Destination Stewardship - Mornings on MainStreet

Special Guests Ilona Spruce and Jessie Hook join to talk about Destination Stewardship, what it means, and how its concepts have been historically implemented at Taos Pueblo.

Mornings on MainStreet airs every third Thursday of the month on KNCE 93.5 True Taos Radio. This episode originally aired on September 25th, 2025.

Transcript

SPEAKER_04 0:00

The history that's here within Taos is very, you know, today it's it's it's beautiful, you know, we have this multicultural component, but that didn't come with, you know, a lot of really um like horrible history.

SPEAKER_02 0:18

Really, the overall goal of the show is to help build the movement to really revitalize our downtown. Main Street Radio here on True Towns Radio. So the Main Street program was developed to start to address and really uh revitalize these historic downtowns and historic neighborhoods right now. It is important to show folks that the historic downtown of the towns district is very watchable and will enjoy the ability that exists.

SPEAKER_01 0:58

Sticking around for another hour to bring you Main Street Radio from Taust Main Street, Charles Whitson sitting across the console. Hey, Charles.

SPEAKER_02 1:06

Good morning, Howie, and good morning to all the beautiful listeners out there.

SPEAKER_01 1:10

Thanks for making it in again. We're uh in episode two, I guess you could call it. We did a little test run during the morning show last month, and we're gonna try to make this a monthly thing, Main Street Radio. And perhaps it'll be happening on this Tuesday, the third Tuesday of each month from nine until ten. So um so far, so good. I think we're off to a good start.

SPEAKER_02 1:30

Yeah, I and excited to be here. Um excited about this show and the concept of Main Street radio. Um, something that we really want to bring to the community are our topics, people, uh, projects, ideas that are all really relevant to the community or really relevant to the revitalization of downtown Taos. Um and today we're really excited to have a few um really powerhouse guests with us um to talk about this idea of destination stewardship.

SPEAKER_01 1:57

Excellent. Well, let's um let's start from the beginning and just give a little uh introduction to what Taos Main Street is. I'm looking at the website, Taosmain Street.org, prominent right on the homepage. Downtown is for everyone. We believe that the plaza district is for everyone. It is a safe, walkable, and bikeable place with a strong, diverse economy and thriving businesses. That sounds like a pretty simple uh explanation of what's trying to happen down there. How do you uh introduce Main Street to folks who might not know?

SPEAKER_02 2:27

Uh well, just the highlight uh you said first is is is downtown is for everyone. Um Main Street uh is an organization that exists in how here in Taos, but it's a movement that actually is happening across the entire country, through Main Street America, across the state of New Mexico, through Main Street, New Mexico. And then we're we're the local organization here in Taos that's that's tasked with really ensuring um that downtown is for everyone. Sounds simple, but there's a lot of work and thought that that goes into making that a reality.

SPEAKER_01 3:00

Sure. Charles Whitson with Taos Main Street, Taos Main Street.org, if you want to follow along at home and um learn about all the great work that's been going on for a few years now. How long has Main Street Taos been kind of an entity?

SPEAKER_02 3:15

Uh this is this is our sixth year as an official uh nonprofit Main Street organization.

SPEAKER_01 3:21

Awesome. Well, let's uh not waste any time and introduce our guests. I know we have plenty to talk about in a small amount of time. So uh Charles, I'll let you introduce who we're here with this morning.

SPEAKER_02 3:34

Sure. So uh first we want to introduce Ilona Spruce, who is the marketing and tourism director for Taos Pueblo, um, a member of the Destination Stewardship Network and somebody who I think has participated in this process uh since the beginning. So, Ilona, if you want to just introduce yourself, tell us a little bit about your your work and your intersection with destination stewardship.

SPEAKER_04 3:57

Good morning, everyone. Thank you for having me. Um, so destination stewardship really came into uh my arena because a lot of it has to do with um exactly what we do with the pueblo directly as far as tourism goes. There's been so much discussion on whether tourism is beneficial to the community or not, and so we really wanted to seek that opinion out and find out why, find out who benefits, find out where and how we can maneuver tourism so that we all have a piece of the pie, and that's really where it came from. And so it's been great to be a part of it. Um, I was initially asked by Contessa Trujillo to be part of the stewardship network, and she really was the one who kind of conjured all of these faces together so that way there would be a spread of everybody from the community to have opinion and voice matter within this conversation. And so now we're here and now we have uh Jesse with us as the manager, and so it's really come into fruition from just everyone, you know, sitting in that room asking if this was just gonna be another plan.

SPEAKER_01 5:22

Right. There's been plenty over time.

SPEAKER_04 5:24

To yeah, to how are we actually gonna use this and implement it? And so we're here, we're in that phase. And thankfully with Main Street and Charles, we've been able to maneuver that with the funding maneuvering through them, and then being able to bring on a manager and being able to continue to conduct um uh you know ideas of what we think stewardship is as far as tourism goes within the community.

SPEAKER_01 5:54

Now I know when I think of the word steward or stewardship, it's um someone taking on the role of caring for something, um, usually a physical space or thing. But this uh I'm getting the sense destination stewardship is um kind of taking on responsibility for what tourism means and can do to a community, for better or worse, right?

SPEAKER_04 6:17

Yeah. So we really looked at um how tourism is being conducted within the town of Taos and how it impacts the town. I mean, we all know that we are a destination, we know that people come here for a variety of reasons, but a huge reason is the cultural component. And you know, Taos wouldn't be Taos if we didn't have this mesh of cultures colliding that has been happening for over, you know, thousands of years. Sure. Not just when the Spanish showed up, but even pre-contact. We've always had visitors in our home. So, you know, it's not it's not um, you know, it's it wasn't the norm, especially during COVID, not to have visitors in our community as far as the public goes.

SPEAKER_03 7:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 7:06

But, you know, it really was a an eye-opener after that time, realizing how much um we do depend on the on the on the visitors coming through.

SPEAKER_01 7:18

Sure. So yeah. Um Jesse Hook is here as well. Um, I would love for you to just uh kind of give a general background about the destination stewardship network, um, what what it is in in a physical sense, the entity itself, and then what what the work will entail. Uh obviously a lot of what we're talking about today.

SPEAKER_00 7:39

Yeah, sounds good. So my name's Jesse. I'm the Destination Stewardship Network Manager. It's been um a really amazing prog uh process. I've been in this role for about six months now. And um the Destination Stewardship Network, just like Ilona was saying, is is a is a coalition of people that have come together to discuss and act on what does it mean to take care of this place and a place that does depend and interface with tourism. Um, so it's a really dynamic conversation and happens in a few different forms. If you want something tangible for how what destination stewardship as a network looks like. We've been meeting monthly for quite some time now, even before I came into the project. And um, those spaces look like looking at different subjects within um what it means to steward a destination and making sure to hear from not just the same opinions um and to really um wrestle with the yes and of tourism and um that paradox of tourism, as I like to say, of okay, there are a lot of really wonderful things and there are a lot of pressures, and how can we work together from our different seats to um mitigate those pressures? So at the end of our discussion today, we can talk a little bit more about what's coming down the pipeline um and what people can expect in terms of programming and community engagement and um resources for the community. But yeah, it's been it's been a really amazing space to be in. So huge, huge thank you to the town and the county and Taus Main Street and everyone, such as Ilona, who's been a part of the process from the very, very beginning. It's been a joy.

SPEAKER_01 9:22

Yeah. Charles, anything you want to add and and kind of tie it all together and how Main Street, um what what Main Street's role is in kind of helping get the word out and and just continuing what we're trying to do here?

SPEAKER_02 9:36

Sure. Um, so I think you know, throughout the planning process, there was there was there was a nagging question that that the that the steering committee and all the people involved were were trying to answer in how do we carry this work forward? Um the plan itself, you know, as a framework, make some recommendations. Um and and really the choices were do we create a new organization to do this? Does this live within one of our local governments, specifically the town or the county? Or can we take a network-based approach where we, you know, in a sense, we we decentralize it a bit, decouple it somewhat from government, make sure it's something that doesn't just live within a department in in a governing entity. Um, and and everybody ultimately decided that that was the approach they wanted to take. So Main Street sits in this position of acting as a host organization for for destination stewardship in the community. Um that means that that we have we have specific relationships with the the the town and the county in terms of of funding and and and contracting that they're going to uh commit to destination stewardship. Um and and we're able to make make the bureaucratic process slightly more easy. Sure. Um, you know, ensuring that every time an initiative, a program, or a project comes up, it doesn't have to go through a lengthy RFP process that it might have to go through at the town or the county, um, that we can we can kind of deliver resources um a bit a bit more quickly to to some of these some of these things that are going to happen as a result of of this uh initiative.

SPEAKER_01 11:19

Jess, you mentioned um some regular meetings that have been happening for quite a while now. Um who's at at those meetings? Who who's at the table? What what number of people? And uh are all the government entities that you're talking about at a seat at the table?

SPEAKER_02 11:35

Uh yes, and and and quite a few more. So originally the steering committee was formed, you know, with with representatives from from uh multiple governing entities, including the town and the county, and we're not just talking um some of the elected officials, but also some key staff members, and then a lot of a lot of organizations, and I can't mention them all, but just just to give you an idea, um, I mean, we have we have representation from from UNM, um, from entities like the Chamber of Commerce, Taos Main Street, um, businesses that are directly uh uh directly functioning within the tourism sector. We're we're a part of that. Um Kit Carson, Kit Carson Electric, the utility company, um, Taos Ski Valley. So a lot of a lot of entities that directly interface with tourism, but also uh tangentially a lot of entities that like obviously deal with deal with tourism in in maybe a less direct way as well. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:35

Do you have um folks at the table who who are just community members at large, folks who just live in the historic district especially, but just in general?

SPEAKER_02 12:43

Yes, always. The and the invitation was always open to just to community members too. Anybody who has who has an interest in in this idea um was welcome and is still always welcome to to to participate. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:57

Um before we dig in a little deeper, can you remind folks how we can how they can learn more about um staying connected? I I mentioned tausmainstreet.org. Um there's also the uh destination stewardship website at taus.org. It sounds like that'd be a good place to start for people who want to uh kind of get get a grip on what we're talking about here.

SPEAKER_02 13:18

Yeah, I think those are those are probably two of the best ways. Another really great way is actually to directly connect with Jesse.

SPEAKER_03 13:24

So Okay.

SPEAKER_02 13:27

So you can you can find Jesse at destination stewardship at tausmain street.org, and and she's a she's a great connection point for anybody who's who's interested um in this work. Awesome.

SPEAKER_01 13:39

Uh Main Street Radio is underway. We're here with Charles, Ilona, and Jesse talking about uh destination stewardship. We have a couple of quick messages here, and when we come back, we're gonna uh uh dig in a little deeper here on True Towers Radio. And we're back. 23 minutes past nine o'clock here on True Towns Radio. It is Tuesday, September 16th. Main Street Radio is underway. Welcome back, Charles. Good to be back. Um we're gonna shift the conversation here to Ilona, Ilona Spruce from Taos Pueblo. Um Charles, you want to just give a little background and and just uh kind of move us into this next little segment?

SPEAKER_02 14:23

Sure. So, you know, something something that I think I think it's really important to hear hear from Ilona uh about is is why why do we actually need an approach like this? And um as as she spoke earlier, I mean, the the the long history of of tourism that has existed here um is is is something I think unique. The pueblo has a very unique perspective on because they they understand it in a context of of centuries um and not just as something that you know happened a couple of decades, perhaps. So Ilona, if if you maybe want to just expand a little bit on on just the history of tourism and Taos Pueblo.

SPEAKER_04 15:09

Thank you, Charles. Um so going into the destination stewardship plan, the conversations that we're first had were about um like how do we do this? What is is what is the model within our space, within this area and the land? And so, you know, Contessa was like, well, you're right here. And so, you know, really doing a deep dive into realizing that that's what we do, um, and even acknowledging it. And so realizing that we that we do stewardship, you know, bit people coming into our home and visiting and whatnot, whatnot. Um, and so taking that model and utilizing some of that perspective to introduce the concept of destination stewardship to the town and to the county essentially, and seeing how we maneuver our community to have a to have a voice and to be able to have an opinion. Um, and also, you know, realizing what the publo like economy means for the community members and how much of an impact it's always had, you know, traditionally or even historically. Pre-contact house was always a trade hub. We've always had people from the north to the south coming here to trade, um, predominantly in the fall and predominantly for San Geronimo Day, which it wasn't known as San Geronimo Day then, but it was a harvest beast, and so you would we had things to trade prior to winter. And so the north and south would come and it was a time of peace, and so you would make those trades, and then you'd all go your own ways, and so and then throughout the year we had relationship with the Hicaria, with um, with the southern pueblos, with the other nomadic um tribal communities that are now, you know, forcibly placed on Oklahoma land. And so we had a lot of relationship with the north because of the mountain range being here, and so we've always had that visitor concept of welcoming, taking care of people, um, and just opening our door. But when you think of tourism, you know, there's a fine line of it being invasive, but also um resourceful, and so that's where I think there was a time for Taos and and the Pueblo to take time during the pandemic to really assess how much of an impact we see of tourism coming in, how much we've seen how the how the typical visitor has changed, um, versus even prior to COVID. I was just telling Jesse 19 was a great year. Like I would even say 15, 16, 17, 18, and 19 were all great years for tourism. But I'll tell you, like 19 before COVID hit or pandemic hit, I was burnt out. Like, like I was like, how are we gonna keep up this momentum? We had so many people coming through in those years. And, you know, being able to assess and look at how and what the impact is, you know, not only on our community, but even like the environmentally and everything along those lines um of people coming into these spaces and essentially utilizing them. And how much are we overutilizing them? Are we overutilizing the village? Um, and so that was something that really came into came into play and when I got asked to be a part of the the the core group that came with uh with Contessa bringing people together at first, and she did it in such a organic way of like being like, we just need your voice, like we really need your voice. Yeah, it's not a meeting, we need your voice. I was like, okay, and because I was you know, I had the same concerns that a lot of other other individuals had of, you know, we're I want to give my time and energy to this, um, and I want to give, you know, my resource to this so that way we all do it right and we all have a voice at the table. And you know, and there was one thing that I really made clear is that tourism's not going to end until the public closes its doors. And a lot of, you know, we have we have about a hundred thousand people that come in every year. Right. And that's truly from like May to the mid, like the mid-October range after balloon fiesta. And so other other than that, those other months are like trickle, you know, like trickling time. Um but for the most part, you know, I wanted to make sure that giving that opinion that people understood that I'm really coming from a a voice of the fact that we need to figure out how to finesse this and manage it in a way where, you know, we're protecting what Taos is and what what all of our cultures coming together make Taos. I mean, that's why people want to live here, want to come here, because there's like multi-layers. Do we know how it works? No, we don't. We just know that it's been over 500 years of living here in the valley with all these cultures coming together and creating what Taos is.

SPEAKER_03 21:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 21:02

And we want to make sure that that's protected, that it's not bought out, that we don't overutilize it as well. And so these were the conversations, you know, that were had within within the within the group. And everyone from even um the forest service was there to, you know, to our one of our shop owners in the town, um, and having those conversations of how of how we can all benefit and how we can educate people. And that really came full circle with the education piece is that there needs to be something when they get here about, you know, we have the visitor center, but more importantly, how do we educate people? And we're seeing a different kind of visitor now, you know, like the a younger demographic just doesn't want to be wine and dine and Then they leave. They want to be brought into the community. They want to experience like who the community is, which sometimes is hard because we've always had tourism here. So we even in town, we have these like, well, we only go to these certain spots, you know, like we're trying to protect it. But we also need to educate people that if you do go to these areas, that you need to, you know, make sure you clean up after yourself, that it is a special place, and that it is, you know, it it's heartfelt for us to be sharing this with you, not the fact that, oh, you can just come and you know do whatever you want.

SPEAKER_03 22:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 22:38

So that's really where, you know, the conversations led is that how do we manage um people coming into the community and how do we manage the storyline? Um house has so many layers and so many angles that you can take. And so, you know, how do we capture telling our story? And so that was something that really came out with um with having the pueblo at the table, is that we do that every day. And so, you know, we see people coming in who, in some instances, have never seen a native person. Um, we've had some really interesting conversations with people um asking, you know, even just the the blatant ignorance that comes out of the education, you know, the education that we see in the United States is really interesting, um, or the level of what they know of Native people or indigenous communities. And a lot of times the ignorance is very high. And so that's where we take it on that it is our responsibility to curve that, to educate people, um, to let them know that, you know, like let's see, an example of, you know, not all native people go to school for free, or we don't have, you know, free health care that is fantastic and magnificent. Um, you know, that there's a lot of assumptions that are made about the native community based off of mainstream um television or whatever your your niche is. And then, and you know, and a a a perspective that we have is the international tourist. And that perspective is very much so more um because they're coming into such a foreign space, they educate themselves about where they're coming, who they're coming to see. And so they're kind of, I was telling the group, you know, when we first started, they're kind of the they they're kind of the example, yeah. Like the model, yeah. The model that we want people to do, you know, we want people to learn about Taos before they come here, and then if they don't, there should be tools and resources for them to learn. And so that's really where this all came from is that the publo does it every day, and how do we maneuver that? And you know, my tour guides, you know, I really appreciate them, and then the parking monitors as well. They're such a young group within the community that deals with such an intense amount of questions and inquiry of their home, and they really do a great job of maneuvering that. And we give them training, we train with them and whatnot. But for the most part, when you're out there, you're really on your own, and you really have to um see how people interact with you. And so that's that's also another layer, you know, that eventually Jesse will go into that of you know, um, maneuvering how do we handle, you know, these quirky interactions that do come along within the community. And, you know, I'm I'm not gonna say that, you know, it's easy. Yeah, it's not. And the pub has been doing it for a long time. We just now with the with the state of where we're at in you know, of being acknowledged and whatnot, we just kind of have the upper hand on it now.

SPEAKER_03 26:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 26:20

But we've really had to maneuver and work through quirks and you know, racial tension and everything along those lines. And I'm glad that, you know, within the group, it was very much so acknowledged that you know the the history that's here within Taos is very, you know, today it's it's it's beautiful, you know, we have this multicultural component, but that didn't come with, you know, a lot of really um like horrible history. Like we've come a long ways. Sure. And having the destination stewardship plan and network and having it institutionally uh maneuvered, and I shouldn't say institutionally, but just maneuvered um and supported by not only county but the town, um, really gives uh gives it some backbone that it's at that we can maneuver this thing together.

SPEAKER_01 27:21

Kind of kind of validates. Yeah. We're speaking with Ilona Spruce. Main Street Radio is underway. We're talking about the destination stewardship program and network here in Taos and northern New Mexico. Um Ilona, you talked about the five years prior to the pandemic as being good years. Um by what measure? Was it just by the number of people and the economic infusion? Um, but did you find there was more respect from the people that were visiting? And do you feel like this education is is trickling down to the people who who are showing up here?

SPEAKER_04 27:54

Yeah, like so we had and I guess what my my um I guess my value of good years is like, yeah, the number of people, but also the we had um really cool interactions with tour guides, like really positive interactions, people just being so much more understanding of the history that they're telling. Um also a lot of support, like there was just this huge wave of like support for indigenous communities that was really around during that time, and acknowledgement, and we had a lot more people who were just um more educated about indigenous communities and what indigenous means. And actually, and and then we saw like a maneuvering like in 1819 of like land acknowledgements happening across the country, which was really cool. Um, because then you saw native and indigenous communities being I acknowledged on a national level, which there were still people that were coming through our doors that didn't even realize that we're still like in existence. And um, or not realizing that we don't, you know, we're not in our we're not in our costume, you know, quote unquote. Um you know, and we're not waiting for them to come through our doors, you know. Um and so there was much more of this um like wanting to really to get to know the community but in a respect respectful manner. Um so that was my gauge of those years prior to to COVID. Um, but we did, you know, because people were a younger demographic was traveling, I think that's where we were seeing some of that.

SPEAKER_03 29:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 29:47

Um, we were seeing a lot of educators traveling during that time. Um, we had multiple universities from overseas coming in and doing workshops and stuff with public community members. And that was another level is that community members were being, you know, tapped into to give perspective and story and history. And there was a lot of great relationship build that even I had with the community members at the Pueblo. Um, and having those relationships build so we can tell our tell our history, tell our story. Um, so that's my gauge of those years. Um, and then when we went into pandemic, though, it was a realization of how much I was working and doing and then just pretty exhausted. Yeah. Um, so I, you know, I really, you know, there's a double edge for me with pandemic. It was horrible and awful, but it was also this like real like pause to really look and observe and observe and realize the layers of tourism within the pueblo and how much of an impact each person or community member within the pueblo is impacted by tourism. And when that was taken away, what that also was as well.

SPEAKER_01 31:16

Yeah, it's it's um what a great opportunity to see it on kind of a smaller scale, right? We kind of can extrapolate to what it means for the Taos, the greater Taos community and the the other cultures. Um from all you learned over those years, uh did you I assume you did bring these ideas to the destination stewardship table and um now tasked with how do we kind of keep it going, right? You talk about educating people and informing people and uh the you know, kind of trying to convey the the uh necessity of respect. And you know, may maybe it's a um positive byproduct byproduct of the woke woke culture. I don't really like to use that word, but uh, you know, people are thinking about it now, right? And and here they are now giving more attention. You said especially the international tourists um do their research and come and realize that they need to be respectful. Um, but not just of Taos Pueblo, but of of any place that they're visiting, right? Downtown Taos or uh any any area of Taos County. Um so let's let's kind of bring it back to destination stewardship because it sounds like you got a lot of valuable learning um from uh what goes on there at the pueblo and and the tourism of Taos Pueblo. Um what what what steps are being taken? I mean, how do we kind of execute a lot of these ideas that I Luna uh Ilona are putting out there?

SPEAKER_02 32:40

Uh good question. Yeah. Um and and I think you know, taking uh again, if we if we're looking at this idea of of stewardship and and defining it as caring for a place that that balances the needs of of residents, of people who who live here um with with visitors, um I think I think there's a lot. There's a lot there. Um education is a huge a huge piece of that. And I think education starts around around values, around shared values of our of our community. What what exactly are those and how do we how do we transmit those in a way to people who who visit who are already here visiting, but people who may uh be thinking about coming here and visiting. So I think it really starts with value. I think it it starts with um the acknowledgement of like Taos is home to people and has been home to to many peoples for a very, very long time. Um it's not not a playground. Not a playground for people to just come and kind of do do as they as they will.

SPEAKER_01 33:49

Nor is it a um uh a zoo where people are coming to just observe and see how this these these people live, whether it's on the Pueblo or people who live like me in the historic district, then I always am confronted with, wow, you you actually live right here on the plaza, you know, and it's like such a interesting take that people have on it's like this magical place, which it is, but people are maybe coming for the wrong reasons at times, you know, and not realizing that it is our home and that it is um more than just a tourist destination.

SPEAKER_02 34:18

Absolutely. And I think, you know, a lot of that does does come to how to how we promote and market this place. I think, you know, I I don't want to beat up on our neighbors to the the north too much, but I think we can take some really um valuable lessons from things that have happened to us in mountain towns in Colorado. Um when we look at places like like Breckenridge and and Telluride Um and Crested Butte, just to name a few. Um when when the uh when the idea behind marketing uh and tourism is really like maximizing visitation with no thought to the cost of that, you end up with some scenarios like like those towns are experiencing where the people who live and work in those communities can no longer afford to actually live in those communities. So now they're having, you know, their workforce and the people who run those towns are having to move several towns away to then you know commute an hour or more to to work in some of those towns. And I think that's a real downstream impact uh that toward that to sort of unintentional uh tourism marketing can lead to. Yeah. Um, so so we want to uh it's really important to kind of look look uh at a at a national level at like some of some of the real costs of tourism and think about okay, how how can we actually mitigate some of those some of those costs?

SPEAKER_00 35:52

Well, and I wanted to bop in there too, because I think um when you look at a systemic level of tourism and how it contributes to an economy, um, there is that dynamic, Charles, you were talking about with housing that we're all very aware of right now. Um with tourism in our local communities comes a tax on where places people, where the heads and beds lay. Um, and that tax can go, it's called lodgers tax and can go directly into community investment. So either um helping local businesses promote themselves with the county lodgers tax grant program that Taus County is putting on. But then also our neighbors to the north, they have passed something recently in their legislation that they can use a portion of their lodgers tax to invest in housing. So I think it's really interesting when you start seeing these things instead of in their silos as potentially contributing to one another. Um, and on the housing subject, I wanted to pose another question to you, Ilona, with um talking about how destination stewardship is all about reminding people that people live here. And that's something you've been dealing with at the Pueblo for a long time, right? Because um the beautiful image of the Pueblo is his historic, it's UNESCO World Heritage Site, but it's also people's homes. And I was wondering if you could talk about how do you approach educating visitors or engaging visit visitors in that conversation of like, hey, people live here. It's not Disneyland.

SPEAKER_04 37:25

All right. Thank you, Jesse. So basically, I mean, it comes down to when visitors first come into the village or when they first inquire about our home. And, you know, they're like, well, I want to see the historic site. So one thing that we've gotten we have had happen within the office is that we really um, you know, get on the assistance and anyone who's answering the phone makes that correction. No, our home. Like you're coming to visit our home. And people are really caught off guard by that, but it's taking a stance, you know, it's taking, it's making sure that people understand that um before they even enter. And so, and then even getting our staff all on board with that terminology of, you know, not just calling, you know, not identifying ourselves, you know, like, oh, the Pablo, the Pablo, no, our home. And so we've really maneuvered a lot of um, you know, technique and whatnot with the staff, especially about how they talk about our home. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 38:32

I imagine it could get even confrontational, right? Some people feel like, well, they're inviting me in. This is this is not my place.

SPEAKER_04 38:39

Yeah, and and you know, and then we are to the point now after pandemic of really where we're we're kind of on that cusp of making the tours, um of making the tours uh that you have to, you know, that you have to take them during during your visit. Cause right now they are optional. Like you can you can either go through, but even on the pamphlets that we give out, there's like welcome to our home. Like it's like a constant word that's utilized throughout the visit uh for a visitor to understand that it is our home. And then working and talking, you know, to shopkeepers, and they don't realize kind of you know what I'm doing at times is that when I get them to talk about the publo, I I want them to hear, I want to hear them saying our home. And so for the most part, you know, they're an older generation as well, and they do, you know, constantly say, Well, this is our home.

SPEAKER_03 39:42

Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_04 39:44

Yeah. And and you know, and it's that reiteration, but truly, like when we do our marketing piece is that we continue that welcome to our home, or you know, you'll be engaging with our home. And you know, we do ads with, you know, larger companies like USA Today and New York Times with their horizon inserts, and you know, and we do um overseas advertising through UNESCO, and the UNESCO status actually really helps um in that perspective because there's we can utilize the living, the living site status. Um, there's only about 15 living sites around the world that are part of the World Heritage Site list. And so we're really unique. And so we can kind of we use that to our advantage, is that you know, um, highlighting in our international um advertisements and whatnot is that we're um a living community. Anytime anyone's doing in the doing anything in the village, I try and highlight it as much. Um, even with like Dawn Butterfly and um like Lyle with Lyle creations. Anytime there's a community member doing something great and um like a little more extraordinary than than most, you know, I really try and highlight that because it highlights the fact that we have people that are part of the community that are thriving, that are that come from this culture and that thrive in it and that still are here living here within Taos.

SPEAKER_03 41:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 41:23

But we also say too, you know, like with the housing situation, if we didn't have the pueblo, I don't know where we would be living as well. Um, so you know, we see, and then we have our housing housing shortage too on the polo. So um, you know, but that idea of wanting to stay here because we're so connected to our home, um, wanting to live here no matter, you know, what it takes. And so all of that, you know, getting that essence and being able to transfer that to a tourist or a visitor. And when they come back out and realizing that, you know, Taos just isn't this destination where they can come and play, right? Um, that they really need to take it into consideration that they are walking where our ancestors walked. And that's really where the tour comes in with talking about like the Pubblow revolt, um, the Taos rebellion, and you know, even that story of the church. And I always tell the guides, you know, there's we have this whole thing, this whole index of things that they can mention. And one of them is mentioning that we still find cannonballs in those areas, and you know, that you're walking in history, but we live it every day. And so, you know, um, we're sharing this with you. And that's another part of it is that giving them that opportunity that an acknowledgement that they're coming into the space, but that we're sharing it with you. And so that was something that came in with destination stewardship too, is that we talked about how do we how do we maneuver that and that thought process of that we're sharing something with it.

SPEAKER_01 43:10

Sounds like um incredibly valuable learning from Tosh Pueblo and what it means for the hundreds of years that you've been kind of dealing with tourism, for lack of a better word, because tourism probably didn't even exist as a word a few hundred years ago. Um But it certainly can be applied, and I think destination stewardship has a lot to learn from that, where it's it's it's a little bit more visible because it's such a small community and you can see how it directly affects all of its community members. And um, no easy task, but uh something I'm sure destination stewardship in Taos Main Street and all of us are trying to um kind of apply uh here in Taos and in the greater northern New Mexico area. So uh we're running out of time. Time sure flies. I Lonus Bruce, I really appreciate you taking some time to share with us this important uh component and And um really kind of the the the essence of what destination stewardship is trying to achieve, right? Again, it's no small undertaking. Um, Charles, do you have any any thoughts on closing here?

SPEAKER_02 44:12

Uh actually, I think this is a perfect opportunity to let Jesse close us out. Okay. So if Jesse could just touch on, you know, some of some of the real the mechanisms for action, some of the things that, you know, we we've heard a lot about about, you know, this concept of destination stewardship, the education, you know, where we're moving, what we need to continue to learn and promote. Um, but I think Jesse can really wrap us up with talking about, okay, well, what what is happening right now and how how can people continue to be involved in the conversation?

SPEAKER_00 44:44

Yeah. Thank you, Charles. Thanks, Howie. Thanks, Ilona. This has been really fun. It is amazing how fast time flies. Yeah, especially talking about something as nuanced as destination stewardship and thousands of years of history. Um, so the destination stewardship network, one thing that I want to emphasize is that it's it's a coalition of people that have come together to have their voice heard and to come up with creative ideas and to jump into innovating, um, not necessarily reach for perfection, but to practice and to try because time flies, you know. Um, so destination stewardship as a network, and I'm hosted by Taos Main Street is not an organization. It's not this entity that has been tasked with completing a list of bulleted items on a plan. It's a coalition of people that have come together to collectively see that plan as a framework and see where they want to jump in, where they have energy, where they're excited, um, and where they see the biggest need for our community right now. So, what does that look like? Where is their energy this year? We have a few different things happening. If you go to taus.org and under the stewardship tab on their website, um, you can learn a little bit about the destination stewardship plan process. And we have nine stewardship goals. And the second one is equity and inclusion, which has been a really, really important part. Um, Ilona spoke to ensuring everybody has a piece of the pie and is considered in the opportunities as well as the impacts of tourism. And so some things that were suggested by the Crest um GW or George Washington University team who were our consultants, was to work with um a few different levers when it comes to equity and inclusion in this economic um contributor of uh our yeah, of our economy here in Taos, which was one, looking to support um businesses that are tied to culture and are tied to place in innovating and diversifying their revenue through tourism. So right now um we're working with an action team on um looking at how can we support small businesses in um diversifying the revenue with tourism and small businesses um in our communities that traditionally haven't benefited from tourism. So we're working with um a few folks in agriculture, in the agricultural space and land stewardship space to uplift our stories of our acequias and do so through revenue generation. And then we're also working with some um businesses that want to do the same kind of thing with Adobe and having those conversations and making sure to be really thoughtful about the words and the invitation when when pursuing revenue. Um, because if we're only pursuing revenue, and this has been a huge theme today, then we lose sight of a lot of other things. But if you if you make the business case for being thoughtful and sustainable and culturally sensitive and inclusive, then that just makes a business all the stronger and a community all the stronger. So we're supporting um through some innovative business projects. We're supporting with cultural events. We um before the end of the year, we're gonna be launching and announcing our business innovation program and our cultural events support. Um, and those are both looking at increasing capacity through investment as well as um different capacity building trainings and initiatives. So there's that. It's not just all talk. There's also a um a concerted investment.

SPEAKER_03 48:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 48:28

Concerted investment of time, of funding, of knowledge. And um, it's been it's been really fun. Did I cover all the things that are are coming down the line or some of the things?

SPEAKER_02 48:41

We we got to some of them. I don't think it's possible to cover all of them in this time frame. Um, but lastly, Jesse, like again, people people are interested in this idea. How how do they get involved?

SPEAKER_00 48:52

Great question, Charles. So if you want to get involved, one space you can go to is taus.org under the stewardship tab, and you can learn a little bit about our process. And the other way is that you can contact me. My name's Jesse Hook. I'm the destination stewardship network manager. And my email is destination stewardship at tausmainstreet.org. Uh, if you're interested in knowing more or getting involved, please, please reach out. It's destination stewardship at tausmainstreet.org. I would love to chat. And huge thank you for having us on today. And huge thank you, Ilona, for speaking to uh how tourism has affected Taos Pueblo and um your experience with destination stewardship. Really appreciate it.

SPEAKER_01 49:34

Awesome. Guys, thanks so much. We'll do this again in about a month. And um yeah, looking forward to it. We'll we'll keep folks up to date on um when when the program will happen exactly. Um, like I said earlier, it'll probably be the third Tuesday of every month. Um, but we'll have opportunities for you guys to come in and especially if there's some actual events to kind of help get the word out about. We're of course happy to do that as well. Charles, Jesse, Ilona, thank you so much for your time this morning. Marcus Holbeer in your ears in the house. Time flies, right? Name of his program coming up next. So it seems fitting because we saw that time does indeed fly when we're having fun. Charles, thank you. And um, we'll see you see you in a month. All right, thank you, Howie.