The Offseason Blueprint: Building Culture, Talent, and Toughness

With the season in the rearview, the real work begins. In Episode 94, Coach Curley pulls back the curtain on how Juniata Basketball is built in the offseason—from recruiting strategy and roster construction to player development and culture-setting. The guys dive into what actually leads to wins, how roles take shape, and why the offseason is where championship teams are made. Plus, a look at the transfer portal, evolving college basketball dynamics, and a few ideas for a certain Juniata cruise that may or may not happen.

Transcript

Cold Open: 150 Years, 100 Episodes

SPEAKER_01 0:00

This is Americ Studios Podcast this week on the Junietta Men's Basketball Show. It's actually the 150th anniversary of Junietta this year, so that there's a celebration on campus next week for that.

SPEAKER_02 0:13

150th anniversary, and we're gonna have our hundredth episode this year. I think somehow they should collide into one thing. Yeah. We're getting close, by the way. We got to plan it out, man. I mean, we're in the 90s right now. All right, we gotta put our getting awful close. It's gonna happen this summer, likely. I'm Tom Frank. I'm Biz. I'm the head coach Greg Curly. And this is your Junior Atta men's basketball show. Welcome,

Welcome Back. Three Champions Crowned.

SPEAKER_02 0:39

listeners. I'm Tom Frank, and I'm joined each and every week by Drew Basket, aka Biz, and your Junioretta head basketball coach, Greg Curley. As we talk all things, Junietta men's college basketball. Fellas, I feel a little lost right now with no college basketball. I know, man. And we're done. We're done on all levels. Yeah, I I I guess we'll just end the episode right now. All right, hey, thanks for coming. It was nice to be able to do that.

SPEAKER_01 1:05

We set up the rest of this biz good.

SPEAKER_02 1:07

We got Hey, I do need to know your thoughts, though. We did have three champions crowned, D1, D2, and D three. We had the Michigan Wolverines, D1. That's hard to root for Michigan.

SPEAKER_01 1:20

Well, we our house was rooting for that because uh Caden Curley had Michigan picked in all his brackets.

SPEAKER_02 1:26

All right, well, that gives you a reason.

SPEAKER_01 1:28

He won in the egg family, he won the egg family pool and he won the Curly Fanley pool, so he was pumped up. So he was fired up. Yeah, it was a big deal.

SPEAKER_02 1:36

I don't know. It was a toss-up, right? Connecticut? I don't know if I can root for Connecticut

Dan Hurley, Superstitions, and What You See Is What You Get

SPEAKER_02 1:40

too. What do we think about Dan Hurley? I like him. He's old school. Do you? Yeah. I'm I I go back and forth on him.

SPEAKER_01 1:48

He's a heck of his coach, a heck of a coach. The guys that play for him love him. Uh the rest, I mean, is what it is. There's a lot of guys that are polished and everybody loves, but behind the scenes they may not be uh probably as uh true to form as I think he is. I think what you see is what you get. Uh but you know, he's a little bit of a mad scientist. Is he too much?

SPEAKER_02 2:10

Is he too much with the superstitions, though? That's all I kept seeing. All the superstitions. Made his wife go back to the hotel room because he forgot his little bracelet or whatever. All this crap that he does. Hey man. Two national championships in uh three final games in four years. I suppose superstitions aren't bad. Carly, how do you feel about superstitions? Do you or do you get into superstitions?

SPEAKER_01 2:32

Yeah, do you do anything? I mean, I have some, uh not as much as I used to have. I mean, I think sometimes those are some first weird world problems. If you're at your third national championship and you can send X home to get it, you know, or riding in the bus doing whatever, you're you're out of luck with that stuff, man. So I I think uh, but I've had my share at times.

SPEAKER_02 2:51

All right, give us the good.

SPEAKER_01 2:52

If something sticks or works, what's that?

SPEAKER_02 2:54

Give us give us your best super.

SPEAKER_01 2:56

I'm not I'm not close to early level, but I mean it would be the same old, like if things are working, you're gonna wear the same outfit or same dress in the same order, eat the same stuff. I try to, I mean, eat the same stuff every day, every game day.

SPEAKER_02 3:12

I was never, I don't think I was ever that. That's a little weird, you gotta admit that. I mean, underwear.

SPEAKER_01 3:17

I bet you more guys do that than you think.

SPEAKER_03 3:20

Maybe.

SPEAKER_01 3:21

You know how it is too. The media's gotta grab something, they gotta create stories, storylines, and he's he gives them enough. He he keeps them going, man. He's got a good way to keep UConn and himself in the uh uh mainstream media and and people see him, so I think it's it's sort of smart, but I think the nuts and bolts of it in the end, the you know, the team's super well coached, they play really hard, they play hard for him. He clearly pours a lot into those guys, they know he cares about them. And yeah, I mean, uh yeah, it was a really good Final Four. I mean, the the NIL transfer portal stuff's kicking in, and I just think it's kind of the top level. The teams that have the haves and have nots are pretty clear. And there's a group that's got super talent, but uh the the depth of talent right now at that top level and the quality of basketball is as good as it's been in a l in a long time.

SPEAKER_02 4:05

There's a lot of fresh. I think that's worked. A lot of good freshmen coming out this year.

Lottery Balls, Wizards Hope, and a Call to the NBA

SPEAKER_02 4:09

Yeah, there are. As a as a Wizards fan, I'm very excited about this. Yeah, what are you getting? Who are you getting, Wizard Boy? I think I want the guy from BY. What are you picking first or what? Well, they we don't know yet. We gotta get we gotta get to the lottery. You gotta which, you know, I put in a call at the NBA office because I have some connections there. Because I I wanna I I said this year I want to see with my own eyes the lottery balls. Because I I'm not so sure they don't fix this every year. I mean, it wouldn't surprise me. Now I'm gonna get a lot of pushback for that statement because uh, you know.

SPEAKER_01 4:42

Yeah, I mean, if anybody, well, you might be it for any tickets or any perks you get when you say that.

SPEAKER_02 4:46

We've

Gannon, Mary Washington, and the PA Pipeline

SPEAKER_02 4:47

had a lot of marks, so I'm I'm not gonna go any further with that. In our D2 and D3, we had Gannon and Mary Washington, but I don't know anything about Gannon. I think you pick Mary Washington? Yes. I don't recall. Yeah, that was the uh the what is Mary Washington? How does that have a close tie to state college PA? And how do they have a tie to State College PA? One Chris Suke Campbell at the You're right, you're right. I think he props for Washington history. That's right, you're right. And Gannon's a PA school, right? Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:17

Is Gannon? Yeah. Engineering, and there's a lot of connections there, particularly Coach Hager. He's from the District 10 area, and so knows the guys that were there. They're they run, which is like a uh kind of the system, the D2. So Nova is. Gannon runs this. Gannon ran it. Their previous coach, Jordan Fee, had left. Now he's the head coach at Lamar. And so this was his assistant. And uh Nova Southeastern, he was in the final four as well, as one of multiple national championships. The head coach used to be at West Liberty. Uh they kind of have a pressing, shooting threes kind of system, and uh it's really worked well well at that level. Um, and one of the guys, their point guard, Pace Prosser, who I think was first team all league, is a bit of the knowledge here. Well, uh there's some connections. He's a Pennsylvania guy, he's not too far away. His dad had played at Grove City, but we actually recruited him the Junietta 25, you know, when I was an assistant. And so there's a lot of connections. We know a lot of the guys. Um, and so uh kind of followed that one closely. And then Mary Washington, uh obviously a uh Virginia school um guy named Marcus Kahn is the head coach there. He used to coach at Pick Greensburg and then he was at Cabrini, and now he's there. Um and that's a very, very because Cabrini is no more, right? Cabrini is no more. Now he left before that, but he actually went to national finals at Cabrini as well. But Mary Washington, Christopher Newport, and Virginia Wesland are actually state schools in Virginia, so they have some built-in advantages. It would be analogous to IUP being a Division III school in Pennsylvania.

SPEAKER_02 6:51

Oh yeah, that's kind of interesting now that you say that, because there's not a lot of state schools that are D3, right?

SPEAKER_01 6:56

Correct. So there's, and it's a very nice school school. It's a good school. Interesting. But located right there in Northern Virginia. You know, there's I just saw something, you know, there's haves and have nots at all level. And and they would be those few programs have some distinct advantages where they can draw from, uh, the quality of basketball in those areas, and then the access they have to all students because of Virginia State tuition, and then any of the Virginia State grants can be it's a it's a big advantage, but you got to take it, you know, you got to do the work to provide uh to take advantage of those opportunities. They've certainly done that. But Kai Robinson, whose brother plays at Hood, um, he was a sophomore for him. I think he's probably national player of the year. You know, they had three guys, I think, or at least two go in the portal like midnight the night after winning the national championship. Wait, who did? Mary Washington? Mary Washington did, because they were sophomores. Like Kai Robinson, who was their best player as if only a sophomore. Yeah, and they had one

Every Division, One City. Indy Nailed It.

SPEAKER_01 7:52

other guy that that won in the portal as well. Um but the cool thing this year is they so they they had all the national championships at the final four. So they started. What's my next question?

SPEAKER_02 8:03

All of them were in Indianapolis. See, that's what it needs to be.

SPEAKER_01 8:06

It's the best idea ever. And so they play, I believe, Sunday. Now they drag it. So like you play basically the final four games the weekend before, and then you go and just play the championship, but they're like consecutively. So you you can go watch the division three and then division two uh national championship on Sunday and then watch the the uh division one off that off day. It's a great idea. And Indianapolis is the perfect city to do it because they have uh the facilities. Uh, if you've been there, uh all the major uh facilities are right next to each other, so you can easily do it and pull people in. So uh it was really cool to see from what I've heard from people that were there. I did not go to the final four this year, but a lot of guys went that it was really cool, super easy to go see, uh, created a lot of excitement. And so congrats to those teams. I mean, it's a heck of an accomplishment for sure.

SPEAKER_02 8:54

So wait a minute, you if you got a ticket for the final four, you get so sat you went Saturday to the actual Division I Final Four, then you went to these games on Sunday, and then you could go to the championship on Monday?

SPEAKER_01 9:05

Uh well, they're different tickets, but they I think they play where the Pacers they played the Division II and III Pacers, and then they claimed the Division I All-Star team game, so they do it that way. I am gonna check, I know, I know Caffid played Mary Washington the last two years. I'm not so sure if that's not one of their losses, but I don't want to misspeak, so I want to check that out.

SPEAKER_02 9:27

You want to do some actually time, just say it. Yeah, I just if you say it with confidence, people believe you. Yeah, I don't want to. So now is there uh while you're looking that up there, Coach uh like do they have one double A or whatever the hell it would be in uh basketball like they do in football?

SPEAKER_03 9:43

No, I don't think they have.

SPEAKER_01 9:44

So there's only Division one, two, and three um in basketball.

SPEAKER_02 9:50

Now, Biz, I did also notice I don't normally root for the Royals of Scranton, but I did see that they I I kind of wanted to see them win the uh Yeah, that was the tough one. That was the tough one. They lost to Denison for the D3 girls' championship.

SPEAKER_03 10:09

I was rooting for.

SPEAKER_02 10:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:11

I mean, I did I I I I'm glad I checked with actually Cat Catholic lost by six this year to uh Mary Washington. I believe they beat him last year, so to just give you an idea where it landed. I'm glad you I'm glad you double checked yourself.

Listener Question: The One Off-Season Thing That Wins Games

SPEAKER_03 10:26

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:27

At least somebody does.

SPEAKER_03 10:28

Yeah, every once in a while. We got an interesting listener question today. Yeah, what do we got?

SPEAKER_02 10:35

And it it's it's from Mary T, which I don't know if that has any relation to Mary Washington, but Mary T. What's one thing players do in the off-season? We're in the offseason. We're we're we're deep into the offseason at this point. Yeah. What's one thing players do in the off-season that actually leads to more wins during the season?

SPEAKER_03 10:57

If you can pin down one thing. One thing. One thing.

SPEAKER_01 11:03

It's the individual development, but it's it's it's the skill work, it's the strength and conditioning. Which one is it though? Is it the skill work? Is it the strength? It depends on the individual. Huh? It depends on who you are. I mean, there's even part of it with guys in this age group, it's just another year older, right? Uh just another year of maturity. Um, I think sometimes guys get a little farther into their uh college career, they have a better understanding of things. Life's coming, so that they tend to have to know that, you know, they you know, talking to some of our guys, what internships are you getting? What's the next step with this? How is that setting you up? They start to get more career focused and locked in on those things, and that just has a way of maturing you. And I think that's a big part of it, the stacked experience you have. But the off-season itself is just gonna be, you know, some guys the most important thing is to get healthy, some guys the most important thing is to get bigger and stronger, some guys the most important thing is to get skilled, more skilled, or get a left, you know, improve their left hand or weak hand. So we have those meetings. We talk to guys about specifics that they need to work on, and we're trying to work on that. We are as a group right now. Our guys are are doing strength conditioning four days a week, and then they'll do three days a week to play, and two days a week they do uh skill stuff as a group. So we're off and running and and into it. I think we're probably about what five and a half months away from our first practice.

SPEAKER_02 12:25

Wowzers. Five and a half months away. How do you answer that question for yourself? What's the one thing you you you can do to lead to more wins next year? I can improve my golf handicap. Perhaps hit the gym a little. I mean, what are you doing to get better this offseason?

SPEAKER_03 12:42

Let's get it.

SPEAKER_02 12:43

Yeah, I mean you know, I mean, uh gym, a little strength training this year, didn't do the strength training last year, so although the hamstring's bot. I'm gonna go the opposite. I'm gonna I'm gonna get away from the strength training, and I need more endurance. Yeah, endurance is big. I need more endurance. Yeah, the old hammy's hurting, man. I yeah, I got issues. Breaking down 53, man. I know. I turned 53 in less well, in about a month.

SPEAKER_01 13:13

Yeah.

unknown 13:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 13:14

What are you?

SPEAKER_03 13:14

Are you 50 yet, Curly? I'm still younger than you guys, though. Yeah, I know. Always will be. Always will be. He was an advanced youth.

SPEAKER_02 13:25

Well, we got no games, we got no crowds. What uh can we talk recruiting? Like what we got no box scores. Yeah, I think we need to,

Recruiting: One Decision From a Finished Class

SPEAKER_02 13:34

because right, this is an important stretch. We got recruiting, we got building culture, we got developing players. Let's start with a little recruiting. Well, what are we allowed to talk about?

SPEAKER_01 13:44

Well, right now I don't, I mean, we won't share the recruiting class. I'm not sure where what we could technically do. We have so uh we're we're we're still finishing the class. We actually probably have one. You still you don't have your whole class at this point. Well, we we are basically done. We have one decision we're waiting on. And now that one decision, it may trigger if we get other decisions. Yes. So if we get them, you know, that that probably just because where we are in roster construction and roster numbers, that probably finishes the class. If we do not get the answer we want, then we may or may not take somebody else that fits uh positional needs. So I mean we're we're but we're effectively done. Hopefully everything's wrapped up in the next two days and we'll be ready to go. We're we're spending again, our guys are working on that stuff end of the year here. Most important things they finish academically. But then we'll start to transition, have our end of the year meetings and transition to our summer program. And that's when we'll bring in uh we'll bring in our incoming first year guys to get them started on our program, basically aligned to the Monday after graduation here. So we're that's not very far away. So in about a week.

SPEAKER_02 14:54

So you'll bring your guys in, like almost like a uh mini kit new student acceptance something or other. No.

SPEAKER_01 15:02

So we'll zoom in camp or what we'll do is we'll just get them started on our so all our stuff will be on video. So whatever we send skill-wise, like all the workouts are broken down and there's video that's attached. All our strength conditioning stuff, there's video attached. Our conditioning workouts will be sent out. So they'll have the full pack the off-season development program. And what we'll do is we'll zoom with those guys before the Monday after graduation. But Monday after graduation is when everybody in the programs gets on the same page and starts in our summer program. We will go, so we'll go basically until May 1st. We have about two more weeks, uh, a little bit more, I guess three weeks, with our spring program on campus. And then there'll be a two-week break period built in. Um, and that's where we build them at the break. Then we'll go through the summer, have another two-week break period before we come back. And believe it or not, you guys know how that goes. We'll be here in September. We'll basically have six weeks, August and September, and and we'll start practice hopefully around October 1st.

SPEAKER_02 15:53

So it's it how does it work? Like Biz and I are kind of going through this right now. Biz, you got a senior in high school. I got a senior in high school. We went to Student Acceptance Day at West Virginia last weekend. Is that what we're doing? West Virginia? That's that West Virginia is the official uh thing. All right, man. Let's go. Yeah. Oh, yeah, you're close. You're not that far. That's exciting. So we went to show from West Virginia. What happened? Does your crew have a choice? Uh we're down to Duquesne and Ohio University. All right. Hmm. I think I'm rooting for the Bobcats. Yeah, you know, I went, I I took her to uh Ohio to check it out. It's a nice campus. I like it. Very nice campus. I've been there. Cool town. It's like the campus is like right in town. It's cool. I liked it. Yeah. City school versus like a college atmosphere type of thing. We'll see.

SPEAKER_03 16:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 16:51

All right. So we're

Onboarding Freshmen: Camps, Roommates, Group Texts

SPEAKER_02 16:52

both, we have acceptance day, we got orientation days. When when these new freshmen come in, do you meet with them when they come on campus?

SPEAKER_01 17:01

Yeah. So what we actually try to do is so they'll go through kind of the academic onboarding. And so that's what every student would do, the same stuff you guys are going through. But that would be they would come in, do an orientation. They might do what what uh uh what we call an inbound program. So you can come in and do different activities. Like you get whitewater rafting, you might do sports, you might come in and do, and they're different kind of affinity groups, and then it's just a way to get to know each other, create relationships. What we'll actually do is so we run our team camp the second week in June, and we run our day camp the first week in August. And so we try to have guys come back and work those camps. We need for them to do it anyway. They get paid, they come work camp, but we try to have our incoming guys come to those and our returners come. So that's kind of how we use it as an informal orientation. We've done that for several years now with a lot of success. So the real, I mean, they're gonna come and work team camp and hang out for two days, play at night. We'll have them room with different guys and so they get to know people. Good idea.

SPEAKER_03 17:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 17:57

It's really helped. And, you know, as easily as guys can stay in touch now. A lot of them are already doing the legwork. So there's a group text with the incoming guys, just getting them up to speed, we getting paperwork to work camps and all those kind of things. So they'll they'll you know start to reach out to each other through social media channels and stuff. And our our uh returning guys, once we start having the end of your meetings, they'll pull them into all of their stuff, you know, whatever group, you know, groups they have in any social media channels, and then kind of gets them going. But it's really helped in the sense that they get here in the fall and they already know people. Now, one of the challenges a little bit is the first, their first and strongest relationships tend to be basketball players.

SPEAKER_03 18:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:37

And that can be a little bit limiting. Where before, like the first introduction to campus may have not been, you know, the guys you're gonna play with, it's other people, and that sort of broadens some uh campus relationships and you know that stuff. So we kind of have to reverse engineer that a little bit. But in terms of like academic success, success with roommates, retention, just comfort for guys coming in, it's been a huge deal. And it's you know, the it's about the players more than anything, and those are the most important relationships, and so we want to try to um you know get those going as as quickly as possible. And so that's how we'll work the summer and go through that. And then when they're here on campus, if we're around, we'll we'll we'll catch up with them, like we'll text them to see if they need anything or whatever. But a lot of times we tell them, hey, you're here to be a student, so just do whatever you need to do. If you need us, let us know. And it's a summer because a lot of those kind of sit right in the middle of our biggest recruiting period. So Nick and I may not even be able to be here because we have to go recruit. So we we try to give them a couple options, but have kind of a basketball specific and then let them be students because that's part of being a student athlete at this level. And they need to understand and come and be a part of that and go meet with their advisors and go through the scheduling and and just be another student and create those relationships without kind of that connection. Uh, and uh we've seen that. I think it's been really beneficial to the guys coming in our program.

SPEAKER_02 19:58

We need to get get in on this team camp thing. I mean, you know, we don't get invited. You guys want to come in and officiate? We don't we don't get we don't get invited, we we don't get t-shirts. I mean, we we should be getting all this stuff. I mean, I got a t-shirt. Uh huh. I'm still wearing a sweatshirt from years ago. You Ed Mansberger Alumni Classics t-shirts. What the hell are you doing? That's true. That's true. Come on. So do the do the player, the incoming freshmen, do they end up uh rooming with each other or do they end up with roommates that are not in the basketball program?

SPEAKER_01 20:30

So we give them their choice. Uh, we let them decide what they want to do. I would say 95% of them want to room with another basketball player. I think that's where their comfort zone is.

SPEAKER_03 20:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 20:39

Uh sometimes we've had guys come in and you know, they might have known somebody from high school coming here or have a previous relationship. But so that's that's what we'll do. The hard part is if we have an odd number of incoming players, depending on whether they're gonna have triples or those kind of things, like we try to go in order of the deposit. So it's kind of random. Whoever deposited first and you want a roommate, you'll get one and go in that order. A couple of guys coming in this year um have some pre-existing relationships. So a couple of guys played AAU or knew each other before. So um, we'll try. If if they got have guys they note they want to room with, we'll do that. But there have been times when we've like we've had high school teammates or something, and we've kind of said, why don't we break you guys up? Um, you know, because you've known each other forever, it'd be good for you to get to know other guys and you can always kind of move back in. But we want to create as many, you know, we want to use it also for to strengthen the team and create relationships and have those opportunities and not kind of burrow into who we already know. So yeah, we'll work we're working through all that stuff right now. It's kind of an amazing, cool thing. I mean, the thing about a college campus is it never changes, you know, you just keep rolling. It's actually the 150th anniversary of Junietta this year, so that there's a celebration on campus next week for the year.

SPEAKER_02 21:48

Hundredth anniversary, and we're gonna have our hundredth episode this year. Well, I think somehow they should collide into one thing. Yeah. We're getting close, by the way. We gotta plan it out, man. I mean we're in the knees right now. Alright, we gotta we gotta put our getting awful close. It's gonna happen this summer, likely. So how many how many guys are coming in? Minus the one you're kinda waiting for.

SPEAKER_01 22:12

Well, we'll we're gonna wait and see here who else we get. So I I don't wanna we're not a hundred percent sure yet. Deposits have to be

Talent vs. Culture: 35 a Game and a Bad Attitude

SPEAKER_01 22:19

in, so kids, put those deposits in.

SPEAKER_02 22:22

What if what if you get some guy out of nowhere? Like he was you weren't expecting him. He's a guy that you're like, holy shit, this guy is a talent. Like, do you make room for somebody like that?

SPEAKER_03 22:35

Or is it more about your limit?

SPEAKER_01 22:38

I mean, there's gotta be a blend. It depends where you are, what's going on. You know, you can only take so many guys, but we'd be naive to say that you know, talent trumps a lot, you know, and particularly like talent that's high character and focused academically and you know, well-rounded and checks all the boxes. I mean, it's a hard point.

SPEAKER_02 22:56

What if he's an absolute jerk? Well, like we try not to play in Spain, averaged 35 points in high school a game. So he's playing. For some reason, his family's moving here and he's like, I want to come to Juniad and make room for him.

SPEAKER_01 23:11

Uh I mean you know, so we Absolutely not. I mean, I don't want to have absolutes, but if we know the kid's a jerk and there's characters 35 a game, maybe he throws in 20 rebounds.

SPEAKER_02 23:20

Yeah, in D1. He's 6'3, but but he like I mean, just can jump through the root the roof of the gym.

SPEAKER_01 23:30

Well, I mean, there's a process we would try to get to know him. I mean, and we're gonna make decisions. Hey, it's a real simple thing. What do we think is the right number? Who are the right people? What's the right mix for the program to move forward? And that's not always the same answer. It's part of the art, not the science to what we're doing. It's one of the challenges, one of our growth, the challenge of our growth here the last two years is we keep going, we keep adding guys, and we have to to keep going. The guys that are juniors and sophomores now are gonna graduate. You got to have other guys and you got to keep going. So it's part of an adjustment to college. The guys that have been around understand and get it. It's and I don't, I, you know, some it's an unfortunate, it's not unfortunate. It's the competitive nature of it, it's the point. It's it's the whole thing. So we're always looking to try to improve. I tell the guys all the time there's two ways to do that. Help and we get better and we recruit. Those are two parts of it. So we want to recruit and develop all the time. But yeah, you have to, I mean, you know, it's not talent acquisition, it's building a team. But sometimes that doesn't mean like day one, you come in a ready-made team. Sometimes it takes a vision to see how this goes together down the road. There's different moments where you tolerate more risk than others. I mean, you guys are in that world and Tom, you run a business, you know how it is. You're gonna, you gotta, you gotta measure that against both things and what's appropriate and what's not. And so we spend a lot of time, actually, a lot of time talking about that, particularly the stage we're in, what's the right number? Where are we? We will carry a fair amount of guys. We're open with guys about that. The guys that are in our program know, the guys coming in know. So we're we try to be as open as honest as we can. But the the number one thing is that we improve. Like you said, how do we get better next year? Um, you know, we need to be back in the championship mix. We need to be on a championship level. We need to compete, be competing again for those championships. And so we're gonna make every decision we can all the time. The number one thing is the guys we have. You know, you got to recruit the guys you have too. So we the guys we have are putting the work in and go and know where they're going. We're we're excited, we're having a very good spring. Um, you're seeing the growth in a lot of guys in a lot of places. Uh, I think kind of the buy-in belief and and kind of process is is there. It really reflects our most successful teams. But uh, you guys know we have some holes, we have to get better. We can fill some of those internally, and we have to fill some of those with guys coming in. Um, we you know, guys don't come in to watch. I tell the guys that, and time serve doesn't count. So like you might be here, but uh we've got to, you know, and I just tell guys that's the way it works, the whole thing. Like, guys aren't coming to watch, and time served that doesn't count, but guys coming in have to understand that this thing was here before them, and they need to come in with an earnest mindset, and they need to understand that uh, you know, you've got to come and help join the group. You gotta come to us, we can't go to you, and that's because there's a whole team here waiting. And so we got to go through that process again.

Time Served Doesn't Count

SPEAKER_01 26:24

When we the season, that was one of the things I talked about. Like we made a lot of progress, we got a lot better. You know, we've won seven of our last 12 games in an exceptionally good league. Like regionally, it was the best league in the region. We beat two top 25 teams. We we did all those things, but we have to do it all again next year. You have to go through the process every year, and you have to be humble enough to do that. And what helps though is experience, right? Guys recognize how it needs to go. It's a little, it doesn't take as long to get certain places. You should get there much more quickly. But I think kind of integrating talent, and you see it at all levels at all programs is part of the deal. And we want to have a highly competitive culture. And so to say if the guy was a knucklehead, we we we wouldn't take him. And there's been guys we haven't taken because of that. But if the guy's a high-level player, yeah, we do our best to try to make room for those guys. Um, that's what our job is and what we need to do. And we try to do it as fair as we can. Unfortunately, you guys know how it goes in this this kind of business and these kind of things is as hard as you try and you try to overcommunicate. It's, you know, you're dealing with young people with dreams and hopes and um that's put a lot of work into it and are high character guys. And in terms of playing time and role, it can't always match what you hope, right? But you can always have a great experience, but sometimes that comes down to choice and what you want and what really matters to you. And we're really proud of the experiences of all our guys have had and the value they bring. And for us, I always tell guys, like, it's really more about you, what you're willing, what you want there. They all really matter to us, and you guys have known that. The guys that have played for us that have had significant on-the-floor roles, and guys that may be a little bit more behind the scenes, but you know, in meeting those guys how how integral they are to what we've done and what we do. You know, you need it takes all guys, there's three basic roles we talk about, a rotation guy, an as-needed guy, and a guy's job is to make us better every day. All of those things come with challenges, and all are exceptionally valuable. The best teams have guys hitting, doing well in all those areas. That doesn't mean they're necessarily happy all the time. They're doing well in all those things. They have the character, they have the commitment to each other. Um, and they they they committed to the group. But then, you know, you get to an end of the year, you got to reset and decide you want to do that again, right? That's the the eternal process, and that's fair. And uh, we really want to put guys in the best position uh for them to be successful. But playing a team sport takes sacrifice. It's you gotta, it's hard, it's sacrifice, and you're not guaranteed. When when when do some of those decisions get made?

SPEAKER_02 28:51

As in, you know, you got guys, every guy who comes into your program was probably a great player at whatever, wherever they came from, right? They they wouldn't be in this position if they weren't the guy potentially at their high school. And so they're coming in, they want to compete, they want to be the guy who's starting, who's who's getting balls in the hands. At what point in the season, or is it in the offseason, do they settle into those roles and accept those roles?

SPEAKER_01 29:20

Well, I've told you the commonality with our best teams is guy, the guy's ability to figure that out on their own is to look at the team, read the team, and figure out how to make it work. That's when it's easiest. Like when you don't feel like you have to coach a lot is usually when you're gonna operate at the best level. And I think part of that is just guys that have been around high-level play, good basketball, they get it. Um yeah, they might have been one of the best players on the team, but they've probably, chances are they've probably played with other really good players. And you just figure out how to put it together. And good players want to play with good players and figure out how to get together. I I would say the roles change daily and change all the time, and they're always evolving. I think you got to be more focused on what the team needs than what you want. That's a hard thing to do. I think if you think about how even we talk to kids and raise people, you know, what are your goals? What do you want to accomplish? Where do you want to go? Write them down, do these kind of things. But I think when you join a team, that sort of goes out the door sometimes. Um, you know, that's particularly at a kind of the logger head here where you've got all these guys that their goal was to play in college. Well, now you're doing that. Now you're together. Everybody's done that. And a lot of that stuff you did. Now, part of that is questions and conversations when you recruit them. Part of that is kind of their evaluation of what you are, system of play. Uh, and then part of that is we have to go put that together, put put that together again, and we have to put that together every year. I think part, you know, a large portion of that is just experience on the coaching staff. We get to know guys. Sometimes what we think we might see in somebody isn't actually what they're maybe best at when you get them here. And it doesn't mean they're not good at it or couldn't be, but you find out that there's easier fits and there's easier ways for those things to go together. And so it's you learn as you go. And I would say one of the things that happens is coaches get better at understanding what guys can or can't do based on the system and who else they're playing with and how things fit together. And then, you know, these guys are playing together all the time. They're playing together another spring, they're playing together another fall, and they really get to know each other's game. And then I think they get to know their own game because you keep playing that many times, which you think you might do well, but the guy next to you is better at it than you every day for two years. You eventually come around. I think what happened this year a little bit is we got some more established roles. We got a little separation that I talked about. Like, there's some guys that did some things that I think if other guys are being honest, like that's not gonna be me. I don't do that. I can do this. And so time is part of it. Self-awareness is a big part of it. I think really good players fit with each other because they're good players. And I've I've always said guys that aren't quite as good or a little bit more limited in their breadth and scope and their ability to flex, like they can't, they're kind of are what they are. And the guys are really good can kind of uh adapt and play different roles in different ways. And they also have enough confidence, usually, because they know they're good, that they'd rather do that because they really just want to win and they know what they can accomplish on their own, but they're they're playing in a team sport and hopefully a highly competitive place and want to win.

SPEAKER_03 32:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:11

That's pretty

Inside the Portal: How Coaches Actually Work It

SPEAKER_01 32:12

good.

SPEAKER_03 32:12

That is pretty good.

SPEAKER_01 32:13

Any transfers coming in? Uh not not not on the docket right now. Uh, but again, it man, the the portal stuff is nuts, so we're we'll go in there and check pretty much every day. Uh, whatever it was, 2,000 that went in, division one and two. Three can be longer.

SPEAKER_02 32:30

Well, our audience, right? Because they don't, when you say you go into the portal, what does that actually mean? You have a you have like a login that you go in there and you can see the list of all the guys and can you search by different criteria?

SPEAKER_01 32:41

How does it work? Yeah, there's actually companies now that are out that actually allow you to sort through the data and sort through who's entered. You can sort a lot easier. I mean, you can pay subscription fees and then they, you know, it gives you the technology to sort a little easier. Yeah, for us, honestly, that's one of Coach Hager's jobs is to check the portal consistently uh and just see who's in there. And and where we have got certain things we're looking for. For us, mostly uh transfers we'd be interested in are guys that we've had a previous relationship with. So if we recruited you the whole way through, because we we have now we know you and and you just and it's easier, kind of the cold call ones or the ones that just show up, that would be need based. If we really think we need something, then we would target that and go after it. But I think one of the things, if you look at us right now, uh it's got to be the really right fit for us because of what you talked about, upsetting chemistry and those kind of things. But uh, you know, we always keep our eyes open. And there's a couple guys that we recruited that might have gone to a higher level and we're waiting to see if they fall or or they're not happy if they come in there. Um we'll take a look at that. And then you're also constantly, you know, actively looking at the league to see how that changes. Who's entered from other schools, how that might change their dynamic, uh, what we think they're looking for.

SPEAKER_02 33:54

That's more like you have an alarm that goes off when there's a 6'10 guy that comes into the portal.

SPEAKER_01 34:00

Listen, you gotta do your work. Like you gotta you gotta be on top of those guys. I mean, you gotta put some legwork in to find them. I would say almost all of those things are generally like previous relationships. Or like if you get a Division I guy coming down, they might target it to certain schools that have certain grad programs they want, those kind of things, from an academic to an academic in general. Is there a lot of D one guys who come down? Uh there's there's been more. Um especially if they have a grad year and they've graduated and they want to now make an impact to play a lot. But yeah, I mean they move all different levels. I I would say there's a fair amount of D2 guys that move. There is a fair amount of division three to division three movement. And I just think we we just have to know culturally things have shifted and changed again. I mean, people are more apt to want to just move somewhere else and to find and I where there's not NIL money really involved, although there can be some, but it's really more just kind of culturally now, right? Like, I'm gonna move and get what I want that that fits. And so you got to keep recruiting your own team too. You want to try to be also the other thing we try to do is be open with guys and honest about what we see as opportunities. Because sometimes, like, then you know, we can't provide that. There's no guarantee you're gonna get that here. So if that's really what matters to you and your family, we know you got one shot at this, then you got to make take that information, and it might be the best thing for everybody for you to go somewhere else and to turn it into an opportunity and so you're happy because we we want guys that know and and try to be upfront and honest about that stuff. Because the chemistry stuff you talked about, you could see this year, that's a huge part of what this is, and it's a huge part of coaching. But we also have to keep roster numbers and we have to have guys, and so it's uh it's that's the work, right? That's what you got to do behind it, and you gotta keep working at it, and you hope you get it right. Because you got you realize how much all these guys have at stake and how much it matters to them. And you don't ever take it lightly. But when you get to practice in games, I mean it is what it is, man. We you know, guys play, some guys don't, and it's not it's and some people, oh that's well, you're in it for this long, it's the way it is. There's nothing you can really do to change that. It's how it works. So yeah, you know, you don't you're not gonna, you know, you you got a choice. Are you gonna do what's best for the team and to win? And you saw John Shire stuff like like I I care about developing our guys, getting them where they want to go, and I care about my individual guy, but in the end, my eye is always on what's best for the team. And sometimes that goes together and sometimes it doesn't, but I have to make the choice that I think is best for the team. And I would say the majority of guys that do this and play and get there, they all understand that. But it's life. We all have had to deal with it, and and you know, setbacks, and I think that's the stuff that prepares you for the rest of your life, though. You learn how to work through and uh kind of carve out and define what success

Transfer Fees, Five to Play Five, and Why D3 Still Holds Up

SPEAKER_01 36:47

is for you by how hard you work and what you do, and understand there's decisions that others make that you can't control. Does anything about the portal piss you off?

SPEAKER_02 36:54

In that, like, you know, like I mean, I think one of the biggest topics in college sports right now is the use of the portal and should there be more limitations on it in terms of how much people can jump, you know, what it how how you know, should there be contracts, should there be some kind of, you know, the player has to stay for so many years, blah, blah, blah.

SPEAKER_01 37:15

Yeah, well, I I just I mean, you're getting into that's more money taste at the higher level.

SPEAKER_02 37:19

We don't think that that as big of a deal.

SPEAKER_01 37:21

Division three, you've always been able to, you've been able to to uh transfer mid-year to division three forever. You've had unlimited transfers.

SPEAKER_02 37:27

So does that irritate you that you could just like have a guy who just bounces from team to team, or you don't it doesn't matter to you?

SPEAKER_01 37:33

Well, I think it it's less likely to happen at our level because it's really rooted in your academics here. When you're rooting, when you're leaving four times for NIL money, you don't care about your degree. The likelihood of that happening at our level where guys are paying their way and paying to get an education is very, very limited. And honestly, if guys are gonna do that at our level, you look at them and say, Man, you're a knucklehead, because I don't know what you're doing. All you're doing is, you know, you're not making money, you're not really going anywhere.

SPEAKER_02 38:00

And you're screwing up your education, I guess.

SPEAKER_01 38:03

And your priorities are messed up. So would you want that guy? No. So I think for us, it's a different perspective. You know, they had Division III self-release for many, many years, and we wouldn't even know you're allowed to go in that for 30 days and talk to other coaches and do that stuff, and we're not allowed to know that people are doing that. So now with the portal, that's changed, and now they've gone basically all portal. So you have a better idea. So I have not the the transfer stuff um hasn't bothered me. Now, the when you intersect the transfer stuff with the money, I get that because there is poaching going on. If I'm a mid-major and you take a guy, there should be some kind of uh transfer fee like you have in Europe in soccer and those kind of things. I mean, if I'm paying the guy $500,000 and you take him the last minute, I should get seven, you know, I should get, you know, you know, $750,000 from you or whatever it is to compensate me not only for who I lost, but to go out the investment in the next person. I think that if they want balance, but they don't want balance. They want the top teams to they want the top teams to win and do those kind of things. So I just think it's the intersection of money. I'm more curious about like President Trump's new bill that came out or whatever he he he put into action, where that goes, like the five years to play five, that could have huge, huge impact at our level. We're all really set up to be four-year undergraduate institutions. It's gonna again benefit like we just saw in COVID schools that have really strong graduate programs. You get people coming from uh schools like ours in our location, they tend to want to graduate and go to grad school in a city or a bigger place, right? And so I think that would disadvantage us and be a big challenge. You know, people aren't coming to our places to stay longer. They want to get out of here as quickly as possible with a great degree, just like just like you and that. Like five years to play five, right?

SPEAKER_02 40:00

Why are we playing five in the first place? I don't know. It should be four. You're playing four years. Four years, and you maybe five years to play four.

SPEAKER_01 40:08

Yeah, well, I mean, uh the whole idea is that if you play five and five, if something happens, it it it just like you just move on. So you don't there is no like you have to designate this isn't the year to get. It's all based on like the football red shirt stuff where now they've moved it up that if you play like more than eight games, you keep your eligibility. It's it's impossible to keep track of. It's stupid. You got guys like in the middle of the season saying, I don't want to play this game because I don't want to lose my eligibility, or and it's they've created all their own problems. Um I think sometimes when you coach at our level, you just got to wait and see what the ramifications are of decisions made at other levels. Sometimes it's even how they they you know roll changes and those kind of things. You know what I mean? Four for five. That's what I think it should be. We should why can't we just go back to the way it used to work? Four for four. Four for five. I think if you you know, if you look back at some of the original things they did, it actually makes a ton of sense. Like I think they probably hit more of it and they tried to stay away from this, but the money wasn't the same, right? You weren't making that much money off of athletics. And as soon as the money hit, and it really TV contracts and stuff, it just shaped and reshaped the entire thing. So, how much that impacts us, we'll see. What happens to Division I basketball, we'll see. Division one football, I'd imagine they're going to kind of a hard split here coming up. How does that trickle down and impact, you know, like what's the I beat Division II and certain things? I I don't know. It's it's crazy. I think in the end you see probably the most pure best college level is still Division III. I would agree. For real. It's it's what it's supposed to be about if you kind of still believe in the pure student athlete and they're doing the right things. It's kind of standing the test of time that we're the only place that still aligns pretty much with how it's supposed to look. And it's not really just kind of a student athletes. Yeah, it's not a merry-go-round where people just go from one place to the other, and it's still, you know, the words everyone uses is a transformational experience, isn't it? It's this is still more about relationships and things that last. And that's why I want to be here and enjoy what we're doing here and believe in our place because I think we do those things really well.

SPEAKER_02 42:09

Biz, I don't think there's a better way to end it. We're gonna celebrate 150 years this year. We're gonna celebrate a hundred episodes this coming year. We got a lot on tap. Do we have we gotta start lining up alumni?

Workout Videos, T-Shirt Club, or the Podcast Cruise

SPEAKER_02 42:22

Yeah, we got a lot to do. Off season. Tom, we gotta put our workout workout videos together to send them to the book. Yeah, when do we get our workout videos? I thought we were gonna do the workout and send it to the boys. Well, I thought we need to get the workout videos like we're recruits. Send them to them. Yeah, I need them. I need them. I need motivation. Give me some time though. I gotta get my hammy back. No, no, no, no, no, Biz.

SPEAKER_03 42:45

Biz, no.

SPEAKER_02 42:47

You gotta be ready to go. Hey, you got injuries, you gotta heal, man. Alright, I'm gonna I'm gonna take advantage of you being down, and I'm gonna I'm gonna take those extra two weeks, three weeks. I'm not down that way. Yeah. Alright, we'll see. All right. All right, folks. We're we're in summer. Not really. But we're getting there.

SPEAKER_03 43:06

We're getting there.

SPEAKER_02 43:07

We're getting there. Five and a half months.

SPEAKER_01 43:10

We went to our first spring AAU event this weekend, so that the AAU circu site uh circuits up and running.

SPEAKER_03 43:16

All right.

SPEAKER_01 43:17

Yeah, we have our first uh tournament this coming Saturday. Yep. It's flying, it's running. So never ends always. Never ends. And so here we go. But it's it's kind of like it's exciting, and you start to watch new guys and get to know the people and the possibilities. Um, you know, something that I've always enjoyed and still do. Excited to get into it. Now we're gonna start getting into kind of the season review and film again and go back through the season, and that's exciting, fun. So yeah, it's just a different cycle. And like I said, five and a half months. I just realized that we'll be uh practicing. So that's exciting. Five and a half months.

SPEAKER_02 43:52

Not only is the off season the off season is where the foundation of success begins. I need a vacation. Vacation, man. I gotta read. Yeah, I need a vacation too. We should get like, yeah, I feel like Juniana should take us on a cruise or something. Yeah, where are we going? Yeah. We don't have it, we're not going international this year. Like, we're not what are we doing?

SPEAKER_01 44:13

Yeah, we gotta be able to do that. You know how like the the TV stations like host the cruises, right? And like people go on the cruise with whoever. There you go. You guys run the Juniana podcast cruise, get a cruise company to sponsor you guys, and everyone can go cruising with this.

SPEAKER_02 44:28

I would totally do that. I was thinking T-shirt of the month club, but now Curly's throwing out there we have a cruise ship. A Junior Pirate Cruise. The Pirates do like a celebrity cruise. We could do a show every night, Biz, and then we would just and we'd have other activities going on in the cruise. Yeah. All day long. Be like a three.

SPEAKER_01 44:50

You can go on a cruise with Biz for four to five. I mean, it's three to four. We don't want to overdo it. Three to four days.

SPEAKER_02 44:56

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Three to four days. It's a cruise. It goes from maybe a lot of food and booze that we're talking about. Does it go from what what rivers are around you? It does it go down the Mississippi or what do we got on? We don't want a river. We got to go in the ocean, man. I was thinking down like the what's the one. Yeah, the Susquehanna.

SPEAKER_01 45:16

We'll go down across the Susquehanna.

SPEAKER_02 45:18

What the hell's happening?

SPEAKER_01 45:19

We could just do the uh we could just do from the Potomac up the Chesapeake, like we did. You've you've got driving though. Get the hell out of the room. We could just see if we can make it in that. Let's hopefully we upgrade from what we had.

SPEAKER_02 45:31

Maybe we start small. There you go. Maybe it's it's a one-night, two-day thing, and it's in it's part survival and part entertainment. Dude, we could tell you. You know who would be one of the first people to book our cruise? Who's that? Clarkmeister. Yes, Clark. He would be on that cruise, I guarantee you. He'd be our first guy. All right. So I I think our listeners need to vote. Do we do do we go the route of a t-shirt of the month club or an actual club? We gotta do a cruise, man. I'm telling you. Would you rather have t-shirts delivered to you every month or one awesome cruise? That's our that's our that's our question to the listeners. All right, let's see. This week, I want to see some junior. I want to see someone. All right, fellas, everybody send us your thoughts on that big question. Follow the show on Instagram at the Junietta basketball show. Dive in with even more on Junietta and all the Merrick Studio shows at Merrick Studios Plus. Be part of our live audience, get access to free episodes, and much, much, much more. Matter of fact, I'm gonna give out a code right now. If anybody does want to join the Merrick Studios Plus, you can use the code Juniatta, and you get you get free access. Wow. Big deal. Throwing it out there. If you made it to the end of this episode, look at that little treasure that you get. That'll work for you as well, bitz. I got my code. You have a code, biz. You're good for life, bizarre. I gotta start uh tuning into these things. Yeah, I know. I haven't seen you in there, biz. But you know, whatever. I'm not keeping tabs. Well, I don't know. Where's the schedule? I need to get the schedule. Yeah, you guys gotta get in there. You gotta get in there. We'll get in. All right, listen to the Junior Adam Men's basketball show on Apple, Spotify, and YouTube, and wherever you listen to your podcast. And until next time, I'm Tom Frank.

SPEAKER_01 47:19

Biz. Coach Greg Carlin. Go eat