn't it doesn't really help. And I wish I had done that sooner. Um, it would have helped me with the loneliness chapter. And for me, also having a team after a couple of years, after my second day in business, really helped because now I was like, okay, I'm not carrying this load alone anymore. I have incredible human beings that are sold into the vision, shop every single day to help me push this thing forward, and that helped. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:50

I asked you this question because I know what it feels like to build something far from home, far from everyone who at least try to understand. And as you mentioned, you had to be your own cheerleader because you were doing something from your from your heart, because you felt that you want things haven't driven by purpose, and that person wasn't understood because people could see as success, not your emptiness. Julie, what does kind of loneliness actually feel like? Not not the version you tell on stage, the real one at the end of the day, on the when it's when you have a very hard day and when there's nobody to call who truly gets it.

SPEAKER_01 14:36

So that's a really good question. It you know, it feels like you are just sometimes it feels like you're crazy, sometimes it feels like you are chasing smokes, sometimes it feels like you are going to drive yourself insane. Because you are, I feel like building a successful business is like giving birth in some way or getting pregnant, because you have this idea that you want to bring into life, and there are so many things that you go through internally that no one's on the outside can even fathom. Because on the outside, you look, oh, she's doing good, she's she's glowing from the from the pregnancy, everything must be going good. But you have you are going through so many things internally, and that sometimes you just think, okay, I'm not gonna share it because I don't want to feel like it's too much or I'm oversharing. So for me, that loneliness felt like I don't know what the next step is. There's a lot of uncertainty. I don't know if I'm even in the right niche or the right industry. I don't know if I have what it takes to pull this off. I don't have any answers, and I had to really sit with myself because there's you know, I've worked with coaches and mentors, but there's always some things that you have to figure out by yourself and by doing. And what how I overcame that loneliness was really to just pray. And I remember to just be like, God, lead me. I I don't know the answer. I'm not gonna try to figure this out because I can't. I'm a control freak by nature, and I always want to have like a perfect plan and all the ducks in a row, but I just felt like, you know what, God, I believe that this vision is not even mine. You've put the vision inside of me. So I trust that you're gonna have, you're gonna guide me every day. You're gonna give me the insights, you're gonna give me the strategies, you're gonna give me the confidence, you're gonna give me the certainty in the midst of uncertainty to move forward. So that really allowed me to show up every single day with more confidence, with more poise, because I know what I'm building is so bigger than me. And when I say it's bigger than me in the sense that the impact that I'm called to have is not just for me, it's for other people as well. The work that I'm doing is bigger than me because I help people have a bigger impact in their own capacity. And I just like to believe that it's not by my own strength that I do what I do. I like to believe that I have kind of someone behind me which who is God, like a that deeper, all-knowing force of the universe that's pushing me, that's guiding me, that's instructing me, and having that as a partner. Like I mean, I'm I'm in partnership with God, basically, you know. So when I feel really lonely, when I feel lost, I just go in, I meditate, I journal, I ask for guidance, I ask for divine guidance. I'd be like, okay, I'm stuck here. What's the next best steps? And I just sit sit still and I just listen or journal, and the answer they always show up, and I'm so grateful for that. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 17:31

That's very brave what you said, because admit like when we surrender to higher power instead of knowing we know it when we know everything, and there's a moment when you feel that, oh gosh, what's what's going to do now? And I think what you said, Johnny, gonna have a lot of conversations. I think this is the moment where people start having breakthrough and they start seeing the situation from completely different uh path. Because, as you said, your partnership with God, so that whatever happens will lead you to whatever it needs leads you to, even if it doesn't if it's not in your imagination, it will lead you somewhere where you you will give the biggest impact because it's driven by by your faith and and work as well. Was there a day when you almost believed that people who said you were you were mad were right and you made a mistake with all this?

SPEAKER_01 18:33

Yeah, actually there were several days like that, um especially at the early stages of entrepreneurship when you are don't really when you're not really sure about where you are going and when you don't have that confidence and you're just figuring things out. I remember losing my first client early in the business, and at the moment I had at the time I just had like three clients, and that was one of my biggest clients that I lost. And it was quite unpredicted. Uh, I didn't see it coming. And at the time I was still, and it's funny because sometimes you launch the business and you say, Okay, my I am I am my own boss, but you are still operating like an entrepreneur, like an employee. So at the time I had the business running, but I was still very operating pretty much like an employee, to be honest. And so I lost that client and I it completely broke me. I felt like I was not good enough, like I was not cut to do this, like what am I even doing? Never gonna be able to pull this off. People, my family were right. What did I get myself into? So it was the whole thing. And I had like a complete mental breakdown. And I remember speaking with my mentor at the time, and I was told him, you know what, I've just been going through a mental fog because I've lost one of my biggest accounts and I don't know what to do next. And I'm questioning everything. And he just said, Jolie, that's he just looked at me and he just smiled and he said, Do you know how many clients we lose every month? I was like, then he was like, we lose about like three to five clients every month. That's just you just have to focus on doing the best that you can do and know that people that are meant for you to work with you are gonna stay. Some of them you're gonna lose along the way. Think about your own purchasing behavior. You don't stay with the same brand for your entire life. Sometimes you switch brands, not because the one that you were using is fundamentally wrong, but because you just want to try something else. So allow yourself to realize that you can do the best that you can. And what the client says is not a reflection of your world because I had my world so linked into my work, and my self-fought was actually coming from how much money I was making, how much client I had. And so losing that big account was kind of made me question everything. So having that perspective shift from him really allowed me to collect myself and keep on going. Yeah, but that was definitely a moment where I was like, oh my gosh, I'm not gonna be able to pull this off. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:42

Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 20:44

You're welcome. Thank you for your asking really, really good questions. Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 20:48

I'm trying, I'm really trying because I I thought, you know, I want to ask you questions that will get your get your story in the way that you can see your journey. On your form, you wrote about the call. So you were working, doing everything, carrying everything alone, and your body said, no, I don't I don't want to skip this moment because I think it's the most important moment in the whole story. Jolie, what do you remember about that?

SPEAKER_01 21:24

I remember quite vividly. That was in 2021, in April of 2021, and I was working with a client. In that season, I was still doing everything by myself, one year and a half in the business, or one year, four months in the business, I was still doing everything by myself because I just thought, you know what, I'm gonna hire a team once I get to this revenue mark. Then I will hire. And so I was working really hard, pushing myself, big goals, and and I was working on a client account. We were in the middle of a lounge, so a lot of things I had on my plate to do, and it was 5 p.m. I hadn't eaten the whole. day just like wake up rush to the the computer go to the work or to the co-working space and just get get it going so I was like working at in my at my in my flat that day in my home office and on a client call I had like a standing desk so I was standing with video call on Zoom and I I remember a couple of minutes before I fell I felt a little bit of dizziness but I had pushed myself so much the past month that I for me it was just normal. You know you feel a bit dizzy whatever it's you just push it's okay you're gonna take a break later on. So I feel a bit of dizzin I felt a bit of dizziness and I was like ah it's okay so I just continue just like we are in the middle of a call let's push this forward and my I think my body was just like enough I'm I'm I'm done with you girl because for the past month I was just like working really hard I wasn't prioritizing my health whatsoever and which is really sad when I look back because I remember always yearning like my body was like okay let's go on a walk let's go walk out let's go get some fresh air and I was like no we got we have things to get done let's focus you know there's not enough hours in the day let's just keep going so my body in the weak pile was kind of screaming at me like we need a break we are tired let's let's take a break and I just wasn't listening because I was just I was just so focused on the numbers that it just happened I think my body was just like okay that's that's it um I'm I'm off and I just collapsed I collapsed on the call and I was so scared I was so scared because you know at that moment I realized okay I'm alone I'm in this foreign country I'm living by myself I'm working with clients internationally if I die in my home because I'm rushing to the next revenue milestone is it really worth it so it really forced me to stop and I and be like okay let's let's just assess where we are and let's assess what we are doing. And just like that moment where I was in the office with my boss and realizing okay I don't want to keep on doing this because it's not leading me to where I want to go, it was exactly the same feeling but even scarier because now I saw how my health was being affected by my decisions. Because back in the office when I was like okay I need to do my own thing with my boss it was more like I want to have more freedom and more control over my time and more agency over my life. But that season in 2020 when I was like I can actually die. I can actually lose my life if I keep on just neglecting my health and not prioritizing my sleep or my nutrition I won't even be here to enjoy whatever revenue I get to it like it doesn't make sense. So yeah it forced me to stop and change everything about the way I operate and just kind of build the business and support my life not because until then I was building my business around I was building my life around my business. It was business first and then life second. And it forced me to be like you know what let's think about my life first what do I want my life to look like what do I want a random Tuesday enjoy life to look like to look like and from there let's build a business that's gonna support that life and that's gonna help me be in the best shape of my life have the best relationships while having a big impact because I had to ask myself how can I do both you know instead of wanting to do one or the other how can I create a space and sign a life where I get to have both anapologistically yeah that was okay so let me just clarify this you were building business for many years and when you collapsed what did you understand in that moment that many years of building business didn't were were were not able to teach you. Yeah I think the biggest thing which I understood there was that there's no you know for me for the longest time I thought you work really really really really hard you get to a point and then you take a break you celebrate so when I launched my business I remember you know I it I think it also comes from what you listen to I was listening to a lot of male motivational go net you sleep when you are dead go for it never rest dah da sleeper sleep is for losers. So I had a lot of those in my ears and for me it was like you gotta push you gotta cut everyone off you gotta sacrifice everything to achieve success and then when you become successful then you can take a break then you can go on a walk then you can enjoy life but first just cut everything off and everyone off and just focus on the goal. And the funny thing about that is that it doesn't really stop in business because you get to that first milestone and you want to you have the next one and you get there you want the next one and it's it's there's always a moving goalpost. And so you know when I was like a student I knew okay I'm gonna work hard in my studies and I then I'll have a break. Studies end you have go to summer break. When you work in the corporate world is okay I'm working and then I have my holidays or what have you but when you're an entrepreneur you have to be intentional about giving yourself the holidays giving yourself the break and if you're always chasing the next milestone you just think I'm gonna do it later I'm gonna do it later. So at that at that point I had been working for over 18 months without a break without really prioritizing my relationships, my health my nutrition I was eating literally out of cans because I didn't have time to cook or just a waste of time. And I just realized that I had been indoctrinated to chase a version of success that was not really aligned with how my body operates. And if I really wanted to be successful I had to stop and design it completely and also create space for me to enjoy the journey because I realized that it actually the journey is the memories.

SPEAKER_00 27:43

You don't get to a place where you've arrived every single step in the journey you has to be celebrated and not just push and wait until you get dead to enjoy life like and that's how I was thinking so I had to shift my thought process as well yeah for things to change yeah you make me realize that men and women do business differently men push you don't sleep you're doing to do this there you can focus your uh your energy for next 50 years just to push and and with women we're more delicate and more insightful as well and both both types of leadership can complement each other and because behind every employee there's a story and behind every employee there are struggles and just being kind to yourself before it happens and what you said is really really powerful after the collapse you rebuilt and not just your business you wrote something that stayed with me but you said when you are grounded and steady everything you build is steady too that tells me something because you understand that you're not separate from your business you are foundation of it. When did you feel when did you first see that and taking care of yourself was not separate from building something great it was the same thing.

SPEAKER_01 29:13

Yeah you know I realized that when I actually started prioritizing my health working out eating healthy spending time with my loved one I realized that it actually energized me. For the longest time I felt like if I go walk out or if I go on a walk, it's taking out time that I could have spent building something or you know whatever working on the business but actually taking time off the laptop and going out and living life actually gave me more inspiration. I just had some ideas starting to flow in my mind I will be on a walk and think about something oh you know what I could do this and this is this if and while I will be walking out and be like oh something just clicked or I will spend time with my family and be like I've just I want what do I want my nation to think about me? What do I want? What type of aunt do I want to be for them what type of example do I want to be for them and that would just motivate me even more to shop in a bigger capacity in the business or I will spend time with my friends and be like you know what I just this was so wonderful let's do this more often let's you so I would just feel always so energized and so happy and I think when you are ultimately the business can only grow that's what I've learned to the extent that you actually grow as a human being and I heard it when I started my business and I thought it meant I had to grow in terms of my skills. So I thought okay the more skills I have the higher the business world would will grow. But the more I might short in business the more I realized that when it's when the when you put the business can only grow to the extent that you grow, it's not just about your skills it's about the type of human that you become and having a life that's fuller to me has allowed me to have a business that's also more purposeful and that has a bigger impact because now when I come back from a workout time I have so much energy I have so much more clarity as well I have so much more the motivation to do the work that I would never have had if I just stayed like eight hours in front of my laptop. So it can be whether that's a walkout, a walk calling my mom or my dad, you know, spend time with my family it's around me and it reminds me what I'm building what I'm doing. It's just it's way bigger than just the numbers it's about what type of daughter do I want to be? What type of friend do I want to be remembered as what type of human being do I want to shop in the world as and I had to stop having my identity completely attached to the numbers. I had to be like you know what I'm gonna I I still want to achieve I still want to grow I have big dreams and I'm gonna get there for sure.

SPEAKER_00 31:39

But how do I want the journey to look like if everything was to stop today what do I want to be remembered as do I want to be remembered as the girl that worked really hard and never was never there for the holidays and never called anyone back and never prioritized her health or do I want to be remembered like yeah she was ambitious but she was also loving she was also present she was also beautiful she took care of herself she was full of energy you know and building that like I want both and I want to create a business that actually supports that lifestyle and not the other way around that's amazing because like we've got our body we've got our mind we've got our energy and if you if you try to tune to all of them calibration goes everywhere and it's really powerful that you build businesses that support everything because that impacts performance but also it enriches people as human beings so that's that's really powerful. I want to read you something your own words because I think you may have forgotten you wrote this you said I am calmer bolder and far more intentional than the woman who took that first lead and I'm genuinely grateful she was brave enough to jump that yeah tell me about it.

SPEAKER_01 33:03

Yeah you know first of all I'm I must give you some kudos because your form really you know draw things out of me when I was filling out the form was like the question was so good and they kind of forced me to stop and just reflect on the journey but yeah it's it's been a journey you know I can look back at my pictures you know when I started and even the way I was thinking and I'm completely different today I'm I've evolved I've changed and I'm grateful I'm grateful for that version of me that took the leap that was bold that was just crazy enough to forge her own path and she served me well she was incredible and I'm so grateful for her. And at the same time I had to come to the realization that she had her blind spot and if I was actually to become everything that she had dreamed of I had to do things differently from what she was doing. And I think sometimes the hardest part for us is to not be congruent with what we thought we what we thought we're supposed to do. So I had to be like you know what Jolie five years ago thank you so much I'm so grateful you've brought us here but I gotta leave you I I just I just have to stop doing things the way you've been doing them if we really want to be all that God wants us want us to become if you really want to have a beautiful life that's also meaningful and that's impactful and that's peaceful we gotta do things differently. And I had to have a conversation with my old self and be like you know what because I like to think of myself in terms of seasons and I like to think of here's my 20 year old here's my 30 year old what would my 40 year old want me to be what will my 50 year old want me to be or what makes want me to do what can I do today that's gonna make my 20 year old self so proud or my 10 year old self so proud but that's also gonna make my 50 year old self life easier. And so when I stopped and I asked myself you know what thank you girl for bringing me this power on the journey however we gotta update the way we put we operate if we really want to create magic. And yeah that's what that was a conversation which I had to do one in one of those seasons where I just when I'm journaling when I'm sitting still when I'm meditating and really going deep inside to really and say okay what do I want to create? What do I want my next chapter to look like and if I had a magic one what do I want to do I just had to be like you know what there are some habits there are some way of thinking there are some belief that we have to leave back behind us because it's they won't serve us. They serve us well in the first part of our journey but in the second part of our journey they are not serving us anymore. And you know it's like in business there is this code that says what got you here won't get you there and it's so true. And it's not just a strategy it's also the way you think it's also the way you show up the way you process things and the way you see yourself because the my self-image had to evolve as well I couldn't keep on seeing myself the self worth the same way my self-worth and the way I value myself had to evolve. So yeah that's what it meant for me.

SPEAKER_00 36:04

Jolie from the past yeah what do you want her to know now? The younger Jolie who jumped without knowing where she would land.

SPEAKER_01 36:14

You know I think about her really often um sometimes I go back and I look at my videos that I made in the beginning of my journey and I'm just like so many insecurities you know I came from a background in data science and finance and statistics to being in marketing and advertising. So for the longest time she felt unqualified she felt like her story disqualified her on all level to do what she really wanted to do. And she second guess herself she shrink herself because she was afraid of being seen uh she was afraid of failing in public and she was so self-conscious she was she felt like she wasn't worried to be seen and also being in an industry where that's male dominated speaking with the with an accent and being a black woman and it was it she had a lot she carried a lot on her shoulder and she felt like she had so many things against her that wouldn't allow her to succeed and but she pushed through and I'm so grateful that she just pushed through and she said you know what I'm I don't feel qualified but I'm gonna do it anyway but what I want her to know is that she's that all of those things that she thinks disqualify her is actually the very reason why she's more than qualified to do what she's doing and that she doesn't have to shrink herself to succeed that you know she's magnificent because she's made by God and she's beautifully and wonderfully made by God and he makes no mistakes so God didn't make any mistake by making her a wh a a woman with a with an accent in a foreign country that her story is and her background is the reason why she's more than qualified. Yeah I think that's because for me that was like the biggest thing which I had like I was like I'm not the massive imposter syndrome stemmed from that and and you know it's funny because I thought that as I achieved that would disappear and I had to stop because I realized you know I'm achieving I'm working with these big clients I'm being featured in magazines and and and you know shows and interviews and stuff but I still have that feeling of unworthiness and it really stopped when I when I had to remind myself you know what you are your story is the very reason why you are worthy the your background is the very reason why you are worthy it's not that you're gonna achieve something then you become worthy no no no you are worthy just the way you are right here where you are you have everything you need to succeed and stop waiting for something external to validate you because you are already enough you know that's one thing that I wish you knew because it would have made her journey so much more easier.

SPEAKER_00 38:46

Yeah it's it's very fashionable saying that you're worthy as you are but feeling this it's a completely different different story.

SPEAKER_01 38:56

It is true true it is that's why it's a it's a work that you do every single day on yourself. I I remember when I my first my very first mentor told me you gotta work on your mindset every single day you gotta carve out 20 minutes 30 minutes to work on your mindset. And at the time I was like why would I do that? That's just just give me the strategy give me the script give me the the hack give me the the the software tool but it is really the most important thing because everything else stems from how you feel about yourself the way you show up the way you communicate people you attract in your life the opportunity you get to go for or don't go for the type of business you end up building the relationship that you attract and that you maintain the level of wealth that you build the level of health that you have everything is a reflection of how you see yourself and it's not something that you do once and you say okay I've done it once and I'm done. No no no it's ever you are ever you are always evolving and I think the next version of ourselves requires us to shop in a different way and unless we take time to intentionally stop reflect and if and ask ourselves what do I want my next chapter to look like I feel like my life it's like I'm writing a book and every single day I wake up I'm like okay what do I want this chapter to be like what do I want to say what do I want to write in this page because I get to decide what my stuff how my story unfolds some extent you know of course there's always like God leading the way but I'm like okay if it's up to me what which which what do I want to write today in this new blank page that I have this if this gift that you know I have how do I want to show up today how do I want to live yeah as you mentioned writing things down is like making wishes this is what I want.

SPEAKER_00 40:43

And very often people see successful people on stages and when they smile with the presence but actually the small moments when you don't want to do something but you're doing it and you can see how painful going gym or going for that walk is when you when you when when you really want to stay in bed when you really want um doing this and but what's once I you go in after that you uh when the body is so tired to argue with you and you just do it and I think as you mentioned this is just this is where actually real change starts in quiet moments for example in the corners no one no one can see you because can see they people see transformed people but they the transformation is just something that I think they this is just one-to-one work isn't it it is it is a deep inner inner work yeah and uh yeah and I think it's the most important part that every entrepreneur should do intentionally is just to stop and assess where they are and just reflect on how they want to show up because it's it's huge because as entrepreneurs we carry so much and we have to make so many decisions every single day and the quality of our decision affects the quality of our results.

SPEAKER_01 41:57

But our decisions stem from what we think about ourselves what we think about our potential what we think about our world those things affect what type of decision we make every single day. And if we want to become the best because as an entrepreneur we show up every single day to serve, to solve problems, to add value in one way or the other and our ability to even be creative to think okay you know what I can solve that thing I can solve it in a new way in a better way I can ask for a better price I can launch the business I can go I can switch career I can reinvent myself that ability to do that is stems from really knowing yourself and loving yourself enough to realize that you deserve it and that you are worthy of it you know absolutely and working with uh with subconscious bias as well because people we may deal with may have different approaches different beliefs and uh for example me as an immigrant I can see things big and for example I had to learn certain things.

SPEAKER_00 42:57

So there's also work on that on in that field and and actually the work is never ending because they well once we've got sales techniques uh we've got different types of software we've got ai we've got communication skills we've got internal world so connecting this it is never ending it's a full-time job as it is it is it is a lot it is a lot to learn and so especially now that things are evolving so fast technology there's always something to get on to yeah it's mind boggling journey I want to shift for a moment not to your past not to your business to the person listening to this right now imagine that there's a woman listening to us she's talented she's driven she's doing everything alone and quietly burning out and she's scared that wanting more makes her ungrateful of for what she already has I want you to speak to her directly not to me to her You said something I want her to hear from you. Being ready is a decision you make, not a feeling you wait for. Say that to her.

SPEAKER_01 44:09

Yeah, you know, I can totally speak to that woman because I've been her for a good part of my journey, so I can I know how it feels like at the deepest level. And I want her to first know that it's okay. It's okay to want more, and it's okay to feel grateful for what you have while also warning a whole lot more than what you have. Sometimes we beat ourselves up for warning more when it's just like it's how we are built. Like it's free, it keeps on growing. It feels anything, you know what? I'm just I've here, I'm not gonna keep on growing. It keeps it free keeps on growing. And I think it's just like the universe, the God in us that wants us to become all that we can be. And so that's a beautiful feeling to have wanting more. Now, in terms of how do you get there, how do you balance both, I would say just for one moment stay still and visualize yourself 20 or 30 years from now, or even 10 years from now, if you can do that at least, and ask yourself what life do I want to create? And I want you to really be specific. How does my how does a typical Tuesday look like for me? How does my Friday evening look like? How does my Monday night look like? Typically, we have the vision board, right? Yes, you can have all of those in your vision board. Ever, how do I want to feel when I wake up? How do I want to feel after I'm done with my work? Because those are gonna be your guiding light. Because ultimately the reason why we chase what we chase is not for the thing, it's for how we're gonna feel when we get the thing. And sometimes we are so focused on the thing and we forget about how it's gonna make us feel that when we get the thing, we are depressed, we are even more worried, we are restless because we we haven't attached a feeling to what we're actually chasing. And so I will start there journaling, having clarity in all areas, not just business, because sometimes we, as ambitious women, we are so focused in the business that we tend to forget everything else. So I want you to think my relationships, my love life, my if I want a family or not, how do I want that to look like, my spirituality, my travel, all the things. What do I want to experience 10, 15 years from now, 20 years from now? And I want you to realize that there's a version of you already that's living that life. So the gap between you right now and you that you are that you've envisioned is not as fast as it may seem. If you actually intentionally shop every single day as that person, sometimes the goal is so big and it feels so separate from us. And we say, Okay, I have this big old camp better, can I even get there? So I want you to just stop. And whenever you think, can I even get there? I want you to stop and say, I'm already there. The version of me that has envisioned all of those things, the only reason why I've envisioned that is because she already exists. So the question is, can I even get that? The question is, okay, she's already there. Now, intentionally, every single day, when you're about to start a task, when you're about to make a decision, when you are about to work on your business, I want you to kind of call that higher version of you in, your decision that you are making, and ask yourself, how will she move? What will she choose? How will she show up? How will she talk? How will she behave? Which choice will she make? Because what I've learned and I know to be true is that that version of you never is never going to lead you astray. Because it's the high you that's calling you. And when you typically we feel imposter syndrome, we overthink, we second guess ourselves, we feel that we are not prepared enough, not ready enough because we are so ingrained into our identity as of today. Because yes, the version of me today might feel imposter syndrome. The version of me today might feel like she needs to buy another training or go to another thing, even before she feels ready. But if I remember, if I remind myself that, hold on, there's a version of me that already has achieved all that I desire to achieve. So I can actually tap into that energy right now and choose, because it is a choice. I can choose to embody the energy of my future self rather than being stuck in why I'm an old and who I've been. Because for us as women, what I've noticed is that we sometimes are so hard on ourselves because of what we've done in the past, because of how things have turned out in the past, because of our past mistakes and our past failures, all the things. And we just beat ourselves down over and over again. And speaking with men and women, entrepreneurs, I've realized that men are not as they are not so judgmental sometimes as we women are with ourselves. That's why they typically go for more. You'll see sometimes a woman that has all the credentials. She's been working in the field for 10 years, she knows more than anyone else. But yet, she shrinks herself, she second guess herself, and you'll see a man that started like six months ago, and he's like loud and proud and doing all the things because it's just like I'm gonna go for it. And I guess one of the reasons why, as housewomen, we sometimes shrink ourselves is because we are so attached to or we are so familiar to the way things have been, and we don't give ourselves permission to fully step into our next level identity. Because once you fully step into that next level identity and you realize that I can, because I always say to my when I coach, when I work with clients, I always say, you know what? Your dreams are your for your reason. I have some dreams that you don't have, Kasha, and you have some dreams that I don't have. And the same with all women. And the reason why we have different dreams is because our the universe, God, has called us for a higher purpose. And so if you don't, the reason why you have the dream is because you already have everything you need to succeed in the biggest, most beautiful way. Now the question is am I going to step up to the plate? Am I going to let my decision be guided by that higher version of me that's already high there, how there live my best life? Or am I going to let my decision be guided by my past identity? What I've done. And something that I will I want that woman to know is that her future doesn't have to look anything like her past. She can create a future that's completely different than anything that she has gone through in the past, and that whatever she thinks disqualifies her, the failures, the missteps, the money lost, whatever has gone bad in the past, that's the exact reason why she's more than qualified. Because God used everything that we go through for good. You know, sometimes you hear the story of an entrepreneur that had had that had gone through bankruptcy and they had had the car repossessed and they've lived in the car. And I'm sure that when that happened to that entrepreneur, they might they could have could have chosen to think, you know what, got my car repossessed, I'm living in my my sister's couch, I'm facing bankruptcy, I'm never gonna succeed. Or they can choose to think, you know what, I'm going through this, it might be challenging, yes, but God is gonna use this for good. Out of all of this mess, I'm gonna create the most beautiful story. And when we change that, and when we choose intentionally every single day to remember our dream, to remember our future, and to live from that place energetically and practically, it we create magic. We create magic because we are more, we are bolder, we know okay, I can't fail because my future has already succeeded. She already made the million, she already has the body and the relationship, so I cannot fail. I might be it might be delayed, I might be redirected, but I'm gonna get there because she's already there, you know. So that's what I want, I want that girl to know and just enjoy the journey, have fun. It's not that serious. Have stop every single day and then dance a little bit, you know, go and smell the flowers, go do your face mask, you know, do your nails, put your makeup on, you know, put your lipstick on, enjoy the journey. It's not, it's not, you know, it's you're gonna get there. It's but also when you get there, make sure that you create that your intention about it about every single step along the way, because you're gonna be get to tell a fantastic story to your kid and to your grandkid. So that's what I would tell her. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 52:09

Thank you. You know, I can listen to you for hours because you know, you're born to be on the biggest stages, and thank you, guess.

SPEAKER_01 52:19

Yeah, thank you.

SPEAKER_00 52:21

Uh, Julie, one last thing.

SPEAKER_01 52:23

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 52:24

You said that legacy you want to leave is proof. Prove that you can build something serious and lasting without losing yourself. Prove that the story is the why and the strategy is the how. Prove that an immigrant woman with no safety net and no one betting on her can build something nobody can ignore. What do you want the next generation of women to know because of that you have built?

SPEAKER_01 52:52

Very good question. I want the next generation of women to know that they are their biggest assets and they are worth investing in. So always invest in yourself, invest in your health, invest in your mindset, invest in your world hope, invest in your skills, invest in you, invest in you because you are worth it. You are worth it. And ultimately, the more you invest in yourself and the more aware you are of how brilliant you are, better you show up. So I would say also audit your internal dialogue because everything else stems from your internal dialogue. Sometimes we think that we don't achieve or we could have achieved better things if we were more supported by our friends, our family, our whatever. But I always ask, do you support yourself? Do you believe in yourself? Do you trust yourself? Because it's easy to point the finger and say, Oh, my husband didn't support me, or my sister didn't, or my friends didn't share my business. But did you really, really, really support you? Did you really, really believe that you could do it? Because ultimately it doesn't matter who doesn't support you as long as you support yourself. It doesn't matter who doesn't believe in you as long as you believe in yourself, right? And I would say really work on that relationship with yourself because it's the most important relationship you ever have in your entire life. Even when you get married or as you are married, there's gonna be seasons where your husband is traveling or he's busy with other things, or even when you have kids, they're gonna be seasons. I've heard that when you when your kid is 18 years old, you spend like 80% of your time that you've ever spent with them. So, and they leave the house and they go and decide their own lives. So ultimately, the person that you come back to every single day for the rest of your life is you until the very last thread. And you have to be mindful of what relationship you have with yourself and really remember that you are brilliant, you are this magic bottle up inside of you, you are a firework in human form. Your dreams are yours for a reason, and you know, it's and being uncomfortable is great. Being unsure, being uncertain is great. Sometimes we think we we want to avoid uncertainty, we want to avoid, you know, discomfort. But if you are someone who is if you're a woman who is striving to be all she can be, there are gonna be seasons where you won't know what the next step is gonna look like, you won't know what that actually is gonna lead to specifically. But I want you to trust that what you are building and the life that you are meant to lead will be magical as long as you are willing to take those scary steps, stay uncomfortable, and just trust that you that you you know, trust your inner knowing, trust that God got you. Yeah, that's what I want her to know.

SPEAKER_00 55:34

Thank you. I I hope this conversation gave you something too, Julie, not just the listeners, you.

SPEAKER_01 55:41

It was absolutely wonderful. It was absolutely I totally enjoyed it. Thank you so much for the questions. Amazing. I have I've never been asked this level of questions, so I'm like, wow, this is different and I love it. Thank you, Kashia. No, it was amazing, yeah. Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 55:57

This conversation needed to happen, so and thank you very much. Ladies and gents, our legacy talks exists because every extraordinary story deserves to be heard just once, forever. Jolly. Drogon Consulting, the Scaling Season podcast. All links are in the description below. Um, and if something here moved you, please share it because someone in your life is standing at the edge right now and they need to hear this. Thank you very much.

SPEAKER_01 56:30

Thank you so much, Kasha, for having me.