Navigating Alcohol's Role in Our Lives

Chad McLain records an early episode of his podcast, The Moral of the Story, with longtime friend and businessman Chris Blount, focusing on examining one’s relationship with alcohol. They discuss moving beyond a binary “no problem vs. problem” view to asking whether drinking contributes positively, neutrally, or negatively to the life someone wants, and emphasize common sense, self-awareness, habits, and control. 

Chris describes twice stopping drinking by personal choice, notes social expectations in business and dining settings, and talks about replacing drinking with alternatives like club soda. Chad shares how alcohol can diminish capacity, waste time with family and work, and how boredom and numbing can drive drinking. 

Chad also describes personal injury cases involving drunk driving, over-service, and severe legal and life consequences. They end by framing the “moral” as awareness creating choice and enabling change.

Menu: 

• 00:00 Pre Show Banter
• 00:47 Mic Setup Check
• 01:58 Producer Notes Flow
• 03:36 LLC Side Question
• 04:35 Podcast Intro Topic
• 06:01 Personal Compass Breaks
• 07:18 Business Social Drinking
• 09:54 Pressure And Expectations
• 12:14 Beyond Binary Thinking
• 14:11 Addiction Consequences Story
• 17:41 Control And Common Sense
• 19:45 High Performers Justify
• 22:52 Need A Drink Mindset
• 23:58 Benefits Versus Costs
• 25:52 Moderation and Stigma
• 27:44 Time and Diminished Days
• 30:25 Why We Drink
• 31:36 Pressure Anxiety and Faith
• 33:58 Bottom of the Bottle
• 36:12 Social Life Without Booze
• 38:27 Retrain Your Brain
• 40:27 Lawyer View on DUI
• 46:22 Self Check and Moral
• 52:58 Closing and Next Episode

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:04

I'm Chad McLean, and today is my first episode uh recording a podcast, and I'm really excited about it. The name of the podcast is The Moral of the Story. And today we're going to talk about examining our relationship with alcohol. I have my friend Chris Blunt here, and we're both a little bit nervous, but it'll be fine, a little bit anxious about what we're going to talk about. We probably have all had this situation where we woke up one morning after we had been drinking, and we were like, it wasn't anything terrible that happened, but we woke up. Things just seemed a little bit off. We were a little bit cloudy. Maybe we weren't as quick as we normally are to get up and get ready. And today's episode is talking about what do we do in reaction to that, whether or not we should talk about and examine our relationship with alcohol. Chris and I have been friends for 25 years-ish. Um, and Chris is a uh local businessman. He owns multiple very successful businesses, and um I've seen the ups and downs of his life, and that's the main reason I want him to come on because we're both comfortable talking about this subject. Thanks for being here, Chris. My pleasure. Glad to be here. Good. Um, well, let's start it out by uh talking about. Have you ever thought about that? Have you ever thought about examining your relationship with alcohol and why?

SPEAKER_01 1:31

Well, number one, I have, and I've uh it's like a compass, it's an internal compass. And um I have on two different occasions in my life stopped drinking, um, not because a doctor said something, not because someone told me I had to, not because of any of those reasons. But I just evaluate, I I do that a lot in my life, whether it be spiritually, whether it be uh just relationships I have with particular people. If I feel like that, you know, it's probably not a good thing, then I kind of stopped communicating with them. So um, but yeah, uh examining the and putting a barometer on consumption of alcohol and and other stimulants, coffee, things of that nature.

SPEAKER_00 2:15

Well, I think one of the things, at least for me, is that it's to me, it was like a binary situation where it was something that was good to do or not good to do. It was like either it's okay to do or there was a problem. And if there's a problem, especially with alcohol or some sort of substance, then there's a a kind of a social stigma that goes with that. So it's like you don't people kind of stay away from I don't know if everybody thinks about it that way, but that binary world, because you want to stay on the positive side of that and not the bad side of that. Is that kind of what you thought about too?

SPEAKER_01 2:47

Correct. I mean, nothing will kill your business than be an absolute idiot um and misbehave or you know, act in a way that's unprofessional. I mean, that uh people typically will like to talk about those environments, and so when you go to trade shows and conferences and things of that nature, um, yes, drinking is a is is very prevalent in those environments. I mean, there's a lot of a lot of parties, a lot of extracurricular activities are going on, uh, and alcohol is definitely a part of that process and and misbehaving is I mean, everything's great until it's not.

SPEAKER_00 3:25

Right. Right? Yeah. Well, do you feel like um it's almost like an expectation in your social circles? It's like you're almost on the outside if you don't partake it.

SPEAKER_01 3:34

I wouldn't say you're not on the outside if you don't, because I've done it, right? So I've stopped. Um, you know, I think, and I think that you would probably agree that some people will feel like they need to have a beverage to loosen up, right? I don't, you know, just kind of take the uh if you feel uncomfortable in a social setting, right? So um yeah, I think that that's pretty common. I think in most, I think, you know, you don't, you know, like that, I don't know, happy hours. Now I read an article where they were talking about happy hours declining, you know. But you know, when I was 19, 21, 40, right, 40, yeah, well, I mean, to give to give hours a thing.

SPEAKER_00 4:15

To give a little bit of context, I mean, 25 years ago, um you and I, that was one of the places where we kind of, I mean, we met at the gym working out, but one of the places that we spent quite a bit of time was one of us was picking up a tab for a large group of people at a bar, right? I mean, that was I wouldn't call that necessarily the nature of our relationship, but there was a lot of alcohol involved and it it was kind of a center of our one of the centers of our social circles, right? I mean, to be fair.

SPEAKER_01 4:45

People, people, um, including myself and people that I hang out with are very generous to others. And, you know, if there's a a a nice gathering, then let's let's continue this festivity and let's all have a great time, right? Like, why stop now? So anyway, and so yeah, I mean that's how you I mean that's how a lot of people I think met, you know, and um not very not very many will meet in a gym or church or whatever else. Usually it's a bar environment or or a dinner. I I love the restaurants that have bars now. I think that's really, you know, really kind of funny, where it's really more of a bar than it is a restaurant.

SPEAKER_00 5:23

Right. Well, I find myself, I mean, I I'm an attorney and I'm a father, I'm a single 57-year-old man, and I find myself, you know, when I go out, um You're only 57. I'm I'm an unmarried 57-year-old man, let me say. And um, I do have a girlfriend at this time. And so I I find myself anytime I go out, I mean, go out to dinner, go out anywhere, it's like the first question you're asked is can I give get you a glass of wine or a cocktail or whatever? It's not, can I bring you a diet coke, right? Or can I bring you water? And so it's it seems like in almost every environment you're in, um, there's there seems to be a lot of social pressure for alcohol. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 6:08

I okay. Yes. I I don't know if it's pressure. I don't feel pressure. Maybe some people feel pressure. Um what do you what do you experience? I per personally it's do you want a beverage or not? You know, uh and if I feel like it, um great. You know, when I when I took the breaks, it was, you know, and then it was, you know what I will say that when I stopped drinking a couple different times, and right now I'm I'm really not drinking. Uh I've had a couple ounces in the last um few months. Um but people are like, oh, you know, it's like it's like, oh like that's you know, it's okay. Uh there's not a stigma to it, but I can see where some people might feel that way or feel awkward when they they get that kind of response. You go to a friend's house and they're like, Hey, I got you. I'm like, oh, I'm sorry, I didn't I'm not drinking right now. What? What's wrong? You know, I've had that.

SPEAKER_00 7:08

Yeah, I found when there's um you probably put more of that pressure on yourself than others put on you. I mean, it's it's like, you know, my my parents and my grandparents used to tell me is you think a lot more about yourself than other people do. You think other people think a lot more about you than they do. Like they, you know, most people don't. Um, I've experienced both um with with alcohol in particular, um, just people questioning if everything was okay, more or less, when you're not drinking. Like they it again, the expectation, I don't know that I would consider it um pressure. One of the things that I thought about sort of um to take us out of that what I called the binary world of it's either good or it's you got a problem, is what if we didn't ask that question? Do you have a problem? And instead we thought about it of it in a way, is it is the use or drinking alcohol contributing in a positive way to your life? Like is it is it aiming you um pushing you in the right direction? Are you or is it pushing you towards the life you want to lead? Right. No, that's fair.

SPEAKER_01 8:17

Uh yeah, I I you know, you know, my you know, for me personally, it's I didn't I don't wake up and go, I can't remember what happened last night. I have friends that I'm close to that I'm like, do you remember last night? I think, you know, like what do you mean you think, right? So either you do or you don't. Yeah. Um and so I never had, I forgot that. You know, um, I've never I I'm fortunate that uh I really very seldom would I ever have a hangover. I didn't feel bad. Right. Which is probably a bad thing, too, right? I mean, you would want the consequences to be able to do that. Didn't need to be the negative. Yeah, you're like, oh, I don't want to feel like shit tomorrow. Part of the French. Anyway. Um it's okay to say shit. Oh, yeah, it's just is this PG rated, I guess. So anyway.

SPEAKER_00 9:11

Um the owner of this podcast says it's okay to say shit. Okay, well, great.

SPEAKER_01 9:15

I might throw a couple F-bombs around it now that you said that. But anyway, so yeah, let's not go too far. Fair enough. Um, so anyway, you know, the thing is that it's just finding your your space as an individual, as a human being, just a just as a person, right? Just find where you're comfortable. If you feel like coffee, too much coffee is causing you problems, then don't drink so much coffee. It's not real, you know. Common sense really does play into a lot of this. Um, you know, and and one of the things I was talking to a friend of mine the other day who is in as a recovering alcoholic, and he's a great guy, and or I'm not sure if he's he's a recovering addict. And he was sharing with me because we were talking, I said, Yeah, I'm I'm gonna do a podcast for a friend of mine. He's like, What? You're doing a podcast? What about your business? And I'm like, no, it's something completely different, right? Um and he shared with me. I'm not gonna give you his name because I don't want to talk any crap on him. Usually I would in a private setting. So um but anyway, he he he shared with me that he would knew of an opportunity that he had early on in his life, and he knew a vice president with this organization was coming in to meet with him to probably promote him. But but he wanted to go out and get ripped. And he knew in advance, before he did it, that he might or it was a 50-50 shot whether he's gonna be able to make that meeting the next day. And he still made that decision.

SPEAKER_00 10:52

Made the decision to get ripped. The night before he was gonna meet.

SPEAKER_01 10:56

And he missed that meeting. And the consequences was he didn't get promoted. Right. And you know, and and so you think about people that have an addiction problem.

SPEAKER_00 11:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:06

Right? Like the consequences, he knew of the consequences before he made his choice. Right. And you know, I've never experienced that. Luckily, I've been blessed, right?

SPEAKER_00 11:17

So and I and I think that's I think that's really brings a lot of what we're talking about kind of to a head is when you're they're extremes to it. So, first of all, what I want to say is I don't have any intention of saying I'm not gonna be the I'm not judgy judgy, right? We're not I'm not here today to say that alcohol is bad at all. You do your own research on that. I'm not here to say that people that go to happy hour drink every day. I'm not saying that that's bad. I'm not making the judgment call on that. The whole purpose of what I wanted to talk about is, and and you inevitably you have to talk about those kind of things, those are examples and stories. Um, is that, hey, if it, you know, just look at it, man. Just, you know, think about whether or not you believe it's healthy for you, whether or not it's again, whether or not it's contributing in a positive way or maybe even a neutral way towards the life that you want to live, right? And so that's all I was saying is, you know, I've had times when you're talking about no hangover. I can't say that, that I've never had a hangover, but um times when I had a couple of glasses of wine and I woke up and I just had this little tinge of a headache. Just a couple of glasses of wine. And it's like, how much, how distracting is that gonna be for the day, right? Even after you try to medicate that, take a little bit of Advil or leave, it's like, why would you do that? Like, what's the I mean, if you know that next time, just like what you're talking about, making that conscious decision um to go out and get ripped before you've got this important day, that is extreme, right? That's when you've lost you've kind of lost control over um doing things that are leading you in the you know, leading your life in the right way. Um certainly don't want to, again, I don't, I'm not trying to be um judgmental. So a question for you, Chris, is I kind of went down a rabbit hole with that.

SPEAKER_01 13:11

So I think I think the the reality is for me, is utilizing common sense and and when I stopped, the times that I did stop, right? I'm like, you know, I had a little too many, too often. Right. And so how you know, for me, too many too often is where you're drinking, like I just I'm gonna give a random example. If you have a couple beverages five nights in a row, is that too much? Yeah, uh there's people that'll tell you yes. Right. So everybody's got their opinion, right? Right. And just examining that and recognizing that and going, okay, you know what? I you know, I I don't want it to control me. I want to make sure I'm in control of myself. Right. And as long as I'm doing that, I'm fine. Well, I think and I like I said before, I mentioned this, and that probably led me to being on this podcast. I had a wonderful relationship with something called vodka, right? I did that for a really long time. Right. And uh we were we were like best buds, right? So, and then then I ended up hanging out with your brother Bourbon, right? So, anyway, after I took a break. So that's kind of that's kind of my journey with a lot of that stuff.

SPEAKER_00 14:24

Well, and the control is that that was kind of where I came with it, is it was like I I didn't feel like I had lost control, but I I I had that question. Um, and it really, really wasn't prompted by anybody or anything. Is it like I'm I mean, I don't know if I'm if I'm a control freak by nature or my career makes me be a control freak in much of my life. But I was like, I don't, I'm I can't say for sure that I'm in control of this. And I was like, I'm I'm gonna be able to say I'm in control of it. That's that was kind of the the um where I came with the decision about um I have not completely I stopped for a while and I have, you know, I drink every once in a while, but it's not anything like it used to be. And I think dominant personality. And so I had to I had to get in that place where I was like, I am in control of this, it is not in control of me.

SPEAKER_01 15:14

I think dominant personalities um and I'm not gonna say control freaks, but dominant personalities that want that are driven to be successful. Yeah. No matter what. They're driven to be successful. They'll pay the price, they'll put in the time, they'll do the they'll do the extra work, they'll go the extra mile, things of that nature. I feel like those are the people that one participate a lot in social activities with alcohol and things like that. Yeah. But they're also the ones that are, you know, they're working on the weekends, they're going to the gym, they're they're they're they're focused on being successful.

SPEAKER_00 15:59

Well, and that's the other other thing um that was part of sort of the process for me too, is that you know, if you if you wake up and you are um in any way diminished capacity, could be 2% diminished capacity, and you're going to run, you know, a thousand dollar business, a million thousand dollar business, a million-dollar, multimillion dollar business, you're not going to make decisions the way that you would if you were not diminished capacity, right? Like, I mean, and I I just like you use the term common sense, I think at some point in time, and it's not just with alcohol, I think we lose our ability to apply common sense, right?

SPEAKER_01 16:38

No, lack of judgment. I mean, they were study after study to talk about that.

SPEAKER_00 16:43

Right. That's part of the problem, is we lose our ability to, I mean, common sense is some people don't have it. I mean, but if assuming you have common sense, that's that's part of the problem. So you you were talking just a minute ago, this um you didn't say it, but kind of alluding to it where these high performers, um, people who um work hard all day and they get into it goes back to this um why they drink or how they drink or how they justify drinking. And it's like you deserve it. Like after a hard day at work, it's like I deserve to go sit at the bar for an hour or two and have a couple of cocktails with my buddies, right? I mean, that's easy, right? I mean, everybody would say that that's justification. And that's why I'm talking about, that's why I kind of backed up with kind of the the theme of this episode was if that's what you want to do, that's fine. All I'm suggesting is just think about it, right? Think about it in the context of is going and sitting at the bar for two hours every day or three or four days a week leading you into the direction you want your life to go, right? That's all. Don't think about just between now and when you go to bed tonight. Think about two years, five years, ten years from now. Right? Does that make sense?

SPEAKER_01 18:01

No, I I I think well, right. I think, but I think it goes back to once again the personality traits of those people. I've got friends that are not social at all unless they drink. Yeah, I don't know if you have any of those or not. Um, but they're just not very social. They're they're they, you know, and then another stigma that that's really interesting to me, and we say we hear this all the time, and people will say, Oh man, I need a drink. And you're like, Okay, you know, that's but I mean, I mean, like, why why I mean I you need something. You're so something just pissed you off, or someone just something just frustrated you, or you had a rough day, right? And now you need you need something to take, you know, give you a break, or you just I need to go to the gym, okay.

SPEAKER_00 18:54

You know, or well, that's a real world example. Right. That's a real world example of how we have how we andor society has wired us to think, right? Like I need a drink. Well, that's the response to a hard day, or somebody just upset me, or somebody something happened I didn't want to happen, or whatever. It's like, you're right. Why why didn't it we should just go to the gym or I should just go down to the river of trails and run five miles. Right. No.

SPEAKER_01 19:19

I need to run 50 sprints.

SPEAKER_00 19:20

I'm gonna go, I'm gonna go have five shots of tequila. And that'll make me feel great. Yeah. Yeah, right. So one of the things um that to me it's like changing um the way you ask questions about it yourself or in that context, and it's like what are you what are you getting from it and what is it costing you? Right? That's not that binary situation I was talking about. It's like what when you think about what is the positive or what is the thing that you get, things that you get from drinking alcohol. Have you thought about that? Because I mean that would be why you would continue to drink, right? That you're getting something from it.

SPEAKER_01 20:03

Yeah. Um what you know, I I don't know if I've ever asked myself that question. What what is the benefit for me to drink? Um just off the cup. What is it?

SPEAKER_00 20:22

What do you get? Like what you go to dinner and you have a glass or two of wine, what do you get from it?

SPEAKER_01 20:27

No, I think the reality is that nothing. For me, I mean, people when I you know, which which, you know, and I I've alluded to this in another conversation we've had one time. Uh I'm like, even people are like, you are crazy. You know, and I you know, and I'm like, well, yeah, you know. Um and then they're like, your personality is the same, whether you're drinking or not drinking. And I'm like, Yeah, I know. So and so it's just funny. It's just funny because they thought that maybe because I was participating in something or uh alcohol with them, or we're having drinks or whatever, that that is changing who I am or what I or how I behave. Well, I mean, does it do youth? And I but I guess that I guess there that is common with people. So, you know, it's just at the end of the day, I keep coming back to this, you know, it's common sense, make good decisions as you say. Do you get anything positive from it? And if you don't get anything positive from it, then why are you doing it? Or, you know, and you don't want to you also don't want to, you know, create a stigma is that alcohol's bad. Alcohol's great. As long as, you know, everything's great in moderation for all intents and purposes. Right. Right? I mean, too much caffeine. I mean, I got it. By the way, I had the my cardiologist yesterday. I had my meeting. They gave me a green, they told me my heart was great. I'm like, how can that be? You know, right? So they're like, Yeah, go to the gym, get back in there. So um, you know, it's just it's just funny because you know, it's just uh it's just Interesting. It's just the stigma isn't interesting.

SPEAKER_00 22:03

I don't think we're um I agree with you 100% what you just said, but I don't think that the people that I'm that I'm talking about are the ones that have control of it and have a lot of common sense and make really good decisions all the time and they don't drink too much and all that. I'm just talking about people who I mean, it's honestly is most of the people that I find in my wider social sphere, right? Like, I mean, there they're obviously there are people that do um have control, they don't drink all the time, and if they do, they don't drink with one or two. But I mean, one or two has never been the problem. Correct. Right? Right. No, I agree. One and or two is not the problem. Ten's the problem.

SPEAKER_01 22:49

Yeah, I'm gonna say and that's why if you have one or two, when it comes to wine, it's the fourth, fifth, and sixth that really kick your ass. Well, it's the bottle, it's the bottle and maybe the second bottle. Right. Uh yeah, I I think it's I think it's great when people uh Oh yeah, I just want one more.

SPEAKER_00 23:10

Well, one of one of the things I made him drink it. Yeah, when when I think about what does it do, um, what positive have I gotten from it, what does it take, and as I think about time, and I think about that more the older I've gotten and the older I get is because it seems like number one, especially with you know, my kids, one freshman in college getting ready to finish his freshman year, the other one's a junior getting ready to finish their junior year of high school. I've got nine to twelve more months and I'm gonna be an empty nester, right? And so when I think about time and again, this 2% or 20 or 30 or 40% diminished when you wake up and you're around them. If I'm a diminished capacity, then I'm not getting, I'm not getting everything I can out of those few minutes with them, right? That little bit of time. Um and I think about that with my business too. Like if I go in and I'm a few minutes, a few percentage points diminished, I'm not, I'm wasting that time or part of that time. And it's precious, and we only have it one, we got one shot at it, right? And so um that works for me, that kind of analysis and holding it under that microscope most of the time, not all the time, like I said. Sometimes I fall short too. Um, but anyway, that the waste of time seemed to be the biggest ones.

SPEAKER_01 24:34

Um do you um I was just thinking about like in my in my relationship with Michelle, um, you know, dinner time is her time. Yeah. Right.

SPEAKER_00 24:50

So that's like something you guys, that's like a routine.

SPEAKER_01 24:53

I mean, I uh with my schedule and the way it is, and as much as I'm, you know, I was matter of fact, I'm anyway, I I I do a lot of traveling. I'm back in that the sequence of traveling and and working weekends, trying to keep things rolling. And so the dinner time is her time, right? So um and and and find, you know, I don't have like like I've you know, I've we've got a well, we've got a senior in high school right now, so we're not uh I guess we're gonna be kind of empty nesters, but um uh so it's just it's just different, right? So I'm I I don't have that I don't have that time element that you you talked about. I don't have a a real successful law firm that that I can I can schedule. Yeah, you have multiple successful businesses. Well, but they but they require a lot of a lot of uh a lot of patience and a lot of um a lot of a lot of hands-on, even though we have we have a lot more employees, I think. Uh I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 25:50

Close to the side. It's okay. Um so one of the things that uh I think this is where we've moved in this conversation is that to talk about people when when people drink, it's like why do they drink? And I know for myself, I um didn't know this at the time, but it was basically numbing things, things that I didn't want to think about or I didn't want to deal with. Um, you know, I didn't want to sit at home by myself. I got bored. And when I would get bored, that was like an automatic, you know, light flipped off in my head. It's like, well, I know one place I can't, I won't be bored. I can go to the bar, right? I got plenty of friends there. And so right. Well, I got a lot of friends. Right, right. That's a bunch of my friends are there. And so it bring to me, it brings the question of um if you think about this thing that we're talking about, examining your relationship with alcohol, are you more afraid of not drinking, or are you more afraid of what you would find out or what you would see if you stop drinking?

SPEAKER_01 27:02

I I that that didn't affect me. I think um But I, you know, I I uh you you you said something that just triggered uh something from my past. You know, it is a lot it is a lot different when you're older than when you're younger. Right? Tell me what you mean by that. Well, it's so you know, when you feel in a tremendous amount of pressure and anxiety, it's like, you know, I I do I'm just starting to think back and and I re I remember having some of those feelings like, oh man, this is this is oh my gosh, I need to take I need to try to, you know, I need to take that edge off, right? And not realize, you know, you don't realize it when you're young, maybe. You don't like, okay, you're creating a bad habit, but the older you get, you're like, look, this shit's gonna pass. Just take a breath. Yeah. Breathe. Yeah. If you, you know, if you're faithful, if you believe in your, you know, if you're one of those people that get into faith and things of that nature, like myself, then might say a prayer. You might do whatever. Just clear your mind for a second, take a deep breath, and respond, versus I need a cocktail, or or I need I need to get shot. This is ridiculous.

SPEAKER_00 28:19

Well, you've figured out a little bit more about how life works, right? Like there's so many things you can't you that you don't control, like most of life you don't control. And so you spent I spent a lot of my life um not, I don't know, I guess I knew that, but I'd, you know, not um putting that into practice. And you spent a lot of I think stomach lining and your life um worrying about things or trying to control things that you just can't, right? Right. I think that's what you're talking about.

SPEAKER_01 28:50

Yeah, but but you but I right. Yes, yeah, absolutely. But there is an element though, when you're younger, that you you feel like, man, this is a lot to deal with. Yeah. It's just a lot to deal with. And so anything to take that edge off. Yeah. And I've and I've got I've got friends even today that um that will will make those kind of comments. It's funny.

SPEAKER_00 29:20

So you guys know you're at 33 minutes, so it's all really good. Cool. Um I wrote down this question. Um I'm not sure it's really a discussion point, but I thought it was a funny question. Uh oh. And it's um, have you ever found the answer to an important life question at the bottom of a bottle or glass?

SPEAKER_01 29:46

Absolutely not.

SPEAKER_00 29:50

So it goes back to that question we talked about a minute ago about what's the positive and what's you know, what does it take?

SPEAKER_01 29:56

I I do have something funny to say though.

SPEAKER_00 29:58

Okay, go ahead.

SPEAKER_01 29:59

Um, what if I'd said yes?

SPEAKER_00 30:02

I'd want to know what it was because I would want to know and what and what the bottle is.

SPEAKER_01 30:06

Yeah, no, I I just um Yeah, no, of course, no. I mean, yeah, I I think that um for me, what's uh as of in my later years, right? You know, I'm still I'm getting up there. You're an old man. I'm I feel I'm I tell you what, my body feels like it. Um you know when I when I I get in the office, like I go to the office a lot on the weekends, as you know, and I get in there and I just start, I just let everything just soak for the week, kind of clean my plate, know what I've got going on. I've got Monday and Tuesday kind of addressed before the week starts. And I just kind of decompress.

SPEAKER_00 30:50

How long have you done that? How long has that been your practice, your schedule?

SPEAKER_01 30:55

I used to do it at home and try to do it at home, or I'd try to do it on Sunday nights, like the family's, you know, basically the family's all taken care of, and I'm gonna go do a little bit of work and just prep for the day. Uh it's different when I get to the office because I just let it just wash off for the week and prep for the next. And then what I also do is I just reflect and I come up with some great ideas that way.

SPEAKER_00 31:19

Did you did you do the same sort of schedule when you were like drinking more? When you when you drank as much?

SPEAKER_01 31:26

Well, when I well, it depends. I mean, if you know, and granted, and I'll do in in all fairness, I'll spend a little bit less hours during football season in the office. Um because I do want to I do want to watch some football. Because there's something, yeah, something else to do. Um and yeah, it's just uh but when I was drinking more or being social, um now I that was that was an outlet, you know. I and once again, maybe um I'm less tolerant in my older age of being around certain people and around certain environments. Right. Um but I I I do enjoy the social element of uh you know doing dinners and things like that. And so uh there are you know there are cocktails and cigars and things like that on the weekends as well.

SPEAKER_00 32:17

Yeah, you like groups of people. It used to be we would sit at the bar, but you like now to do dinners because it seems a little more grown up to do that way, right? I mean it's not it's nothing like what it used to be, but yeah, that's kind of a progression, right? You still and that's one of the things that um I've had to ask questions about too. It's like those I am very social. I'm I am always want to be around a group of people. I'm the I want to be the last guy to leave the party.

SPEAKER_01 32:46

If people don't know this, you're a fantastic cook. So we need to get that started up again.

SPEAKER_00 32:52

Yeah, that's a great idea. That you I'm a grill, I'm a grill master. You're a grill master for sure. That is absolutely correct. But but the the the desire to be around people and the desire to not be bored to and to be around people is really hard. That pull is really hard to um put in perspective, particularly in the context of alcohol and alcohol consumption because of the pressure when you get around those. It's you you gotta rewire yourself, right? Like you gotta rewire yourself to be in those kind of environments and to be around those kind of people, or you gotta just like I can't be around those people, which is kind of what I've had what I had to do.

SPEAKER_01 33:32

You know, I I it's so you it's used so much now, it's retrain your brain, right? But it it really is. I mean, it's a thing. I mean, you can do that. And and if you as you'll remember, um, whenever I would take the breaks even years ago, because I think the longest I went was I want to say three years or something like that, right? Yeah, um, but that was back about seven or eight years ago. Yeah. Right. I um yeah, and once again, I don't know if we mentioned this earlier. No one said you need to stop drinking. No one didn't go into whatever, right? So it was just once again, it's a conscious decision. I want to and and I also think people I've got two two thought processes here. One, um I think a lot of people uh they they, you know, with with I don't know, they they fear like you know, like for instance, people were like, well, how are you gonna get when you're gonna have a drink again? I'm like, I don't know. It's like when I quit smoking, I'm not, yeah, I'm like, I'll whenever I'm comfortable, I'm comfortable. Whenever I'll do it, I'll do it. And it was for me just proving, and then I got into other habits, you know, and it's all about creating good habits. So it's like retraining your brain. And one of the things that I would do, which is one of my favorite beverages, is club soda, yeah, splash a tonic, yeah, and an orange watch. Yeah. It for some reason it feels it, it I don't know, it just tastes great, the bubbly, the sparkling water, the whatever. So um, I don't know. I think a lot of people just need to find different habits.

SPEAKER_00 35:05

And that's I think that's a good point, too, is there I don't like calling it an addiction, but it's addictive behaviors that contribute to your the amount and frequency of your alcohol consumption. And so you're gonna the fact is that um you're gonna pick up other habits. You're gonna have to do something to fix the boredom, right? The boredom or the the lack of things to do. It might be chewing a bunch of gum, it might be drinking coffee. I'm like an iced coffee fiend now. And so, yeah, that helps me. It does, it really does. I told the told the girl at the drive-in at Starbucks the other day that I was now an iced coffee addict. This is my second one of the day. Yeah, so one of the things um, you know, in my practice um doing plaintiff's personal injury work, um, and that's what our firm, all of our firm does, or all our firm does, um, is we see where we see alcohol being a problem is when someone goes out, maybe they're at their house, maybe they're at a bar or a restaurant, they they're drink too much, they get in a car, which you know, there's a series of mistakes there, series of problems there. And the most horrific um situations that we see are where they're overserved at a bar, they get behind the wheel, they blow through a you know traffic sign or stoplight or whatever, and they cause an accident and somebody gets killed. And so immediately you've got the person who was killed, and all of the people around them are impacted by this bad decision or these two or three bad decisions. You've got the driver of the vehicle, if somebody's dead or seriously injured, is going to be criminally charged. You've got the bar or restaurant who overserved them. Um, and if they did and they were noticeably intoxicated, that they're not criminally criminally liable, but they could be civilly liable. And so it's like all of a sudden, this person who maybe they didn't have a problem, right? Maybe they didn't drink all the time. They go out, and that might be the problem, is they went out and they're not, they don't have a high tolerance and they go out and have a few drinks, two, three, four glasses of wine, five glasses of wine, just having fun, business meeting or whatever. They leave, and all of a sudden, everybody that was in the path of destruction, their lives are changed. Some of them forever, right? Some of them are gone, and that's what we see um the most in.

SPEAKER_01 37:32

What you you mentioned earlier that you've seen that well, I mean, my m mine is nothing compared to that. And and but what's you know, when you think about that, um I had gotten pulled over 30 years ago, uh, 30 something years ago in Dallas, and uh I was charged. Um it didn't stick. Um but I remember saying, and and and it's I'm gonna tie it back to what you just talked about because um I we were at a wedding, and this girl was this girl was really messed up, and she was gonna drive, and I'm like, you can't drive. And I'm I'm I didn't even know this. I just met her that night at this wedding, and there was a group of us, and I'm like, you can't drive. She's like, What? No, yeah, I'm gonna drive. I'm like, no, you're not. You're too screwed up. Yeah. I'm I mean, I was, I mean, maybe it was longer than 30 years ago. But anyway, I just said, You're not gonna drive, not gonna let that happen. I end up driving, I didn't know Dallas, and they're like, follow us, and I'm like, follow you up anyway. I end up getting pulled over and I got charged, and I was so embarrassed because one, I got pulled over, two, they charged me. Uh, three, the fact that um I, you know, just just the embarrassment of it being in a paper or being publicized. And I cannot imagine, I mean, talk about feeling bad for someone. What about that one person that you described in your story? Um, by the way, uh, we changed because of that situation and the legal defense I had, uh, we changed the laws in the state of Texas. I'm kind of proud of that. But anyway, I like doing things in a big way. But anyway, uh, but going back to um that does not surprise me shocker. Um but one of the things that I think is interesting is that can you imagine how horrible, terribly horrible it would feel if you're not really a big social person and you go out and you have some drinks, maybe it's your one out of ten times you've ever done that, and you have destroyed your own life and just killed someone and the consequences and all that guilt.

SPEAKER_00 39:54

Well, that would be horrible. Well, in Oklahoma, it used to be that you didn't have um lawyers, for example, unless it was a crime um involving dishonesty or a felony, your your license was not at jeopardy. Um and now I don't know exactly what the reporting is, but now there is an auto reporting to um the governing board, um, the Supreme Court when a lawyer is arrested for a DUI. So if it there are certain instances where it doesn't trigger that ultimate warning, um, but a lawyer can lose their license now for getting a DUI. Nobody gets hurt. I mean, nobody they don't hit anybody, nobody says, No, no consequences outside of the You get a DUI and in some jurisdictions it would trigger an automatic to the Supreme Court and they issue a show cause notice, meaning you got to show cause why we shouldn't suspend your license. And you're talking about something that can, you know, I mean, take away your way, your means of making an income. Right. And you've changed a lot, you know, you've changed a lot. That's obviously being selfish, um, talking about lawyers and and DUI, but the instances I'm talking about with the drawer.

SPEAKER_01 41:08

We're talking about consequences, right? How you feel and and the consequences of those choices. Right. And um, yeah, it's crazy.

SPEAKER_00 41:17

If um, Chris, if somebody else described your relationship with alcohol, do you think it would match your description of your relationship with alcohol? Like if you ask my closest friends, your business associate.

SPEAKER_01 41:36

Right. You with me on that? I I got the question. Um I think it really depends on if they know me or not, right? Sure. Because if you don't know me, you'd be like, man, that guy is, you know, wow. Well, I mean, I think to be both, but let's say like you, you you might sit there and go, oh yeah, it's it's I can see that.

SPEAKER_00 41:56

When you say no, you do you mean the distinction between Chris with alcohol and Chris without always? In other words, the the level of energy you bring regardless, right? That is correct. Right. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 42:07

So that makes sense. You know, hands are moving, you know, typically I keep putting my hands down on my in ground.

SPEAKER_00 42:15

That's what people get on me about talking with my hands, and I move my hands on other sides. They're like, you should see my friend Chris.

SPEAKER_01 42:23

Well, you know, we thought about going into the weather as a uh being a meteorologist at one point in time in our lives. But anyway, so um I don't think I'd I guess I'd do it without even thinking about it. So but but it also gestures, right? So anyway, um I think those who know me would say that um they would agree with me, right? Um they would describe it the same way. They would describe it the same way. U maybe Michelle might say um I might be a little bit more irritable towards her if I've had a couple, uh if if something is said or something, right? But that's you know, that's somebody you've you've been with for 10 years, so of course they're gonna be a little more critical.

SPEAKER_00 43:04

Well, I think I think that's I think that's exactly what somebody would say about me is that I'm probably a little more um short. I mean, I'm pretty docile most of the time anyway, and I get more generally more docile after I've had a little, you know, a couple glasses of wine or a couple of cocktails. But it's kind of interesting, I guess consistent that the people closest to you would feel like you acted differently, right? And I think that's true with me too. I feel like I'm probably a little more sensitive to things, like I like I'm able to um calm my nervous system when I'm not drinking um and take things on the chin a little bit better, or things that might normally upset you don't upset me, but when I'm drinking, they they do, and it's like I I just slowly diminished a bit.

SPEAKER_01 44:08

Michelle's the only one that's told me that. Yep. So I I I respect that and I have to listen to that and and I'll you know um I and sometimes I will say I disagree with her.

SPEAKER_00 44:23

Just sometimes? Just some. All right. We'll just say that.

SPEAKER_01 44:26

We're on camera.

SPEAKER_00 44:27

Let me let this will be um in the last question or so is um do you think there's a point um in our lives, and I don't necessarily tie it to age, that we owe it to ourselves and the people around us to kind of reevaluate our relationship with alcohol? Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 44:45

I think everybody needs to reevaluate everything that they do. Do you work out enough? I don't work out. I haven't worked out in so many years, it's ridiculous. And I need to get back in the gym. I gotta, I've got to make that a priority. Um, I've got to reduce the amount of caffeine that I'm drinking now. It's ridiculous. Uh how many Americanos I drank yesterday, right? So um, you know, I think everybody needs to take, you know, just take a look at themselves when it comes to alcohol. Well, specifically alcohol based on the case. Okay, absolutely. Well, I mean, I think absolutely everybody needs to look at that. I think that if you're naive enough to think that you can do you can choose anything without evaluating it, and choices when it comes to anything that of substance. I mean, look, we live in a state where people have medical marijuana cards and they there's cannabis. And I've got a I've got another gentleman that I have dinner with periodically, and you know, he ought to reevaluate how much cannabis he participates in, right?

SPEAKER_00 45:55

Um Well, it's just that you, you know, the reasons that we use, like in the days when you and I talked about earlier, where we're going to the bar and we're like throwing down your credit card and picking up a tab for whoever shows up. Um, those were different reasons and justifications and different times. So we're just talking about like, that's not where we are now. Your life has changed, you're in a different, you know, stage in your life. So reevaluate whether or not. And that was that was kind of the one of the things I wanted to end with is again, that we're re-evaluating, not not saying it's bad, not saying you're not you don't have control of it, um, but we're reevaluating it to see if it's contributing to your life in a positive or negative way. Right. Right. And that's kind of the um the way I would leave and what I'll call the moral of the story is that um awareness of what role alcohol plays in your life creates choice. And when you have a choice, that gives you an opportunity to change. And I think that's the moral of the story. Um, if you got something from this episode today, talking about your relationship, examining your relationship with alcohol, we hope you got something from it. Um, if you did, come back and see us for the next episode. Hope to see you soon.