Born Fabulous
Born Fabulous
Season 3, Episode 24, Part 8: June & Jim Zoul with Melody & Bob Rupple, "From Uncertainty to Independence- It's a Journey"
What happens when the dreams you have for your children shift dramatically? June and Jim Zoll, along with Melody and Bob Ruppel, share their heartfelt stories of raising young adults with Down syndrome and the transformative role of advocates like Lisa Hotelen and organizations such as LifeWorks. Hear them recount their initial uncertainties and the pivotal moments that helped them embrace their children's aspirations for independence. Melody discusses the importance of focusing on potential positive outcomes rather than lingering fears, while June emphasizes the necessity of supporting the lives their children hope for, rather than clinging to initial visions of their future.
Ever wondered what love looks like between two people with Down syndrome? Meet Kristen and James, a truly inspirational married couple who highlight the beauty of their unique relationship. In this episode, we explore the dynamics of their marriage and the deep love they share. We also touch on the evocative lyrics of Melissa Riggio's "Love is a Potion," brought to life by Rachel Fuller's stunning musical interpretation. Don't miss this chance to be moved by the stories of the Zolls, the Ruppels, Kristen, and James. Their experiences offer invaluable insights into the challenges and triumphs of fostering independence and nurturing love in the lives of young adults with intellectual disabilities.
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Hello, my name is Greta Harrison. Welcome to Born Fabulous Podcast, season 3, episode 24. The theme of this season is young adults with intellectual disabilities living full lives of independence and interdependence. This episode features June and Jim Zoll and Melody and Bob Rupple. It is the last of eight episodes with the Zouls and the Rupples, which is part of an in-depth series about marriage featuring parents, self-advocates with support staff and an employer. Both the Zouls and the Rupples are retired and have been married for over 40 years. They are the parents of James Zoel and Kristen Rupel, who have been married over five years. James and Kristen have Down syndrome. Now please enjoy this clip. Of Love is a Potion. The lyrics are by Melissa Riggio, who was the focus of Season 1, episodes 1 through 4. The music and voice are by Rachel Fuller.
Bob Rupple:Love is everything.
Rachel Fuller:Love is all around. Love is all around. Love is a potion. Love is passion, love is devotion.
Rachel Fuller:Love is fusion. Did you have any role models ahead of you to watch? Either of you. You all mentioned somebody that I have written down. Her name Lisa.
Melody Rupple:Hotelen.
Greta Harrison:Hotelen, and you said she's written a book, so she's not just a neighbor next door.
June Zoul:No, she told me about the book. She hasn't written a book, she told me about that.
Greta Harrison:Oh, she told you about the book. Okay, she hasn't written a book. She told me about that. Oh, she told you about the book. Okay, she hasn't written a book. So is she an advocate that I might know of, or is she just somebody who lives in your area?
Melody Rupple:She worked in the social services field. I mean, she worked with my boss at one point and then she went on to community or what was it. It was Nixie, wasn't it, which was a parent support, yeah, agency. So she's been in that field and so she had started the idea of jamie, of her daughter moving out first and, uh, 16 years, and so I I think she was ahead of us in education, but really there wasn't people doing what we were doing at that time well, and we didn't know what we could or couldn't do.
Bob Rupple:We didn't know anything about it. What's this all about? How would she ever go out? What's this called Independent living, or something?
Melody Rupple:Yeah, I mean.
Bob Rupple:We went to a meeting, actually at Lisa's house, and Beth from LifeWorks was there, and together they explained to the parents this is how this could work, this is what you as parents can do, this is what the best agency can do to help you, and really that was our introduction into the brave new world.
Melody Rupple:And we are fortunate that we live in a state that has services. I can't imagine how difficult it is in other states, because it's difficult enough.
Bob Rupple:With the services, with the services.
Melody Rupple:With the services available there, it's still a whole lot of work.
Greta Harrison:Yeah, I'm sure I just wish it was a national model instead of state by state. But our education system could be like that too.
June Zoul:Yeah.
Greta Harrison:If you could talk to yourselves back when your kids were little, is there anything that you would tell yourselves then that you know now?
Melody Rupple:Well, I suppose the biggest thing. I mean when a doctor tells you your kid might not walk, talk or feed themselves, you know I mean that seems pretty. You know dim future and you know really, you just don't know, you don't know. I remember one time being in the car when kristin was in middle school and she's talking all the way home and I look at her and I go, you know, they said you might not talk.
Bob Rupple:Maybe you don't want to, occasionally, you know by this time she really understood.
Melody Rupple:She had Down syndrome and she talked about it too. You know and stuff, and so you know you have to just be open-minded to all the possibilities of what could happen, not all the bad things that might happen. I lost a whole lot of sleep that I'm sure I didn't need to. If I had one, I know. Now, you know.
Greta Harrison:I love that quote. If you know, melody, if you give me permission, I'd like to make a meme of several things that you all have said, but one of them is that quote you just said Think about all the things that could happen instead of the things that might not happen. That's great. I love that. June, do you have anything to?
June Zoul:add, I would just piggyback on that 100%. You know, I would tell my younger self to listen to the life that he's hoping for rather than the life I think he's going to have, because I never thought he would move away from me. I for some reason never entertained that idea, so when he expressed it I was in shock. So I would probably tell my younger self that, yes, he will live independently and move out and just to listen to, uh, to what the life that he wants, rather than the one that I think he's going to have.
Greta Harrison:Listen to the life that he's hoping for, instead of the life that.
June Zoul:Yeah, say that again.
Greta Harrison:Listen to the life that he's hoping for, instead of the life that yeah and say that again. Listen to the life that he's hoping for, instead of the life that you think he's going to have yeah, I love it.
June Zoul:You know, I just I had his whole adult life planned out in my head and, uh, it's not what he wanted.
Bob Rupple:Another aspect of this that I think about too is that I think a lot of people and rightly so I mean it's certainly understandable. But when you have a challenged child, I think you tend to surround your entire life around that child and it begins to inform your life and your family. And I know what. We had Kristen. We had Nicole already, of course, but we had Kristen. The other two weren't there yet and when Kristen was born, you know, at the time it was we're going to have a disabled child and we became a disabled family and that kind of defined our family and people even at work and stuff would say, oh yeah, he's got a disabled child, you know. And that became sort of the definition of our family and we thought the rest of our lives might be that.
Bob Rupple:And I know other people that it had and that determined the rest of their lives. And I know other people that it had and that determined the rest of their lives when we had Lisa and Kaylee. That kind of normalized our life again. And I'm not my point of this isn't to say, go out and have a lot of kids but all of a sudden we felt like, okay, we're not a disabled family, we're a normal family with a child with Down syndrome and that flips it on its ear. Because if the parents continue to follow their dreams and have a normal life and a normal family, of which this child with the Down syndrome is part of, that's what's going to be best for the child, because it's all that modeling that we're talking about, and that's what's going to be best for the parents, because they're taking their child along with them on their dreams.
Bob Rupple:It can be really easy to sort of fall into this thing that everything in your life now is down syndrome, and I think it's important and this is what I tell my younger self too to not bury yourself in that. You can be involved in it as much as you want, but do your normal life and include your yourself in that. You can be involved in it as much as you want, but do your normal life and include your child in that Wow Very profound today.
Greta Harrison:I love it.
June Zoul:That was so. That was so well said, bob. I appreciate that I appreciate that.
Greta Harrison:That really was. Everything you've said is going to be turned into memes. I'm telling you all it's all, it's all great, I love it. Is there anything left to share that I have not asked that you want to share?
Melody Rupple:I will tell you. When I asked Kristen about I'm going on a podcast, I'm going Kristen, do you want to do a podcast? And she looks at me and she goes I'm fine with being famous. And then she lays her hand on my shoulder and she goes you are so lucky you had me, because now you could be famous too. I love that. I laughed for a week. You're so lucky you had me.
June Zoul:Full circle.
Greta Harrison:See, I cannot wait to meet these two because I can tell they are going to be a trip, and I love that. I just love that. I do want you to know and set her up. I don't think this is going to make her famous, but I will tell you. What makes me happy is and I don't even know if I told June this or not Radford University uses my podcast when they're training special educators. And I'm talking to a couple of other people because I mean, I know that this is not going to make me famous. That's not why I'm trying to do this. I'm trying to make a dent, and so I'm trying to talk to other universities as well, because if we can help that next generation of teachers be better, that's a win-win for everybody, right? So they use season one and part of season two to talk about scenarios, and I've got this on my website.
Greta Harrison:Radford University is and people don't know this, but in the country it's one of the founding little hubs of inclusion, even though Virginia is pretty backwards. Radford is where Educating Peter was filmed back in 1992 by HBO. They have been including students fully since 1992. And that's not well actually since before that. That's just not very common around the country and they still have a lot to be modeled. There's a professor there who has founded the Center for Inclusive Practices for the State of Virginia. I mean she could have retired, but she knows there's so much work to do I don't know if she's ever going to retire.
Greta Harrison:So if we can, if this can get out to little pockets like that and help, that's what makes me happy. What makes me happy. It makes me happy that I haven't had a new episode since 2000 and since 2020, but I still have the same number of listeners every week and I haven't had a new episode. So that means that there are new listeners every week, which makes me happy. But I'm not Julia Dreyfuss from Seinfeld, who has millions and millions of listeners, you know. And or Rob Lowe I love Rob Lowe's pocket, but I, you know, it's not that it's not. But if she feels famous, if she feels special, yeah, I think they've just.
Melody Rupple:That's great. We've been exposed to enough, uh films and things things and uh, they've gotten to meet. Uh, what's that actor's? Name they met sean right yeah yeah, they met sean, those kinds of things. Plus kristen's always been that I mean she's always been putting on a show and, you know, being the first in drama class to volunteer, and I mean I don't know, not like me at all. So she has always had that comes from Bob's side of the family, that gene to be an entertainer, and so, yeah, she just really cracked me up.
Greta Harrison:This is great. That's very cute you know, I'm gonna pick, I'm gonna pick things well it was.
Melody Rupple:It was a pretty special clip yeah I was thinking about one thing I didn't say when kristin left middle school. There were so many parents that came up to us at graduation to thank us that their children were better people because they grew up with Krista. Yeah, yeah.
Jim Zoul:Amen.
Melody Rupple:Amen, and there were many more of those parents than parents that complained yeah.
Greta Harrison:I love that. That's powerful because inclusion is two way, it's not one way, right, and that's what led to the great employer James has. You know, my daughter's great boss is only 39. And she told me that she grew up um riding the bus with somebody who has Down syndrome and she has a very large family and she has several kids already and she thought she was going to have a child with Down syndrome, either adopting or having. So when Yazzie started working with her, it was like full circle, you know, and that's the more that we have people included in society, the more full circles there will be like that. Yeah, just, I love that. But I love that. I love that extra clip you just gave me. Thank you.
June Zoul:Just thank you for your work, Greta I. I just know that all of this is very time consuming and you've given such a large part of your life to making new parents, other parents' lives better, so kudos to you.
Greta Harrison:Well, thank you, June. I appreciate that. I love talking to people like you. I love this. This is, this is such a joy. I love it, thank you for involving us. Thank you, I you know we're going to meet someday. I've already been out there once recently. So we're going to meet someday. I'm sure of it, because I haven't hit San Diego yet, so I know we will.
Bob Rupple:But it's the best place to hit, so you're saving the best for last.
Greta Harrison:That's right. I'm going to remember that piece of advice too. That was very smart of you all with your wedding.
Melody Rupple:That was very smart.
Greta Harrison:So I look forward to talking to your children next your adult children, but they're still your children. I look forward to talking to them next. So I want to thank you so much for your time and your wisdom, your willingness to share and open yourselves up. This has been a true joy, so I thank you so much, thank you.
June Zoul:You're welcome. Thank you for having us.
Greta Harrison:Thank you. Thank you for listening to episode 24 of Born Fabulous podcast, third season. I hope you enjoyed the entire series of episodes with the Zoels and the Rupels. Having both families on the same page is important to the success and support of a married couple who have intellectual disabilities. I am forever grateful for their time, honesty and wisdom. I do have some clarifications and an update. While Radford University is a wonderful inclusive partner in many ways, it is the Montgomery County Virginia school system that was featured in Educating Peter. That school system has been a shining example of inclusive practices for many decades and can still be modeled for many things to this day. I mentioned a professor at Radford University who has been a tremendous inclusion champion in Virginia as well as nationally. She is Dr Liz Alteri. She recently did retire. I and so many are grateful for the tremendous difference that she made for so many Short video clips from most episodes are available on our YouTube channel and on BornFabulousPodcastcom.
Greta Harrison:You can also hear all released episodes of Born Fabulous Podcast on YouTube. Now, in episode 25, you will meet Kristen and and james oh, the wonderful married couple we have been talking about for eight episodes. Kristin and james have down syndrome. Please follow and like us on facebook, instagram, twitter and threads. If you enjoyed this episode, I'd be honored if you would leave a review wherever you heard this podcast. Now, please enjoy this clip. Of Love is a Potion. The lyrics are by Melissa Riggio, who was the focus of season one, episodes one through four. The music and voice are by Rachel Fuller. Love does not tear apart.
June Zoul:Love is a potion, love is passion. Love never fails. Love's emotion In motion.