Interview with Amos about LED Lights and Agronomy - Episode 2

In this interview, Amos Bassi, a senior plant specialist and agronomist with international experience across Europe, Asia, and North America, shares how a lifelong passion for agriculture led him to specialize in sustainable and efficient food production. Growing up in Italy, he chose an agriculture-focused high school and pursued the path of a “doctor agronomist,” working across crop production, science, and technology. Now part of the Philips horticultural lighting division as a sales application specialist / senior plant specialist, he supports growers in greenhouses and vertical farms by translating plant science into practical strategies—optimizing lighting, adapting innovations to local climates and market needs, and helping producers improve yields while managing energy, labor, and other constraints.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Hello, Helen speaking.

SPEAKER_02 0:01

Hi, Helen. It's uh Brandon calling. How are you doing?

SPEAKER_00 0:04

Good. How are you?

SPEAKER_02 0:05

Awesome. Well, excited to uh to have you if this has been our right time for uh about 30 minutes to uh get you to share a little bit um uh not only about yourself, but obviously about uh Pure LifeSquales. Uh so yes, of course, it's a perfect time. Before we uh before we get kicked off, I'm uh I'm just excited because uh you're actually our first uh first guest on our podcast series uh that sort of follows up some of the documents that we've been working on with regards to the places, people, and passions uh behind our local food system. Uh and so I'm very excited again to have you and thank you so much for your time today to basically discuss uh a little bit again about um your company yourself and what helped you know drive our local food system from different perspectives. Uh and so again, really privileged to uh to have you here today. And sorry, I promise I'll uh I'll shut up.

SPEAKER_00 0:57

Yeah, no, no, no. Thank you for having me. It's an honor, and I'm very uh excited to be a part of it.

SPEAKER_02 1:02

Awesome. And so uh over the course of this this next little uh you know, a little bit in terms of our discussion, um, I wanted to um not only introduce you, we'll say, as Helen Stylos from uh Pure Life Soils, um, but maybe get you to uh share a little bit about um what the company does uh that you work for before we get into a more deeper dive in terms of some of the other activities.

SPEAKER_00 1:23

Sure. Yeah, can I go ahead and explain that right now?

SPEAKER_02 1:26

100%.

SPEAKER_00 1:28

Okay, great. So Pure Life Soil is a regenerative soil company. We started way back when, when we were initially the parent company was a bait company. Um, and the family that started this company about 53 years ago ended up with a byproduct. And they weren't sure what this byproduct was all about, but the byproduct were the worm castings. And farmers started going to the family for the worm castings every single week for you know fertilizer, but the family didn't know what how potent, how amazing worm castings were until they started looking into the science behind soil. So Pure Life was born a really long time ago. It was called another company back then, it was under the family name, and then they switched the name to Growfor. And in 2021, we rebranded to Pure Life Soil. Now I came along about three and a half years ago. I've had a personal obsession and love for soil biology and biostimulant since I was a little girl. So we're talking over 40 years ago. And the first time I used Pure Life Soil and I opened up the bag, I swear there was like a halo hovering over top of the soil. I knew what I was looking at. Like this was a very unique product. And I know I got to know the family and what they were doing, and they got excited that I was excited about the product. So here I am right now with Pure Life Soil, and I'm here to stay. But um, going back to Pure Life Soil, the history, it's been around for 53 years, believe it or not. And the family is in its third generation of management. It was the founder, the son, and now the grandson. So it's come a long way in 50. Yeah, it's come a long way in 53 years, and it's gotten to be a very serious product in in the environment. So our soil is alive, it's like loaded with millions and millions of microbes. Actually, there's more life and a little spoonful of worm castings than there is the entire population on the planet. So, with our worm castings, we can actually regenerate land masses, we can trap carbon and promote symbiotic communication in the ground. It's something so magical and so necessary to sustain life, like below our feet and above ground. It's it's a miraculous product. So we've got millions of earthworms. We're the largest holder of earthworms in Canada, and we feed these earthworms and they poop out the soil. So we're essentially just feeding, changing out their bedding, and then refeeding them again. It's a rinse and repeat cycle. So we always get a pure product.

SPEAKER_02 4:09

Amazing. And so uh where where exactly is this uh this all happening? Oh, that's a great question.

SPEAKER_00 4:17

Yes, lo and behold, we're right in the west end of Toronto, which is kind of strange to say. Um, we have a large indoor facility, about 48,000 square feet, and 15,000 square feet of of our facility are cooler spaces, so massive walk-in coolers. And we feed these worms, we're they're all temperature control, these rooms with these rooms. So we feed these worms and they continuously poop out the fertilizer for us. So every two weeks we'll change out their bedding.

SPEAKER_02 4:49

That's amazing. And uh, I think one of the things that you said earlier is just the fact that, you know, kind of like in and we'll say Canadian agriculture is usually the kind of family farm, right? In multi-generational families in the world of agriculture and producing food or raising livestock. Um, but here we have a key input supplier that I think is again, the story is quite amazing in terms of going from like a premium, you know, let's say fishing and bait business to then realizing that the black gold that they're producing, you know, as a byproduct per se of having worms for bait uh has now really exploded, I think, to people realizing the impact of um of this kind of product or byproduct, we'll say again worm poop, um being both biologically active and having nutrients. And then the the recipe that you guys have and actually doing it, we'll say, in an urban environment in Canada's biggest city is uh is actually just phenomenal. But I know that your um your reach doesn't just ban, you know, Ontario, Toronto, GTA. Um, you guys, I believe, are across the border. So maybe you can share just a little bit about how um maybe your business works and some of the different uh segments we'll say that you are are servicing or providing um providing healthy, nutritious soils too.

SPEAKER_00 6:05

Yes, uh so thank you for bringing that up. So from our worm castings, we produce three soil blends, plus we produce custom mixes for growers and farmers across Canada and the US. That is why we're located in the west end of Toronto. Now we need to be nearby every highway exit. So we've got the 400, the 401, the 427. And the other unique thing about us is we actually ship earthworms overseas to Europe. So we need to be near the airport, which is the other, the other um, you know, sort of like avenue, the other um outlet we need nearby us. And because we can control temperature, we can easily control humidity levels and light indoors, it's the best scenario for these worms. These worms will live longer, stronger, healthier lives in our facility and happier lives, actually. They'll they'll produce a better quality casting under our roof. So that is the nicest part about raising earthworms inside is that they're healthy, they're happy, and we're getting a consistent NPK ratio, we're getting consistent quality, saturation rates, you name it. And these worms just thrive for a really long time. If the worms were being raised outdoors, they faced environmental issues and the possibility of being plucked up by a bird. So they actually have a pretty long lifespan. If they don't get plucked up by a bird out in the out in the wild, they can live anywhere from six to seven years, which is pretty long for a small, tiny little creature that's so soft and squishy like that. That's a that's a long lifespan. But we ship our product all across Canada into the US and overseas to Europe. That's amazing. That's the reason why we're in the city.

SPEAKER_02 7:49

And and the a quick question on that, just out of my own curiosity, is so when you um we'll say pack up war, and I just can just imagine you know, 10,000 worms on a plane flying flying overseas, which is kind of surreal. But it's it's the reality of your business. And again, having a premium product shipping it around the world. But um, the technical question I wanted to ask you is um how long will like the worms live, I guess? Like you obviously you maintain temperature as much as you can, but then you package them up, put them for express shipping, I assume, and um they're there within 24 hours. Is that sort of the the overall we'll say lifespan or I don't want to say stress, but just in terms of just what they're being provided? Is that sort of a rule of thumb?

SPEAKER_00 8:35

That's a really good point. They actually get packaged up in breathable containers and in cardboard boxes after they're in a breathable container. And then those cardboard boxes get wrapped up in a mesh instead of a plastic. So we have to ensure that everything is timed properly, that we're getting them to the airport right before they're being shipped off. And we've got um, we we meet that criteria that they're being shipped and delivered within their breathable time.

SPEAKER_02 9:03

Amazing.

SPEAKER_00 9:04

So they can go for, yeah, they can go for 24 hours without air, but we don't like to do that. We like to give them air.

SPEAKER_02 9:11

Of course, right? Healthy, healthy, happy uh animals will say. I don't know, is a worm considered an insect or it sounds like a stupid thing.

SPEAKER_00 9:21

Yeah. Actually, that's a great question. I need to look that one up. You'd think I'd know that by now after so many years. But um they're um they they need to be delivered, yes, within a certain time frame. So it's it's all timed.

SPEAKER_02 9:35

Amazing. And in terms of your other products, because obviously the worms is one aspect, both are are they, we'll say your your farmers uh in in producing, you know, growing themselves, we'll say, as both bait and uh and for the castings. Uh, but in terms of some of the castings uh that you're selling as well as your your customized soil mixes, um where, you know, if I if I can ask, like whereabouts are you shipping? Are you shipping like across the United States as well as like across Canada?

SPEAKER_00 10:03

Yeah, so shipping soils is a whole other different beast. Um, along with earthworms, they are handled separately. We need separate licenses and registrations to sell across the border and to ship across the border. We need certain clearances. So we're shipping earthworms and all of our soils and worm castings across Canada. That's not an issue. To ship earthworms across south of the border and overseas to Europe, we need separate licenses, registrations, and clearances. And then we can also ship worm castings only south of the border. In order for me to ship soil blends, it's a whole other process. They're all handled separately through the government and the agricultural um offices of each state.

SPEAKER_02 10:49

Interesting, right? So a little bit more.

SPEAKER_00 10:53

Yeah, a lot of paperwork and a lot of approvals, a lot of jumping through fiery hoops to get uh approvals on regist on um our packaging as well. The packaging can only say certain things in certain states and can say more in other states, let's say. So it's kind of it's kind of been a little bit of a uh, I guess like a game for us to figure out what one fits one package fits all. That's that's what we're trying to achieve right now. But each state functions differently. Whereas Canada, we've got like laws that that work for all provinces across the board. The US doesn't work that way. So we when we ship across the border, it's a different scenario for each state.

SPEAKER_02 11:36

Very interesting, right? And and uh I guess with that comes, you know, the world, the world of agribusiness, right? Dealing with the the papers and the you know, the paperwork, the regulations, et cetera, to make sure not only is the product you know vetted and verified, but also again labeled appropriately to whatever you know different types of regulations might uh might be. Um and uh a quick quick plug for uh for those uh those who are listening um is that you'll probably notice the Pure Life brand being this beautiful white and purple and neon green um packaging. Um and just on that, just on the topic of we'll say um uh regulatory stuff, um you guys have been able to stand out above almost all of your competition by having not only high quality, but very consistent outputs to where you have almost the same, we'll say nutrients, microbes in terms of consistency of that. And and obviously that goes back to your proprietary, but maybe you can just share a little bit about um, you know, 50 years of developing a recipe that then can now apply to um international, you know, international sales, business development, and and that sort of thing. So um I know there's certain things you definitely aren't going to share, um uh, but maybe you can just share a little bit about how that that process has evolved on the I will call it the innovation side of we'll say biological innovation of understanding worms.

SPEAKER_00 13:01

For sure. And that goes to the treatment of the worms and the temperature, the humidity levels and light levels. Um because the family has been doing this for over 50 years, it's almost become like clockwork now. And the one really interesting thing, and I do want to share this with everyone who's listening, is that we're kind of old school, I would say, in the ways of processing where we do everything by hand. And when we separate our worms from castings, we will we will do it all by hand. We have a large amount of staff in our production facility that will inspect the worms with their eyes to make sure the worms are not at the end of their lifespan, that they're not cut, they're not damaged, that we're we only have healthy worms on on hand. Typically, what a lot of other worm casting companies will do, they'll use vibrating machines, screeners, um, tumblers, and that's how they'll separate castings from the worms. Now, when you're using these screeners and machinery, it does cut the worms. You will end up with perhaps some carcass in your castings, which will produce mycelium, which is not a bad thing, but you don't want to kill off the worms. It's kind of inhumane. So we'll do it by hand for many reasons. Number one, because it is humane. Number two, we don't produce emissions. Number three, we can inspect with our eyes, which a machine can't do. And number four, we keep people employed. So this is all adding good things to the economy, to our livestock, and making sure everything is running properly, like tickety-boo. We don't want any mishaps, we don't want any infections or viruses going through our livestock. Once there's one sick worm in the in the bunch, it could infect the others. So that's why we do everything by hand. We want to make sure that everything is clean and healthy and happy and just running properly. So that's one aspect of our production facility. We'll do everything by hand. The other thing is we control temperature levels and we can control feedstock, and we can control humidity and uh basically the light. So those all come into play. They're all very important factors to producing a very consistent quality worm casting.

SPEAKER_02 15:12

Yeah, well, just on that, that's it. Well, I was gonna say too quickly, it's like, you know, you guys are embodying um what we would say more modern is like controlled environment agriculture, right? Optimizing the temperatures, making sure that things are, you know, within the right parameters to ensure that you've got a healthy, um, as you say, sort of livestock, right? Which are your farmers and uh and really um, you know, also your workers. And the thing that I really love about Pure Life is that it is not only, you know, family-owned and operated, um, which has a certain set of values that have carried through over 50 plus years, um, but it's also a people-centric business. Um, and so maybe you can share just quickly both, you know, how many people generally you guys are working with, and then how many of your little uh your little farmers are in your controlled environment chambers?

SPEAKER_00 16:02

Well, that's a great question. So during peak season, we'll have about 250 million worms of one species in our facility. We do have a couple different species, so we'll have top feeders and bottom feeders. So the bottom feeders will have about 250 million during peak season. Right now, we're probably just over at 100 million right now. Um, and then that goes up, it fluctuates, and that fluctuates for a reason. So the worms do go off to market for sure. That's one reason. The other reason is the weather and our changing seasons, which is key for our business. We sublease six chunks of farmland in Midwestern Ontario, and we have been doing this for over 50 years. The reason we do this is we want to protect those lands from ever being tilled or sprayed. That's where we pick our worms from. So our pickers go out at nighttime. What we need to do is during the day check weather patterns. We're gonna check which way the wind blows, we're gonna check precipitation, and then we're gonna select the best area to go to, the best farm to go pick our worms. We will never pick worms from a golf course or a park or anything like that, because if worms do exist on those properties, they're gonna be toxic. We can't bring those in. So we bring our own worms in from the the uh farmland that we sublased. Interesting fact, if there's a full moon at night, we don't send anyone out. No one's picking worms at night.

SPEAKER_02 17:33

And why the worms will not surface. Why is that? The worms just don't surface under full moons.

SPEAKER_00 17:39

They don't. So they don't like light, as we all know. Earthworms will stay underground and they'll only surface at nighttime to feed on decaying plant matter. However, if there's a full moon, they're gonna stay underground. They're not gonna want to come out to the moonlight. And the moonlight does produce a painful protein that does surge through their bodies. So they're not gonna want to come out of the ground when it's a full moon. So it's gonna be a slow night. We're not doing anything that night.

SPEAKER_02 18:03

Wow, that's extremely extremely interesting. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:07

Well, a lot of people And that's where we get into the anatomy of the earthworm, right? Like how they don't have any senses other than what they feel through their skin, which is light and vibration. That's it.

SPEAKER_02 18:19

Yeah. And so, you know, when we're talking about um, and this is because you and I obviously have had a few different discussions in the past, so I kind of get a visual, but like what what does it look like? So if you have uh between 100 million and 250 million worms and you have people going out into these fields at nighttime, uh, what does that sort of look like? Is it like a like a like a hockey team on a bus that go goes out there and just starts to to pick? Or maybe you can share just a little bit about how that's uh coordinated because it does sound like you know it's um we'll say a day-by-day uh process and also a seasonal process. Like is there a pertinent particular time of year where you're sending the pickers out more frequently? I'm assuming not minus 35. Um but uh what does that kind of look like?

SPEAKER_00 19:06

So the pickers will go out at nighttime. Well, the best days are the rainy nights. They'll all surface. All the worms want to come out when it's raining, except when there's a full moon, as I mentioned earlier. So if it's a if it's a night where there's torrential downpour and a full moon, the worms will choose to stay underground and drown rather than come out to the moonlight. That's how much they hate the moonlight. Wow. But if it's a night where we've just got a sliver of a moon, torrential downpour, we're gonna be out there, we're gonna be picking the worms, and our pickers come back in the morning. Yes, it is like a bus full of hockey players. We've got trucks lined up down the street waiting to offload in the morning, and that's when our assembly line starts. We offload the worms, we check with our eyes, we make sure that the worms are healthy and they go into habitats, they get divided into habitats of 500. In that habitat, they're gonna be fed and they're gonna go into a cooler for two weeks. Well, for two weeks, they're gonna eat and rest and poop. That's what that's their job, and they're gonna be happy doing it. After the two-week period, we're gonna do a rinse and repeat cycle. We're gonna check the worms, make sure they're happy again. We're gonna separate them from their castings, refeed them, and they go back into the cooler for another two weeks. So this can go on and on and on for a very long time.

SPEAKER_02 20:24

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 20:25

And that's basically our process. But yes.

SPEAKER_02 20:28

Are the, and I'm sorry, I'm gonna get technical, another question just because I only know so much about worms, but are are worms, um, are your worms like reproducing inside their containers, or are they sort of like how I guess how does that happen, you know, in terms of having a uh a supply of worms that remains consistent? Um yeah, like does that happen in the warehouse or is that just a natural uh phenomenon, we'll say so they will mate, they will mate and produce cocoons.

SPEAKER_00 20:59

Um, we can accelerate that the mating process by bringing the temperature up a little bit. We also run the risk in the coolers that if we raise the temperature a little bit, the worms will escape from their habitats. So it's a bit a bit of a tricky thing. You want to keep them at a temperature that's just gonna make them active enough to eat and poop, but not active enough to really go crazy mating, producing cocoons and crawling out of their habitat. So there's like a fine line there. We can't cross it. We've tried a few times. The worms do mate, they do produce cocoons and will crawl out, but it's almost next to impossible to separate all the cocoons from the castings. So we try not to encourage them to mate. We want them to live a long time and to produce castings, but it's very difficult to separate a tiny little cocoon from the rest of the batch. It it's um extremely time consuming, and it would be impossible to uh I guess employ someone just to do that.

SPEAKER_01 22:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:02

So we do end up with cocoons and they do end up in the product. And if you end up with cocoons in your product, consider yourself extremely lucky.

SPEAKER_02 22:11

That's amazing. Well, and again, at at 250 million worms, you can imagine trying to hand pick cocoons. It's not, you know, maybe it's someday we'll have some AI technology that can maybe help with that. But again, as a human-centric business, it's not like you want somebody to be picking um, you know, a million, a million little tiny cocoons a day. It's not good for anybody to use it for their for their carpal tunnel or whatever that might be, right?

SPEAKER_00 22:34

So exactly. Yeah. Carpal tunnel does happen in our facility for sure. But I have gone ahead myself personally, and I've I have been picking out cocoons myself just for my own leisure and my own to raise them myself. But it is very time consuming. And each cocoon will hatch many babies. So when the cocoons are out in the wild, like we're regenerating land masses at an alarming rate. You can protect those land masses, let the crop cover grow, mow it down, let it decay. And it's a feast, it's like a haven for all these earthworms. You want that. That's what we need.

SPEAKER_02 23:09

And so that's what's happening on the properties that you you guys have, right? That you exactly. So then you're actually, you know, um, we'll say employing an aspect of sustainable or regenerative agriculture in order to create an ecosystem that we don't, you know, as humans, we barely even see beneath our feet. And that ecosystem, I guess, for you is a core, it's a core to your business. So again, the whole aspect of, well, the more sustainable we are, the healthier worms are, the healthier worms are, the more castings we can produce, the more castings we can produce, the more customers we can serve to then help to actually regenerate the land again, just by having a product for those that are looking to begin regenerating their land spaces, gardens, you name it, right?

SPEAKER_00 23:53

That's right. There's this beautiful exchange constantly happening between the ground and the air above. It's never ending. It's evergreen, it's never ending. Like we constantly have earthworms. So as long as the land is happy and healthy, the worms and the life in the ground is happy and healthy. We want to keep that going. That's the goal. And we want to spread that all across Canada, the US. We want to make sure this is happening everywhere. Of course, with conventional farming, it's difficult to do, but we're trying our best to get this everywhere and to teach everyone about it.

SPEAKER_02 24:29

Which is such an amazing, you know, amazing feat. It's definitely an uphill battle as I I work in my own domain to try to do the same to, you know, build awareness. But also, again, for for you guys, is there's no point in saying you can regenerate the land if it's going to cost you a hundred million dollars, right? And so you've been able, again, through through these generations of business, been being able to um produce something that's fantastic for the soils, for the microbiome, uh, the soil microbiome, eventually plant microbiome, um, and being able to share that, right? Which I think again leads to there's so much more impact, I think, that comes from your business and the ethos of it than surely just the product alone.

SPEAKER_00 25:10

Yes, it's really interesting how the word is getting around now. People are really starting to become aware of this, so much so that about two months ago, I received a phone call from a real estate agent who was trying to sell a commercial property for four years. And no one is buying it because a chemical plant used to exist there. Nothing is happening with this, the soil is just too toxic there. So he came to me and he said, What can we do? I said, Well, let's try a test like a patch test with earthworms. So we're gonna see what happens now and by spring. We're gonna do this patch test and test the soil there and see what happens. But hopefully we can let our little earthworms do their jaws. They'll eat all the toxic soil. And when it bypasses through their body, it's gonna turn into a pure filtered byproduct. We hope we can regenerate this landmass. So we're gonna test it out and see. Well, just stay tuned for that one.

SPEAKER_02 26:01

That's super amazing, right? And and think about the number of sites and brownfields and X gas stations and all these other chemical factories, right? This could be a huge, could be a huge new line of business, right? Let alone uh sequestering carbon, right? And creating healthy organic matter that's gonna then increase uh moisture retention, potentially retain different types of gases, atmospheric and through plants. That's um amazing. I'm excited to hear.

SPEAKER_00 26:26

Yeah. Yes, it's revolutionary because for a chunk of land that's sitting there, the investor is like losing money with each passing month. He can't sell this property. Well, I'm sure there are many other landlords out there with toxic properties that they can't sell. It's deemed unsafe for any kind of use right now. But if we can bring the land back to a healthy state, it becomes much more valuable and much more desirable.

SPEAKER_02 26:51

For sure. Big, big, big, big, big case, cutty, right? Not just on the um the individual, say the private side, but also on the provincial, the federal, national, maybe international side of things as well. How can you use uh you know different type of land regeneration protocol um to make it happen? So again, very very excited. Um but I wanted to jump just quickly because we kind of touched on it. And obviously, having happy and healthy uh worms is one thing in terms of you know what your general core line of business will say, but also um happy and healthy people and a team, right? As we discussed, you know, a very human-centric business employing people of all different walks of life and different skill sets. And so there's two questions I have to ask you, I guess. Is number one, maybe you can share a bit about what that team sort of looks like. And then a curious question is like, does somebody go to school to become like a worm expert? Or like how does how does that sort of happen? Or is this just um, you know, we'll say traditional knowledge that's shared?

SPEAKER_00 27:53

Yeah, it goes more to traditional knowledge that's shared and a passion for what for what you love. For me, it started as a child. This is me personally now. And that obsession becomes very intense as you get older. It doesn't go away. Once you go down that rabbit hole, you're not coming back out again. All the amazing things that these slimy little creatures do is incredible. You start learning one little fact and you're not gonna stop. It's like a you're like a fast moving train. You're not gonna want to stop learning. So the people that work at Pure Life, it's generally the family, the founders, and the children and the grandchildren. There's myself and a few other people that I would say have been there for well over 20 years. Not a few, I would say probably about maybe, I would maybe 20 over who've been there for well over 20 to 25 years. There are many people who've joined on in the last 10 to 15 years who are going to be lifers. I myself is a lifer. I won't be um, I can see myself sticking with pure life soul because I just love it so much. I love the ethos, I love the whole camaraderie with the family. We have all become family in there, everyone. And it's just become a place where you can go to work, you can get up in the morning and be happy to go to work. You don't wake up in the morning think, oh my God, I have to go to work today. I hate my life. It's not like that at Pure Life at all. It's just such a happy place. It's a place where we're doing great work, it's very scientific. We're all constantly learning. There's not a day that goes by that we don't learn a new fact or new science or new species that are doing something great for the environment or something horrible for the environment. We're constantly learning. So there's no like really like a day that we go to work and it's like a boring day. It doesn't exist at pure life. That's every day is exciting.

SPEAKER_02 29:57

And that's, I think, part of the part of the journey, right? Being involved to say in a lot of different things in the world of agriculture or food is, you know, it kind of happens 24-7. There's always things to improve, there's always things to do, and especially since you guys, you know, whether or not you're selling worm castings or live worms, you are you are stewards of life, right? And and managing that, not only stewards of um worm life, we'll say, um, but you know, of the humans that have uh have supported you, which again, being at your your facility and having a quick walkthrough and seeing um the camaraderie, you know, the smiles on people's faces, even as they're sorting worms, and understanding that not only is that providing meaningful employment to people, um, it's also you know, healthier worms, happier worms that are not being, you know, chopped up through a much more industrialized process, albeit you guys are producing tons and tons and tons of product to ship across North America, which again, for me is such an amazing um showcase of how you know people who are dedicated and committed and like the environment um are still happy to come to work, you know, and pick worms for six hours, eight hours, whatever that might be, and help to do these other tasks because it's part of actually a much bigger, um, much bigger vision, much bigger impact.

SPEAKER_00 31:11

Yes. And it all goes back to, I'm gonna have to say kudos to the owners as well, because they have created a happy environment as well. Um, they're great people to work for. Uh, it's very family-oriented. They treat everyone like families. So it's it's a pleasant place to go to every day. And there's always something innovative going on. We're just never, ever bored. Um, with all the newcomers that come in. So within our offices, we have about 13 people in our office. Then we've got the production facility, which we have about another, depending on the time of year, we can go from 30 to 100 people depending on the time of year. And then we've got our teams who are on the road. So basically our drivers who are delivering the worms. So we've got a fleet of trucks. So we've got like three sort of divisions here that are constantly intertwined with each other. Everyone communicates with each other, everyone works as a team. And the owners have created this great ethos, this great sort of feel, camaraderie, like this harmonious, cohesive team that uh we all work together and it shows within the success of the company. So we're all in it together. And those newcomers that have come on, they they come and they're like, okay, I guess I'll be like working in a warehouse or working in the office, and it's worms. Like, who would ever think that they would end up working with worms? They never thought that. And within the first two weeks, they all come to me and say, I had no idea how amazing earthworms are. I had no idea how serious this business is. And it really is quite amazing to get up every day and to think, oh my gosh, we're gonna do something new today. We're gonna try a new experiment, we're gonna try a different temperature, different feedstock, or we're gonna try different applications with the worms. Let's try something new. We know their behaviors, we know what harms them, we know what helps them. So let's stay away from the things that harm them and let's try to promote the good things that help them do even better work. That's what we, that's what we're all about.

SPEAKER_02 33:14

That's so amazing. Yeah, it's so amazing even to hear the story of, you know, people come into a workplace like, I'm gonna sift through worms today. But then again, there's a there's a connection back to the environment. And I know you've spoken about um, you know, what's happening on the internal side of the workings of the company, but also I know that you um you're kind of the face of Pure Life Soils, and I know you're out there because building awareness, building a brand, um, building a network and community of supporters is also something that's critical to what you've been working on. And and I do know that um I saw you down a couple of weeks ago at the um Royal Ag Winter Fair, I've seen you at the uh Canadian National Exhibition, I believe the home show as well, a whole bunch of different um trade shows. So maybe um you can share with us a little bit about um, you know, not necessarily the details of where you go, because I know that you travel across Canada and North America in terms of um, you know, representing pure life and br building awareness of of the product, its benefits. Um, but maybe there's one or two things you could share. Like um when people come up to a pure life booth and they've never seen or heard about worm castings, like what are some of the the maybe the comments or curious questions that you usually get?

SPEAKER_00 34:35

Well, it's funny you asked that because people who know know. The people who don't know, um, that's where I step in and try to educate and uh try to get them to somehow get their feet in that rabbit hole, just discover what the difference is between a healthy living, breathing, growing medium is like a healthy soil, compared to an inert dirt. Once I've I've got their attention, then I know I can spend a little bit of time with somebody and educate them and tell them how important it is not just for the environment, but for us for humanity. We're growing our food in this soil. And if you're using inert chemically treated dirt that just came up from a job site in God knows where, because the soil in every part of Ontario across Canada is different. You're not gonna have the same soil on a farm that's like right down by your feet, and then a hundred yards away, that that soil is gonna test differently. It's gonna be a different type of soil. It's really important to understand and to educate the public what we do and why we do it and the importance of it. So those who know about worm castings, they're they get excited. And then, you know, we use the worm castings to make our different soil plans. But when we're talking about soils, it's really, really important to get out there, to be in the public eye, to make sure that when people do go to a garden center and they see the pure life brand, they know what they're looking at now. They know the difference. That's the whole point of us doing the trade shows, like the home shows. They see any the educational activation we do there and at the Royal Agricultural Winter Fair. The other shows that we do are more for industry related. We'll do the Ontario Fruit and Veg Show, we'll do Greenhouse Canada, we'll do Landscape Ontario, we'll do cultivate in the US. When we do those shows, the people who attend already know about us. They already know the product, they already know what it's capable of doing. But when we're out in uh in the GTA in the Greater Toronto area, trying to educate children, parents, grandparents, people who've never even picked up a shovel before, who want to try to maybe grow a few herbs on their balcony of their condo downtown Toronto. That's what we're there for. We want to get them hooked and we want to explain to them that when you grow your food in the soil, you are growing something that's going to be healthy, that's going to nourish you and not make you sick. That's the whole point. So that's why I like to be out in the public eye. We want to make sure that um people are aware and the word is getting out there that they can grow healthy food in healthy soil.

unknown 37:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 37:10

It's easy to do.

SPEAKER_02 37:11

Well, it's like help, you know, let us help you, you know, and then part of that starts again with education and then being like, well, hey, we're just here to share what our take is on it. This is what the facts, the stats, the reality sort of says. And if you'd like to buy our product or not, that's up to you. But at the end of the day, this is uh where, again, you're everything you've said not only speaks to your family values, but it's actually the value you're uh creating for your customers, which then spans even further because again, as an example is I use pure life soil on my farm and uh feed 30, 40, 50 families, right? And so now I'm using your product as a as a tool, I will say, um supply, um, but as a tool to create better product that is better yielding, more nutritious that then I can pass down the line. And I think you know, you've got tons of hundreds of different clients and customers spanning from farmers to landscapers, backyard gardeners, et cetera. Um, and I know you've got a number of different product lines as well, from you know, small bags, big bags, totes, um, and probably more in terms of what you guys are offering. So it's just so amazing to see.

SPEAKER_00 38:26

And it's nice to be out in the public to educate because once we get the kids and the parents involved, it's something that we can create like this beautiful like activity that you know families can do together. Get in the garden together. Don't put gloves on, use your bare hands, even go barefoot if you can. It's so healthy for you. And I try to always put the earthworms in the kids' hands and watch their reactions. Once I put an earthworm in a child's hand, you see their face lit up and the smiles become like huge from they're grinning from ear to ear. And I'll ask the children, do you feel happy all of a sudden? And they say, Yeah, I do. It kind of tickles, it makes me feel happy. And it's funny because it has been scientifically proven that earth, when you hold an earthworm, it will release dopamine in the human body. So, really key thing is like just get the kids involved, get the parents in there, even for parents who've never picked up a shovel before. Get involved, do this with your children, do it for yourself, do it for your health, and do it for the environment. There are many good reasons to do it. Just get gardening. And I've tried your food many times before on your farm, Brandon. It is outstanding. It's extremely flavorful. So the Earth Room castings do produce a really tasty, flavorful fruit and vegetable. Like it's it's you've you're doing great work on your farm.

SPEAKER_02 39:48

Well, and you nourish.

SPEAKER_00 39:49

Thank you for including us.

SPEAKER_02 39:51

No problem. Always happy to, right? Again, not only in terms of alignment, but uh supporting supporting each other as you've you've continued to support and share, uh, you know, share your story today. Um and I think, you know, going back to it is when you nourish the soil through a compost or a casting, it's nourishing the soil that nourishes the plant as opposed to a potentially synthetically based fertilizer that only nourishes the plant, which is kind of like um, you know, it's like a band-aid solution to something that's a lot better, right? Building immunity in the soil, building resilience, all these other things that you guys are are providing um while at the same time, you know, being able to keep a roof over your head, right? In the world in the Western world of actually having a business, but a business with values and sustainability, which is just um.

SPEAKER_00 40:38

Exactly.

SPEAKER_02 40:39

Um and then I'm yeah, we're very proud of it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 40:42

Yeah, thank you. Uh, you should be. Yeah, we're extremely proud of what we've what has happened organically over time without even knowing. So it's it's been like a really amazing story to get started from like a a simple bait company, a small family-owned bait company, to this amazing soil, like fertilizer and and just regenerating land masses. It's it's been incredible. And it's been very exciting for me to be a part of it. I'm very proud of it.

SPEAKER_02 41:09

When I and I know that uh we're gonna wrap up here in a second because I know you've got another uh meeting to run into. Um, but I do have a last question too, because again, you mentioned you know your journey's been just over, we'll say, three, three-ish years with pure life. Um, but uh you're an extremely passionate person who's not only, you know, being the outward face of the company, whether it's dealing with industry or families that have never touched or, you know, put a shovel in the ground. Um you have a lot of passion, right, for what you do. Um passion not only for the worms, but for sustainability in the environment and healthy food for healthy people. Um but maybe the question I want to ask you as we sort of leave off as we're talking about, you know, places, people, and passions is um I don't think when you were a child, maybe you thought you'd be working for um the largest worm compost vermicat verma compost business in Canada. But um here you are. And so maybe you can just share for those of uh you know, those who are looking for inspiration or never think about um jobs or careers in agriculture or agri-food or supporting services. Um, maybe you can share a little bit about what um I don't know the best way to say it in terms of like you you've shared a bit about your passion, but kind of what um is what helps to drive you, motivate you, or even inspire those to look at these as career opportunities in the future.

SPEAKER_00 42:31

Well, I'm living proof that even at my age that you can make a change in your life. My hobby of, you know, growing horticulture, dealing with biostimulants. I've been composting myself for well over 20-something years, building earthworm farms in my own backyard. If you told me five years ago that I would be working at pure life soil and dealing with this massive livestock of earthworms and studying poop every single day, um, I wouldn't have believed you. There's no way. I'm like, what are you talking about? My full-time job before my career, I come from the design and building industry. However, my obsession with earthworms and soil biology, I've been researching on my own since I was a kid, was just a very intense hobby. Every day of my life, I've got my hands in the dirt. Even in the wintertime, I have grow lights in my in my basement and tables. I save seeds, I fuse seeds together, graft trees, you name it. I'll experiment every single day. I'm not the type of person that's gonna sit and watch TV with any spare time. If I've got spare time, I'm going to tinker in my basement in the wintertime. And if it's spring, summer, fall, I'm gonna be outdoors. I'm not gonna be watching TV. I had no idea that my obsession with horticulture and soil and biostimulants would turn into a full time job. So after my own research, after 40 years of researching and tinkering. And experimenting that this would pop up in my life. I'm living proof that anything can happen. So when your hobby becomes your full-time job and your full-time job becomes your side hustle hobby, um, it's a it's a good life. It's a really good life. And I'm happy to do it every single day.

SPEAKER_02 44:19

And having a happy workplace makes that just a little bit better, right?

SPEAKER_00 44:25

Yes. And the faith, like the owner puts faith in you. He'll he he will tell you, I trust you. I'm leaving you responsible. I trust you. Once you hear that, it drives you to do even better. Which is fantastic. We all work together as a team. And that's that's uh it's a very yeah, it's a very harmonious team. So that's great.

SPEAKER_02 44:51

Did you say sort of small and small and mighty, right? And well and well connected.

SPEAKER_00 44:55

Small and mighty, yeah. On a personal level and on a professional level. It it works. So I've been there for over three and a half years, and I I I love my job. I wake up every day thinking I get to go to this job. I get to. So it's a good feeling. But I'm living proof anything can happen. You just don't know sometimes.

SPEAKER_02 45:16

Yeah. And I think there's a lot of people out there that are are have a you know an itch, we'll say, for whether or not, again, gardening or just general sustainability and saying, well, how can I put my time to use to do something that is bigger than me? And you are definitely doing something and catalyzing a movement that is much, much bigger than you, right? And I think that that's um that's that's huge in so many ways as we talk about you know, this next generation and moving into, you know, sustainability and circular economies and thinking about take-make waste society and closing that loop. And well, you know, literally and figuratively, worms are closing that loop. They're closing the cycle and they're available to us every single day, you know.

SPEAKER_00 46:01

Exactly. And to put things into perspective, I'm a mother of two girls, two diva fashionistas, 21 and 22 years old, and they love earthworms. They would, they never thought in their entire lives that they would get hooked as much as I have. So it's it just goes to prove it doesn't matter where what your background is, what you're doing in life, earthworms will always make you happy. Earthworms and soil.

SPEAKER_02 46:27

And if that's the one takeaway from today, I would completely agree. Put a smile, put a smile on your face, whether or not it's going to work or holding uh holding worms like a new baby. So I'm exactly I'm jealous you get to it every day.

SPEAKER_00 46:42

Exactly. So just everyone, you need to get dirty, get in the soil, and just remember that all life starts in the soil, all of it.

SPEAKER_02 46:50

Well, and I think that's a fantastic, we'll say word of wording word of wisdom, right? Is uh life below your feet is where it all starts. And um, I think you could agree, Helen, is you literally are what you eat. Um, and so at least the better thing is eating things that are nourished from a healthy soil, nourish your body, nourish your mind, and uh can also nourish your your future and your family.

SPEAKER_00 47:13

Exactly. Well, Brandon, thank you so much for the opportunity. It was great. I hope that uh we've inspired some more people to look into the biology of soil and make better choices. But uh I want to thank you for inviting me today. It was it was such a pleasure. It's great talking to you always.

SPEAKER_02 47:30

Uh absolutely. And um likewise, right? And thank you so, so much for uh taking time out of your busy schedule to uh to speak with me and and be part of our podcast today. And uh I'm excited to see and and just quickly in terms of anybody who wants to reach out, I believe it's uh purelifesoils.com is a place to find you.

SPEAKER_00 47:49

Yes, exactly. And we can reach out by phone or by email anytime.

SPEAKER_02 47:53

Awesome. And the odds of Helen picking up the phone are about 90%. So you get to hear her lovely voice on the phone as uh you may be interested more about uh the product, the process, uh, and the purpose. So thank you again, Helen, so much for your time today. I really appreciate it. And uh I'm looking forward to seeing you in uh in a couple of weeks.

SPEAKER_00 48:11

Perfect. Thank you, Brandon. It's a pleasure.

SPEAKER_02 48:13

Okay, have a great day.

SPEAKER_00 48:15

You too. Bye.