Expressions of a Hairstylist Off the Record
Real People Real Careers Real Conversations
Don has a variety of different guests on the show to get an inside look into their career choices. These career topics will educate and inform the listener on what it takes to be in each field.
Expressions of a Hairstylist Off the Record
HVAC Techs
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Real People, Real Careers and Real Conversations.
In this Episode Don speaks with 2 HVAC techs to get a better understanding of how they chose this career and what they do from day to day to service their clients.
I have two people here today that the entire world needs, and we are more than appreciative appreciative of them. We have Lance Burgess, who is an HVAC technician. I'm sorry, he's the HBAC starvist technician here in the City of Columbus. He has been for 28 years. We also have Don Joe Watkins, who is an HVAC installer, Class technician. He has been doing his work in the City of Columbus for eight years. Gentlemen, welcome to the show.
SPEAKER_02Thank you for having us.
SPEAKER_00Thank you for being here. So I always start my um I always talk about the show off with good customer service. We always hear about the bad customer service. You know, we hear about that, but I like to talk about the good customer service. So if you have experienced any good customer service in the last 30 days, could you share that with us and the listeners? Because I think it's good to give shouts out with for good customer service. Lance, I'll start with you.
SPEAKER_02Uh yeah, I receive it. I think uh the good outweighs the bad. Um it's just the bad sometimes is gets more focused on. Um, but I've I don't know any uh particular, I mean there's a lot of different instances, but um over the years I've learned a lot actually from a lot of clients and customers, things that they knew may have learned as they grew up that you know about credit and just life in general, um, just different perspectives and stuff like that. And it kind of helped me just realize that people are still good people, they're still good people out there, you know. Because a lot of times, like I say, the negativity outweighs like when you look at the media or just different stuff, you can have uh one track mindset. But um actually getting out there and meeting people, and I also like to let them meet me too, because they don't get to meet people that look like myself a lot. And then when they do meet me, they have a different perspective on things as well.
SPEAKER_00That's true, that's true. So I have like a restaurant or coffee, or have you been anywhere where you was like, okay, you know what? She was really nice, or he was really nice, and I appreciate them, you know, respecting me and giving me good customer service. Have you been anywhere specific, like in the last 30 days that you can think of? Like where it's like, you know what? Yeah, that she was nice, she likes her job, or he likes his job.
SPEAKER_02Uh yeah, yeah, I can't think of specific specific. That's okay. No, that's fair.
SPEAKER_00That's fair because that's fair. I'm no worries, Dante.
SPEAKER_02I'm going a little left to center at first because I I thought you were talking about pertaining to the like the trade that we're in or whatever.
SPEAKER_00Oh no, no, yeah, just I mean, just in general, just you going somewhere to eat or to get coffee or get gas, and and the person at the front seemed like they was happy to be at work because that's what I like to see. Like, you know what I'm saying? I could tell it was like, okay, yeah, you you like being you like your job, you know what I'm saying? That's what I'm in.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Um, yeah, I actually recently, just last week, had um a situation like that. Um just I just bought a an older truck, uh, older Chevy Tahoe truck 2001. So um I originally found out that I had to replace all of my radio systems, speakers, subwoofers, everything, um, in the car as far as uh sound goes. And I had to go to a store, it's called Sound Investments, um, just to get a better sense of what I need, what I don't have for the truck that may be needed, um, anything aftermarket wise. And the guy, as soon as I walked in and explained to him what I already have as far as equipment that I bought, whether it was the speakers, the amplifier, subwoofer, wiring, whatever, you know, he I brought him out to my truck, showed him what I had, and of course, he, you know, was very truthful and honest with me about everything that I had, whether it was junk um or if it was something that we could actually use for the install. Um, and once he explained everything, you know, I definitely felt discouraged. But, you know, after um, you know, we left my left for my truck and went into the store and he explained more in detail with everything, it better help me understand what I really need for my truck as far as sound and what I don't, you know, necessarily need. Um, not all the bells and whistles, but he explained everything um from the wattage to the clear sound when the radio is coming on, um, the wiring, trying to keep things out of sight, out of mind, just in case if you have kids in the car or animals. Um, and he he helped me a lot actually. And he could he could even tell himself that I was starting to get discouraged off of what he was telling me and the information that he was giving me. But me explaining to him that I appreciated him, let him know it kind of opened his eyes a little bit more, like, okay, um, you know, he's not mad at it at me for what I'm telling him, or he's not, you know, gonna be angry because of the pricing or whatever I'm explaining to him. You know, he could he actually could tell I was more acceptant to what he was explaining to me. And he even took the initiative to take me back to their shop, which they don't typically do, um, to show me as someone's vehicle that they're already working on, uh, putting a sound system in and show me what all I actually need for my my truck, and they're doing the same thing for somebody else's. So he was kind of trying to show me what is going to be needed and how it's actually gonna happen and you know what it's gonna take. So, you know, I appreciate that. Yeah, he was very, very thorough. I was appreciative of that. Um, and he also let me know, like, you know, I used to have a truck like yours, so I too know what it feels like to have to grasp and wrap your head around all of what you have to replace just to get the sound that you want in your car.
SPEAKER_00So and what was the name of the the place that you went to again?
SPEAKER_05It's called Sound Investments, it's located off the East Main Street. Yeah, it's kind of in the White Hall area.
SPEAKER_00Well, shout out to Sound Investments for um being detailed and thorough and and doing everything he could to make you feel comfortable because that's that was that was good, that's good customer service right there. Especially if he can see the look on your face and see, you know, that you're starting to get disturbed and kind of turn it around. That's um that's good. So shout out to them. Okay, so when people think of HVAC, they usually think of just a broken air conditioner, right? So can the two of you share a part of your daily job that would completely surprise the, you know, a person that's not in the industry? Lance, I'm gonna start with you.
SPEAKER_02Um, I think the most part uh that will surprise people is how much the weather like really affects our day-to-day job, basically. You know, um, not only just the demand of if it's hotter or colder, but a rainy day is just kind of just ruins the whole day. Snowy day ruins the whole day, having to drive around town and deal with the weather and traffic and uh all that. That's uh, and then not knowing, like most people go to work, they know where they're going every day. We don't know what side of town, what kind of job, you know, whatever. You know, it can be something different every day, somewhere different, new, like a different location every day.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. So the both of you were surely glad you were off yesterday when the hail storm came through.
SPEAKER_03Yes, definitely.
SPEAKER_00We had a terrible, it was it was quoted on our phones as being a thunderstorm. Yeah, but I'm witness to it that it was more of a hail storm, so much so that um when I was at work, it literally blew the door open and slammed it shut. So that was not just a regular thunderstorm, that was a hail storm. So for sure, I'm glad I know you were both of you were glad you were off. Donzel.
SPEAKER_05Um as far as you know, the getting there, and I mean, kind of to piggyback off of what Lance is saying, for me, it's a little bit different um with me installing most of the time. We don't know where we're going, um, still in the day-to-day, but for me, once I'm, you know, once I do figure out where I'm gonna be or what side of town, then I'm there pretty much the majority of the day. I'll say at least we typically, as installers, would say six to eight hours, eight hours being the max of what we want to be at the home, but we could be there longer. Um, but you know, when you're going to check out an AC specifically, or I'll speak on experience from the time times when I'm helping out with the service side. Um, a lot of times you don't, you know, really know what you're going into, even you know, with the knowledge that you have, everything happens differently with the components and electrical things that uh are built into the equipment. So um, you know, nine times out of ten, you may be thinking that you're just going to check out an AC and do a diagnosis, but it could turn into the AC being, you know, it maybe need to be replaced or repaired, or it can go from that to you having to go inside and figure out what's going on with the furnace. So it could be, you know, just the AC, or it could be you going in to figure out if the whole system um has a has an issue. So um I think it really just depends. Every situation is different. Um, and that's one thing we always have to keep in mind. Some things are some jobs are more challenging than others, and it's far more complex than just my air conditioner is broken. Yeah, my air conditioner is just broken, and yeah, it just needs fixed. It's not it's not that easy.
SPEAKER_00It's it could be far more complex than that. But good. I hope listeners learn. Okay, so Lance, you're essentially considered a mechanical detective, if you will. Can you like walk walk us through a time where um you know you were able to diagnose a problem and everyone else was just kind of stumped and couldn't figure it out? You managed to you managed to put all the puzzles together in your mind and was able to figure out the problem?
SPEAKER_02Uh yeah, that's something that kind of I'm often faced with being a more tenured uh technician. But um the biggest thing is just thinking outside of the box and not, you know, um looking past the basic things, um, and then just going through the sequence of operation of how things work and seeing where things are kind of off a little bit. Um a lot of times that's the biggest thing is just knowing how it works and then seeing how it's not working and what's actually going on. Like, is it getting the call from the thermostat? Is it trying to come on? Is it you know, knowing what's supposed to happen first, second, third, fourth, you know, so on and so forth. That often helps. And then um just kind of a lot of it is uh experience too, just knowing things weird, things can happen sometimes that are kind of off the cuff. And uh you just remember from things you may have seen years ago that remind you of it or whatever. But the biggest thing is uh just um thinking outside the box and just going through the sequence of operations.
SPEAKER_00Well, I mean, that's good that you have your own system to be able to figure that out. You know, if you it's like, okay, one, two, three didn't work, okay. So let's go to 4A. You know what I'm saying? Before we go to 5C, let's go to 4A and see if we can figure out. I mean, that takes some mental skill, you know what I mean? That's not just that like sitting there thinking and resolving and trying to figure it out in your brain. Now, me, I probably would have had to pick up a piece of paper because I just work like that and start writing.
SPEAKER_02I mean, sometimes we have to do that, um, or you know, read the book to the menu on some of this newer stuff, it's real complex. So um, sometimes you have to do that too, or go online or whatever, you know.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. And Donzel, so when you, you know, as an installer, it's considered to be artwork, right?
SPEAKER_05I think it's yeah, correct. It is.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. So when you're doing like your your when you're done with your duckwork and your piping and you everything looks like it's it's neat and it's where it's supposed to be. Do you do you kind of stand back and acknowledge and and and appreciate the work that you've done?
SPEAKER_05Uh yes, definitely. That's a almost an everyday thing. Um, it really kind of is an everyday thing for the most part. Um the beauty of that though, on the the the other side of it is that we actually get to take pictures and see what it looks like before we get started, all the way up until, you know, we'll take pictures when we first get to the job, see what all we're looking at, what we have to do. And then once we rip everything out and you start to, you know, tie all the equipment back in, duck work, um, return airdrops. If we're doing new builds, then it could be registers, uh, trunk lines, different run heat runs. Um, and we also take pictures at the end. So you get to see the before and after, and when you stand back and really pay attention to every small detail that you actually put into the job, you're more appreciative of you know, your work and your craft. You know, that's how you really look at it. Um, every job is different, so you can run into uh several different things uh during your installs, but to be able to to kind of transform which what was originally in the home to something else, or it could be or not necessarily a home, it could be a business or um or a store or hair salon of that, you know, sense. But just from you being able to see the difference from how it looked before as opposed to when you're done, it's a huge transformation. It's like really like a remodeled home or um building in a sense, it's just the equipment is all brand new, the ductwork, the piping, everything. So it's it's definitely art. It's crafty in a sense, mechanically, I guess, if you want to say.
SPEAKER_00Absolutely. So when people walk in and they look up and see all that work, put some respect on it because it is definitely it takes a skill, it takes experience, it takes to me clarity of the eye as well. I don't even do it, right? Not gonna do it, but I I respect it. Um, when I walk into stores and stuff sometimes and I'm looking up, I'm like, yeah, Donzell and Lance, even if it's not y'all, I still say the same thing, you know.
SPEAKER_02Um, but on the flip side to that, a side note to that is the reverse effect. If it's not presentable, you know, a lot of times we can go into a job that we didn't do and see it and say, man, this is messed up, or they didn't do this, X, Y, Z. And, you know, uh, so that that's a thing too.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, that's a thought. That actually, um, to piggyback off of what Lance is saying, that actually will keep you kind of more um focused and you know, kind of tight with what you're installing and making sure you're not doing what somebody which you see somebody else should have done, or you know, it it's it should have been done by code or you know just by the specs of the of the installer, how the equipment is supposed to be installed. So yeah, that's a that's a huge um fact because we see that every day.
SPEAKER_00So now how do you tell? How do you tell a homeowner or someone like, you know, hey, you know, I just want to let you know, like that's you know, because I mean take us through that really quick. If it's bad duct work, like eventually is that gonna affect something else, or is it just it's just bad, they just didn't, you know, they just didn't take the time to to do it properly, or they it was a rush job, or it was just sloppy, or I mean, do you tell the people that or do you just let it go? Like, how does that go?
SPEAKER_05Um I mean, you can definitely let the well, sometimes the customer might notice it before you notice it, and they'll have questions way before they even before you even get to their home. So sometimes it plays out like that. Sometimes you can see it. What I try to do personally, um, I try not to throw anybody under the bus, whether it's somebody from my company or a totally different company, because I don't know them. I wasn't there during the install, so I don't know what problems they had or what they could have gone into or uh ran into. So I don't technically try to down talk um the next person. Um, I'll just explain to the customer how it should have been installed. And if they want, you know, to speak to a manager or salesperson that can be able to maybe give them a quote on fixing that specific part of the ductwork or equipment, um, then I'll do that. That way, nobody's been thrown under the bus. They're not calling the other company, like, hey, you did this, this is what they told me. Um and instead, we're just going to point you into the right direction so that we can fix the problem now. I don't know what happened beforehand, but we'll fix the problem now, and that way moving forward, it will be correct. Um but yeah, I don't I don't I don't ever like to, you know, let them know like it's it wasn't done right. You need to talk, call them and tell them that you need your money back now. Because it can affect um the home over time, depending on what part of the equipment it is, and then you know, at that point, it doesn't matter, it needs to be fixed.
SPEAKER_02So yeah, that's something that you want to stay away from, also, because I've known people that have been in the middle of lawsuits do this stuff like that, like you know, commenting on things that like another company may have done, and then they call the company and then mention it to them, and then it just kind of can it can get ugly. But if it has something to do with what you're actually there to do, sometimes it's hard to avoid it, you know what I mean? If it's something that wasn't done. I I had a situation one time where on a service call, even um, it was an older lady, it was a middle of winner, and a guy from another well-known company that's known for like doing people wrong. And I know that, and people mention them all the time, and I don't, you know, feed into it or say what I know or feel about them. But this guy had left these wires loose and cut some wires and did a bunch of messed up stuff, and the lady just called us to say the heat wasn't working, and I instantly knew somebody had been working on it, so I went up and asked her just so I wouldn't get accused of doing that. And she's like, Yeah, well, she broke down and just told me, yeah, this other company was out, but they wanted to charge a bunch of money. And um, and I'm like, Well, where are the other pieces to this wire and the screws was missing, all kind of stuff? And uh, so she said, Well, uh, I don't know, but I'm gonna call and ask them. And I had kind of stepped into that that time, but I that was kind of unavoidable because I couldn't do my job without things being right. So then it would have created more labor for her for me to actually fix that, what he didn't do right. He wasn't even there to fix it, he was just there to diagnostic and took a bunch of extra stuff apart and cut wires that shouldn't have been cut and all kinds of stuff. So uh she actually had to call them back, and the guy came back and put it back allegedly like how it was supposed to be. I mean, he did it to the best of his ability, and then I came back and fixed it like the following day or whatever.
SPEAKER_00But well, that's good. I mean, you know, um my thing is it's good that you went in because you probably would have never known that things were the way they were, you know, and you can't do your job with it being like that because you don't want to be liable for some previous work that you didn't, you know, that you didn't do. So that was good. I mean, I can I can understand that. But picking back on Don't Zell, like, you know, never mention you never want to mention, you know, previous company or whatever, but you do want to guide them in the right direction. And this is no comparison to what you do, but there's been some, you know, some pretty bad haircuts. And so, okay, well, you know, next time, just you know, uh just suggest that you know they watch this cowlick or you know, they fade it a little bit more, you know. So I understand I didn't even have to cut it previously. I just, you know, let the parents know, hey, this is so I could definitely understand that. That's a that's a good one. So many people um in their adulthood carrying a massive college debt. Uh how did you how did getting into HVAC allow you to start earning a great living quickly? And what does financial independence look like in this field? Donzell, I'm gonna start with you.
SPEAKER_05Um as far as the you know, getting into the field and you know, the financial debt, I mean, that's I feel like that's gonna come um either way, it doesn't matter what you're in school for, it's gonna Be some depth behind it, but um I feel like for me to be able to get into a career field as quickly as I did within a year or maybe a year and a half, um that's pretty good to be able to do, and for you to be able to start making money like right away, as soon as you start, you know, working there, like even though you're not complete you may not be completely inclined with everything that's going on, um, you're already starting to make, you know, uh a good amount of money for what you're doing. So um me starting off doing that and being told by different people um, you know, that the money will eventually come, you just gotta keep working at it, you know, keep learning, and it'll all come to, you know, it me being, you know, doing it for eight years now and actually seeing the outcome of it is definitely worth it. Um the debt thing, you kind of don't there's nothing that you can really do about that until you know once you start making money, then you can set up whatever payments or whatever you need to to go ahead and take care of your debt. That's really all you can do. I don't really feel like there's much else to, you know, there's not really much else to it. There's that's the only way to go about it. Um it will help you though with the job being in this specific field. Um, you can make a a great amount of money over time. So, you know, uh debt that you may think you might have been paying on for the rest of your life may only be, who knows, you know, for maybe one to five years or so, you know, maybe a little bit more, but it gives you time to be able to pay it off and you won't be paying on it forever.
SPEAKER_00Manage managing a man.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, you're able to, yeah, you're able to manage your money well. Um as far as the financial independence is just you really gotta be very, very um focused on um managing your money correctly uh because making a lot of money in this field, you know, as quick as you as quickly as you're getting the money, it can go right back out the door. So you really gotta be diligent um about how you are managing your money. And um in this field, you also have to, you know, spend a lot of money on tools and things over time. So you also have to take a an account of that for that as well. Um, but for my me personally, that's how kind of how I've always looked at it, and I always explain that to you know younger guys that talk to me about it or ask me questions about it just so it doesn't discourage them. Cause that's that's not really it's it it is something big because it's debt, but it'll be worth it in the long run.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so sounds like uh what you're saying is the guest that I had on last week. Uh she's a certified financial planner, and she said, try your best not to spend $800 a month on DoorDash uh when you're making good money.
SPEAKER_05That's a fact. That's a fact.
SPEAKER_02Um for the debt thing, I think uh, you know, you're gonna have to pay for school, but it's it's a definitely a great alternative trade for or you know, field to get into versus going to a four-year college, you know, because it's not as uh expensive as that. And another good thing, I I don't know about making money quickly. That's kind of a uh, you know, because I've been doing this for so long, and people always stop me, or you know, when they see the truck or when they know what I do, everybody assumes HVAC a lot of money, but you don't get it right away. Um, but the one good thing is that you get to start working in the field and earning money and learning at the same time versus like a doctor, you go to school forever. I know not forever, but for eight to ten years or whatever, and don't make anything, and then you make a lot of money when you first get into it, and you don't know anything. Um, I mean, you just know what you learned in school. With this, you actually learn and earn at the same time. Um, you learn in trade school the basics, which you don't you can get straight out of trade school and you you can't fix a thing because you really don't know anything until you get out there. You learn on the job, that's the best way to learn. And um, you know, and then any type of apprenticeship program or you know, mentorship program or whatever, you get somebody that can teach you the right things in the right ways, and then you put in the work and then you get the money. That's basically how that works. You don't just get into HVAC and make a lot of money. I think a lot of young guys get into it and they think that that's just kind of just from what I get from people. They think, oh, you get into this, you're gonna make a lot of money. And that's not necessarily true. I actually took a pay cut when I first started, like it was almost 30 years ago, but I made $850 an hour. And I took a pay cut coming from, I worked in the at the limited uh in the warehouse, and I took like a two or three dollar pay cut because I knew it would help me in the long run. But I was able to offset the pay cut by working more overtime and working more hours. So I would work 60, 70 hours a week. I ride with guys, I come in on the weekends, ride with people, learn, just trying to get to the top, like, you know, not to the top, but just to excel. And I liked it and I enjoyed learning and I was interested in it. But it was nice to be able to be earning money and learning at the same time. But you have to like it too.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, exactly. And yeah, you were trying to get you were trying to get to the top of where you wanted to be. So yeah, that's that's you were, yeah, you know what I'm saying. You and I mean, on the job, on the job learning, getting paid to learn. I mean, to me, it just doesn't get any better than that. Like that's the that's where, I mean, it's just like anything else. Like when I came out of class school, I mean, they taught me a lot, but starting to learn on the job and you know, back and forth from people coming in and you know, they see me now, like, oh, you know, you're real fast. Well, I wasn't my fourth, you know, my third or fourth year, I wasn't fast. You know, I'm supposed to be almost 26 years now. You know, I'm moving faster now because I've been out there. So yeah, that on-a-job training is definitely, and and even though you took a bank of it, you knew in the long run that it was gonna pay off for you. And you was motivated, you know. So it sounded like you were making it up with 60, 70 hours a week.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah. And another thing I'll mention for what I see with the younger generation, because this field really a lot of the old timers are fading away. When I came in, it was baby boomers that taught me, and they were old school, and and all of those guys retired within the first five to 10 years when I was in the field. And then even people in my generation are starting to retire or move on or out of the field and into different things, but there's not a lot of interested, good technicians coming in under us. I don't see it as much. Um, what I see that that they mess up at a lot, what what the younger generation messed up messes up at a lot is just the basics. I mean, all you need to do is be able to be on time. I mean, just the most simple things you would think that they would get it and they don't. Be courteous, have, you know, uh be able to talk to people, be respectful. Stuff that doesn't take using your hands and knowing how to figure out how to fix an air conditioner or a furnace. That can go a long way. If you have somebody like that, you can teach them and they can go far. But those basic things, yeah. But if you can't get there on time and you're not motivated and you're not paying attention, and you know, you're not gonna get far. You know, you're probably not gonna get anywhere. You might as well go work in a warehouse or something at that point for real, because um, it's not really worth it. You're just wasting your time.
SPEAKER_00That's a general consensus. You're you're you sound like a lot of other people that's saying the same thing. Like I'm not really sure what it is or why, you know. Well, first of all, first I wanted to say that there's not, I I don't I used to see it, but I don't see any trade commercials anymore. I don't see any trade, you know, uh that's coming through my social media. I used to see them all the time. You know, and I was when I was, you know, come here going close, there would be a guy coming in and he was a free drummer, another guy with electricity, like, no, do you know anybody? Because we know people blah, you know, dah dah dah da. There you, you know, you they're advertised for a lot of stuff, you know, corporate and fighting about, but you don't hear anything about things like that. That's first off, you know what I mean? And a lot of the city, I don't know about the clubs, but a lot of the city corinthers, I don't think I'm not sure if they're talking about it. You don't have to, and I'm not sure if they're even offering it. So first of all, you gotta introduce it, you don't have to know for it to even get some notoriety. And then, okay, so let's work on just your whole mannerism. Okay, I need you to go to school, you gotta get to work on time, you gotta be able to speak and talk, you know, uh to people in a respectful manner, you know. So, yeah, all of those. Um hopefully, you know, because I know there's a lot of young people out there that would do good in this business if they had someone to tell them. There's not even there, there aren't even very many people to even talk to them to say, no, you you're not gonna go to a four-year college, that's totally fine. You don't want to work in corporate, totally understand. Have you considered a trade? Okay, let's sit down and go over the different trades that you might be interested in. First, you got to have somebody introduce it to them, you know, before it can.
SPEAKER_05Well, I was about to I was about to bring that up.
SPEAKER_02Like it kind of and that just lets me know that it's not only us, it's tons of other guys out there in the same situation. Like, you know, you know, I and I didn't even know this about him until after he started working and we was riding together and talking and he was told.
SPEAKER_00Share that, share, share that with the listeners, Lance, how you how you got into the HVAC.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, so like after high school, well, not to mention when I was in high school, HVAC was in the career center, but I was always told in high school, if you go to career center, you can't go to college. Um, and me, just like a lot of other inner city uh kids, you know, playing sports, I thought I was gonna go to the NFL. Like, you know what I mean? Like, so you know, I my thought is that you can't go to the NFL if you don't go to college. They tell them that you can't go to college, you go to the career center, um, which I learned later on that you could actually go to the career center and go to college. I don't know why they teach that in schools. That's very misleading. Um, but um anyway, I went away to college uh for a couple years and uh played football for a little bit, tried, you know, tried out, played on the uh team and did like spring ball and in the summer camp. And it just didn't work out. I got homesick and then I didn't have the funds, no support, you know. I didn't have, you know, my family wasn't didn't have much money to support me. So, you know, I ended up coming home and that was very embarrassing. And uh, you know, it was, it was, it was, it was tough as a kid. You know, you go away, everybody's rooting you for you, you get the graduation party, people giving you gifts, you go away, and they're telling you, oh yeah, you're gonna be the man, this, that, the other, and you're thinking you're gonna go away and see them in four years and graduate and then get some more gifts. But when you come back home, you know, you're ducking and dodging people, like, oh, I don't want them to know I'm here. Like, yeah, I'm making up stuff and telling them this and that. And I didn't know what I wanted to do. But I was uh actually hanging out with some guys, and the guy that told me about the HVAC school I went to, he was like a criminal. He was in and out of jail and had a fed case, and his probation officer was like, uh, man, you got to get into something and do something. And he told him to go to the HVAC school. So when I was talking to him, you know, we were sitting around one night and he was like, Yeah, I'm in school for HVAC. And I was like, oh yeah, and this is right when I had first dropped out of college and came home and was trying to find my way. And he's like, Yeah, um, it's cool, it ain't that bad. And he was just kind of explaining the program, told me where it was. And I'm thinking, man, if he can, nothing, no offense, then I won't say who it is, but my thoughts was like, Man, if this dude can do that, I know I can do it. You know what I mean? So I looked into it and went to the school. He ended up dropping out like after the first six weeks in the program. He wasn't even there by the time I got there, and he went back to jail and just got out of jail. But I went on to go there and got into it. And then, you know, obviously the rest is kind of history, you know, got a job right out of school and never looked back. But yeah, so my point was that I know there's a lot of other people that went through that that may have dropped out of school that feel like college is the only way, but that that's not true. I mean, even if it's not HVAC, it could be any other trade, plumbing, electrical, whatever, you know.
SPEAKER_00I'm I'm just flabbergasted at the fact that somebody would tell you that. Like I've never even heard of someone telling students, like, if you go to a trade school, you can't go to college. Like that, that doesn't, I don't, there's no rationale for them even saying anything like that.
SPEAKER_02Like, that was I don't know who started that. It was just a myth in school. I remember hearing like if you go to career center, you can't go to college. Because I guess they meant you couldn't take like the college prep classes because it took you away from the time of school, but it it's totally untrue, though. I mean, and it really didn't make a difference anyway, because college wasn't for me and it's not for everybody. That's the problem.
SPEAKER_00Right, it's not, it's not for everybody, and you had an anointed, um, I call them anointed appointments, like you were talking to that guy who, you know, he was just doing it because he had to, right? But then it set you up, you know what I'm saying? It was just for you, so it's like that was the perfect meeting. Like he didn't even make it through, you know what I'm saying? But him telling you boom, it got you there, you know what I mean? Don't tell.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, I was gonna say, um, to piggyback off of that, yeah. I mean, Lance is really LB. That's that's this is he's the reason I'm even in HVAC, kind of like I had a one of my good buddies, a best friend that um he kind of seen how I was, you know, going to school. Of course, similar to Lance, you know, I was playing ball, you know, and playing football, and I was told I was gonna be, you know, this and that, and you know, you you it makes you feel so great to hear it. Um, and then I didn't go to like a four-year college like a lot of my other buddies did or classmates did. I actually had to go to a junior college to kind of trying to further my football career in a sense, and you know, doing that, sometimes you you come out successful, sometimes you don't. So um I actually went off to two different schools. I went to a junior college in California, um City College of San Francisco, played football out there for a little bit. Um, and that was my first time ever being in another state by myself um without any family around. Granted, I had some family um that lived in LA, but I wasn't close enough to them to be able to reach out to, you know, go visit them or have them come to me or whatever the case. So you, you know, you're by yourself. And similar with Lance, my family didn't really have the funds um like that to be able to support me as much as they wanted to. They did the best they can, and I was always appreciative. Um, so I never really paid too much attention to it. I kind of always tried to keep my mind focused on what I was there for and what I was trying to do, so that would kind of overcome everything else. But I definitely will have the homesick feelings. Um, I had a bad homesick feeling actually, um, one particular time being in California. But um, I went from California, I actually had to come back home as well. Um, and I hated it. You know, I worked at warehouse jobs for about five or six months, and um, I went off to school again to Alabama and I went to uh Alabama AM and I actually enjoyed myself there too. Uh, I was actually on the college campus in the dorms, um, enjoy myself. I I love the school, but again, I had some complications just with as far as money and um the tuition, so I ended up having to come back again. And when you have to come back home a second time after going to college twice, makes you feel like you're completely like it makes you feel like at an all-time low. Like, yeah, you went off to do all these great things, but now you're coming back home, not only one time, but you this your second time coming home. So now you have to trigger something in your mind to keep you um focused and understand like what you're going through is not forever, and you know, it things are gonna turn around. You just have to figure out what it is that you can find to do outside of going to college that can help you for right now, so that maybe you can get back to that. Um, so you know, my college journey kind of ended there. Um like I like I said, a good friend, a buddy of mine's um was working for Pickerington School uh district, working with the busing, and he actually reached out to me, um had some um ties to Fortis College here in Columbus, um, and located off of Sunbury Road. Um, and he actually talked to me about going there for HVAC, and I looked into HVAC, how much they made, you know, how how much information you needed to know to be able to do it, just different things, and it caught my eye um and my interest. And I've always been a guy that liked to take things apart and put them back together, and that's with anything. So it definitely triggered me in my mind, like, okay, that may maybe I just need to go ahead and do that. So I got into it like that. Um, you know, went through the schooling, did the year, you know, did everything I could to learn everything I possibly could while being in school. Um, because it's like Lance said, it's the basics. Um, and then as soon as I got out of school, you know, they they helped me find a job, they actually helped me get interviews. Um, it just so happened that I happened to be close to Lance, him being a family friend, and knowing me before I was even thought of, or before I was even born. So um, you know, help him helping me and already working for uh a company and also been have doing it already for so many amounts of years that he was actually able to um kind of pull me in to the company that he was working for, let them know who I was and what type of you know guy they were bringing in. And I had the interview and you know the rest is history. I've you know, we've kind of been working together ever since. But one thing I will say with that is um you have to have somebody in your corner in a sense that can talk to you about these things because there's there's always somebody around you that has been through these same situations that you you're either going through or that you've been through. So if you have a person like that that's close to you, that's the you need to be talking to them every day about what it is that that they know that you may not know that can help you move forward in your life as far as having a career job in general, because I feel like young guys they all the time will they'll rather look at what these celebrities do, uh, what's going on on social media, how much money they can make in a little bit of time, but they don't have that big homie or that person that they can look up to, a mentor that can explain to them, like, yeah, all that glit and glamour, that stuff is cool, but what happens if all that stuff goes away? Then what can what what are you gonna be able to do? Or what can you do? How can you support yourself and support your family if you have a family? Um, and a lot of guys kind of get stuck on that. So, you know, if you have a older person that you talk to or that you're cool with that is a mentor, kind of pick their brain on different things as far as like uh having a trade, because that may be something that you may actually be interested in and you don't even know it. Um and then once you get into it, it's gonna further help you in life in general, because I'll say for me, HVAC not only does it I've learned a lot from doing it, but I've also learned on the back side personally different things that I can add to that I do with work that I can add to my my regular life. Um so I always said like as far as young guys, just just kind of listen and try to get a better understanding of what certain things can do as far as trades, as opposed to going to a four-year college or three-year college that you know may make you a hundred thousand of dollars and that sort. Because you don't want to have that hundred thousand dollars off the rip as opposed to making a hundred thousand dollars over time to where you can double it. Um so I feel like young guys always need to look further than just how much you can make in little in a little bit of time. I I was like that too. I'm the in between, you know, I'm generation Z, so I'm I'm the in between to you know the baby boomers and then the the generation that we have now, and it's a huge disconnect. Nobody, the the younger generation doesn't want to work. Um They're real lax, they just think they can go make money fast, and then that's it. But one thing I always tell young guys, as soon as they ask me about HVAC, the main thing I always say is, man, if you really want to get into this, you really need to make sure this is what you want to do because it it can help you over time, it can make you a lot of money over time. But the main thing, well, everything that's going on in the world now, this is one of the main jobs that a robot cannot do. So they cannot take over your job at all. This is something you'll know and have for the rest of your life. You can go anywhere in the world and work, um, and it's just a great trade to have. But that's like a main thing. When we have world crises and things like that, we're still gonna be working. We don't, we're not gonna be laid off or sent home or anything like that. We're kind of we we're needed as much as they think of that.
SPEAKER_00As much as they want to, AI is you know, it's not it's not necessarily gonna replace it. And let me just say really quickly that I think as a community, we need to do better. We need to do better. If someone decides to pivot or and and not saying that um anyone in particular may either of you feel that way, but no one should feel ashamed or embarrassed about changing directions. Like you just gotta, it's Let Brown. He's a motivational team. If you're going in the wrong direction, just turn around and go the other direction. Like people do it all the time. So, you know, uh, let me be the first to apologize. Like, our community should do better. Like, you should never, you know, I do corporate was not my friend. I tried to go to corporate twice, and those people are miserable, they're angry, it's boring. Uh, you know, that that just is that's just not for me. I don't want to do corporate. I don't care if you offer me a hundred grand a year. I'm not happy there. I don't want to sit in that seat all day. It's boring. Don't nobody want to be there. Those people are grumpy and angry, and you know, so I knew I'm like, okay, corporate, this is not it. So and it's hard. It is it is hard to know at 18, 19, maybe even 35 to know what exactly what it is you want to do with your life. Some people are in their 50s and they are still trying to figure it out.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, that's real.
SPEAKER_00I'm just I'm I'm just they're still trying to figure it out. You know what I'm saying? Like there's folks that's still just on the fly every day not knowing where they want to go. So I just, you know, our community for sure need to do better um at you know, accepting people and accepting someone when they decide to go in a different direction or they pivot and say that wasn't for me. Because those are feelings that neither one of you um.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I think I think a lot of it was disappointing. I feel like I disappointed myself. Well, you know, it was just like, and it was just uh embarrassment and thinking, you know, when you're young and just uh not you don't know where you go, which right direction to go. You know, you just think like, you know, what are they gonna say or this or that? And like the older I got, the less I care what people think or say or do or whatever. But as a kid, you know, it was really difficult. But yeah, you're right. Putting the pressure on yourself. More people need to like embrace that and say, it's all right, you're gonna be all right still, you know. Exactly. As a as a young man, uh, especially as a young black man, because the odds are against us. Um, if you keep your general morals, you know, like you said, just having respect, being on time, knowing how to talk to people, all that can take you a lot, and keeping your record clean. Yeah, all that can take you very far in life, like just that basic stuff right there. Because I know so many people that have don't have those qualities or might have had a little ding on their record, and it just continues to haunt them the rest of the rest of their life. You know, something they did when they was 19, 20 years old, haunting them until they in their 50s.
SPEAKER_00Oh wow.
SPEAKER_02Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Okay. And okay, so can either of you share a story about a time you showed up to a house or to a business and the folks were miserable and desperate. They were hot and so hot in there they didn't know what to do. And when you left, they literally, you know, you were the hero. Well, you hero anyway, but you definitely was a hero. Did they did they treat you like a hero? Did they show you they were appreciative? Is there a time you showed up where, you know, they couldn't get an appointment? Because let's just be honest. Sometimes when you make these phone calls and you're looking for a Lance or a Dozel, they can come in two hours, right? It's by important because there's five other people ahead of you or 15 other people. So you might have to wait, you know, three, four days before they can show up. So is there a story you can share about a time where you showed up to a house or or a business and you know people are doing backflips?
SPEAKER_02I'm sorry, I don't know who you have. Oh no, go ahead. Yeah, let's go. Um, but yeah, it happens so much. I can't think of a you know uh an individual time because like I go to over a thousand houses in a year. Um, but it happens every spring and every winter and every summer. Uh I've had people break down in tears and cry and hug me, and you know, they'll give you tips and uh offer food and snacks and gift cards. I mean, so yeah, it is a good feeling to know like that you can help people out, especially like in the middle of the winter, because like air is a luxury, but heat is a necessity, even though people don't treat it like that. We're actually busier in the summer than we are in the winter. Um, but in the winter, you know, when you got people with a house full of kids or um you got to worry about their pipes freezing or stuff like that, and then when you're able to fix their heat on a nice cold day or night and get them back warm, it is a good feeling, you know.
SPEAKER_00Well, good. I'm glad they're I'm glad they're appreciative of you for sure, Don Zell.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, I've had I've definitely had several different times where I could say I've walked out and the person's been happy or trying to hug me or trying to, like Lance said, that I've tips trying to give you food, cookies, drinks. I've had I've had hungry. Here you go. I've had these people, you know, it could be late, you know, I could be on car, running an on-call, you know, service call for them, and they could be beer wine. Yeah, beer. That's all I was about to say. They'll offer beer, wine, some brand, some brand new alcohol that they just bought from overseas, and they want you to have it. And yeah, so I've I've definitely been been there and had that happen several times. Um, I'll just say I'll all the main thing I try to let customers know when I get to them, or I typically, you know, we call before we get there, we try to get a little bit of information. I always say, you know, I can't promise you anything, but I'm gonna try to do my best to make sure we get back on, you know, whether it's the AC or it's the heat. Um, and the heat more so in the winter time, I'm for sure trying to get the heat back on because it's freezing outside. They may have an infant or kids in general, um, or maybe an elderly person. So, you know, I try to do everything in my power to help get them their um system back running, but sometimes it doesn't always work out like that, you know, especially if it's during the day, um, you know, you might be able to service it and repair it, but sometimes it may not be um repairable. You may have to actually get it replaced, and then at that point, you have to give them the bad news and let them know, like, hey, we'll have to come back. But, you know, once we do, we'll make sure we get you taken care of. And nine times out of ten, they're always super appreciative. Um, when you do get it fixed, and you know, like Lance said, they're always trying to give you something for sure. That's like a regular thing. If it's not money, then they're trying to feed you or they're trying to give you something to drink.
SPEAKER_00I said that that heat coming back on and it's been off for three days, or you know, it's hot, it's like, what kind of you hungry? Here you go. What you like? You like I got some sandwiches? Listen, I understand. That's good. That's good that they appreciate um all that you do because it's I mean, it's major, you know. Uh, I mean, we're guilty of it, but your comfortability level. I know for me, like that I can't sleep when it's hot. So, you know, my comfortability level, it matters. I want to be comfortable when it's time to go to bed. So I couldn't imagine, you know, it's you know, negative four in my in my in my house and it's 10 degrees outside. So for sure. So what is the biggest myth about working in a trade that you want to completely debunk? Is there is there a myth that you hear or a myth that you think that people carry around? And not just, I mean, trades in general, but specifically yours, that you're like, no, don't believe that. That's not how that goes. Lance?
SPEAKER_02Uh, I think one of the biggest things is we get the reputation of being kind of like a shyster sometimes. You know what I mean? Like people think um, oh, those he's cooling guys, they're just coming out here to get a little bunch of money from you and those sell parts because it's because of bad technicians in the past, just like an auto mechanic or anybody else. Um, you know, a lot of times people think that all other technicians are like that, but that's not that's not true. That's you know, you have good and bad apples in every trade. Police officers, um auto mechanics, dentists, doctors, everybody. So, you know, but uh, you know, we try to show them that it's not always like that, or whatever. Um, but I think some people, not everybody has that myth or whatever, but it is definitely out there for sure.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, I was gonna say that's definitely like the I think that's the main main, I guess, myth in the sense that you can say for HVAC, that's like a major thing. Everybody always thinks you're trying to get over on them, or you're trying to sell them something else that they don't need. And nine times out of ten, that's never that's never the case. Um I I being in the install side or the install department, I don't I don't know if we really have any myths. That's really uh like I said, that's probably the main one. That's for you know both side both departments, that's for you know, kind of all around. I don't really that's probably the only myth in a sense I would say that we have. Everything else is kind of, I feel like it's either straightforward or something that needs to be explained so that the customer will better understand it, but that's about it.
SPEAKER_00Mm-hmm. And what do you say, Lance and Donzo? What do you say to those people that feel like, oh, I don't wanna, they shysters, they're crooks, they're frauds, I don't wanna, I don't wanna go with them. I'm gonna, I'm gonna just buy it and install it myself, or my brother-in-law, he knows this buddy down the way, he can guide me through what to do when I install it. Or, you know, what do you say to those people who feel like because they believe the myth that they want to try to do this themselves? Lance.
SPEAKER_03Good luck.
SPEAKER_02I've experienced it on the other side too, uh, where people try to install a thermostat or change a motor or do something, and then it costs them twice as much because they got to call somebody to come clean up their mess that they tried to fix themselves. So yeah, I just tell them if you're gonna do it, then good luck. And hopefully, and sometimes if if they're nice enough or you know, I can understand everybody could be in a financial bind or something like that. I may give them some pointers like a thermostat or something, you know, they can get at Home Depot or low. So I just tell them make sure you turn the power off first, because if they touch a couple of the wires together, they can cause a short or something like that. You know, I might give them some pointers like that. But there's certain things that I really wouldn't recommend a homeowner doing. I I don't care how uh mechanically inclined you are, it's just if you don't have the technical ability. And it could be misleading online when you see these YouTube videos and stuff like that. Um, people think they know you could you could really get down the uh go down the wrong road and get yourself in a lot of trouble. I mean, even if it may work halfway or something, it might not be working right. Or it's just good to have a professional to come in. Um, like in a heating situation, you can have uh something deadly if an exhaust pipe is not vented properly or has cracks in it or holes in it, it's almost like a car exhausting into the house. Um, so you know, you just it's good to have somebody, even if you don't do it like every year, somebody should be coming in professionally and just laying eyes on things every now and then just to make sure you're safe. I've been at people's houses not for HVAC, just visiting and I'll look around in their basement and see something. Hey man, you might want to call your maintenance people or whoever, or or I can come back and do this or whatever, you know, and just pointing stuff out to them that they'd have no clue. So if you if you I feel like you should definitely have somebody come out regularly to check things out. A professional.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, I was gonna say, yeah, that to piggyback a little bit. That preventative maintenance is one of the best things that you can ever have. Um someone coming out once a you know, twice a year really is what it is. Once in the fall, once in the spring, um, to kind of prepare you for the winter and then um prepare you for the summer for the AC season and you know, same for in the wintertime for the furnace for the heating season. Um because you can catch a lot of different things beforehand. Um you know, so that if if it is costly and you really don't have the money, we might be able to try and figure something out for you that we can do that can help you for the time being. Or you know, there's other times where, you know, we'll try to do I can't speak for every company, but I know most companies they'll do um, you know, like financing and things that way so that it'll better help you if you can't afford to, you know, pay for it in total right then and there. Um, but yeah, you uh you should always have somebody coming to check something out, um, whether it's just to make sure you're prepared for the season or to to let you know, hey, you're coming up on a little bit of a closer time to where um the life expectancy for you know this specific equipment or this specific, you know, AC or furnace is about, you know, it's about to go out or it's getting close. So if certain things start to do hap, you know, start to happen, this is the reason for that. Um but it it definitely helps for overtime and just um that way you can catch kind of catch things.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, not can I piggyback on that? Like this is something I wanted to say when you said it I just had a brain freeze when you were asking earlier uh something that people may not be not not think of, or I forget exactly what the question was. Not the myth. Like, what was one of the first questions you asked?
SPEAKER_00Um, that was customer service.
SPEAKER_02No, the after that. I'm sorry, I don't mean to make you go back and it's okay.
SPEAKER_00Just when they think yeah, they just they just think of a broken air conditioner, you know, when they think of the trade, that's the only thing they think of.
SPEAKER_02Okay, so I was gonna say one thing that's uh a proven fact is that 70% of the furnaces and air conditioners that break down are due to lack of maintenance or something that could have been caught on the you know, on the maintenance check or something like that. And it's very well proven, like since I've been doing this, people that have their stuff serviced regularly don't really have problems. Uh, but people that don't have them serviced for years and coils get dirty and filters get dirty and don't get checked and replaced, and they're very those are what we see. Like, if you're on call, that's the main cause that you see is usually maintenance items that were overlooked or just neglected for years.
SPEAKER_00So and so people should have their furnaces uh checked twice a year, and air could check twice a year.
SPEAKER_02Once for the furnace and then once for the air, so twice a year if the system itself should be checked twice a year. Yeah, okay, yeah.
SPEAKER_00That's I mean, I I don't think I've ever heard of um someone not doing that um at all. I don't think I knew that um that people actually don't get that check because that's part of like just um I guess I mean because I mean eventually at some point you're gonna have to go to the doctor, right? Right.
SPEAKER_03You know what I mean?
SPEAKER_00So I I'm I'm just like, why wouldn't they get that check? Like even if you I don't just want to get like hanging, you know, they're handling your blood pressure's a little this and that, you know. I mean, like at some point, years and years and days and days and weeks and weeks go by and you don't think to have somebody come out and and just take a look.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I'm I'm I'm going out and people I say you checked your filter, and they'll say, What filter? Like with the air conditioner, they don't even have there's not a filter. So, and it'll be filthy, dirty. I've seen filters not changed for like five years before. It's crazy. And it's full of dust and dirt, and then they'll want to like replace it with some allergy filter after having the filter in there, or they'll have a bunch of cats with full litter boxes, and then say, Oh, I don't understand why my allergies bother me so much in here.
SPEAKER_05You know, it's just crazy. I was about to say, Yeah, I've had customers call and they don't even know if the equipment is even located at all. They don't even talk about you trying to help them over the phone and you tell them where to go to the control, you'll say the control for the equipment, and or you'll say thermostat, and they don't even have a clue of what you're talking about. They'll literally ask you, is it this thing on the wall? And you not being in their home with them, you don't know what what they're talking about, but you try to help and hope that that's exactly what you're trying to get them to be able to use so that they can control the heater cooling um in their house. But yeah, a lot of customers don't even have a clue of what the equipment is at all. So that's it, and it happens a lot more than what you would think. Like you would think the majority of the world knows what's going on as far as the equipment in their house that you know that keeps them comfortable, but they don't. They only know or try to learn or become more knowledgeable about things like that when it becomes a problem for them or when it stops completely, and then they have to figure it out. That's really the only time. When it's a disruption to their life, yeah, that's the only time for the other and then they want you there like right now, like to fix it. And then they get they get super mad and angry and pissed off, and they'll try to argue with you if you can't come right away. But everybody around the world has there's always somebody else that has it just as bad as you or worse. So it's you know, it's it's more or less you need to pay attention and understand what you have in your home equipment-wise before you buy your home. That's what the best thing I'll say for that. Just that way you can never, you know, not have something checked out or looked at.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, do some preventative maintenance. So we were talking about some some young people. So if you if you have a young person that's like, man, I'm I don't I'm not really good with my hands like that, and I don't really solve problems, and I don't really, I don't really know about that. You know, they're afraid they want, they want to start, but they're you know, they're not sure that they can do it. What, you know, what advice would you give to them or what suggestion would you give to them um to say, hey, you know, you can if you want an apprenticeship process, uh apprentice start an apprenticeship or you want to own a job learning after you go to school, or if you want to be open to it, what advice would you give them, Lance?
SPEAKER_02Um, first of all, there's a lot of different, you don't have to just be a technician in this field. You can go into sales, you can go in the counter sales, um, you know, if they want to work on the phones. Um, there's a lot of different uh avenues getting into this business without you know just being a technician, an installer or a service tech. So that's the main thing I let them know is that that's good.
SPEAKER_00That's good.
SPEAKER_05I would say the same thing, kind of don't get so caught up in especially if you're not completely mechanically inclined, I guess, in a sense. I have it's funny because I always I I used to be the young guy that would be always asking certain questions and things or going up to different guys that are you know mechanical engineers or doing HVAC and just asking different questions, and you can always be in that field, but you don't have to technically be working with your hands. Like like Lance said, you could be in the office, you could be answering the phone, you can be, you know, counter sales or a salesperson. Um there's tons of different things that you can do, and it won't it'll also with you doing those different jobs and not being In the field, it still kind of helps you learn or at least keeps you knowledgeable on what the guys in the field are doing or what they're going through or what parts they have or what each part does, different things like that, where it's being picked up from, just everything across the board. There's a lot more to it than just being in the field. We have to we're just getting the equipment to either repair it, you know, replace it or install something. Um but there's other people within our job that help us get that equipment or help it be in any if it needs to be ordered or if it needs to be sold a certain way or you know, something to that extent. So yeah, definitely don't get so wrapped up in not being able to work with your hands because there's other things that you can there's other jobs that you can do in that in within HVAC or any trade um besides just being in the field.
SPEAKER_02But I think a lot of it is uh like on the service side, especially, you use your brain a lot more than your body, which can take you further in life in your later years anyway. Um so like if you get into it, it all depends on the individual. But I just recommend them to try it, or you know, if you don't like it, you can always move to something else.
SPEAKER_00I mean, and then too, what I was just gonna say is I mean, even if you're not good with your hands, who's not to say that you won't be once you get started? Right. You really don't know, you know, just try it, you know, try it, you know. If you go on the the side where you got to use your hands and your body and you feel like you're not you're not doing good, okay. Well, let me go over here to sales. I've been listening, hearing him sell it over here. And so there's options, there's room, you know, you got some spaces you can go to if you feel like you know, I'm not really good at solving puzzles and putting stuff together, but but you know what, but I can get somebody to buy a piece of mustard if I, you know what I'm saying, if you give me the opportunity, you know what I mean?
SPEAKER_05Yeah, no, I mean, and then too, as well, even if you uh don't I don't when people get so caught up in not being able to use their hands, honest, honestly, I wasn't the complete mechanically inclined with using certain tools when I first got into the trade, and I found that out. You found out found find things out when you start to do something. And I wasn't completely inclined with a lot of the tools that were used in the field. Um, there was like different types of shears and and cutting tools that you have to hold a certain way to be able to cut. And if you haven't been doing it or haven't been using those tools, you won't be inclined with that at all. So, you know, once you get into it, you know, it may discourage you when you first start, but you're learning. So once you learn and you've done it for so long, a lot of the stuff you'll be able to do in your sleep. So you become mechanically inclined. And it won't just be you at work, you'll start doing stuff around your house that you know how to do now because of what you learned at work.
SPEAKER_00So you have to start to be great. If you don't start, you never gonna you're never gonna know what you can do. You have to you have to put one foot forward to at least start. If you two could go back to when you first started um in HVAC, what advice would you give to yourself? Lance.
SPEAKER_02Um I would say invest in yourself more than you do into companies. But um that's one thing I learned. I mean, I I always invested in myself by getting a lot of training and learning, and but uh there was a point in my career, you know, especially working at a company over 20 years where I invested in myself and kind of fell for the smoke, like you know, they would tell you, you know, they would pump your head up and make you think you're the best thing since sliced bread and uh which is you know it may be true, but they only want you to go so far as far as they want you to go, you know what I mean? And um I would just say keep a mind, uh open mind to that and try to make main thing just in a nutshell, just invest in yourself, like and that doesn't mean learning. Yeah, exactly. That's what I mean by that. Not necessarily like go out and get your own business, but yeah, definitely keep learning. Um, you know, I I got like my there's this Nate certification, which there's only 40,000 technicians nationwide that have that, and there's probably a million people that do HVAC. So that sets you aside. That uh, you know, that's one thing I took a lot of pride in. I've always I'm almost had that over 20 years now, but um don't fear learning and bettering yourself. I mean, contractors license, I tried to tell, I've taken that test twice. Um, just any type of training, a lot of this newer stuff, you know, technology. It we talked about AI and all that stuff, robots and all that, but a lot of it is is coming to where you are gonna have to start really using your brain and not your hands because everything's so you know, plug and play kind of like. But um, yeah, so you definitely want to stay up on the technology and keep you know investing in yourself and learning as much as you can.
SPEAKER_00Awesome.
SPEAKER_02Don't never get too comfortable with where you are.
SPEAKER_00There you go.
SPEAKER_05There you go. Never get complacent.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_05I would say for me, I just uh wish I probably would have started off with it a lot sooner. Um I think if I would have known, you know, I I kind of knew about trades, but I didn't really know much about what a trade actually was besides what my mom did, and you know, having a cosmetology license or a barber per se. I didn't really know too many other trades besides that. I would hear what a plumber is or HVAC, but I never knew what the stuff actually meant. So um, you know, maybe if in the career centered thing for me, um we had it, but again, kind of like with Lance of Sam, like you were taken away from you know, you possibly being able to, you know, do something college prep wise for a class or to get you closer to going to college because you're going to the career center to, you know, c try and learn a trade. Um, so it's like it was like kind of a give and take. I I was never really I never really had to hear, you know, you not be you can't go to college because of it, but it would definitely hinder you from you trying to get into college because you're taken away from that with trying to learn a trade. So kind of the same thing, but I wish I would have been more interested and more um curious about it fresh out of high school or maybe while I was in school. Um, of course, I was playing football, so you know I wanted to college. Yeah, yeah. And then that's the and that's that's really the other thing. Anything that's cooler than something that you really never heard about or you're not really familiar with, is gonna be way better in your mind, or to the average young person's mind, as opposed to trying to learn something that they have no interest in, not really worried about, don't really know who does it and why it could be important, or any of that. So if you are, and when you do have that, then it kind of opens up a totally different door for you. Um, like, you know, I work with a guy that's probably about three years younger than me, about three or four years younger than me, and he knows a little bit more than me just because he learned a lot of stuff right out of high school. So he's a that just that much more, you know, ahead of me, you know, I'll say knowledgeable about things um than I am just because of how he started. Uh so if I could have, you know, went straight out of high school and jumped into HVAC, I probably would have done it knowing now what I know, you know. Um, I definitely would have tried to start like right out of after high school. It probably would have pushed me a lot further than what I am now. Um, but you know, different things happen. So, you know, I'm I'm appreciative of how everything played out. But if I had maybe like four more years before I actually started HVAC, I think I'll be a lot better off, you know, as far as knowledge and um where I'm at as far as doing HVAC.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so to those eight those listeners out there, if you're in high school or you're graduated from high school, do your research. That's what I'm hearing. Do your research, you know, check on all the trades.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I think the main thing is is like like I said, like when you're young, everything you want to be in in the in-crowd and what's cool. And like I remember I started when I was 21 years old doing this, and uh people were laughing, like, yeah, don't you do plumbing? Yeah, he a plumber or he a maintenance man, you know, because I would drive to work, man, and that used to bother me back then, but over time, you know, it didn't bother me. And then I see where they are now. The maintenance man has left them in the past. Now they're really maintenance. But now, but um, as a kid, but I just I've been thinking about getting back into this, and so it's some things I want to do, you know, upon like retiring from this trade. I'm never gonna stop doing it, but I like to give back to the community by showing kids that this is a cool thing to do. You know, I'll me and Donzel talked about getting a YouTube page and kind of just because there's a certain face you put with this too. Sometimes you think it's just some old guy, you know, smoking a cigarette, fixing the furnace. But it could be a cool young black dude too that can fix a furnace, maybe better than him, but uh than the guy with the cigarette. But um yeah, so I just I just want to kind of I'm gonna put some things together in the future, and um maybe we can come back and do a part two to just interview once we do that.
SPEAKER_00I mean, I just I mean it's important. That was one of the reasons why I wanted to do it because I'm not seeing or hearing and just used to exactly what I was thinking. Like, um, I mean, I remember hearing it in high school, I never knew what it was, but I didn't think it was something bad or something like it was something degrading, or you know, like you got to downplay what the person is doing. I never really knew exactly what all entails, but for that just people who are purely uneducated, you know what I mean? To to think like, oh no, you this and you know, you don't know the difference between electric, electric, an electrician and a plumber, you know, age recentist and a tree trimmer. That's you know, that's that's their their problem. But I just feel like I just feel like personally, that was one of the reasons why I wanted to have you both on the show because I feel like there's needs to be more respect um and notoriety bought you know brought to Detroit.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah, definitely. And they're there it's getting more popular. I saw a guy on Instagram, he has a header. If you look at some HVAC services, and he's really uh with the guys from Bring Your Leisure that do the Invest Festival down in Atlanta. And I've gone down there a couple of times, not even on that, but now that he's he's putting the more uh he's starting to shed light on the HVAC trade, and and so that's making it more popular as well. So I kind of see it, it reminds me, it likes it's like it's about to take off. And I think it might that might help, you know, to get gain more interest to people to bring it back.
SPEAKER_00I mean, because it's never it's always been around. I mean, let's just talk about it, it's never died down and went anywhere, but I just feel like it just it's the fact that trying to make it uh make it a okay thing, a cool thing to do again, to make it um more known as far as what all you can do in your life with it and where all you can go with it, and uh understanding it's not just the trade.
SPEAKER_05You could look at it further along than just the trade itself. You know, you could teach a lot of people, you could bring a lot of people together with what we do. So um I think that's what is more about trying to get back to that and letting kids know that just because it's not football or it's not social media, you're not streaming, or you know who's to say in the next 10 years or so, we'll be there'll be people that are streaming installs. Yeah. You know, streaming an install or streaming uh uh service call that they're going to to do a diagnosis. So um it's just just understanding what's going on around you, but also understanding what can go in the HVAC and what all can it can be used for and it being for the better good. Um, and that's whether you you know black or you know, white or it doesn't matter. You know, foreign, it it doesn't matter. There's it's for it's really for everybody. It's just a matter of if you want to get into it or not, and not looking at it as it needs to be cool or it needs to be if it's something that you're interested in, go for it. Don't be discouraged because you think your your best friend is gonna clown you because of something that you want to do. Because who's to say once you start doing it and then tell him about it, he might end up wanting to do it too.
SPEAKER_00Exactly. And I mean, and it and you know, to piggyback off of that for sure, it's you make you know a career out of improving other people's lives. That's that's the gist of it. You make a career, your career is improving everyone else's life. So um so glad to have you on the show. That is the end of our show today, listeners. I hope that you, I'm sure you took you have taken away more than what you thought you were going to today. Um, thank you, Lance and Donzel, for being on. Um, and definitely stay on the lookout for everyone knows that we uh uh appreciate everything that you do because you know, our comfortability and our lives, um, the elderly, the kids, the people everywhere, you're needed all over the world. So we appreciate you. You gotta be well, you gotta be at peace.