004: Balancing Perfectionism and Expectations as a Female Business Owner With Lisa Warner

Have you ever felt disappointed by the outcome of your employee's work only to realize you communicated unclear expectations? In today's episode, Lisa Warner, entrepreneur and business owner, and I share our experiences navigating perfectionism with ourselves and others. 

We hope you walk away from this episode encouraged, built up, and ready to say YES to your big ideas and dreams!

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Music: "Great podcast intro (both short and long version included)" by Lundstroem. Licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 International License.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

There's things in your head that you think everybody adheres to that standard. Oh yeah. And then they don't because we all have these made-up expectations. Well, hi Lisa. I'm so excited to have you on the show. Hi. I'm excited to be here. Thanks for having me. Yeah. So tell us a little bit about who you are and yeah, professionally, personally, just tell us about yourself.

SPEAKER_01 0:27

Oh man, I could really, I could really spiral here. I have a lot to say, a lot to talk about. Um, let's see. So I um I was born in California. And then I uh my mom and I moved here when I was seven. Um and then I've just stayed in Salt Lake the entire time. Um basically raised in Sandy, Cottonwood Heights area, you know. Um I mean, that's like the short squished version of me. And then let's see, so professional version, you know, I've been in a lot of different industries as far as professionally speaking. Um, but I landed in in cleaning and and here I am. And how I got there is kind of a weird story. Never thought I'd end up in cleaning, but here we are.

SPEAKER_00 1:09

Yeah. So have you always been a business owner or did you work for someone else at some point?

SPEAKER_01 1:15

I worked for someone else for a little bit when I was first starting out in my career path. I didn't go to college. I mean, I we tried the college thing. Um then my mom called me like two months later and was like, this isn't working. You're just spending money in partying. And I was like, that's what you do when you go to Dixie C, you know?

SPEAKER_00 1:31

Like I thought that's what we agreed on.

SPEAKER_01 1:33

Yeah, that was the terms. I guess I don't know. Anyway, so I came home. College didn't go well. Um anyway, and then from there, yeah, I worked for a couple of various things, um, just like various management team lead positions for other people, and then I ended up in mortgage, which was weird. Um I did various positions, sales, and processing, all kinds of different things in mortgage, and then um yeah, and then I had a so mortgage wasn't going well for me. Um I I couldn't get on board with everything that the the government, if you will, wanted us to do in order to make a mortgage work. I'm I like to disrupt things, you know, it's more fun that way, apparently. Um and so I was having a conversation with a really good friend of mine, uh as a real estate agent. And um, like I said, real estate was not going well for me. And she was like, Why don't you become a cleaner? And I was like, there were some swear words exchanged. And then I said, No, I will not do that. And she said, Why not? And I said, Because I never imagined being a cleaner. I don't want to clean houses, that's the dumbest thing on the planet. And she's like, Okay, but I just want to point out that while I've been having this 45-minute conversation, you've literally emptied my dishwasher, you've organized my Tupperware drawer. And she's like, And whenever I need you to come and help me clean, right? Because I'm gonna bind you, come over and clean. And I was like, Okay, I see your points. My ego's involved right now, so I really can't have the rest of this conversation. But I think you might be on to something. So yeah, and then from there I just decided to be like a solopreneur, so to speak, and just word of mouth, just gained clients and stopped doing mortgages. I mean, I did it on the side, but it wasn't really like a big thing I was focusing on. I was just focusing more on building a cleaning business. Um, because you know, lo and behold, I was very good at it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 3:25

So when did you start hiring people or were you always a solopreneur?

SPEAKER_01 3:29

So I started hiring people about a year in. Uh-huh. Um, and like every business owner, you hire people and you kind of go through the um ups and downs of okay, maybe not a good fit. Yeah, it's a good fit, not a good fit, then you have to let them go, or they quit and move on, stuff like that. Right. And so um, because I had been burned and I I wasn't prepared, I guess. I wasn't as prepared as I wanted to be to have employees. So I kind of then stopped having employees for a little bit until I could kind of regroup. Um, and it's so funny because I had told myself, I just want to meet someone like a woman-owned company who uh is you know has a cleaning business, right? But they have everything set up, right? They have everything that I need. They have the building, they have the employees, yeah, everything set up. They've been doing everything they need for a while, right? And then I swear, probably I want to say maybe five months after I met my business partner. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 4:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 4:29

Yeah. Yeah. It was really cool. It's very interesting.

SPEAKER_00 4:32

That is interesting. So how fast? So you were looking to merge, like you wanted to find a partner. Yeah. You show up in a lot of networking spaces, so I'm sure you know lots of other cleaning companies too. Like, was there something specific about Molly that like made it be a 100% yes, or were you hesitant? Like, what was that process like for you?

SPEAKER_01 4:56

You know, it's so funny. The way my mind works, I overthink everything. Yeah literally everything on the planet, right? And my friends can vouch for that. It's almost overkill. It's a gift and a curse, right? But yeah, when Molly and I approached, okay, actually, when Molly approached me with the idea.

SPEAKER_00 5:12

Oh, so she approached you. Yes. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 5:14

Yes. She approached me with the idea. Um, she has to called me one day out of the blue. And to back up a little bit, we did meet at a networking group. Yes. Um, and she was the commercial cleaner in in our group. We each have a seat that we hold in a business, right? And so and with that within that group, she was the commercial cleaner, and then I was a residential cleaner in there. And you know, I had passed referrals to her back and forth. Um, and she was just, she was great. I mean, to the point where I even started subcontracting her employees to work with me um because it was just easier than hiring my own, because again, she had the the vetting process and the and stuff that she's able to do to have awesome employees. Um, and so so moving forward when she approached me with the idea, it I didn't even have a second thought. Like, honestly, I you almost like play that game of like, oh yeah, let me let me think about it. Let me check my schedule. Let me just think about it for a sec. But in my mind, I was like, it's yes, it's a yes. But you know, I had to play cool for a sec, you know, and honestly, it didn't even matter that. Right, like now. I was already sweaty, but as soon as we had the conversation, I was like, I'm in. Yeah. So, but yeah, it was it was just it was a very easy decision. I didn't even have a second thought. That's so cool.

SPEAKER_00 6:28

Would you have any like obviously it's kind of a rare situation where you like found the perfect fit and it all meshed really well? Right. Were there things running through your mind of like pros and cons, like things that you were looking for in someone, like someone who is in a similar position of like they like this half of their business, but not this half, and they want to merge with someone? Like, what would be your list of what to look for?

SPEAKER_01 6:57

I mean, as far as looking for someone, I mean, definitely someone who has a lot of self-awareness because there's a lot of people out there that run businesses that don't have self-awareness, right? Um, and I knew that for Molly, she has she has a lot of self-awareness. She's been a businesswoman for I think 22 years now, you know, since she graduated college, I think. That was her, that was her thing, right? And so um it was that, I mean, and and a great personality, right? And someone that um can communicate, right? Communication is hard for people, unfortunately, and it's real raw, authentic communication, yeah, you know, and you know, those are some things that maybe might not be on the on the the list of this is what I would look for in a partner, but for me, those were like my high values that I had to have in someone, you know. Right. Um, and she just handled herself really well. Like I've seen her in a lot of business settings. Um, and yeah, she just handled herself very well.

SPEAKER_00 7:57

So were there any other people that you considered or looked at?

SPEAKER_01 8:02

Um, no, no, it was just she approached me and yeah, yeah, and it was green fit. I feel like, you know, when you know, you know. Yeah, you know what I'm saying. And she is someone who I admire and has taught me a lot when it comes to business, right? Um, and so I know when she approached me, she had thought about it for a while. It wasn't just a wasn't okay, sounds good. Let's go judge. Exactly. Yeah, exactly. So um, I actually felt very honored that I was like, oh, well, thank you. Right. Yeah, you know what I mean? Yeah. Um, so yeah, no, there were no other candidates that even come up. Actually, I'm lying to you right now. There is another one that did come up. Um, but that one, it just it felt weird from the get-go. So, you know, that was like a whole six-month process we were going through, we were talking back and forth. And this was before I had even met Molly. Um, but she then ended up selling her business. So I think there was a reason why it didn't work out. Sure. Right.

SPEAKER_00 9:06

Yeah. She was just looking for something.

SPEAKER_01 9:07

Yeah, yeah, not sure exactly what it was. Yeah, exactly. It's kind of wishy-washy. Sure.

SPEAKER_00 9:11

So yeah. So yeah, it was good.

SPEAKER_01 9:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:14

I mean, that's a big decision to make, but I mean, it's been mutually beneficial for you both so far. So, and like what you've brought to the table, you have a lot of structure behind like the brand values and how you want the company culture to feel and the standard of excellence and things like that. Yes. Do you you've kind of wrapped it up in this pretty bow of we work with Moxie? Yes. Can you talk about that a little bit more? And then also my question is was it always that clear? Like you have, like I feel like you have a very clear vision of what you want the brand to feel like. Was it always that clear, or how did you get to that point of we work with Moxie?

SPEAKER_01 10:02

Okay. Um, so taking it back to my childhood, right? My mom was a military mom. And and the way that she, you know, taught you how to clean is she said, here's your cleaning products that you need, go do it. And if you didn't do it right, she was like, still not right, do it again. And so you would have to do it over and over. And I remember I was so frustrated one day with this darn bathroom because I could not get it the way that she wanted it to be, but she wouldn't tell me how it was. And I remembered there was a commercial that came on the TV. You know, those, I don't know what the lady's name is, so forgive me, lady on the TV. But um, it's that lady that like is like the we can do it with like the the redhead band. Oh, Rosie the Riveter? Is that her? Yes, Rosie the Riveter. Rosie and I'm involved.

SPEAKER_00 10:46

Um, but she the World War II icon.

SPEAKER_01 10:50

Yes. That was not good at history. That's okay. As you now know. Rosie the Riveter. Yes, Rosie the River, thank you, Robbie. Yes, Rosie the Riveter. No, I know. Um I gotta incorporate her somehow, but she was very involved because there was a commercial that said we can do it and we do it with Moxie. And I was like, Yeah, yes. And I had no idea I was nine. I didn't know what that word meant, but it felt so cool to be like, yeah, Moxie.

SPEAKER_00 11:13

Yeah, Moxie.

SPEAKER_01 11:14

So I just went in there and I redid the bathroom the entire thing. I don't know how long it took me, but as a nine-year-old, I felt great about myself. And then my mom was, she was like, Yeah, now it looks great. And I was like, because Moxie was like, exactly. Obviously. And who doesn't know what that is? Come on, mom.

SPEAKER_02 11:30

Get with it.

SPEAKER_01 11:30

Right? All the kids are doing it. Yeah, exactly. Asked the lady on the TV who I didn't know her name in the cool jean outfit. Um, but uh yeah, so that's kind of that's kind of where that whole thing started. And then moving forward, I just loved that word. And I don't think I ever even found out what the word meant. Like I never even looked it up until probably in my 20s. Because I was just like, that's such a cool word. What does it mean? Right. I looked it up because you know, we have the access to do that now, and uh and I was like, oh, well, I've been doing that the whole time. That's cool. Like I did know what that was. I did that the whole time, right? But it's like it's it's character, it's unnerving character. And like I kind of mentioned how I like disruption. I like silent disruption. Do you know what I mean? Like kind of like I don't want to say poke the bear, but that's the only word that comes in. You know what I mean? It's like that, it's like that disruption where it's like I come in and disrupt, but I can do with like a smile on my face. So you're not mad at me after. You know what I mean? So um, so yeah, when it comes to moxie, I just, you know, um creating uh when you're going into someone's vulnerable space, such as their home, right? Um, it's very important to make sure that you are, you're not afraid to go in there and one, be who you are, but two, recognize that the the client, like this is their vulnerable, this is their home, this is a vulnerable space for them. Um, you know, we're going in and we're cleaning and we're making sure that we have respect for what's going on around us, and that it also is in like really good, pristine condition. Excellence. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? And I know we're not perfect, um, but we definitely strive to be very, very clear in that fine line of perfectionism versus like what's acceptable and what's not. Right. You know what I mean? Right. Um, so yeah, so that's kind of that's kind of how I feel about about the word moxie. I don't know if that wraps it up. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:26

No, that was great. Um, and kind of along the same lines. So you're saying that your mom had these standards, but she didn't communicate them. How has that affected you as a business owner? Like in what ways do you because you have a standard of excellence and it's darn close to perfection. How do you communicate that with your employees, people that work with you, without creating a culture of fear and anxiety?

SPEAKER_01 13:53

Um, you know, I just I learned from a young age what I didn't want as far as communication goes, right? And it wasn't, I didn't want someone to not communicate with me, whether it was hurtful or not hurtful, right? And it took me a while to learn that, like into well into my probably 30s when I was like, oh yeah, this doesn't feel good. I should probably learn how to communicate better, you know. So I I've been practicing that for a while. So when it comes to communication, I feel like the best policy is you just you just say it. You know what I'm saying? So there's there's no scarcity of of what's real, what isn't, you know what I mean? What were the expectations? Does that make sense? And you can say it in a way where it's not fear-based, because I don't think fear-based helps anybody, right? It's more or less like, these are my expectations. Can you do them? If you can't, that's okay. Let's meet each other where you're at, and then let's try to figure out our way around that so we can all be on the same page. Yeah. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_00 14:53

Yeah. I think this is something that I deal with both personally and professionally, where I have written or unwritten expectations, and then it's not until someone delivers something where I realize I didn't communicate fully. Absolutely. But then I also don't want to overwhelm them of like, no, it needs to be this, this, and this. And but there's things in your head that you think everybody adheres to that standard. Oh yeah. And then they don't because we all have these made-up expectations from all these other factors of our lives. Right. Right. So yeah, that's definitely something that I'm still working on.

SPEAKER_01 15:31

So same. And I think we're always gonna work on that. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's just part of the the human experience.

SPEAKER_00 15:37

Right.

SPEAKER_01 15:37

You know?

SPEAKER_00 15:38

I think words of affirmation are kind of like the opposite of that and help alleviate maybe some of that pressure. Like I try to I I had a really good experience working at an advertising agency where the leadership was very heavily focused on like positive feedback. And I think that makes an environment where it's easier to accept like the expectations while I hear that maybe you missed the mark on something. Like it's easier to be like, okay, like yeah, next time I need to do this, this, and this. Right. When the feedback is coupled with like, hey, I really loved how you did XYZ next time, like we've got to do this and that, but otherwise, like everything looked great.

SPEAKER_01 16:25

Yeah. You know, yeah. No, I think that's really important. I think it's important to, I mean everybody does it differently, but I like what you were saying there. How, you know, I've gone to a ton of sales and coaching and management classes and stuff like that. And one thing that they've always said is, you know, give two positives to every one negative or three positives to every negative, right? And which I love that, right? But at the same time, there's also then this other space of like toxic positivity. Does that make sense?

SPEAKER_00 16:54

We don't want it to be inauthentic either.

SPEAKER_01 16:56

Yes, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 16:57

So you have to like walk that fine line too, or it's like plus like the sandwich method of like start the email positive, end the email positive. Like we all know the formula, you know.

SPEAKER_01 17:09

So I think when it is genuine, like what you actually that's so funny. Yes. Sandwich method. I love that. It's true.

SPEAKER_00 17:22

I know I I love when I get sandwiched. I'm like, okay.

SPEAKER_01 17:24

Like I see what you're doing here. Right.

SPEAKER_00 17:26

Like, love that thought.

SPEAKER_01 17:29

That's funny.

SPEAKER_00 17:30

You can just say what we're missing here.

SPEAKER_01 17:33

Exactly. Just skip all that. Just go right to it.

SPEAKER_00 17:37

This is something we do as women though, specifically, because I notice when I'm emailing a guy, there is no sandwich mess.

SPEAKER_01 17:44

You just say it.

SPEAKER_00 17:45

No, the guys are just like dire direct.

SPEAKER_01 17:48

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_00 17:49

Oh no, I needed this by yesterday. I'm like, okay, well.

SPEAKER_01 17:53

You're like, okay, awesome.

unknown 17:55

I'll get that.

SPEAKER_00 17:56

Or it's always like, is this passive aggressive?

SPEAKER_01 17:59

Right?

SPEAKER_00 17:59

I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 18:00

Yeah. Exactly. No, I hear you because you never know. And especially when you're reading an email or a text.

SPEAKER_00 18:04

Yeah, the tone. Right. I have no idea.

SPEAKER_01 18:06

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:08

But it's real. I mean, we're two different, we're two different same species, but two different people. And there's a reason why there's men and women on this earth and we teach each other, you know, the different balances and stuff like that. But at the same time, it's like we do, we respond differently. And I understand that gender is construct. I'm I'm not hitting on that. I get it. Right. But at the same time, it's just interesting how some of us respond differently or act in a way differently. Yes.

SPEAKER_00 18:35

And I think that's what it comes down to. It's like it is different. And we have to acknowledge that because as you're growing a team, like you will work with both men and women. We work with female and male clients. Like it's gonna come up. Like even if you are this like female founded company, yeah. It's not a female world, and like we don't want it to be. No. So you have to just acknowledge the differences and how different people respond, especially in building like a team culture. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 19:02

I mean, I have a supervisor right now, Jefferson. He's our our supervisor of our team, right? Yeah. And you know, sometimes he'll have to tell me that I am out of line the way I said something. Because he sometimes can be a little bit more gentle than I can. Right. But he's like he's he's saying it with a punch, like he's telling you exactly how it is, but he's just saying it softer. Or having like he said, I got it, I got it. I'm like, okay, Jefferson, yeah. Apparently I'm I'm out of line on this one. So yeah, I agree with you. It is, it's not it, it is a woman-owned company, but we hire men and women. Right. Because that's just the world that we that we live in. I don't I don't just want to have just men or just women. Right. Do you know what I mean? I want people who are driven and have the same core values and the same, the same Yeah, the same things that we have as far as our core values go.

SPEAKER_00 19:51

I love what you said about Drafferson, like maybe being able to deliver something gentler than you would be able to, I think, acknowledging like this goes back to what we were saying of like authentic compliments, not just coming up with something to ease the blow, but exactly like truly calling out what someone is good at or what their strengths are and acknowledging that I think goes a long way.

SPEAKER_01 20:13

Oh, it does. It absolutely does. And and here's the thing is not everybody can do it, not everybody can deliver a message um in in an impactful way. Some people just are not good at delivering messages, and that's okay. You know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_00 20:27

We don't all have the same skills. Exactly, and we don't want to because that is a leadership skill to be able to see people's strengths and weaknesses, yeah, I was and not dog them for their weaknesses, but also emphasize their strengths. I think is like what is one of the things that makes a good leader, yeah, especially in like a team setting. Yep. Agreed. Agreed. Kind of along the same lines with this standard of excellence and borderline perfectionism.

SPEAKER_01 21:00

I'm I'm going to therapy.

SPEAKER_00 21:01

But you but you and I don't.

SPEAKER_01 21:06

Abby's seeking therapy.

SPEAKER_00 21:08

Maybe I should, right? Yeah, this is you know, okay, I actually have a funny story about this. Okay. I was diagnosed as a perfectionist in the fifth grade.

SPEAKER_01 21:18

Oh my gosh, I'm making fun of you over here. This is awful.

SPEAKER_00 21:22

By my fifth grade teacher. Oh, okay. Okay, not a professional.

SPEAKER_01 21:25

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 21:25

Not a professional teacher. Yeah, okay, okay. So it it's actually funny because so I was in the fifth grade, her name was Miss Weber, and she called my mom. We had a parent teacher conference about this. Because wow. No, it was bad. Because like I would keep my desk a certain way. Like, you know, there were these standards for how we needed to keep our desks, and no one did it the right way besides me. Of course not. Like, I was the only one appearing. To this role from Miss Weber. Miss Weber was my favorite teacher. Okay. Because she herself had very high standards as well.

unknown 22:07

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 22:08

And I could meet, I like I could meet the standard.

SPEAKER_02 22:11

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_00 22:12

And she once said that she, if she could have a classroom of cloned versions of me, that would be her ideal class. I love that. And that stuck with me. Like that, I mean, that was several years ago. Yeah. It's been a long time since I was in fifth grade. So I mean, that really made a mark on me and my identity.

SPEAKER_01 22:30

But now you have a bar.

SPEAKER_00 22:34

Like if I was her favorite student.

SPEAKER_01 22:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:36

Like I took teacher's pet to a whole new level when she said if she could clone me, she I mean, that's a pretty high compliment.

SPEAKER_01 22:44

That is a high compliment, yes. But at the same time, that's a lot of pressure for you.

SPEAKER_00 22:48

It's well, and the so the parent-teacher conference was because I received a A minus instead of an A plus. And I was sobbing because I received an A minus instead of an A plus. And so that's when it was like, okay, like if you keep your desk clean and you answer the questions right and always follow the rules, like that's great. But if we're sobbing because of an A minus, like that's a problem.

SPEAKER_02 23:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:23

And so yeah, that's like my earliest memory of realizing, okay, this whole perfectionism thing, like there's a limit.

SPEAKER_01 23:32

This might be a real issue.

SPEAKER_00 23:34

Like this, this might be a problem for my whole life.

SPEAKER_01 23:36

Yeah. Remind Mary the oldest in your family? I'm the youngest. You're the youngest. Interesting. Usually the oldest has that perfectionist streak.

SPEAKER_00 23:45

I don't I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 23:46

That's interesting. Yeah. So how is it going for you now?

SPEAKER_00 23:49

I mean, I I like I said, I still have these really high expectations. I can appreciate that. And I was just talking about this with like a life coach, business coach type of situation. And um, like coaching obviously is like focused on the now versus therapies like looking at the past. So she had asked me to create a list of all the expectations that I have for myself. And so I just was like rambling them off. And she's like, okay, and what would happen if none of those things got done today? Like if you didn't meet any of those expectations. And it like it makes me nauseous thinking about it. I'm like, don't, Emily, like, no. Like, we're done talking. Don't like end Zoom call. Yeah. Like, why are you torturing me?

SPEAKER_01 24:39

Why would you ask me that?

SPEAKER_00 24:40

Reality of me not accomplishing any of my expectations. Right, right. Yeah. So I wish I could tell you I'm like on the other side of it. And like, yes, I've let go of if all of my expectations fail, I still have all of the same value and everything is fine.

SPEAKER_01 24:56

But that is far from true. But the good news is you're working through it.

SPEAKER_00 25:02

We're working on it together.

SPEAKER_01 25:06

And it's like I told you before, awareness. That is half the battle.

SPEAKER_00 25:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:09

See?

SPEAKER_00 25:10

I think I'm I have a better grasp on it professionally because I'm mindful of other people. And I don't want to make other people feel the way that I can make myself feel, which kind of sounds terrible to say out loud. But like No, it's not terrible. You know, I don't I know how I react when like that example of okay, if these are all your expectations for a single day, and if none of those things happen, like makes me nauseous, makes me want to like not like I can't imagine that reality. Like it's just so uncomfortable. I don't want to make someone else feel that way. Right. With all these expectations that I pile on them. So I think it's a little bit easier business-wise because I can also like with design specifically, like there are design rules, and so it's not just like me making it up. It's like, oh hey, like these are like the basic design rules. Like we need to so the example that comes to mind is I have someone else managing my social media, and this has been one a huge relief for me because I don't have a good relationship with Instagram. Like it can just suck six hours out of my day so fast. So having her doing that is great, but it's also difficult to let go because that is like an aesthetics thing and everything that I do is an aesthetics thing. I mean there's like stra I mean there's more to it, but yeah, at the end of the day, like people like my design skills and that I can make things look pretty. Yes, that's a big part of it.

SPEAKER_01 26:45

Yes, you can.

SPEAKER_00 26:47

I mean, that's a big part of it, right? And so letting someone else use my face and my logo and like make it look their version of pretty is is a challenge that I have to let go of.

SPEAKER_01 27:00

It's hard to let go of that though, too. I mean, you and I work together on our website, which is phenomenal. And there are some things that I was nitpicky about, right?

SPEAKER_00 27:08

Yeah, but it's your website. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 27:11

So I'm like, yes, let's do it. But I I mean, and I'll be honest, like it's hard to just like you were struggling with putting your face on the social media, right? Like Molly knew you, but I didn't know. So I was like, oh, who is this girl? But like there's still that fear of like, but can she capture it what I'm looking for? You know what I mean? And then you did, right? But it's just like it's it is it's trusting and letting go of that, which is hard, right? Letting go of the sense of control that we think we have, but at the same time, when your face is on it, when it's gonna designs or yeah, you know what I mean? Like I get it. I totally so I completely understand. Like once I saw your finishing work, I was like, okay, she's in.

SPEAKER_00 28:00

Like, okay, she can do it. She cuts it. But it's hard to like.

SPEAKER_01 28:04

It's hard.

SPEAKER_00 28:04

Yeah, and I deal with that a lot, like with web design. It's one of those things where people often, I mean, it depends on the industry and what they're doing, but I work with people that are creative and they're they can think outside of the box. Yeah. And they're they have that willingness to figure it out. Right. And so often that bleeds into creating their own website. Right. Which I think is great. Like there's nothing, I'm not gonna say there's nothing wrong with that, but like I understand, you know, like why when you are a female solopreneur, why you would take that on yourself. Yeah. Of like, okay, no, I'm gonna do it because I know how to do it best. Exactly. And I know how I want it to be, yeah. Like how I want to portray myself. But in working with you, you had this, like we've kind of talked about previously, like this vision for how you want people to feel and how you just want everything to come together. And so it was so fun to bring that to life in a way that didn't stress you out. Like you're not having to figure out how to build your own website, like you're getting to just like lead the creative direction. Yeah. Almost. Yeah. And so that's probably one of my favorite parts is that like there's this gap. Like when someone starts working with me, they're a little bit apprehensive. Like they probably have some personal connection to me. So they trust me enough with like their passwords. Yeah. But like they're a little nervous about how it's all gonna come together. And if they have given me enough information to work off of and all of these things, right? Yeah. Where they just like want to be portrayed in the right way. And are they getting their money's worth? And am I gonna charge them for edits later because people are shady and do weird things, yeah, or just ghost you. And and then at the end, like when we press publish, and they're like, oh my gosh, like this is so much better than one we could have ever made, and two like than I ever thought. And that's like the most rewarding.

SPEAKER_01 30:16

Oh, for sure. Because it's like that instant like gratification. Yeah, look what I did. Yeah, they're like, oh dang, like yeah, we should have had you do more. Yeah, well, exactly. And you it's but that's that instant gratification that just like when you get to see your work, like you see it coming together the entire time. But then once you put your whole package together, then you're kind of like, and there it is, and now everybody's happy, and everyone's yeah, but that's how I felt with cleaning. Like when I was cleaning, it was like that instant gratification. Like, I'd go into a house and I was like, Okay, let's get to work, and then I'd do the whole thing, and by the time I was done, I was like, Look what I did. I don't have to wait for results. Right.

SPEAKER_00 30:50

It is actually very similar because people are nervous to let you in the house. Like that's even scarier than some online password. They're like, who is this girl or who is like who are these people, this team? This is something we've talked about a lot, like in building your like the whole rebrand and the whole new website and everything of like, hey, we're gonna try and keep the same people like it's relational. Yeah, it's not this like dirt cheap crew of people coming in your house and doing who knows what with what who knows what products. Like you care about the ingredients of the products that you're using, the quality of the materials, the quality with the people. And yeah, people have their preferences, like we have all these expectations. Yeah, so does everyone else with their household.

SPEAKER_01 31:39

Absolutely, absolutely, and it's it's it and that stuff is important, right? It's important to know who is coming into your house and can I have the same cleaner? Are you just some company that I found online that's a franchise that's just gonna send some random person each time? And I enjoy it being able to explain that to new clients um that this is how we run our business. And and I feel like they feel they feel safer because of that. They feel like they can give us their keys to their home. We can come in when their kids are there. Yeah, some of some Jefferson gets invited to people's weddings. Like, you know what I mean? They love him. He goes to Christmas parties, he gets invitations, he gets bonuses all the time from clients because they just love him, right? And they fight over him and it's hard. I told Jefferson, I'm like, I need you to find me. We need to clone him. Yes, yes, like your fifth grade teacher said, you know. We need clones of Jefferson. We do, we do, and he knows it and he's so funny. It's it's funny because um I've never I clean very, very well. Um, like I said, I when I was a solopreneur, I built my business just on word of mouth, right? And so when I first met Jefferson, he was like my match, right? And so like I cleaned with him a couple times, and then it just became this rival because it's kind of like, oh, well, no, you can't be better than me. Are you better than me? Do you know what I mean? And and he would fight back and be like, I'm probably better than you. So you know what I mean? And it's just it's just this funny banter that we have, but it just made the it made work fun. Yeah, you know what I mean? And he's he's fun, he's great for our team.

SPEAKER_00 33:07

So I love that fighting over right. Well, this conversation has been amazing. I always love connecting the dots between different industries and like realizing how much we have in common, even if we do something completely different.

SPEAKER_01 33:24

Right.

SPEAKER_00 33:24

So thank you so much for taking the time and coming on the show.

SPEAKER_01 33:28

Yeah, thanks for having me. It's been super fun. I love this. I love just talking, talking to you. We could probably sit here and probably record like another hour and a half, I bet. We could. We really could, but for the sake of everyone else. Fair enough. Fair enough. Well, thank you so much. Yeah, absolutely. Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 33:53

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