Why Does God Allow Evil?

The Problem of Evil is often presented as Christianity's greatest intellectual challenge. If God is all-powerful, all-knowing, and perfectly good, why does evil exist at all?

In this episode of Actual Answers with Matt Hazelwood, we tackle that question head-on by walking through one of the clearest and most comprehensive biblical treatments of the problem of evil, following the framework developed by Dr. Norman Geisler.

Rather than offering shallow clichés or emotional platitudes, this episode carefully examines the major philosophical and theological questions surrounding evil, including:

• What evil actually is (and what it is not)
• Where evil came from
• God's sovereignty over evil
• How perfect creatures could choose evil
• How evil could arise if God created everything good
• Why God doesn't immediately eliminate all evil
• The problem of physical suffering
• Why evil continues to persist in the world today

Throughout the episode, we argue that the Christian worldview not only survives these difficult questions—it provides the only coherent foundation for understanding why evil exists, why we recognize it as evil, and how God has decisively defeated it through Jesus Christ while preserving genuine creaturely freedom.

Whether you're wrestling with suffering yourself, responding to skeptical objections, or simply wanting to deepen your confidence in the Christian faith, this episode provides a thoughtful, biblical, and intellectually rigorous treatment of one of the most important questions anyone can ask.

Recommended Resources

• If God, Why Evil? — Norman L. Geisler
• Why Is There Evil in the World (And So Much of It)? — Greg Welty
• The Problem of Pain — C.S. Lewis

Transcript

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Welcome to the Actual Answers Podcast. I'm your host, Matt Hazelwood, and here we tackle the questions that matter most. From the challenges of atheism and competing worldviews to the theological questions that Christians ask every day. Our goal is simple: to seek truth, provide clear biblical answers, and equip believers to think carefully, speak faithfully, and defend the Christian faith with confidence. So whether you're a skeptic looking for answers, a believer seeking understanding, or a Christian wanting to sharpen your ability to engage the culture, this podcast is for you. Because truth matters, questions matter, and Christianity has actual answers. Welcome to the Actual Answers Podcast. Let's get to the episode. We are going to address the problem of evil. What problem strikes at the heart of human experience more than this one? Who has not said, why God? Right? If God exists, why is there so much pain, so much suffering, so much evil? Well, there have been three basic responses to the problem of evil. There are three basic worldviews that kind of address this issue. One of them is pantheism, which affirms that God exists, but denies that evil exists. It's an illusion. Another one is atheism, which affirms that evil exists, but denies the existence of God. And theism, which I would maintain, affirms both of these things. It affirms that evil exists and God exists. But of course, the question is how can both of those realities be true at the same time? So before we deal with theism, let's talk about pantheism. See, pantheism is unrealistic. Mary Baker Eddy, the founder of Christian Science, which is neither Christian nor science, held this view. And she said that God is all, therefore, all that really exists is in and of God. And so she concludes that evil, quote, evil is but an illusion and has no basis or has no real basis in reality. That evil is an error of the moral mind. And the logic goes like this if God is all and all is God, God is good. Therefore, anything we see that we think is evil cannot be evil because all is God and God is good. Evil is an illusion, but that that's unrealistic. And so the poet once put it that there was a faith healer of deal who said, although pain isn't real, if I sit upon a pen and it punctures my skin, I dislike what I fancy I feel. Pantheism is unrealistic. See, if evil is illusion, an illusion, why is it? If it's not real, then why does it hurt so bad? If pain, suffering, and death are an illusion, then how do we explain where the illusion comes from at all? If if pain and suffering and evil is an illusion, why does everyone have the same illusion? Have you noticed that we have the same experience as one another? And why is this illusion so persistent? If it's an illusion, shouldn't we be able to get rid of it pretty easily? Right? Why can't we make it go away since it's just an illusion? Pantheism is unrealistic. Norman Geisler is right when he says that we can tell an illusion because there is always a backdrop of reality, which we know it is an illusion. But evil is part of the backdrop of life itself. How then can it be illusory? See, pantheism is unrealistic, but atheism is ungrounded. C.S. Lewis got it right when he said that my argument was that the universe seemed so cruel and unjust, but how had I got this idea of just and unjust? A man does not call a line crooked unless he has some idea of a straight line. Of course, I could have just given up my idea of justice by saying it was nothing but a private idea of my own. But if I did that, then my argument against God collapsed too. Atheism is ungrounded when it addresses the problem of evil. If if the atheist says something is evil, then he admits that there is something that is good, which is not the evil he complains about. But if he admits that there is both evil and good, then he necessarily posits a moral law to distinguish between the two, which we talked about last week. But if there is a moral law, then there is a moral law giver, because that's what it means to be a moral law. It's a prescription, there must be a prescriber. But that's exactly what he denies. So the atheist has no ground to call anything good nor evil. Atheism is ungrounded. And the reality is that evil cries out for God in several ways. But there's a problem if we hold theism and the existence of evil as well. And the problem of evil is goes something like this: God is all good and opposes evil, God is all-knowing and forenew evil, God is all powerful and can defeat evil. So why does he permit evil? Well, before we start addressing the problem of evil forthrightly, we need to talk about what in the world evil is. What is the nature of evil? Because evil is not just a single problem. There are many problems concerning the problem of evil. And so one of the problems is the nature of evil. And the problem goes something like this God created all things, evil is something, therefore, God created evil. In fact, my son, who is eight years old, actually asked me about where evil came from because he came to this exact conclusion, saying that if God created all things, evil is something, therefore, God created evil. Why in the world would he do that? In fact, he used a syllogism as an eight-year-old to ask this question to me. So that's the problem. But here's the response: okay, God created all things. That's true, of course. Evil is not a thing. Hence, God did not create evil. See, Augustine, uh, Saint Augustine actually wrestled with this quite a while ago. And he came to the conclusion that evil is not a thing, but a privation of a thing. And you can find this in his confessions, book chapter seven or book seven, chapter 12, where Augustine says, Evil then is not a substance, nor a nature, nor a good. It is a privation of good. For what is evil but the privation of good? Evil has no positive existence of its own. It is the absence of the good that should be. Evil is like rot to a tree. There's no such thing as rot to a tree without the tree. The rot to the tree doesn't have existence in and of itself. It's the tree that exists. And then we have the distortion, the privation, the absence of what should be there with the rotten tree. Goodness is the norm. Evil is like rust to a car, right? Rust to a car doesn't exist without the car. It doesn't have a positive existence in and of itself. The good thing, such as the car, has a privation, a perversion of what the good is in rust. Evil is like moth holes in a sweater, right? The the holes are not a thing in and of itself. It's that is a privation of the good sweater hanging in a closet. So it doesn't exist apart from that. It's a privation of good. It's not part of the design, it's a privation, not a thing. And it damages and destroys. Evil is like an amputated limb, right? If you're missing a leg, you're missing the good that is there. But a missing limb is not a positive thing. It's not a thing in and of itself. It's a it's an issue of the good that has the positive existence in itself. Now, there can be a few problems with taking this view of what evil is. And one of the problems is that evil, if if evil is a corruption or a privation in a good thing, then it's not real. Such as they would say, a whole is nothing, such as the hole in the sweater is not a thing. There's not a positive existence here, or it's not real. But I think that that is not true. It is a real lack in a good thing. Blindness is does not have a positive existence in and of itself, but blindness is real, it's a real lack of sight. Deafness doesn't have a positive existence in and of itself, but it is a real lack. It's a real lack of hearing. Same thing for being mute. Another issue that's been raised is that if evil is the absence or negation of good, then it is a negative, but evil is a positive reality. But I think that there needs to be a distinction between absence and privation, right? Evil is a privation, not an absence. Absence is merely not there, but privation is not there, but ought to be there. So you can think about a rock and a blind man, neither one of them have sight. But one of them is an absence and one of them is a privation. It's not evil for the rock to not have sight because a blind rock doesn't or a blind rock or a rock with no sight makes no sense, right? It was not necessarily there, so it's not supposed to be there, so it's not bad that it's not there. That's absence. Whereas privation is that it should be there, and it is a privation of the good thing that ought to be there. It's an absence, it's a privation, not a mere absence. So we can we can kind of resummarize all of this by saying God created only good things. That's true. Evil is not a thing, but a privation of a good thing. So God did not create evil. So that's how we would address the nature of evil. But of course, the question then becomes, what about what about God's sovereignty in all this? Right? Is He not sovereign over the privations as well as the the positive things as well? So the problem of sovereignty could be could be stated like this: God is the author of everything that happens, meaning God is sovereign. That is, God is in control of everything. Evil is something that happens. So, what would we say? God is the author of evil. So let's talk about this. This ultimately commits the logical fallacy known of equip of equivocation on the word author, right? At the beginning, God is the author of all things, meaning he is the creator of all things. And then it says, then God is the author of evil. But there needs to be a distinction between what God permits, evil, his permissive will, and what he allows. So God does not promote evil in his perfect will, right? But he does permit evil. Evil is permitted, but controlled by God because God is sovereign. So God permits evil in order to defeat evil and then produce a greater good, which we'll talk more about. So just because God is sovereign and control of all things doesn't put the responsibility at him because he he is not the one creating evil or promoting evil, even though he does permit evil. And so one of my favorite examples, and this doesn't solve all the issues, but it's still a good example. If I would say, Who killed Macbeth? you would say Macduff killed Macbeth. And so that would be right. That is the correct answer. But isn't it true that William Shakespeare wrote the play of Macbeth? So isn't he the author of that as well? It's like, yes, in a sense he is, but it is Macbeth who is killed by Macduff. So God is sovereign all over all things, like God is like McUh Shakespeare is sovereign over the play that happens. Right? First Chronicles 29, 11 through 12 says that yours, O Lord, is the kingdom. You are exalted as head over all, you are the ruler of all things. God is sovereign. In Job 42, he says, I know that you can do all things. No plan of yours can be thwarted. In Psalm 1153, our God is in heaven and he does whatever pleases him. In Psalm 135, verse 6 says that the Lord does whatever pleases him in the heavens and on earth, in the seas, in all their depths. Proverbs 21, 1, it says that the king's heart is in the hand of the Lord, he directs it like a water course wherever he pleases. Daniel 4 17, the most high is sovereign over the kingdoms of men and gives them to anyone he wishes. God is in control. He is sovereign. Isaiah 14 24 says, Surely I have planned, so it will be, and as I have purpose, so it will stand. For the Lord Almighty has purpose, and who can thwart him? And finally, Isaiah 55, 11 says, So is my word that goes out from my mouth, it will not return to me empty, but it will accomplish what I desire and achieve the purpose for which I have sent it. God is sovereign over all things. He's even sovereign over our free choices. Both are true. Right? Acts 2 23. This man was handed over to you by God's set purpose and foreknowledge. And you, there's the free will part, the choices, with the help of wicked men, put him to death by nailing him to the cross. See, it puts it there side by side. There's no problems with God's sovereignty and free choices. This man was handed over to you by God's set purpose and foreknowledge. The very same verse in Acts 2 23. And you, with the help of wicked men, put him to death by nailing him to the cross. Then we also see in 1 Peter 2 8, it says that they stumble because they disobey the message, which is also they were destined for. They did the disobedience, but they were also destined by God for that. And in John 10, 17, it says, I lay down my life. Jesus talking, I laid down my life only to take it up again. No one takes it up from me, but I lay it down of my own accord. Yet, as we read earlier in Acts, yet it resulted from God's quote, definite plan and for knowledge. Truly I say to you, in Luke 22, truly the Son of Man goes as it was determined. He does the going, but it was determined by God, sovereign overall. But woe unto that man whom he is betrayed. See, there is no issue between free choices and God's sovereignty. And I think Sir Spurgeon has the best quote on this for sure, when he says that divine sovereignty and human responsibility have never had a falling out with each other. I never try to reconcile friends. There is no problem with free choices and God's sovereignty. So God is sovereign, but then of course the question is where in the world did evil come from? That that's a problem in and of itself. And the problem goes something like this Okay? God is absolutely perfect, God cannot create anything imperfect, and a perfect creature cannot do evil, therefore, evil cannot arise in such a world, but evil did arise in this world. Hence, either A or B is false. Either God is not absolutely perfect, or God cannot create anything imperfect. The response? Something like this. God is absolutely perfect. That's certainly true. God cannot create anything imperfect because he only does perfect things. Point C, the third premise here is false. And a perfect creature cannot do evil. That is false. Therefore, the previous conclusion that does not follow because that's not what scripture teaches at all. A perfect creature can do evil. In Ezekiel 28:15, thou speaking of Lucifer, thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created till iniquity was found in thee. He was perfect, he was created perfect. But in first Timothy 3:6, we read not that a pastor should not be a novice, lest being lifted up with pride, like Lucifer, he fell into condemnation of the devil, being cast down because of his pride. He became proud and incurred condemnation. And of course, we know what this resulted in. Revelation 12 9, it says, And the great jack dragon was cast out, that old serpent called the devil and Satan, which deceiveth the world. He was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him. So scripture teaches that evil is a choice even for a perfect creature. He was created perfect, but it seems that perfect creatures can actually will and do evil, even though they were created in a perfect state, in a good and upright state. So, of course, the question is well, how can a perfect creature do evil? That doesn't make sense. Well, we can think of it like this God created only good things. One good thing that God created was free will. Free will makes evil possible since it involves the ability to do otherwise, but to do otherwise than good is evil. Hence, a perfect creature can do evil. Because to do otherwise, and it is a free creature. God made evil possible, but free creatures made evil actual. But then you're gonna ask, how can one will evil when there is no evil to will? Right? There's no evil around to will. So how is it that Lucifer could have willed evil in the first place? Well, think of it like this a good creature with the good power of free will that God gave willed the finite good of the creature over the infinite good of the creator. Hence, no evil need exists in order to will evil, right? Willing a lesser good can be an evil. So the finite good was willed over the infinite good. We have two goods here. It's good that you have the ability to choose, and it's good that God has the ability to choose. Free will is a good thing, but when you take the good thing and put it in a bad order, you create evil, and so that's how evil came about when there was no evil to will. So who caused Lucifer to sin? Well, how did we get this? Well, it's pretty straightforward. No one else caused him to do it. Lucifer was the cause of his own sin, right? There's really only three options. He either caused it, it was uncaused, or it was caused by somebody else. Those are really our own only three options. Well, it can't be caused by another, or else they would be responsible for it. And scripture clearly teaches that Lucifer is responsible for that evil. And it can't be uncaused since every event has a cause. That's analytically true. You cannot have an effect without a cause because when you have an effect, you automatically presuppose a cause. That's an analytical truth. Just like if you posit a bachelor, you have posited an unmarried man. You cannot posit one without the other. That's what it means. So if you have an effect, you have a cause. It cannot be uncause. Hence, the only other option is that it is self-caused. And that's exactly what we read in scripture. Ezekiel 28, 13 through 17. This is not talking about him specifically, but it is echoing what happened to Lucifer to kind of give some insight here. And in Ezekiel 28, verse 13, it says, You were in Eden, the garden of God. Every precious stone was your covering and was in you on the day that you were created. You were the anointing cherub who covers, and I placed you there. You were on the holy mountain of God. You walked in the midst of the stones of fire. You were blameless in your ways from the day you were created. He was perfect until unrighteousness was found where? In you, and you sinned. Therefore I have cast you as profane from the mountain of God, and I have destined you a covering cherub from the midst of the stones of fire. Your heart was lifted up in pride because of your beauty. You corrupted your wisdom by reason of your splendor. I cast you to the ground, I put you before kings that they may see may see you. So it's pretty clear that scripture lays the blame solely at Lucifer's feet. We see something similar in Isaiah 14 12. It says, How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning? For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God, I will be like the most high. So we can summarize where evil came from like this. With a good power, a free will, willed the finite good of the creature, which is himself, over the infinite good of the creator, God. So, but the question then is why didn't God just stomp it out right then before it happened? Right? Why, why did he let this go on? Why doesn't he just stomp out evil altogether and just prevent this whole mess? Well, that leads us into the persistence of evil. Remember, evil has many problems, not just one singular problem, but the persistence of evil. And the problem goes something like this, right? If God is all good, he would defeat evil. If God is all powerful, he could defeat evil, but evil is not defeated. Therefore, no such God exists. Now, this is probably the most powerful argument that atheists have in their tool belt. This it really is an actual issue that needs to be addressed. If God is all good, he would defeat evil. Yep. If God is all powerful, he could defeat evil. But evil is not defeated. Just look around. Look at the news. Look at the newspaper. Look at the mirror. Evil is everywhere. Just look around. So what do we say? Well, first, if God is all good, he would defeat evil. That's true. And if God is all powerful, he could defeat evil. But evil is not yet defeated. See, the atheist loses their strongest argument because they forget one word that is absolutely crucial to the conversation. Evil is not yet defeated. Therefore, no such God exists. That conclusion doesn't fall. This conclusion doesn't follow because, since evil might yet be defeated, right? It might be defeated next week. Just because I start speaking a sentence and I don't finish the sentence doesn't mean I won't complete the sentence to the very end. Just because I read a novel and I'm not done reading the novel doesn't mean that the novel doesn't have an end. Evil might yet be defeated. Of course, atheists are clever and they they've come up with a new version of this, but I think it's actually worse. And so they would say that if God is all good, he would defeat evil. And if God is all powerful, he could defeat evil, but evil will never be defeated. Therefore, no such God exists. Well, this has a huge problem, obviously, because there's no way for the objector to know this unless he is God. You would have to be omniscient to know that God will not defeat evil someday. So the new conclusion, it has to go like this if we grant those other things, since you're not omniscient. If God is all good, he would defeat evil. That's true. If God is all powerful, he could defeat evil, but evil is not yet defeated. So what follows from that? It's not defeated yet. We agree. The only thing that follows is therefore, evil will one day be defeated. Why? Well, the character of God itself. He is all powerful and can do it, just like we've said. And he is all good and he wants to do it. Hence, he will do it. He will defeat evil someday. You can just guarantee it. Of course, the question is why doesn't God destroy all evil? Why not just stamp it out? Well, he doesn't destroy evil, but he does defeat it. But there's a distinction. And the reason is, again, free will. God desires creatures capable of genuine love. And genuine love requires genuine moral freedom. And genuine moral freedom makes rebellion, sin, possible. And destroying or eliminating all moral evil immediately would eliminate the freedom required for love, which is the highest ethic. Therefore, God temporarily permits evil so that genuine love, repentance, redemption, and virtue are even possible at all. C.S. Lewis is right when he says, I would pay any price to be able to truthfully save, all will be saved. But my reason retorts, without their will or with it. If I say without their will, I at once perceive a contradiction. How can the supreme voluntary act of self-surrender be involuntary? If I say with their will, my reason replies, how? If they will not give in. You see, there's only two people in the end. C.S. Lewis is right when he says there are only two kinds of people in the end, those who say to God, Thy will be done, and those to whom God says in the end, Thy will be done. All that are in hell, choose it. Without that self-choice, there could be no hell. But more to the point, if God was to destroy all evil, what would happen to you? Frank Turek is right when he says, if God destroyed all evil at midnight tonight, would you still be alive at 1201? Of course, the Bible is true. All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. There is none that are righteous. No, not one. If God destroys all evil, where are you going to end up? Because God is all good, all just, all perfect. He will do such a thorough job if he were to set that task before him that you would not make it at all. But God doesn't will that. And so you need to trust the wisdom of God. What's interesting is I think David Hume actually points out a really critical missing piece to the conversation on the problem of evil. And he says, in his dialogues concerning natural religion in 1779, he says that the pain and suffering in this world is not by any means what we expect from infinite wisdom and infinite goodness. Now I want you to note, he says, he he he kind of expands the atheist argument. It's normally about God being all-powerful and all good, being able to do it and wanting to do it. But he also kind of brings in an interesting point that needs to be part of the conversation. He says we should, we wouldn't expect this from infinite wisdom and infinite goodness. So you could almost reframe the problem of evil with Hume's kind of twist there. His argument can go like God's power, all powerful, means he could defeat evil. God's wisdom, being all-wise, means he would know how to do it. And God's goodness, meaning he's all loving, means that he would want to do it. His wisdom is the key to understanding the issue. The real question is, how can God defeat evil without abolishing free moral agency and condemning all humanity? That's why there's a distinction between destroying evil and defeating evil. We need to trust his wisdom. How is it that God will defeat all evil? Well, he allows everyone to freely choose their destiny so that freedom is preserved. And he defeats evil by separating good from evil. This is the separation of the sheep and the goats, the good fish from the bad fish, the wheat and the tares. So he separates the good and evil forever. And then he quarantines evil forever in hell and eventually thrown into the lake of fire. He quarantines it. This is exactly what we do with diseases here. When there is a disease spread over there, we separate it so we don't infect the issues over here. That's exactly what God does in eternity. He's going to separate the good from the evil, and there is going to be a smoking section and a non-smoking section. And you can just guess which one is which. So he's going to punish evil and reward good in heaven by defeating death and Satan. So he did this officially, right? The official, he officially defeated evil at the cross, at his first coming. It was the decisive victory, just like in World War II in 1944, right? The decision was made to do this. And so we see this in uh Colossians 2, 14 through 15. He says, having cancelled out the certificate of debt consisting of decrees against us, which was hostile to us, and he has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross. When he had disarmed the rulers and authorities, he made a public display of them, having triumphed over them through him. Hebrews 2, 14 through 15. Therefore, since the children share in flesh and blood, he himself likewise partook of the same things that through death he might destroy what one who has the power of death, that is the devil, and might free those who through fear of death were subject to slavery all their lives. See, uh Satan was declawed and defanged at the cross. He's now all bark and no bite. It was officially done at the cross, and one day he's going to do it actually. He's going to finish the job, what you would consider uh V Day in 1945. The victory is actually secured. It was officially decided and then secured. Same thing for Christ, his first coming and his second coming. Revelation 19, 11. Then I saw and opened up and behold, a white horse, and he who sat on it is called faithful and true and righteousness. He judges and makes war. Revelation 21, one through four says, Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and then the sea is no more. And I saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of the heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is among men, and he will dwell among them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be among them, and he will wipe away every tear from their eyes. And there will be no longer any death. There will be no longer any mourning or crying or pain, for the first things have passed away. So how do we He's going to do this at a second coming? How do we know that this will happen at the second coming? Well, he proved it in his first coming. Over 100 prophecies uh were prophesied about the first coming, and he literally fulfilled all of them. So you can bet that what he says about the second coming is true, right? He never said that this would be easy. Pain is real, but he just said it would be worth it. Romans 8 18, for I consider that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory that is to be revealed to us. But of course, the question is why? What's the point? Even though we can understand why evil persists thus far and what he will do in the future, the what's the point of all this? What is the purpose of evil itself, right? What is the significance of suffering? And what is the meaning of misery? What is the design for disaster? What is the cause for calamity? What is the purpose for pain? The problem could be stated like this, and it is a very painful problem, right? An all-good God must have a good purpose for everything, but there is no good purpose for some suffering, for example, like useless or innocent suffering. Hence, there cannot be an all-good God. Well, just because we don't know a good purpose for evil does not mean that there is none. Just because we don't know, it doesn't prove that God is dead, it just proves that the atheist is dumb. An all-good, all-knowing God knows a good purpose for everything, including evil. Some evil seems to us to have no good purpose, but in all good God has a good purpose for everything. So even evil that seems to us to have no good purpose does have a good purpose, right? Just because we don't know it doesn't mean that God doesn't know it. Just because we don't know doesn't mean that God doesn't know, right? God is not dead. We are just dumb. We don't know all things, right? Why don't we know a good purpose for all evil? Well, we don't know everything as much as we would like to think otherwise. We don't know the end of all things, but God does know the end from the beginning. But an all-knowing God knows both. So a few verses just to kind of keep in the back of your mind. This is a big one. Deuteronomy 29, 29. The secret things belong to the Lord our God, but to us and to our children, the things that are revealed. We don't know everything. There is a secret will of God that he has and we don't. And that's exactly what we should expect. He is the Almighty Creator of heaven and earth, of everything we see. He is much smarter, much more powerful, much more wise than we are. And so we should not expect to know all things, but he does. And the things that he does reveal to us are for us and our children. Right? His ways are unsearchable, and his judgments past finding out, as Romans 11, 33 says. And on an episode of Paul Harvey on the rest of the story, he had a young man dying of cancer they interviewed, and of course he's asking about this. And the young man said to Paul Harvey, he said, I do not believe that the divine architect of the universe ever builds a staircase that leads to nowhere. Right? We don't know all the answers. We don't know why God allows pain and suffering and evil. But there are some things that we do know about suffering, right? Here are a few things. Some pain does have a good purpose. For example, warning pains. You have a toothache that tells you to go to the dentist. Otherwise, that could get out of hand fast. You have a pain in the chest, you better go get that checked out. That's painful, right? That's not good. But that was a good thing that you felt that pain to go get that addressed. Pain in your lower right side, your appendix is about to burst. You better get that checked out. So some pain does have a good purpose. And who here does not learn more from pain than pleasure, right? We we learn more through pain than pleasure. And you can just ask anybody how many enduring life lessons have stuck with you from pleasure? And very few people would raise their hands to that. But how many of us have an enduring life lesson through pain? Most of our enduring lessons are learned through pain. And that is a good thing that we've learned these lessons that we need to know.

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Right?

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C.S. Lewis is right when he says, God whispers to us in our pleasures, speaks in our conscience, but shouts in our pains. It is his megaphone to rouse a deaf world. So, I mean, God, because he values the freedom of choice we are created in his image, he's not gonna, you know, rope tie a donkey's head and drag you into uh the kingdom. But what he might do is take a two by four and whack you over the head to wake you up so that you will walk the right direction. So the real truth is God is more interested in our character than he is our comfort. God is more interested in our holiness than he is our happiness, right? There's no verse that says, Be ye happy as I am happy, saith the Lord. Right? There is a verse that says, Be ye holy as I am holy, saith the Lord, Leviticus 11, 45. So this is what God does through allowing allowing suffering. And we see some examples of this. Genesis 50, 20 says, You intended to harm me, but God intended it, the same thing, for good to accomplish what he is now being done. What is now being done, the saving of many lives. He's using that pain and suffering, the same thing that they intended for evil to save many lives. Hebrews 12 11. No discipline seems pleasant at the time, but painful. Later on, however, it does produce a harvest of righteousness. He's saving lives, he's producing righteousness. Second Corinthians 4 17 says, For our light and momentary troubles are achieving for us an eternal glory that far outweighs them all. I love the poem that Geisser points out, says that said to the Robin to the sparrow, I should really like to know why these ancient, anxious human beings rush about a worry, so said the sparrow to the Robin, friend, I think that it must be that they have no heavenly father such as cares for you and me. Voltaire in Candide is right. This is not the best of all worlds. It's hard. It is a it is a world that we have freely chosen and thrown ourselves into pain and suffering, and God has permitted that to happen. This is obviously not the best of all worlds. We can always think of one more or one less death or one less pain. But it might be the best way to the best world, right? Evil has to be permitted in order to defeat it. How do you defeat something without letting it get into the ring and you stepping into the ring to defeat it? So evil has to be permitted to be defeated. Permitting evil is necessary to producing higher goods, such as right, with you don't have courage without danger. There's no patience without tribulation, there, there's no character without adversity, there's no forgiveness without sin, no pain, no gain. And this is part of what scripture teaches, Isaiah 48, 10. Behold, I have refined you, but not as silver, I have tested you in the furnace of affliction, the refiner's fire. First Peter 1, 6 through 7 says, In this you greatly rejoice that even though now for a little while, if necessary, you have been distressed by various trials, so that the proof of your faith being more precious than gold, which is perishable, even though tested by fire, may be found to result in praise and glory and honor at the revelation of Jesus Christ. We are learning things. We are growing, we are becoming more through these trials and tribulations. Norman Geisler is right when he says that God knew that Christians would be like tea. Their real strength comes out when they get in hot water. This is not the best world, but it does seem to be the best way to the best world. This is not the best world possible, but God is the best being possible. Now, the best being possible must accomplish the best end possible. But this world is the best way to the best world. Therefore, making this world was the best way to achieve the best world possible. That's the purpose of evil, but that explains a lot of the moral evil. But what about physical evil? Right? We understand that we have made choices that cause evil, but what about the problem of natural disasters and things that we're not choosing, if you would, the problem of physical evil, and it goes something like this moral evil can be explained by free will, but physical evil does not result from free will. Earthquakes, tornadoes, floods, the like. Hence, physical evil cannot be explained by free choice. No one chooses to have these things happen to them. Well, I do that, I do think that free will and physical evil have a closer relationship to each other than we might like to admit. So some of these, some are directly self-inflicted, such as some evil happens because you yourself have abused the body, right? The natural consequence of drinking a lot of alcohol that you chose to do is a destroyed liver. So you abuse the body itself. Some are indirectly self-inflicted, such as poverty from laziness. So there might be results outside of your control that were brought about by your own uh self-inflicted choices, such as laziness. Or some directly result from free choices of others, such as child abuse, right? That is an absolute evil. But that came about by the free choices, even though the child didn't have control, that was the free choice of somebody else. That's not God. And some result indirectly from free choices of others. This is an indirect um kind of cause and effect here, such as the poverty of children from who parents abuse alcohol, right? They're not physically hurting the child, but because the parents are physically hurting themselves, that environment is therefore affected because of those free choices they make. That then impacts the children in a negative way. So they are having this physical problem because of somebody else's free choices. And some are byproducts of a good process, such as floods. But it is good to have rain. And so it's a byproduct of them. Some are necessary for a greater good physically, right? The bird gets the worm, but it is the worm that gets eaten. That's good for the bird, but bad for the worm. So it is, it is necessary for a greater good physically in nature. And some are needed for greater moral good, such as character, right? If you decide to climb Mount Everest, that is a physically demanding uh task, and all kinds of great moral character will develop from partaking in that task that that person will have if successful, that I don't have. However, there is a risk of that there is a physical harm that could come to you by trying to achieve that greater moral good. And some may be inflicted by God as punishment for our free choices. God does have the right as judge to punish evil. And guess what? All of us are evil, and we often wonder why doesn't God punish such and such? So and so. And then when he does that, then we go, What's up with that, God? Right. So it's it's an is a catch 22. Some are a result of Adam's free choices, right? All of creation groans and is cursed because of the free choices in Adam. And Romans 5 says that all sinned in Adam. So ultimately, a lot of what we're dealing with is because of Adam as our representative head, and us under his covenant headship, we chose all sin, and therefore we have the consequences of a cursed world. Of course, none of you in the garden would have done any better than Adam, right? It wasn't the apple on the tree, it was the it was the pear on the ground. And finally, some may be inflicted by evil spirit beings, such as we see in Job. So don't forget, it's not just our free will or our free choices that bring on problems. There are other agents beyond humans that do have free will that cause issues as well. Lucifer in heaven being the case in point. So the problem is that since God can do miracles, why doesn't he intervene? Right? Why doesn't he intervene and prevent this physical evil? Well, kind of like before. In his first coming, he did intervene. He did come. He did perform miracles. He did stop a lot of these things. And in the future, he's coming again. He's done it in the past. He'll do it in the future. But if he did it regularly, then God couldn't defeat evil, right? He permits evil in order to defeat evil because he can't destroy evil without destroying the good that he wills. And he would never we would never learn from our bad choices. So some examples, right? We learn that driving too fast is dangerous. That's a free choice. But without those consequences that happen, we don't learn those lessons. Drunk driving can be fatal. Weapons can be dangerous, right? Be careful with a sharp knife. Really bad things can happen. And we cannot even live a moral life since it depends on knowing natural consequences for our actions. Right? He can't destroy all evil without destroying all freedom in the process. So again, why not destroy evil rather than just defeat it? Well, God cannot destroy evil, moral or physical, without eliminating genuine creaturely freedom. And genuine creaturely freedom is a great good that God has willed. God genuinely is free and has a free will and makes choices, and we are made in his image, and that is good that we are made in his image. And so eliminating creaturely freedom would eliminate a great good that God himself wills to be. And a perfectly good God cannot act contrary to his own perfectly good nature by needlessly eliminating a greater good. Therefore, God has morally sufficient reasons to permit evil temporarily rather than eliminating the greater good of creaturely freedom. So God's purpose is not merely to eliminate evil, but ultimately to defeat evil while preserving the greater good of creaturely freedom. Like we said before, C.S. Lewis noted that I would pay any price to be able to truthlessly say, all will be saved, but my reason retorts, without their will or with it. For if I say without their will, I at once perceive a contradiction. How can the supreme voluntary act of self-surrender be involuntary? And if I say with their will, my reason replies, How? If they will not give in. There are only two kinds of people in the end: those who say to God, Thy will be done, and those to whom God says in the end, Thy will be done. All that are in hell, choosing. And without that self-choice, there could be no hell. Now, these are these are some of the logical problems of evil, and they they have good answers, and we can address this. But I just want to leave you with a few practical things. Okay. I want to leave you with a note of wisdom. Right? If you can learn all the theodicies out there, all how to deal with all the problems of evil, but that is not always the most helpful approach. So what you want to do, whenever somebody asks you about the problem of evil, you need to ask a question. When somebody says, Well, what about all the evil and suffering that God allows? You need to ask, why do you ask that? And how they answer determines how you answer. So you say, Why do you ask that question? And if they say something to the extent, well, I've been studying this and this and philosophy, and I don't think there's a great, well, you know what? Just unload on them and have a great time. Just give them all the answers you have, do the best you can. But often what you're going to find is that it there's another reason, right? Those are the logical problems of evil, but never forget there is an emotional problem of evil. And a lot of times it will be something, why is there so much evil and suffering if God exists? Why do you ask that? Because I backed over my child in the driveway a week ago. Well, that's not the time to sit there and give all the best answers that you have in your pocket. So you need to be wise when addressing this. Be sure to ask, why do you ask that? All right. And remember, you need to think about the posture you take on this. You need to read the book of Job and what that posture looks like that. Right? When God kind of gets a little sassy back with Job and says, Where were you when I did all this? You know, answer me if you know. If your days are so long, why don't you tell me? Gird up your loins like a man. You need to have a posture of humility when addressing this problem. That's what happens in the book of Job. That's what Paul does in Romans 9 when we say, Well, how could how could God find fault with anybody if he's sovereign over all things? And Paul's response is, Who are you, O man, to answer back to God? Our posture needs to be in line with the way that scripture postures as well. So I'm going to recommend two essential resources on this. Okay, and they're two totally different camps. If you notice, I'm I'm trying to play to both fields here, the Arminian and the Calvinists. I'm trying to walk this line side by side. And I think there's two resources that both sides need to read. One of them is Norman Geisler's If God, why evil? I think it just gives a great, broad overview of how this has historically been answered. And I think you just need to have these in your pocket, anyways. And another one is Greg Weltie's book, Why Is There Evil in the World and So Much of It? And this really hits the greater good theodicy, which I think is ultimately where it ends up. And it also hits the posture appropriately. And so you kind of have the logic and the posture side by side as you address this issue because it's a hard issue, right? This has been an issue for 2,000 years and longer. And I'm not going to solve this issue over one single podcast. But I want you to have some resources. So check that out. If if evil, if God, why evil? And why is there evil in the world and so much of it by Greg Weltie and Norman Geisler. So check those two out and know that you're probably not going to solve the issue as well. Why? Because God's ways are higher than ours. We are finite and he is infinite. I don't know why there is so much pain, suffering, and evil, at least specifically. But I know why I don't know. It's because I'm not God. I don't know why. But I do know the God who does know why. And you need to turn to him for comfort and trust in him today. I'm Matt Hayswood. I'll see you next time. Hey, thanks for spending this time with me on the Actual Answers Podcast. My prayer is that these conversations help you know God more deeply, trust his word more confidently, and engage the world more faithfully. Hey, if this episode was helpful, be sure to subscribe, share it with others, and send in your questions or rebuttals for future episodes at questions at actual answers podcast.com. Until next time, keep asking your questions, keep seeking truth. And remember, Christianity doesn't hear questions, it provides actual answers. I'm Matt Hazelwood, and I'll see you next time.