103: Making It Up to An Archdevil

On our return episode, Taylor tells us all the dirty details of everyone's favorite(?) archdevil Zariel!

Please excuse the dust on the audio. It's not quite our usual quality. We learned a lot for our first live, and we'll only improve from here.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:01

You the adventurer? Yes, you. Do you desire knowledge of immense worlds and arcane power? A codex of untold stories and lore? Or perhaps simply easy listening for your daily commute? And feast your eyes. Or more accurately, yes, upon Dungeon Pedia. Shit's about to get nerdy in here.

SPEAKER_03 0:48

Taylor Peasley.

SPEAKER_05 0:49

And I'm Travis Peasley.

SPEAKER_03 0:54

You know, that's not smart to switch things up on our first episode.

SPEAKER_05 0:59

Old habits die hard, man.

SPEAKER_03 1:01

They do indeed. Old habits die hard, dude.

SPEAKER_05 1:04

Yeah. My bad.

SPEAKER_03 1:07

It's okay. Uh right. My name is Taylor Peasley now, by the way.

SPEAKER_05 1:13

Yes, we got married. Yeah, they got married. I sound like this. You know. The more things stay the same, the more they change, I guess. That's not how that saying goes. But you know.

SPEAKER_03 1:25

But it works.

SPEAKER_05 1:26

You know, sometimes it'd be that way.

SPEAKER_03 1:28

Thank you. All right. Take a deep breath, ladies and gentlemen. We are back.

SPEAKER_05 1:35

Oh man. It's been a while. It has been quite some time.

SPEAKER_03 1:41

So I guess I will just start with getting into it. Let's explain a little bit about how the new format's gonna go. In order to keep most of the original flavor, we're probably not going to interact much with chat during the first hour. This is gonna be the regular podcast format where it's just kind of a discussion between the three of us. We will, of course, still be monitoring chat. So if anything happens, we'll be aware. But for the most part, it will probably seem like we're ignoring you, but we're not. We're just focused on talking.

SPEAKER_05 2:10

Um it's not, it's not, it's not you, it's us, you know. Exactly. Except like except for real, you know.

SPEAKER_03 2:16

Except for literally. Um, I'm estimating that to be at about an hour, depending on the topic. And right.

SPEAKER_05 2:25

Well, we and we famously never go over. We've famously never gone over roughly an hour. No, definitely not.

SPEAKER_03 2:34

Absolutely never. Um at that point, we're gonna switch over to the interactive portion, uh, which will last up to about an hour-ish as well, depending on how everyone's feeling, and we'll but all everyone wants to talk about it. This is where we'll interact with chat, answer questions, discuss hypotheticals, speculate, and whatever you guys want. We'll it's basically just gonna be a fun chat session. Yeah. In the future, we'll look at emails that any of you guys want to send to us to be read during this portion. We may adjust how we do these things in the future. Come up with a couple of different ways of doing this format and maybe try some of them depending on how you guys like this or want to do something else. Only way to see if it works is by trial and error.

SPEAKER_05 3:15

Yeah, is to just kind of do it.

SPEAKER_03 3:17

So yeah. I can't believe we're here. I know we're back in the back in the saddle. It feels simultaneously like it has been a blink of an eye, but also like it's been 84 years. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 3:31

Dude, for real.

SPEAKER_05 3:32

Like, yeah. I mean, honestly, I think for me, it really feels like it kind of hasn't been, it hasn't been that long. And then I have to remind myself that like, oh no, it it has been a little while. It has been a minute. It has been a minute, yeah. It has been. I was reminded how long it's been whenever I was going through our uh email cleaning it up again. Oh yeah, it's like oh yeah, that's that's that's the the the nature, I guess the nature of of of the passage of time, I guess.

SPEAKER_03 4:01

It does sneak up on you. But uh what I will say is this past month has really snuck up on me because we were busy hearing out all the details on this for a while.

SPEAKER_04 4:12

Yes, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 4:13

So I it's been a very busy month for me and for all of us, really. But you know, the devil is in the details, and this devil is full of details. That's right. Shitty transition time. Yes. This episode is about Zariel the Archdevil.

SPEAKER_04 4:31

Oh boy. Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_03 4:33

Archduchess of Avernus, Lord of the First, etc. etc. Uh today is our sort of sort of our first revisit. Uh, not a hundred percent. We never did a full deep dive on Zarael, but we have discussed her a number of times.

SPEAKER_05 4:48

Yeah, she's been mentioned. We've been we've been in there, we've been name we've we've name-dropped her a few times. Which feels like something you should you like you shouldn't do, I guess.

SPEAKER_04 5:00

You know, devil, probably not.

SPEAKER_03 5:04

So here we are. I was inspired to do this episode for a couple of different reasons. I discovered I was wrong about a number of things as recently, uh, specifically about Zaryel and Archdev's in general. Uh as recently as last month. That's unforgivable. Unforgivable.

SPEAKER_05 5:21

Hmm. Um what what exactly were you?

SPEAKER_03 5:24

I'm sure you'll probably get there, but I'm very curious. Zaryel was re referenced quite a bit recently, um, significantly in Baldur's Gate 3. So this might be a really good way for people to ease it if they decide that they want to start their dungeon pedia journey here.

SPEAKER_04 5:42

That's true. Um I mean Baldur's Gate 3, great game, big game.

SPEAKER_03 5:47

Yeah. Uh lots of people entered this whole like hobby because of Baldur's Gate 3.

SPEAKER_05 5:53

Yeah, I I would be, I would be very interested to to, you know, maybe hear from people. I don't know if that this reflects the experiences of anyone in in chat um or listening to this episode, you know, post you know, post-stream. But I would I would be very interested to hear from the experiences of people who got into Dungeons and Dragons because of Baldur's Gate 3. Um, because most of the people that I know who played Baldur's Gate 3 were DD fans first. So it kind of, you know, but I would be very, but it would, like you said, Travis, it was such a big game and such a such a successful game. I'd be very interested to hear from people about that kind of experience. Because it's the reverse. I'm sure that there's plenty of people that uh played that and then got into DD because of that. Yeah, because like even beyond beyond being like a DD, you know, kind of IP, you know, it's a it's big, you know, it's a beautiful game. So I'm sure there was a lot of interest even outside of that.

SPEAKER_03 6:55

So when I first started doing the research on this, or well, when I first started doing research for this episode, I started doing research on grass. And while I grass while I found doing that quite enjoyable, uh, he's a very interesting character. And I'm definitely gonna finish it up. And you know, I'd be totally willing to do to do a full episode on him later. The demon prints of pleasure and debauchery might be a little much for our first episode back.

SPEAKER_05 7:23

I mean that's kind of but I mean I don't know. Look, I thought the debauch the debauchery is pretty par for the coin. The debauchery would be a shocking intro.

SPEAKER_03 7:37

It is very I don't want to put people off by thinking that we are uh freaks.

SPEAKER_05 7:44

I mean, I mean, yeah, you know the the the irony being the irony being in that the jumping off point uh for the Zarial discussion, potentially kind of being from Baldur's Gate 3 to this podcast, the irony being that like in the game, even though she's just referenced not not really as it's been out for a few years. Uh, you know, she's not a very nice person. She's not either.

SPEAKER_03 8:12

So, but you know, but yeah, well, in fairness, it's not so much that uh I was put off by Cast's meanness, that's not quite it. Um, it's uh the pleasure part more so.

SPEAKER_05 8:28

Yeah, I it the the the demon prints of pleasure and debauchery does evoke a certain yeah mental mental images, you know.

SPEAKER_03 8:38

So yeah. Either way, let's go ahead and dive in.

SPEAKER_05 8:41

Yeah, what's the gun for us?

SPEAKER_03 8:44

Uh so Zaryel was originally introduced in second edition, not first.

SPEAKER_05 8:49

Okay, so she's not quite as old as the game itself, but very close.

SPEAKER_03 8:53

Uh well 1999, actually.

SPEAKER_05 8:56

Oh.

SPEAKER_03 8:58

Zariel's younger than us. Zariel is younger than us. She should be at the club, man. Uh, so in 1999's Guide to Hell, written by Chris uh Pramus, uh, that was Zariel's first inclusion in a supplemental book. Technically speaking, in November of 1995, Dragon Magazine 223 had an article, The Lord of the Nine, which referenced Zariel, but did not mention her by name. It only said that she was the former Lord of Avernus.

SPEAKER_05 9:25

Oh damn. So they were just like, yeah, she was there, but not now. So we don't really need to actually reference it. Not even by name, too. Did they just kind of describe like a former?

SPEAKER_03 9:37

So specifically, they mentioned that there was a former Lord of Avernus uh struggling to break free that was imprisoned, that the new lord is siphoning her life force, and that she is specifically not Tiamat.

SPEAKER_04 9:52

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 9:53

Because remember for all of all of first edition and probably a good chunk of second edition, Tiamat was the only previously mentioned ruler of Avernus.

SPEAKER_05 10:01

Right. Tiamat we've we've talked about Tiamat a fair bit.

SPEAKER_03 10:04

Yeah. Uh interesting. So Guide to Hell is from everything I can tell, the very first real mention of Zarael and D D lore. The reason I write it specifically like that is because you guys, it's been five years since we've done this.

SPEAKER_05 10:20

Right. And there's so many.

SPEAKER_03 10:21

Oh no, hold on. I have a specific tangent. Oh no.

SPEAKER_05 10:25

Oh, I know this tangent actually.

SPEAKER_03 10:27

Yeah, I complained a lot to Travis when this happened. AI was not a thing when we did this last. Not really. Oh my god. Oh no.

SPEAKER_05 10:34

Okay, we've officially we've officially extended the runtime of this episode by like 20 minutes because we're just gonna sit here.

SPEAKER_03 10:41

I'm gonna I'm gonna make it real fast and sweet.

SPEAKER_05 10:45

We have to restrain the urge to just kvetch about it for 20 minutes.

SPEAKER_03 10:49

Yes. I have to navigate through threads that swear Zariel was mentioned in Planescape as an angel that was had a morbid fascination with the Blood War. Um, I found no such evidence.

SPEAKER_05 11:01

And that's such a like that's such a almost there because it references the blood war and like, you know, that kind of stuff. Yeah. It feels it does feel like something that could get cobbled together by AI, you know.

SPEAKER_03 11:15

All the posts I've seen are only mentioning it are only a few years old. So my best guess is that it was an AI hallucination that was posted without fact checking and then just repeated for like a right.

SPEAKER_04 11:27

Yeah, just repo. Yeah, yeah. Because man, and it's just AI.

SPEAKER_05 11:33

Yeah, and it doesn't help that like angel names, like so many angel names, they kind of kind of all sound the same. I don't know if this is a this is a thing, if this is something that you you you researched at all, or if it might just be that all angel names sound the same. But I was kind of curious if Zaryel was also like the name of a real life, like a real life angel from like mythology.

SPEAKER_03 11:54

I don't believe so. But if I'm not mistaken, E L, like the or just L is the uh as uh N to the name is basically of God.

SPEAKER_05 12:07

Okay, that makes sense.

SPEAKER_03 12:09

So that's why yeah.

SPEAKER_05 12:10

That's why all angel names sound like that.

SPEAKER_03 12:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 12:14

Uh okay, I guess that would make sense, yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 12:18

So but interestingly enough, it really didn't mention that she was an angel for a really long time. Um she had a very obviously angelic name. In Guide to Hell, the very first thing we learned about Zariel was was that she was the archdevil of Avernus and that she is in a faction, and that she was, I suppose, in a faction opposed to Mephistopheles, the arch devil of uh Kania.

SPEAKER_05 12:51

Right. Okay, so immediately just starting off against Mephistopheles, good. Perfect, yeah. Typical, typical, like hellish politicking and different factions within not liking each other and uh, you know, yeah, pretty typical, typical hell, typical hell stuff.

SPEAKER_02 13:11

Typical, just your stereotypical hell.

SPEAKER_05 13:14

Yeah, y'all. I love I love DD hell. Like I love the smart that you preface that with DD hell. I love I love hell. I don't have, I mean, granted, I don't have any experience with real life hell, so you know totally fair. But I do love the the politicking and the the lawfulness of it, but it's still very unquestioningly evil. I think it's so much fun.

SPEAKER_03 13:39

Yeah. You know, devils are always scheming against each other, uh, and doubly so the arch devils, and apparently even more in the early days of hell. Right. Uh every archdevil wants to be the lord of the ninth and depose of a Asmodeus. Right.

SPEAKER_05 13:54

Because, you know, gotta you know that's that's just that's just business, you know.

SPEAKER_03 14:01

There's just that's just good business.

SPEAKER_05 14:03

That's just that's just that's just the corporate, it really it feels like a corporate kind of thing to me, you know? Like it just feels like really cutthroat corporate business.

SPEAKER_03 14:12

I mean, uh the way that hell is set up in DD feels that way, yeah. So eventually factions sort of formed around the two most powerful lords that were rising to the top. So Mephistopheles of Kenya and Belzebal of Melodomini.

SPEAKER_04 14:30

Melodomini. Sure.

SPEAKER_03 14:32

It's I don't I should have given you guys homework to uh go back and listen to all of the infernal episodes, but um yeah. I didn't do my homework in college, so but all you have to do is l well, you have to listen to yourself, never mind.

SPEAKER_05 14:50

Yeah, that is a slight problem.

SPEAKER_03 14:53

Yeah, um, so you never really get used to it. All the other lords sort of settled behind their lord of choice to replace Asmodeus, besides Osmodius, of course, because he he totally doesn't know about this.

SPEAKER_04 15:06

No, I'm sure. So behind I'm sure he has no idea.

SPEAKER_03 15:10

Yeah, no, none. Uh behind Mephistopheles, you have Dyspator of Dis, Mammon of Menaros, and Garyon of Stygia. And behind Bailcible, you'll have Moloch of Malvolge, Lyle of Phlegathos, and Zaryel of Avernus. Some of these names may be completely foreign to you. You'll see why.

SPEAKER_05 15:33

I mean, I recognize most of them. Not in a DD way, but fair.

SPEAKER_03 15:39

You should recognize them, but it has been like uh I think six years specifically since my trek through um the Infernal Plains.

SPEAKER_05 15:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 15:49

And Blood War.

SPEAKER_05 15:51

But yeah, but these also do, at least most of them share the same names as like, you know, real life princes of hell and stuff.

SPEAKER_03 15:58

So uh when the reckoning came, and it it's capital T, capital R, the reckoning.

SPEAKER_05 16:04

The reckoning team.

SPEAKER_03 16:06

Uh-huh. Zariel had been preparing an enormous army ostensibly to lead against the demons of the abyss, except nope! It was a lie, and she caught Dispatter completely off guard by charging into dis and laying siege.

SPEAKER_05 16:20

What that is the Zariel lied. I know a devil lied and and schemed. Well, outrageous.

SPEAKER_03 16:28

Well, Simon or so for some reason, Dis uh Dispatter was uh was completely caught off guard. I said that she charged into dissipater, I meant she charged into dissipater's the guy. Um I mean presumably.

SPEAKER_05 16:42

No, I think my brain just autocorrected, so I mean that's what he gets for naming the lair after himself. I mean that might not be what happened, it might be coincidental. No, I'm pretty sure it's named after him. Yeah, that's Figadz. And also, presumably at some point something was charged into him, like a sword. So, you know.

SPEAKER_03 17:04

Well, maybe, maybe not. I'm gonna go with probably not though, because this lasts apparently eons. Um, but simultaneously, Mulloch and Belial attacked Stygia. Mephistopheles and his faction were surprised, and and classic DD tradition could not take action in the first round.

SPEAKER_05 17:24

Oh my god, they got a surprise round.

SPEAKER_03 17:27

They got a surprise round that lasted eons. Yes. Uh jokes aside, uh, Mephistopheles and his faction did actually take heavy losses, and if not for his complete willingness to sacrifice millions of his own devils to reorganize and figure out what to do, uh faction likely would have at least taken Kania. I really doubt that they'd necessarily get to Asmodeus, but they would have been in the best position they ever could be.

SPEAKER_05 17:54

Yeah, I mean that's basically like they would have had a foot in the door, so to speak.

SPEAKER_03 17:58

Like yeah, and you know without getting into all the nitty-gritty, because it's kind of boring in that second edition way. Umphistopolis faction pushed the opposition back to their own layers and then actually press into Baelzebel's own home. Oh uh at that point, each of those squabbling lords and their armies to fight in frenzy and Malodomini.

SPEAKER_05 18:23

Yeah, so it just kind of spilled over into everything naturally.

SPEAKER_03 18:28

Uh meanwhile, Garion was actually still secretly loyal to Asmodius and had infiltrated both of the factions with his own pit being generals.

SPEAKER_05 18:37

Oh the the the thick plotons playing both sides. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 18:44

When Garrion blew his warhorn and cued them, each of his pitfiend generals turned on the armies and lords they had infiltrated, showing loyalty to Asmodius. It was a bloodbath for all the rebel factions.

SPEAKER_05 19:00

Man, I love devils.

SPEAKER_03 19:02

Yeah, I love the the just this is sort of the origin story of the Dark Eight, which we haven't really talked about, but essentially they are I'll I'll get into it in a minute. Um just briefly. In the aftermath, I would have expected that this to be how Zara was deposed. Nope, apparently not.

SPEAKER_04 19:22

Uh okay, that's what I would have thought, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 19:25

Pretty much everyone kept their positions except for Mullock, who had apparently offended Asmodius in some other way that was never mentioned, and so he just did away with him. Um Garyon, you know, the loyal one.

SPEAKER_05 19:41

Right, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 19:42

Um Asmodeus never explained himself on that one.

SPEAKER_05 19:47

That that feels like a a backwards. I keep I keep going back to this like corporate metaphor, but that that feels like that's like it it would would have been one of those like you know, things that you see in like a like an article on like some Forbes clone looking website about like how in in every job interview I make them sit in a in a like unbalanced chair, and I only hire them if they say something about it, because that means that they're not a pushover or whatever. So maybe he was like, okay, well, you were loyal to me and that's cool and all, but I am gonna sack you because that's kind of that's kind of that's that's kind of like beta behavior, bro. So he straight up just like got rid of the one that was loyal to him. Yeah and then and then just didn't explain it at all. And then Moloch for some reason, I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 20:37

Well, Moloch because he had p already pissed him off, essentially.

SPEAKER_05 20:40

Oh, okay. Uh oh, okay, okay, gotcha.

SPEAKER_03 20:43

So uh Garion was replaced with Levistas, and that's a whole story. But Moloch was replaced with Malagard, who you also won't recognize.

SPEAKER_04 20:53

Yeah, nope, I do not recognize Malagard.

SPEAKER_03 20:56

It'll maybe make sense later. It's not important to today's story.

SPEAKER_05 21:00

He's just he's he's he's just he's just some guy.

SPEAKER_03 21:02

No, Malagard is actually uh a female and a night hag.

SPEAKER_05 21:06

Oh, okay. Okay. So just some night hag, you know.

SPEAKER_03 21:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 21:09

Just some other some other some other lord of hell, you know, whatever.

SPEAKER_03 21:13

Apparently, from what I've learned, there is still even despite all of the everything I've done, there's still so much to learn about hell's.

SPEAKER_05 21:22

Yeah, apparently. Yeah, it's it's it's its own, like, you can't even call it a microcosm exactly, because it's bigger than that, but it's it's just such its own, like, you know. It's a medium cosm. Yeah, exactly. There's like you know, there's like as much of that kind of politicking and conflicts and inheritances and things changing hands as in like, you know, a whole continent, you know, on like the material plane.

SPEAKER_03 21:52

Right. So uh the Pitfiend generals did get promoted to being Exmodius's. Personal pit fiends. Oh, good for them. And that is the origin story of the Dark Eight, who I don't know if they're at their own episode, but they're at least their own mini set at some point.

SPEAKER_04 22:09

I was gonna say they could very well be a mini set for sure.

SPEAKER_03 22:12

So how was Zariel removed? Nothing so glamorous.

SPEAKER_05 22:17

I I mean I wouldn't really think a devil would do anything glamorous, though. I mean, then that that kind of makes sense because I feel like if you're not gonna get deposed by Asmodeus. Yeah, if you're not gonna get deposed by Asmodeus for like, you know, being part of a of a rebellion, then like, you know, I feel like it would have to be something weird, you know?

SPEAKER_03 22:39

Yeah. So let me introduce you to Bell. Bell was a pit fiend. At one point, he orchestrated the assassination of a pit fiend general, not one of the dark eight, obviously.

SPEAKER_05 22:48

That was just him, just another one.

SPEAKER_03 22:50

Um, and then took over the position himself.

SPEAKER_05 22:53

Oh, okay. Very clear path to promotion.

SPEAKER_03 22:56

Uh master of deceit, uh, evidently. At one point he convinced enough devils and demons to believe that he had actually turned coat and betrayed the hells to go join with the Tanari, who, if you are if you have forgotten or are unaware, is just another name for demons, basically. Um they were the Tanare were eventually totally convinced themselves. He then led them into an ambush that he'd long since set up and completely decimated that demon those that group of demons.

SPEAKER_04 23:25

Oh my god. This guy is crazy. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 23:40

Asmodeus knows better than to keep someone that skilled at deception close to the eye.

SPEAKER_05 23:43

Okay, I was gonna say that does not seem like a smart idea. I see, I see where this is going. At least not for his for Asmodeus.

SPEAKER_03 23:52

More than likely you've figured it out at this point.

SPEAKER_05 23:54

I feel like, yeah, I feel like Zarya was was probably at least, at least at first, was probably like pissed. Probably like Asmodius was like, hey, here's this, here's this guy. Here's this. Really?

SPEAKER_03 24:13

Yes. That is a recurring trend.

SPEAKER_05 24:17

Like, come on, I got like I don't do I have it's like when you get when you get told to like train the new guy. Like this guy obviously doesn't need training, but it's like, you know, you get you get the you get the intern or whatever like stuck on you, and you're like, really? I've never worked a corporate job, but you know.

SPEAKER_03 24:34

As commander of her armies, uh, Belle served Zariel seemingly faithfully for many centuries. This will I bring this back later.

SPEAKER_05 24:44

He'll be back.

SPEAKER_03 24:45

In time, uh Zariel came to trust him, and then Belle said, psych and orchestrated her coup.

SPEAKER_05 24:52

Right. That fork found and fork found in pitchfork found in hell, you know.

SPEAKER_03 24:56

Pitchfork found in hell. Uh he turned her court against her, imprisoned her in some sort of prison that rendered her powerless, and declared himself Lord of Avernus.

SPEAKER_04 25:07

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 25:08

I mean, he he found a path to to promotion, and he is sticking to it.

SPEAKER_05 25:15

Yeah, and you know, uh I you know, if you uh if you if you can do it, then Yeah. You know.

SPEAKER_03 25:24

I guess why not? Why not? Right. Um and to Belle's great surprise, no one was upset. As modius even sent his own constable to show support, but also to tell him that he still had to serve his obligation as a commander of the armies.

SPEAKER_05 25:40

Like, hey, congratulations, but also remember your place. Yeah, that's such a I feel like that is such a such a hellish mentality of like uh if you have the means and like the power to do something, then like it's uh if it does feel very much like a might makes right kind of to some degree, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 26:00

I mean, at the end of the day, as Modius kind of calls the shots for everything.

SPEAKER_05 26:06

Yeah, even when people try to like that that feels like it feels like such a testament to how powerful and how in control he is that he didn't even like he didn't even, you know, replace or kill or depose or whatever, like most of the generals that tried to lead different rebellions against him. Like he was kind of like like it literally just feels like a little like you know, just like a slap on the wrist and like okay, that was cute, but like get back to work.

SPEAKER_03 26:38

I mean, they all got their own like little punishments here and there. Um, if I recall correctly, this is one of the things that made Bailzebel turn into a slug and become Lord of the Flies. Um but it does just feel like such a testament to like Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 27:01

You know, that he wasn't immediately like, oh no, I need to get rid of all these people. Like he's just kind of like, okay.

SPEAKER_03 27:07

He knew basically that uh humiliating him, them the way he did would basically be enough to deter him them for at least another couple of millennia.

SPEAKER_04 27:16

Right, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 27:17

That's literally it on info on Zaryel in this. Not even so much as a reference to how she's doing, if she's plotting to take back control, what have you. Just a little aside at Zara about Zariel's rage at being in prison, manifesting as random fireballs streaking across the sky, which is referenced a few more times up until fifth edition.

SPEAKER_05 27:41

I mean, that's pretty cool. Like okay, so yeah, she just kind of gets imprisoned and then they're like Yeah, that kind of that kind of that kind of sucks for her that like her story essentially just ends. It's just like a you know, a a a failed, uh, you know, a sort of failed revolt, and then she like just gets imprisoned. Completely unrelated to failed revolt, completely unrelated to failed revolt. She gets imprisoned by like her right-hand man that she had had come to trust, and then she just gets imprisoned, and it's like, okay, well, that's yeah.

SPEAKER_03 28:16

Uh T Mod's also completely reduced to guard dog of a burn is in this literally no mention of her previous posts.

SPEAKER_05 28:23

Damn. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 28:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 28:26

Yeah. I think, yeah, that that that tracks.

SPEAKER_03 28:29

So in 2001's Manual of the Plains for third edition, uh, Zariel is only briefly mentioned as a footnote for Belle. No, no new info. This is where I was actually really surprised. I had actually thought that Zariel had been mentioned much more throughout various editions.

SPEAKER_04 28:48

Same.

SPEAKER_03 28:49

Um, she was also mentioned in uh 2003's Book of Vile Darkness by Monty Cook. Again, little info, but the added fact that Belle has absolutely no worshippers. Zariel still has a devoted cult that refused to follow him after he overthrew her, and that none of the arch devils trust him enough to make any deals or pacts with him.

SPEAKER_04 29:10

Gee, I wonder why.

SPEAKER_03 29:12

I mean, don't get me wrong.

SPEAKER_05 29:15

Like, I get it, but also, like, I don't know, I can't I can't really see his behavior as being like that far.

SPEAKER_03 29:25

I think it's not even necessarily his behavior. I think it's just that he is so good at lying that the others don't trust that they'd be able to see through him.

SPEAKER_05 29:34

Yeah, like you know, and and maybe the maybe the this is this is purely speculative, but maybe also his his overthrowing of that other like pit fiend, uh general, the the way that that kind of involved like the demons, maybe that kind of put some people off. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 29:55

Yeah, even though it's very ta like.

SPEAKER_05 29:58

Yeah, it still is kind of like, you know, he's involving the he's involving their their enemies, you know. Right. Or maybe he's just an unlikable guy. Maybe that's why. Maybe he's like he's very good at the subterfuge and the da-da-da. But he's just not a he's just a really unlikable guy, you know.

SPEAKER_03 30:16

That is entirely probable when you consider that we're dealing with devils.

SPEAKER_05 30:20

Right, because it's like, you know, to take it back to Baldur's Gate 3, you know, a little bit for a second. Like, yeah, obviously, like Raphael is not a is not a good person in any shape, form, or fashion, but at least he's kind of a cool, like he's kind of a cool, charismatic dude, you know.

SPEAKER_03 30:36

Oh yeah. I mean, Raphael's got charisma out the wazoo.

SPEAKER_05 30:39

Yeah, he's he's a he's very interesting, you know, guy. Whereas like maybe maybe this guy just sucks.

SPEAKER_03 30:45

Like, one thing I will say, uh which I don't know, I would have to see um like more it takes on Bell. I would I I I mean Raphael, you wanted to keep seeing him.

SPEAKER_05 31:00

I get the feeling that if you had to deal with Bell, you wouldn't Yeah, you might just you might know you might just be like, uh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, maybe he just sucks. Maybe he sucks. Yeah. And even if even if you you're you're kind you're kind of thinking about like, oh, is there, you know, is there a is there another meaning to what he's saying right now, or like, well, what's the catch here? Like, you know, I feel like for for for some people that are are very, very manipulative in a in a sort of a sort of way, you just feel totally on the back foot in every interaction you have with them to the extent where it's like you're just like, I just want to get out of this conversation, you know? Yeah. Maybe maybe Belle is kind of like that.

SPEAKER_03 31:49

She was mentioned throw out a few more supplements for third and 3.5, but no new information. Just reiterating and reconfirming everything from previous entries. In 2007, um, which I believe is technically still 3.5. I'm not 100% sure, but that sounds yeah. But this was a Dragon magazine, Dragon magazine number 359. It had an article titled 1D 20 villains, DD's most wanted, preferably dead.

SPEAKER_06 32:20

Which definitely featured Tiamat.

SPEAKER_03 32:23

I hear you saying this isn't about Tiamat. Yes, true, but I am desperately perusing for any Zariel lore. I mean, it could be. And the feature on Tiamat actually mentions Zariel quite a bit.

SPEAKER_05 32:34

It can always be about Tiamat.

SPEAKER_03 32:36

It can always be about Tiamat.

SPEAKER_05 32:37

It can always be about Tiamat. Also, fifth edition officially released in 2014. So, yes, this still would have been, I think, 3.5, because I think fourth edition was very brief. Very brief for good reasons. I really thought that you were mentally, you mentally just like skipped over fourth edition. Like you were like, okay, 2014. There would have been nothing, there would have been nothing between 3.5 and 4th or 5th edition.

SPEAKER_03 33:05

I mentioned, and this will come back later. I mentioned that I actually liked something that fourth edition did, and Travis threatened to divorce me.

SPEAKER_04 33:14

Whoa! It's a serious offense.

SPEAKER_03 33:17

Whoa. It's okay. You will also like it.

SPEAKER_05 33:20

Maybe. Dang. Now we're we're air we're airing out, we're airing out our dirty laundry here. Dang. Uh so we just told everyone y'all got married, and now you're now now we're gonna get a divorce over fourth edition. Right.

SPEAKER_03 33:34

First and foremost, uh, the article officially retcons Tiamat's reign over a vernace. Oh doesn't exist anymore. Um, so before anyone gets mad, this is still 3.5.

SPEAKER_05 33:46

I mean, it you know, listen, they listen, they were doing, they were, they were doing stuff.

SPEAKER_03 33:53

I I don't actually have issues with it one way or another. I you know, I'm just saying some people would probably love it, some people probably hate it.

SPEAKER_05 34:00

Yeah, and it's it's kind of you know, whatever. I mean, she's just she's she's still cool, you know, she's still, you know, a incredibly powerful, five-headed, you know, evil dragon matriarch. So it's kind of like eh, you know, whatever. She can leave, she can leave that off her resume. That's fine.

SPEAKER_03 34:16

True. Essentially, Tiamat set up shop in the house because she liked the devils. Uh, she was she saw kind of secured spirits in them.

SPEAKER_04 34:26

That makes sense. That makes sense.

SPEAKER_03 34:28

Zariel and Tiamat made a deal wherein Zariel guarantees safe passage for Tiamat's servants and followers through Avernus, and Tiamat's Deephic realm overlaps the main portal between Avernus and Dis, which she guards. Basically, instead of it being like a punishment or Asmodeus just put her there, um, it's now sort of a a pact that they made.

SPEAKER_04 34:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 34:54

Okay. The pact then transferred over to Belle when he overthrew Zariel.

SPEAKER_05 34:59

Oh, well, at least, you know, she was still nice enough to uh carry the pact over to the new ruler.

SPEAKER_03 35:04

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 35:05

Instead of just like bye.

SPEAKER_03 35:06

Yeah. So more on the pact and Zariel's sort of friendship with Tiamat. Zariel gifted Tiamat's red dragon consort, Etiel the Abandoned.

SPEAKER_04 35:17

Oh. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 35:18

I wonder with a chalk white spear, uh, which was named the burning orb of Etiel the Abandoned. Okay.

SPEAKER_05 35:27

They couldn't even be more sad. They couldn't have they couldn't have trimmed I'm who up pondering the burning orb.

SPEAKER_03 35:33

Yeah. It was allegedly carved from the god corpse of Voril, which this is a deep cut that I I don't know how many people are gonna remember. The brother that Tiamat had slain for her father's affection.

SPEAKER_05 35:46

You know what's crazy is even though it's been so long, I literally like I I my eyes like you know kind of glazed over that name, and I was like, I had that moment from like like ratatouille where you remembered where Anton Ego like eats the ratatouille and then he's like transported to his childhood home. Except it's um uh um fratricide.

SPEAKER_02 36:09

Yeah, fratricide.

SPEAKER_05 36:11

It's reading about draconic fratricide, so you can talk about it with your friends later that week, you know?

SPEAKER_03 36:17

Yeah. Uh so the orb radiates a sense of loss of rage, loss and rage, and a halo of white flames and incomprehensible whispers around its folder. It does other things, but mostly it's just like proof that Zariel actually kind of treasured her friendship with Tiamat in in this version. Okay, also she just like she found the most perfect gift and gave it to her consort.

SPEAKER_05 36:45

Also, what a what a what a crazy okay. I'm sorry, I know this is a Tiamat episode, but what a crazy thing to give someone like you know what is essentially, you know, at Tiamat's Tiamat's little boy toy is like, oh hey, you know, you're you're you're like, you know, dead brother Empress, Empress, whatever. Um, here's a part of her dead brother's corpse.

SPEAKER_02 37:11

Like that's so that is the most draconic and devilish of all gifts.

SPEAKER_05 37:18

It really is. That's crazy. That's crazy though.

SPEAKER_03 37:23

Unfortunately, like I I kind of love this little bit of their friendship. Um, but unfortunately, Zariel and Tiamat with later have a more complicated relationship.

SPEAKER_05 37:33

Oh, trouble in trouble in paradise.

SPEAKER_03 37:36

Zariel is literally only really mentioned in fourth edition, like any new information in fourth edition in the form of magazine articles.

SPEAKER_05 37:45

What's fourth edition? I have no memory of this place.

SPEAKER_03 37:49

Okay, but listen, the the this This is good though, right? You said this is really interesting. Pretty good. Okay.

SPEAKER_04 37:58

Thank you.

SPEAKER_03 37:59

This can unfortunately does continue the trend of almost exclusively mentioning Zarael to advance other characters' development.

SPEAKER_04 38:07

Oh no.

SPEAKER_03 38:09

But the article is still very cool, very interesting, and um expands on other characters in the hells. And a dungeon dungeon, not dragon, dungeon magazine article from 2011, Codex of Betrayal, Glacia, Princess of the Nine Hells. The article's long and but it's really it is really interesting. Glacia is the only child of Asmodius, which her name might sound familiar because you guys have heard of her as the ruler of Malbolge. Yeah. Malbolgy, Malbolgy.

SPEAKER_04 38:43

Uh yes. I do briefly recording.

SPEAKER_03 38:47

Because she replaced Malagard, who replaced Moloch, which is why you have heard of neither of them. Because when I went when I did my tour through the hells, I discussed Glacia.

SPEAKER_05 39:01

Yeah, she's the most the most recent. That's very, I'm sure, I'm sure she probably killed a lot of people, you know, did a lot of plotting, trampled over stuff. But it, you know, it it is hard to hear that and not immediately think like hellish nepo baby.

SPEAKER_03 39:17

Hellish Nepo. By the way, no, this article is hellish nepo baby, but also girl boss.

SPEAKER_05 39:24

Oh good. Oh good.

SPEAKER_03 39:26

So she had a really weird childhood and a traumatic adolescence. Wow. Shocking, I know.

SPEAKER_04 39:33

That's crazy. I would have never guessed. I would have never guessed.

SPEAKER_03 39:36

Glacia ends up becoming a master manipulator behind much of the political events of hell throughout history. That's right. So she actually in this article, she orchestrated the reckoning and sought to replace her father as the queen of the nine herself.

SPEAKER_05 39:52

Oh, I bet he was so proud. I was gonna say he must be so proud.

SPEAKER_03 39:56

Well, in this retelling of events, it's unsure whether or not Asmodius knew that she was the one behind it. I'm willing to bet that he did, but it's Asmodeus, yeah. Um, but also in this retelling of events, Zariel was hunted by the Pitfiend generals from before and actually in prison for her crimes during the reckoning. Okay, so so now she is punished for the reckoning.

SPEAKER_04 40:22

And okay. I see.

SPEAKER_03 40:24

Belle was actually raised up by Asmodeus as a puppet ruler of Avernus.

SPEAKER_05 40:29

Oh.

SPEAKER_03 40:30

I wrote of Asmodius, but I meant of Avernus.

SPEAKER_05 40:33

I mean, I guess he could be of Asmodeus if he is Asmodeus's puppet. That makes sense grammatically.

SPEAKER_03 40:39

So, first of all, Glassia is a really cool character. Asmodeus's daughter in a Hellion in her own right. She is sort of a master schemer. Uh, there are parts of the story where she is so clearly just a teenage girl disillusioned with the way things are going in the hells.

SPEAKER_05 40:55

Oh no. That's you know what? Actually, that that that like that kind of fucks, honestly.

SPEAKER_03 41:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 41:01

Because it feels so different. It feels like it would be a different vibe from the you know, the usual, the just the usual, the, you know, the usual devil vibe.

SPEAKER_03 41:10

Yeah, I mean, it it's very interesting because it's kind of the first time you get to hear about what it's like to grow up as an arch devil.

SPEAKER_05 41:19

Yeah, yeah, yeah. That too. Like I don't hear really anything of.

SPEAKER_03 41:24

And I I do love the article. And it I I would love to talk about it more at some point. It just sucks that so much of Zaril up until this point has just been a background character in everyone else's story.

SPEAKER_05 41:36

Yeah. Yeah, she really kind of has been, which I mean, kind of sad. I'll I'll say I feel kind of sad for this devil. It's it's it's it's all I mean, she to be fair, she did, she did. You could only feel so bad for her. She did do a lot of she did do a lot. She's done a lot of she's probably not a very nice person, so you know.

SPEAKER_03 41:58

But that uh takes us up to fifth edition. Um yeah, and we will get into fifth edition after we do our quick ad read.

SPEAKER_04 42:08

Yeah, oh, it's been a minute, it's been a while.

SPEAKER_03 42:13

All right, we're back.

SPEAKER_05 42:15

All three of us are back. We're all back.

SPEAKER_03 42:18

Okay, uh, so first of all, thank you guys so much for listening. Uh, I I cannot believe the response we've gotten already. I cannot believe it's just it's so amazing to have you guys. Thank you to Grumpy Pear, Your Treon, um, Hachikuma, Saracen, Games, everyone for hanging out with us.

SPEAKER_05 42:38

Like on our first streams.

SPEAKER_03 42:41

Uh thank you, Roland Jim, for the prime subscription. Oh, thank you so much. Whoa. Thank you.

SPEAKER_04 42:50

Hell yeah.

SPEAKER_03 42:51

It's amazing. You guys are amazing, and I'm I'm so happy to get to do this again with you. So uh the more things change, the more they stay the same. Uh, we do still have an affiliate link with the company formerly known as Metallic Dice Games. It is now Fanroll Dice. So you can use code Dungeonpedia for 10% off your entire order at fanroll. Hold on, let me let me get the new website, fanrolldice.com. Again, offer code dungeonpedia for 10% off your entire order. Uh, we do get get a portion of that. We of course still have our Patreon if you'd like to support us directly. It is at Dungeonpedia. We now are going to be doing at least monthly mini mini shows, and we are visiting uh other ideas, like maybe doing like Jackbox game nights or something like that, if anyone is interested in pursuing that. So we are visiting different ideas for things to give you guys for being a part of the Patreon. In addition to the monthly mini shows, which will only be exclusively there from here on out.

SPEAKER_05 43:58

Yes. Um we do. Of course, have our uh Discord. Uh, the link is on our Twitch page. Um, just a quick update. We are no longer going to be using Twitter. Twitter is just less pool, and I just don't want to deal with it.

SPEAKER_03 44:15

So Travis is the one in charge of that, so he gets to make that call.

SPEAKER_05 44:20

Twitter. So we have now switched over. We have a threads account, and we are still on Instagram. Um and as always, if you have any suggestions for episodes to cover or whatnot, you can always still email us. Our email is the same, dungeonpedia.podcast at gmail.com. And wherever you listen, if you are listening to this after the stream, um subscribe wherever to get notifications whenever we upload new episodes. And while you are on those platforms, uh we would appreciate it if you left us a rating and review. Um and even more than that, if you have any friends or loved ones that you think would be interested, um send them, send them our way. And uh of course, it's been a good hot minute, but thank you to Nakarada. Yeah, woo! Or our theme song, Blacksmith. Uh love it, not gonna change it. And I think with that, we can get back to hopefully um letting Zaryel have some of her own spotlight.

SPEAKER_03 45:26

Fifth edition finally makes it right for Zariel.

SPEAKER_05 45:29

Yay! Yay, she finally gets to be the main character of her own story.

SPEAKER_03 45:32

She finally gets to be the main character of her own story.

SPEAKER_05 45:37

Finally, she's the main character. It only took four editions.

SPEAKER_03 45:42

Right. Yeah. So Monster Manual for Fifth Edition was released in September of 2014. Here is the official first deepening of the lore.

SPEAKER_04 45:50

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 45:51

Under information about angels, specifically fallen angels. Here's the first mention of Zariel being a fallen Osimon.

SPEAKER_05 45:59

That's that's so crazy that that I know.

SPEAKER_03 46:02

This was one of this is one of the things where I was wrong. I mentioned very recently that I believed that Zariel was described as an a fallen angel from the beginning. No, apparently the only one that is is I'm pretty sure Bailsable.

SPEAKER_05 46:21

Yeah, that okay. Really? You know, that feels like one of those things that it does feel strange because even though like I know I only got into DD after fifth edition, so there might there might be a sense of like any of that information that did come from fifth edition still like fills that prime, you know what I mean? Like that primary, like oldest source in my head. Right. Like it does, it does feel like such a like such an integral part of like the character that like it feels weird. Like it feels weird that it wasn't introduced until this edition, you know.

SPEAKER_03 47:00

So she's also mentioned as being the arch devil, not the former archdevil. So we're we're looking good.

SPEAKER_05 47:08

Yeah, everything's coming up.

SPEAKER_03 47:09

Zariel in Rise of Tiamat, part two of the two-part adventure Tyranny of Dragons. It also mentions Zariel as the Archduchess, and specifically she wants Tiamat out of the Nine Hells. Oh no! So she is working with the cult of the dragon to free her from a burnus.

SPEAKER_05 47:27

They've had a falling out. So now is when their uh relationship drastically changes.

SPEAKER_03 47:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 47:33

Oh no.

SPEAKER_03 47:35

The Dungeons Master Guide was released in December of 2014 and gives us even more of her backstory and some of the earliest depictions of what she looked like. Because up until now, she hasn't had an appearance. No!

SPEAKER_05 47:46

Oh my god, yeah, I didn't even think about that. Yeah, she literally has had nothing. Like no.

SPEAKER_03 47:53

Zariel is back in charge of Avernus. Belle is forced to serve as her advisor. T Must is now no longer buddies with the devils, but is actually trapped on Avernus due to an ancient contract between her and Asmodeus. Uh the terms are only known to her and the Lords of the Nine.

SPEAKER_04 48:11

Oh, damn. Yeah. Get fucked.

SPEAKER_03 48:13

That that sucks. So Zariel looks like an angel, perhaps a solar, who was once beautiful, but whose skin and wings have been burned burned and ruined by fire.

SPEAKER_04 48:26

Ooh.

SPEAKER_03 48:27

Her eyes are a burning white, which can actually cause creatures to burst into flame when they look upon her.

SPEAKER_04 48:33

That's crazy.

SPEAKER_03 48:34

Oh, that's kind of sick. That's kind of sick though. Oh, yeah, no, super sick.

SPEAKER_05 48:39

The coolest shit, but um But like, that's that's damn, that's intense. That is intense.

SPEAKER_03 48:46

So Morden Kinen's Home of Foes, released in 2018. We're getting the ball rolling. It's really starting to flesh out her backstory.

SPEAKER_05 48:54

It only took it only took like a gazillion years.

SPEAKER_03 48:58

19 years.

SPEAKER_05 48:59

Oh no. Introduced in 1999.

SPEAKER_03 49:02

Technically, 1995, if you want to get to backwent before she was named.

SPEAKER_05 49:07

Uh yeah.

SPEAKER_03 49:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 49:10

Damn. Yeah. So better late than never, I guess.

SPEAKER_03 49:12

This is where it talks about the fact that she was an angel that was tasked with watching the tides of the blood war, and at some point she was corrupted by the nine hells itself and fell.

SPEAKER_05 49:22

Yep. Fallen angel, tales all the time.

SPEAKER_03 49:25

Yeah. In the timeline of fifth edition, Zariel has retaken Avernus from Bell quite recently in the grand scheme of things. Apparently, Bell was an overly cautious sort and inadequate ruler.

SPEAKER_05 49:39

I mean, when take your power by scheming and deceiving and doing what you did, yeah. I I could see being overly cautious.

SPEAKER_03 49:49

Interesting. Zariel is most interested in collecting souls from warriors, securing their loyalty or their debt to her. Uh she follows she allows her followers to live their lives without much meddling, expecting them to give their best whenever they whenever she finally makes good on what they owe. Her servants are therefore widely known to be effective and deadly.

SPEAKER_05 50:10

It turns out if you let them cook for a little while, then they become uh pretty uh yeah, pretty reliable. The power of the power of of of not micromanaging, I guess.

SPEAKER_03 50:20

We're also given Zariel's first stat block here.

SPEAKER_05 50:24

That's so crazy.

SPEAKER_03 50:26

So Zariel.

SPEAKER_05 50:29

We're here though.

SPEAKER_03 50:30

Yeah. She's lawful evil, obviously. Yeah, she has an AC of 21, naturally armored.

SPEAKER_04 50:37

Yep.

SPEAKER_03 50:38

She has 580 HP.

SPEAKER_04 50:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 50:41

She is resistant to cold, fire, radiant, and all physical attacks from non-magical, non-silvered weapons.

SPEAKER_05 50:47

Yeah. Oh well, no, the resistance to radiant actually makes sense. Never mind. I was gonna make a comment, but it makes sense.

SPEAKER_03 50:55

She was an angel.

SPEAKER_05 50:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 50:57

Uh she's immune to necrotic and poison damage. Yeah, that's she's immune to being charmed, exhausted, frightened, and poisoned.

SPEAKER_05 51:06

I love that she's specifically immune to being charmed. She learned her lesson from right, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 51:12

Uh she has innate spellcasting of at will, alter self, detect evil and good, fireball, invisibility on self, and wall of fire.

SPEAKER_05 51:22

I love that she can just cast fireball at will.

SPEAKER_03 51:25

I know. Yeah. Uh she has innate spellcasting three times a day for use of blade barrier, dispel evil and good, and finger of death.

unknown 51:33

Oh good.

SPEAKER_05 51:35

Oh good. Man, I love finger of death.

SPEAKER_03 51:37

She has legendary resistance, magic resistance. She has fiery weapons that deal an extra 88 fire damage.

SPEAKER_04 51:44

This one is crazy.

SPEAKER_03 51:46

She has regeneration. Zara regains 20 hit points at the start of her turn.

SPEAKER_04 51:51

20?

SPEAKER_03 51:52

Which is probably why you're like 580? That's not so bad. No, at the start of every turn, unless you are doing more than 20 damage to her in every turn, she is going to just yeah, fuck you. If she takes radiant damage, this trait doesn't function at the start of her next turn. So there is a way to get around it.

SPEAKER_05 52:13

Right, but the fact that she's also resistant to radiant kind of makes players immediately like back off from using radiant because, like, okay, she's not actually taking extra damage, it's doing less.

SPEAKER_03 52:27

Now, a good DM would probably leave some subtle hints uh in the description of how she takes radiant damage and the fact that she doesn't heal at the start of the next round so that they can try and figure it out.

SPEAKER_05 52:41

But good DM is not gonna like be like, oh yeah, no, keep trying that. But it does, it does still like it does kind of suck that like you know, every turn you're committing at least a few of your a few of your resources to doing resisted damage, you know. I'm not gonna lie, my eyes glazed over the word radiant in that description, and with like Baldur's Gate 3 on the mind, I thought they were about to hit us with like the radiant retort where you get like return damage. Oh my god. I was about to be like, that's too far.

SPEAKER_03 53:12

Well, I don't know. Uh Zariel dies only if she starts her turn with zero hit points and doesn't regenerate. Yeah, that makes sense. She can do a multi-attack, uh, including horrid touch. Oh, which uh Zariel touches one creature within 10 feet of her. The target must succeed on a DC 26 constitution saving throw or take 44 aka 8 D10 necrotic damage and be poisoned for one minute. While poison the target is also blinded and deafened.

SPEAKER_05 53:43

That is that's a very dude. That is that's a very bad touch. That is such a high difficulty. That's such a high DC too, especially especially if you're if you're me and the characters you play usually don't have fantastic constitution. I mean, it makes sense that she has all this because you know she's an arch devil. Right, yeah. It's just it's it's insane. Yeah, it's not nice.

SPEAKER_03 54:13

Zariel can also magically teleport, which she can do as a legendary action as well, which she can also do immolating gaze as a lesson legendary action, which she turns her magical gaze towards one creature she can see within 120 feet of her and commands it to combust.

SPEAKER_04 54:33

Oh what? Damn.

SPEAKER_03 54:36

Target must succeed a DC 26 wisdom saving throw or take 22, aka 4d10 fire damage.

SPEAKER_05 54:43

That's crazy. Spontaneous human combustion. Yeah, literally.

SPEAKER_03 54:47

Not so spontaneous.

SPEAKER_05 54:50

No, yeah, no, and the the the DC as well, another 26. That's that's that's way too high. 26 wisdom, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 54:58

That's too high.

SPEAKER_03 55:00

I I'm not gonna get super into it, but Zariel can also uh take a number of layer actions if she uh is fought in her lair in Avernus.

SPEAKER_05 55:13

Which if you're planning on fighting Zaryel, do not fight her in her lair. Don't honestly dogs don't.

SPEAKER_03 55:22

Well, I got some bad news for you. Unless, you know.

SPEAKER_05 55:30

Bad news.

SPEAKER_03 55:31

You know, unless you Well, we might you might end up if you have a DM that wants to do Descent into Avernus, you might end up fighting Zariel in her lair. Yeah, that given the name that that track you know 2019 really, really made it up to Zaryal.

SPEAKER_04 55:52

Uh it did. I I am very glad.

SPEAKER_03 55:55

Because in tw in September of 2019, Baldur's Gate Descent into a Vernus was released.

SPEAKER_04 56:00

Yep.

SPEAKER_03 56:02

It was an adventure that put Zarya front and center and really developed her.

SPEAKER_05 56:07

Oh, she finally it finally got everything's coming of Zarya.

SPEAKER_03 56:10

It really is. So first and foremost, she's on the cover. Yeah, it's a gorgeous shot of her flying through a vernace, wreathed in flame, chasing a glowing sword. She has this bald head, um, with like it looks like tears, like dark black, black and tears streaming down, but I don't think it's her crying. I think it's just like dark, like the dark corruption.

SPEAKER_05 56:35

Yeah, I was gonna say, I think it's more like corruption or yeah, or just the just the you know vibes. Yeah, just the just the just the vibes, you know. She had to do her makeup first. Yeah, she's like, hold on, give me a minute.

SPEAKER_03 56:49

Let me just like me. She just like me for real.

SPEAKER_05 56:55

Dude, that is a gorgeous cover, though. It really is. And like like the the the the looks like a fiery halo. That's so sick, dude.

SPEAKER_03 57:02

There's an alternate cover that harkens back into the uh original Baldur's Gate game, like Baldur's Gate OG one.

SPEAKER_05 57:11

Oh yeah, I can see that.

SPEAKER_03 57:13

But I like I prefer the big Zariel Friends Center, honestly.

SPEAKER_05 57:18

Yeah, I'm I'm sometimes torn on whether or not I prefer the designs that are like, you know, kind of just like some some simple like iconography, you know, and then the ones that are like these like gorgeous kind of like paintings of like whatever the subject is, you know.

SPEAKER_03 57:35

Yeah, no, I I I completely agree.

SPEAKER_05 57:38

And you know, given that it's you know, for like, you know, the the the Baldur's Gate kind of uh you know, but like but like come on, like are you gonna take like a like a seal with a skull on it or like a like a like a painting of this scary angel devil woman, you know?

SPEAKER_03 57:56

Obviously scary angel devil scary angel devil woman, duh.

SPEAKER_05 57:59

I mean, yeah, obviously.

SPEAKER_03 58:01

So the campaign opens with the holy city of El Tyrell having descended into Avernus.

SPEAKER_05 58:06

Yes, sorry, wait, one second. So I believe this is a point where we should put in a spoiler warning.

SPEAKER_03 58:13

Yes, okay. Spoilers for Descent into Avernus. If you have a DM that is interested in running Descent into Avernus, do not listen further. If you want to play Descent into Avernus as a player at any point in the future, do not listen further. Or or do, we're not uh I will go ahead and say that this is going to be the rest of the episode.

SPEAKER_05 58:37

So yeah, bear bear that bear that in mind. You know, tread tread carefully if that's uh yeah. We understand if you uh stop listening here, makes perfect sense. Yeah, into the campaign. Let's let's descend.

SPEAKER_03 58:50

The campaign. So Elter L descended into Avernus.

SPEAKER_05 58:54

As as it does.

SPEAKER_03 58:56

The events were predated by an infernal pact. Um, the setup here, Zaryel wants to take mortal cities and use citizens as fodder in the forever war against the demons. Also known as the blood war.

SPEAKER_04 59:09

Okay. I mean that sounds about right.

SPEAKER_03 59:11

Yeah, next step on on her list is Baldur's Gate. And if you've ever played a single Baldur's Gate game, you'd know that that's a bad idea. Because there's always an intrepid band of adventurers ready to kick your ass.

SPEAKER_05 59:24

It's always it's always Baldur's Gate. I feel like Baldur's Gate is like the New York City of the Forgotten House. Like it's like it's always happening, it's always happening there. Like not always, always, but like often, you know.

SPEAKER_03 59:38

So we're gonna skip all the fighting and rooting out the followers of the dead three because they're always involved. Of course. Um, they're being financed by Duke Dal Dalamra Van Thamper, who I'm pretty sure, or Valarm the the Larm, the Larm, nope, I'm not Van Thamper. Uh Duke Van Thamper.

SPEAKER_05 1:00:00

Van Thamper, I hope you're Jesus Christ.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:05

If you played Baldur's Gate 3, you probably recognize at the very least the surname from like some lore and the the Dukes all coming together for Axbury spoilers. Redacted. Um Thamper is a Zariel devotee and brokered a deal to become Grand Duke of Baldur's Gate with the removal of Grand Duke Older Raven Guard.

SPEAKER_05 1:00:30

I wonder who that is.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:31

I wonder who that is.

SPEAKER_05 1:00:32

Um never never heard of this.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:34

He fell with El Terell. Okay. Yeah. It's all grand for Zariel, though.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:40

Yeah, like I mean, yeah. Zariel wins. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:44

Yeah, because either way, she can make sure that the person, like, she didn't even have to like make that deal. Like, you want to be a devotee devoted to me and be grand duke? Yeah, okay, sure.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:56

Yeah, that's crazy. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:58

Um, and basically the attempt is to bring Baldur's Gate into the hells as well.

SPEAKER_04 1:01:04

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:04

Alongside El Tyrell. Um, so that's just the adventurer's introduction to Zariel and what they know. Uh, let's talk about what the book tells us about Zariel and her past.

SPEAKER_05 1:01:13

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:14

Descent expands on retcons and adjusts much of the lore that already was established on Avernus and attempts to sort of bridge it all together. Zariel was once a beautiful solar living on the plain of Mount Celestia in service to Lithander. Uh, she chastised the rest of the heavens for refusing to get involved in the blood war. She felt that it was their responsibility to rid the multiverse of evil, not stand by and let devils and demons destroy each other and parts of the innocent populace. Pretty straightforward.

SPEAKER_05 1:01:42

Yeah, that makes sense.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:44

So after seeing the demon lord Yunogu, who is like the patron demon of dolls, uh Yunogu slaughtered the majority of the village of Idol Glen before she could intervene. She had previously protected Idolglen, like a like hundreds of years before from Yunogu.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:03

Oh, under her her her her purview.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:08

Yeah, and she had sworn to protect it, but she didn't get there in enough time to save the majority of the city. So she sort of defied orders to stand down after this, rallied an army at El Terrell, and trained volunteers, and accepted anyone willing to help her fight in the Blood War.

SPEAKER_05 1:02:27

Oh, so she was kind of just she was she was, you know, she was tired of the the the inaction and the the innocence dying in the crosshairs.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:02:39

Which it kind of it kind of sucks that like, you know, and and maybe the the the mechanisms of which will will kind of be explained more. But it kind of sucks that you know her her, you know, what what you could you could see as a a goodness in that she she wanted to, you know, she felt that them staying out of it, the celestial staying out of it was bad. Was bad, you know? That that so like her her desire to to get involved to like, you know, keep innocent people from being killed, put her in proximity to what would eventually corrupt her. So it kind of was like her own to get innocence killed. Yeah, her own, her own kind of her own goodness, you know, was kind of what what ended up being her downfall in a way, because it put her in proximity to to that, you know. That sucks.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:33

So in 1354 DR, Zariel, the actual angel still solar Zariel, marched her army from El Tyrell into Avernus. The reason I am putting so much emphasis on this is because do you know how recent 1354 DR is in the sense of DD?

SPEAKER_05 1:03:51

Uh I do not know. Like maybe like a I I promise I'm not actually looking at the thing. It's like a hundred, it's like it's like 200 something years.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:00

Pretty close, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:04:01

Like pretty close, right?

SPEAKER_03 1:04:02

Modern DD takes place around the like quote unquote modern DD takes place around the 1490s DR.

SPEAKER_05 1:04:10

Okay, yeah, I was pretty close.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:12

So that is pretty recent as far as descent itself takes place, like the majority of of it takes place in 1492 DR. Oh so yeah, this completely changes the history of the nine hells.

SPEAKER_05 1:04:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:28

Now Zariel has only been fallen for roughly 150 years, give or take, depending on the adventure in question.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:37

Wow.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:38

In 150 years, she became Lord of the First, helped and like assuming that everything from before was not right condui, which some of it probably was. She became Lord of the First, helped lead a march on disc, lost rule of Avernus, regained control of Avernus. And all that time she was able to orchestrate all these crazy plot plots like trying to release Diamond and setting up the events of this campaign.

SPEAKER_05 1:05:00

Yeah, so she she she got in there. She got in there and she was shmooving.

SPEAKER_03 1:05:07

She was shmooing. So back to the march on Avernus, which is now known as the ride. Capital R.

SPEAKER_05 1:05:13

The Ride. That's a very like whimsical almost kind of way to describe a march into hell.

SPEAKER_03 1:05:21

Yeah. Zariel's army marched into hell.

SPEAKER_05 1:05:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:05:24

And took the fight straight to Bell, who was the archdevil at the time. Uh so most of the army fought bravely and without hesitation, but a small fraction of a group known as the Hell Riders, this might uh uh pique some ears of listeners who play Baldur's Gate 3. Uh they fled in horror uh and sealed the portal behind them.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:46

Oh god, yeah. A bunch of dicks.

SPEAKER_03 1:05:49

Never revealed their shameful retreat and took their shame to their graves. Zariel never forgot them, though.

unknown 1:05:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:57

Zaru never forgets.

SPEAKER_05 1:06:00

Sucks.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:00

The rest of Zariel's armor made uh armor? The rest of Zaryel's army made massive strides into Avernus. Nevertheless, they could not defeat the endless legion of devils in hell.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:13

That that that tracks.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:15

Zariel's hand was severed in her final battle against Avernus. She ordered Yale, her most loyal general, to take her sword and hide it so that the devils could not corrupt or destroy it.

SPEAKER_05 1:06:27

Oh no. But they just corrupted her instead.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:31

Alongside Yale was Lulu, who, if you watch the minisode, I did reference. Lulu is Daryl's faithful Hollyphant companion in Warmount.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:42

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:43

They both fled the battlefield, Yale and Lulu, but stumbled into a horde of demons led by none other than Yunogu.

SPEAKER_05 1:06:50

Oh no. That's fucked up. Of course.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:55

Oh, of course they evaded him, but Yunogo's pet, an enormous demon named Prokectoek, chased them across a Vernus. As it cornered them to devour them, Yale plunged Zaryel's sword into a stone. Lulu then used every ounce of her celestial energy, pouring it all into creating a fortress, encasing and protecting the sword from all evil.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:20

Oh wow.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:21

Of course, this attacks Lulu so much that she became incredibly disoriented and flew away into a random direction without Yale.

SPEAKER_05 1:07:28

I mean, yeah, she kinda just just took all of her celestial energy. Yeah. And she's trapped in Avernus, so I don't think she really has the connection to get that back. Right, yeah. And it's like, where's she gonna go? You know.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:43

Well, um and yeah, poor Lulu and poor Yale, because Yale does die here.

SPEAKER_05 1:07:49

Yeah, yeah. Um dang, and like a like a sword and sword in the stone type thing. Yeah. That's pretty neat.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:56

Meanwhile, Zariel is officially defeated on battlefield. Her two other generals, Alanthius and Harman, refuse to leave Zariel. All three were captured and taken to Nessus, which is Asmodeus's realm, the bottom of the nine.

SPEAKER_05 1:08:11

Uh all the way down.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:13

The deep deep Asmodius welcomed her with open arms.

SPEAKER_04 1:08:19

I don't trust that. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:22

The one thing to remember about Asmodius is that he never lies. He will distort things and only give you half of the information, but he'll never lie to your face.

SPEAKER_05 1:08:32

Yeah, and and you know, as in often keeping with, you know, a lot of a lot of devils, there is a little bit of like uh, you know, a respect of of of of power, you know, and and and abilities and and capabilities and things like that, you know, as opposed to a lot of other situations where it's like there's this massive threat that they would kind of just want to get rid of it. But you know, Asmodeus is definitely the kind of person that you know looks at a situation like this and is like, oh, I can get something out of this.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:03

Pretty much.

SPEAKER_05 1:09:04

Which is, you know, that tracks.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:07

Yeah. He commanded her battle prowess and offered her the chance to rule in hell. Offered her averness on a silver platter. She would receive legions of devils under her command, which would follow her without question to battle against the demons. Which, mind you, because of recent events, she was definitely angrier at demons than devils. She hated them both.

SPEAKER_05 1:09:28

Yeah, true. But she had a big grudge against demons at this point. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:34

All she had to do was swear fealty to Asmodius and the Nine Hells. That's it. Oh still in Rage at the Blood War, uh, Zariel completed her fall from Greece and accepted Asmodeus' deal.

SPEAKER_05 1:09:48

Damn. In front of her generals, too.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:51

Well, Harriman was loyal to Zaryel and would do anything. And he followed Zariel directly into damnation.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:58

Oh.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:59

He was transformed into a devil. And Olanthius, while heartbroken at Zariel's fall, I don't think he thought of it as a betrayal. Not yet, anyway. Um, he took his own life to avoid bowing before the Prince of Evil.

SPEAKER_04 1:10:14

I mean, yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:16

And then was immediately brought back to sort of death tonight. That's so fucked up, man.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:22

That is so fucked up.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:23

Like I said, he I don't think he felt betrayed by her yet.

SPEAKER_05 1:10:27

And now Yeah, now like he he probably he probably saw the situation as more of like uh like just a just a tragedy that still was like a hundred percent just as Modius' fault, you know? Yeah, and that's crazy. Yeah. I would I would love to read this as like a novelization. Oh same. Because I feel like the I feel like the the elements of like, you know, her her her sort of descent and and maybe the mindset that she was in and like the emotions that she was feeling when she took that deal, I would be very interested in because I could see it as being like a I don't know maybe if the module itself uh kind of discusses any of this.

SPEAKER_03 1:11:12

Not really.

SPEAKER_05 1:11:12

I mean or if this is purely speculative on my part, but I I could see it being like uh maybe in her head she's like she's also like, oh, this is an opportunity.

SPEAKER_03 1:11:23

And maybe like I imagine that is what she was thinking.

SPEAKER_05 1:11:26

And that like I don't think she was fully, you know.

SPEAKER_03 1:11:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:11:29

I like I don't think before that she was like, oh yeah, awesome. A devil. Yeah, hell, hell's awesome. Asmodeus is is my new boss, you know. Love the devils. Love yeah, love the devils. Like I could see it fully as being like, you know, the sort of thing where she's like, okay, well, this is a snag in the plan, but like maybe I take this deal and then come back, you know what I mean? Like, yeah, and then come back, which I guess she does kind of try to lead, you know, participate in coups against Asmodeus after the fact. So maybe I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 1:12:02

Assuming that they didn't, you know, retcon all that away. I haven't seen anything to suggest one way or the other yet, but I did intentionally stop roughly here. Yeah, but I could I could for stat block and all that information is uh is updated for 5.5. But I I didn't there there's nothing new to go and read about, so I didn't bother.

SPEAKER_05 1:12:25

Yeah. Um dang, that sucks.

SPEAKER_03 1:12:28

Back with Lulu. Uh so she wanted around Avernus days for months because she's still like really out of it on account of right, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:12:38

On account of the the holy, the holy magic explosion.

SPEAKER_03 1:12:42

Yeah. Until so she ended up stumbling upon this traveling market that travels on the back of like this um infernal war machine. It's actually really cool. There's a lot of really cool stuff that I just don't have time to get into. Eyes that upload time.

SPEAKER_05 1:12:56

Hey, you know, it's fine.

SPEAKER_03 1:12:57

Uh there, a rock shassa named Pahadi tricked her and pretended to be her friend, only to splash her with a bit of water from the river sticks.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:06

Yep, that sounds like a rock shassa. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:08

That is exactly what you said during the mini-suit as well. I just want to point that out.

SPEAKER_05 1:13:13

Well, at least I stand by it. You do. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:16

So her mental faculties, her memories, and much of her powers were stripped away. So she was kind of just a bumbling mess of just golden elephant.

SPEAKER_05 1:13:26

Ugh. Golden flying elephant. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:30

Maybe. I don't know.

SPEAKER_05 1:13:32

Yeah, I don't know. Maybe she lost her ability to fly too.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:35

Uh most of her mental faculties were gone. So I'm willing to bet that she just kind of was kind of just like a vegetable.

SPEAKER_05 1:13:41

Essentially. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:43

He then gave the Holy Phantom to a group of devils as a gift for the new arch devils.

SPEAKER_05 1:13:47

That's so fucked up. First, one of her one of her other generals, like, you know, kills himself and then is resurrected as a death knight. And then, you know, and and then her her you know, her her war steed is just slash best friend. Slash best friend is like brought in with all of all of her memories and like mental faculties just stripped from her. Yeah. And is like, oh hey, here you go.

SPEAKER_03 1:14:18

Like that's just Imagine your new boss suddenly drags me in, drooling and just like memory. And gives gives me as a gift to you.

SPEAKER_05 1:14:29

Yeah, especially given that I I would speculate that that Zaryel's like not, like, yeah, maybe she's she's suddenly got a lot of a lot of new evil impulses that she didn't have before. Like, I'm sure at this point she's not really on the like it my interpretation of it would be that she's not fully on the like, oh yeah, hell, evil's awesome, cool.

SPEAKER_03 1:14:53

That's entirely accurate because like rubbing salt in the wound, you know. Yeah, even though Zariel recognized Lulu, she was not comfortable in Lulu's presence. Right.

SPEAKER_05 1:15:05

I mean, she's an arch devil now.

SPEAKER_03 1:15:07

Lulu is still uh a being of pure celestial energy.

SPEAKER_05 1:15:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:15:12

And she but she also couldn't allow her to remain in an Inverness, and but she couldn't bring herself to hurt her best friend. Oh, that's she sent Lulu back to Feyrune with her mind restored. Um, but her memories and powers were still locked away. She couldn't bring those back.

SPEAKER_05 1:15:29

Yeah. Okay, but at least she had her mind restored. So yeah, she could, you know, go on. So basically, Zara was pretty much just like, I'm gonna give her a new life, more or less.

SPEAKER_03 1:15:39

Essentially, like, or the ability to make her own new life.

SPEAKER_05 1:15:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:15:44

So it can be assumed that she then wandered around no longer days, but still very confused in the fields of the dead outside Baldur's Gate for roughly 140 years.

SPEAKER_05 1:15:53

God, goddamn. That's dang. Everything about this, everything about this, like I knew it, I knew it would, and I was very interested to to hear how it played out. Like everything about Zaryel's descent into hell just this just fucking sucks. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:16:08

As I mentioned, Zariel never forgot the Hellriders betrayal. When they returned to El Tyrell, she kept a close eye on the city because she wanted to take revenge on the Hellriders, but sort of the city that they inhabited as well.

SPEAKER_05 1:16:21

Yeah, just an extension there.

SPEAKER_03 1:16:22

That day ended up coming in 1444 DR, when El Tyrell was conquered by a vampire lord. Yeah, just you know priest uh named Thavius Krieg appeared to anyone, uh appealed to anyone to help him from the vampires. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:16:39

They're here, there's just vampires here now, whatever.

SPEAKER_03 1:16:41

Zariel immediately sees on the opportunity.

SPEAKER_05 1:16:43

Oh god, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:16:44

Um emerged in a pillar of fire and offered him a deal. Which he readily accepted. I don't necessarily blame him, but it it is a little wild that he is immediately like, oh yeah, great.

SPEAKER_05 1:16:59

This is fine. Yeah, this is fine. I guess it's I I I do wonder if he's desperate to save his people, I guess. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:17:06

I don't I didn't really read through a lot of the characterization of him, but I think it starts out as that, and then he ends up sort of being corrupted by the deal. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:17:16

Okay. Yeah, I mean, that's not surprising. Like I I kind of I kind of would be curious if like from the outset this guy is just kind of no offense, this guy's just kind of dumb. Like maybe he's like, oh, okay, cool, this is good. Or if it was initially maybe a little bit of uh, you know, kind of weighing the options.

SPEAKER_03 1:17:35

Right. Yeah, either one.

SPEAKER_05 1:17:38

Like maybe, maybe this could be okay because like I already know that like the the vampire lords have already come in and or the vampire lords already come in and like you know killed people or done whatever. So he's like, oh, maybe this could be okay. Like the opposite of the double you know, I guess, maybe.

SPEAKER_03 1:17:56

Yeah. Sorry, I was uh rolling uh to to see how much I had left, to see if I needed to truncate anything. I'm actually good.

SPEAKER_05 1:18:02

Uh trunk truncate like a like a holly. Sorry. That's really insensitive. That's really insensitive given what we just talked about. I'm sorry. Well, you walked into it instead of flu into it. That's rude. Oh.

SPEAKER_01 1:18:18

So anyway, back to El Tyrell.

SPEAKER_05 1:18:20

Uh back to back to back to vampire conquered El Tyrell.

SPEAKER_03 1:18:24

Yeah. In the sky over El Tyrell, a radiant spear called the Companion appeared, blazing like a second sun. Um secretly. It was powered by a planetar that was imprisoned within it.

SPEAKER_04 1:18:38

That trash.

SPEAKER_03 1:18:38

Uh nobody nobody knew except for Zariel and those who helped her. It's this beautiful orb that encased El Torrel and bathed it in holy light, which of course had the vampire lord scrambling and fleeing.

SPEAKER_05 1:18:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:18:57

Destroyed his entire undead army.

SPEAKER_05 1:19:00

Yeah, because while he won't be destroyed necessarily by the holy light, his underlings wouldn't be.

SPEAKER_03 1:19:05

And he will still be weakened.

SPEAKER_05 1:19:07

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 1:19:08

Uh and I guess if he stood there and continued to take radiant damage, eventually would eventually die.

SPEAKER_05 1:19:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:19:15

Everyone under him died, though.

SPEAKER_05 1:19:19

Yeah, because like what are they gonna do? You know? Yeah, that's one way to do it.

SPEAKER_03 1:19:24

Good old Thavius uh was allowed to take credit for summoning the companion, of course. Uh he was hailed as savior of the city and easily became its higher reserver for the next several decades.

SPEAKER_04 1:19:36

But at what cost?

SPEAKER_03 1:19:37

LT And I hold on.

SPEAKER_05 1:19:40

We'll get there. And I bet, I bet, guys, I'm gonna make a prediction. I bet that that that that weird uh that that weird second sun stays suspended perfectly in the sky forever. It never falls, nothing bad happens.

SPEAKER_03 1:19:55

Never that's a beautiful prediction.

SPEAKER_05 1:19:58

That's my prediction.

SPEAKER_03 1:19:59

Well, that is sort of what everyone thought. El Terrell prospered as a holy city, and it truly came into its own as a city state alongside along the sword coast. Uh standing toe-to-toe with cities like Baldur's Gate and Waterdeep, you know, finally really cementing itself.

SPEAKER_05 1:20:16

Yeah, put it on the map, if you will.

SPEAKER_03 1:20:18

So Thavius was told exactly when it was time to pay up.

SPEAKER_05 1:20:21

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Here comes the downside. Here comes the the other the other shoe.

SPEAKER_03 1:20:27

In the weeks leading up, Thavius lured Grand Duke Older Ravenguard to El Torel under the guise of diplomacy and personally fled El Tyrell.

SPEAKER_04 1:20:35

Oh no. Oh my god.

SPEAKER_03 1:20:37

A few others managed to flee as the companion warped warped into a black orb of infernal energy and sunk out of the material plane, bringing it and everyone down to Ravernus.

SPEAKER_05 1:20:47

I personally am flabbergasted. I would have never guessed that that would happen when they put a a weird, a weird orb in the sky, and they were like, hey, that's the companion. Don't worry about it. That's just the companion. It's part of our.

SPEAKER_03 1:21:00

I mean, the guy was a priest of Torm. Torm. Um and so like I I can kinda and this is a freaking world filled with, you know, gods doing really cool stuff sometimes, and clerics too, gods specifically, more often than not, doing really cool stuff.

SPEAKER_05 1:21:18

Yeah, true.

SPEAKER_03 1:21:19

So like I I can understand everyone being like, it's probably fine.

SPEAKER_05 1:21:24

It's it's kind of weird, but it's probably fine. And also it was, you know, it was, it did, it did drive out the the the vampire lord that like did try to take over the city and you know everything. So like it's probably fine. Yeah, you know what? That's that is fair. That is fair. I did not know that that's how L Tyrell fell though. I feel like I I feel like I just have, you know, and this is also a world, this also this is also a world without video games that have a very similar plot point to this. Yes. So I guess the me in that universe would have never like, you know, you know, would have never been like distracted by a roadrunner of running by my window. Yep.

SPEAKER_03 1:22:11

Me too. Sorry.

SPEAKER_05 1:22:12

He wants to, he wants to, um, he wants to be on the podcast.

SPEAKER_03 1:22:16

He needs a lot. Um, so all that said, not much of a personal experience to Thavius. I mean, yeah, he didn't die from it, so however, if adventurers kill him in the adventure, it becomes apparent that Zariel does actually lay claim to his soul. As he re-emerges on Avernus as an omnizoo devil, one of those six devils with the tiny wings.

SPEAKER_05 1:22:42

Oh, that's good. That's that's really good. Reduced to a little devil with wings. Just a little, just a little, just a little guy.

SPEAKER_03 1:22:51

I'm going to skip the majority of the adventure because this isn't the descent episode, but it's a very good adventure. The art is fantastic, and if you are a DM, I recommend running it. It's fun.

SPEAKER_04 1:23:02

Well, I can't now, so it's not you.

SPEAKER_03 1:23:05

Well, you can't run it for me. I mean, you I mean you could. I mean, you the the the thing is like you could like you trust me not to metagame.

SPEAKER_05 1:23:15

Yeah, like like I'm I'm playing in like a cursive Strahd campaign right now, and like, you know, uh we recently found the the journal that talks about all the stuff I talked about in the Strahd episode. Yeah. And it's still like, you know, Oh, this is new information. Well, yeah, and like, you know, like you know, like don't don't metigame, don't metigame kids, but like, you know, I I also fully respect people wanting to go into a yeah, you know, to go into a campaign like, you know, without, you know what I mean. Like, I understand some people like having that kind of stuff spoiled does really change the experience, but you know, it can it's still fun.

SPEAKER_03 1:23:55

Yeah. So depending on the actions of the adventurers, the adventurers recover Zaryel's sword. Um, it's a sentient sword.

SPEAKER_04 1:24:03

Yep, that makes sense.

SPEAKER_03 1:24:04

Yeah, it allowed the wielder to fly and have her lots of really cool abilities. It changed the wielder's alignment to Lawful Good. Um, they bring Lulu's memories back to her, unlocking all her abilities, and she remembers being Zaryel's best friend. Oh no! Losing her.

SPEAKER_05 1:24:22

No, that's so tragic, dude. Yeah, having to lose her again, yeah, again, yeah. That's so sad, dude.

SPEAKER_03 1:24:31

Uh, I they can also encounter a number of people who knew Zariel as a solar. Solar, my bad. Oh they can have varied opinions on Zaryel and her fall. Um, most of them are ghosts or you know, a death uh or a particular death knight.

SPEAKER_05 1:24:47

No, just some some some random death knight. No idea who that could be.

SPEAKER_03 1:24:51

They all have varied opinions on her. They do end up making their way to Zaryel Citadel and can influence her fate here. There are three main options for the adventures to not TPK and ruin their quest and finish the adventure.

SPEAKER_05 1:25:05

Which is probably a pretty likely, it's probably a pretty likely outcome.

SPEAKER_03 1:25:10

I can't remember what the uh recommended level is, but I'd imagine it's relatively high.

SPEAKER_05 1:25:15

Yeah, given all the given what we talked about earlier.

SPEAKER_03 1:25:19

Yeah. So technically there is a fourth option, but it does where they don't TPK, but they do still ruin their quest. Uh, they can decide to serve Zariel.

SPEAKER_05 1:25:28

Oh. Okay, I mean, yeah. I mean, that could that could be interesting, you know.

SPEAKER_03 1:25:32

Yeah, Elterel stays fallen. Zariel shatters her sword.

SPEAKER_05 1:25:37

Oh.

SPEAKER_03 1:25:38

Um, Lulu's mind becomes fractured, having witnessed her best friend fall beyond redemption.

SPEAKER_05 1:25:42

Again. Again, this poor Holly fan. Yeah. She's just gotta she had such a rough go of it.

SPEAKER_03 1:25:50

They can make a deal with Zariel. Zariel will agree to let El Torel return to the Material Plane as long as the adventures remember to ask specifically for it to be freed and returned. She will just leave it there if uh they don't ask. If they just say free. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:26:06

I love, I love devils, man. I love devils.

SPEAKER_03 1:26:09

But the thing in return is that the adventures have to kill Baphomet and Yunogu, which no easy. Okay.

SPEAKER_05 1:26:15

That that is a bit difficult, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:26:18

She'll also trade El Tyrell for Baldur's Gate. So if you brought with you the means to uh to sink Baldur's Gate, which you end up finding in the course of your adventure. Oh. Um, you can trade El Tyrell for Baldur's Gate. El Tyrell rises back, Baldur's Gate falls down.

SPEAKER_05 1:26:34

Okay. All right. That's so interesting, though. Yeah. Like the the the way to the the the means of like dealing with her as kind of a middle ground, presumably, between, you know, either just outright serving her or that so we still have two more options. Oh, yeah, true. Sorry, go on.

SPEAKER_03 1:26:53

No, you're good. You don't know about the final option, the mystery option.

SPEAKER_05 1:26:57

The oh, there's a mystery option.

SPEAKER_03 1:26:59

So I love mystery. The second option is because I'm not counting the very first thing because that's not really it doesn't really complete the quest. Like it does, but it doesn't. It's a failed quest.

SPEAKER_05 1:27:10

Yeah. Unless you're really evil, I guess.

SPEAKER_03 1:27:12

I guess unless you're really evil and you've secretly had a different quest the whole time. So the second option is that they can kill Zariel.

SPEAKER_04 1:27:19

Good luck. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:27:21

I did read her stat block out loud, yes.

SPEAKER_04 1:27:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:27:24

But you know, it could be it could be, you know, you can get really lucky. You can kill Zaryel in her in her home plane.

SPEAKER_05 1:27:33

Which would be an a tremendous feat.

SPEAKER_03 1:27:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:27:36

Yeah. Good luck. But you know, you could do it. It could happen. You could get really lucky.

SPEAKER_03 1:27:43

Killing Zariel frees Alterell and forces the player to deal with one of the power streaming seeming to rule Avernus and therefore sort of cements who the new ruler of Avernus will be. Right. So that Avernus doesn't plunge into chaos.

SPEAKER_05 1:27:57

Yeah, because you know, regardless of The the evilness is being opposed to whatever evilness that would be bad cosmologically.

SPEAKER_03 1:28:05

Yeah. So the final option: the Avengers can redeem Zarya.

SPEAKER_05 1:28:13

I like that. I like that.

SPEAKER_03 1:28:15

They must present her with her sword, which glows brightly and hovers in her presence. It actually starts glowing more as you approach her. So it starts glowing more and more and more.

SPEAKER_04 1:28:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:28:32

So once you're finally in front of her, it like brings itself to hover before her. The players then must pass a DC 25 persuasion check to rejoin the host of heaven.

SPEAKER_05 1:28:44

Okay. I mean, you know, that's better than the 26 um DC constitution savings are that she can force you to do, or else you just get every disease.

SPEAKER_03 1:28:54

The DC is brought down by five for each of the following. Lulu being president, present. If Lulu is present, she weeps for what Zariel has become and wants her friend and battle companion back. This makes Zariel feel incredibly guilty and miss Lulu. Olantheus. The heroes can ally with Olantheus in their travels, which Olantheus was the death knight.

SPEAKER_04 1:29:14

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:29:17

He will kneel before Zariel. Oh this fills her with great shame for what she did to such a loyal friend because this was like she can tell that this is his own decision and not something he's doing just as a death knight.

SPEAKER_05 1:29:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:29:32

He is kneeling in front of her as a friend.

SPEAKER_05 1:29:35

That's uh wow.

SPEAKER_03 1:29:38

So if you bring both of them, the DC is now 15, which is actually pretty good.

SPEAKER_05 1:29:44

That's pretty that's doable, man. That is doable. You must bring it up.

SPEAKER_03 1:29:49

Like you hope that everyone you has the health action. And yeah, so like honestly, that's doable.

SPEAKER_05 1:29:57

Like, oh yeah, just put your put your paladin, you know, put your put your you know, put your charisma.

SPEAKER_03 1:30:04

I would argue for advantage if I had a LeFander paladin.

SPEAKER_05 1:30:07

Yeah. Oh true, but like just put your just put your charisma up.

SPEAKER_03 1:30:12

I argue for disadvantage because of the fact that she uses and then it just cancels out.

SPEAKER_05 1:30:19

You just have a straight roll, yeah. But like, you know, the 15's doable though, like you know.

SPEAKER_03 1:30:26

If she grabs the sword, and there's actually this whole thing for you for the DM to read, but I'll just read what Zariel says. She starts crying in pain and through tears of confusion and sorrow and a little bit of joy. She says, I, Zariel, supplicate myself before the holy light of justice. If it should accept me, I vow to take up this blade once more in its service. Then she's bathed in radiant light. The fiery visit the fiery halo disappears, feathers burst from her wings that had long since been destroyed, and her angelic form is restored. Which I will read what that looks like here in just a moment. At the sight of this blessed transformation, Lulu gasps in delight and transforms into a celestial mammoth with golden fur, feathered wings, and gleaming tusks.

SPEAKER_04 1:31:16

Oh, that's sick.

SPEAKER_03 1:31:18

Zariel is returned to her full celestial glory, brings Elterl back to the surface with the help of the formerly imprisoned planitar, who is now perfectly fine. Zariel turns Olantheus to dust, granting him rest at last. And she and Lulu become battle buddies again. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:31:38

I mean, that is by far the best. Uh and then and then I still run up and stalk her in the face, and I'm like, listen. I know, I know you you you say you're back on the side of good now, but like you you better you better not better not forget what you did to Carlack. This is for Carlac.

SPEAKER_03 1:32:01

True. So fun fact actually, um, this is spoilers for for Bulberskate 3. So if you have not played Bulgars Kate 3, um stop listening for like five minutes.

SPEAKER_05 1:32:13

So or you know, or or you know, we're not your dad. Yeah, but yeah, there'd be spoilers.

SPEAKER_03 1:32:19

Bulberscape three takes place in 1492, meaning that these events can be occurring simultaneously.

SPEAKER_05 1:32:28

That's so crazy.

SPEAKER_03 1:32:29

And could either predate or coincide with either redemption or her not so redeeming. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:32:39

Yeah, that is crazy.

SPEAKER_05 1:32:43

Um man, it's like it'll just be happening at the same time. Yeah, that's like when you know, when like a like a like a movie, like a movie, either just the movie itself or like a series of movies, like you know, it gets to a point where like something happens and then you realize I I guess I'm acting like it's an analogy when it's literally the same thing. But you know, when it when you realize it's happening concurrently as something else, or it's happening at maybe just a like a different time period than you thought it was, and you're like, whoa, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:33:14

Okay, so real quick, I do want to describe um the series of stained glass paintings that are featured throughout the sentence of Avernus that showcases Zaryel's fall into becoming an arch devil. It shows her as a beautiful solar wherein she actually has hair. She has four blue wings, blue feathered wings, golden skin, and aqua-colored hair that is long, like goes down to like past her midrift easily. And it's like these like cute low low pigtails, and she's blindfolded, probably to prevent other people from from from getting burning from her vision, yeah. The fact that she's cyborg.

SPEAKER_05 1:34:03

Um cyborg vibes.

SPEAKER_03 1:34:06

Or cyclops, that's what it is.

SPEAKER_05 1:34:07

Or yeah, cyclops, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:34:09

Um, and and these she's leading her army into El Torel. She's wearing this beautiful purple gown that's also like armor. She uh is fighting devils and demons, and then it shows her taking off her blindfold and accepting a deal with Osmodius. And then it shows it shows her turning her best, her, her dear friend into a death knight, and her visage is slowly warping. She's burning now, and she has tears streaming down her face that are blackened tears, and her wings are you know wilted and burned. And then finally, it shows her wielding war hammer and a flail and uh commanding the armies of devils into war.

SPEAKER_05 1:34:53

Then that's crazy.

SPEAKER_03 1:34:55

Finally, if you get the hashtag hidden true ending, the true ending, um, you get one more, one more stain glass, which is Zariel reascending, not necessarily into heaven, but into the sky at a in what looks like a very peaceful sunset, her former sword, her hair and her wings and their former glory, and Lulu hovering next to her.

SPEAKER_04 1:35:24

Oh, that's so good though. That's so uh that's all I have.

SPEAKER_02 1:35:30

That's it.

SPEAKER_05 1:35:32

Um, I gotta say, I do I do think that the the and I I I'm not looking at the I couldn't find the I I did a quick goo and a quick goo.

SPEAKER_03 1:35:42

I'll send pictures later, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:35:44

But the the the the change from like her her angelic form wearing the blindfold and then her like taking it off when she makes a deal with Asmodius feels very like it feels like a subversion of how you think that would usually go. Like, you know, I I would think that almost it would be like you know, her her making a deal with Asmodeus, she like would, you know, like would put it on, you know, kind of to like to blind herself in a way, you know, like from from from the evils or or whatever. I think that's a really interesting subversion of how I would have imagined that kind of change would be, I guess. I don't know. It feels like it feels like, I don't know, it just feels like uh feels like there's something there's something there. There's some, you know, I don't know. There's some symbolism there, you know.

SPEAKER_01 1:36:34

That's all I got. So all right.

SPEAKER_05 1:36:40

So I mean again, thank you everyone so much for listening and for joining us on our uh uh record library. It has been fantastic. Just remember, uh, like we said earlier, we are no longer doing Twitter, so you can abandon that one if you haven't already. But yeah, we are going to be on threads as soon as I figure out how to actually do social media for once in my life. What is social media? I know I'm so bad at it. Make sure to spread the word to your friends. We always appreciate that. And uh, if you have anything that you would like to suggest as a topic for us to cover, you can email us at dungeonpedia.podcast at gmail.com.

SPEAKER_03 1:37:25

Thank you guys so much for listening. And we'll catch you next week.

SPEAKER_05 1:37:36

I can't actually hear this, I can hear it in my head. We're back, baby. Back like we never left.